Latest / Sales Trajectory Podcast / “Future-Proofing Timber: Recruitment, Training & Carbon Warrior Movement with Kersten Gentle (FTMA)”

Transcript

“Future-Proofing Timber: Recruitment, Training & Carbon Warrior Movement with Kersten Gentle (FTMA)” · Sales Trajectory Podcast

• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to the Sales Trajectory Podcast, where innovation meets execution in sales.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Jason Howes, your host, a 35-year sales veteran and lifelong student of the game.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_01: This podcast is for leaders and sales professionals with a growth mindset.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_01: You'll hear real sales stories about new products, motivating teams to prospect, and boost productivity.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: We dive deep into sales process, cutting edge tech, and recruiting top sales performers.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: Let's get started.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome, Kirsten.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: Nice to see you again.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Jason, nice to be here.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_02: And look, it wasn't that long ago that we did catch up at your excellent conference you had on the Gold Coast.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: And there recently we were having a bit of a discussion, and I I think there was a lot of value in what we were talking about.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_02: So I do appreciate your time and being able to catch up today.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: My pleasure.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: And Kirsten, I mean you're very active in the market.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: I see you're in Canberra, you're all you're traveling nationally, you've got the carbon warrior shirt on there.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: Just give us a bit of an update about what you've been doing lately.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so from FTMA, we've really been focusing on our future and we've been looking at what the issues are for the industry.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_00: So a few weeks ago we brought all our partners, um, previously known as our sponsors.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: So we put all our partners together with our board.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: The FTMA board sat down and did our strategic plan, which we'll be releasing in the next fortnight.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: And then we sat down and met with all of our um partners to go through all the key issues.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_00: So we put forward our key issues such as training and ability to attract the right people, especially around the timber systems design.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: We looked at the fact that we need to promote, you know, timber as the environmental benefits of timber over steel and other building materials.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: We looked at a whole range of what the issues are and how we're going to combat it.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_00: And really excited by the work that's been, yeah, we're doing like Carbon Warrior.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: I must say, lobbying for Carbon Warrior compared to my old job of lobbying for the native timber industry, wow, it was so much easier.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: And at the moment, carbon is is the answer.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: And what we're doing is we're taking solutions to the politicians.
• 2:40
  SPEAKER_00: We're showing them examples from eight different jurisdictions around the world that have got policies that recognise the role that timber plays in addressing our climate crisis and the fact that they can't do it without using more timber.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: So we've been really, it's been really exciting actually, Jason, going up and talking to the politicians and just getting that real passionate feedback, whether it's from liberals, whether it's from the Labour, whether it's from Tammy uh Tammy Terrell or Jackie Lamy's pay, or even the teals, they're really excited about it and they all recognise that timber plays a role in addressing the our climate crisis.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: Look, I mean you're talking to an old timber guy here.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: I've been selling timber for over 30 years, even though I actually don't sell it right now in my job, but I work with a lot of companies that do.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean it is very close to my heart.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: And um, yeah, nothing better than getting on a building site and smelling that the fresh smell of timber cut and and that that construction process, you know.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's uh it's it's very yeah, I love getting on site and seeing what the guys do.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_02: And look, I mean, who would have thought we're in this situation we're at at the moment?
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, this has been going for a you know for a long time now, and and we've obviously seen the supply shortages, you know, around the world with timber, and I think it's fantastic what you're doing.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_02: I know going back to my time with Hein, you know, years and years ago, they used to take us out through the forest as part of it, you know, our sort of training and development in the business there.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: And it was always great to see the process and how it works from tree to finish product.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's a credit to the industry.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: I know a lot of people are under a lot of pressure, they've been under pressure for for a long time, and you must be seeing that with the the manufacturers as well.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely are the the stress levels besides dealing with with the pandemic, which everyone's had to do, that the absentees and that's been um caused by the pandemic.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: And and then on top of that, they had the timber shortages, which is you know now slowly but surely smoothing itself out.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: But there's so much on the plate of a small business owner at the moment, whether it's the new IR laws, whether it's just the inflation, it's a stressful time.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it was probably the second interest rate rise that builders, you know, fabricators started to see that builders were putting the brakes on or consumers were putting the brakes on.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: And those stresses continue to rise.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: So yesterday, actually, we released uh a new FT time podcast, and it's all targeted at the business owner around how to handle stress as they come up to Christmas.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we want to make sure that um too many business owners get to Christmas and they go, yes, everyone's out of the way, we can now catch up on everything.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you know what?
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_00: If the owner of the business or the manager doesn't take that time to look after themselves over the break and refresh their batteries, they're not going to be good to anyone in the new year.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, yeah, I mean, I'm actually uh part of TX.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_02: This is a conversation starter, it's a uh mental health uh support mechanism for our industry.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: And look, I mean, they do some fantastic work.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and actually they are nominated for Queensland of the Year this year.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: So I think it's very important to have that support for your team.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_02: Actually, and this sort of leads into the conversation we were having as well.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's just about obviously having that ability to be able to, you know, get the people on your team that you need.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: And and we spoke about the difficulty in in finding estimators and details, detailers, and and you've you've got some new terminology that you're using as well, trying to, you know, really ramp up the the excitement about this role.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: Because I I was that was my job when I came out of school.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: So what's the uh the new name you came up from?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: It wasn't we came up with it.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_00: We brought together industry, the NAPAC companies and looked at it.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: So basically, somebody from Oz Industry, which is a government, federal government program, they talked to me, and I reckon this was probably eight years ago now, and they said, The problem is you're advertising for estimators and detailers.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: You advertise for detailers and you get people that wash cars and they do a really good job at it, or you advertise for estimating and people think along the tax terms.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so he said, these days, the younger generation, they want a title.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: They want a title that you know is a sexy title.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: I I remember my nephew getting a role and he was a sales rep.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, here he was 23 and he was a sales executive something.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, what the you know, just just the way they worded it.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_00: So anyway, when I was speaking to um Tim about this, they turned around and said, Well, what do you do?
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_00: That's what you need to look at, what your industry does.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: So it those people seeing the ads, they know straight up what it means.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: So we got together with the industry, as I mentioned, and we came up with timber systems designers.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: What we do is we build timber systems and we design them.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, that the role of the estimated detailer, which people continually go back to, and slowly but surely you're seeing people say, my business team.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_00: So we want it, we believe being part of a design team is a lot more inclusive, and we created advertisements for this.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: So the advertisements we created actually have the job advertisement for a timber systems designer or a trainee, timber systems designer, and it also has a job description.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the first two fabricators that actually use this, one up in North Queensland and one in uh West Sydney, they had the position filled within the week.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: And the people they actually got applying for the jobs were people that had building qualifications and understanding.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it's really about attracting the right people.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: We need the right language, and we need to make sure that that language is uniform across the industry.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_00: So even when it comes to jobs in the factory at the moment, Jason, I can look on Seek, for example, and I can see three or four jobs from our industry, and they all got different language.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: So at the moment, FTMA has just received a Victorian government grant, and we're engaging Katie Patterson of um from our HR consultant who will work with our members and will create job descriptions for every job in our business.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_00: So that way we'll be able to give these job descriptions to fabricators.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: The next part will be creating that job advertisement around it, and that way we get some uniformity around the language in our industry, but also how do we sell it?
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: Because people go, This is the job.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's great.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_00: But as we talked in our discussion, the people looking at the job are going, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's the job.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_00: But what's it what's in it for me?
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_00: What's the benefit to me?
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not just about the money, it's not about their their remuneration, it's about the team that they're working with, it's about the flexibility.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_00: It's things like our members, we provided them with a free domestic family violence policy.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: It's about working for a business that provides a supportive work haven.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: Things that people are looking for.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_00: So in these job advertisements, it's not only getting the right wording and the uniformity around the job advertisement, uh the job descriptions, but it's also showing them what they can actually do.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: They can have uh I love that.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that's I can speak from my own experience, um, because I'm actually, I think I mentioned I'm recruiting for a estimator veto at the moment, and we this is how we sort of had this discussion because when I looked online, and obviously recruitment is part of what we do, um, it is like contracts estimators, there's contracts administrators, there's um, you know, all these different, you're right, different terminologies.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I I actually really like the one you've come up with because when I because it traditionally, as you know, it was you know frame and trust.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_02: And now it's like, oh, do you do frame and trust?
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but also do four systems.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, well, how many do you need to mention before you go?
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, a new name is is is better, you know what I mean?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: Totally agree.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think also, Jason, the important part is that we can then break it into say four KPIs.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_00: So what the next step of the process is to break it into those four KPIs, and then FTMA's next in 2023, we'll be looking at benchmarking different salaries right across our industry, and then we can actually get benchmarked salaries for those different four KPIs.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_00: So at the moment, I recently said to my board, you know, I I know for designers out there that are getting 50k, and I know ones that are getting 100k.
• 10:42
  SPEAKER_00: The first response when I say that is everyone says, Can you send me the new details of those on the 50k?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: Because they recognise that they're it's it's definitely being underpaid.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_00: But what we need to look at is okay, these are the different descriptions.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_00: How do we actually because employers don't know how to set rewards or set those increment pays for the designers because that we're not in any award, and we need to make sure that we are actually doing, you know, paying the right money for the designers because they are an integral part of our business, but that there's some sort of transparency there in regards to what those KPRs, KPIs are and what the expectations are.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, most certainly.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I think what what I'd love to touch, go back and touch back on what you said about the fact that I think it's fantastic that you're writing job descriptions and and and also uh job adverts, because part of what we do in our recruitment is helping companies rewrite it because you, as you said, you want to be able to go to the market and go, this is a fantastic opportunity.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: This is what it looks like, this is what's in it for you.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_02: This is what you know we offer as far as you know, like work perks are big at the moment, you know, like you're gonna get, you know, a few half a Friday afternoon off, or you're going to get your birthday off, or you can work from home so many days a week, or you know, you and I think they're the big things at the moment.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: I think we need to flip this back around and and be writing it to be candidate specific because it's tough to get people.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: And and if you're asking someone to come and join your team from the comfort of another company, well then you've got to be able to talk the right language, you know.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I mentioned before, like, you know, 60 plus percent more are looking at a seek ad on a mobile phone.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I mean they don't want to read a full job description, they want to be able to scan it.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: Is the money reasonable?
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I think what you said is great as well, because I we're in in the process, I mean now there was a massive variation in in salary levels, you know what I mean?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_02: And as a past detailer or timber design system, um you can make a company a lot of money and you can cost a company a lot of money.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I think a very good one is worth, you know, rewarding.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: And and as I said, that can be a mixture of base or allowance or work from home.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't have to be all financial, but but as I said, yeah, maybe there are some leading KPI incentives as well for for these people to go, hey, I can come into this job and I can do it well and I can earn more money and I can have a better work-life balance, you know.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's um yeah, the days because you might someone might say, Oh, I'm paying my guy 50 grand, that's pretty cool, hey, but it's not cool when you turn around and he's walked out the door the next week because someone's offered him more because you're underpaying them.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_02: So the market has switched, and I think business owners need to, you know, obviously look at their staff and go, hey, what have I got to do to, you know, make sure they stay?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_02: And and I think a lot of that as well, what we spoke about was the investing in training and development.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you know, a lot of businesses haven't done that, and it's easy to say that I'm, you know, really busy, I haven't got time, but it's not an excuse.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: And and it also goes back, Jason, to the you know, that old line of when people say, you know, I don't want to train my people because if I train them, they'll leave and get a better job.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: But if you try if you don't train them, they're gonna stay with you and continue to do a shit job.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: W we need to look at it and we need to look at what makes people stay.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: People don't stay purely for the remuneration.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: No, as our sector is slowly changing from, you know, traditionally, and and we still are that 90% mum and dad businesses, as we continue to change and and with people at Bunnings and and the continued growth of IHG and some of the other corporates, people say, How do I, how am I going to compete with a loyalty card, like a discount card, I should say.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: Well, people don't stay with these businesses for loyalty cards or discount cards.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: They stay because they're part of a team.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I love the fact that I can go around to our members and I can see the employment, employee wellness programs that they put together.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: And recently, you know, I was at a plant interviewing um some of the employees about um what it's like to work in our industry.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_00: And they all said, we are here for so you know, so-and-so.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: We are we work for him because he treats us right.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: So many people have different things.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_00: I know there are fabricators that give a day off for their birthday or or things like that.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_00: But what we want to look at is where you want to work.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I know years ago there was a company in Canada that painted the in a hole inside of their factory.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we all talk about how beautiful it is, the benefits of working around timber, and yet we work in steel factories.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: We've had, I've seen some members go in and paint the floors or paint the walls just to make it a better environment for people to work in.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, we need to, we need to continue to address that.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_00: But as an industry, it's a great industry to work at.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: And you only have to see the businesses where they've got employees working for them for 10 years, 15 years.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_00: We we did an award um recognizing employees that have been with businesses, and I think the the longest we did was like a 45-year war.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_00: So in our industry, because it's a great history and great people.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, there's a lot of long-term people in the you know, the old, as we mentioned, the Dalsons and the Heinz of the World might sort of stuff, it's pretty impressive.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_02: But I think going back to, I mean, your team is your greatest asset, and I think right now, yeah, there's a lot of challenges going on there, and it's a good time for for companies to protect their team.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_02: And I mean, the last thing we want to see here is, and I know there's been, you know, a lot of offshore, you know, jobs going over because of the lack of people here.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: So I think we we definitely we need to bring, you know, the younger generation through.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_02: As you mentioned, we need to bring people off site and we need to, and if there is offshore work, I mean, it's you know, at least the people here are managing it.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: But the important part about offshore is offshore will not work unless you have a good designer in your business.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_00: So, unless you have a good designer based in your factory here, it will not work using offshore.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_00: Offshore is fantastic and they have done a brilliant job filling the gap.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_00: But unless you've got someone, so what would people need to do?
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: We're in the lowest unemployment in over 50 years.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_00: We need to look outside that sphere.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: I've been to a member's where behind them they've got a computer screen and I can see it moving.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I said to them, What's that?
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what's happening?
• 17:00
  SPEAKER_00: And they said, Well, you know, so-and-so, one of our top designers worked for us, his partner got a teaching job down in Victoria, and we didn't want to lose him.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: So a Queensland-based business.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: So he said, What we did is we said, right, would you like to work with us remotely?
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_00: He said, We have it set up.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: And he said, Not so we can keep an eye on whether he's doing the job, but more the fact that if he stripes a problem, instead of us having to waste time finding out where we're up to, he will then say to us, and I'll just turn around and I've been see it completely on the screen.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: We need to look at those nine to three jobs.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_00: Is it better having no one work for you at all?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: Or is it better that you have someone work between the hours of nine to three so they can do it?
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I think in this position, it's a perfect role for that.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I was it, you know, we we often interview people for jobs and they're like, they're up front.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, we say, like, what are you looking for in this role?
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_02: What's important for you?
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: And they're like, I need to be able to do this.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, okay, well then if that's on the table and and our clients happy to accept that to get the best person for the job, or that's what they do.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_02: And you're right, there are a lot of people working remotely now.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I suppose so, in that, in that from that point of view, I mean, when you are recruiting, it gives you a bigger pool of people to to look around for, particularly from the regional area, as you know, because sometimes there's not as much choice as um and they need to take off the blinkers as an employer.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: You need to take off the blinkers.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: So recently I interviewed Sean Harper, who's a wheelchair user, works for Alpine Trust up in Wangareda.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: So Sean said he'd applied for a lot of jobs.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_00: He said, you know, when you're putting a job application together, it's hard as somebody in a wheelchair.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: Do you push it?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Do you not?
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, but you he he wanted to be up front.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: He said, for him, he was lucky that George Prothero saw past the wheelchair.
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_00: He said he saw past the wheelchair and he gave me a job.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_00: He plays wheelchair rugby and he's talking to someone on the sideline of wheelchair rugby and goes, What do you do for a job?
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_00: And he went, I'm a trust detailer.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: And he goes, What?
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a wall frame detailer.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_00: And they were so excited because Scott McKay works at Bendigo Trust, um Officer Bendigo.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: So our industry is really suitable for people that are wheelchair users.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um recently I contacted um the Dylan Orcott his new foundation called The Field.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_00: So the Field is all about placing people with disabilities into jobs.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_00: And it it was really remarkable, Jason.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_00: So we are going through the steps with them, whether FTMA creates an employment platform for our sector or whether individual businesses actually go on.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: We're working through what will be the best benefit.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: And what you can do is you can actually put in videos of your workplace to show that it, you know, how how suitable it is.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: You can put videos about the job.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: So FTMA is looking at doing a few videos around, you know, the role of a designer and and to show how it is friendly for those wheelchairs.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: And it's got an inclusive language tool.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know about you, but I was always unsure.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_00: I used to say wheelchair bound, and I didn't know whether I was using the right language.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't want to be insulting.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: So on the the field, which is on their website, there's an inclusive language tool.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_00: So for example, I can go to that inclusive language tool and I can type in wheelchair bound, and it comes up with other language that you may consider is wheelchair users, you know, and and it shows you those options.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: So we're going through looking at how we can attract those people that do use wheelchairs into our sector as designers.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: But the thing that's holding us back is the lack of training for our sector.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: It is just so damn frustrating.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: So FTMA coordinated with the nail plate companies, a few fabricators, and through the Victorian Skills Commission, which is now the Victorian Skills Authority, and we created this amazing short course for timber systems designer.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: The idea is this classroom delivered and it's one week, you know, and then a month or one week in the factory.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: We were wrapped with it, and the materials that we have created are just brilliant.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone looks at the materials and says, but there's no way they've seen any better materials.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_00: We were thankful that Tabmar came on board with the project and they got Colin Taranto to actually write all that assessment material and it can be used for the designers that do the course.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: They can use it as information to go back and refer to.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_00: The only problem is we've got a lack of trainers in our sector.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: It came out ready to be delivered, just like I think everything else in the world in February 2020.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: So of course, COVID delayed it.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: I've got a meeting next week where we're going back to say we need to get this training online.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_00: It needs to be, you know, no inhibitor there, needs to be no inhibitors to the course for geo geographic, you know, depending on where you live, whether you are in a wheelchair, whether you can get out.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_00: So we're trying to get that training on online and once we believe we get that online and it will really help in this I think the e learning platforms are very good these days.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, I've I've got one myself that I use.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I think and and what you were saying before, it's about getting you know, the people into the industry and really being out of and I I I think as well, without disrespect, and and I know um I'm not running a um a large manufacturing site, but uh I think the importance of getting the young people through and and and the and and the people the existing people that are working in these businesses as well.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_02: I mean from what I've spoken to recently is that they're looking for opportunities to um learn more and be more of a part of a business as well.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_02: So why not give them that buddy system or mentor system where they can go, hey look, that's your buddy, you know I mean and you're gonna walk him through and support him through his training and development.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's very important.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: I know I was fortunate when I was uh 18 to have a very good I had two or three good mentors in in different areas of the business and I think that makes a big difference because yeah you want to feel like you're part of the team and you want to feel like what you're doing is is going to get you.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I actually had a quick look at the course you you uh sent through I think it's fantastic and again I mean I'm here to support you in any way as well if I can offer any assistance because for me it's important for us to continue to bring these young people through but as you mentioned also bring people off site that have that have possibly had enough of it and for the builders I I encourage fabricators talk to your builders or if you're part of your HIA or MBA we'll be actually working with HIA, MBA, the Independent Builders Network, Company Australia to promote the fact that people who builders make absolutely brilliant designers.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_00: So they know so much of the terminology already they know where everything fits together.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_00: So they're well ahead of the class when it comes to coming into this field and it's a great what what got me is um Scott um sorry Sean up at Wangaratta.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: He said to me Kirsten when I was a builder I used to hang shit on all my mates that worked in the office like they they they're missing out they're not out in the fresh air they're not stimulated as a builder we're stimulated how can you be sim stimulated sitting behind the desk however now that he's a designer he goes I am still I I am problem solving every day.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm stimulated I feel part of a team he said as I said when I was a builder I'd hang it on my mates now they'll work in an office he said wow why I didn't do it earlier he said you know maybe I wouldn't have been in a wheelchair if I did it earlier but the important part is they they are great jobs for the for for people that um want to get off the tools they are great jobs for people that want to be you know who are not want to be sorry but people that are in wheelchairs they they are great jobs for them.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: People that are nine to three stay-at-home parents it's a great job for them.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_00: Digital fabricators need to take off the blinkers and hate to say it, but you know 98 point or 88% men in our industry, we need to also look at employing more women.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_00: So if if we take the blinkers off I think that we um can try and attract more people to look for me when I'm recruiting I I hire the best person for the job.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_02: That's got nothing to do with it.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I actually I've you know recruited some fantastic ladies in the sales community and I take my hat off to everyone that um you know they everyone I think has said best person for the job and I think what you mentioned makes a lot of sense.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_02: I think um the other thing I was going to go back on with the uh new terminology you're using and and building up the you know the the role itself because when I was doing it I loved it it was you know you don't know what that next plan's gonna look like when it walks in.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_02: So from a yeah from a problem solving and technical point of view it's actually a really great job to do.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: And the passion Jason of being so the carbon warrior when I walked into eco to first stand in Tassie the other week what uh other month wearing the t-shirt I walked in and and the designers were in the front office and they went wow carbon warrior what is it?
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I went oh it's you and they went what I said well your carbon warriors you spend your whole day working out how to store you know how to build and design with timber and that timber stores carbon for life.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_00: We want it so instead of saying I work in a factory I work in a frame and trust factory and people go what's what's that?
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: They go, I'm a carbon warrior my whole job is storing carbon in timber for life.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_00: Now there is an argument some people say oh it won't make any difference but if Visi can advertise for green manufacturing jobs why can't our sector our sector is m is the perfect definition of green manufacturing jobs because they're jobs for people to come in in the manufacturing industry and they're doing an amazing job as an environmentalist storing carbon and timber.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I just think that that may attract only 1% of extra employment.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: But if that's 1% that we can get extra because people want to come in because they know they're doing their bit for the environment, because as we tell politicians, the biggest financial investment the average Aussie makes is their home.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: But we need to make sure that the people of Australia realize the biggest environmental investment an individual can make is also their home if they choose renewables.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: It all starts with a choice and that's what we need to get across.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: So if we can get fabricators and the employees whether they work in the factory or whether they're timber systems designer if we can get them passionate about being carbon then them as a company are more likely to cascade the information and about the environmental benefits of timber and it also gives them something to be proud of that every day they are doing their bit to actually address our climate crisis.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely no a lot of thanks very much for sharing your story there.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_02: It's always great to uh hear more about what you've been up to look I think we could talk for hours uh it's been really great talking with speaking again with you Kirsten appreciate everything that you do in the industry and and look I think next year like everything you know there's there's going to be challenges but there's also a lot of great opportunities as well for our industry and I think you know what we're seeing at the moment with with the changing in dynamics and with construction and offsite construction it's it's really exciting to be part of it.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: So again thanks very much for your time uh it's greatly appreciated.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_00: No worries truly appreciate Jason and all I'd say is to fabricators out there, we don't have a lot of employment agencies or people like yourself that actually work specifically with our industry.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_00: So I do encourage fabricators if you do want Jason's contact details reach out to me.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure they're going to come up on the screen after the end of this anyway.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah reach out because to have somebody that actually understands the role of designing actually understands our industry to have Jason help find the right people for your industry whether it's salespeople, marketing or timber systems designers, you definitely can help.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah it will I appreciate that very much and it's it's quite interesting you say that too because you know as part of a timber system designer I mean you're also doing a lot of selling a lot of people don't realize.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_00: They are the first contact and that's why our short course we went back to basics learning how to take the plans off manually but also problem solving and communication because you're f your your estimators, your timber system designers in the early stage, they're your first contact with your builder so they have to be able to have good communication skills and they have to be able to problem solve and Jason could definitely help you with that too.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and I appreciate your kind words there.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks very much no worries thanks a lot got a product that's struggling or launching something new reach out we're inviting guests who want to make a real impact