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How China's E-Commerce Rescued What Amazon Abandoned · eCommerce Podcast

• 0:04
  Welcome
• 0:05
  to
• 0:05
  the
• 0:06
  E
• 0:06
  Commerce
• 0:06
  podcast
• 0:07
  with
• 0:07
  me,
• 0:07
  your
• 0:07
  host,
• 0:08
  Matt
• 0:08
  Edmundson.
• 0:09
  This
• 0:09
  is
• 0:09
  a
• 0:10
  show
• 0:10
  all
• 0:11
  about
• 0:11
  helping
• 0:11
  you
• 0:11
  deliver
• 0:12
  E
• 0:12
  Commerce.
• 0:13
  Wow.
• 0:14
  And
• 0:14
  I
• 0:14
  am
• 0:15
  chatting
• 0:16
  today
• 0:16
  with
• 0:16
  my
• 0:17
  very
• 0:17
  special
• 0:17
  guest,
• 0:17
  Björn
• 0:18
  Ognibeni.
• 0:19
  We
• 0:19
  are
• 0:20
  going
• 0:20
  to
• 0:20
  be
• 0:20
  talking
• 0:21
  about
• 0:21
  why
• 0:21
  E
• 0:22
  Commerce
• 0:22
  has
• 0:22
  remained
• 0:23
  largely
• 0:23
  unchanged
• 0:24
  for
• 0:24
  many
• 0:24
  years.
• 0:25
  And
• 0:26
  is
• 0:26
  all
• 0:26
  that
• 0:26
  about
• 0:27
  to
• 0:27
  change?
• 0:28
  That's
• 0:28
  the
• 0:28
  question
• 0:29
  of
• 0:29
  the
• 0:29
  day.
• 0:29
  So
• 0:30
  we're
• 0:30
  gonna
• 0:30
  get
• 0:30
  into
• 0:30
  that.
• 0:30
  But
• 0:31
  before
• 0:31
  we
• 0:31
  do,
• 0:32
  the
• 0:32
  usual
• 0:33
  shout
• 0:33
  out
• 0:33
  for
• 0:34
  the
• 0:34
  newsletter.
• 0:34
  If
• 0:35
  you
• 0:35
  haven't
• 0:35
  done
• 0:35
  so
• 0:35
  already,
• 0:36
  head
• 0:37
  over
• 0:38
  to
• 0:38
  our
• 0:39
  newsletter
• 0:39
  and
• 0:39
  sign
• 0:40
  up
• 0:40
  for
• 0:40
  that.
• 0:41
  We
• 0:41
  would
• 0:41
  love
• 0:41
  to
• 0:42
  stay
• 0:42
  connected
• 0:42
  with
• 0:42
  you.
• 0:42
  We
• 0:43
  send
• 0:43
  you
• 0:43
  the
• 0:43
  notes,
• 0:43
  the
• 0:43
  transcripts
• 0:44
  and
• 0:44
  all
• 0:44
  that
• 0:44
  sort
• 0:44
  of
• 0:45
  stuff
• 0:45
  along
• 0:46
  with
• 0:46
  our
• 0:46
  very
• 0:47
  new
• 0:47
  shiny,
• 0:48
  beautiful
• 0:48
  newsletter
• 0:49
  thing
• 0:49
  that
• 0:50
  gets
• 0:50
  sent
• 0:50
  out
• 0:51
  and
• 0:51
  it's
• 0:51
  beautiful
• 0:51
  and
• 0:51
  it's
• 0:51
  wonderful,
• 0:52
  but
• 0:52
  just
• 0:52
  go
• 0:52
  to
• 0:52
  ecommercepodcast.net
• 0:54
  and
• 0:54
  sign
• 0:55
  up
• 0:55
  for
• 0:55
  it
• 0:56
  there.
• 0:56
  But
• 0:56
  before
• 0:57
  get
• 0:57
  into
• 0:58
  today's
• 0:58
  conversation,
• 0:59
  let
• 1:00
  me
• 1:00
  give
• 1:00
  a
• 1:00
  short
• 1:01
  shout
• 1:01
  out
• 1:01
  to
• 1:02
  Friedrich
• 1:02
  Schwandt,
• 1:03
  who
• 1:04
  connected
• 1:04
  Björn
• 1:05
  and
• 1:05
  I
• 1:05
  today,
• 1:06
  if
• 1:06
  you
• 1:06
  haven't
• 1:06
  done
• 1:07
  so
• 1:07
  already.
• 1:07
  Friedrich
• 1:08
  and
• 1:08
  I
• 1:08
  talk
• 1:08
  about
• 1:08
  the
• 1:08
  science
• 1:09
  behind
• 1:09
  data
• 1:09
  driven
• 1:10
  E
• 1:10
  commerce.
• 1:10
  And
• 1:10
  it
• 1:11
  was
• 1:11
  absolutely
• 1:12
  fascinating.
• 1:13
  And
• 1:13
  that
• 1:14
  episode
• 1:14
  is
• 1:14
  live
• 1:14
  on
• 1:14
  the
• 1:14
  site
• 1:15
  as
• 1:15
  we
• 1:15
  speak.
• 1:16
  So
• 1:16
  go
• 1:16
  check
• 1:16
  that
• 1:16
  out.
• 1:18
  Now
• 1:18
  let's
• 1:18
  talk
• 1:18
  about
• 1:19
  our
• 1:19
  guest
• 1:20
  for
• 1:21
  the
• 1:21
  day,
• 1:22
  Mr.
• 1:22
  Björn
• 1:23
  Ognibeni,
• 1:23
  a
• 1:24
  digital
• 1:24
  strategy
• 1:25
  maverick
• 1:26
  with
• 1:26
  over
• 1:26
  two
• 1:27
  decades
• 1:27
  of
• 1:29
  who's
• 1:29
  helping
• 1:29
  bridge
• 1:30
  the
• 1:30
  gap
• 1:30
  between
• 1:31
  companies
• 1:31
  and
• 1:31
  their
• 1:32
  customers
• 1:33
  in
• 1:33
  our
• 1:33
  rapidly
• 1:34
  digitized
• 1:34
  world.
• 1:35
  Oh,
• 1:35
  yes,
• 1:35
  he
• 1:35
  is.
• 1:36
  When
• 1:36
  he's
• 1:37
  not
• 1:37
  teaching
• 1:37
  at
• 1:37
  Hamburg
• 1:38
  School
• 1:38
  of
• 1:38
  Business
• 1:39
  Administration
• 1:40
  or
• 1:40
  directing
• 1:41
  XR
• 1:41
  Research
• 1:42
  at
• 1:42
  the
• 1:43
  University
• 1:43
  of
• 1:44
  Munster,
• 1:44
  you'll
• 1:45
  find
• 1:45
  him
• 1:46
  decoding
• 1:47
  China's
• 1:47
  digital
• 1:48
  innovations
• 1:48
  for
• 1:49
  Western
• 1:49
  executives
• 1:50
  through
• 1:50
  his
• 1:51
  think
• 1:51
  tank
• 1:51
  ChinaBriefs.io.
• 1:54
  And
• 1:55
  he's
• 1:55
  dropping
• 1:55
  knowledge
• 1:55
  bombs
• 1:56
  everywhere
• 1:56
  in
• 1:57
  publications
• 1:57
  like
• 1:57
  Focus
• 1:58
  and
• 1:58
  Handelsblatt.
• 1:59
  And
• 2:00
  I
• 2:00
  hope
• 2:00
  I'm
• 2:00
  not
• 2:01
  butchering
• 2:01
  too
• 2:02
  much
• 2:02
  Björn,
• 2:03
  the
• 2:03
  German
• 2:03
  pronunciation
• 2:04
  for
• 2:04
  some
• 2:04
  of
• 2:04
  these
• 2:04
  things.
• 2:05
  I'm
• 2:06
  very
• 2:06
  sorry
• 2:06
  if
• 2:06
  I
• 2:06
  am,
• 2:07
  but
• 2:07
  warm
• 2:08
  welcome
• 2:08
  to
• 2:08
  the
• 2:08
  show.
• 2:08
  It's
• 2:09
  great
• 2:09
  to
• 2:09
  have
• 2:09
  you.
• 2:09
  Thank
• 2:09
  you
• 2:09
  for
• 2:10
  joining
• 2:10
  us.
• 2:10
  And
• 2:10
  I'm
• 2:10
  loving
• 2:11
  the
• 2:11
  backdrop
• 2:12
  too.
• 2:13
  Yeah,
• 2:14
  thank
• 2:14
  you.
• 2:14
  Thank
• 2:15
  you
• 2:15
  for
• 2:15
  inviting
• 2:15
  me.
• 2:16
  No,
• 2:16
  no,
• 2:16
  no
• 2:16
  problem,
• 2:17
  no
• 2:17
  problem.
• 2:17
  Maverick
• 2:18
  sounds
• 2:18
  good.
• 2:20
  Yeah.
• 2:21
  Everyone
• 2:21
  loves
• 2:21
  the
• 2:21
  word
• 2:22
  maverick
• 2:23
  if
• 2:23
  you're
• 2:23
  a
• 2:23
  man
• 2:23
  of
• 2:23
  a
• 2:23
  certain
• 2:24
  age
• 2:25
  with
• 2:25
  the
• 2:25
  Top
• 2:25
  Gun
• 2:26
  movie
• 2:26
  franchise.
• 2:26
  Everyone
• 2:27
  just
• 2:27
  loves
• 2:27
  the
• 2:27
  word
• 2:28
  maverick,
• 2:28
  don't
• 2:28
  they?
• 2:29
  Yes,
• 2:30
  I'm
• 2:30
  maverick.
• 2:31
  No,
• 2:31
  you're
• 2:31
  not.
• 2:31
  Your
• 2:31
  goose.
• 2:32
  You
• 2:32
  know
• 2:32
  those
• 2:32
  kind
• 2:32
  of
• 2:32
  things.
• 2:33
  It's
• 2:33
  funny,
• 2:34
  isn't
• 2:34
  it?
• 2:35
  So
• 2:35
  behind
• 2:36
  you
• 2:36
  on
• 2:36
  the
• 2:37
  screen,
• 2:37
  I
• 2:38
  see
• 2:38
  a
• 2:38
  dragon,
• 2:39
  I
• 2:39
  see
• 2:39
  some
• 2:39
  Chinese
• 2:40
  letters.
• 2:41
  Do
• 2:41
  you
• 2:41
  know
• 2:41
  what
• 2:41
  they're
• 2:41
  about?
• 2:43
  Yes.
• 2:44
  Do
• 2:44
  you
• 2:44
  know
• 2:45
  how
• 2:45
  Chinese
• 2:45
  letters
• 2:46
  work?
• 2:46
  I
• 2:47
  have
• 2:47
  Absolutely
• 2:48
  no
• 2:48
  idea.
• 2:50
  The
• 2:50
  thing
• 2:51
  is
• 2:51
  with
• 2:51
  Chinese
• 2:51
  letters
• 2:52
  that
• 2:53
  every
• 2:53
  letter
• 2:54
  has
• 2:55
  a
• 2:55
  meaning
• 2:55
  and
• 2:56
  when
• 2:56
  you
• 2:56
  combine
• 2:56
  them,
• 2:57
  you
• 2:57
  create
• 2:57
  a
• 2:57
  new
• 2:58
  meaning.
• 2:59
  So
• 2:59
  that's
• 3:00
  different
• 3:00
  from
• 3:00
  our
• 3:01
  letters
• 3:02
  or
• 3:02
  syllables.
• 3:02
  Yeah,
• 3:03
  that
• 3:03
  doesn't
• 3:03
  make
• 3:03
  much
• 3:04
  sense
• 3:04
  alone.
• 3:05
  And
• 3:06
  that
• 3:07
  one
• 3:07
  here,
• 3:08
  I
• 3:08
  think
• 3:09
  maybe
• 3:09
  you
• 3:09
  can
• 3:09
  guess
• 3:10
  at
• 3:10
  what
• 3:10
  that
• 3:10
  means.
• 3:13
  It's
• 3:13
  actually
• 3:14
  extremely
• 3:15
  simple.
• 3:15
  It's
• 3:16
  middle.
• 3:17
  This
• 3:17
  is
• 3:17
  where
• 3:18
  my
• 3:18
  ignorance
• 3:18
  is
• 3:19
  just
• 3:19
  going
• 3:19
  to
• 3:20
  blissfully
• 3:20
  become
• 3:21
  aware
• 3:21
  to
• 3:21
  everyone.
• 3:22
  Middle
• 3:22
  of
• 3:23
  something.
• 3:24
  Middle
• 3:24
  of
• 3:24
  something.
• 3:25
  Middle.
• 3:26
  Okay.
• 3:26
  And
• 3:26
  this
• 3:27
  means
• 3:27
  country,
• 3:29
  kingdom.
• 3:30
  And
• 3:30
  if
• 3:30
  you
• 3:30
  combine
• 3:31
  these
• 3:31
  two,
• 3:32
  like
• 3:33
  country
• 3:33
  and
• 3:33
  middle.
• 3:34
  Yeah.
• 3:35
  Guess
• 3:36
  what
• 3:36
  you
• 3:36
  get?
• 3:37
  Middle.
• 3:37
  Country.
• 3:38
  Oh,
• 3:38
  China.
• 3:38
  Okay,
• 3:39
  so
• 3:39
  this
• 3:39
  is.
• 3:39
  Okay,
• 3:40
  fair
• 3:40
  play.
• 3:41
  The
• 3:41
  Middle
• 3:42
  Kingdom.
• 3:42
  Yeah,
• 3:42
  of
• 3:42
  course,
• 3:43
  the,
• 3:43
  you
• 3:43
  know,
• 3:43
  the
• 3:43
  old,
• 3:43
  ancient
• 3:44
  novels.
• 3:44
  The
• 3:44
  Middle
• 3:45
  Kingdom.
• 3:46
  So
• 3:46
  that
• 3:46
  means
• 3:47
  China
• 3:47
  and
• 3:47
  the
• 3:47
  one
• 3:48
  above
• 3:48
  means
• 3:48
  digital.
• 3:49
  And
• 3:50
  so
• 3:50
  the
• 3:50
  whole
• 3:51
  thing
• 3:51
  means
• 3:51
  digital
• 3:52
  China.
• 3:53
  Ah,
• 3:54
  very
• 3:54
  good.
• 3:55
  I
• 3:55
  feel
• 3:55
  like
• 3:55
  I'm
• 3:55
  learning
• 3:56
  already.
• 3:56
  This
• 3:56
  is
• 3:56
  great.
• 3:57
  So
• 3:57
  digital
• 3:58
  China.
• 3:58
  So
• 3:58
  you've
• 3:58
  obviously
• 3:59
  got
• 3:59
  involved
• 4:00
  with,
• 4:01
  I
• 4:01
  mean
• 4:01
  you,
• 4:01
  you
• 4:01
  know,
• 4:02
  you're
• 4:02
  one
• 4:02
  of
• 4:02
  your
• 4:02
  companies,
• 4:03
  ChinaBriefs,
• 4:05
  you've
• 4:06
  obviously
• 4:06
  got
• 4:06
  involved
• 4:07
  with
• 4:07
  trade
• 4:07
  with
• 4:08
  the
• 4:08
  east
• 4:08
  then,
• 4:08
  haven't
• 4:09
  you?
• 4:09
  And
• 4:09
  you
• 4:09
  understand
• 4:09
  China.
• 4:10
  I'm
• 4:10
  just
• 4:11
  reading
• 4:11
  through
• 4:11
  your
• 4:11
  notes
• 4:12
  and
• 4:12
  the
• 4:12
  bio,
• 4:12
  Björn,
• 4:13
  you
• 4:13
  seem
• 4:13
  to
• 4:14
  become
• 4:14
  quite
• 4:14
  an
• 4:15
  expert
• 4:15
  in
• 4:15
  this
• 4:15
  whole
• 4:15
  area.
• 4:17
  Yeah,
• 4:18
  well,
• 4:19
  my
• 4:19
  usually
• 4:19
  joke
• 4:20
  when
• 4:20
  I
• 4:20
  introduce
• 4:21
  myself
• 4:21
  is
• 4:22
  not
• 4:22
  maverick,
• 4:22
  but
• 4:23
  being
• 4:24
  a
• 4:24
  practical
• 4:24
  visionary.
• 4:26
  And
• 4:27
  that's
• 4:28
  only
• 4:28
  half
• 4:28
  a
• 4:28
  joke
• 4:29
  because
• 4:29
  that's
• 4:30
  actually
• 4:30
  what
• 4:30
  I
• 4:30
  do.
• 4:30
  I
• 4:31
  try
• 4:31
  to
• 4:31
  find
• 4:31
  new
• 4:32
  interesting
• 4:33
  ideas.
• 4:33
  That's
• 4:34
  the
• 4:34
  visionary
• 4:34
  part.
• 4:35
  But
• 4:36
  I
• 4:36
  do
• 4:36
  a
• 4:36
  lot
• 4:36
  of
• 4:36
  keynotes
• 4:37
  and
• 4:37
  do
• 4:37
  teaching
• 4:38
  at
• 4:38
  universities.
• 4:39
  But
• 4:40
  I
• 4:40
  always
• 4:41
  try
• 4:41
  also
• 4:41
  to
• 4:42
  help
• 4:43
  companies
• 4:44
  use
• 4:44
  these
• 4:44
  trends
• 4:45
  and
• 4:45
  actually
• 4:46
  drive
• 4:46
  value
• 4:46
  with
• 4:47
  them.
• 4:47
  And
• 4:48
  that's
• 4:48
  the
• 4:48
  practical
• 4:49
  part.
• 4:50
  And
• 4:51
  being
• 4:51
  a
• 4:52
  practical
• 4:52
  visionary,
• 4:53
  I
• 4:53
  always
• 4:53
  need
• 4:53
  to
• 4:54
  find
• 4:54
  new
• 4:54
  trends.
• 4:55
  Yes.
• 4:56
  Sometime
• 4:57
  like
• 4:57
  10
• 4:57
  years
• 4:58
  ago
• 4:58
  or
• 4:58
  so
• 4:58
  I.
• 4:59
  I
• 4:59
  realized
• 5:00
  for
• 5:00
  this
• 5:00
  I
• 5:00
  used
• 5:01
  to
• 5:01
  go
• 5:01
  to
• 5:01
  the
• 5:01
  us
• 5:02
  to
• 5:02
  Silicon
• 5:02
  Valley.
• 5:03
  And
• 5:04
  at
• 5:04
  some
• 5:04
  point
• 5:05
  I
• 5:05
  realized
• 5:05
  there's
• 5:06
  not
• 5:06
  much
• 5:06
  new
• 5:07
  coming
• 5:07
  out
• 5:07
  of
• 5:07
  Silicon
• 5:08
  Valley.
• 5:08
  Yeah.
• 5:09
  And
• 5:10
  that
• 5:11
  was.
• 5:13
  I
• 5:13
  go
• 5:14
  every
• 5:14
  year
• 5:14
  to
• 5:14
  south
• 5:14
  by
• 5:15
  Southwest
• 5:15
  in
• 5:15
  Austin.
• 5:16
  Really
• 5:16
  love
• 5:17
  the
• 5:18
  whole
• 5:18
  festival.
• 5:19
  And
• 5:19
  it
• 5:19
  used
• 5:19
  to
• 5:20
  be
• 5:20
  that
• 5:20
  when
• 5:20
  you
• 5:20
  come
• 5:21
  back
• 5:21
  you
• 5:21
  have
• 5:21
  something
• 5:21
  on
• 5:22
  your
• 5:22
  phone
• 5:22
  that
• 5:23
  the
• 5:23
  whole
• 5:24
  world
• 5:24
  talks
• 5:24
  about
• 5:25
  that
• 5:25
  for
• 5:26
  the
• 5:26
  rest
• 5:26
  of
• 5:26
  the
• 5:26
  year.
• 5:27
  Like
• 5:28
  Twitter
• 5:28
  was
• 5:28
  launched
• 5:28
  there.
• 5:29
  Yeah.
• 5:30
  And
• 5:31
  I
• 5:31
  think
• 5:32
  it
• 5:32
  was
• 5:32
  2014
• 5:33
  or
• 5:33
  so.
• 5:34
  I
• 5:34
  did
• 5:36
  a
• 5:37
  speech
• 5:37
  there
• 5:37
  and
• 5:37
  I
• 5:37
  realized
• 5:39
  there
• 5:39
  isn't
• 5:39
  much
• 5:40
  new
• 5:40
  coming
• 5:41
  out
• 5:41
  of
• 5:42
  south
• 5:42
  by
• 5:42
  Southwest.
• 5:43
  And
• 5:43
  then
• 5:43
  I
• 5:43
  realized
• 5:44
  there
• 5:45
  isn't
• 5:45
  much
• 5:45
  new
• 5:46
  happening
• 5:47
  in,
• 5:48
  in
• 5:48
  the
• 5:48
  western
• 5:48
  Internet
• 5:49
  in
• 5:49
  general.
• 5:50
  And
• 5:51
  at
• 5:51
  one
• 5:52
  point
• 5:52
  I
• 5:53
  was
• 5:54
  invited
• 5:54
  to
• 5:56
  come
• 5:57
  on
• 5:57
  a
• 5:57
  tour
• 5:57
  with
• 5:57
  Accenture
• 5:58
  to
• 5:59
  China.
• 6:00
  And
• 6:01
  I
• 6:01
  didn't
• 6:01
  knew
• 6:02
  what
• 6:02
  to
• 6:02
  expect,
• 6:02
  was
• 6:03
  just
• 6:03
  interested.
• 6:04
  And
• 6:04
  I
• 6:04
  realized
• 6:05
  that
• 6:05
  all
• 6:05
  the
• 6:05
  new
• 6:05
  Things
• 6:06
  that
• 6:06
  I
• 6:06
  was
• 6:06
  missing
• 6:07
  from
• 6:07
  the
• 6:07
  US
• 6:07
  are
• 6:08
  now
• 6:08
  happening
• 6:08
  in
• 6:09
  China
• 6:09
  and
• 6:09
  nobody
• 6:10
  here
• 6:10
  knows
• 6:10
  anything
• 6:11
  about
• 6:11
  this.
• 6:12
  And
• 6:13
  so
• 6:13
  that
• 6:14
  was
• 6:14
  the
• 6:14
  point
• 6:14
  where
• 6:14
  I
• 6:15
  started
• 6:15
  to
• 6:16
  look
• 6:16
  more
• 6:17
  into
• 6:17
  China's
• 6:17
  digital
• 6:18
  trends
• 6:19
  and
• 6:20
  helped
• 6:21
  explain
• 6:21
  companies
• 6:22
  here
• 6:22
  in
• 6:22
  the
• 6:22
  west
• 6:22
  that
• 6:23
  don't
• 6:23
  have
• 6:23
  anything
• 6:23
  to
• 6:24
  do
• 6:24
  with
• 6:24
  China.
• 6:25
  Mostly
• 6:27
  to
• 6:28
  learn
• 6:28
  from,
• 6:28
  from
• 6:29
  China,
• 6:29
  the
• 6:29
  same
• 6:30
  way
• 6:30
  we
• 6:32
  normally
• 6:33
  look
• 6:33
  to
• 6:33
  Silicon
• 6:34
  Valley
• 6:34
  for
• 6:34
  new
• 6:34
  trends
• 6:35
  and
• 6:35
  learn
• 6:35
  from
• 6:35
  them.
• 6:37
  So
• 6:37
  that's
• 6:38
  basically
• 6:39
  the
• 6:39
  idea
• 6:40
  behind
• 6:41
  China
• 6:42
  Breeze,
• 6:42
  but
• 6:42
  also
• 6:43
  behind
• 6:44
  what
• 6:44
  I'm
• 6:44
  doing.
• 6:46
  And
• 6:46
  so
• 6:46
  you've
• 6:47
  been
• 6:47
  going
• 6:48
  in
• 6:48
  and
• 6:48
  out
• 6:48
  of
• 6:48
  China
• 6:49
  then
• 6:49
  for
• 6:49
  a
• 6:49
  little
• 6:49
  while.
• 6:50
  Are
• 6:50
  you
• 6:51
  still
• 6:51
  going
• 6:51
  to
• 6:52
  Austin?
• 6:53
  Well,
• 6:53
  because
• 6:53
  of
• 6:54
  COVID
• 6:54
  I
• 6:54
  haven't
• 6:54
  been
• 6:55
  going
• 6:55
  there.
• 6:57
  I
• 6:57
  started
• 6:57
  going
• 6:58
  down.
• 6:58
  Now
• 6:58
  it's
• 6:59
  easier
• 6:59
  than
• 6:59
  ever
• 7:00
  because
• 7:00
  you
• 7:00
  no
• 7:00
  longer
• 7:01
  need
• 7:01
  a
• 7:01
  visa
• 7:01
  for
• 7:02
  short
• 7:02
  term
• 7:02
  stay.
• 7:04
  So
• 7:04
  I
• 7:04
  invite
• 7:04
  everybody
• 7:05
  to
• 7:06
  go
• 7:06
  and
• 7:06
  visit.
• 7:07
  But
• 7:08
  I,
• 7:08
  I
• 7:08
  can
• 7:08
  do
• 7:08
  all
• 7:09
  my
• 7:09
  research
• 7:09
  also
• 7:11
  just
• 7:11
  using
• 7:11
  the
• 7:12
  Internet.
• 7:13
  But
• 7:13
  being
• 7:14
  in
• 7:14
  China
• 7:14
  is
• 7:14
  actually
• 7:15
  something
• 7:15
  that
• 7:15
  I
• 7:16
  recommend
• 7:16
  for
• 7:16
  everyone
• 7:17
  because
• 7:17
  being
• 7:18
  there
• 7:18
  and,
• 7:19
  and
• 7:19
  seeing
• 7:19
  what's
• 7:19
  happening
• 7:20
  there,
• 7:21
  experiencing
• 7:21
  what
• 7:22
  happens
• 7:22
  when
• 7:23
  one
• 7:23
  of
• 7:23
  the
• 7:23
  biggest
• 7:24
  cities
• 7:25
  like
• 7:25
  Shanghai
• 7:26
  or
• 7:26
  Shenzhen
• 7:27
  or
• 7:27
  Beijing
• 7:28
  are
• 7:29
  totally
• 7:29
  quiet
• 7:30
  because
• 7:31
  all
• 7:31
  the
• 7:31
  cars
• 7:32
  are
• 7:32
  already
• 7:32
  electrified.
• 7:33
  It's
• 7:34
  not
• 7:34
  a
• 7:35
  distant
• 7:36
  future.
• 7:36
  It's
• 7:36
  something
• 7:37
  that's
• 7:37
  totally
• 7:37
  normal.
• 7:39
  Things
• 7:39
  like
• 7:39
  this
• 7:40
  and
• 7:42
  when
• 7:43
  you
• 7:43
  are
• 7:43
  there
• 7:43
  and
• 7:43
  you're
• 7:44
  experiencing
• 7:44
  them,
• 7:45
  it's
• 7:45
  much
• 7:45
  easier
• 7:46
  to
• 7:46
  understand
• 7:46
  why
• 7:47
  it's
• 7:47
  so
• 7:48
  interesting.
• 7:49
  But
• 7:49
  you
• 7:50
  can
• 7:50
  get
• 7:50
  all
• 7:50
  the
• 7:51
  latest
• 7:51
  interesting
• 7:52
  things
• 7:52
  also
• 7:53
  from
• 7:53
  just
• 7:54
  online
• 7:55
  sources.
• 7:57
  Do
• 7:57
  you
• 7:57
  think?
• 7:58
  I
• 7:58
  mean,
• 7:58
  listening
• 7:58
  to
• 7:58
  you
• 7:58
  talk
• 7:59
  and
• 7:59
  I
• 7:59
  get
• 8:00
  why
• 8:00
  you
• 8:00
  would
• 8:01
  say
• 8:01
  there's
• 8:02
  been
• 8:02
  not
• 8:02
  much
• 8:03
  innovation
• 8:03
  from
• 8:04
  the
• 8:04
  west
• 8:04
  where
• 8:04
  the
• 8:05
  Internet
• 8:05
  is
• 8:06
  concerned,
• 8:06
  with
• 8:06
  probably
• 8:07
  the
• 8:07
  exception
• 8:07
  of
• 8:08
  AI,
• 8:09
  which
• 8:09
  has
• 8:09
  been
• 8:09
  the
• 8:09
  big
• 8:10
  thing
• 8:10
  everyone's
• 8:10
  talked
• 8:11
  about
• 8:11
  maybe
• 8:11
  the
• 8:11
  last
• 8:11
  18
• 8:12
  months.
• 8:12
  But
• 8:12
  you're
• 8:12
  right,
• 8:13
  I
• 8:13
  think,
• 8:13
  you
• 8:14
  know,
• 8:17
  I'm
• 8:17
  an
• 8:17
  Apple
• 8:17
  guy
• 8:18
  and
• 8:18
  Apple
• 8:19
  news
• 8:19
  is
• 8:19
  awash
• 8:20
  of
• 8:20
  leaks
• 8:20
  of
• 8:21
  the
• 8:21
  new
• 8:21
  iPhone
• 8:22
  17.
• 8:23
  And
• 8:23
  you
• 8:23
  know
• 8:23
  that
• 8:23
  the
• 8:24
  iPhone
• 8:24
  17
• 8:24
  is
• 8:25
  going
• 8:25
  to
• 8:25
  be
• 8:25
  remarkably
• 8:26
  similar
• 8:26
  to
• 8:26
  the
• 8:26
  iPhone
• 8:27
  16.
• 8:28
  It's
• 8:28
  just,
• 8:28
  it's
• 8:29
  just
• 8:30
  they
• 8:30
  try
• 8:30
  and
• 8:31
  jazz
• 8:31
  it
• 8:31
  up
• 8:31
  and
• 8:31
  make
• 8:31
  it
• 8:32
  sound
• 8:32
  really
• 8:32
  good,
• 8:33
  but
• 8:33
  fundamentally
• 8:34
  there's
• 8:34
  not
• 8:35
  really
• 8:35
  that
• 8:35
  much
• 8:35
  innovation
• 8:36
  there.
• 8:38
  And
• 8:39
  so
• 8:40
  I'm
• 8:41
  curious,
• 8:42
  you
• 8:42
  know,
• 8:42
  with
• 8:42
  that
• 8:42
  sort
• 8:43
  of
• 8:43
  mindset,
• 8:45
  if
• 8:46
  I
• 8:46
  think
• 8:46
  about
• 8:46
  the
• 8:47
  world
• 8:47
  of
• 8:47
  e
• 8:47
  commerce,
• 8:48
  I've
• 8:48
  been
• 8:49
  around
• 8:49
  since
• 8:49
  2002
• 8:50
  in
• 8:50
  E
• 8:51
  Commerce.
• 8:51
  So
• 8:51
  I've
• 8:51
  been
• 8:51
  doing
• 8:51
  it
• 8:52
  23
• 8:53
  years
• 8:53
  now,
• 8:54
  which
• 8:55
  is
• 8:55
  a
• 8:55
  really
• 8:55
  long
• 8:56
  time.
• 8:58
  The
• 8:58
  basic
• 8:59
  essence
• 8:59
  of
• 8:59
  e
• 9:00
  commerce
• 9:00
  has
• 9:00
  not
• 9:00
  changed
• 9:01
  in
• 9:01
  23
• 9:01
  years.
• 9:02
  You
• 9:02
  know,
• 9:02
  the
• 9:02
  fundamental
• 9:03
  structure
• 9:03
  of
• 9:03
  an
• 9:04
  e
• 9:04
  commerce
• 9:04
  website,
• 9:05
  the
• 9:05
  product
• 9:06
  page,
• 9:06
  the
• 9:07
  image,
• 9:07
  the
• 9:07
  add
• 9:08
  to
• 9:08
  carbon,
• 9:09
  there's
• 9:09
  not
• 9:09
  been
• 9:10
  that
• 9:10
  much
• 9:10
  innovation.
• 9:11
  What
• 9:11
  we've
• 9:11
  done
• 9:11
  is
• 9:11
  we've
• 9:12
  made
• 9:12
  the
• 9:12
  Internet
• 9:12
  faster
• 9:13
  and
• 9:13
  we've
• 9:13
  made
• 9:14
  code
• 9:14
  a
• 9:14
  lot
• 9:14
  more
• 9:14
  complicated
• 9:16
  and
• 9:16
  now
• 9:16
  we've
• 9:16
  bought
• 9:17
  in
• 9:17
  things
• 9:17
  like
• 9:17
  AI.
• 9:18
  So
• 9:18
  the
• 9:18
  stuff
• 9:19
  that
• 9:19
  we
• 9:19
  show
• 9:19
  you
• 9:20
  is
• 9:20
  maybe
• 9:20
  a
• 9:20
  bit
• 9:21
  more
• 9:21
  relevant,
• 9:21
  you
• 9:22
  know,
• 9:22
  with
• 9:22
  personalization,
• 9:23
  but
• 9:24
  there's
• 9:24
  not
• 9:24
  been
• 9:24
  massive
• 9:25
  innovation
• 9:26
  there.
• 9:26
  I
• 9:26
  don't
• 9:26
  know
• 9:26
  if
• 9:26
  I'm
• 9:27
  being
• 9:27
  a
• 9:27
  bit
• 9:27
  doomsdayish
• 9:29
  or
• 9:29
  whether
• 9:30
  you
• 9:30
  would
• 9:30
  see
• 9:30
  the
• 9:31
  same
• 9:31
  thing.
• 9:32
  Yeah,
• 9:33
  the
• 9:34
  funny
• 9:34
  thing
• 9:34
  is
• 9:35
  I
• 9:35
  totally
• 9:36
  agree
• 9:36
  with
• 9:36
  you,
• 9:37
  but
• 9:37
  nobody
• 9:37
  knows
• 9:37
  anything.
• 9:38
  I
• 9:39
  realized
• 9:39
  that
• 9:41
  if
• 9:41
  I
• 9:41
  tell
• 9:42
  people
• 9:42
  that
• 9:42
  E
• 9:43
  commerce
• 9:43
  never
• 9:43
  really
• 9:44
  changed
• 9:45
  then
• 9:45
  people
• 9:46
  would
• 9:46
  say
• 9:46
  yeah,
• 9:47
  but
• 9:47
  that's
• 9:48
  because
• 9:48
  E
• 9:48
  commerce
• 9:49
  is
• 9:49
  like
• 9:49
  that.
• 9:50
  What
• 9:51
  should
• 9:51
  change
• 9:52
  there?
• 9:53
  And
• 9:53
  that's
• 9:54
  also
• 9:54
  the
• 9:55
  reason
• 9:55
  why
• 9:55
  China
• 9:56
  is
• 9:56
  so
• 9:56
  interesting.
• 9:56
  I
• 9:57
  mean
• 9:57
  there
• 9:57
  are
• 9:57
  a
• 9:57
  lot
• 9:57
  of
• 9:57
  very
• 9:57
  interesting
• 9:58
  countries
• 9:58
  in
• 9:59
  Asia
• 10:00
  besides
• 10:00
  China,
• 10:01
  but
• 10:02
  they
• 10:02
  are
• 10:02
  all
• 10:02
  living
• 10:03
  in
• 10:03
  the
• 10:03
  same
• 10:04
  digital
• 10:04
  ecosystem.
• 10:06
  I
• 10:06
  have
• 10:06
  a
• 10:06
  lot
• 10:06
  of
• 10:06
  friends
• 10:07
  in
• 10:07
  India,
• 10:07
  they
• 10:07
  are
• 10:08
  all
• 10:08
  on
• 10:08
  LinkedIn,
• 10:09
  Instagram,
• 10:09
  WhatsApp.
• 10:10
  Yeah,
• 10:10
  we
• 10:11
  are
• 10:11
  all
• 10:11
  in
• 10:11
  the
• 10:11
  same
• 10:12
  digital
• 10:12
  ecosystem
• 10:13
  and
• 10:13
  they
• 10:14
  are
• 10:14
  all
• 10:14
  looking
• 10:15
  to
• 10:15
  the
• 10:15
  US
• 10:15
  for
• 10:16
  guidance.
• 10:17
  And
• 10:17
  China
• 10:18
  is
• 10:18
  the
• 10:18
  only
• 10:18
  place
• 10:20
  in
• 10:20
  the
• 10:20
  digital
• 10:21
  space
• 10:21
  that's
• 10:22
  being
• 10:22
  locked
• 10:22
  up
• 10:23
  for
• 10:23
  political
• 10:23
  reasons
• 10:24
  with
• 10:24
  all
• 10:24
  the
• 10:24
  problems
• 10:25
  that
• 10:25
  are
• 10:25
  connected
• 10:25
  to
• 10:25
  this.
• 10:26
  But
• 10:26
  because
• 10:27
  of
• 10:27
  this,
• 10:29
  things
• 10:29
  developed
• 10:30
  in
• 10:30
  a
• 10:30
  totally
• 10:30
  different
• 10:31
  way
• 10:31
  there.
• 10:31
  And
• 10:32
  that's
• 10:32
  why
• 10:33
  it's
• 10:33
  so
• 10:33
  interesting.
• 10:34
  If
• 10:34
  I
• 10:34
  need
• 10:35
  new
• 10:35
  ideas,
• 10:36
  I
• 10:36
  look
• 10:36
  at
• 10:36
  places
• 10:37
  where
• 10:37
  things
• 10:38
  are
• 10:38
  different,
• 10:38
  not
• 10:38
  where
• 10:39
  everybody's
• 10:39
  doing
• 10:39
  more
• 10:39
  or
• 10:40
  less
• 10:40
  the
• 10:40
  same.
• 10:41
  And
• 10:42
  E
• 10:42
  commerce
• 10:42
  is
• 10:43
  a
• 10:43
  pretty
• 10:43
  good
• 10:43
  example
• 10:44
  for
• 10:44
  this
• 10:45
  because
• 10:46
  as
• 10:46
  you
• 10:46
  said,
• 10:47
  our
• 10:48
  E
• 10:48
  commerce
• 10:49
  was
• 10:49
  always
• 10:50
  search
• 10:50
  driven.
• 10:51
  Somebody
• 10:53
  like
• 10:54
  Google.
• 10:54
  Yeah,
• 10:55
  you
• 10:55
  want
• 10:55
  to
• 10:55
  have
• 10:55
  something,
• 10:56
  you
• 10:57
  have
• 10:57
  a
• 10:57
  search
• 10:57
  bar,
• 10:58
  you
• 10:58
  get
• 10:59
  a
• 10:59
  product
• 10:59
  listing,
• 11:00
  you
• 11:00
  get
• 11:00
  a
• 11:00
  product
• 11:01
  details
• 11:01
  page,
• 11:02
  you
• 11:02
  put
• 11:03
  it
• 11:03
  into
• 11:04
  some
• 11:04
  kind
• 11:05
  of
• 11:05
  shopping
• 11:05
  cart
• 11:06
  and
• 11:06
  then
• 11:06
  you
• 11:06
  have
• 11:06
  a
• 11:06
  lock
• 11:07
  on
• 11:07
  process
• 11:07
  and
• 11:08
  then
• 11:08
  you
• 11:08
  have
• 11:08
  a
• 11:08
  logistic
• 11:09
  process
• 11:09
  and
• 11:09
  that's
• 11:09
  it.
• 11:10
  That's
• 11:11
  E
• 11:11
  commerce.
• 11:11
  Right.
• 11:14
  And
• 11:15
  that
• 11:15
  never
• 11:16
  really
• 11:16
  changed
• 11:17
  and
• 11:17
  nobody
• 11:17
  realized
• 11:18
  that
• 11:18
  it
• 11:19
  should
• 11:19
  change.
• 11:20
  That's
• 11:20
  the
• 11:20
  other
• 11:20
  thing.
• 11:22
  It's
• 11:22
  not
• 11:22
  like
• 11:23
  people
• 11:24
  are
• 11:24
  asking
• 11:24
  for
• 11:25
  something
• 11:25
  different.
• 11:27
  And
• 11:27
  in
• 11:27
  China
• 11:27
  you
• 11:28
  have
• 11:29
  a
• 11:29
  different
• 11:31
  e
• 11:32
  commerce
• 11:32
  paradigm
• 11:33
  that's
• 11:33
  parallel
• 11:34
  to
• 11:34
  this.
• 11:35
  Our
• 11:36
  ecommerce
• 11:37
  Powerline
• 11:38
  grew
• 11:38
  out
• 11:38
  of
• 11:39
  the
• 11:39
  idea
• 11:39
  of
• 11:40
  what's
• 11:40
  the
• 11:40
  mission
• 11:41
  of
• 11:41
  E
• 11:41
  commerce?
• 11:42
  Making
• 11:42
  things
• 11:42
  easy.
• 11:44
  But
• 11:44
  like
• 11:45
  20
• 11:45
  years
• 11:45
  ago
• 11:46
  or
• 11:46
  25
• 11:46
  years
• 11:47
  ago
• 11:47
  when
• 11:47
  we
• 11:47
  thought
• 11:47
  about
• 11:48
  why
• 11:48
  do
• 11:48
  we
• 11:48
  need
• 11:48
  E
• 11:49
  commerce,
• 11:49
  we
• 11:50
  realized
• 11:50
  E
• 11:51
  commerce
• 11:51
  makes
• 11:51
  things
• 11:52
  easy.
• 11:53
  I
• 11:53
  don't
• 11:53
  have
• 11:53
  to
• 11:53
  go
• 11:54
  to
• 11:54
  a
• 11:54
  shop,
• 11:54
  I
• 11:54
  don't
• 11:55
  have
• 11:55
  to
• 11:55
  check
• 11:55
  if
• 11:55
  stuff
• 11:56
  is
• 11:56
  there.
• 11:56
  Go
• 11:56
  to
• 11:57
  another
• 11:57
  one
• 11:57
  to
• 11:57
  see
• 11:57
  if
• 11:58
  there
• 11:58
  is
• 11:58
  something
• 11:59
  that
• 11:59
  was
• 12:00
  totally
• 12:00
  normal
• 12:01
  20
• 12:01
  years
• 12:01
  ago.
• 12:01
  It's
• 12:02
  something
• 12:02
  that
• 12:02
  we
• 12:02
  don't
• 12:02
  do
• 12:03
  now.
• 12:03
  Yeah.
• 12:03
  So
• 12:04
  that's
• 12:04
  the
• 12:05
  easy
• 12:05
  thing
• 12:05
  we
• 12:05
  have
• 12:05
  covered
• 12:06
  and
• 12:06
  that's
• 12:06
  the
• 12:06
  Same
• 12:07
  in
• 12:07
  China.
• 12:08
  And
• 12:08
  in
• 12:08
  China
• 12:09
  they
• 12:09
  at
• 12:09
  a
• 12:10
  certain
• 12:10
  point
• 12:10
  said,
• 12:10
  yeah,
• 12:11
  okay,
• 12:11
  we
• 12:11
  have
• 12:12
  this
• 12:12
  easy
• 12:12
  thing,
• 12:12
  but
• 12:13
  how
• 12:13
  about
• 12:13
  making
• 12:14
  shopping
• 12:14
  exciting,
• 12:16
  creating
• 12:17
  experience?
• 12:19
  And
• 12:21
  that's
• 12:21
  a
• 12:21
  goal
• 12:22
  that
• 12:22
  we
• 12:22
  never
• 12:23
  had,
• 12:24
  I
• 12:24
  think.
• 12:25
  And
• 12:26
  out
• 12:26
  of
• 12:27
  this
• 12:27
  grew
• 12:27
  something
• 12:28
  that
• 12:28
  you
• 12:28
  could
• 12:28
  call
• 12:29
  discovery
• 12:29
  driven
• 12:29
  E
• 12:30
  commerce.
• 12:31
  So
• 12:31
  it's
• 12:31
  not
• 12:31
  Google,
• 12:32
  it's
• 12:32
  more
• 12:32
  Instagram
• 12:33
  or
• 12:33
  TikTok.
• 12:34
  You
• 12:34
  don't
• 12:34
  go
• 12:35
  to
• 12:35
  Instagram
• 12:35
  or
• 12:35
  TikTok
• 12:36
  to
• 12:36
  look
• 12:36
  at
• 12:36
  this,
• 12:37
  to
• 12:37
  find
• 12:37
  a
• 12:38
  specific
• 12:38
  picture
• 12:40
  or
• 12:41
  video.
• 12:41
  You
• 12:42
  go
• 12:42
  there
• 12:42
  to
• 12:42
  look
• 12:43
  at
• 12:43
  videos
• 12:45
  and
• 12:46
  to
• 12:46
  get
• 12:46
  entertained
• 12:47
  by
• 12:47
  videos.
• 12:48
  And
• 12:49
  that's
• 12:50
  the
• 12:50
  basic
• 12:51
  paradigm
• 12:52
  for
• 12:52
  a
• 12:52
  lot
• 12:53
  of
• 12:53
  e
• 12:53
  commerce
• 12:54
  companies
• 12:55
  in
• 12:55
  China.
• 12:57
  You
• 12:57
  don't
• 12:57
  want
• 12:58
  to
• 12:58
  go
• 12:59
  there,
• 12:59
  present
• 13:00
  or
• 13:00
  let
• 13:00
  the
• 13:01
  customer
• 13:01
  find
• 13:01
  what
• 13:02
  he
• 13:02
  wants.
• 13:02
  He
• 13:03
  doesn't
• 13:03
  want
• 13:04
  anything,
• 13:04
  he
• 13:05
  wants
• 13:05
  to
• 13:05
  get
• 13:05
  entertained.
• 13:08
  You
• 13:08
  create
• 13:08
  a
• 13:08
  totally
• 13:09
  different
• 13:09
  experience
• 13:11
  and
• 13:11
  that's
• 13:12
  why
• 13:12
  people
• 13:12
  come
• 13:13
  to
• 13:13
  your
• 13:13
  site
• 13:14
  and
• 13:14
  then
• 13:14
  suddenly
• 13:15
  you
• 13:15
  have
• 13:15
  a
• 13:16
  totally
• 13:16
  different
• 13:16
  e
• 13:16
  commerce
• 13:17
  system
• 13:19
  that
• 13:19
  also
• 13:19
  needs,
• 13:20
  for
• 13:20
  example,
• 13:20
  totally
• 13:21
  different
• 13:21
  KPIs.
• 13:22
  If
• 13:23
  conversion
• 13:23
  is
• 13:24
  your
• 13:24
  main
• 13:24
  KPI
• 13:25
  and
• 13:26
  people
• 13:26
  just
• 13:27
  come
• 13:27
  to
• 13:27
  hang
• 13:27
  out,
• 13:28
  what
• 13:28
  happens
• 13:28
  to
• 13:28
  your
• 13:29
  conversion?
• 13:32
  It
• 13:32
  suddenly
• 13:33
  becomes
• 13:33
  a
• 13:33
  problem
• 13:33
  because
• 13:34
  it's
• 13:34
  too
• 13:34
  low.
• 13:36
  But
• 13:36
  it's
• 13:36
  totally
• 13:37
  fine
• 13:37
  to
• 13:37
  have
• 13:37
  people
• 13:38
  just
• 13:38
  hanging
• 13:38
  out.
• 13:39
  Why
• 13:40
  not?
• 13:41
  And
• 13:42
  that's
• 13:42
  actually.
• 13:44
  That
• 13:44
  all
• 13:44
  sounds
• 13:45
  totally
• 13:45
  new,
• 13:45
  but
• 13:46
  it
• 13:47
  isn't
• 13:47
  that
• 13:47
  new.
• 13:48
  A
• 13:48
  classic
• 13:49
  mall
• 13:49
  worked
• 13:50
  like
• 13:50
  this.
• 13:51
  Yeah.
• 13:51
  Yeah.
• 13:52
  What's
• 13:52
  a
• 13:52
  place
• 13:52
  to
• 13:52
  hang
• 13:53
  out?
• 13:53
  A
• 13:54
  classic
• 13:55
  normal
• 13:55
  retail
• 13:56
  shop
• 13:56
  used
• 13:56
  to
• 13:56
  work
• 13:57
  like
• 13:57
  that.
• 13:57
  Yeah,
• 13:57
  I
• 13:58
  just
• 13:58
  go
• 13:58
  there
• 14:00
  to
• 14:00
  browse
• 14:01
  through
• 14:01
  things
• 14:02
  if
• 14:03
  I
• 14:03
  want
• 14:03
  to
• 14:03
  buy
• 14:03
  anything
• 14:04
  or
• 14:04
  not.
• 14:05
  We'll
• 14:05
  see.
• 14:06
  And
• 14:06
  there's
• 14:06
  another
• 14:07
  interesting
• 14:07
  use
• 14:07
  case
• 14:08
  that's
• 14:08
  missing
• 14:08
  from
• 14:09
  our
• 14:09
  Internet
• 14:10
  is
• 14:11
  I
• 14:11
  can
• 14:11
  go
• 14:11
  with
• 14:12
  friends
• 14:12
  to
• 14:13
  the
• 14:13
  mall
• 14:13
  and
• 14:14
  browse
• 14:14
  through
• 14:14
  shops
• 14:15
  together
• 14:15
  with
• 14:15
  other.
• 14:16
  Yeah,
• 14:16
  that's,
• 14:17
  that's
• 14:17
  a
• 14:17
  use
• 14:18
  case
• 14:18
  that
• 14:19
  I
• 14:19
  think
• 14:19
  is
• 14:19
  not
• 14:20
  very
• 14:20
  unusual.
• 14:21
  Yeah.
• 14:21
  How
• 14:22
  do
• 14:22
  you
• 14:22
  do
• 14:22
  this
• 14:23
  online?
• 14:26
  How
• 14:26
  do
• 14:26
  I
• 14:28
  go
• 14:29
  to
• 14:30
  some
• 14:30
  kind
• 14:30
  of
• 14:30
  e
• 14:31
  commerce
• 14:31
  shop
• 14:31
  with
• 14:32
  friends
• 14:33
  to
• 14:33
  look
• 14:33
  at
• 14:33
  what.
• 14:34
  What's
• 14:34
  there?
• 14:35
  Yeah,
• 14:36
  but
• 14:37
  it's
• 14:37
  something
• 14:37
  that
• 14:39
  I
• 14:40
  could
• 14:40
  send
• 14:40
  you
• 14:40
  a
• 14:40
  link
• 14:41
  on
• 14:41
  WhatsApp
• 14:42
  and
• 14:42
  then
• 14:42
  you
• 14:42
  also
• 14:44
  go
• 14:44
  to
• 14:44
  a
• 14:44
  web
• 14:45
  page
• 14:45
  and
• 14:45
  then
• 14:45
  something
• 14:46
  like
• 14:46
  that.
• 14:47
  But
• 14:47
  it's
• 14:47
  not
• 14:48
  really.
• 14:49
  Yeah.
• 14:49
  And
• 14:49
  it's
• 14:49
  not
• 14:50
  really
• 14:50
  an
• 14:50
  experience.
• 14:52
  And
• 14:53
  that's
• 14:54
  something
• 14:54
  that
• 14:54
  you
• 14:54
  can
• 14:55
  find
• 14:55
  in
• 14:55
  China.
• 14:56
  You
• 14:56
  see
• 14:56
  there
• 14:57
  on
• 14:58
  Taobao,
• 14:59
  they
• 14:59
  have
• 14:59
  a
• 15:00
  function
• 15:00
  where
• 15:01
  you
• 15:01
  have
• 15:02
  the
• 15:02
  Taobao
• 15:03
  app
• 15:03
  open.
• 15:04
  I
• 15:04
  hit
• 15:04
  a
• 15:05
  button,
• 15:05
  the
• 15:06
  app
• 15:06
  connects
• 15:07
  me
• 15:07
  to
• 15:07
  a
• 15:07
  friend.
• 15:08
  Just
• 15:09
  like
• 15:09
  what
• 15:09
  we
• 15:09
  are
• 15:09
  doing
• 15:10
  here.
• 15:10
  Screen
• 15:11
  sharing
• 15:11
  and
• 15:12
  looking
• 15:12
  at
• 15:12
  the
• 15:12
  screen.
• 15:13
  We
• 15:13
  look
• 15:14
  at
• 15:14
  the
• 15:14
  shared
• 15:14
  screen
• 15:15
  which
• 15:15
  is
• 15:16
  what
• 15:16
  happens
• 15:17
  to
• 15:17
  be.
• 15:17
  It's
• 15:17
  a
• 15:17
  shop.
• 15:18
  Yeah,
• 15:19
  it's,
• 15:20
  it's
• 15:21
  technology
• 15:21
  wise,
• 15:22
  it's
• 15:22
  totally
• 15:22
  uninnovative.
• 15:23
  Yeah.
• 15:24
  It's,
• 15:24
  it's
• 15:24
  not
• 15:25
  really
• 15:25
  spectacular
• 15:26
  innovation
• 15:27
  that's
• 15:27
  going
• 15:27
  on
• 15:27
  there.
• 15:28
  And
• 15:28
  then
• 15:28
  we
• 15:29
  both
• 15:29
  look
• 15:30
  at
• 15:30
  the
• 15:30
  same
• 15:30
  shop
• 15:31
  and
• 15:31
  talk
• 15:31
  to
• 15:31
  each
• 15:32
  other
• 15:32
  and
• 15:32
  then
• 15:33
  at
• 15:33
  the
• 15:33
  same
• 15:33
  time
• 15:34
  browse
• 15:35
  through
• 15:35
  the
• 15:35
  shop
• 15:36
  together.
• 15:36
  That's
• 15:37
  a
• 15:37
  very
• 15:37
  simple
• 15:38
  use
• 15:38
  case.
• 15:39
  And
• 15:39
  nobody
• 15:40
  here
• 15:40
  in
• 15:40
  the
• 15:40
  west
• 15:41
  has
• 15:42
  even
• 15:42
  thought
• 15:42
  about
• 15:43
  it.
• 15:44
  See,
• 15:44
  this
• 15:44
  is,
• 15:45
  this
• 15:45
  is
• 15:45
  really
• 15:45
  fascinating
• 15:46
  to
• 15:46
  me,
• 15:46
  Björn,
• 15:46
  and
• 15:46
  partly
• 15:47
  because,
• 15:48
  right,
• 15:48
  the
• 15:48
  last
• 15:49
  two,
• 15:51
  last
• 15:51
  three
• 15:51
  days,
• 15:52
  I
• 15:52
  try
• 15:52
  and
• 15:53
  write
• 15:53
  a
• 15:53
  post
• 15:53
  and
• 15:53
  put
• 15:54
  it
• 15:54
  on
• 15:54
  LinkedIn
• 15:54
  every
• 15:55
  day.
• 15:55
  I
• 15:55
  try
• 15:55
  and
• 15:55
  be
• 15:55
  active
• 15:55
  every
• 15:56
  day
• 15:56
  on
• 15:56
  LinkedIn.
• 15:56
  I'm
• 15:56
  a
• 15:57
  big
• 15:57
  fan.
• 15:58
  And
• 15:58
  for
• 15:58
  the
• 15:58
  last
• 15:59
  three
• 15:59
  days,
• 15:59
  right,
• 16:00
  this
• 16:00
  is
• 16:00
  why
• 16:00
  this
• 16:00
  is
• 16:00
  timely.
• 16:01
  I
• 16:02
  have
• 16:02
  been
• 16:02
  talking
• 16:03
  about
• 16:03
  old
• 16:04
  brands
• 16:05
  that
• 16:06
  for
• 16:06
  whatever
• 16:06
  reason
• 16:07
  didn't
• 16:07
  seem
• 16:07
  to
• 16:07
  cut
• 16:08
  it
• 16:08
  in
• 16:08
  the
• 16:09
  e
• 16:09
  commerce
• 16:10
  digital
• 16:11
  world.
• 16:11
  The
• 16:11
  obvious
• 16:12
  one
• 16:12
  being,
• 16:13
  and
• 16:13
  the
• 16:13
  one
• 16:13
  that
• 16:13
  I
• 16:13
  started
• 16:14
  with
• 16:14
  being
• 16:14
  Blockbuster,
• 16:16
  the
• 16:16
  video
• 16:16
  rental
• 16:17
  store.
• 16:18
  I
• 16:18
  don't
• 16:18
  know
• 16:18
  if
• 16:18
  you
• 16:19
  had
• 16:19
  those
• 16:19
  in
• 16:19
  Germany,
• 16:20
  but
• 16:20
  we
• 16:21
  had
• 16:21
  them
• 16:21
  here
• 16:21
  in
• 16:21
  the
• 16:21
  uk.
• 16:22
  And
• 16:22
  you
• 16:22
  would
• 16:22
  go
• 16:23
  and
• 16:23
  you
• 16:23
  would
• 16:23
  rent
• 16:23
  your,
• 16:24
  you
• 16:24
  know,
• 16:24
  your
• 16:24
  film
• 16:25
  and,
• 16:25
  and
• 16:25
  all
• 16:26
  that
• 16:26
  sort
• 16:26
  of
• 16:26
  thing.
• 16:27
  And
• 16:27
  how
• 16:28
  everybody
• 16:28
  uses
• 16:29
  this
• 16:29
  as
• 16:29
  a,
• 16:29
  as
• 16:30
  an
• 16:30
  example
• 16:30
  of
• 16:30
  a
• 16:31
  company
• 16:31
  that
• 16:31
  didn't
• 16:32
  innovate
• 16:32
  and
• 16:32
  therefore
• 16:33
  they're
• 16:33
  not
• 16:33
  around
• 16:33
  anymore.
• 16:34
  And
• 16:34
  Netflix,
• 16:35
  you
• 16:35
  know,
• 16:35
  is
• 16:35
  dominated.
• 16:36
  And
• 16:36
  Blockbuster
• 16:37
  should
• 16:37
  have
• 16:37
  been
• 16:37
  Netflix.
• 16:38
  And
• 16:39
  you
• 16:40
  listen
• 16:40
  to
• 16:40
  the
• 16:40
  stories
• 16:41
  and
• 16:41
  you
• 16:41
  go,
• 16:41
  yes,
• 16:41
  because
• 16:42
  on
• 16:42
  the
• 16:42
  surface
• 16:42
  that
• 16:43
  makes
• 16:43
  sense.
• 16:44
  But
• 16:44
  the
• 16:45
  last
• 16:45
  three
• 16:45
  blog
• 16:46
  posts
• 16:46
  I've
• 16:46
  done,
• 16:46
  I'm
• 16:46
  like,
• 16:47
  well,
• 16:47
  hang
• 16:47
  on
• 16:47
  a
• 16:47
  minute.
• 16:49
  Have
• 16:49
  we
• 16:49
  thrown
• 16:50
  the
• 16:50
  baby
• 16:50
  out
• 16:51
  with
• 16:51
  a
• 16:51
  bathwater?
• 16:51
  I
• 16:51
  don't
• 16:52
  know
• 16:52
  if
• 16:52
  that
• 16:52
  phrase
• 16:53
  translates
• 16:54
  into
• 16:55
  your
• 16:55
  German
• 16:55
  ears,
• 16:56
  but
• 16:56
  it's.
• 16:57
  Did
• 16:58
  we
• 16:58
  have.
• 16:58
  We
• 16:59
  missed
• 16:59
  a
• 16:59
  trick
• 16:59
  here?
• 17:00
  Because
• 17:01
  here's
• 17:01
  the
• 17:01
  thing,
• 17:02
  when
• 17:02
  it
• 17:02
  comes
• 17:02
  to
• 17:02
  Blockbuster,
• 17:03
  I
• 17:03
  have
• 17:04
  some
• 17:04
  great
• 17:05
  memories
• 17:05
  of
• 17:06
  Blockbuster
• 17:07
  because
• 17:07
  I
• 17:08
  had
• 17:08
  to
• 17:08
  go
• 17:08
  to
• 17:08
  the
• 17:08
  store.
• 17:09
  I
• 17:09
  went
• 17:09
  with
• 17:10
  family,
• 17:10
  I
• 17:10
  went
• 17:11
  with
• 17:11
  friends.
• 17:11
  We
• 17:11
  decided
• 17:12
  together
• 17:12
  what
• 17:12
  movie
• 17:13
  to
• 17:13
  watch.
• 17:14
  We
• 17:14
  couldn't
• 17:14
  watch
• 17:15
  what
• 17:15
  we
• 17:15
  wanted
• 17:15
  whenever
• 17:16
  we
• 17:16
  wanted
• 17:16
  to
• 17:16
  watch
• 17:16
  it
• 17:17
  because
• 17:17
  they
• 17:17
  weren't
• 17:17
  always
• 17:18
  in.
• 17:18
  You
• 17:18
  know,
• 17:19
  we
• 17:19
  got
• 17:20
  the
• 17:20
  popcorn,
• 17:21
  there
• 17:21
  was
• 17:21
  the
• 17:21
  smell,
• 17:22
  there
• 17:22
  was
• 17:22
  the
• 17:22
  sort
• 17:23
  of,
• 17:23
  the
• 17:24
  effort
• 17:24
  to
• 17:24
  go
• 17:24
  and
• 17:25
  get
• 17:25
  it.
• 17:25
  And
• 17:25
  in
• 17:26
  the
• 17:26
  name
• 17:26
  of
• 17:26
  convenience
• 17:27
  we
• 17:27
  seemed
• 17:27
  to
• 17:28
  have,
• 17:29
  everybody
• 17:29
  was
• 17:29
  like,
• 17:30
  oh,
• 17:30
  this
• 17:30
  is
• 17:30
  brilliant,
• 17:30
  because
• 17:30
  I
• 17:31
  can
• 17:31
  just
• 17:31
  go
• 17:31
  to
• 17:31
  Netflix
• 17:32
  and
• 17:32
  decide
• 17:32
  what
• 17:32
  to
• 17:32
  watch.
• 17:33
  Not
• 17:33
  that
• 17:33
  we
• 17:33
  can,
• 17:33
  because
• 17:34
  there's
• 17:34
  so
• 17:34
  much
• 17:34
  to
• 17:34
  watch.
• 17:35
  We're
• 17:35
  sort
• 17:35
  of
• 17:35
  paralyzed
• 17:36
  by
• 17:36
  choice.
• 17:37
  But
• 17:38
  what
• 17:38
  Netflix
• 17:39
  is,
• 17:39
  it's
• 17:39
  sort
• 17:40
  of
• 17:40
  like
• 17:41
  a
• 17:42
  sort
• 17:42
  of
• 17:43
  sanitized
• 17:44
  convenience,
• 17:44
  I
• 17:45
  think
• 17:45
  I
• 17:45
  called
• 17:45
  it.
• 17:46
  Whereas
• 17:46
  Blockbuster,
• 17:47
  for
• 17:47
  all
• 17:48
  its
• 17:48
  quirks
• 17:48
  and
• 17:48
  for
• 17:49
  all
• 17:49
  its
• 17:49
  lack
• 17:49
  of
• 17:50
  innovation,
• 17:51
  there
• 17:52
  are
• 17:52
  many
• 17:52
  people
• 17:53
  in
• 17:53
  my
• 17:53
  generation
• 17:54
  that
• 17:54
  will
• 17:54
  be
• 17:55
  able
• 17:55
  to
• 17:55
  give
• 17:55
  you
• 17:55
  some
• 17:56
  kind
• 17:56
  of
• 17:56
  memory
• 17:57
  that
• 17:57
  is
• 17:57
  linked
• 17:57
  to
• 17:58
  the
• 17:58
  Blockbuster
• 17:58
  store.
• 17:59
  I
• 17:59
  Cannot
• 17:59
  give
• 17:59
  you
• 17:59
  a
• 18:00
  single
• 18:00
  memory
• 18:00
  to
• 18:01
  a
• 18:01
  Netflix
• 18:01
  adventure.
• 18:02
  I
• 18:03
  just
• 18:03
  can't.
• 18:03
  I
• 18:03
  can
• 18:03
  tell
• 18:04
  you
• 18:04
  the
• 18:04
  TV
• 18:04
  show
• 18:04
  that
• 18:04
  I
• 18:05
  watched
• 18:05
  and
• 18:05
  I
• 18:05
  thought
• 18:05
  it
• 18:05
  was
• 18:05
  great.
• 18:06
  Right.
• 18:07
  And
• 18:07
  so
• 18:08
  I'm
• 18:08
  intrigued
• 18:08
  by
• 18:08
  this
• 18:09
  because
• 18:11
  I
• 18:11
  think
• 18:11
  E
• 18:12
  commerce
• 18:12
  in
• 18:12
  the
• 18:13
  west
• 18:13
  has
• 18:13
  gone
• 18:14
  down
• 18:14
  the
• 18:15
  same
• 18:15
  route
• 18:15
  that
• 18:15
  Netflix
• 18:16
  has
• 18:16
  gone
• 18:16
  down,
• 18:17
  the
• 18:17
  same
• 18:17
  route
• 18:17
  that
• 18:19
  Spotify
• 18:20
  has
• 18:20
  gone
• 18:20
  down,
• 18:20
  you
• 18:21
  know,
• 18:21
  the
• 18:21
  same
• 18:21
  route
• 18:22
  that
• 18:23
  a
• 18:23
  lot
• 18:23
  of
• 18:24
  these
• 18:24
  sort
• 18:24
  of
• 18:24
  stores
• 18:24
  have
• 18:24
  gone
• 18:25
  down,
• 18:25
  which
• 18:25
  is
• 18:25
  speed
• 18:26
  and
• 18:26
  convenience.
• 18:27
  Amazon
• 18:27
  is
• 18:27
  fast
• 18:28
  and
• 18:28
  it's
• 18:28
  convenient.
• 18:30
  I
• 18:30
  can
• 18:31
  search
• 18:31
  what
• 18:31
  it
• 18:31
  is
• 18:31
  that
• 18:32
  I
• 18:32
  want.
• 18:32
  I
• 18:32
  have
• 18:32
  to
• 18:32
  know
• 18:32
  what
• 18:33
  it
• 18:33
  is
• 18:33
  that
• 18:33
  I
• 18:33
  want
• 18:33
  first
• 18:33
  and
• 18:34
  foremost.
• 18:34
  But
• 18:34
  if
• 18:35
  I
• 18:35
  know
• 18:35
  what
• 18:35
  it
• 18:35
  is
• 18:35
  that
• 18:35
  I
• 18:35
  want,
• 18:36
  I
• 18:36
  can
• 18:36
  go
• 18:36
  and
• 18:36
  find
• 18:36
  it
• 18:36
  quickly
• 18:37
  and
• 18:37
  easily.
• 18:38
  But
• 18:38
  we
• 18:39
  seem
• 18:39
  to
• 18:39
  have
• 18:39
  lost
• 18:40
  the
• 18:40
  soul
• 18:41
  of
• 18:41
  that.
• 18:41
  One
• 18:42
  of
• 18:42
  the
• 18:42
  things
• 18:42
  that
• 18:42
  we.
• 18:43
  That
• 18:43
  came
• 18:43
  up
• 18:43
  in
• 18:43
  those
• 18:44
  conversations
• 18:45
  is
• 18:46
  the
• 18:46
  mall.
• 18:47
  So
• 18:47
  you
• 18:47
  would
• 18:47
  go
• 18:47
  the
• 18:47
  shopping
• 18:48
  center.
• 18:48
  The
• 18:48
  shopping
• 18:49
  mall
• 18:49
  with
• 18:49
  your
• 18:49
  friends,
• 18:49
  and
• 18:50
  it
• 18:50
  was
• 18:50
  events.
• 18:51
  Right.
• 18:51
  You.
• 18:51
  You
• 18:51
  would
• 18:52
  go
• 18:52
  there
• 18:52
  for
• 18:53
  the
• 18:53
  day,
• 18:53
  you
• 18:53
  would
• 18:54
  browse
• 18:54
  with
• 18:54
  your
• 18:54
  friends,
• 18:55
  you
• 18:55
  would
• 18:55
  look
• 18:55
  with
• 18:55
  your
• 18:55
  friends.
• 18:57
  And
• 18:58
  I
• 18:58
  think
• 18:58
  Western
• 18:59
  E
• 18:59
  commerce
• 18:59
  seems
• 19:00
  to
• 19:00
  have
• 19:02
  forgotten
• 19:02
  that.
• 19:03
  So
• 19:03
  I'm
• 19:03
  kind
• 19:03
  of
• 19:03
  curious
• 19:04
  that
• 19:04
  the
• 19:04
  E
• 19:05
  commerce
• 19:05
  in
• 19:05
  China
• 19:06
  seems
• 19:06
  to
• 19:06
  have
• 19:08
  engaged
• 19:08
  with
• 19:09
  that.
• 19:10
  Yeah.
• 19:10
  I
• 19:10
  think
• 19:11
  one
• 19:12
  of
• 19:12
  the
• 19:12
  reasons
• 19:12
  why
• 19:13
  things
• 19:13
  are
• 19:13
  like
• 19:13
  this
• 19:14
  is
• 19:15
  we
• 19:16
  don't
• 19:16
  invent.
• 19:17
  We
• 19:17
  invent
• 19:18
  something
• 19:18
  when
• 19:18
  something
• 19:18
  is
• 19:19
  new.
• 19:19
  Yeah.
• 19:19
  When
• 19:19
  there
• 19:19
  was
• 19:20
  no
• 19:20
  E
• 19:20
  commerce,
• 19:21
  we
• 19:21
  had
• 19:21
  to
• 19:21
  invent
• 19:22
  E
• 19:22
  commerce
• 19:22
  and
• 19:22
  there
• 19:23
  were
• 19:23
  a
• 19:23
  lot
• 19:23
  of
• 19:23
  innovation.
• 19:24
  At
• 19:24
  a
• 19:25
  certain
• 19:25
  point,
• 19:25
  we
• 19:26
  are
• 19:26
  finished.
• 19:27
  It's
• 19:28
  ready.
• 19:29
  E
• 19:29
  commerce
• 19:30
  was
• 19:30
  ready
• 19:30
  or
• 19:31
  finished.
• 19:32
  And
• 19:32
  at
• 19:32
  that
• 19:33
  point
• 19:33
  we
• 19:34
  have
• 19:35
  KPIs
• 19:35
  and
• 19:35
  we
• 19:36
  optimize
• 19:36
  these
• 19:36
  KPIs
• 19:38
  and
• 19:38
  convenience,
• 19:39
  how
• 19:40
  quick
• 19:40
  things
• 19:40
  are,
• 19:42
  how
• 19:42
  cheap
• 19:42
  it
• 19:43
  is,
• 19:44
  lowering
• 19:44
  costs.
• 19:45
  These
• 19:45
  are
• 19:45
  all
• 19:45
  very
• 19:46
  handy
• 19:46
  KPIs
• 19:47
  that
• 19:47
  we
• 19:47
  can
• 19:47
  optimize.
• 19:48
  Everything
• 19:49
  that
• 19:49
  we
• 19:49
  can
• 19:49
  put
• 19:49
  into
• 19:50
  Excel
• 19:50
  charts.
• 19:51
  How
• 19:51
  do
• 19:52
  you
• 19:52
  optimize
• 19:53
  experience?
• 19:56
  Kind
• 19:56
  of
• 19:56
  difficult.
• 19:59
  Difficult
• 19:59
  to
• 19:59
  measure.
• 20:00
  Yeah.
• 20:00
  Let's
• 20:01
  try
• 20:01
  to
• 20:01
  drive
• 20:02
  down
• 20:02
  costs.
• 20:03
  That
• 20:04
  is
• 20:04
  much
• 20:05
  easier.
• 20:06
  And
• 20:07
  that's
• 20:07
  probably
• 20:07
  one
• 20:07
  of
• 20:07
  the
• 20:08
  factors.
• 20:08
  And
• 20:09
  the
• 20:09
  other
• 20:09
  thing
• 20:09
  is
• 20:10
  in
• 20:10
  China,
• 20:10
  you
• 20:11
  have
• 20:11
  so
• 20:11
  much
• 20:11
  competition
• 20:13
  that
• 20:13
  people,
• 20:14
  companies
• 20:15
  don't
• 20:15
  get
• 20:15
  finished
• 20:16
  with
• 20:16
  anything.
• 20:18
  If
• 20:19
  you
• 20:19
  have
• 20:19
  something
• 20:19
  that
• 20:20
  works
• 20:20
  today,
• 20:21
  you
• 20:22
  know
• 20:22
  that
• 20:22
  tomorrow
• 20:23
  will
• 20:23
  be
• 20:23
  five
• 20:23
  other
• 20:23
  guys
• 20:24
  who
• 20:24
  do
• 20:24
  the
• 20:24
  same.
• 20:26
  But
• 20:26
  they
• 20:26
  can
• 20:26
  only
• 20:27
  copy
• 20:27
  your
• 20:27
  yesterday
• 20:28
  idea,
• 20:29
  maybe
• 20:30
  the
• 20:30
  one
• 20:31
  that
• 20:31
  you
• 20:31
  had
• 20:31
  today,
• 20:32
  but
• 20:32
  you
• 20:32
  know
• 20:32
  you
• 20:33
  have
• 20:33
  to
• 20:33
  have
• 20:33
  another
• 20:33
  one
• 20:34
  tomorrow.
• 20:35
  If
• 20:35
  not,
• 20:36
  you
• 20:36
  won't
• 20:36
  survive.
• 20:37
  And
• 20:38
  this
• 20:38
  kind
• 20:38
  of
• 20:39
  competition
• 20:40
  and
• 20:40
  pressure
• 20:41
  make
• 20:42
  sure
• 20:42
  that
• 20:43
  you
• 20:43
  have
• 20:43
  a
• 20:43
  lot
• 20:43
  of
• 20:43
  innovation
• 20:44
  in
• 20:44
  these
• 20:44
  systems.
• 20:45
  And
• 20:48
  that's
• 20:48
  probably
• 20:48
  also
• 20:49
  a
• 20:49
  reason
• 20:49
  why
• 20:51
  things
• 20:52
  are
• 20:52
  so
• 20:52
  different
• 20:52
  there.
• 20:54
  Here
• 20:55
  we
• 20:55
  don't
• 20:55
  have
• 20:55
  any
• 20:56
  competition
• 20:56
  if
• 20:57
  we
• 20:57
  really
• 20:57
  think
• 20:57
  about
• 20:58
  it.
• 20:58
  Yeah.
• 20:58
  If
• 20:59
  you
• 20:59
  look
• 20:59
  at.
• 21:00
  I'm
• 21:00
  an
• 21:01
  economist
• 21:01
  by
• 21:01
  training.
• 21:02
  Yeah.
• 21:02
  And
• 21:04
  the
• 21:05
  situation
• 21:05
  where
• 21:05
  you.
• 21:06
  Our
• 21:07
  whole
• 21:07
  market
• 21:07
  economy
• 21:08
  is
• 21:08
  not
• 21:08
  supposed
• 21:09
  to
• 21:09
  create
• 21:11
  giant
• 21:12
  corporations
• 21:12
  with
• 21:13
  giant
• 21:14
  surpluses
• 21:16
  and
• 21:17
  even
• 21:18
  more
• 21:18
  giant
• 21:19
  market
• 21:20
  values.
• 21:21
  That's
• 21:21
  actually
• 21:22
  a
• 21:23
  sign
• 21:23
  of
• 21:23
  a
• 21:23
  system
• 21:24
  that
• 21:24
  doesn't
• 21:24
  really
• 21:24
  work.
• 21:25
  Yeah.
• 21:26
  Because
• 21:26
  the
• 21:27
  prospect
• 21:28
  of
• 21:28
  getting
• 21:29
  giant
• 21:30
  earnings
• 21:31
  is
• 21:31
  what
• 21:31
  should
• 21:32
  drive
• 21:32
  our
• 21:32
  system.
• 21:33
  Because
• 21:33
  if
• 21:34
  somebody
• 21:34
  earns
• 21:34
  a
• 21:34
  lot
• 21:35
  of
• 21:35
  money,
• 21:35
  others
• 21:35
  should
• 21:36
  come
• 21:36
  and
• 21:37
  take
• 21:38
  it
• 21:38
  away
• 21:38
  from
• 21:38
  him
• 21:39
  through
• 21:39
  better
• 21:39
  innovation
• 21:40
  and
• 21:40
  better
• 21:40
  ideas.
• 21:41
  Yeah.
• 21:43
  That's
• 21:44
  free
• 21:44
  market
• 21:45
  economics
• 21:46
  in
• 21:46
  a
• 21:46
  nutshell,
• 21:46
  isn't
• 21:46
  it?
• 21:48
  What
• 21:48
  we
• 21:49
  see
• 21:49
  when
• 21:49
  we
• 21:49
  describe
• 21:50
  what
• 21:50
  we
• 21:51
  have.
• 21:51
  And
• 21:51
  that's
• 21:52
  not
• 21:52
  an
• 21:52
  E
• 21:52
  commerce
• 21:53
  topic,
• 21:53
  that's
• 21:54
  a
• 21:54
  whole
• 21:54
  digital
• 21:55
  ecosystem
• 21:55
  topic.
• 21:56
  You
• 21:57
  mentioned
• 21:57
  Apple.
• 22:00
  They
• 22:01
  have
• 22:01
  no
• 22:01
  real
• 22:01
  competition.
• 22:03
  They
• 22:03
  have
• 22:03
  great
• 22:03
  products
• 22:04
  and
• 22:05
  they
• 22:05
  have
• 22:05
  a
• 22:05
  lot
• 22:05
  of
• 22:05
  satisfied
• 22:06
  customers.
• 22:08
  But
• 22:10
  the
• 22:10
  innovation
• 22:11
  is
• 22:12
  very
• 22:13
  small
• 22:13
  from
• 22:16
  phone
• 22:16
  as
• 22:16
  you
• 22:17
  mentioned.
• 22:17
  Yeah.
• 22:18
  Because
• 22:18
  there
• 22:18
  is
• 22:19
  no
• 22:19
  competition.
• 22:20
  Yeah.
• 22:21
  The
• 22:21
  same
• 22:21
  with
• 22:22
  Meta
• 22:22
  and
• 22:23
  with
• 22:25
  and
• 22:26
  E
• 22:26
  commerce
• 22:26
  is
• 22:26
  the
• 22:27
  same.
• 22:27
  Right.
• 22:28
  And
• 22:29
  the
• 22:29
  reason
• 22:29
  I
• 22:30
  focus
• 22:31
  more
• 22:31
  on
• 22:31
  automotive
• 22:32
  and
• 22:33
  totally
• 22:33
  different
• 22:34
  areas
• 22:34
  than
• 22:34
  E
• 22:34
  commerce,
• 22:35
  but
• 22:35
  E
• 22:35
  commerce
• 22:36
  came
• 22:36
  on
• 22:36
  my
• 22:36
  radar
• 22:36
  because
• 22:37
  of
• 22:37
  Shein
• 22:38
  and
• 22:38
  Temu.
• 22:41
  And
• 22:41
  these
• 22:41
  are
• 22:42
  companies
• 22:42
  that
• 22:42
  suddenly
• 22:43
  arrive
• 22:43
  here
• 22:45
  and
• 22:46
  take
• 22:46
  away
• 22:46
  a
• 22:46
  lot
• 22:47
  of
• 22:47
  revenue
• 22:49
  from
• 22:49
  companies
• 22:50
  who
• 22:52
  don't
• 22:52
  expect
• 22:53
  any
• 22:53
  competition.
• 22:57
  And
• 22:58
  that's
• 22:58
  the
• 22:58
  reason
• 22:59
  why
• 22:59
  I
• 22:59
  became
• 22:59
  interested
• 23:00
  in
• 23:00
  the
• 23:00
  whole
• 23:01
  e
• 23:01
  commerce
• 23:01
  sphere.
• 23:02
  And
• 23:02
  then
• 23:03
  that's
• 23:03
  also
• 23:04
  where
• 23:04
  I
• 23:04
  realized
• 23:05
  how
• 23:05
  little
• 23:06
  has
• 23:06
  changed
• 23:06
  over
• 23:07
  the
• 23:07
  years.
• 23:10
  Yeah,
• 23:10
  it's
• 23:10
  a
• 23:10
  fair
• 23:10
  point.
• 23:11
  And
• 23:11
  I
• 23:11
  mean
• 23:12
  having
• 23:12
  purchased
• 23:13
  from
• 23:13
  Temu,
• 23:14
  the
• 23:14
  app
• 23:14
  and
• 23:15
  you
• 23:15
  know,
• 23:15
  some
• 23:16
  of
• 23:16
  these
• 23:16
  banggood
• 23:17
  and
• 23:19
  there's
• 23:19
  another
• 23:19
  one
• 23:20
  that
• 23:20
  I've
• 23:20
  looked
• 23:20
  at.
• 23:22
  It's
• 23:22
  interesting,
• 23:22
  isn't
• 23:23
  it?
• 23:23
  Because
• 23:24
  some
• 23:24
  of
• 23:24
  the
• 23:24
  stuff,
• 23:25
  if
• 23:26
  I'm
• 23:26
  honest,
• 23:26
  I,
• 23:26
  when
• 23:27
  I'm
• 23:27
  on
• 23:27
  the
• 23:27
  apps
• 23:27
  I
• 23:27
  just
• 23:28
  found
• 23:28
  annoying
• 23:28
  or
• 23:28
  I
• 23:29
  found
• 23:29
  garish.
• 23:29
  And
• 23:29
  that
• 23:30
  part
• 23:30
  is,
• 23:30
  you
• 23:30
  know,
• 23:30
  my
• 23:31
  Western
• 23:31
  mindset,
• 23:31
  isn't
• 23:32
  it?
• 23:32
  It's
• 23:32
  just
• 23:32
  I.
• 23:32
  This
• 23:33
  is
• 23:33
  not.
• 23:33
  I'm
• 23:33
  culturally
• 23:34
  not
• 23:34
  connected
• 23:34
  with
• 23:34
  what's
• 23:35
  going
• 23:35
  on
• 23:35
  here.
• 23:36
  I
• 23:36
  must
• 23:36
  get
• 23:36
  an
• 23:36
  email
• 23:37
  from
• 23:38
  one
• 23:38
  of
• 23:38
  the
• 23:38
  Chinese
• 23:39
  websites
• 23:39
  every
• 23:39
  day
• 23:39
  going,
• 23:40
  oh,
• 23:40
  sorry,
• 23:40
  we
• 23:40
  forgot
• 23:41
  that,
• 23:41
  you
• 23:41
  know
• 23:42
  something
• 23:42
  with
• 23:42
  your
• 23:42
  order
• 23:42
  you're
• 23:43
  entitled
• 23:43
  to
• 23:43
  a
• 23:43
  discount
• 23:44
  and
• 23:44
  all
• 23:44
  this.
• 23:44
  It's
• 23:45
  like
• 23:45
  really?
• 23:46
  Okay.
• 23:47
  And
• 23:48
  some
• 23:48
  of
• 23:49
  the
• 23:49
  things
• 23:50
  I
• 23:50
  do
• 23:50
  find
• 23:50
  a
• 23:51
  little
• 23:51
  bit
• 23:51
  odd,
• 23:51
  but
• 23:51
  I
• 23:52
  appreciate
• 23:52
  that
• 23:52
  that's
• 23:52
  a
• 23:53
  cultural
• 23:53
  thing.
• 23:54
  One
• 23:55
  of
• 23:55
  the
• 23:55
  things
• 23:55
  I
• 23:55
  guess
• 23:56
  that
• 23:56
  I've
• 23:56
  seen
• 23:57
  and
• 23:57
  I
• 23:57
  think
• 23:58
  is
• 23:58
  a
• 23:58
  topic
• 23:58
  of
• 23:58
  massive
• 23:59
  conversation
• 23:59
  at
• 24:00
  the
• 24:00
  moment
• 24:00
  is
• 24:01
  what
• 24:01
  is
• 24:01
  being
• 24:01
  coined
• 24:02
  in
• 24:02
  the
• 24:02
  worst
• 24:02
  social
• 24:03
  commerce.
• 24:03
  So
• 24:03
  you
• 24:04
  mentioned
• 24:04
  TikTok
• 24:04
  for
• 24:05
  example,
• 24:06
  and
• 24:06
  how
• 24:06
  TikTok
• 24:07
  seems
• 24:07
  to
• 24:07
  be
• 24:08
  disrupting
• 24:08
  the
• 24:08
  game
• 24:09
  quite
• 24:10
  considerably.
• 24:11
  As
• 24:11
  long
• 24:11
  as
• 24:11
  Donald
• 24:11
  Trump
• 24:12
  doesn't
• 24:12
  turn
• 24:12
  it
• 24:13
  off
• 24:13
  again,
• 24:13
  you
• 24:13
  know,
• 24:14
  it's
• 24:14
  that
• 24:14
  Kind
• 24:14
  of,
• 24:15
  certainly
• 24:16
  for
• 24:16
  the
• 24:16
  states.
• 24:17
  But
• 24:19
  I
• 24:19
  was
• 24:19
  always
• 24:19
  surprised
• 24:21
  that
• 24:22
  three
• 24:22
  years
• 24:22
  ago
• 24:23
  Instagram
• 24:23
  didn't
• 24:23
  allow
• 24:24
  you
• 24:24
  to
• 24:24
  buy
• 24:25
  products
• 24:25
  on
• 24:25
  their
• 24:25
  platform
• 24:26
  and
• 24:26
  they
• 24:26
  took
• 24:26
  a
• 24:27
  cut
• 24:27
  of
• 24:27
  all
• 24:27
  the
• 24:27
  sales.
• 24:28
  That
• 24:28
  just
• 24:28
  really
• 24:28
  surprised
• 24:29
  me
• 24:29
  that
• 24:29
  they
• 24:29
  didn't
• 24:29
  do
• 24:30
  that.
• 24:31
  I'm
• 24:31
  really
• 24:31
  surprised
• 24:32
  YouTube
• 24:32
  hasn't
• 24:33
  done
• 24:33
  that
• 24:34
  yet
• 24:34
  because
• 24:35
  it
• 24:35
  just
• 24:36
  tells
• 24:36
  me,
• 24:36
  I
• 24:37
  just
• 24:37
  think
• 24:37
  the
• 24:37
  platforms
• 24:37
  are
• 24:38
  right
• 24:38
  for
• 24:38
  it.
• 24:38
  And,
• 24:40
  and,
• 24:40
  and
• 24:41
  I
• 24:41
  think
• 24:41
  TikTok,
• 24:42
  you
• 24:42
  know,
• 24:42
  comes
• 24:42
  along,
• 24:43
  the
• 24:43
  little
• 24:43
  upstart
• 24:43
  and
• 24:44
  starts
• 24:44
  adding
• 24:44
  that
• 24:44
  and
• 24:45
  all
• 24:45
  of
• 24:45
  a
• 24:45
  sudden,
• 24:46
  you
• 24:46
  know,
• 24:46
  the
• 24:47
  US
• 24:47
  is
• 24:47
  like,
• 24:47
  well,
• 24:47
  it's
• 24:47
  Chinese.
• 24:48
  You
• 24:48
  can't,
• 24:48
  you
• 24:48
  can't
• 24:49
  use
• 24:49
  it
• 24:49
  because
• 24:49
  it's
• 24:49
  Chinese
• 24:50
  and
• 24:50
  we're
• 24:50
  going
• 24:50
  to
• 24:51
  shut
• 24:51
  it
• 24:51
  down.
• 24:52
  And
• 24:52
  Instagram
• 24:53
  is
• 24:53
  going,
• 24:53
  well,
• 24:53
  do
• 24:53
  we
• 24:53
  need
• 24:54
  to
• 24:54
  do
• 24:54
  social
• 24:54
  commerce?
• 24:54
  And
• 24:55
  I,
• 24:55
  I
• 24:55
  find
• 24:56
  it,
• 24:56
  I
• 24:56
  find
• 24:56
  it
• 24:57
  fascinating.
• 24:58
  And
• 24:59
  so
• 24:59
  I'm
• 24:59
  seeing
• 25:00
  play
• 25:00
  out
• 25:01
  what
• 25:01
  you're
• 25:01
  talking
• 25:01
  about,
• 25:02
  for
• 25:02
  example,
• 25:02
  with
• 25:02
  TikTok
• 25:03
  and
• 25:03
  with
• 25:04
  Instagram
• 25:04
  and
• 25:04
  how
• 25:04
  TikTok
• 25:05
  has
• 25:05
  innovated
• 25:06
  and
• 25:06
  Instagram,
• 25:07
  which
• 25:07
  has
• 25:08
  all
• 25:08
  the
• 25:08
  money
• 25:08
  of
• 25:09
  Zuckerberg
• 25:09
  behind
• 25:10
  it,
• 25:10
  you
• 25:10
  know,
• 25:11
  and
• 25:11
  Facebook
• 25:11
  and
• 25:12
  WhatsApp
• 25:12
  and
• 25:12
  all
• 25:13
  of
• 25:13
  that
• 25:13
  data
• 25:13
  and
• 25:13
  all
• 25:14
  of
• 25:14
  that
• 25:14
  knowledge
• 25:15
  has
• 25:15
  done
• 25:15
  relatively
• 25:16
  little
• 25:16
  other
• 25:17
  than
• 25:17
  try
• 25:17
  and
• 25:17
  get
• 25:17
  me
• 25:17
  to
• 25:17
  spend
• 25:18
  more
• 25:18
  on
• 25:18
  my
• 25:18
  ads.
• 25:20
  Yeah.
• 25:21
  And
• 25:22
  you
• 25:22
  see
• 25:22
  the
• 25:23
  same
• 25:23
  digital
• 25:23
  stagnation
• 25:24
  in
• 25:24
  these
• 25:24
  services,
• 25:25
  right?
• 25:26
  I
• 25:26
  mean,
• 25:26
  Facebook,
• 25:27
  YouTube,
• 25:27
  Instagram,
• 25:28
  that
• 25:29
  they
• 25:30
  all
• 25:30
  never
• 25:30
  really
• 25:31
  changed.
• 25:32
  I
• 25:33
  think
• 25:33
  the
• 25:33
  most
• 25:34
  change
• 25:34
  on
• 25:34
  Instagram
• 25:35
  was
• 25:35
  driven
• 25:35
  by
• 25:35
  TikTok.
• 25:36
  Yeah,
• 25:37
  they
• 25:38
  suddenly
• 25:38
  showed
• 25:39
  up
• 25:39
  and
• 25:39
  did
• 25:40
  something
• 25:40
  totally
• 25:40
  different
• 25:41
  and
• 25:41
  all
• 25:41
  the
• 25:41
  advertisers
• 25:42
  went
• 25:42
  there
• 25:42
  and
• 25:43
  then
• 25:43
  Mark
• 25:43
  Zuckerberg
• 25:44
  said,
• 25:44
  hey,
• 25:44
  look
• 25:45
  at
• 25:45
  this,
• 25:45
  I
• 25:46
  want
• 25:46
  this
• 25:46
  too.
• 25:47
  But
• 25:48
  it
• 25:49
  never
• 25:49
  really
• 25:50
  evolved
• 25:50
  from
• 25:52
  the
• 25:52
  thing
• 25:53
  that
• 25:53
  was
• 25:53
  finished
• 25:54
  at
• 25:54
  some
• 25:55
  point
• 25:55
  in
• 25:55
  the
• 25:55
  past.
• 25:57
  And
• 25:57
  the,
• 25:58
  the
• 25:58
  real
• 25:58
  innovation
• 25:59
  with
• 25:59
  E
• 25:59
  Commerce
• 26:00
  on,
• 26:01
  on
• 26:01
  TikTok
• 26:01
  is
• 26:01
  not
• 26:02
  that
• 26:02
  you
• 26:02
  can
• 26:02
  sell
• 26:02
  it
• 26:03
  on
• 26:03
  the
• 26:03
  app,
• 26:04
  it's
• 26:04
  that
• 26:05
  you
• 26:05
  don't
• 26:05
  have
• 26:06
  to
• 26:06
  link
• 26:06
  to
• 26:06
  some,
• 26:07
  to
• 26:07
  a
• 26:07
  different
• 26:08
  place.
• 26:08
  You
• 26:08
  can
• 26:08
  buy
• 26:09
  it
• 26:09
  within
• 26:09
  the
• 26:09
  app.
• 26:11
  And
• 26:11
  TikTok
• 26:12
  is
• 26:12
  also
• 26:12
  making
• 26:13
  sure
• 26:13
  that
• 26:13
  you
• 26:13
  get
• 26:14
  your
• 26:14
  stuff.
• 26:14
  Yeah.
• 26:14
  Doing
• 26:15
  all
• 26:15
  the
• 26:15
  hard
• 26:16
  fulfillment
• 26:17
  part.
• 26:18
  And
• 26:19
  that's
• 26:19
  something
• 26:19
  that
• 26:19
  everybody
• 26:20
  in
• 26:20
  China
• 26:20
  does
• 26:21
  and
• 26:21
  nobody
• 26:21
  here
• 26:21
  does.
• 26:22
  Yeah,
• 26:22
  yeah.
• 26:23
  I
• 26:23
  mean
• 26:23
  Meta
• 26:24
  and
• 26:24
  all
• 26:24
  the
• 26:25
  other
• 26:25
  companies
• 26:25
  have
• 26:26
  a
• 26:26
  very
• 26:27
  solid,
• 26:27
  well
• 26:28
  working
• 26:28
  business
• 26:28
  model
• 26:29
  and
• 26:29
  that's
• 26:29
  ads.
• 26:31
  And
• 26:31
  everything
• 26:32
  that
• 26:32
  distracts
• 26:33
  from
• 26:33
  this
• 26:34
  is
• 26:34
  probably
• 26:35
  bad.
• 26:37
  And
• 26:37
  if
• 26:37
  you
• 26:38
  suddenly
• 26:39
  have
• 26:39
  to
• 26:39
  handle
• 26:40
  the
• 26:40
  packages
• 26:41
  and
• 26:42
  have
• 26:42
  to
• 26:42
  have
• 26:43
  hotlines
• 26:44
  for
• 26:44
  customers
• 26:46
  because
• 26:46
  they
• 26:47
  buy
• 26:47
  something
• 26:47
  from
• 26:48
  your
• 26:48
  platform,
• 26:49
  that's
• 26:49
  something
• 26:50
  that
• 26:50
  you
• 26:50
  try
• 26:50
  to
• 26:50
  avoid.
• 26:52
  So
• 26:52
  you
• 26:52
  stick
• 26:53
  to
• 26:53
  your
• 26:54
  basic
• 26:56
  business
• 26:57
  model,
• 26:57
  selling
• 26:58
  reach
• 27:00
  and
• 27:00
  what
• 27:01
  you
• 27:01
  do
• 27:01
  is
• 27:01
  you
• 27:01
  outlink
• 27:02
  to
• 27:03
  a
• 27:03
  different
• 27:04
  shop.
• 27:05
  And
• 27:05
  that's
• 27:05
  something
• 27:06
  that
• 27:06
  actually
• 27:06
  works
• 27:07
  pretty
• 27:07
  well
• 27:07
  as
• 27:07
  we
• 27:08
  all
• 27:08
  know
• 27:09
  buying
• 27:10
  something
• 27:10
  on
• 27:10
  Instagram
• 27:11
  meaning
• 27:12
  clicking
• 27:12
  a
• 27:12
  link
• 27:13
  and
• 27:13
  then
• 27:13
  going
• 27:13
  to
• 27:14
  a
• 27:14
  shop.
• 27:15
  Yeah.
• 27:16
  And
• 27:16
  Instagram
• 27:17
  earns
• 27:17
  money,
• 27:17
  the
• 27:18
  shop
• 27:18
  sells
• 27:18
  something.
• 27:19
  But
• 27:19
  the
• 27:20
  conversion
• 27:20
  rate
• 27:20
  is
• 27:20
  probably
• 27:21
  not
• 27:21
  very
• 27:21
  good
• 27:22
  because
• 27:22
  you
• 27:22
  always
• 27:23
  have
• 27:23
  the
• 27:23
  problem
• 27:23
  with
• 27:25
  sign
• 27:25
  up,
• 27:26
  email
• 27:26
  registration
• 27:27
  and
• 27:27
  all
• 27:28
  these
• 27:28
  other
• 27:28
  things.
• 27:29
  I
• 27:29
  think
• 27:29
  there
• 27:29
  was
• 27:30
  some
• 27:30
  interesting
• 27:30
  experiment.
• 27:31
  I'm
• 27:31
  not
• 27:31
  sure
• 27:32
  how
• 27:32
  well
• 27:33
  this
• 27:33
  actually
• 27:33
  works,
• 27:34
  where
• 27:34
  Instagram
• 27:35
  and
• 27:35
  Amazon
• 27:38
  together
• 27:38
  created
• 27:39
  an
• 27:39
  integrated
• 27:40
  checkout
• 27:41
  process.
• 27:43
  Is
• 27:43
  that
• 27:44
  something?
• 27:45
  Yeah,
• 27:46
  I
• 27:46
  have
• 27:46
  some
• 27:46
  vague
• 27:46
  recollection
• 27:47
  of
• 27:47
  this
• 27:47
  and
• 27:48
  it
• 27:48
  never
• 27:48
  really
• 27:48
  took
• 27:48
  off.
• 27:49
  Yeah,
• 27:49
  yeah,
• 27:50
  yeah,
• 27:50
  yeah.
• 27:51
  I'm
• 27:52
  sort
• 27:52
  of
• 27:52
  racking
• 27:52
  my
• 27:52
  brain
• 27:52
  and
• 27:53
  I
• 27:53
  remember
• 27:53
  it
• 27:54
  didn't
• 27:54
  take
• 27:54
  off.
• 27:55
  Yeah.
• 27:57
  Wonder
• 27:57
  why.
• 27:58
  Really
• 27:58
  interesting
• 27:59
  question.
• 28:00
  I
• 28:00
  have
• 28:00
  no
• 28:00
  idea.
• 28:02
  But
• 28:02
  that's
• 28:02
  something
• 28:03
  that
• 28:03
  would
• 28:03
  be
• 28:03
  natural,
• 28:04
  right?
• 28:04
  That
• 28:05
  somehow
• 28:06
  you
• 28:07
  have
• 28:07
  a
• 28:07
  very
• 28:08
  smooth
• 28:08
  buying
• 28:09
  process
• 28:09
  within
• 28:10
  these
• 28:10
  platforms
• 28:11
  and
• 28:11
  that's
• 28:11
  something
• 28:12
  that
• 28:12
  everybody
• 28:12
  in
• 28:13
  China
• 28:13
  does.
• 28:14
  Social
• 28:14
  commerce
• 28:15
  here
• 28:16
  doesn't
• 28:17
  mean
• 28:17
  anything
• 28:18
  social.
• 28:18
  Right.
• 28:18
  It's
• 28:19
  just
• 28:19
  something
• 28:19
  that
• 28:20
  we
• 28:20
  call
• 28:20
  social
• 28:21
  media,
• 28:21
  which
• 28:21
  also
• 28:22
  usually
• 28:22
  isn't
• 28:23
  social.
• 28:23
  And
• 28:24
  ironically,
• 28:25
  yeah,
• 28:26
  you,
• 28:26
  you
• 28:26
  click
• 28:27
  on
• 28:27
  something
• 28:28
  and
• 28:28
  you
• 28:28
  buy
• 28:29
  something
• 28:29
  and
• 28:29
  then
• 28:30
  the
• 28:30
  whole
• 28:30
  thing
• 28:31
  becomes
• 28:31
  social
• 28:31
  media,
• 28:32
  social
• 28:33
  commerce.
• 28:34
  Yeah.
• 28:34
  And
• 28:35
  have
• 28:35
  you
• 28:35
  heard
• 28:35
  about
• 28:36
  Xiaohongshu
• 28:37
  (aka
• 28:37
  RedNote)?
• 28:38
  Because
• 28:39
  that's
• 28:39
  a
• 28:39
  very,
• 28:40
  very
• 28:40
  interesting
• 28:40
  case.
• 28:42
  As
• 28:42
  I
• 28:42
  said,
• 28:43
  our
• 28:43
  social
• 28:43
  media
• 28:44
  is
• 28:44
  not
• 28:44
  really
• 28:44
  social.
• 28:45
  I
• 28:45
  think
• 28:45
  we
• 28:45
  all
• 28:45
  know
• 28:46
  that.
• 28:47
  It's
• 28:47
  a
• 28:47
  place
• 28:47
  where
• 28:48
  we
• 28:48
  hang
• 28:48
  out
• 28:48
  to
• 28:48
  see
• 28:49
  ads
• 28:49
  and
• 28:50
  then
• 28:50
  some
• 28:51
  content.
• 28:52
  Place
• 28:52
  where
• 28:52
  we
• 28:52
  go
• 28:52
  to
• 28:52
  get
• 28:53
  mental
• 28:53
  health
• 28:53
  issues.
• 28:54
  Yeah,
• 28:54
  yeah,
• 28:55
  that's
• 28:55
  the
• 28:55
  other
• 28:55
  problem.
• 28:56
  Well,
• 28:56
  that's
• 28:57
  the
• 28:57
  side
• 28:57
  effect.
• 28:59
  And
• 29:00
  social
• 29:00
  media
• 29:00
  in
• 29:00
  China
• 29:01
  is
• 29:01
  totally
• 29:01
  different.
• 29:02
  Yeah,
• 29:02
  you
• 29:02
  have
• 29:02
  a
• 29:03
  really
• 29:03
  social
• 29:03
  experience
• 29:04
  and
• 29:05
  all
• 29:06
  the
• 29:06
  stuff
• 29:06
  that
• 29:07
  makes
• 29:08
  social
• 29:08
  media
• 29:08
  in
• 29:09
  the
• 29:09
  west
• 29:09
  so
• 29:09
  miserable
• 29:10
  is
• 29:10
  missing
• 29:10
  in
• 29:11
  China.
• 29:12
  And
• 29:14
  we
• 29:14
  don't
• 29:15
  know
• 29:15
  anything
• 29:15
  about
• 29:15
  this
• 29:16
  because
• 29:16
  we
• 29:16
  don't
• 29:16
  know
• 29:17
  any
• 29:17
  Chinese
• 29:17
  social
• 29:18
  media
• 29:18
  services.
• 29:19
  TikTok
• 29:20
  is
• 29:21
  the
• 29:21
  one
• 29:21
  exception.
• 29:22
  And
• 29:23
  when
• 29:23
  the
• 29:23
  TikTok
• 29:24
  ban
• 29:24
  loomed
• 29:25
  two
• 29:25
  weeks
• 29:26
  ago,
• 29:27
  millions
• 29:28
  of
• 29:29
  TikTok
• 29:30
  users
• 29:30
  under
• 29:31
  the
• 29:31
  hashtag
• 29:32
  TikTok
• 29:32
  refugees
• 29:34
  joined.
• 29:38
  Somebody
• 29:39
  told
• 29:39
  them
• 29:39
  that
• 29:39
  this
• 29:40
  Shangshu
• 29:40
  is
• 29:41
  the.
• 29:41
  The
• 29:41
  Chinese
• 29:42
  tick
• 29:42
  tock,
• 29:42
  which
• 29:43
  isn't
• 29:43
  because
• 29:45
  is
• 29:45
  the
• 29:46
  Chinese
• 29:46
  tick
• 29:46
  tock
• 29:46
  which
• 29:47
  is
• 29:47
  owned
• 29:47
  by
• 29:47
  the
• 29:48
  same
• 29:48
  company.
• 29:48
  It
• 29:48
  looks
• 29:48
  more
• 29:49
  or
• 29:49
  less
• 29:49
  the
• 29:49
  same,
• 29:49
  different
• 29:50
  content.
• 29:50
  But
• 29:51
  so,
• 29:52
  but
• 29:53
  suddenly
• 29:54
  you
• 29:54
  have
• 29:54
  an
• 29:54
  influx
• 29:55
  of
• 29:55
  millions
• 29:56
  of
• 29:56
  Western
• 29:56
  users
• 29:58
  to
• 29:58
  Sha
• 29:58
  Hongshu
• 29:59
  and
• 30:00
  getting
• 30:01
  an
• 30:02
  unfiltered
• 30:03
  authentic
• 30:05
  Chinese
• 30:05
  social
• 30:05
  media
• 30:06
  experience.
• 30:07
  And
• 30:08
  that
• 30:08
  was
• 30:08
  an
• 30:08
  extremely
• 30:09
  interesting
• 30:10
  experiment
• 30:10
  because
• 30:11
  everybody
• 30:12
  liked
• 30:12
  it.
• 30:14
  Suddenly
• 30:15
  if
• 30:16
  you
• 30:16
  look,
• 30:17
  if
• 30:17
  you
• 30:17
  search
• 30:18
  for
• 30:18
  TikTok
• 30:19
  refugee
• 30:20
  on
• 30:21
  TikTok
• 30:22
  or
• 30:22
  on
• 30:23
  Instagram,
• 30:23
  you
• 30:23
  see
• 30:24
  lots
• 30:24
  of
• 30:24
  videos
• 30:24
  from
• 30:25
  people
• 30:26
  who
• 30:26
  describe
• 30:27
  their
• 30:27
  experience
• 30:28
  that
• 30:30
  social
• 30:30
  media
• 30:30
  can
• 30:31
  be
• 30:31
  totally
• 30:31
  different.
• 30:32
  People
• 30:32
  were
• 30:32
  so
• 30:33
  welcoming
• 30:33
  and
• 30:34
  had
• 30:35
  really
• 30:35
  good
• 30:35
  conversations
• 30:36
  and
• 30:38
  all
• 30:39
  the
• 30:39
  stuff
• 30:39
  that
• 30:40
  makes
• 30:40
  Life
• 30:41
  here
• 30:41
  so
• 30:41
  miserable
• 30:42
  isn't
• 30:43
  happening
• 30:43
  there
• 30:44
  because
• 30:45
  every
• 30:46
  social
• 30:46
  media
• 30:47
  service
• 30:47
  in
• 30:47
  China
• 30:48
  tries
• 30:48
  to
• 30:50
  create
• 30:51
  the
• 30:51
  atmosphere
• 30:51
  of
• 30:52
  a
• 30:52
  neighborhood
• 30:52
  bar
• 30:53
  where
• 30:53
  you
• 30:54
  come
• 30:54
  hang
• 30:55
  out
• 30:55
  with
• 30:55
  friends,
• 30:55
  have
• 30:56
  nice
• 30:56
  conversations,
• 30:58
  because
• 30:58
  that's
• 30:58
  the
• 30:59
  place
• 30:59
  where
• 30:59
  people
• 30:59
  like
• 31:00
  to
• 31:00
  be.
• 31:00
  Yeah,
• 31:01
  yeah.
• 31:02
  It's
• 31:02
  the.
• 31:03
  The
• 31:03
  Western
• 31:04
  social
• 31:04
  media
• 31:05
  cage
• 31:05
  fight
• 31:06
  thing.
• 31:08
  I
• 31:08
  don't
• 31:08
  know
• 31:08
  why
• 31:09
  it's
• 31:09
  so
• 31:09
  successful,
• 31:10
  but
• 31:11
  it's
• 31:12
  counterintuitive
• 31:13
  if
• 31:13
  you
• 31:14
  want
• 31:14
  to
• 31:14
  create
• 31:14
  a
• 31:15
  good
• 31:15
  atmosphere,
• 31:15
  get
• 31:16
  people
• 31:16
  to
• 31:16
  be
• 31:16
  social.
• 31:19
  You
• 31:19
  don't
• 31:20
  go
• 31:20
  into
• 31:20
  a
• 31:20
  bar
• 31:20
  where
• 31:21
  everybody's
• 31:21
  fighting
• 31:21
  with
• 31:22
  each
• 31:22
  other.
• 31:22
  You
• 31:23
  even
• 31:23
  never
• 31:24
  come
• 31:24
  back.
• 31:25
  And
• 31:26
  for
• 31:26
  some
• 31:26
  reason,
• 31:27
  this
• 31:27
  model
• 31:27
  was
• 31:28
  a
• 31:28
  prevailing
• 31:28
  model
• 31:29
  in
• 31:29
  Western
• 31:29
  social
• 31:30
  media.
• 31:30
  And
• 31:30
  that's
• 31:30
  what
• 31:31
  everybody
• 31:31
  is
• 31:32
  doing.
• 31:35
  And
• 31:35
  that's
• 31:36
  not
• 31:36
  the
• 31:37
  social
• 31:37
  media
• 31:37
  thing
• 31:38
  in
• 31:38
  China.
• 31:39
  And
• 31:39
  there
• 31:40
  it's
• 31:40
  really
• 31:41
  social
• 31:42
  and
• 31:42
  that's
• 31:43
  a
• 31:43
  much
• 31:43
  better
• 31:43
  atmosphere
• 31:44
  to
• 31:44
  sell
• 31:44
  stuff,
• 31:46
  to
• 31:46
  get
• 31:46
  recommendations,
• 31:47
  to
• 31:48
  talk
• 31:48
  about
• 31:48
  products.
• 31:49
  And
• 31:50
  so
• 31:51
  the
• 31:51
  whole
• 31:51
  Xiaohongshu
• 31:52
  thing,
• 31:53
  or
• 31:53
  in.
• 31:54
  In
• 31:54
  Western
• 31:55
  world,
• 31:55
  it's
• 31:55
  called
• 31:55
  (aka
• 31:55
  RedNote).
• 31:56
  The
• 31:56
  app
• 31:57
  is.
• 31:57
  (aka
• 31:57
  RedNote)
• 31:58
  was
• 31:59
  an
• 31:59
  extremely,
• 31:59
  extremely
• 32:00
  interesting
• 32:01
  experiment
• 32:02
  because
• 32:02
  it
• 32:02
  showed
• 32:03
  that
• 32:03
  the
• 32:04
  Chinese
• 32:05
  version
• 32:05
  of
• 32:06
  social
• 32:07
  is
• 32:07
  very
• 32:08
  compatible
• 32:09
  with
• 32:09
  Western
• 32:10
  consumers
• 32:10
  or
• 32:10
  users.
• 32:12
  So
• 32:12
  it'll
• 32:12
  be
• 32:12
  interesting
• 32:13
  to
• 32:13
  see
• 32:13
  how
• 32:13
  that
• 32:14
  changes
• 32:14
  things
• 32:14
  over
• 32:15
  the
• 32:15
  next
• 32:15
  few
• 32:15
  years.
• 32:16
  It'll
• 32:16
  be
• 32:17
  interesting
• 32:17
  to
• 32:17
  see.
• 32:17
  I
• 32:17
  mean,
• 32:17
  now
• 32:18
  we
• 32:18
  have
• 32:18
  TikTok
• 32:18
  back
• 32:19
  and
• 32:19
  probably
• 32:19
  a
• 32:20
  lot
• 32:20
  of
• 32:20
  people
• 32:20
  move
• 32:21
  back.
• 32:21
  The
• 32:22
  interesting
• 32:22
  thing
• 32:22
  is
• 32:23
  it's
• 32:23
  also
• 32:23
  a
• 32:24
  very
• 32:24
  interesting
• 32:25
  case
• 32:25
  of
• 32:25
  China
• 32:25
  speed
• 32:26
  because
• 32:27
  Cha
• 32:28
  Hongshu
• 32:28
  had
• 32:28
  an
• 32:29
  app
• 32:29
  in
• 32:29
  the
• 32:29
  Western
• 32:29
  App
• 32:30
  Store,
• 32:30
  but
• 32:30
  it
• 32:31
  was
• 32:31
  not
• 32:31
  really
• 32:32
  localized.
• 32:33
  There
• 32:33
  were
• 32:34
  some
• 32:34
  English
• 32:35
  navigation
• 32:36
  elements,
• 32:36
  but
• 32:36
  most
• 32:36
  of
• 32:36
  the
• 32:37
  stuff
• 32:37
  was
• 32:37
  just
• 32:38
  Chinese.
• 32:39
  I
• 32:39
  think
• 32:39
  their
• 32:39
  main
• 32:39
  target
• 32:40
  group
• 32:40
  were
• 32:40
  just
• 32:41
  Chinese
• 32:41
  people
• 32:42
  who
• 32:43
  are
• 32:43
  expats
• 32:43
  in
• 32:44
  Western
• 32:44
  countries.
• 32:45
  So
• 32:45
  Chinese
• 32:46
  users
• 32:47
  downloading
• 32:48
  the
• 32:48
  Western
• 32:48
  version
• 32:49
  to
• 32:49
  get
• 32:49
  into
• 32:49
  the
• 32:51
  Shanghu
• 32:52
  in
• 32:52
  China.
• 32:53
  And
• 32:54
  it
• 32:54
  took
• 32:55
  Sha
• 32:55
  Honshu
• 32:56
  3,
• 32:56
  4
• 32:57
  days
• 32:57
  to
• 32:57
  localize
• 32:58
  the
• 32:58
  whole
• 32:58
  app.
• 32:59
  Within
• 33:00
  just
• 33:00
  a
• 33:00
  couple
• 33:01
  of
• 33:01
  days,
• 33:02
  we
• 33:02
  had
• 33:02
  all
• 33:03
  the
• 33:03
  navigation
• 33:03
  in
• 33:04
  English.
• 33:04
  We
• 33:04
  had
• 33:04
  translate
• 33:05
  buttons
• 33:05
  on
• 33:06
  all
• 33:07
  Chinese
• 33:08
  postings.
• 33:09
  Was
• 33:10
  extremely
• 33:11
  fast.
• 33:12
  And
• 33:13
  that's
• 33:14
  also
• 33:14
  an
• 33:14
  interesting
• 33:15
  learning.
• 33:15
  Yeah.
• 33:15
  How
• 33:16
  quickly
• 33:16
  you
• 33:16
  can
• 33:16
  do
• 33:16
  this.
• 33:17
  And
• 33:17
  the
• 33:17
  interesting
• 33:17
  question
• 33:18
  is
• 33:18
  now,
• 33:19
  does
• 33:20
  Shahongshu
• 33:21
  use
• 33:21
  this
• 33:21
  as
• 33:22
  an
• 33:22
  opportunity
• 33:23
  to
• 33:23
  grow
• 33:23
  their
• 33:24
  business
• 33:25
  here?
• 33:27
  Nobody
• 33:28
  knows.
• 33:29
  Not
• 33:30
  sure
• 33:30
  if
• 33:30
  even
• 33:30
  Shahangzhi
• 33:31
  knows
• 33:31
  this,
• 33:31
  how
• 33:32
  they
• 33:32
  make
• 33:32
  use
• 33:32
  of
• 33:33
  this
• 33:33
  situation,
• 33:34
  but
• 33:35
  that's
• 33:35
  extremely
• 33:35
  interesting,
• 33:36
  I
• 33:36
  think.
• 33:36
  Yeah.
• 33:37
  No,
• 33:37
  fascinating
• 33:37
  as
• 33:38
  to
• 33:38
  how
• 33:38
  fast
• 33:38
  and.
• 33:39
  And
• 33:41
  that
• 33:41
  change
• 33:42
  was
• 33:42
  brought
• 33:42
  about.
• 33:42
  I
• 33:43
  mean,
• 33:43
  goodness
• 33:43
  me,
• 33:44
  three
• 33:44
  to
• 33:44
  four
• 33:44
  days.
• 33:45
  You
• 33:45
  imagine
• 33:45
  you
• 33:45
  wouldn't.
• 33:46
  I
• 33:46
  just
• 33:47
  don't
• 33:47
  know.
• 33:47
  It
• 33:47
  takes
• 33:48
  Apple
• 33:48
  six
• 33:48
  months
• 33:49
  to
• 33:49
  make
• 33:49
  some
• 33:49
  changes
• 33:49
  to
• 33:50
  the
• 33:50
  way
• 33:50
  they
• 33:50
  do
• 33:50
  news
• 33:51
  notifications.
• 33:51
  So
• 33:51
  I'm
• 33:52
  not.
• 33:52
  I'm
• 33:52
  not
• 33:52
  holding
• 33:52
  my
• 33:53
  breath.
• 33:54
  What
• 33:54
  do
• 33:54
  you
• 33:55
  think,
• 33:56
  Björn?
• 33:56
  I
• 33:56
  mean,
• 33:56
  I'm
• 33:56
  aware
• 33:57
  of
• 33:57
  time
• 33:57
  here.
• 33:57
  So
• 33:58
  I.
• 34:00
  What
• 34:00
  do
• 34:00
  you
• 34:00
  think?
• 34:01
  Knowing
• 34:01
  what
• 34:02
  you
• 34:02
  know
• 34:02
  about
• 34:02
  the
• 34:02
  market
• 34:04
  is
• 34:04
  the
• 34:04
  biggest
• 34:05
  thing
• 34:05
  that
• 34:05
  we
• 34:06
  as
• 34:06
  e
• 34:06
  commerce
• 34:07
  entrepreneurs
• 34:07
  can
• 34:08
  take
• 34:08
  advantage
• 34:08
  of
• 34:08
  from
• 34:09
  our
• 34:09
  Chinese,
• 34:10
  you
• 34:10
  know,
• 34:10
  cousins.
• 34:10
  What
• 34:11
  can
• 34:11
  we.
• 34:12
  How
• 34:12
  can
• 34:12
  we
• 34:12
  look
• 34:12
  at
• 34:12
  what
• 34:13
  they
• 34:13
  do
• 34:13
  and
• 34:13
  go
• 34:14
  right,
• 34:14
  this
• 34:14
  is
• 34:15
  one
• 34:15
  key
• 34:15
  thing.
• 34:15
  We
• 34:15
  could
• 34:16
  learn
• 34:16
  to
• 34:16
  help
• 34:16
  out
• 34:16
  our
• 34:17
  business.
• 34:18
  Yeah.
• 34:18
  I
• 34:18
  think
• 34:19
  that
• 34:19
  the
• 34:19
  first
• 34:19
  thing
• 34:20
  is
• 34:20
  become
• 34:20
  aware
• 34:21
  of
• 34:21
  what's
• 34:21
  happening
• 34:21
  there.
• 34:23
  Yeah.
• 34:25
  Because
• 34:25
  we
• 34:25
  aren't.
• 34:27
  Yeah.
• 34:27
  I,
• 34:27
  I
• 34:28
  always
• 34:28
  like
• 34:28
  to
• 34:29
  call
• 34:29
  this
• 34:29
  asymmetric
• 34:30
  ignorance.
• 34:32
  Chinese
• 34:32
  know
• 34:33
  everything
• 34:33
  about
• 34:34
  us.
• 34:34
  Yeah.
• 34:35
  We
• 34:35
  don't
• 34:35
  even
• 34:35
  know
• 34:35
  what
• 34:36
  we
• 34:36
  don't
• 34:36
  know
• 34:36
  about
• 34:37
  China.
• 34:37
  Yeah.
• 34:38
  And
• 34:39
  so
• 34:40
  get
• 34:41
  rid
• 34:41
  of
• 34:41
  this
• 34:41
  is
• 34:42
  probably
• 34:42
  the
• 34:42
  best
• 34:43
  recommendation
• 34:44
  that
• 34:44
  you
• 34:45
  can
• 34:45
  get.
• 34:47
  Look
• 34:47
  at
• 34:48
  companies
• 34:48
  like
• 34:49
  Xiaohongshu
• 34:50
  and
• 34:51
  study
• 34:52
  what
• 34:52
  makes
• 34:52
  them
• 34:52
  successful.
• 34:53
  Also
• 34:54
  tmall
• 34:54
  for
• 34:54
  example
• 34:55
  or
• 34:55
  Taobao
• 34:56
  and
• 34:57
  all
• 34:57
  these
• 34:58
  other
• 34:59
  Chinese
• 35:00
  e
• 35:00
  commerce
• 35:00
  operations.
• 35:02
  There
• 35:02
  are
• 35:02
  a
• 35:02
  lot
• 35:03
  of
• 35:03
  small
• 35:03
  things
• 35:04
  like
• 35:04
  the
• 35:04
  one
• 35:04
  that
• 35:05
  I
• 35:05
  just
• 35:06
  mentioned,
• 35:07
  social
• 35:08
  shopping,
• 35:08
  meaning
• 35:10
  thinking
• 35:11
  about
• 35:11
  how
• 35:11
  can
• 35:11
  my
• 35:12
  customers
• 35:12
  shop
• 35:12
  together.
• 35:13
  That's
• 35:13
  something
• 35:14
  that's
• 35:14
  very
• 35:14
  easy.
• 35:15
  Another
• 35:15
  thing
• 35:15
  that's
• 35:16
  missing
• 35:16
  is
• 35:17
  every
• 35:17
  Chinese
• 35:19
  e
• 35:19
  commerce
• 35:19
  app,
• 35:19
  but
• 35:20
  also
• 35:20
  normal
• 35:21
  app,
• 35:21
  has
• 35:21
  an
• 35:21
  easy
• 35:22
  mode
• 35:22
  for
• 35:22
  senior
• 35:22
  people.
• 35:24
  Think
• 35:24
  about
• 35:26
  how
• 35:27
  difficult
• 35:27
  Amazon
• 35:28
  is
• 35:28
  actually
• 35:29
  for
• 35:31
  not
• 35:31
  somebody
• 35:31
  who's
• 35:32
  70,
• 35:32
  but
• 35:32
  like
• 35:33
  80.
• 35:34
  We're
• 35:36
  in
• 35:36
  a
• 35:36
  society
• 35:37
  that
• 35:37
  has
• 35:37
  more
• 35:38
  and
• 35:38
  more
• 35:39
  older
• 35:39
  people
• 35:40
  and
• 35:41
  they
• 35:41
  very
• 35:42
  often
• 35:42
  have
• 35:43
  a
• 35:43
  lot
• 35:43
  of
• 35:43
  time
• 35:43
  and
• 35:44
  a
• 35:44
  lot
• 35:44
  of
• 35:44
  money
• 35:46
  and
• 35:46
  they
• 35:46
  probably
• 35:46
  would
• 35:47
  like
• 35:47
  to
• 35:47
  spend
• 35:48
  it
• 35:48
  online
• 35:49
  because
• 35:49
  all
• 35:49
  the
• 35:50
  shop
• 35:50
  closed
• 35:51
  on
• 35:51
  the
• 35:51
  high
• 35:51
  street
• 35:52
  so
• 35:53
  they
• 35:53
  actually
• 35:53
  have
• 35:54
  to
• 35:54
  buy
• 35:54
  something
• 35:54
  online.
• 35:55
  But
• 35:55
  it's
• 35:55
  extremely
• 35:56
  difficult
• 35:56
  to
• 35:57
  do.
• 35:58
  Not
• 35:58
  for
• 35:58
  us,
• 35:59
  but
• 36:00
  for
• 36:00
  older
• 36:01
  people
• 36:01
  it
• 36:01
  is.
• 36:02
  And
• 36:03
  that's
• 36:04
  also
• 36:04
  something
• 36:04
  that's.
• 36:06
  There
• 36:06
  are
• 36:06
  solutions
• 36:07
  in
• 36:07
  China
• 36:09
  where
• 36:09
  you
• 36:09
  can
• 36:10
  use
• 36:10
  this
• 36:11
  easy
• 36:11
  mode
• 36:11
  to
• 36:12
  make
• 36:13
  everything
• 36:14
  a
• 36:14
  little
• 36:14
  bit
• 36:14
  easier.
• 36:15
  Get
• 36:15
  rid
• 36:15
  of
• 36:16
  all
• 36:16
  the
• 36:16
  pop
• 36:16
  ups,
• 36:17
  make
• 36:17
  the
• 36:18
  selection
• 36:18
  of
• 36:18
  products
• 36:19
  a
• 36:19
  little
• 36:19
  bit
• 36:19
  different.
• 36:20
  That's
• 36:20
  something.
• 36:21
  Also
• 36:22
  don't
• 36:23
  copy
• 36:23
  what
• 36:23
  the
• 36:24
  Chinese
• 36:24
  are
• 36:24
  doing.
• 36:25
  That's
• 36:25
  also
• 36:25
  a
• 36:25
  very
• 36:26
  common
• 36:26
  mistake.
• 36:27
  Understand
• 36:28
  it
• 36:28
  and
• 36:28
  then
• 36:29
  adapt
• 36:29
  it
• 36:29
  to
• 36:30
  how
• 36:30
  we
• 36:31
  should
• 36:31
  do
• 36:31
  this.
• 36:32
  Yeah.
• 36:32
  That's
• 36:33
  probably
• 36:33
  the
• 36:34
  other
• 36:34
  recommendation.
• 36:35
  And
• 36:37
  it's
• 36:37
  not
• 36:37
  like
• 36:37
  there's
• 36:38
  just
• 36:38
  one
• 36:39
  thing,
• 36:40
  it's
• 36:41
  the
• 36:41
  thinking
• 36:42
  that's
• 36:42
  different
• 36:42
  and
• 36:43
  that
• 36:43
  we
• 36:43
  should
• 36:44
  change.
• 36:44
  Becoming
• 36:45
  aware
• 36:45
  of
• 36:46
  stuff
• 36:46
  that
• 36:47
  isn't
• 36:47
  changing
• 36:48
  here.
• 36:49
  Yeah,
• 36:50
  no,
• 36:50
  it's
• 36:50
  so
• 36:50
  important.
• 36:51
  I
• 36:51
  love
• 36:51
  that.
• 36:52
  I
• 36:52
  love
• 36:52
  that.
• 36:52
  Be
• 36:52
  aware.
• 36:53
  Just
• 36:53
  go
• 36:53
  and
• 36:53
  stop
• 36:54
  being
• 36:54
  ignorant.
• 36:54
  Matthew.
• 36:56
  Don't
• 36:57
  be
• 36:57
  an
• 36:57
  ignoramus,
• 36:58
  as
• 36:58
  my
• 36:58
  mum
• 36:58
  would
• 36:58
  say,
• 37:00
  and
• 37:01
  go
• 37:01
  and
• 37:01
  find
• 37:01
  out
• 37:01
  about
• 37:02
  stuff
• 37:02
  which
• 37:03
  tell
• 37:03
  us
• 37:04
  about.
• 37:06
  You've
• 37:06
  got
• 37:07
  China
• 37:07
  Blast.
• 37:08
  I
• 37:08
  was
• 37:08
  looking
• 37:08
  at
• 37:09
  the
• 37:09
  site,
• 37:09
  you've
• 37:09
  got
• 37:09
  a
• 37:09
  lot
• 37:09
  of
• 37:09
  information
• 37:10
  on
• 37:10
  there.
• 37:10
  So
• 37:10
  I
• 37:10
  guess
• 37:11
  that's
• 37:11
  a
• 37:11
  good
• 37:11
  Place
• 37:11
  to
• 37:11
  start.
• 37:14
  Yeah,
• 37:15
  my
• 37:16
  homepage
• 37:17
  is
• 37:17
  probably
• 37:18
  a
• 37:18
  good
• 37:18
  place.
• 37:19
  I
• 37:20
  aggregate
• 37:20
  all
• 37:21
  my
• 37:21
  podcast
• 37:22
  appearances,
• 37:23
  my
• 37:24
  blog
• 37:25
  posts
• 37:25
  and
• 37:25
  all
• 37:25
  the
• 37:25
  stuff
• 37:26
  that
• 37:26
  I
• 37:26
  write
• 37:26
  for
• 37:26
  other
• 37:26
  magazines.
• 37:27
  It's
• 37:28
  all
• 37:28
  on
• 37:28
  this
• 37:29
  site.
• 37:30
  There
• 37:31
  are
• 37:31
  also
• 37:31
  all
• 37:32
  my
• 37:32
  speaking
• 37:33
  engagements
• 37:34
  if
• 37:34
  somebody
• 37:34
  wants
• 37:35
  to
• 37:35
  see
• 37:35
  me,
• 37:36
  that's
• 37:36
  a
• 37:36
  place
• 37:37
  to
• 37:37
  see.
• 37:37
  LinkedIn
• 37:38
  is
• 37:38
  of
• 37:39
  course
• 37:39
  another
• 37:39
  good
• 37:41
  place.
• 37:42
  And
• 37:43
  yeah,
• 37:43
  we
• 37:43
  are
• 37:43
  right
• 37:43
  now
• 37:43
  in
• 37:44
  the
• 37:44
  process
• 37:44
  of
• 37:44
  relaunching
• 37:45
  ChinaBriefs
• 37:46
  in
• 37:46
  a
• 37:46
  couple
• 37:46
  of
• 37:46
  weeks
• 37:47
  with
• 37:47
  a
• 37:47
  different
• 37:48
  team.
• 37:48
  And
• 37:49
  the
• 37:49
  site
• 37:50
  will
• 37:50
  be,
• 37:52
  will
• 37:52
  look
• 37:52
  different,
• 37:53
  but
• 37:53
  we'll
• 37:54
  have
• 37:54
  the
• 37:54
  same
• 37:54
  mission.
• 37:55
  Explain
• 37:56
  companies
• 37:57
  in
• 37:57
  the
• 37:57
  west
• 37:57
  what
• 37:57
  they
• 37:58
  can
• 37:58
  learn
• 37:58
  from
• 37:59
  digital
• 37:59
  China.
• 38:00
  Fantastic.
• 38:01
  Now
• 38:02
  we
• 38:03
  will
• 38:03
  of
• 38:03
  course
• 38:03
  link
• 38:04
  to
• 38:04
  ChinaBriefs
• 38:05
  in
• 38:06
  the,
• 38:07
  in
• 38:07
  the
• 38:07
  newsletter
• 38:08
  it
• 38:08
  will
• 38:08
  be
• 38:09
  in
• 38:09
  the
• 38:09
  show
• 38:09
  notes
• 38:09
  which
• 38:09
  if
• 38:10
  you're
• 38:10
  listening
• 38:10
  on
• 38:10
  a
• 38:10
  podcast,
• 38:11
  you
• 38:11
  just
• 38:11
  scroll
• 38:11
  down
• 38:11
  and
• 38:12
  get
• 38:12
  them
• 38:12
  super,
• 38:13
  super
• 38:13
  easy.
• 38:14
  And
• 38:14
  of
• 38:15
  course
• 38:15
  we
• 38:15
  will
• 38:15
  link
• 38:15
  to
• 38:16
  your
• 38:16
  LinkedIn
• 38:17
  as
• 38:17
  well,
• 38:18
  Björn,
• 38:18
  which
• 38:18
  you
• 38:18
  mentioned
• 38:19
  and
• 38:19
  we'll.
• 38:21
  I
• 38:21
  connected
• 38:22
  with
• 38:22
  you
• 38:22
  earlier
• 38:22
  actually,
• 38:23
  so
• 38:23
  we're.
• 38:23
  I'm
• 38:23
  going
• 38:24
  to
• 38:24
  be
• 38:24
  following
• 38:24
  with
• 38:24
  avid
• 38:25
  interest
• 38:25
  what
• 38:25
  you
• 38:25
  post
• 38:25
  on
• 38:26
  LinkedIn.
• 38:27
  I
• 38:28
  really
• 38:28
  am.
• 38:29
  I
• 38:29
  will
• 38:29
  be
• 38:29
  on
• 38:30
  there
• 38:30
  commenting.
• 38:30
  So
• 38:32
  one
• 38:32
  very
• 38:33
  lengthy
• 38:33
  article
• 38:33
  about
• 38:34
  the
• 38:34
  whole
• 38:34
  Xiaohongshu
• 38:35
  thing
• 38:36
  that
• 38:37
  I
• 38:37
  would
• 38:37
  recommend
• 38:39
  because
• 38:39
  that's
• 38:40
  really
• 38:40
  an
• 38:40
  eye
• 38:41
  opening
• 38:41
  experience
• 38:42
  I
• 38:42
  think
• 38:42
  on
• 38:42
  so
• 38:43
  many
• 38:43
  levels.
• 38:43
  Yeah,
• 38:44
  no,
• 38:44
  fantastic,
• 38:45
  fantastic.
• 38:46
  Listen,
• 38:46
  thank
• 38:47
  you
• 38:47
  so
• 38:47
  much
• 38:47
  for
• 38:48
  coming
• 38:48
  onto
• 38:48
  the
• 38:49
  show.
• 38:49
  It's
• 38:50
  been
• 38:50
  great
• 38:50
  to
• 38:51
  chat
• 38:51
  with
• 38:51
  you,
• 38:51
  great
• 38:51
  to
• 38:51
  have
• 38:52
  a
• 38:52
  conversation
• 38:53
  and
• 38:54
  I'm
• 38:54
  absolutely
• 38:55
  fascinated
• 38:55
  by
• 38:55
  the
• 38:56
  whole
• 38:56
  thing.
• 38:56
  And
• 38:57
  yeah,
• 38:57
  I'm
• 38:58
  gonna
• 38:58
  go
• 38:58
  away
• 38:58
  and
• 38:58
  do
• 38:58
  some
• 38:59
  research
• 38:59
  and
• 38:59
  have
• 38:59
  a
• 39:00
  little
• 39:00
  bit
• 39:00
  of
• 39:00
  think
• 39:01
  about
• 39:01
  the
• 39:01
  whole
• 39:01
  thing
• 39:01
  and
• 39:01
  what
• 39:02
  it
• 39:02
  means
• 39:02
  for
• 39:02
  our
• 39:02
  business.
• 39:03
  But
• 39:04
  really
• 39:04
  great
• 39:04
  to
• 39:04
  meet
• 39:04
  you.
• 39:05
  Thank
• 39:05
  you
• 39:05
  so
• 39:05
  much
• 39:05
  for
• 39:05
  coming
• 39:06
  on.
• 39:06
  It's
• 39:07
  been
• 39:07
  much
• 39:07
  appreciated.
• 39:09
  Yeah,
• 39:09
  thanks
• 39:10
  for
• 39:10
  having
• 39:10
  me.
• 39:11
  Great,
• 39:11
  great.
• 39:12
  Well,
• 39:12
  there
• 39:13
  we
• 39:13
  go,
• 39:13
  another
• 39:14
  great
• 39:14
  conversation.
• 39:15
  In
• 39:15
  fact,
• 39:15
  let
• 39:15
  me
• 39:15
  do
• 39:15
  the.
• 39:16
  Yes.
• 39:17
  Oh
• 39:17
  yes.
• 39:18
  Another
• 39:18
  huge
• 39:19
  round
• 39:19
  of
• 39:19
  applause
• 39:19
  for
• 39:19
  our
• 39:20
  guest
• 39:20
  today.
• 39:21
  Now
• 39:21
  be
• 39:21
  sure
• 39:21
  to
• 39:22
  follow
• 39:22
  the
• 39:22
  ecommerce
• 39:23
  podcast
• 39:23
  wherever
• 39:23
  you
• 39:24
  get
• 39:24
  your
• 39:24
  podcast
• 39:24
  from
• 39:24
  because
• 39:25
  we've
• 39:25
  got
• 39:25
  more
• 39:26
  great
• 39:26
  conversations
• 39:27
  lined
• 39:27
  up
• 39:27
  and
• 39:28
  I
• 39:28
  don't
• 39:28
  want
• 39:28
  you
• 39:28
  to
• 39:28
  miss
• 39:29
  any
• 39:29
  of
• 39:29
  them.
• 39:29
  And
• 39:29
  in
• 39:29
  case
• 39:30
  no
• 39:30
  one
• 39:30
  has
• 39:30
  told
• 39:30
  you
• 39:30
  yet
• 39:30
  today,
• 39:31
  let
• 39:31
  me
• 39:31
  be
• 39:32
  the
• 39:32
  first.
• 39:33
  You
• 39:33
  are
• 39:33
  awesome.
• 39:34
  Yes,
• 39:34
  you
• 39:34
  are
• 39:35
  created
• 39:35
  awesome.
• 39:36
  It's
• 39:36
  just
• 39:36
  a
• 39:36
  burden
• 39:36
  you've
• 39:37
  got
• 39:37
  to
• 39:37
  bear.
• 39:37
  Björn's
• 39:38
  got
• 39:38
  to
• 39:38
  bear
• 39:38
  it.
• 39:38
  I've
• 39:39
  got
• 39:39
  to
• 39:39
  bear
• 39:39
  it.
• 39:40
  You've
• 39:40
  got
• 39:40
  to
• 39:40
  bear
• 39:40
  it
• 39:40
  as
• 39:41
  well.
• 39:41
  Now
• 39:41
  the
• 39:41
  E
• 39:42
  Commerce
• 39:42
  podcast
• 39:42
  is
• 39:43
  produced
• 39:43
  by
• 39:43
  Podjunction.
• 39:44
  You
• 39:44
  can
• 39:44
  find
• 39:45
  our
• 39:45
  end
• 39:45
  entire
• 39:46
  archive
• 39:46
  of
• 39:46
  episodes
• 39:47
  on
• 39:47
  your
• 39:48
  favorite
• 39:48
  podcast
• 39:48
  app.
• 39:49
  Our
• 39:49
  theme
• 39:49
  music
• 39:49
  was
• 39:49
  written
• 39:50
  by
• 39:50
  Josh
• 39:50
  Edmundson
• 39:51
  and
• 39:51
  as
• 39:51
  I
• 39:52
  mentioned,
• 39:52
  if
• 39:52
  you'd
• 39:52
  like
• 39:52
  to
• 39:53
  read
• 39:53
  the
• 39:53
  transcript,
• 39:53
  the
• 39:53
  show
• 39:54
  notes,
• 39:54
  head
• 39:54
  over
• 39:54
  to
• 39:54
  the
• 39:54
  website
• 39:55
  ecommercepodcast.net
• 39:58
  where,
• 39:58
  incidentally,
• 39:59
  you
• 39:59
  can
• 39:59
  sign
• 39:59
  up
• 39:59
  to
• 39:59
  the
• 39:59
  newsletter
• 40:00
  and
• 40:01
  get
• 40:01
  all
• 40:01
  of
• 40:01
  the
• 40:01
  good
• 40:01
  stuff
• 40:02
  coming
• 40:02
  straight
• 40:02
  to
• 40:02
  your
• 40:03
  inbox
• 40:03
  every
• 40:03
  week,
• 40:04
  all
• 40:04
  for
• 40:04
  free.
• 40:05
  But
• 40:05
  that's
• 40:05
  it
• 40:06
  from
• 40:06
  me.
• 40:06
  That's
• 40:06
  it
• 40:06
  from
• 40:07
  Björn.
• 40:07
  Thank
• 40:07
  you
• 40:07
  so
• 40:08
  much
• 40:08
  for
• 40:08
  joining
• 40:08
  us.
• 40:09
  Have
• 40:09
  a
• 40:10
  fantastic
• 40:10
  week
• 40:10
  wherever
• 40:11
  you
• 40:11
  are
• 40:11
  in
• 40:11
  the
• 40:11
  world.
• 40:12
  I
• 40:12
  will
• 40:12
  see
• 40:12
  you
• 40:12
  next
• 40:12
  time.
• 40:13
  Bye
• 40:13
  for
• 40:13
  now.