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Why your family triggers you #2 · Free Therapy with Ben & Kevin

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Raise your hand if you're challenging family dynatics.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: These are the people that brought us into this world,
• 0:05
  Speaker 2: and then they're the most challenging, most triggering, most difficult
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: relationships in our lives. Today, we're getting into why the
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: people closest to us are also the ones who trigger
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: us the most. We brought in therapists Alexislvaggio to break
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: down parts work or internal family systems, and it completely
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: changed the way we see ourselves, our triggers and codependents.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: She even guided me through a parts work practice.
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: Can you ask this part what would happen if it
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: didn't do it's strong?
• 0:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah, things would fall apart.
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: Who do you want to abandon them? Are you?
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: The world is free therapy. I'm Ben and I'm Kevin.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Welcome to free therapy.
• 0:45
  Speaker 3: Hell yahs on the stairs.
• 0:47
  Speaker 5: This is so funny. I'm so excited for this.
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: I am too, guys, so much amazing.
• 0:53
  Speaker 4: Feels good. Alexa, thanks for coming out.
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: Are you kidding? What a gift? I love talking to
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: people about therapy us too.
• 1:01
  Speaker 4: It's the best.
• 1:02
  Speaker 5: That's great.
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: I tell then every time we have these conversations, like
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: all the pre calls, like after our call last week
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: I get off the call, I just go I fucking
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: love my job. Like, this is amazing that we get
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: to do this.
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: It is crazy that, like there's a world where someone says,
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: what do you want?
• 1:23
  Speaker 5: What's your dream?
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: What's the thing you could do if you had, you know,
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: all the money in the world or whatever, And I
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: think of there would be a version of this in
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: my head, Like sitting down with my best friend every
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: week talking about mental health feels like the pipe. I
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: feel like I'm here, I feel like I'm in it.
• 1:40
  Speaker 4: What was that thing you said the other day?
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: It was like, find the thing that feels effortless and
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: then put all of your effort into it.
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: Because then you're like, oh, is it actually effort? Is
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: it effort or is it just like joy?
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: Right?
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  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah, moving from our highest excitement is pretty lito.
• 1:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, okay.
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: So the first thing that lit me up from our
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: conversation was this one question of why does it feel
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: like everybody has these very challenging family.
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Dynamics raising challenging family dynamics.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: These are the people that that brought us into this world.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: They are the people we should love, that we care about,
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: that have cared for us, our entire lives, and then
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: they're the most challenging, most triggering, most difficult relationships in.
• 2:39
  Speaker 3: Our lives totally. I mean, there's so much to say
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: on that. I mean, these people know us the best,
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: right and not only do they know us the best,
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: but they they know certain versions of us that are
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: potentially integrated into their psyche. And so it's like, like
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: I have an older sister, and she will always remember
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: me as like the annoying twelve year old little idiot
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: that was like her mass and like didn't know what
• 3:08
  Speaker 3: she was doing and I was twelve, you know. So
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: it's like on some level I will always be that
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: to her. She can't. She can't necessarily, and I love
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: my sister, but like there are moments where she probably
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: can't see me as accurately as I really am, because
• 3:24
  Speaker 3: she remembers me back when the you know what was
• 3:27
  Speaker 3: hitting the fan or this terrible thing happened, or I
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: behaved a certain way that really imprinted in her. You know,
• 3:35
  Speaker 3: every family member has a version of that with us.
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: And so I think Rahm Doos said it best, like,
• 3:42
  Speaker 3: if you ever think you're enlightened, go spend a week
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: with your family. Did you say that.
• 3:50
  Speaker 4: Are having a moment. Dude, you're dudeg momento.
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: So I mean, just first of all, like when I
• 3:57
  Speaker 2: was writing my notes, yeah, like how the only chance,
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: the only thing we prepped. I was like, we have
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: to have the first question and then we can go
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: wherever we want from.
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  Speaker 4: So let's start here. The second thing on my notes
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  Speaker 4: was that line.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, it's the truest truth truth.
• 4:13
  Speaker 4: And this is on top of that, this is the
• 4:15
  Speaker 4: best part.
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  Speaker 2: Last night in my dream, I turn around and in
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: my living room is ram Das.
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  Speaker 4: And I go, Richard. That's that's his real name, Kevin Richard.
• 4:32
  Speaker 4: He goes Kevin and give him a big hug.
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  Speaker 2: And I like, it looks just like him, Like I
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: felt like I was meeting him. Give him a big hug,
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  Speaker 2: and I start crying and he goes, why are you crying?
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  Speaker 4: And I go, I feel like I'm home.
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  Speaker 3: Wow.
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  Speaker 4: I woke up like, oh my god, that's my this
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  Speaker 4: is my Yeah, and you're bringing up the quote. Okay, great,
• 4:58
  Speaker 4: thank you for sharing that. Yeah, I it was just
• 5:00
  Speaker 4: too perfect.
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  Speaker 5: Okay, so what's the quote again?
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  Speaker 3: If you think you're enlightened spent a week with your family, Yeah, like, no,
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  Speaker 3: one knows you better, and simultaneously, no one knows your
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: trigger is better because all of our triggers are architected
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: in our childhood, not all of them, but many of them.
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: And so of course, like they're just going to step
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: on those land mines like crazy, and because there's a
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: sense of safety there, hopefully for many of us, there's
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: a sense of safety just in the familiarity of it, right,
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  Speaker 3: if it's familial, it's familiar, and so like with that
• 5:33
  Speaker 3: familiarity comes the safety of allowing ourselves to get triggered, right,
• 5:38
  Speaker 3: like the spaciousness to be able to be like I
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: hate you, like you did this thing you know, which
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: maybe you wouldn't do to like a friend.
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: I can still relate to that thing about the sisters
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: because like I have two brothers, and they both consistently
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: triggered me, of course, and I know my mom has
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: told me, who's a therapist, she has been like your
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: or he's like your brother has changed. You need to
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: see him the way he has changed, not in the
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: moments that he did the things that actually made you
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: resent him or get mad at him.
• 6:09
  Speaker 5: But like my.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: Body feels it every time, like I'm back then, so
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: I just want to.
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: But then I'm like.
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: Oh, oh, your body wants to protect you, right, Yeah,
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: that original the original source of pain, not knowing that
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: right now you're safe and going back to Ramdas, Like
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: the most urgent wisdom I can ask anyone to do
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: is simply to be here now. And I really do
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: think that presence is the great healer of all things.
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: You're like, if you're anxious, yeah, that's forward thinking, Like
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: you're thinking about this potential thing that may or may
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: not happen in the future. And if you're in a
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: depressive state, you're probably sitting in something that occurred, right,
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: And so like presence really is this audacious healer. And
• 6:55
  Speaker 3: so yeah, think back to Rumdas, be here now.
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: But when you're in that moment of like, let's say
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: you're present and your trick because you're looking at something
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: that brings you back to the past, it's in your body,
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  Speaker 1: what's the best thing or the most easy thing to
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: do to prevent that blow up or how do you
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  Speaker 1: approach it where you can be more forward thinking and
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: growing with your person that's triggering you.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, there's so much there. I mean, first of all,
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: we have to remember that our triggers are actually showing
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: us where our deepest wounds are that there's something to
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: be healed there. Right, So it's not oh my god,
• 7:24
  Speaker 3: stop triggering me, it's oh my god, I have a
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  Speaker 3: trigger hold on. Let me like take full accountability for
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: the fact that I have a trigger there. We have
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: to signal safety to our body somehow, and that can
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: be through bilateral stimulation. That can be through things like tapping,
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: that can be through deep breaths, that can be through
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: using our senses, you know, like so many clinicians will
• 7:47
  Speaker 3: use things like okay, like notice everything red in the room.
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: Just take a second to notice everything red in the room,
• 7:52
  Speaker 3: or like what are you actually hearing? Using our body
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: to get into the present moment, because the body is
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: always present, actually, and so that's a huge, huge piece
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  Speaker 3: of it. So once the body is then safe, we
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  Speaker 3: can take accountability and notice where we're reacting and notice
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: where we're having a moment, and then have an honest
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: conversation about what's really going on. Something I love to
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: talk to my clients about is leading with things like
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: the story I'm telling myself. The story I'm telling myself
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  Speaker 3: is this is happening and I'm really anxious about it,
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  Speaker 3: and I'm really triggered.
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  Speaker 2: So trigger happens, you find a sense of safety somewhere
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  Speaker 2: in your body. And then the first thing you say,
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  Speaker 2: the story that I'm telling myself.
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  Speaker 3: I'm telling myself is this is what's going on, And
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  Speaker 3: I'm leading with a sense of vulnerability as long as
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  Speaker 3: this is a person that there's some sort of intimacy with.
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  Speaker 3: And again intimacy means into me. See, it's not like
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  Speaker 3: I bang them, like there's a sense of knowing there.
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  Speaker 5: Right.
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  Speaker 3: We don't want to do this with a random person
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  Speaker 3: on the street because we don't know what their stuff is.
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  Speaker 2: Someone flicks you.
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  Speaker 4: Off on the.
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  Speaker 2: Story I'm telling myself.
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  Speaker 3: Is your mean yeah, no, no, But like leading with
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  Speaker 3: the story I'm telling myself is this, can you confirm
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: or deny that story? Because again, like what's being scaffolded
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: in our brain is emergency bad fill in the blank
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  Speaker 3: when really like maybe they're just asking you to like
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: pass the coffee in a way that didn't quite sit
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  Speaker 3: right with you, So we just have to notice. And
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: the beautiful thing about saying something like the story I'm
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: telling myself is it goes from this to this it's
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  Speaker 3: not stop triggering me. It's oh, I'm telling myself a story. Fuck,
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  Speaker 3: I'm telling myself a story.
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  Speaker 4: You takes a responsibility. This is the story I'm telling myself.
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  Speaker 2: You get to actually also say is this a true story?
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  Speaker 4: Is this what's actually happening?
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  Speaker 2: Or am I picking up on a past experience with
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  Speaker 2: this person that is telling me this story?
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  Speaker 3: Because again, like we're going back to that moment of like, oh,
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: well he's reacting. You're reacting to this thing that happened
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: ten years ago or fifteen years ago or twenty years ago,
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  Speaker 3: and I'm having this response to it right now, not
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: noticing that actually my brother's changed.
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And something helpful for me is I will I
• 10:17
  Speaker 1: know that I'm going to get triggered before I get
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: into the moment, Before I get there, I'm like, there's
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: a chance you're going to get triggered in this conversation.
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: Totally be more aware that it's not worth blowing up,
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: because like you're both older now and you can resolve it.
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: And I will do that every time I see him.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: Still it's okay, like the thing's wrong with it, like
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: I want. It's just like hard to have those relationships.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: So every time I'm like all right, like this is
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: this is a relationship that I'm I love and I'm
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: going to cherish forever and I'm going to be triggered
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: probably and that's cool, nothing wrong with that.
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: Well, and this is this is such a huge piece
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: because the triggers are often these, like you said, like
• 10:55
  Speaker 3: these very young parts of ourselves. And this is part
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: of why I love things like parts work, because we
• 11:00
  Speaker 3: can differentiate like, oh, this is a part of me,
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: this is not necessarily who I am right now, and
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: noticing these different aspects of ourselves being present, like oh,
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  Speaker 3: that's the part that's being really triggered in this situation.
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: Is my anxious part or my planner part or whatever.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: So today we're going to talk about something called parts work,
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: also called internal family systems or ifs. You can do
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: it with a therapist, but even just understanding the concept
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: is a game changer.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: It's basically a framework that says you're not just one
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: single thing. You've got a whole group chat going on
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: in your head, and every single part of that group
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: chat has its place there.
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: Right, you know what we're talking about. It's when you say,
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: part of me really wants to go out tonight, but
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: part of me also just wants to stay home.
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  Speaker 1: Part of me knows that I should definitely leave this relationship,
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: but part of me is just terrified to be alone.
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: Part of me wants to send that text, and the
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: other parts like, dude, definitely do not send that text.
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: A part of me just wants to quit my job,
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: and the other part is like, wait, but you have
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: rent and Bill's pay.
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: What are you doing? Don't quit your job. Look, this
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: isn't you being indecisive. These are real parts of you,
• 12:14
  Speaker 2: and they each have their own job, their own fears,
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: or an agenda. But underneath all those parts there's a self.
• 12:22
  Speaker 2: It's a calm, curious, compassionate core that's always been there.
• 12:27
  Speaker 2: It's you when these voices are quiet, and IFS is
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: basically about helping that self get back into the driver's seat,
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: learning to have a relationship with those parts rather than
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: being at war with them.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: Now here are some of the big parts that you
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: will probably recognize. There's the inner critic that tells you
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: you're not doing good enough.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: There's the people pleaser, right, It's the one that says
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: yes when you actually just want to say Now.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: There's that protector, the part that shuts you down and
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: makes you so avoidant that you can't get hurt.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: There's the ANXI plan, all right, the one that's running
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: worst case scenarios at two in the morning, just trying
• 13:05
  Speaker 2: to prevent the worst case scenario from happening.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: Now here's the thing that changes everything. None of these
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  Speaker 1: parts are bad or broken. They're all just trying to
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: help you. They just learned their strategies a long time ago,
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  Speaker 1: usually when you were a kid, and they never got
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: the memo that you're a grown adult now who can
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: handle these things differently. So the work is just getting
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: to know them, getting to know what they need, letting
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: them relax a little, and so on.
• 13:32
  Speaker 5: You get it.
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: So all you have to do is to start checking
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: yourself in real time, like, oh, that's just a part
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: of me.
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: And now back to the show.
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: So KEVI, now that you have a little bit of
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: an idea, let's liable a couple of parts.
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: Great, I have.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: The part of me that tries to make everyone around
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: me happy, that tries to Yeah.
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: Would you feel comfortable doing a little process right now?
• 14:00
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah, sure, I love that. I invite you to close
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: the eyes. If that feels safe for you. Now you
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: can find one point of attention. Beautiful, Let's just see
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: if you can slow the breath down ever so slightly,
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: softening the shoulders, widening the space behind the eyes. And
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: I invite you to start to feel into because this
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: practice is inherently somatic. I invite you to feel into
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: your body where you can feel a sense of self,
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: true self, capital s self. And that again, that self
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: is that listener. It's that calm, curious, connected, caring, creative
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: part of you that is always there even when you
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: don't feel like you have tons of access to it.
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: Do you feel like you have a bit of access
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: to self? Yeah? So beautiful. Where do you feel that
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: in your body? And talk to me.
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: In the heart?
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, for the listeners, you know, often self is
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: felt in the heart or in the solar plexus. Generally,
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: then everyone's different. And then as you just stay in
• 15:14
  Speaker 3: that space of self, I invite you to feel into
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: again in or around your head or body for the
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: part of you that wants to make everybody else happy. Yeah,
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: and again there's no bad parts. And that's, by the way,
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: the name of the book. If you were interested in that, yeah,
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: that's the one and just start to notice there's no
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: wrong answer, right, there's no wrong answer here. So just
• 15:41
  Speaker 3: start to notice any part of your body that kind
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: of lights.
• 15:44
  Speaker 4: Up, shoulders, in the back of the neck.
• 15:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, beautiful, And just start to notice what this
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: part of you feels like. Maybe this part takes on
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: any sort of shape, Maybe this part looks like something,
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: maybe looks like nothing. Maybe it's just an energy, and
• 16:03
  Speaker 3: start to describe it to me. And again there's no
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: wrong way to do.
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: It feels heavy, It both like looks like a skeleton.
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: It looks like something's being dragged. Like I just have
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: this vision of like a village and it's like a
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: big sack that I'm just dragging and it's heavy.
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: Well, how do you feel toward this part from the
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: space of the self, How does the self feel towards
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: this part of you that's right there carrying that big,
• 16:35
  Speaker 3: heavy bag.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: The self feels sad? Yeah, it feels like compassion.
• 16:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah for that part.
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you just said the magic word. That's how we
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: know self is really accessed right when you when you
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: describe that part of you that's heavy and frankly what
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: you described was, you know, not exactly idyllic. But when
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: the self sees that part with compassion, does that part
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: see you? Or there in the back of the neck.
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: Does it see me?
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, no, it's like looking out when the self
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: is behind it. Yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: Can you ask this part at the neck and the
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: shoulders what its job is and just let the part.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: Answer to keep things together?
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, to keep things together. Can you ask this part
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: what would happen if it didn't do its job?
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah? Things would fall apart, that'd be it'd be anger.
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: Mm hm.
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: Does it like its job?
• 17:39
  Speaker 4: Can you just ask yes, it does like it?
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Well it feels a sense of like value and yeah,
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: responsibility and pride.
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, of course, of course what it's an important job?
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: Or I things would fall apart if it didn't do
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: its job. Can you ask this part how old it is?
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: In a weird way?
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: I like it looks old? Yeah it actually he looks
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: very old. It looks like an old man. Yeah.
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: Can you ask this part how old it thinks?
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: You are?
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: A kid? Like seven?
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: Can you? Yeah? Totally. Can you just let this part
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: know how old you are and maybe just like inform
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: him where you're at in life, like what you're doing
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: just kind of update him.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: He's looking out a little more like instead of he
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: was crouching a lot, he was sort of like he
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: was like dark. He had like a cloth over said,
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: he looks like a yeah, yeah, so's he's looking out more.
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: Wow. Can you ask him just before we close out
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: of this, can you ask him if he needs anything
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: right now? He could need something physical. Maybe he's like
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: I need water, Like whatever he needs is fine.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: He needs the first thing was a massage and it
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: was like stretch, and then it was to lighten the load.
• 19:06
  Speaker 4: But he's caring.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that sounds right. Can you help him get all
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: those things? Give him a massage therapist and give him
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: a place to stretch, and give him give him a
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: place to maybe put down that bag, and just can
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: you let him know that maybe you know, if he's interested,
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: you'll be back for him to get to know him
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: a little bit more beautiful. Just thank him for his
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: time forgetting to know you. But once you've done that,
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: let's just start to feel your feet on the ground.
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: Here you can take a deep breath and come back
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: to the room. Mm hmm. I love that part. I
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: love that part. Thank you for letting us get to
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: know that thanks.
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: For yeah.
• 20:00
  Speaker 3: A lot. Yeah, and you know, just to give you
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: both a little context like that that seven year old
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: that he thinks you are, there's something there. So there's
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: in the seven year old, in the seven year old.
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: So there's three different types of parts. There's firefighters, managers,
• 20:23
  Speaker 3: and exiles. Firefighters are destructive behaviors. They put out fires,
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: like being an alcoholic. That drinking part is a firefighter.
• 20:32
  Speaker 3: You feel bad, have a drink, You feel bad, have
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: a drink. Our managers are the parts, like we just met,
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: that's doing something to keep you safe. If there were
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: a slogan of the manager parts, it would be never again,
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: never again, we will never let that happen again. The
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: managers protect the exiles. That's the seven year old, and
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: so our next job would be to ask the manager
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: to take you to the seven year old. It's a
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: younger version of you that's been exiled. And then what
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: we do is we then unburden the seven year old
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: of whatever burdens he's been caring, she or they have
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: been caring, and we unburden whatever they're holding in their
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: nervous system. Whatever that seven year old is caring, We
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: unburden them and we bring them into the present. And
• 21:20
  Speaker 3: when we bring them into the present, that part that's
• 21:23
  Speaker 3: at the nape of the neck doesn't need to be
• 21:26
  Speaker 3: quite so loud because it's protecting the seven year old,
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: if that makes sense.
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: If it's cool, it's really cool.
• 21:37
  Speaker 5: That was fun to watch.
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: I've never seen it in action in real time.
• 21:40
  Speaker 5: I've only seen it like in a book.
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 21:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but it's it's cool.
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: To watch somebody explore that for the first time because
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: you I can see when you're when it's maybe like
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: clicking in your head, or there's like a new feeling
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: of rising or maybe some like clarity happening that gives
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: you some freedom, Like it like opens you up from
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: not feeling the pressure or the disgust or whatever those
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: feelings are towards that part that shows up today.
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: Yeah, So drawing the thread back to the triggers, m M.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: What's happening when you get triggered? Yeah, in the in
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: the context of parts.
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: Work, Yeah, a part is getting activated.
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: So like that old man is.
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: Getting lit up and driving the car. It's going, oh,
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: something happened. So let's I don't know the context of
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: your making everyone happy, but I'm just going to kind
• 22:36
  Speaker 3: of make something up for the Totally podcast. So something happens,
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: someone says something or does something that triggers an old wound.
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: All of a sudden you come into it. Oh my god,
• 22:49
  Speaker 3: what can I do to make this person happy? Because
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: if I can make them happy, then they won't hurt me,
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: they won't do fill in the blank thing that makes everything,
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: as you said, fall apart, right, and so you rush
• 23:04
  Speaker 3: into some sort of action. For some of us, those
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: actions are firefighter parts, right, like, oh, I'm gonna make
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: everyone happy by serving everyone drinks and getting really drunk,
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: and then I'll be happy and they'll be happy and
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: everyone's whatever. But those triggers are it's like it just
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: lights up apart, and so our work is to notice, like,
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: oh it's again just like oh I have a trigger there.
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: It's like, okay, well, which part is being activated right now?
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: And how can I allow a sense of safety for
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: that part? Because again, like you said, that part is
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: just trying to keep things together. It's not a bad part.
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: There's no bad parts. We're never trying to get rid
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: of a part. We're just trying to get to know
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: them so that we can support them and also access
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: more self. At any given time, we all want more self.
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: We've all taken that breathwork class, or we've had those
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: really embodied moments and been like, God, this feels so
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: good to just be calm and curious and connected. We
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: want to feel that way, and the parts are protecting
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: us from whatever pain happened in our past so that
• 24:13
  Speaker 3: we can feel better. But again, just like any behavior,
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: that repetition can inevitably lead to pain, right, like someone
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: who drinks, like once upon a time that behavior really
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: served them, like it worked. Everything we do, everything we have,
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: has a payoff. If it didn't, we wouldn't do it, Like,
• 24:37
  Speaker 3: even if the payoff is nasty, even if the payoff
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: is like it reaffirming that we are a bad person.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: But that's in our inherent belief, right, If that's my
• 24:47
  Speaker 3: inherent belief, I'm going to look for proof of that. Everywhere.
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: Whatever we're looking for proof of will find it. So, yeah,
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: it's interesting.
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: I want to take it back to the trigger, so
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: you get triggered, find a place of safety internally. The
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: story I'm telling myself is and then let's say someone
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: has done some of this part's work and they understand
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: it is there something that they're doing in that moment
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: to take care of that part.
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah, what are you doing?
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: Like in essence, like checking in with that part. Like
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: I said, it's inherently somatic, like noticing your body, what's
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: happening in my nervous system, what's happening in my body,
• 25:27
  Speaker 3: and then just checking in with that part, Like you
• 25:29
  Speaker 3: can excuse yourself, take a walk, go to the bathroom,
• 25:32
  Speaker 3: like whatever you need to do, and just take a
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: second to like notice, okay, like what do you need
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: just like your guy needed a massage, and like you
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: don't have to take a lot of time. It's just
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: checking in, like what is this part of me need
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: to feel safe and talking to the part, checking in
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: with the part, noticing it, even just noticing that the
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: part is activated, That in and of itself is such
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: a huge piece of it. Like even if you can't
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: carve out I'm in the moment to like go through
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: an experience, just even noticing like this is not me,
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: this is the part activated that in and of itself, So.
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: The separation is important, huge interesting.
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: Another modality that I love is acceptance and commitment therapy.
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: My favorite, it's the best favorite. Yeah, and honestly, like
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: the intersection of act and i FS is so sick.
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: The work goes really beautifully together. But we talk about
• 26:33
  Speaker 3: an act like the Witness, and in parts work it'd
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: be the self. Right, So the Witness is like if
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: you can just right now, I invite everyone, you don't
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: even need to close your eyes, Like think of think
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: of something that happened to you in your childhood, Like
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: it doesn't have to be bad, just like it could
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: be a birthday party, it doesn't matter. Just like, think
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: of something that happened to you when you were seven,
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: and then just notice if you can just like step
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: to the left of it and just like miess it
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: rather than like being in that Like can you just
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: kind of step to the left and see it and
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: just like notice how you feel about it, Like you
• 27:10
  Speaker 3: notice what feelings were there, Like was it sweet? Was
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: it sad? Was it tender or was it yeah?
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: And like everybody has an idea of the moments in
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: their life that made them sad, angry, frustrated, and then
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: most people just like push it away or just like
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: don't ever deal with it, and then it shows up
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: somewhere else in a relationship or a job, but I
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: think that everybody, like I know that I could be like,
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: oh those were if I thought, oh, those are like
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: ten really hard moments of my life, and that could
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: open me up to being the witness accepting them, thinking
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: about the part that it is, how it's affected me today.
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: But I think people like I don't blame people for
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: like pushing it down because I think it's like really
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: hard to go there. But I think once you was
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: like kind of decide to just like let yourself relive
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: one of them, just like even the easiest of the hardest,
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: you're giving yourself such a better opportunity for everything else
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: that comes after it.
• 28:13
  Speaker 3: Totally. I mean you just named depression, right, like to depress. Yeah, yeah,
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: Like we don't want to explore things that have happened
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: to us because we think we can't handle it, and
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: the manager parts think we can't handle it, so they
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: depress the exiles when really like, as as soon as
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: you integrate whatever's happened to you, there's so much more space,
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: there's so much more freedom.
• 28:38
  Speaker 4: How has act acceptance going with therapy?
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, like, what do you love about it?
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: Why you're said to change your life?
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: Why how it was when I started reading about acceptance
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: and commitment, I stopped blaming myself and realize that, like
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: I just have a bully from a child to that
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: is just like always trying to protect me. But that
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: bully is like I don't need there's nothing to protect
• 29:04
  Speaker 1: me anymore.
• 29:05
  Speaker 5: So when I started to.
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: Just accept that like this was part of myself that
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: I was just this is just what happened to me.
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: It wasn't my fault. I was just like, you know,
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: every kid just goes through a bunch of shit. And
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: then I started learning about like, oh, like if you
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: just like move towards your values and you just live
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: in line with like what makes you feel like you're
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: living your the life that matters to you, Like everything
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: that comes up is okay, like it there's nothing like
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: it's not worth being mad that it's there.
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: Total, it's not.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: Worth just like wishing it wasn't there, because you really can't.
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: Like I think people think that therapy is about just
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: like fixing all your problems, but it's just about like
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: realizing what's there, getting the tools to live with it.
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: And then I was like, oh, I don't have to
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: actually like solve all these problems. It's just about like
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: understanding them better, and so ACT helped me understand the
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: things that were making me depressed or making me anxious.
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: And I'm not trying to like solve the anxiety anymore.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: I'm just trying to like understand when it's there. And
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, it's not a problem to be fixed.
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: Did you used to push it away and avoid it
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: and not be able to sit with.
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: It, and them anxiety got worse, of course, and I
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: was like, oh, I need something to make it better.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: But I understand that that was fueling it.
• 30:35
  Speaker 3: It's resistance, right, Yeah, It's like anything you resist, it persists.
• 30:38
  Speaker 3: It sort it all heard and that's it. It's like
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: you said it so beautifully, Like meditation is not about
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: stopping our thoughts. It's about changing the way that we
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: relate to our thoughts. And that's why, like ACT is
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: a mindfulness based practice. We're not changing even the behavior
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: as much as we are changing how we relate to
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: the behavior. And then the irony is as often the
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: behavior changes once you change the way you really to it,
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: because there's a level of acceptance once you accept something
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: that's the like great paradox of the universe, Like you
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: accept something and then it changes. Yeah, but the more
• 31:10
  Speaker 3: you're like I hate this about myself or I want
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: this to change, like it can't because you're in resistance
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: to it.
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: No.
• 31:16
  Speaker 1: It's funny because like we talk about all this work,
• 31:18
  Speaker 1: like there's like internal family systems, there's ACT and there's
• 31:21
  Speaker 1: CBT and like.
• 31:22
  Speaker 5: All these ideas.
• 31:23
  Speaker 1: Right, everyone's like, oh, how do I what kind of
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: therapy do I want?
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: And they're all like kind of related, right and so
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: and so. I think when I was like doing ACT work,
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: I was like, oh, I was feeling better, and then
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: I read about IFS, I was like, oh, I feel better,
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: and all of it like helps me. But I think
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: for me it was like what are the things that
• 31:38
  Speaker 1: are actually inhibiting my life? And I think the work
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: made me realize like, oh, this is like my attachment
• 31:47
  Speaker 1: style and this is why I'm having a hard time
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: in relationships. Oh, I became codependent because of something that
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: happened at a young age. That's what's causing me anxiety.
• 31:59
  Speaker 1: And so when I was able to like understand it
• 32:01
  Speaker 1: from any system, then I started to be able to
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: like engage in a more healthy way that wasn't giving
• 32:09
  Speaker 1: me anxiety. And I think like people don't have to
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: like decide what is the best kind of therapy for me,
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: because I think it's more just about trying to understand
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: the things that are happening that are causing you anxiety, depression, yes,
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: and not being like how do I fix the depression?
• 32:28
  Speaker 1: How do I fix the anxiety? It's like no, no, no, like,
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: oh my people please are shit. Why think about the
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: moment or let me think about my family dynamic and
• 32:36
  Speaker 1: then once I understand it, I can just learn about
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: it better. And that's where I think it really helped me.
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: I'm so glad going back to Ramdas because we have
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: a thread.
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: He's here, Hey, Richard, Richard, he's.
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: Huging us all you know. I think he said something
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: to the effect of, you know, in all my years
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: of psychotherapy and all my years of this work, psychedelic work,
• 32:57
  Speaker 3: going to India, all the things he said, I never
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: I've never gotten rid of one of my neurosies, and
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: yet now I just invite them all in fatigue.
• 33:05
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: Right, It's like rather than just going like I'm supposed
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: to get rid of this, no, we just like once
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: once the anxiety is here, like, how can we invite
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: it in and be like what do you need? Yeah,
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: like the depressions here, Like, what do you need? We're
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: not just trying to get rid of it. We got
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: to ask you what it needs because it's here. It's information.
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: What information does our formation have? Like our body? Yeah,
• 33:26
  Speaker 3: body really does keep the score after all.
• 33:28
  Speaker 5: It really has a great book too.
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: Can I read? You know the RHM DOS line that
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: is similar to this as well? Yeah, please, he goes.
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: Life is being like in the fourth grade, you took
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: birth here because you have certain work to do that
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: involves the suffering you do, the kinds of situations you
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: find yourself in. This is your curriculum. It's not an error.
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: Where you are right now, with all your neuroses and
• 33:51
  Speaker 2: your problems, you're sitting in just the right place. Imagine
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: that that line, like, this is the curriculum. It's not
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: a problem you're trying to like solve. This is part
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: of the class you're in. Like your life, everything that's
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: happening right now is part of the class that you're in.
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: You're not supposed.
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: To bypass it. You're not supposed to be like get
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: me out of class. No, you're supposed to be.
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: There and the only way out is through.
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: It sucks, though, Like I just genuinely think it sucks,
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: Like I think, I just think it's like fucking terrible,
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: Like it's everyone's just like it's really hard. And I
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: think candily, like I don't know, I'm boomer, parents raise kids.
• 34:27
  Speaker 1: I don't think anyone told me that life was going
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: to be this hard. Like adulting is not easy. And
• 34:32
  Speaker 1: everyone thinks you just get a job and you make
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: money and you have kids. But it's like it's that
• 34:36
  Speaker 1: times one hundred. Yeah, and then it's like, well, how
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: do you like deal with those problems? Does everyone deal
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: with those problems and you keep them to yourself? But
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: you're like, no, everybody's going through the exact same thing
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: at different times.
• 34:45
  Speaker 5: It's like it's.
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: Hard and it's not supposed to be easy.
• 34:49
  Speaker 5: Some people have it easier, some people have it harder.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: We don't compare problems, but like it's challenging.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: Well, this is the beauty of this dialogue that we're
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: having right here. It's like we're creating a sense of
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: oh wow, okay, thank you for that permission. Right, Like
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: the problem with problems is that we think we shouldn't
• 35:05
  Speaker 3: have any yeah, and like crazy, yeah, like we should
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: like this is this is the curriculum, and we're here
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: to learn and grow and move through this human experience,
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: hopefully with as much presence as we can.
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: Somebody told me, I totally agree. The problem is the problem, right,
• 35:24
  Speaker 1: but it's like how big is the problem? We have
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: to ask ourselves that am I being triggered? Is it
• 35:28
  Speaker 1: a small problem? Do I feel like it's a big problem?
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: It is actually a small problem. Oh is my job?
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: Actually? Is it my is it my health?
• 35:35
  Speaker 1: Is it my parking ticket?
• 35:36
  Speaker 5: Right?
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: Like if we just every time get aggravated, we're telling
• 35:39
  Speaker 1: our body there's so many problems. But I think like
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: my biggest my favorite quote is like when you when
• 35:46
  Speaker 1: you have your health, you have one hundred problems, and
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: then the moment you don't have your health, you have
• 35:51
  Speaker 1: one problem. Right, And I just think we have to
• 35:54
  Speaker 1: do our best to evaluate the problem and tell our
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: body that like, maybe not all aren't so big.
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: That is such a huge piece that I work on
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: with my clients is just the ability to zoom out
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: at any given moment, like whenever we're in it going
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: through something. And this is not to minimize an experience
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: that someone's going through. We all have tough moments, but
• 36:20
  Speaker 3: the ability to zoom out in moments that maybe seem
• 36:23
  Speaker 3: really big but kind of aren't, like to zoom out
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: and go like, hey, just is again getting into that
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: witness or self piece, Like can I just look at
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: it from up here for a second and just like
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: really assess whether or not the energy that I'm expending,
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: excuse me on this problem is worth it, because like, yeah,
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: if you're going through something tumultuous, or going through something tough,
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: if someone's died, if something's really hard, like please like
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: be in that. But if you're just like if you're
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: tripping over a parking ticket.
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: Like if it's your one hundred, they haven't paid them
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: to their cars and you get TOWLD, you're gonna lose
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: your license.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: Great, Yeah, totally, And that's a whole other problem.
• 37:06
  Speaker 4: Over grade parking ticket one.
• 37:08
  Speaker 7: A couple of weeks ago, I park my car outside
• 37:13
  Speaker 7: of my office, come into work, I go outside to
• 37:16
  Speaker 7: get something from my car, go back into work, come
• 37:20
  Speaker 7: back at the end of the day, ticket and I
• 37:23
  Speaker 7: started getting like what the fuck, bro?
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: And at the ticket was like twenty minutes after I
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: had come back to check the car. I could have
• 37:30
  Speaker 2: easily looked. And I started getting pissed. And I just
• 37:34
  Speaker 2: read this thing from Buyron Katie. She has this line,
• 37:37
  Speaker 2: She's like, is it true. It's the first thing you asked?
• 37:41
  Speaker 5: Is it true?
• 37:43
  Speaker 2: And I realized, because I do it, I go I
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: said is it true? And I'm like I realized I
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: was getting I wasn't getting angry myself because of the money.
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: It's like whatever, seventy bucks, I can deal with that.
• 37:55
  Speaker 4: I was angry at myself because of what it meant
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: about me.
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: I was telling myself there wasn't even someone else there.
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: I'm an idiot, I'm bad.
• 38:05
  Speaker 2: I'm fucking stupid, and I don't pay attention to ship
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: like I'm just like I can't take care of life.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: Like all this story is that, all these stories that
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: are in my head.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: And they come so quickly, too so quick, just a
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: punching bag totally.
• 38:24
  Speaker 4: And I was like, is it true?
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: And I'm like, no, none of that's true. I just
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: didn't see the sign.
• 38:31
  Speaker 1: And you're human, and I was fine, you're human.
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: Yeah, what's up? And then I was like, oh, all
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: the anger went.
• 38:37
  Speaker 3: Away, and this is what's so profound about Byron Katie's work,
• 38:40
  Speaker 3: is it. It immediately gets you into that point. It's
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: a witness, right, you're zoomed out. You're not going this.
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: Is that true love?
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: That? Oh can I really know that that's true?
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: Sometimes the simple ship like you got to practice on
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: the fucking parking ticket, not on.
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: Your parents, Spingo.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: Train your body in your mind. Yeah, that's a great point.
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: It's so real because you're like, you go into you
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: have this conversation and then you're like, all right, and
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: you're get into conversation with your mom and you're.
• 39:16
  Speaker 6: Like no, no, no, you can't do anything, and then
• 39:22
  Speaker 6: you get mad at yourself again because you make up
• 39:24
  Speaker 6: another story about the fact that you just had a
• 39:27
  Speaker 6: therapy session right where worked on the thing, and you
• 39:30
  Speaker 6: go home to get triggered again.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, this is my newest favorite thing. I mean, I
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: have a therapist who I love. This guy's fucking amazing.
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: I've been my whole life. This guy's like changing my life.
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: All my therapists are great, by the way, but they
• 39:41
  Speaker 1: all they led me to this guy. Like every you know,
• 39:43
  Speaker 1: every chapter whatever, I'm very happy with this guy. Discomfort
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: is just discomfort doesn't mean you have to act. You
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: don't have to actually do something. If you're uncomfortable, you
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: can just be uncomfortable, witness it, see if it passes.
• 39:56
  Speaker 5: Ask yourself a question because people just like me, especially
• 39:59
  Speaker 5: if I am.
• 40:00
  Speaker 1: If I feel discomfort, sometimes I can't tell if it's
• 40:03
  Speaker 1: big discomfort, trauma, little discomfort, So I just go to survival.
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: But it's not always like that, and so just like
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: reach and it has to be like a practice every day.
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: An uncomfortable emotion of like having a stomach ache from
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: eating something bad, or like getting a parking ticket or
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: getting trigger it's oh.
• 40:17
  Speaker 5: I'm uncomfortable. Okay, okay, I'm uncomfortable.
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: That's distress tolerance so hard.
• 40:23
  Speaker 5: I have none of it these I'm getting better. It's
• 40:26
  Speaker 5: very hard.
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: Distress tolerance very hard for me. I was gonna ask.
• 40:29
  Speaker 2: A topic that I hear more than anything right now,
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: is like codependence. And everyone is just like I'm codependent.
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: They're codependent. How does ifs and parts work? Look at codependence?
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, yeah, I mean you have a codependent
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: part right, and the part would say something to the
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: effect of if you're okay, I'm okay, can.
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: You explain codependency just like a basic term before we
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: get into I think people like it's a very trigger word.
• 40:56
  Speaker 1: Instagram TikTok, you're a codependent, but like, actually, yeah, let's
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: evaluate if you codependency.
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, codependency is, like I said, if you're okay, I'm okay, right,
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: It's anxiety, and codependency is created to reduce one's anxiety,
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: and that's really where it's birthed from. I'm anxious, so
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: I'm going to do whatever I have to do for
• 41:16
  Speaker 3: you to make me less anxious because I don't want
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: you to leave, right, And so that codependency birth's a
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: lot of self abandonment because then we're just relating to
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: the other person as the means of our tempered anxiety
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: and the means of us feeling okay about ourselves, rather
• 41:37
  Speaker 3: than us actually just being safe. And we need other
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: to make us feel safe rather than inherently feeling safe
• 41:45
  Speaker 3: in our own nervous system.
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: So it's interesting to look at it as a part
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: and to what you said earlier, which I loved that
• 41:53
  Speaker 2: there's no bad parts the book. I feel like codependency
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: is demonized right now. Often it's like you're codependent or
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: I'm coda, you blame yourself being codependent. How can you
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: look at codependence in a supportive light? Yeah, to like,
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: you know, accept and appreciate it, versus being.
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: Like, fuck, why am I so codependent?
• 42:17
  Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah, I mean it really ties into everything we've
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: been talking about, right, It's we are all safety seeking.
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: We all have a different version of what safety means.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: And if safety means if you're okay, I'm okay, then
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: we're going to do that behavior because it makes us
• 42:32
  Speaker 3: feel okay. So this protective measure is a means of
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: staying safe in the world. There's a part of you,
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: a protective part of you, that codependent part that thinks
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: that if it stops doing its job, it will be left.
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: It will be left, it will be alone, it will
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: be you know, everyone's different, of course, everyone's parts are different,
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: but some version of alone and so that behaves is adaptive.
• 43:02
  Speaker 3: Every pattern we have is adaptive. And so, yeah, like
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: someone that has a codependent part viewing that part as
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: a sacred adaptive behavior that was meant to protect us
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: from abandonment, Like, I can have compassion for that part. Yeah,
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: I can totally have compassion for that part.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: I think it's hard for people, even me still to
• 43:22
  Speaker 1: this day, like to understand the adaptive part and why
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: it was adaptive, because I think like when you learn
• 43:28
  Speaker 1: that you have codependency, it came from a adaptive behavior
• 43:32
  Speaker 1: that you did earlier on in your life. But I
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: don't think it was even clear to me, like why
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: I was, you know, codependent, Like I didn't understand it,
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: and I didn't even know it was a behavior that
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: I was doing until there was anxiety that was coming
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: around the relationship or there was understanding the reasoning that
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: it happened, and then it became so clear and like,
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: you know, I'll say it like I was, you know,
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: I was codependent with my mom growing up, Like I
• 44:00
  Speaker 1: just was, and I've learned why, and I'm like great
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: now around it. I totally figured it out and we're
• 44:06
  Speaker 1: like have a very healthy relationship. It's always been, you know,
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: like it's been my favorite relationship with my mom. But
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: I think, like it is challenging because you don't really understand,
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: you don't really know you have it until you know
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: you have it, yeah, or in like I don't think
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: people even like I mean I'm thirty six now, like
• 44:24
  Speaker 1: took me most of my life to even understand it,
• 44:26
  Speaker 1: of course, and and it clicked, but it took forever,
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: of course.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: And you know, this is part of why we learn
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: in relationship, like it's really hard to heal your relationship wounds,
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: not in relationship like going back to the familial piece,
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: like it's hard for things to come up unless there's
• 44:46
  Speaker 3: some sort of intimacy and who better to do that
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: than like a romantic partner, right, And going back to
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: that distress tolerance piece, like, part of why you were
• 44:55
  Speaker 3: able to heal your codependency with your mom was because
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: you were able to expand your discomfort, expand your capacity
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: for discomfort and go, Okay, I don't need to do
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: this a mesh behavior. I don't need to have this
• 45:08
  Speaker 3: type of relationship with my mom to feel safe. I
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: can have one that doesn't make me abandon myself in
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: the process.
• 45:16
  Speaker 5: Oh oh, that was distressed tolerance.
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: That was distress.
• 45:20
  Speaker 5: Well, I should give myself more credit for that.
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: I did not account that part for distress tolerance because
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: I would say to myself and words have meaning, that
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: I am actually bad at distressed tolerance. But that's actually
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: just not true now, I mean, yes, a little bit
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: but the fact that I was able to learn because
• 45:36
  Speaker 1: I did a fear like, what would I what would
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: it be like if I separated? Could I trust myself?
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: Could I could I do it on my own?
• 45:44
  Speaker 3: Wouldever still be there for me?
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: Would all these things? And then obviously the answer is yes.
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: But the distress tolerance is hard. Yeah, that's so interesting.
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: We were talking about the triggers and the different parts,
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: and you know, you were saying that you were so
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: avoidant of some of them at the pain and that discomfort,
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: and then now you've been able.
• 46:04
  Speaker 4: To explore it.
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: If someone has someone in their life that is, you know,
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: constantly experiencing these triggers and they're avoidant of that pain,
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: and so they're not addressing it. They're not addressing the
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: source of the trigger. It could be a partner, could
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: be a friend. How do you navigate that? I know
• 46:23
  Speaker 2: you can't change people. I know you can't do the
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: healing for them. I know you can't, like they're on
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: their curriculum, right, but it doesn't make it easier that
• 46:31
  Speaker 2: you're like, you love this person, You're spending time with
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: them every day or you know, multiple days a week, Like,
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: how do you navigate that?
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: I mean a word that is also thrown around like confetti. Boundaries,
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: Like you have to have boundaries around that stuff, Like
• 46:48
  Speaker 3: I can love someone so deeply and inherently, but if
• 46:51
  Speaker 3: like every time I'm with them, they're having an explosion
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: because Phil in the blank happened and it like activates
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: my nervous system in a way that doesn't make me
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: feel safe, then like the most loving thing I can
• 47:02
  Speaker 3: do is reflect that and be like I love you.
• 47:07
  Speaker 3: I notice this pattern. It affects me. I'm going to
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: take a step back and like create some space. You know,
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: walls keep everybody out, boundaries show us where the window is.
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: Like that we have to find the window that yeah,
• 47:25
  Speaker 3: like it's not stonewalling and just saying like I'm done
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: with you, I'm never talking to you again, Like you
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: do this bad thing and it triggers me and that
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: like that's your own stuff. A boundary is I love
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: you so deeply and I care about you, and this
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: is how you're making me feel and this is how
• 47:43
  Speaker 3: it affects me, and like I care about you too
• 47:46
  Speaker 3: much to see you blow up your relationships or blow
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: up your work or so I'm going to take a
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: step back and like, if you need some support around this,
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: like I'm here to support you, if you want a therapist,
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: if you want some guidance around this, like I'm here
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: to support you. But I can't do this every day.
• 48:05
  Speaker 3: I can't. And so this is this is the boundary,
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: and boundaries are DNA desire need action. I desire need action. Yeah,
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: what I want is this. The need is this, and
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: this is how you do it.
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: What I want is this? The need is this, and
• 48:26
  Speaker 4: this is how you do it.
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: This is how you do it.
• 48:28
  Speaker 4: So someone is doing something repeatedly, that is you realize
• 48:33
  Speaker 4: you need to set a boundary around what I want
• 48:36
  Speaker 4: is I.
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: Want is more space from you because it doesn't feel good. Yeah, right,
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: So I need you to respect that and I need
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: you to maybe get some help around this. And what
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: that looks like is calling this person doing this thing.
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: And once that's there, we can reopen the door.
• 48:53
  Speaker 1: But like, yeah, it's boundaries are like so hard, so hard,
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: like the hardest. I think it's one of the hardest
• 48:57
  Speaker 1: things to do with people.
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: You love, especially if you're a code Bennett.
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: Don't remind me, but I think I think, but I
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: think you're okay.
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but I think.
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: The challenge with the boundary is that codependency often just
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: goes one way, not always both.
• 49:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and so absolutely.
• 49:11
  Speaker 1: In relationship, when you set a boundary, oftentimes if the
• 49:14
  Speaker 1: person on the other side is not as healed as
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: you are, or is not doing the work or does
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: not realize it. Like I have friends that want to
• 49:20
  Speaker 1: set boundaries of people they love, and they're afraid to
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: set the boundary because of the reaction from the other person.
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: And that reaction gives you so much anxiety that potential,
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: so you actually don't create the boundary, and then you
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: resent them, and it goes on and on.
• 49:31
  Speaker 5: I guess my.
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: Question is, like, what do you tell somebody who is
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: so afraid to make the boundary with the person they
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: love deeply because of the potential reaction the person is
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: going to have? Like, how can someone who is an
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: anxious or even an avoidant sit with that potential.
• 49:46
  Speaker 5: Outcome?
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: Who do you want to abandon them? Are you? Yeah?
• 49:51
  Speaker 3: Like which one?
• 49:52
  Speaker 4: Yeah?
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: Come on, you have it's so hard.
• 49:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that's fucking.
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: Great, but you have to like, yeah, I started thinking
• 49:58
  Speaker 2: about this.
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: People abandon themselves more all the time, more times than
• 50:01
  Speaker 1: they should because of the relationship as.
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: A people pleaser, and you know, I recovering people pleaser.
• 50:08
  Speaker 2: Something I started asking myself was whenever I would catch
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: myself where I'm gonna give up one of my needs,
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: like I want to go home and relax, and someone's like,
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: my friend's like, let's go out. If I'm going to
• 50:23
  Speaker 2: people please, I have to be one of the people
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: that I'm pleasing, Like I have to put myself If
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: one friend's like, let's go out to a party, my
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: other friend's like, let's go out here, and I have
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: to put myself in front of me be like, yo,
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: I want to go home, so let me at least
• 50:41
  Speaker 2: please this third person.
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: Some of the time, totally choosing the discomfort of saying
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: no over the resentment of saying yes is like.
• 50:50
  Speaker 1: Such a game changer. Resentment's a terrible feeling.
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: Oh, it's terrible. It's the worst. Foundaries are hard, they
• 50:57
  Speaker 3: are and worth it.
• 51:00
  Speaker 1: In the end, they are yeah, because you just start
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: to like, the relationship just dwindles over time, and you
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: don't even realize that it's dwindling progressively worse to the
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: point where you're like, you don't enjoy the relationship, and
• 51:14
  Speaker 1: the person doesn't know that you don't enjoy the relationship,
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: so it's like a double whammy.
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: We could have a whole nother podcast on that.
• 51:19
  Speaker 5: Well, you're going to come back.
• 51:20
  Speaker 1: I would love this has been I could do this
• 51:22
  Speaker 1: for five more hours. You're coming back on TV. I'm
• 51:27
  Speaker 1: telling you right now, you can come back on.
• 51:29
  Speaker 3: I'd be honored.
• 51:30
  Speaker 5: Are you taking new clients?
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: I am taking new clients. I just had a couple
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: of spots open.
• 51:34
  Speaker 5: Cool.
• 51:34
  Speaker 1: I think you're amazing. I think anybody out there. Yeah,
• 51:37
  Speaker 1: how can people find you?
• 51:38
  Speaker 3: People can find me on the gram at Alexa Silvaggio
• 51:43
  Speaker 3: s Yeah, perfect a l e x A s I
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: l v A G G I O alexisilvajo dot com
• 51:50
  Speaker 3: and you can register register for therapy. But you know
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: what I mean. You can do an intake and then
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: we can have a free call and see if it's
• 51:58
  Speaker 3: a good fit. I am taking new clients in person
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: and on the interwebs in California. Yeah, in Pasadena is
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: where my business is.
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: Alexislovagia, Welcome to free therapy.
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much, both of you for your outrageous
• 52:16
  Speaker 3: openness and your presence. You're such a gift.
• 52:18
  Speaker 5: Thank you.
• 52:18
  Speaker 4: Wow, thank you. Appreciate you. So fun than such a gift. Yeah,
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: I appreciate you. Hey, thanks for listening. We appreciate you.
• 52:27
  Speaker 1: If you enjoyed this episode and us embarrassing ourselves and
• 52:30
  Speaker 1: talking about our feelings, you are definitely going to like
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: everything else.
• 52:33
  Speaker 2: Follow on on Instagram at free therapy and we'll see
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: you next time.