Latest / The Complete Agent - The Podcast For Premium Real Estate Agents / 135. You Want 2%. But Are You Actually Worth It?
Transcript
- Dave Warburton: Hello and welcome to another episode of the Complete Agent Podcast, where each week we get together to talk all things estate agency. My name is Dave Warbett, and today I am joined by Mr. Ian Storett and Mr. James Kendall. Lads, how the hell has your week been? Let's go to you. Hmm, you both you both look a little bit distracted, but we'll go for you, JK. JK: How's the week been? To be fair, we haven't been busting with sales. We've got a couple of dependents. One thing we have got going on at the moment, which has been really good, is pricing conversations with clients. We've got one particular property that we'd sold three years ago and we actually outperformed the market in my opinion. We sold it just over a million quid and unfortunately the sellers at the time, change of circumstances, decided not to sell. We've then got that property back to sell two and a half years later, nearly three years later. yeah, the market obviously landscape has changed somewhat. And we started out at that's part of a million quid and we then moved to 900, thinking that, I mean, that's got to get a result, surely. It's got to get a result. Nothing, absolutely nothing. And then... Yeah, we've been speaking to the seller every week and fair play to Matt because Matt's the one that's been speaking to this client every week. They've built up a good relationship. we had a sit down in the morning meeting, you know, like we talked about before on the pod where, you you go for all of your stock, you know, what sells this house, what sells this house in price. We kind of came to the conclusion 850 sells it. And we had a conversation with the seller. And they've agreed to 850. And then overnight, we've had three inquiries on Rightmove. One dependent that wants to buy it. We've got two more that are going back today. So that should be a sale. We've then also got another one that started out with 900 with another agent. I originally said 850. We've had a slightly lower offer from somebody on there that's dependent, but again, not going anywhere. So I've had a conversation with a client there. Now that's coming on offers over 800. And that should fly now. And that can make a huge difference to our monthly result. mean, we're in the September now, so it's probably going to be pushing it to maybe get those in for the end of the month. know, two, 800 and 850 sales at 2%, like that turns the result very, very quickly from, you know, a not so good result, an average result into, you know, if I look back and I think, and this is, I wasn't going to discuss it on the pod. because we're going to talk about something else. But when you think about your average sale price and where you came from and where you're at now, to get a sale at 800 grand at 2 % and 16 grand, like back in the day, that would have been eight sales for me. And in a market when there's less transactions, it's just, it is game changing, being able to charge a premium fee, which does sort of feed into what we're going to talk about today. so no real actual sales. We've got a few dependents, that are, as soon as somebody sells, there'll be sales that lights up some instructions coming on as well. New board site. We're doing an open day on this weekend. So yeah, I mean, it's, this things are happening. we're in the trenches. We're working hard. don't think speaking around the country. mean, there's lots of people having lots of different results. Some people are flush with instructions and plenty of sales. There's others that I'm speaking to that can't buy a viewing at the moment or buy an instruction. So, you know, it's, it's a mixed bag across the country. But you know, we're, we're doing okay. We're having, we're having a tough time in terms of, know, it's not easy. It's not 2021. You know, my nine year old son could sell houses back then, but you know, we're in the trenches and things are happening, but you just got to have those courageous conversations and keep in contact with your clients regularly and you'll get a result. So that was a really long way of telling you about my week, but why don't we go back to you, Dave, and then we can go, you can tell everyone about the seven offers you're negotiating and then we can go to Ian. Dave Warburton: Well, like you, JK, it has been a little bit quieter. so we're actually I've only negotiated two offers this week. we've agreed two sales, but good sales, you know, five hundred and seventy thousand. Some might say those are in the gold dust range. and we've done JK: Yeah. So 570,000. I didn't think you were selling flats still. Ian: Ha ha ha. JK: Is that 2 %? Dave Warburton: yeah, 0.5% plus that, subject JK: Ha ha. Dave Warburton: to a maximum fee of £400, including that. JK: Excellent. Dave Warburton: and then we've done one at £1.275 million, which was a really nice, nice one. And do you know what? Do you were just talking about hard cells and things like that? This is a another good test case, and and we're gonna come on to this as part of the chat today, I'm sure, but it's it's a good one where you know all the data suggested around 1.3, 1.31. vendor wanted to try at one point four five. you know, assessing motivation, not the market to be doing it. We had that those chats and it was only listed about eight, nine weeks ago. but I got we got this guy in at one point two. got him up to one point two seven five after a bit of messing around and I just said to the owner, you know, let's look at the the stats and facts from what we discussed. This is the good thing about proposals, isn't it? You know, making sure everybody gets a proposal and They can look back on what you actually discussed during the meeting and not pinning the valuation on yourself. and I said you you you're probably like ha 1% away from market value ish. and he he got it. You know what I mean? He he he agreed, sorry, 10% away from market value. He he's he's he's not a million miles away. And we talked about the market conditions, educated him a little bit, and he was like, Yeah, I get it. And it was about how we framed that particular offer, you know, what What does this materially change your life? Does what an extra if I go and get you an extra twenty five thousand pounds, thirty thousand pounds, if it if he would if he walks away, are you are you prepared to lose it for that? Are you but is it's a thirty grand gamble? so we've you know we we placed that one quite well and and we managed to get that tied up, which was good. instructions, we've put a couple of cracking instructions on this week. just again, just two that have actually launched this week, but plenty to come on. So we've got nine in photography. on the Burton side, 700, 1.2 million, 650, 530, 600. So quite a lot of gold dust in there. and I think the thing for me at the moment is, you know, things are a little bit steadier, but pipeline is strong, very strong, and the on-market fees are very, very strong. So when I say very, very strong, you could look at it two ways. You might your on-market fees are high, which means you need to sell some more stock. but at the same time, You've got the stock there to sell. and that's something that I've been chatting to the team about this week, saying, you know, that it's all there. You know, if we were to s like literally sell every house this week, we'll have done you know, fifty percent of the target. So it's just it's just there, like for a full year. It's just all there. so we need to we need to obviously work our stock as well. But what I'm finding is that the new s the new instructions are a little bit more realistic. and you're having to work hard on your reductions. Existing stock. Ian, what about you? Ian: Thanks, Dave. Hello everyone. we've had Yes. JK: Ian, just before you go mate, could you just give us a quick rundown of your internet connection and how good it is? Ian: Me or Dave? JK: No, no, you just want to love to know how good your internet connection is because you know, Ian: Very good. JK: mine's pretty good and stable. Yours seems pretty good and stable. Dave didn't mention his. But yeah, just just Ian: Yep. Yep. No, best not. JK: how's your internet connection been mate? Ian: My internet connection's been really, really good. I've had great week of internet connections. Yeah. Thanks for asking. Strong 5G currently. JK: No, thank you. Excellent. Ian: so things remain busy, you know, across the board. but just as a bit of a snapshot of things, Matt's la on Monday, Matt's previous thirteen valuations had all been people who aren't moving yet. So Matt's had a JK: wow. Ian: bit of challenge of, yeah. He did a bit of a challenge of you know, go into a lot of houses, but quite a lot of them in in a run are people who aren't going to do it until next year, even though we've been trying to persuade them otherwise. So that's been a bit of a challenge for Matt, but equally a couple of good listings this week from him and and Vicky. we've done 14 sales so far in September. So pretty strong month. and four of those were over one point two million. So there's definitely buyers, keep saying to sellers, there's definitely buyers if the price is right or if you've got, you know, patience. required on s on some of them. But there's definitely interest on I think pretty much every house bar one or two that are super quirky at the higher end, there's viewings on everything. we've also got quite a lot in photography, which is in the last couple of weeks we've had so many in photography that it's led to a a bit of a dip in listings because they've not had the time to go out and do valuations because they've been doing so many photo shoots. So you know, it's pros and cons. we have Done a really good interview this week for our senior value a role with a guy who works for one of the premium brands. So that went well. got good experience. Meeting with him again this week. So that was a a good interview. And another good interview, two or two other good interviews for the other role that we're advertising for as well. The see the the client exec role. tricky pricing conversations, lads, as ever. You know, got one. We did a pre-launch at one point seven. We've done five viewings on it. It's had no offers. It's it's a lovely house, but it's it's got quirky elements to it. And I've said to the seller, look, five viewings, no offers. It really should be offers over one point five max. But trying to convince them of that is difficult and we've still not got a resolution on what we're gonna put it the market for. So even with the pre-launch and showing people there's no one wants to buy it at that level, it's still not easy to get it on at the right kind of price. and then Dave, simple similar to you, our pipeline is amazing. Our on-market stock is amazing, but getting them completed, Christ JK: Mm. Ian: almighty, is unbelievably challenging. It's been harder this year than any year we've had since we started stories to to get stuff through and completed and into the bank. Really, really challenging. We've got so much about to exchange, you know, it's so close. So we've got four. Off the top of my head, four, at least four that are sort of thirty, forty thousand pound fees, but they've not exchanged and there's like last minute issues with a boundary or documents being delayed from solicitors or god, it's so close on so many. And I don't know, you know, seventy-five percent of them I suppose will happen as we know, but it's whi which one's gonna fall through. That's the question. So really, you know, yeah. Dave Warburton: Yeah, w we're the same as well. And you and you're trying to you're trying to like I don't know, last minute renegotiations that are s so in insignificant in the grand scheme of things and you just tear in your hair out, it's so frustrating. Ian: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's so frustrating. Yeah. I I can't imagine a world where, you know, being in a being an estate agent in a in a country like the US or you know, like where the system's so much better for the legal process, it must be a much more enjoyable job. Because that side of it, the the twelve, sixteen weeks is just a bloody nightmare, isn't it? It's an absolute nightmare. For everyone concerned and they need to sort it out sooner rather than later. Dave Warburton: Ian, I've got a quick question for you. you mentioned there Ian: Mm. Dave Warburton: about Matt and he's been to 13 people that aren't Ian: Mm. Dave Warburton: yet selling. Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: you know, one of the biggest frustrations I think with estate agent for estate agents, with and for estate agents, is that JK: you Dave Warburton: they'll go to a val, they don't deem it as hot, they go away because and they say they're not selling yet. And then it might be six months later, eight months later, twelve months later, They see a board go up and they think, What? I went and valued that one. So what's your Ian: Yeah. Yeah. Dave Warburton: keep in touch policy now? Have you have you got a strategy for that? Ian: Yep, so they've got a strategy for that. Yeah. That's they they they it depends on the client, you know, so it depends on the client and how amenable they are to us keeping in touch with them. But the the the valuers have all got a a spreadsheet and it's a separate manual spreadsheet that we keep outside of street because we think it's an easier way to to manage it for the individual listeners. And they have a they have touch points when they're speaking to them, they they forward diaris when the net's gonna speak to people and they're keeping in touch with them. regularly, depending on how you know what some clients are like, they don't want you to call them, do they? So it depends. Is it a call, is it a message, is it a visit? Is it a letter? You know, but yeah, they have a strategy on a and a spreadsheet for keeping in touch with people who say they're not going to come on the market. But their first target is to get the market ready and it's to persuade them to go market ready and to try and entice them with properties. Because we know with most people they would sell it today if they found the perfect times to buy. So it's just demonstrating that to them and encouraging them to to get up to to get it you know to get it market ready. And and quite often that's obviously suggesting properties with other agents, you know, that they might not have thought of and really trying to be that trusted advisor as opposed to just being the agent. Dave Warburton: Well you just said there, didn't you? I mean, the the fact is that most people would sell if they found the right property now. and at Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: some point they're going to find the right property and it might not be with you. So that's Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: why market ready is so important, 'cause at least then they can say, Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: I I can be on the market tonight. You know, I just need to Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: ring Ian and it's done. Ian: Yeah, that's right. Yeah. So it's using case studies. I use myself quite a lot as a case study because we did that. We had ours market ready when we moved a couple of years ago. And I was able to say to the house that we bought is ready, I'll put it on right move today. so using a case study of other clients who really benefited from market ready is important as well. Dave Warburton: Mm-hmm. Agreed. Ian: No, I was just gonna say usual mix of estate agency weeks for us, but overall are good, but the same challenges as everyone really, you know, with fallers and and and renews, yeah, at the last minute. JK: So going to get into today's topic, which is a bit controversial. And if anybody has been suckered in by the clickbait title, here's what you've been waiting for. So we were actually going to talk about, are you actually worth your fee? So we obviously spend a lot of time telling agents that, you know, you need to charge more, be a premium agent. Should the argument be, and we said off air, should some agents be charging less? You know, are there there agents out there that are charging 1 % that aren't worth 1 %? What do you think lads? You know, should everyone be charging more? Should some people be charging less? You know, if a seller is, let's say for example, I'm a seller and agent A charges 1 % and you charge 2%, what exactly am I going to get for 1 %? The extra. Dave Warburton: So for me, first of all, it's not always tangible, is it? It's not you know, y y I was I was actually with a client yesterday, and and it was a a long valuation, like a good two and a half hour valuation. house was worth, you know, one point four million. and they asked a lot of questions. And it's quite a unique home as well. And they'd had all the usual suspects out, you know, they they they'd had all the usual agents out that you would have in that local area. And every single one of them is 0.75, 1% based on the actual value of the home, because that's how people value it. it's your house is 1.4 million, so we can charge you half a percent or or or 0.75 because they used to just char you know, getting three and a half grand average fees, so to get a maybe a seven grand fee is is fantastic for them. but not actually delivering any value. so you know, we were comfortably, comfortably more expensive. quite a bit more expensive. And right at the end she said to me, Well, if she her exact words were, Well, I think you can get me more. So if you can get me more, I'm willing to pay you more. So her perception following that two and a half hour meeting was, You are the person that can get me more money. So so how how did we demonstrate that during the meeting? That that I mean there's there was loads of different things. they were actually saying a few things. I think a lot of it's down to some of the questions that you asked, you know, who recommended us and things like that. understanding what their experience has been with the company so far. And what she she was telling me was she watches all of our she follows on social media, she sees all of our pre-launches, our coming soons, she sees all of the cinematic video tours that we do, she likes what I do. and and sh and what she said was we got back to her very quickly. she likes the team engagement so far. And I think it it just starts with stuff that you probably don't put enough emphasis on. obviously we've done the how do you look to death, but so somebody you know somebody will al always resonate with your business brand and your personal brand, but there's so much build-up to that, all the all the touch points that we've talked about before that sort of set you apart before you walk through the door. And then It's it's also how you articulate value and what you can do for the client on the day itself. So again, you know, I I I said to the clients yesterday at the fee point, I I know the photographs in particular are copyable. People are doing better photographs these days, and people can do twilight images and all that sort of stuff. What they can't replicate is me, our service, our team, and the results that we're achieving. So it then moves into sort of storytelling and and what you've done in the past and social proof and things like that. I'll not steal everybody else's thunder here here, because I'm sure that you'll want to get into this as well. but there's loads of things that I've written down here. But for me, a lot of it is down to the stuff that they well, the the lot of it's down to the stuff that they can't see. Which you've got to try and demonstrate, like the the communication, the the fact that you might have an app, the the way you negotiate. JK: So Dave, Dave, I, can I just make things a bit interesting? Couldn't a 1 % agent do all that? Dave Warburton: y well Yes and no. So i I I could charge one percent tomorrow. JK: Yeah. Dave Warburton: and I've got over 20 years of experience and know I feel like I'm knowledgeable at the about the market. I know what's happening because I I t I'm curious about the market. I'm interested in what's happening and what's affecting the market conditions. your standard one percent agent doesn't know these things. They they they typically use a best price guide and will keep compare four bed detached homes with other four bed detached homes. And not not think about any unique features, any unique marketing elements or anything like that. so I think how you carry yourself and how you articul articulate the market is a it's it's how you make someone feel. So so that person, if they're sat in the chair, essentially interviewing you to sell their house, they've got to connect with you, they've got to want to work with you. And One c w I've said I think I've said it before on the pod, but one of the things that I say to pretty much every client that I meet these days is Take the price away because we'd honestly don't know. And you know, the valuation conversation is another podcast, isn't it? because we honestly don't know and nobody can know. Ten people, ten estate agents can walk in here, you'll have ten different opinions. So who do you pick? You know, you'd just pick the highest and the cheapest fee. Take Ian: Yeah. Yeah. Dave Warburton: that away for one moment and then look at each estate agent and how they market your home and what they are going to deliver, what they're telling you they're going to deliver. In terms of the service levels and all that. But look at them. Look at what they've actually done, not what they're telling you they're going to do. look at the social pages, look at the right move adverts, you know, speak to previous clients. Are they prepared to give you the contact details of previous clients? That kind of thing. Once you've done all that and you you know who you think looks the best, and that's how you want your home to look, and that's how you'd like to be represented, then bring the value conversation and the fee conversation back onto the table. And it's it's really powerful when you do it in the room with the client. It really, really is. And I think it it it it can separate the weak agents from the strong agents. but overall, it's not just a tangible thing because you could get a a really you could get and you could get a purple bricks type offering. a really good agent who goes to purple bricks and he says, right, well I'll do for professional photography, I'll do a Twilight, I will do a reel, and I will do a brochure for you and I'll still charge you two thousand pounds, knowing full well they'll make a loss on it all. But can they then deliver the market conditions? Can they then look after you throughout that pro process? Are you confident of picking up the phone to that person and and They and they know exactly what they're doing. They understand the market. They can get you from A to B, can they understand your journey? And that's another massive one. You can demonstrate your value simply by listening to what the client is trying to achieve. And and and most estate agents go out, they look at the house, they'll walk around, sit down and say, This is what I think it's worth, this is what we charge. Without any this any any conversation surrounding the onward circumstances. Again. Yesterday, one of the reasons that the valuation took a while is because we were we we probably spent four forty minutes discussing almost their life, how that property came to be, how they've bought a place in in Anglesey, and they live a lot of the time there. but they were then telling me what they needed to buy in absolute detail. So w we went through all that and I now know exactly what that client needs to achieve to get from A to B. I know how we I think we're gonna do it. But they're also in a position where if the market doesn't deliver, that they're in the hands, the right hands with someone who can keep them abreast of the market conditions and and tell them how it is and get them from A to B. So I think in terms of what makes you a a two percent agent, you know, we'll we'll talk about sort of social proof and all that sort stuff. But I think it starts with how you're making that client feel and and all the things that happened before it, the touch points and things like that. And then how you articulate stuff on the day itself and how you're separating yourself from the competition. JK: To put that into context, so it's a difference between, and when you're telling in terms of being an expert, you know, if you change a state agency to brain surgery and having two brain surgeons sitting opposite you and one person says, you know, basically what we do is we just whip a knife around your top of your head, scoop it out, crack on, set it back up, bish bash bosh, happy days. And then it's the other one that says, right, what we need to do is do a local anesthetic. into your cerebral cortex, cerebral cortex controls, do know mean? It's the detail that that person is able to articulate. And that's an extreme case. But that's where my mind went when you were talking about that. Because we talk about, when you do the, you know, if call it the valuation, if we want to call it the valuation. And obviously, Michelle did that section at the Mastermind on congruence, which, you know, is great for AI and how people are searching for you. But it's also really important when you're Articulating what you're doing as a business. And it's the difference between sitting, like you said, Dave, with a right move, best price guide and saying, well, that one's sold for a 1.2. So your completely different house is a similar size. It should be about 1.2 as well. And not being able to articulate the difference. Whereas, you know, things like the data loft part, part of the valuation in terms of, you know, what What's the market done over the last six years? Why has the market done what the market's done? Where are mortgage interest rates? What is the average interest rate for somebody on a mortgage? What does it cost somebody on average between now and what it costs back in 2021, 2020? What does aggregated inflation mean for the market? So whilst prices on paper have been relatively resilient, £100 back in 2020, You know, even if the house prices are similar, it's very, very different to a hundred pounds in 2026 when aggregated inflations eroded the value of that pound by 36, 37 % now. And I always say to people, you know, it's the difference between I'll have Marks and Sparks and spending a hundred quid in Marks and Sparks in 2020, you get five, six, seven shopping bags. You know, now you're lucky if you get one and I mean, that's just one part of the multifaceted approach of, know, like you said, Dave, the questions that you ask the seller and how you understand them and their needs in order to provide a solution to what it is they want to achieve. And sometimes we're not always the best option for certain people. So for example, I went to one the other day, it's probably in the gold dust range at like 400 odd. They just want to get it on the market and sell it. they don't really, there was no real conversation about, you know, what we do, how we do it. You know, I turned up and despite doing the pre-vowel call and, you know, sending texts and pre-list pack, et cetera, I got there and they were like, which agent are you? It was all very much, I was one of six. And it was like, I just kind of felt like... this, I don't know really why I'm here. Dave Warburton: Mm. JK: And they were like, yeah, yeah, yeah. Now you're the one that got recommended. Yeah. But you sell the big houses, don't you? So sometimes, you you're pre-qualifying the clients as much as they're pre-qualifying you. And I could have won that, you know, if I'd have matched somebody else's 0.7 % and just under half my fee, I could have had that business, but that's not what we're about. You know, we're about adding value to the right sort of clients. And then just quickly on the other end of that, I went to see somebody on Friday, on at 1.75 and sat there, had an hour and a half meeting with them. And at the end I was like, look, you know, I appreciate it. I'm going to be more expensive than the current agent. You know, your agent at the moment, you've said, you know, there's 1 % plus fat. we're going to want a thousand pounds plus fat upfront. We're two grand, 2 % plus fat. and they just said, to be honest, What you charge is irrelevant really. We just want to get a good price for the house. And we believe that you're the person to take us forward and get us moved to market a house properly. So it's as much about them as it is you. Ian: Yes, yes, yes to all of that. I totally agree about the feel and everything you've said. I do think there are some facts and figures that you can throw at people if they ask you those questions, though. So we have data compiled every quarter where we analyze or have analysed for us our key data points. So percentage of marketing price achieved. Amount of properties that we reduce versus the average agents, average time to exchange, et cetera, et cetera. percentage of properties we s that we sell, that we list, those sorts of things. And we well, we we we put that into a lovely little document that we send out in our in our pre-list pack. But it's great to be able to articulate some of that in front of a client. We don't really discuss it as much as we used to. When we were early, I used to use it all the time when we were new because you didn't have any you didn't really have any have any social proof. So all the stuff that you lads are talking about there is completely true. And we basically trade on our reputation now. It goes before us, we're consistent with what we do, we get great fees, we don't get much pushback. Of course, we don't list, we don't convert everything we go to, you know, but we get the percentage that we want. but we do still have this data put together. So it does articulate people and it's proof that we get the price that we put the house on the market for. We get over 100% on average. Still, no one gets over 100% near us. And it's not always about getting more than the competition, even though we do. It's about being accurate with our pricing. So it shows that we're not overpricing. A percentage of what we sell that we list is higher. We reduce loads less than the average agent does before they sell them. So it shows that we're not overpricing. So there is data that you can have if you're good enough that you can use. And I think that's particularly useful when you are a newer company, less well known. I think when you're more established, you need that less because you reputa the three of us, you know, our reputation's so good now and our consistency across everything we do is so good that we don't need that data as much to rely on. because we y you get so many recommendations. But I think having that data to hand is useful as well as as well as just the feely touchy, feely bits. JK: So do you think a lot of estate agents confuse expensive marketing with premium estate agency? Dave Warburton: Yeah, I I think they do. I th JK: So, for example, if you've got great photography, but the agent can't negotiate, are they premium? Dave Warburton: Right. So so this this is a great point and and the JK: Thank you. Dave Warburton: negotiation side is key. Like are you you the the the percentage of asking price is important, of course it is, and it's a brilliant barometer of how agencies are performing. But equally also someone's ability to negotiate, what was the first offer they received and where did it actually end up? That's a key metric. And Ian: Yeah. Yeah, that's another one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dave Warburton: you mentioned the surgeon analogy before. You know, one one of my bug burrs s bears suddenly from my Sort in my corporate days because it was more of a you know, back in corporate y it was a bums on seats mentality. You've got lots of branches, there's th multi you've got volume of instructions, you just need somebody answering the phone and you could have somebody quite inexperienced nego negotiating your biggest tax free asset, you know, like an order taker. and I used to say, like if you've when you nego when you're negotiating a lot of a lot of a lot of estate agents will say to the client, what's the lowest you'll accept? Ian: mate, do you know what I had that this week? Just quickly, Dave Warburton: Which is Ian: I had that this week from another agent locally whose client is buying, well, not buying, is viewing one through us. It's on at 975 grand. It's only around the market for a month. Lovely house. It is listed. It's had a lot of viewings, but it's listed, so it's not for everyone. And the other agent messaged me and said, What's the lowest they'd go? Is there room for negotiation? The procedable. I said, no, it's on it, it's on at a fair price. There's room for negotiation up. Dave Warburton: Yeah, yeah. Ian: But not but not down. It's like like go away, mate. 'Cause and I know that Dave Warburton: Yeah. Ian: that particular agent, he the the the amount of times I've been to properties where they've sold that one of our clients has been buying through them and if they've been working really on behalf of the buyer, not the seller. They've been saying, JK: Mm. Ian: Look, I reckon just offer fifty grand below. I reckon you'll get it for that, no problem. And that is so, so common. And that agent has got good photographs, like really good quality photographs. You know. Yeah. Dave Warburton: Well, exactly. And it's like what you were saying about the surgeon analogy bef before. You you don't you're not about to go into surgery and then the s right at the last minute the surgeon says to you, Right, do you want me to where do you want me to put my incision? Here or here? You'd be like, Fucking Ian: Yeah. JK: Yeah. Dave Warburton: you tell me, Doc. You know. And Ian: Ha ha. Dave Warburton: it's the same with your estate agent, you say, Well, what Yeah. Yeah, you JK: What we doing again? Sorry, this is my first day on the job. Dave Warburton: know, and and asking questions like, you know, we've got two offers here. One's at seven hundred and sixty thousand, they've got a mortgage, they've got thirty percent deposit. The other ones offered seven hundred and eighty thousand, but they're only they've only got a ninety percent loan to value product and 10%. What do you want to do? And then they they're going like, Well, you tell me what's the best thing to do. So, you know, it it does a demonstrating that kind of thing, you know, you you can it's it's it's very difficult because they're not actually engaged. y they've not actually been engaged by you you yet, or you've not been engaged by them rather. So it's hard sometimes to demonstrate things like that, but actually just using some analogies and examples are good. JK: Shall I, can I just say that on the vow, that's one thing I say to people is that, you know, when, when I talk about where we actually earn our fee and why we're worth what we're worth and why we charge what we charge is one of the most difficult things to articulate because it's not as tangible as say the marketing. So I always sort of say to people that you've seen the marketing, no doubt. You can, you can clearly see our marketing is the best in class locally. But where we really earn our money is in the negotiation side of things. And. until we're in the trenches together, you're not actually going to be able to feel the real value for what you're getting until we're actually in it together. Unless you've experienced not so good. And these people that I went to see on the Friday last week, where they said the fees are relevant. The agent they're on with is a quote unquote premium agent. The house is on at 1.75 and the agent has rang the seller. and said, good news, we've got you an offer of 1.7. And the seller went, right, okay, what's their position? And the agent went, I don't know. Ian: Yeah. JK: And she was like, well, it's funny, isn't it? Because it's like, but this is a premium agent. Ian: It's funny. JK: know, we've got London buyers and, you know, we do this and bring London from the Capitol, you know, all that, all that crap that they just spin. Ian: I love your voice. I love your posh old man voice, JK. Love your Yeah. JK: But then when it actually comes down to it, the person that's booked into view has not been qualified. And that's why, you know, when I had that conversation, before they even brought that up, I'd mentioned this and said, look, The value is, you when we're in the trenches together, when I'm ringing you up and saying, right, well, now I've got 1.7 on the table for you here. You know, we have a ruling house. We never accept the first offer. It is their first offer. This is their position. I think we should go back to them and try and get some more money out of them and see what their next offer is. And before they've even said, I will take this, I'll take that. Let's see what we can get back from these people. And let's see where we can get them to. And they were totally on board and kind of bought into that at the time because they've obviously had a bad experience. But the sellers that I go and see that haven't had that experience that maybe haven't sold for 25 years, I say to them, you know, this is where we earn our money because, you know, somebody comes in and, your average agent will spend probably more time, like you guys just said, working on behalf of the buyer. trying to get the deal done because that's, going back to what we were talking about 10 minutes ago on fees, if you're on 1 % or less and you need deals, you'll make, try and make a deal happen at all costs. Cause you know, you've got, you know, you've got deals that need to be done. You know, you're charging a low fee, so you obviously need the volume. So any costs you need to get, you need to get deals done. And I said, you'll find more, more often than not. the agent will spend more time trying to get you to accept the buyer's offer than concentrating their efforts on the buyer, trying to get them to a higher offer. And one of the big things I've often used and credit Stephen Brown with it, because it's one of his obviously training techniques that he uses, taking them back to when they were buying their house originally. would you have lost it for, and I had this conversation with someone the other day, you know, when you bought your house, would you have paid more for it? And quite often people will say yes. And even the ones that want to be really difficult, they say no. So you would have lost it for a thousand pound. Well, no, no, we wouldn't have lost it for a thousand pound. you know, and I had this conversation with someone the other day and we talked them up an extra 10 grand. I said, so there's an extra 10 K there on the table that the previous agents cost the seller that you bought this house off. Dave Warburton: Yeah. JK: That is that's what I do. Let's forget about the marketing for a second that gets the people through the door. I said, but this is where I earn my money in the trenches, getting you more money for your house. But then it's not only that. Dave Warburton: Just just just to pause there, JK, you've just said something really important. I don't want to lose my train of thought. But you're right, th the marketing gets people through the door. It's it's what happens after that as well. You know, so who Ian: Yeah, yeah, that's right. Dave Warburton: is who is representing you? Because you you're one percent agents, not point seven five percent agents who don't have marketing budgets and stuff, they can do a certain level of copiable marketing. After that, if you've got somebody that's inexperienced or not as knowledgeable. Not as passionate, whatever it might be. I mean, a lot of this is about passion, wanting to get that extra 10 grand that you've just described there. Stephen Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: Brown's question is r is valid, it's brilliant. I love how he teaches it, and it's a really good one to use. And like I've said, you're not always going to be able to demonstrate that tangibly. So you've got to you've got to talk it, you've got to articulate it really well. And your passion has got to come across and and negotiation is the key. You know, what is your viewing process? What JK: Case studies are important as well. If you've got case studies for that, Ian: Yeah. You JK: that Ian: wanna flop you wanna flop out as many as you can on the table brochures, that is. we always say to the we always say, Yeah, thank JK: Glad you cleared that out, mate. Thanks so much for that. Ian: you. Do you know what? It's actually Perry Power that used to s make me laugh saying that. Flop it all out on the table. And he's right. JK: what I used to flop it out for you. The brochure. Ian: I always say to sell it not to sellers, well they are I'll start again. I always say to to Matt and Vicky or to any listers that we're gonna have moving forward. Really, you want as many brochures as you can and you want to stick them all out on the table on the valve. Like it's good to have like six, seven, eight. I honestly I would take as many as possible. If they all look mint and they're all relatable to the one you're going to, it's a massive thing for the seller. Really, really JK: massively. Ian: hits home. Really, really hits home. You know, it's a selection of super quality brochures. They all look really high-end, they're all bespoke, and they're all sold within, you know, recent times that's relatable to their house. Brilliant, brilliant for case studies. That and you and then you can talk through each one. This was John and Jane. This was Dave and Sally. They you know what mean? It's but but it's but it's tangible because they can pick up the brochure and look at it while you're talking about it. Dave Warburton: Yeah, I agreed. I I think the storytelling is obviously key. but like I say again, how how is everything else gonna be handled afterwards? The the viewing process, that's a big one. Who are do who's gonna be doing my viewings? Is it gonna be you doing my viewings? Who's gonna be doing that was a conversation we had yesterday with these homeowners, who's gonna be doing the viewings? And you know, I was talking about our two viewing two main re viewing representatives almost on a personal way, their personalities and this is what they do and this Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: is what they like and this is what that they're gonna come round and they're gonna see your house like I've seen your house today before it goes to market. and and they'll they'll know all the passionate things that you know about it. They'll be passionate as as passionate as you are about some of the stuff that you've added. we'll get loads of information about the house and you know it it's it's giving the the the seller a level of confidence that they that they are in the right hands. and Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: and and do you know what it's funny because yesterday's valuation was probably for me textbook to this exact podcast because they asked a lot of questions. They'd had all the low-fee agents out. I was instructed on the day. and they were feeding back to me in the room as to why, you know, they were both at the end saying, you know, I want to go with you because I I just feel you you you've got a bit more passion about you, a bit more, I think you're really going to try and sell it. That kind of thing. Ian: Yeah. Yeah. Dave Warburton: and it you know it's really it's good to hear. and I think that often gets overlooked. You know, the the the share the passion for the house. That that's another thing. You know, when you're doing the walk round. What are you doing? Are you just walking around and getting told there's four or five bedrooms? Or are you are you making mental notes? you know, Ian: Yeah. Dave Warburton: I I always think when I when I get to a marketing spiel and we're talking about right how we've got the home set up and we've got the professional photography and all that sort of stuff, but the biggest USP we've got is video, I might start saying, you know, because what it'll allow me to do is take people on a journey on how this kitchen's become to be and, you know, you've been telling me. that for the last fifteen years you've been the ones that have hosted all the family parties. You told you've had a Christmas tree in that corner. These are the sorts of things that I need to get across on video to peep make people understand the lifestyle. You know, you've built that huge outdoor kitchen area there that's like a little bar area, a proper bar. you know, how has that come to be? You told me you hosted a Christmas in there. and if I'm talking like that and the you know they're telling me that the sun sets right on the house and we sit on a balcony outside our bedroom. We've got a little air fryer there and a little barbecue there. And you know, I'm repeating it back to them. I'm saying, so what I need to do, all the things that you've passionately talked about today and all the things that you've enjoyed over the years, that's what somebody else is going to enjoy. You know, the reason you're selling is because it's just two of you in your five thousand square foot house and you're pottering around. So this needs another family to come in and they're going to be doing everything that you've done for the last two two decades. And it's it's up to me to convey that to make sure that we get the absolute best result and the right buyer through the door for your home. And that that comes with taking an interest in the house, taking an interest in the people's circumstances and how it's come to be. and articulating it and relaying it back to how you're then going to convey that as part of the marketing process. You know, just adding a bit of passion into it rather than just saying, Thanks for walking me around your house, it's worth one point four million, we charge not point five percent. That's it. JK: So three things to think about then. So if the photography is incredible, but the agent can't negotiate, are they premium? If you've got a cinematic video, you don't bring the client for two weeks, are you premium? You know, if your branding looks high end, but your sales progression is terrible, are you premium? Like there's just so many things that are sort Dave Warburton: Yeah. JK: of multifaceted there that you can kind of go into. And I just think there's this... Again, there's so much we can kind of go into. I'm conscious of time. There's so many different parts that we could kind of go through here. if we're... Let's have a look. Do you think sellers actually care about all the things we think makes us premium? So for example, do think they care about professional videos, brochures, drone? office, social Dave Warburton: No. JK: media following. Dave Warburton: No. Not everyone. And that's that's when you've got to be able to walk away sometimes. Like you you said something right at the start, I think, when you were reviewing your week, that the client wasn't for you. You know, you the the a lot of the time, you know, you are I've I actually said so Ellie, who's recently joined us, she's she's come out on quite a few valuations with me and commented on how calm I am sometimes in valuations and just requite relax very relaxed. And then that's what I always try to be. It's just a conversation at the end of the day. and I think you go in in a lot of people go in there with the mindset of the being interviewed for selling this house. I actually see it the other way around as well. I I I'm looking at this and saying, Do I want to work with these people? Do I want to represent this house? I don't want to take on problems. And it's got to be a two-way relationship. If they don't buy into what I'm doing, and if they don't buy into what our marketing can do for them and they don't buy into the fact that a a higher fee might result in a better result, then that's okay. But they're just probably not for me. So I I think think it's like a lot of most most people that you see at the mid to higher end of the market definitely get it. they don't all value it necessarily because they might just think, well my house is the best on the streets. It will sell, stick it on right move and it'll get a load of inquiries. they won't put as much emphasis on all the other stuff. So I I don't think automatic I don't think they automatically think that personally. JK: So a couple of questions then. So this is a good one for you, Ian, because I know you're big on this mindset as well. Can you be worth 2 % and still be incapable of charging 2 %? Ian: yeah. No question. There's no question about that, 'cause that's mindset. So JK: So where does that come in then? So for example, we've got people we talked about on last week's pod about people in the room that have been with TCA now for about two years. they had the chat where they're like, well, we're not taking anything else, less than 10 grand plus fat. And another member getting their first 2 % fee. What would you say to somebody that is thinking about it and is perhaps doing all of the right things but still you know, only charging 1.2%, for example, and then we might charge 1.3%, you know, later. Where do think that shift changes? Ian: Do know what JK? I'm not sure I can answer the question as to where the shift changes, but it but and I d and I don't think it o does always, necessarily, for a lot of people. I'm I'm not sure it ever changes for for everyone. You know, but you but you you do need to I think you need to understand that you can, JK: I think you've said it before. You've said it before. Ian: you need to believe that you can charge it. Because you can charge it, but until you start asking for it, you're never JK: Exactly. Ian: gonna charge it. JK: Exactly that. And that's the thing, know, you, add, once you know, you're confident, you've got all the fundamentals in place to do so. And you know, yourself, cause that's, again, one of my last things I was going to ask, you know, would you instruct your own agency? Like, do you have the belief that, you know, someone came out, you know, Ian story is, you you're not Ian story and Ian story comes out and says, it's 2 % and a thousand pound upfront, you know, knowing what you know about your business. Could you confidently say yes, you'd instruct him? Ian: Well, I think the answer to that for probably for the three of us is yes, because other people do all the time. So I think the the answer is yes, because other people do we week in, week out. But I think for other agents, they need they they really should listen to this podcast and and understand that you can charge the fee if you're worth it. You can charge the fee if you're doing everything that we teach and you put everything everything's in place and everything we've discussed today is there. Then you can charge it and they will pay it. But you know, also comes down to being a good salesperson, you know, and ultimately if if if you're a good salesperson, you can charge, you you can command the right fees, but you've got to be a good salesperson in the room and not a flashy, you know, not a knob ed sales person. I don't know what else to say that. But no JK: So how did you get 2 % then? Dave Warburton: Yeah. I do think there's that old cliche, isn't there? You know, if you if you can't negotiate your own fee, then how Ian: Is a hustle as an element of Yeah. JK: how you're gonna negotiate the house price. Dave Warburton: how yeah, exactly, how are you going to negotiate the house price? So I I think I think there is an element of being a bit bullshit as well. But you know, if you've I think if you've got gaps in your marketing, JK, you know, the tangible thing, then it'll naturally take a strip of confidence off you a little bit. 'Cause you'll think, wow, well that other your stories are doing twilight, and I'm not. So I guess I'm only worth one point seven five percent if they're two. And then they do presenter led videos on every single house. I don't, so there's maybe it's I'm only one point five. And then actually I'm a I'm not as selective of stories about what I take on. so you know, I've got some two bed terraces and I've got a few four bed detached and I've got the odd one at the very high end, but I'm not I'm not doing this every week. So maybe I'm only worth one point two five. And then, you know, y you've you've you've got to I t I class it like you know building up your armory. So I I just think I I feel bulletproof when I go into a a valuation because I'm so confident of the brand behind me. So I know that when we take this property on, it is going to look incredible. I know that it's going to be exposed in all the right areas. And I know that you're in really good hands in terms of negotiation and team communication and all that. I'm so confident with that. But what I'm also super, super, super confident with is my knowledge of the market, the knowledge of the industry, the knowledge of the local areas that I'm covering. I'm really confident. So if somebody asks me a challenging question, I feel that I can ask answer it every single time. And it comes back for me if I'm just going full circle now to write at the start. It's that feel that you give someone. So yes, get all your tangible stuff in place, your top end photography, your twilights, your videos, all that sort stuff. But it all falls down if you can't articulate this in in the actual valuation appointment. And I think it's generally at the end of that meeting, someone needs to think, I let's take pricing, let's take the valuation out of the conversation, let's just take the fee out of the conversation for one minute. I want this guy to represent me selling my house. That's what you've got to get to. JK: Yeah, I think that's probably a really good place to call it this week. I think we've covered a lot in terms of mindset and asking a lot of questions in terms of, are you worth what you charge? And also equally something to think about, you know, do you charge what you're worth as well as an agent? As always, if you are interested in learning more about the Complete Agent and what we can offer and how we can help you get to there, please do reach out, check out the completeagent.co.uk. This podcast runs every week without fail, like clockwork. Dave. Dave Warburton: One last thing. Yeah, just you are giving a bit of a pitch to the complete agent there. The the next mastermind is in December. It's one of the most important, isn't it? Ian: Yeah. JK: Yeah, for setting up 2027. So if you're on the fence now and you are thinking about it, then I would say now is a good time to start looking at it and set yourself up for success for 2027. You can always have excuses about I'll do this when and I'll do that when, but what you really do is you need to take action now. So thanks everyone for joining us and we will see you all again next week. Ian: Bye.