Latest / Imperfect Marketing / How Sena 10x'd Her Business with Email Marketing | Fish Story Secrets

Transcript

How Sena 10x'd Her Business with Email Marketing | Fish Story Secrets · Imperfect Marketing

• 0:28
  Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Kendra Korman.
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: If you're a coach, consultant or marketer, you know marketing is far from a perfect science and that's why this show is called Imperfect Marketing.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Join me and my guests as we explore how to grow your business with marketing tips and, of course, lessons learned along the way.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome back to another episode of Imperfect Marketing.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: I'm your host, Kendra Korman, and I am really, really excited, like I was super excited when I got an email about Sina Wheeler, who is the founder of sinaccom.
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: Okay, and I just love the fact that you 10X'd your business by writing better emails, which is just amazing.
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: But before we jump into that, why don five generations?
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: But my parents say you know?
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: probably 500, because my grandfather immigrated from Norway.
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: He learned to commercially fish from his father, who learned from his father, who learned from his father.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: So we're a fishing family.
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: We live in Washington state and we fish up in Alaska and my husband's a fisherman because he married in.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: My dad was a fisherman because he married in.
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: So really we're sort of like my mom and I are like fishing wives we just bring it, find the fisherman.
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: So my husband sort of married into this and he's a fisherman and so he's been doing that for over 20 years.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: So we have a long history of fish.
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: I have a master's degree in food science and I worked in industry like regular normal non-fish industry.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: I studied fish and got my master's degree in fish and omega-3 content and all that.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: But I just worked for like a baked goods, you know, and for 10 years, and so that gave me a lot of good.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: I loved it.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: I worked in a lab.
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: It was very like food science, like I wore a lab coat, it was very cool.
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: And then I stayed home to, you know, with our third child and so I'd been home for a couple of years and my husband was fishing and I've, you know, I studied on board handling techniques compared to sensory.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: So I'm telling him all you know, like you have to do this and you have to do that, like we have, literally.
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: And he's catching Copper River, sockeye and King, like he's catching the best fish on the planet and he's handling it the best you can possibly handle it.
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: And so one day we're on a road trip or going to Thanksgiving and I'm, and he's on the marketing committee for Copper River, which is like Copper River is a big deal, and I'm going like you should do this and you should do that and you should market it like this, you should market it like grass fed beef and it should be special because of this, and blah, blah, blah.
• 3:18
  Speaker 2: And he finally just turns to me and goes you should.
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: And I was like no, you should.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: And he's like no, you should market my fish.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: It's the best fish, and you know why?
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: And why don't you tell people and why don't we just sell it?
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: And I was, and by the time we got to Thanksgiving we told everybody we're starting a business, it's called Seen a Sea, and the crazy thing is that was Thanksgiving and by the first of the year, you know, we really did.
• 3:45
  Speaker 2: We started the business and we had it going because he's going to he leaves for fishing in the spring and it was like, all right, well, go catch some fish and I'll sell it on our website.
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: That is just such a cool story.
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: I love the origins, I love the history, I love the passion.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: I mean it truly.
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: You can tell that you're passionate about more than just the company, right?
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: You're actually passionate about the science behind the food and how it's done, and that is so cool, all right.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: So you started the company and then you started an email list right away.
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, there's that moment like we got the website going and we literally I mean we had champagne and we toast ourselves like wow, we really did it.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: And like we sit there and it's like crickets.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: I mean I don't know what we expected.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: Like we just expected that we'd done the hard part and like people would just show up and we had no idea about marketing.
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: And so I was following an online like class on how to set up everything Right and thankfully because I had we were living very rurally, I barely even had internet I had to watch the videos like between eight at night and eight in the morning and like wake up and watch the videos.
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: I got three kids.
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: He's in Alaska.
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: I mean sometimes I'm like it's amazing that we pulled that off.
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: But you know, when you're passionate, you do it Right.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: And so the biggest thing was like, oh, we didn't do the hard part, that's the easy part, you know, now we have to get people to come, and part of my program was, she said, set up an email list, and I literally was like this was 10 years ago.
• 5:25
  Speaker 2: I'm not on people's email list Now.
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: I'm very aware of what they are.
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: I didn't even know what it was very aware of what they are.
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: I didn't even know what it was.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I was like, okay, I'm just did it literally because step eight do this.
• 5:38
  Speaker 2: And I'm like I told my website person I guess I need an email list, I don't know.
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: So I started sending and then on the program, like now start sending emails, and I'm like, okay, there's like 40 people on my list and they're my own friends and family.
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: Okay, there's like 40 people on my list and they're my own friends and family.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: So I emailed them.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: So what I'm very thankful for is that I did what I was told and I started emailing them and those emails were horrible.
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: Well, I just cringed thinking about them, you know.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: But thank goodness I did that and started where I started and there was a few friends and family and they didn't hate me for it.
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: They just like, oh, sina's so cute, whatever, this is whatever.
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: And it just I was able to keep a little bit of perspective, like because my list was small.
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: I knew it was, it didn't matter that much and it allowed me to practice.
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: So by then our list just grew and grew and grew and it really grew organically SEO and things like that, I guess.
• 6:41
  Speaker 2: Or people told their friends, I don't know.
• 6:43
  Speaker 2: But we did have just steady growth and I just got better and better at it.
• 6:47
  Speaker 2: And then I started taking courses on how to write things because I realized this is where my sales are coming from, right away.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: Yes, 100%, and I love that you followed direction and that you started an email list.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: I got an email from someone, so I sent an email a couple months ago now and it was if I was to start over what I would do, and one of the things that I would do is I would have started my email list from the get-go rather than just I was.
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: I was very comfortable, right, I was getting referrals, my business was growing.
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: I didn't have a big email list and I was like, yeah, I was like I'm good, I don't really need that.
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: But I made all my clients do it right, because I love email marketing and I think that's one of the most effective things.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: But, of course, I didn't do it for my business.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: So that is just amazing that you did it for yours right from the get go.
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: And just so you know, my first emails were not so good.
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: My first podcast I don't even want to listen to those things anymore.
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, they were so stiff.
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: And yes, so we all have to start somewhere and I think that it's good that we do and that we learn and get better as we go.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: So talk to me about why do you think email marketing is important to small businesses.
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: It's definitely where I have the best connection with my customers and because I've been emailing and because my emails, I've allowed myself to be personal in the emails.
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: Like this is where I have learned to express myself.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: I can put it in an email Like social media doesn't.
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: I don't feel connected with my social media audience.
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: I post more content but I don't feel connected and I don't feel like they know me.
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: But on my email audience, you know I've talked about my kids and this and that I mean I have merged a lot because our lifestyle does revolve around fish.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: I mean you think, how can you talk about fish?
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: I've talked about fish every week for 10 years and I've got more to say, but I think it's because it weaves our family in so much, and so it's really about the lifestyle.
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: You know, when Rich is coming, when he's going, what our kids are doing.
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: They come out on the boat.
• 8:52
  Speaker 2: But I've also taken on the challenge of, like, my son is a wrestler and my husband's a coach when the off season, so we're like a wrestling family.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: It has nothing to do with fish, but if that's what I've done, I'm doing all weekend, you know, and I got to write an email on Monday.
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: It's like I would take the challenge of like how can I write about wrestling and have a hook, have a transition, make it about fish, because I've sell in every single email and there is a link to purchase fish in every email and I judge every email by how much it's sold.
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: I mean, that's what I'm, that's the point.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: That's why I'm sending this to you guys.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: My audience.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I'm not trying to act like I'm not selling fish, I am.
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: That's why I sent the email.
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: So I think that's part of it too, is having the confidence to just yes, I am selling you something.
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: I'm going to tell this fun story, we're having a great time, I'm going to transition it and I'm going to sell fish and I feel fine about that.
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: And I don't think there's anything wrong with selling.
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: In every email I have people that are uncomfortable selling.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: You can still build a connection and have some people not buy.
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be a hard sell on every email right, you can make that connection.
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: It doesn't have to be boring.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: It doesn't have to be.
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: Here's the five reasons you should buy from me today.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: So that's part of what I have taken, that challenge of, like I use the wrestling, but you know it's like, well, how do I write a fun story?
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: And you know, make it work, and that's kind of the challenge but it's, you know, writing about your life or being authentic.
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: I've had times that last year it was my son again, he was graduating, but right, we had graduation right at the same time of our Copper River Salmon opener and we have all these pre-orders and I mean there's, you know we didn't get all the fish in time and things were just like not going perfect.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: And I wrote this email to my customers and it was like thank you, thank you for being patient, thank you for being the best customers Like this is a lot and we are doing the best we can and I appreciate you guys and I appreciate everything and I had a huge positive response from it.
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: And then I put a link and sold some fish and I sold a lot of fish and so I think that you know having that connection and going ahead and writing, you know they understand and get to know you, but always going ahead and putting that link in there.
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: I think of it this way, too, is when my friends talk about something that they really like, the first thing I say to them is send me the link.
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: Like I want to buy it and I want you to make that easy for me.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: And when they send me a text with the link, I'm very appreciative because they just saved me a bunch of time to go and look for it.
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: So I feel like if I'm gonna talk about fish and then not put a link in, that's almost like rude, that's almost like now, go find it for yourself.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: So I think of it as a time saver and a nice thing to do is to put a link to your products.
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: It definitely is a time saver, and there are people who want to buy your product right.
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: So just because you're emailing them and building that relationship again, that selling piece doesn't have to be hard.
• 12:02
  Speaker 1: You're making it convenient because you have something that they want or need, and I think that that's really important to keep in mind, and I love how you phrase it that way, that, hey, you're helping them by including that link.
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: So we talked about the fact that you don't wanna read your early emails, and I'm right there with you.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: I changed the email system so I don't ever have to see that again.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: How do you get more comfortable writing and creating that, because that's not easy.
• 12:30
  Speaker 2: What you're saying to do to create a connection between wrestling and fish, right, I think, just doing it honestly, just taking the time to do it.
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: And then I've also worked at it, so I've taken some courses on copywriting, so I've, you know, incorporated some of that and I found that, oh, when I incorporate some of this, I can do better, I can write better.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: So it's this actual skill.
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: And then, through that experience of taking some copywriting courses, I now follow copywriters and I'm on their email list and I receive their emails and I read them, and so I actually, just from reading other people's emails people that do a really good job I think that that can be kind of inspiring.
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: It's like you're not going to do the exact same thing, but you're hearing their tone, you're seeing the way they're writing, and that can help a lot.
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: So I think just putting a little bit of effort into the world of copywriting and following some experts and reading their stuff can make a real big difference.
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: Yes, I had a copywriting coach, I think last year.
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: No, it feels like forever ago, but anyway, last year for a majority of the year, and it was amazing.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: I mean, I've written my whole life.
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: I actually consider myself a good writer, but sometimes too close to my business and so I don't make the connections that I should.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: I don't always sell as much as I should, right, because it's my business, and so it's different and it's a little bit harder and things like that.
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: And so making that effort, I think, is huge, and figuring out what you like to read, right, what are you connecting with, and then how can you take those lessons and apply them to what you want to do.
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: So I love that.
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: Are there any copywriters that you recommend we follow?
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: Oh, I'm going to blank on their names.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Oh, jump on our email list.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: Of course, her group is the Shrimp Club.
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: Shrimpers and I'm trying to think of Laura Belgray.
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: Yes, she's really good, and she sells products of copywriting.
• 14:27
  Speaker 2: And I'm trying to think of Laura Belgray yes, she's really good, and so, and she sells products of copywriting and I've taken some of her courses and she's really good.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: And just having just her style like you don't want to open with a big paragraph, people are going to look at that and they're just not even going to want to invest in reading it and that's just the way it is.
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: People that looks like work, and so even just putting spaces in and just cutting out some words, you don't need these lengthy sentences, people just want to dive right in and have it very digestible.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: So I think making it really looking for easy to read.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: When I took Laura's courses, it was all about the red pen, just like write it and then take most of it out.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: And when I that was years ago, like I found that I was taking out my intro paragraph every single time.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: I actually still write it.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: Sometimes it helps me sit down and go like, because I did this last week, now I'm talking to you about this and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and then I start writing and then when I edit I'm like, okay, yeah, just delete that whole first paragraph.
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: Nobody cares why I'm writing this.
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: Yes exactly.
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: It's what's in it for me as the reader, right, so they don't necessarily care about the why behind it all the time.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: So let's talk about growing your list and your revenue per email, because you determine the success of an email not by opens or by clicks, but by sales, which I think is amazing.
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: I use Klaviyo, I used to use MailChimp, but either one you get a number on.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: You know, I have a link in everyone, like I said, and I have a sales number so I know what's hitting I have, I can see the title, you know the subject line and the sales and so I'm looking back at those and I'm going what are some of my bigger seller?
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: You know, obviously, when I have something available, sometimes it's just like Copper River is open and you know money falls from the sky and so it's like sometimes I'm just announcing something.
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: I get that.
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: But there's other times that I can definitely see a message hit with my audience.
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: One of our biggest emails one summer was you know, everybody talks about limitation.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, you got to make it limited and blah, blah, blah.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: But I sent this email about the biggest salmon run on history.
• 16:33
  Speaker 2: You know, at Bristol Bay it's not even our river, not where we catch our fish, but it's the biggest return of salmon in the history of recording returns of salmon.
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: That's a huge deal.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: That's a that means all the sustainability things we're doing are working.
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: It's a really awesome message and that was my biggest selling email.
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: It wasn't even about our fish, but it resonated with people like, wow, this is awesome, I can buy this fish, it's not the last fish on the planet, that's great.
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: So it's understanding what messaging is resonating with your audience.
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: So I think, looking back over those emails and seeing what worked and what didn't, so you're really kind of self-teaching yourself with your own stuff.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: And then also, when I'm writing an email and I'm not sure, I just tell myself well, I'm just trying something, I'm just going to see.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: It might not work, but it'll be data, it'll be something I can look at and something I can see.
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: So it gives myself a little freedom there.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: And you send once a week, I send on Mondays and that's the other thing.
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: The next easiest way to increase your revenue is just send more emails.
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: I know, I mean it doesn't cost you any more to do it.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: When I first started I would.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: I just sent like a couple times a month and it took me a couple years to really be like okay, I'm going to send an email every Monday and that's my thing, and I'm gonna do it every Monday and I still missed a few.
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: But now I do a monthly giveaway.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: So if you're on the list, you're eligible for the $50 coupon giveaway and that's one email a month.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: That is very easy to write.
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: It's already written.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: I just changed the name and so that's my freebie for myself.
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: So I put it wherever I want it.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: It doesn't matter what time of the month it's on.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: I put it when I'm gonna be busy.
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: I get like a done for you email that week and so that's really.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: That helps me just manage my own schedule.
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: And like I'm gonna be busy, it's giveaway week and so I mean if there's two in a row, there's two in a row, you know whatever.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: But so I do once a week.
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: And then a year ago I added fish Fridays.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: So it's just a recipe, it's no story.
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: I include a recipe I value, I see it as like value to the customer, and then I of course include a link for that fish that's in the recipe to purchase.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: But there's no hard sell, it's just a recipe and then a link to the fish with a description of the fish.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: I also send that to my most engaged audience, so the people that are already reading my emails and enjoying my content.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: So that helps because I get really good open rates, which my service providers like oh wow, you have really good open rates, so people open it and then sometimes I have more purchases on that one than my Monday email.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: So you know you're just hitting people when they're ready for the information.
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: They might store it, they might look at it later, they might just increasing it.
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: What that did for me was it allowed me to go from one email a week to two emails a week without being much more difficult.
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: Just sending more emails.
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: It's going to make you more money Okay, so let me ask you a crazy question how do you feel when people unsubscribe?
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: I feel nothing, I don't look at it, I don't worry about it.
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: It's not for me.
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: That means they weren't going to buy.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: I pay for subscribers on my list.
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: I don't want non-buyers, so if people aren't going to buy, then they can just get off, and that's just been like a mindset.
• 19:56
  Speaker 2: You have to go there.
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: I love that mindset because, yes, if I personally know the person, it tugs at my heartstrings but they weren't going to buy, I don't need to be wasting my time sending them emails.
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: They don't need to be wasting time deleting my emails.
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: Right, having that narrowed list really does help.
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: Right, because you actually get more revenue.
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: Right, and higher open rates and higher click rates and everything goes higher as a percentage size of your list.
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: When the people that aren't the right fit get off of that list, which I think is just so important, and I love that you just don't even look at it.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: It doesn't even bother because you can't, right?
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: And I know that some people are like, oh, I can't send that often because people will unsubscribe.
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: So if they really like your stuff, they're going to stay on your list, even if they're like delete.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: You know, this week I'm too busy to deal with it.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: Right, the other people aren't gonna they're not gonna buy from you.
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, I sit on people's lists for a long time and sometimes I unsubscribe because my inbox is overflowing blah blah and I and I'm, when I make that choice, I'm thinking I'm not going to buy from the like, I don't need this.
• 21:05
  Speaker 2: I'm making that choice.
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, I would say, don't worry about it.
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: And what's way more important than that because, on if you did a really passionate email, maybe you'll get some unsubscribes, but you might get some people passionately loving what you're saying, which is more important.
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: But the numbers to watch are not the unsubscribes.
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: I literally don't even look.
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: But your list needs to be growing all the time and so you just want those numbers to be going up, whether it's advertising or it's very tied to how your business is doing so in the background, you just want to make sure your list is always growing, even if it's a slow rate.
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: Yes, I think that that is just so important, and I love the fact that you shared this story with us on how you 10X your business with email, because you can do it right.
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: I mean, you're sending two emails a week on fish.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: Just, and I'm talking about fish.
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: I mean, what a weird topic, right Like, if I can send two emails a week about fish.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: Right, so I think that there's just so much opportunity there.
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: I love that you took that creative creativity and took building your email list seriously, because email is not dead.
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: Email is still one of the highest, if not the most effective and efficient way to communicate with people, and there are people that have opted in to get your emails, which is amazing.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: So I think that there's a lot of value here, and I really appreciate everything that you shared today.
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: But before I let you go, I do have to ask you the question that I ask all of my guests, and that is this show is called Imperfect Marketing, because marketing is anything but a perfect science.
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: What has been your biggest marketing lesson learned?
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: What's interesting is I never thought of myself as a writer and in fact, I mean I don't even like to write in birthday cards before I started this business I still don't, really I would make my husband do it I never thought of myself as a writer and it was, you know, a couple of years into the business when I had to really make the shift and realize that owning a small business you're a writer, you are a writer, you have a website, you are writing, you're doing copywriting.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: I mean, you have an email list, you're emailing your customers, you're doing social media All of that is writing.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: Just, you know, lean into it.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: And it was when I said to myself okay, I'm a writer like this is a skill in my business, that it made a huge difference.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: I love that.
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: So, for all of you listening, you are writers, so, whether or not you enjoy it as much as you could sort of not relevant that's what you do.
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: It's a skill that you need for your business and so, as you identify your audience and you connect with them connect with them and build relationships through email, because there's just so much value that you can create with them and just such a strong relationship you can create with them.
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: Again, I love that you sell in every email.
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: Again, not a super hard sell, at least a link to where to buy your products.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: Make it easy to work with you if people wanna work with you right.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: So just amazing conversation.
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: Thank you again so much for your time.
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: I really appreciate it.
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: I was so excited when I heard that you were available to be on the show and I think that there's a lot here that hopefully everybody listening or watching got out of it.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: Until next time.
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: Thank you all for tuning in.
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: Have a great rest of your day.