Latest / hol+ with Dr. Taz MD | The Future of Medicine is Holistic / Why You Still Feel Sick: Mold, Toxins, Nervous System Dysregulation & Chronic Illness - Root Cause Explained with Dr. Jessica Peatross

Transcript

Why You Still Feel Sick: Mold, Toxins, Nervous System Dysregulation & Chronic Illness - Root Cause Explained with Dr. Jessica Peatross · hol+ with Dr. Taz MD | The Future of Medicine is Holistic

• (00:00) You're fine in your nineto-five job if everything goes as planned and as you expected it. If anything goes unexpected, people feel unsafe. They'll often go home, doom scroll on their phone, and watch a marathon of Netflix in their safe space with their safe blanket on their safe couch. >> And that is functional freeze. (00:17) >> That's freeze. >> That's functional freeze. >> Wow. >> Or parasympathetic emergency. Indecisive, hopeless, helpless. >> People do that every day. Are we in emergency mode every day? >> It's so many people. >> Oh man. >> So many people. So many people. And I mean veagal nervous dysfunction we have shown is anything from ulcerative colitis to inflammatory bowel disease in the lower veagal tone all the way up to mental health issues depression anxiety palpitations [music] EDS all this kind of stuff is connected to veagal tone and (00:44) veagal nerve dysfunction. So many people today men and women and even children are experiencing chronic fatigue unexplained weight gain anxiety and hormone disruption but are told the labs are normal. What if these symptoms are a byproduct of hidden infections, mold exposure, parasites, [music] and environmental toxicity disrupting the body from the inside out? My guest today, Dr. (01:10) Jessica Petros, is a pioneer in functional and environmental medicine. She is known for uncovering the root causes that conventional medicine often overlooks. And so when you look at this chart, all the neuropeptides, the neurochemistry, the hormones are released differently in the body when you're not in a homeostasis. Everything there's not a pill to fix that. (01:32) So I can half the time of drainage and detox for people [music] if I get this right in the beginning with their nervous system. And many of them say, "I feel safe here. My body doesn't feel safe." We will explore how toxins, stealth infections, and dental health play a role, a major role in hormone patterns, mood, energy, and inflammation. (01:50) We will also talk about medical gaslighting, which honestly applies to all men, women, and children, and how we can all advocate for ourselves, and practical strategies to detox safely without overwhelming the body. If you have ever felt ignored, dismissed, or stuck with unexplained symptoms, this conversation will give you answers, tools, and clarity on what to do next. (02:15) Please join me in welcoming Dr. Petro, Dr. Jess to the show. Okay, before we jump in, quick health check. Are you subscribed yet? You'd be surprised how many people forget the one click that actually helps them feel better every week. Go ahead, hit it. around here. We turn science into self-care you can actually use. Let's get started. All right, Dr. (02:38) Petros, welcome to the show. You've been here like 10 minutes and I already feel like I have a new friend. It's really it's you're just you've just got this energy. I love it. We're going to call you Dr. Jess for the rest of the show. >> I think that's how I'm known. Sure. So here like a lot of my invitations onto the show are partly selfish, partly motivated by patients, you know, but one of the things that I would love more education on personally for my patients and for myself, but I also think I don't see it being talked about enough kind of (03:09) in the grand scheme of things, right? Is the role of the environment on our health. And we hear a lot about detoxing. We hear a lot about like, you know, maybe someone over here is talking about mold, someone over here talking about pesticides, somebody over here is talking about, you know, cosmetics and clean beauty and all these different things, >> but we're not hearing about it in the exam room >> and we are not kind of sinking our teeth into how we understand that as clinicians and even as patients. What do (03:41) we latch on to? What is a lot of noise? You know, where do we go from here? So that's why I wanted you on the show because I know about the work that you've done and I would love for our audience to learn a little bit more about you and a little bit more about kind of your perspective of the environment and health as somebody who's been practicing medicine. (03:59) >> Yes, absolutely. Thank you for having me too. >> Of course. So I am a traditionally cha train trained medical doctor. I was trained in internal medicine, previously board certified, not anymore. And um I worked in the hospital as a hospitalist for almost seven years before I started to see cracks in the system. (04:16) >> And you know how it is. I was discharging people on 30 or 40 different medications. They were feeding factory farm meat and Pepsi and Coke to people in the hospital, Jell-O, you know, all that stuff. >> Um and it just wasn't aligned with me anymore. So I jumped ship. I probably would have been a little bit more conservative about it had I known that I was going to make a fourth of what I used to make in the hospital. (04:34) And none of your insurance and malpractice is taken care of. It's all kind of like you have to kind of jump out of the plane and build the parachute on the way down. >> That's a scary shift, by the way. So, I also had to make that decision, you know, because I was in the ER like we were talking about. (04:48) And I remember I specifically told my husband, I'm like, I'm not going to make the money that, you know, that I make working these ER shifts. So, we need to sell the car. We need to get rid of like all this other stuff. No more like lattes and and coffees at Starbucks. Like, I go, "We've got to clamp down on the budget. (05:01) " He's like, "Okay, sure." You know, whatever. [laughter] you know, and I had no idea that I'd be as busy as I got. And I'm sure the same thing happened to you, you know, but anyhow, >> I mean, I suffered for a while, but you're braver than me. I didn't have a family to take care of. So, that's very brave what you did. (05:17) Um, >> well, I credit him with that. I've got to say I credit him. He's the one who was like, "Go. Don't be scared. Go. We'll figure it out." So, I've got to I've got to give him a shout out on that. Otherwise, I don't know. >> It's a good man >> that I would have had the courage to do it on my own. >> Yeah. It was scary me by myself even. (05:32) And um you know I got trained by different medical doctors in the holistic world, naturopathic doctor and really everything took off after that and I love my job now because I actually take people off of medicine rather than put them on and I really try and get to the root cause and what you mentioned was part of the root cause that I look for. (05:50) It's we now know in the science and in medicine it's starting to come out that the environment signals the changes in the genes, >> right? >> And it talks to us every single day. We're getting inputs and outputs from our environment and really it's our nervous system that's taking everything in from the environment. What I've noticed in my career as I've gone on and this was not something I knew right off the off the jump. (06:11) I had to really get in and kind of >> talk to patients who and providers, they've really been my best teachers. And what I've seen is that when people are in flight or fight or freeze, which we live in such a toxic society with toxic work and chemicals and everything everywhere, it's really hard to keep your nervous system feeling safe, your body, your mind feeling safe. (06:30) And when you don't feel safe, your body feels in threat. >> It contracts and it doesn't release toxins like you want it to. An example of this is people in flight or fight. They're it's the opposite of rest and digest. So they're often constipated. They cannot poop, which is a way you release toxins. (06:49) They often can't sweat in a sauna. And this is me saying, you know, when you're stuck in flight or fight, your body contracts, it doesn't feel safe. It doesn't release as well. And so, I start from the very beginning with every single patient working on them feeling safe in the body, mind, and environment because then it's a lot easier for me to complete a successful detox later on for them. (07:11) So, and that really that means I have to dig into their history, their trauma, their anticedants, their triggers to see where things begin to unravel on their health journey. >> So, you're starting at a different point, right? Like a lot of people start with, well, I've got this lab report back or you know, like I mentioned in the beginning, like I've been exposed to mold, I've been exposed to X, Y, and Z, so I need a detox. (07:36) But you're actually I if correct me if I'm wrong I feel like you're starting on the other side where you're saying all of this stuff has triggered an not an autoimmune but a veagal response of some kind or a cortisol response maybe that's a better word or a histamine response and we need to start there. Why does that approach make more sense than starting down here where we're dealing with the actual chemical or the actual toxin or the actual issue? For me, the toxin um or the pathogen is not root cause. (08:05) It's the trauma of the body. When you look at sympathetic >> impair, wait, we got to say that again. >> Yes. >> Say say that one more time because that is a different statement. The toxin is not the root cause. >> Correct. >> It's the trauma of the body. >> Correct. >> Wow. Okay. Correct. Help us understand that. >> Yes. (08:24) If you look at the um I have a chart. I wish I could show it to everyone right now. It's a it's for flight or fight. When you're in parasympathetic parasympathetic or according to Steven Forges's poly vagal theory um you're when you're in vententral veagal which is the tone of the vagus nerve the vagus nerve is the nerve that comes out the medulla oblangatada on both sides comes down intervates or sends nerve branches I like to say sings love songs to the different organs on the way down you know the thyroid the thymus the heart the lungs the liver the small intestines (08:51) all the way down till it terminates and the vagus nervous has to be a certain tone um that way it works properly in releasing chemicals throughout the body and and firing properly. And um so when it's not in the right tone, people feel indecisive. They're hopeless. They dissociate. (09:08) And as you move from flight or fight into freeze, this is considered a parasympathetic emergency. Now, let's practically describe what this looks like to people. >> Absolutely. >> You're fine in your 9 toive job. If everything goes as planned and as you expected it, if anything goes unexpected, people feel unsafe. They often go home, doom scroll on their phone and watch a marathon of Netflix in their safe space with their safe blanket on their safe couch. (09:31) >> And that is functional freeze. >> That's freeze. >> That's functional freeze. >> Wow. >> Or parasympathetic emergency. Indecisive. Hopeless help. >> People do that every day. Are we in emergency mode every day? >> So many people. >> Oh man. >> So many people. So many people. And I mean veagal nervous dysfunction we have shown is anything from ulcerative colitis to inflammatory bowel disease in the lower veagal tone all the way up to mental health issues, depression, anxiety, palpitations, EDS, all this kind of stuff is connected to veagal (10:00) tone and veagal nerve dysfunction. And so when you look at this chart, all the neuropeptides, neurochemistry, the hormones are released differently in the body when you're not in a homeostasis. Everything there's not a pill to fix that. So I can half the time of drainage and detox for people if I get this right in the beginning with their nervous system. (10:22) And many of them say I feel safe here. My body doesn't feel safe. >> So how do you know the difference between because I I feel like this is not a conscious awareness, right? How can we help somebody understand that their body's transitioning from feeling safe to feeling unsafe? >> Absolutely. They start sleeping deeper. They can get into rest and digest and get into a deep sleep. (10:46) They can be more emotionally regulated in >> safer states. Correct. >> Okay. >> Correct. So if something they get bad news, something that normally would have rattled them, they have the emotional regulations like a tree in the storm, >> right? Resilience. >> Um they can eat foods they couldn't eat before because their body feels safe. (11:04) So many food intolerances or histamine reactions because the body doesn't feel safe anymore. So the rise of so many of these disorders that we see today, right, like MCCAST, mass cell activation syndrome, gluten sensitivity, right, dairy intolerance, candida, >> what would you say to all these diagnosis diagnoses that many of us are making >> kind of day in and day out? >> Listen, drainage and detox is there's a place for it. (11:30) It's still important, but oftentimes people suffer through this. Yeah. >> Because their body isn't prepped and ready. M >> if I can make their body feel safe, it's going to accept the detox easier and it's going to half the time because if I can get you regulated, your body is a healing vessel. It is meant to heal. If it is in homeostasis, I'm in I'm the problem. (11:49) I just need to move roadblocks out of the way so the body can heal itself. >> Wow. >> That's it. >> So the vententral Vegas >> is one part of the Vegas, right? Like >> it's a tone that the Vegas. >> Are there other parts of the Vegas nerve thinking about? >> Yes. When you move up into flight or fight and into parasympathetic emergency or functional freeze, that is called dorsal veagal tone according to the polyvagal theory. (12:10) >> Okay? >> And that is really where people feel so their body is so unsafe they can't even hardly get through their day sometimes. I've seen people bed bound because of their nervous system. >> Oh my gosh. So we have the dorsal veagal and is there one more part? >> There's just vententral and dorsal. >> Those are the two main parts. (12:27) But we really want to aim for vententral. >> For vententral. Yes. Okay. So if we now can wrap our heads around this and understand that it's the veagal nerve, the vententral veagal area that's sending messages to other organs and tissues in the body, right? Correct me if I'm wrong. There's it's sending messages to other organs and tissues in the body, >> putting it in fight, flight, or freeze mode. (12:50) >> What's happening next within our bodies? >> Yes. So I'll tell you a little bit more details before we move on. What we've shown is that epinephrine or adrenaline is released in the bloodstream during a flight or fight response. However, it cannot cross the bloodb brain barrier. So, we didn't know how a lot of these fear consolidation memories were happening with the vagus nerve when things happen. (13:11) What we now know is that epinephrine or that response can trigger um the nucleus of solitary tract and have it release norepinephrine >> and that is what triggers the vagus nerve to consolidate memories within the limbic brain or the part of your brain that stores traumatic memories or fear right and so that consolidates that memory based on when the vag nerve does that. (13:32) So we have connected it to our fear in our memories in our body. However, you were asking what happens next with all this? How do we how do we function? >> Right? >> Um so what happens next when we're in dorsal veagal is some people stay there their entire life unfortunately and they they will continue to get these labels or diagnoses from the from the from the system and then not have solutions for themselves because they're put on a a medication which often band-aids the problem. (13:59) >> What are some of the common like diagnoses somebody like this might get? chronic fatigue syndrome, POTS, postural orthot or orthostatic >> technical. I've seen a ton of POTS in the black. >> You know what CO did? Yeah. >> Really activated histamine and ma and mass cell activation syndrome for people. (14:16) It really put people in dorsal >> veagal. >> It absolutely did. It causes a cytoine storm just like mold does. >> They're very similar that way. And so I've seen a huge rise in MCCAST and histamine since 2020. >> Since 2020. Fascinating. >> Yes. >> All right. So those are some of the diagnoses that we're seeing as somebody's in this particular state. (14:35) >> There's a lot more too obviously I mean just brain fog, fatigue, joint pains, um digestion problems, problems sweating, problems going to the bathroom. I mean all these vague symptoms people have. I mean things like Epstein bar virus and COVID, they're reactivated by each other and they live off adrenaline and cortisol in the body. (14:55) They live off that state of stress. So that is something that I've not heard before and I've been in the space for a long time that reactivated I've always talked about Epstein bar and lime as more of like autoimmune diseases because I think we all get a you know most of us if we've had it if we have a good immune system we fought it off it's now dormant but we saw that with co too by the way that you have this reactivation right and that reactivation I've always said is usually because some other terrain in the body is not where it needs to be right (15:25) >> but You're actually connecting the reactivation to adrenaline and cortisol. >> Yes. Because everyone knows if you're going to get a cold sore often times it's when you're stressed or around your cycle um or you're sunburned, right? Because these herpes viruses often live in the nerves, right? Like herpes 1, herpes 2 come out in the same pattern or same dermatome. They're in the nerves. (15:46) That's the nervous system. >> Fascinating. So, okay. So, how I have so many questions. >> All right. Question number one is as a provider, as a clinician, and I'm treating you the patient, >> and you're having all these different symptoms, right? And I'm creating these treatment plans and I'm trying to put things together. (16:07) >> How do I know that I need to start with the vententral veagal system before I start doing things for MCCAST or I'm just making this up, MCCAST or POTS or whatever else. Yeah. How how do I make that clinical decision? Honestly, the biggest reason I see MCCAST, histamine, and all that stuff is nervous system dysregulation followed closely by mold and COVID. (16:30) So, [clears throat] I almost start every single person in this pattern in my in my practice. You know, we're all different. We're all unique and bio-individual, but we still have the same feelings, emotions, organs, things that run the same in the body that need to be tailored bio-individually for us. So, oftentimes I'll put people through a nervous system dysregulation part of my program at the very beginning. (16:50) Um, and some people need shorter and some people need longer, but I always go through it with them because if you have a chronic illness or label, >> then chances are your nervous system is not in homeostasis. Is very rare that I see someone who is in rest and digest and still has a chronic illness. >> Interesting. >> It's very rare. (17:06) >> So then what do you do next when you identify and how how do you identify? Are you using certain parameters, lab test, >> physical exam, like how are you identifying? >> Yes. >> And then what do you do next? So, everyone who comes through my clinic gets a total tox test from Vibrant Labs and that checks for miccotoxins, environmental toxins like pesticides, Roundup, phalates, plastics, um, and, uh, heavy metals and they also get a pretty intensive blood work panel. (17:32) So, it's a really inflammatory based panel. So, I can look at things that might be driving the system, right? Um, I definitely check a CRP, ESR, homocyine on everyone. And I always check CMP, um, CBC, vitamin D, full thyroid, full iron panel on everyone. And that lets me see how some of their drainage pathways or organ systems are doing as well as the inflammation within the body. Yeah. (17:56) And usually if people are in flag, they have some level of inflammation that's picked up on one of those lab tests. On top of the questions, I spend an hour asking them and talking to them about their history. And I start them in childhood. Did you have a happy and healthy childhood? and have them give me that timeline all the way through into the present day. (18:13) And I note anticedants, triggers, and traumas that occurred before a physical diagnosis every time for these people. So that's really important to me. >> Well, there's that ACE report, right? Is it the AC scoring where if you've had childhood trauma, you're more than likely to have an autoimmune disease or a chronic disease of some kind. (18:29) What's happening there with >> childhood trauma and then the expression of some of these disorders? I think it's changing the methylation epigenetically on people's genes >> as they're going through life. >> Yes, absolutely. And I can give an example for myself. >> In 2017, I got a Dutch test, which is a hormonal test, but on there, it shows you your level of methylation because it's in phase two liver detox, right? >> And I had almost 80% methylation in 2017. (18:56) I went through seven years of of hell and trauma where I lost my license. I surrendered it. I was sued three times. I had a miscarriage. My six-year relationship ended, and then my dog died of a brain tumor. Oh my god. >> And that's just the major issues that happen. And so, um, at the end of that, I got a Dutch test in 2000, I think it was last year, 2023. (19:13) My cortisol was completely flatlined and I had zero methylation. >> So, methylation is is not static. >> No, no. >> So, these things are not static. >> No, they're happening in real time. >> Absolutely. And so, that changed my ability to methylate based on stress. We already know we can strip magnesium and B vitamins during stressful times with high cortisol. (19:35) >> Okay, I'm in shock right now. I'm sorry. I need a minute. Like, talk about I I see how many patients have we seen? 60 70,000 patients through our clinics. And I think the the ideology that we have is you have this gene, therefore you're a poor methylator, therefore you need this plan. (19:56) You're saying it's it's like flexible in real time. Just because I have MTHFR alals, does not mean they're activated. >> Doesn't mean they're turned on >> doesn't mean that, you know, think about that. I mean, I know people who had a slow comp gene, which is the ability to break down adrenaline and things quickly, and they've reversed it >> a thousand% you can reverse these because this the environment signals the genes. (20:19) So, if we can have negative epigenetic changes, by God, let's get >> Yes. That's that's like an incredible message right there because so many people park on their genes. I've got this gene, therefore this is going to happen. I have this gene, therefore that's going to happen. >> And you're saying that these genes are mutable and they can change and they're flexible. (20:38) [clears throat] All these different things. >> I mean, obviously you have a full genetic change that came through the parents. It's not. But if it's epigenetic, absolutely. >> Yeah, >> that's exciting news. >> It's wonderful news for everyone. >> So, going back to the exam room. So, you're doing all these Sorry, not just not to sidebar you there, but I was like, wait, wait, we got to talk about this. (20:56) So, um, so anyhow, so you're doing these workups, you're going through these labs, you're talking, you know, through all the different issues that a patient's having, where where do you go with that person next? >> So, >> after the after looking at their childhood trauma, >> kind of what their ACE experience has been. >> Absolutely. >> What's next? >> So, then I basically tailor my nervous system regulation program to that person bio-individually. (21:18) You know, some people, let's give for example, I love liposal GABA as one example with athenine, phospatidylcholine. It's amazing. But some people have a GAD mutation >> and they can't they turn GABA into glutamate. So it has the opposite effect of calming on them. It makes them hyperexitable which we don't want. >> So that person couldn't have GABA, right? I also love highdose minerals. (21:39) >> Um nerves fire because they have a potential or a charge. So if you don't have a charge for the nerves to fire in the nervous system, it's not going to work properly. And so many people are demineralized. They're taking binders. They're in the sauna all day without remmineralizing. they're stressed out which makes you dump minerals out the kidney. (21:56) It's why your heart rate and blood pressure goes down when you're in dorsal veagal. So remmineralization can really help stabilize MTHFR. It can stabilize the nervous system for people. So that's one of the first things I do is get them on high dose minerals. Now >> is there a specific mineral deficiency that you're noticing over and over again? >> Yeah. (22:14) Some people have a calcium shell which is sodium, potassium, magnesium, and calcium on some of the hair analysis tests which means they are in sympathetic overdrive or flight or fight. >> Interesting. And so then that's kind of a test that's a dead ringer for people if you need to know if they don't believe you because a lot of people don't want to believe it's just >> right >> their nervous system that could be >> I can imagine. Yeah, I can imagine. (22:33) What are top three things that you can pick up in lab work to tell that people are in fight or flight? >> Homoyine. >> Okay. >> 100%. >> Where do you like a homoyine level? >> I love it below 10. >> Yep. Me too. >> I love it below 10. So yeah, that's important. I also can tell oftentimes from the MCV in the CBV in the CBC the mean core puscular volume lets me know that they need B vitamins if it's very very high >> if it's high. (22:57) We get a lot of high MCVs for those of you that are patients you know that but like high MCVs are in your CBC. This is a basic lab test though by the way guys this is like a CBC. This is not fancy testing. You can do it anywhere and get and kind of understand what's happening there. Okay. CBC. What? Homoyine. CBC. What's the third? >> Um, it's probably a thyroid panel, too. (23:19) Um, reverse T3. I always get TSH, free T4, free T3, TPO, TG antibodies, and a reverse T3 on everyone. Um, and that lets me know, especially if their reverse T3 is 20 and above, um, if their free T3 is really low, I know that their liver's in trouble because they're not converting. So that's the thing when your nervous system dysregulation that everything starts to come kind of unravel over time. (23:44) So you can start to see it in all the labs where it's affecting everything. >> Do you ever look at morning cortisol levels or are those helpful? Not so helpful. >> I think so. I've had a few patients bring me blood work in and their morning cortisol and blood work is skyhigh. Um and I'm like wow. Okay. But often times it's not a test that I have everyone run through when they come in the clinic, but one of the tests I often order on top of everything else is a hormone zoomer or a Dutch test. (24:09) And that definitely lets me know about their morning cortisol flatlined or high if they have a paradoxical where, you know, they're they're flatlined in the morning and then their cortisol goes up at night and they don't sleep all night. >> What else are you seeing hormonally that can identify that someone's in fight or flight? >> High [snorts] estrogen as well. (24:26) you know, cortisol will pull those sex hormones out right away. It'll pull the blood sugar out, too. So, I can often see it in disregulated blood sugars, hemoglobin, A1C. I can see it in high estrogen or estrogen dominance, low progesterone or, you know, it's actually the ratio that matters, right? Um, on the Dutch test or hormone zoomer, >> um, and uh, >> sometimes testosterone can be involved too. (24:51) Do you feel like testosterone like low testosterone in men is connected to the nervous >> system regulation issue? >> For sure. I think so. And the basic building blocks that people need to make testosterone. It's very laborious process for the body to make some of these hormones from cholesterol. >> So, >> yeah. And the overcorrection of cholesterol too, I think, is a big player in the declining testosterone levels as well. (25:12) >> Don't even get me started. I know. So, okay. So, I'm the patient. You finally convinced me it's my nervous system. I'm having this parasympathetic issue. >> What's the solution? >> You know, I mentioned GABA. I mentioned minerals, but we can't have a pill for every ill. It just doesn't work that way. I wish it did. (25:28) It make my job a lot easier. >> Just take those. You'll be better tomorrow. I wish. What a miracle worker then. No, it's honestly it's the hardest part of my job because it's I'm asking Think about how hard it is to change me. I'm asking someone else to change. It's difficult. And you know, the brain has hardwired itself because neurons that fire together wire together. (25:46) So it's hardwired itself to protect this person and it probably did for a while and it's no longer serving them. So it's a lot of um stop being a human being and become a human or human doing and become a human being. Um really learn to be sit still. Don't doom scroll on your phone and dissociate. (26:06) Um really learn to be with those uncomfortable emotions. Some people need sematic work. They need breath work. They need a veagal nerve stimulator sometimes. Mhm. >> Um they need to um revamp their life because money isn't everything. Your health is more important. Sometimes that needs to be said. Sometimes they're you can can't mitigate it as well as you'd like because they're taking care of their sick parents. (26:27) They're working a full-time job. They have three kids. It's like how can you make someone feel safe when life comes at you like that? So oftentimes I'll recommend a nervous system program called Primal Trust. >> Okay. >> By Dr. Kathleen King, who was bedbound because of her nervous system. and she does 20-minute programs every day teaching people how to get back in their body and out of their head because really that's the problem. (26:48) >> And how do you do that? Like what what's a simple way is it back to like meditation and journaling and some of these self the problem is like >> there's so much conversation about all these modalities out there, right, that it almost is like >> it feels like it's not real or it's not really going to have an impact, you know? It does. (27:12) So what like if we were trying to structure a veagal nerve reset or a nervous system reset for somebody you know that was kind of grounded and directed like how would you structure their day? What are some of the things that you would really advise them to do maybe as a part of the morning, you know, as a part of the evening? Because the other thing like >> people want to accomplish things, they want to do things. (27:34) They want to have families. They want to have careers, right? They want to >> do big things, you know, whatever they want to do. So, we don't want like I am always saying, I don't want you guys to not do the things you want to do or be the person that you want to be. I just want you to be aware of some of the blind spots and then how to structure your day, your week, your month so that there's a little bit of a cyclical rhythm to it so that there is opportunity to reset this nervous system. (28:02) How can we help people do that? >> So, it really depends on the person. I'll give you an example. Um, I have a patient right now who's had multiple traumatic brain injuries from combat. >> And, um, he's not sleeping, he's not going to the bathroom, he's having panic attacks and being suicidal half the day because he's so distraught from his brain injuries and his nervous system dysregulation that's catching up with him over the years. (28:24) So, for him, I suggested neuro feedback because there's not going to be a talking over, you know, with me to be able to to beat this. He needs something extra on top of it. So like a series of neuro feedback I really like. I went and did this for myself after I had a traumatic brain injury and it made it changed my life. So you know I can help >> what's happening with neuro feedback. (28:44) Talk about that for a second. >> So you have electrodes attached to your head and it's actually giving feedback to your brain right to change your you're actually what I did the one I did I watched a screen a movie that kind of went in and out and the sound went in and out and at first it was really annoying to me but over time I acclimated. (29:02) I didn't even really realize it was happening anymore. So you're literally, it's such a pleasant therapy. You're sitting there watching and listening. >> You're not talking. >> No, >> you're just watching and listening >> and it's giving feedback to the brain. I I slept like a dream that week. And so things like hyperbaric oxygen, neuro feedback, sematic work, primal trust, um, Tai Chi, even stuff like that. (29:22) Meditation is great, but some people don't even have the bandwidth to do it because they're so >> wound up. >> Yes. >> So you have to really know the person and what would be okay with them. A lot of people I like tapping. Um, like for example, I had a patient come on last week. She was full body eczema. (29:38) She was a painter and she couldn't even hold the paintbrush because her hands were so swollen, balling, crying. And she didn't want to hear it. I said, "This is your nervous system. Listen to me. This eczema all over, hives all over. This is a histamine release. You're having food reactions. Histamine release. (29:51) You're crying. You're not emotionally regulated. You're literally in a histamine flare." >> And so I had her on the call. My body can heal. My body is smart. my body can release in other ways. It doesn't have to erupt like this. By the end of the call, she was smiling. She felt empowered. I couldn't believe. She's like, I didn't believe that it was my nervous system. (30:11) And that little exercise showed me how much that calmed me down and empowered me. >> Even just tapping emotional freedom technique and telling yourself something because half of these people, they're perfectionists. >> They That's right. That's right. And so your body, >> nobody can be perfect. It's too much on your body. (30:31) So just the things that we say to ourselves, we wouldn't be friends with people who said this to us. >> So when you say nice things to the body and tap it out, release that energy, people cry. It's the first thing they've said something nice to themselves in years. >> Yeah. I see that all the time. Yeah. >> You know, I'm also thinking about some of our viewers and listeners who may have families and they can identify sort of this this parasympathetic dysregulation or veagal dysregulation in somebody that they love. (30:57) >> That's right. H what's the best way to advocate for them whether it's a child, a teenager, you know, a partner, like how how do we set sort of a healing environment or guide some of these folks if they're unaware themselves or not ready to be aware >> and to kind of accept like you're saying your patient not really ready to accept that like this is your nervous system and nothing else. (31:21) >> It's very hard. It's very very hard and sometimes if the family is willing and able to help, sometimes it helps to coming from multiple family members in a very kind, gentle, thoughtful way, right? Because this is something that a lot of people don't want to hear and it really offends some people to hear that they are the ones that their body is making them sick because of how they're responding to the world. (31:43) So sometimes it takes me multiple appointments to chip away at someone and talk to them kindly and show them charts that I was talking about earlier and evidence and science to actually convince them of this. And sometimes they don't believe you until you a get them on the supplement or a protocol or some sort of program that shows them how much they improve when they're doing >> their time. (32:05) Do you like tools like this like an HRV? >> I love it. um tracking that and maybe being like see like look at your HRV. It's not quite where it needs to be. >> Actually, I just signed on as medical director in a a clinic called We the People in Venice, Florida. And that's one of the screening techniques they they're going to do is HRV at the very beginning. (32:22) And I can't say enough good things about that. That's heart rate variability is extremely important to showing us how the nervous system functions. >> Where do you like that number for >> tracking? Is there is there something like >> age? Really? Well, it's important because like my own daughter's asking this question like she's 17 like where should my HRV be? What would you tell her? >> 17 I would say 70s. (32:41) >> 70s. Okay. >> 80s something like that. Like mine is now like 40s50s. >> That's where I hang out. Yeah. >> As you age it gets lower. >> Yeah. And then what's a like flashing light alert warning HRV level? >> Well, you don't want it too too low. I would say in the teens you have to be careful. (33:00) I have a good friend who's is in the 170s. 160s. >> She has HRV in the 160s. >> Gotcha. And she's great, but we still aren't really sure what that means. If it's negative or positive. I've never seen it that high before. >> High. I don't think I've ever seen that number that high. HRV, by the way, guys, is heart rate variability. (33:17) It's looking at the changes in your heart rate given, you know, different stressors or different situations in life. And it's a great way. The lower your HRV, usually I historically say the higher your cortisol, you know, the more adrenal dysfunction, the higher your HRV, usually you're in a better kind of parasympathetic state. (33:36) >> I saw that as well with all my trauma. My HRV was higher and as I went through the trauma over the last seven years, it had definitely has lowered. >> Um, and then, you know, I got the Dutch test which confirmed my flatline cortisol last year. So, it does actually tie in >> ties together. All fascinating. (33:51) Well, let's move more. So, we've got this nervous system component that's really important to healing and to getting better. Um, and reversing some of these reactivated viruses, infections, toxins, all of that. You started our episode today talking about toxins having [clears throat] that same traumatic kind of adrenaline cortisol disrupting effect on the body just like a stressor would, right? Just like maybe processed food would or things like that. (34:19) As we move though through and once we accept that and start to work on that, >> do we still need to work on the other detox pathways, the lymphatics, you know, what what's sort of the next steps in recovering from an environmental illness. >> Absolutely. It's kind of like what came first, the chicken or the egg, right? It's all connected. (34:38) >> It's all connected. Yeah. People can be stressed out because their environment or toxic sighting. They can be stressed out because they have a self pathogen. Right. Right. they have or mold in their house, water damage in their house. Great reason to be disregulated. >> So, of course, that stuff still matters. (34:52) And there's a time and place for it as well. Often times, the first couple months I'm working on nervous system, but I'm bleeding and drainage, too. And so, what's drainage? >> I was about to ask you. >> What's drainage? >> You all have drainage pathways or detox pathways. And these are things like the bowels, the sweat pathway, cycles for women, the liver, the kidneys, the lungs. (35:14) All of these things, bile, all of these things are drainage pathways. And stagnation breeds disease. >> So we want things flowing in the body, right? We want our energy flowing. We want our organs to be able to release things that we pick up every day because when things go in you and they don't come out, this stacks in your toxin bucket till you get a label. (35:29) So it's really important to be sure if things go in that we don't want in, your body goes, "Oh, we see you. We can filter you out and remove on." Um, but people say things to me like, "You have a liver and kidneys. You don't need detox." Right. >> To which I say, "What's non-alcoholic fatty liver disease then?" >> Yeah. It's a stagnant liver. (35:45) >> That's a stagnant liver. High blood sugar, high insulin, all the things. >> Exactly. That's just not your genes. I'm sorry. >> So, I I work on that. And most of the time in Western countries, the problem child is the liver, >> right? >> Sometimes it's the bowels. Lots of people constipated because often they're stuck in flight or fight, not rest and digest. (36:03) >> Um, and then a lot of people tell me they glisten and they don't sweat and that's not really great either. >> You want you want like a sweat sweat. >> I want them to be able to sweat in 10 to 15 minutes in a sauna. All of those are ways to detox the body, right? >> Yes. (36:19) Are there any other tools somebody should be using to really improve their liver health? Because I feel like the liver, again, I've do a lot of Chinese medicine, Ayurvedic medicine, have loved that stuff. >> I love it. >> But they talk a lot about the liver, right? They put more emphasis on the liver than we do in Western medicine. And one of the things they talk about is the relationship between cortisol and the liver. (36:39) They drew that >> together way before we started testing hormones, right, 5,000 years ago. So they talk a lot about cortisol and the disruption of and they didn't use the word cortisol but the disruption of cortisol essentially and how all of that is stored in the liver. Yes. The liver holds anger. Yes. (36:57) The liver holds like stress essentially and with enough emotional burden you disrupt the liver meridian which then in turn impacts your hormones you know your mental health all the other things >> the gallbladder >> gallbladder all of it. So that's the Chinese medicine interpretation of it which if we apply it to modernday you know sort of clinical work in the western world. (37:17) You can actually see those things work together. You can see the liver meridian if you look at it a pulse or excuse me tongue or face and then you can look at labs and see high cortisol. And you can also see the liver enzyme starting to go kind of haywire a little bit. So >> I've been thinking a lot about this and I'm so curious about what you have to say. (37:37) you know, when we want to detox the liver, if we accept that the nervous system and cortisol regulation is a part of it, what are your favorites? Like what's easy? Like, you know, does everyone have to do like a a 28 day detox and IV glutathione and like all this stuff? What is an easy way to clean up the liver that everyone can do? Well, you know, I give a lot of people heavy liver detoxes with their drainage while doing nervous system work because, you know, one way to connect the liver and the just to go real quick, one way to connect the liver and cortisol is if (38:07) you're hypoglycemic, low blood sugar at night, you spike cortisol and wake up, right? Because that's how they're connected. So, I see this so much. Um, you're exactly right. So, the liver I really like things like castor oil packs. in the sauna, put on a castor oil pack in your right lower quadrant, um a right upper quadrant, and then basically just sit and it pulls things out with castor oil. (38:27) I also love things like bitter herbs. The liver is a bitter pathway in arurveda. And you know, when you think about the American diet, what bitter things do we have? Sour patch kids. >> Limited. Yeah, very limited. Yeah, [laughter] sour patch kids. I'm not sure that counts, does it? >> It really counts. So, I really like liver sauce by Quicksilver Scientific. (38:44) It's very bitter. It tastes awful, but it's that bitter pack >> liver sauce. Yeah. What's in it? >> It's like gentian, milk thistle, dem some other things. Um, and then I love my supplement, Toddka Max. It's knack milk thistle. Um, tudka, which stands for to uro deacolic acid. Okay. >> The tea and tug is torine, which crosses the bloodb brain barrier and helps with cognition. (39:05) >> Um, and then it has Sheila in it. So, humicopic. >> Yeah. And, um, I really use both those in combination with people >> and that helps the liver. Yes. Yes. Is there a more structured liver detox that you like for people to go on or that you've recommended or you think it's not really necessary? >> I think it's not really if I use those two in combination with nervous system dysregulation along with GABA along with minerals along with B vitamins I can really regulate people pretty quickly and sometimes they don't need the full (39:32) detox. They'll need half the time for the drainage and detox if I can get that right because the body is a healing machine. I just need to get it get it back in normaly and then it's a get this out of the body. Get this out of the body. Oh wait, we missed this pathogen set off the inflammation cascade. (39:46) Kill, kill, kill. It can't do that when there's haywire communication as cytoine storm everywhere. It cannot. >> Should we be measuring cytoine storm? Is that helpful or is not necessary? >> I think in some people it is helpful. It's really hard to It has different symptoms in different people. It can be hard to identify. (40:00) >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I've looked at like some of the interlucans and stuff like that before and tried to measure them to to see if it would help explain things a little bit better. >> I mean definitely Dr. Richie Shoemaker who pioneered mold and his whole protocol. He looks at all that right the toll receptors C C3 C4 you know um all the different interlucans it's really important to see what's going on in the immune system when there's a cytoine storm and CO does something similar let's talk a little bit so while we're (40:28) working on these different pieces you know like the nervous system reset drainage detox all the liver all of this the gut um a lot of people are coming in with maybe four or five medications that they're already on >> or sometimes like 8 to 10 supplements that they're already on. >> How do you manage crisscrossing these worlds? Because >> sometimes the medications are necessary, right? >> But we also know that some of them impact the liver. (40:57) >> How how do we dance between these protocols? >> It depends on what they come in with me on. If they come in on a PPI, proton pump inhibitor like previsid, I pretty much wean them off of that really quick >> because really people with acid reflux have low stomach acid. most of the time unless they have an ulcer. (41:15) Um and um and when I add like digestive enzymes, betane, HDL, things can disintegrate and move forward in paralysis rather than sitting in the gut and reflexing up. So the >> PPIs apparently we were not supposed to be on for more than like seven days to 10 days. >> So they almost fired me as a hospitalist because they wrote in the electronic medical record, this person's been on a PPI for eight years. (41:33) The package insert clearly says six months and the PCP called and complained about me. >> Oh wow. >> I wrote that in the chart because I was so mad. So yeah, I really hate PPIs. I really don't like statins, as you mentioned. So, if they're on those two things, I pretty much take them off as quickly as I can in a safe meth manner and method. (41:49) Um, other things like thyroid medication, they're going to stay on that, right? It's pain medicine. If they have to have that, they're going to stay on that even though I don't like it. Um, and so I try and wean things off and I get labs often, you know, every 3 to six months to see what we're doing because sometimes if we give minerals, sometimes a parasite cleanse, we move people out of their moldy house, guess what? that they start having hyperthyroidism symptoms because they don't need their dose of thyroid medication anymore, (42:11) >> right? >> Yeah. >> What's your take on GLP1's? >> You know, I used to be fully against them. But life doesn't work that way. No, it doesn't. It's not black and white. It's gray and there's a gradient and I really give a lot of credit to Dr. Tina Moore. >> Yeah. >> Who hermpic university, she taught a lot of people, including me. (42:29) And um I think everything is a gray area. I think some people really benefit from a little micro dose. It doesn't even help with weight loss. It's helping with neuro and gut inflammation, >> all that stuff. >> Yes. >> So, I can't knock it. It's not may not maybe not for everybody. And I don't like the high doses that cause gastroparesis, >> but at micro doses, I've seen amazing things happen for women. (42:49) It's where I really hope medicine will go because I feel like there needs to be a micro medicine movement >> where some of these medications and pharmaceuticals are necessary for things like blood pressure or cholesterol or mental health all for the short term, right? We need to be thinking about these medications. (43:06) Actually, I'm going to say that again for everybody watching and listening. If you're on a medication, it should be a short-term strategy. It should not be a long-term strategy. So, we don't want to throw all the pharmaceuticals out, right? >> But one of the things that we've done a lot in clinic, and I don't know how you feel about this, is that we've been micro doing a lot of things. (43:22) So, you might get a pediatric dose of something. You may get a mini dose of something. That applies to the GLP1s as well. And that way we're not overwhelming body pathways so that we are creating future detox issues, future heavy burdens of of the liver, those type of things. >> I mean, I think that's in general what they should be used for is a band-aid to the system until you get to the root cause. Right. (43:46) Then hopefully they don't need it anymore. Like that's the beautiful part of being integrative functional medicine doctors is our goal is what where is the body out of normaly and where can I fix it? maybe with drainage or detox or nervous system regulation. So, this just is a temporary band-aid for you. >> Absolutely. >> It's beautiful thing to tell people. (44:03) >> And I think it's also again an empowering message, right? Because I think a lot of what you're saying and I and I can see the push back is that if we're saying your nervous system is the root cause when we talk about root cause medicine if we're going to say the nervous system is the root cause there's a certain sense of responsibility that comes with that because it's not the something out here that's causing this. (44:26) So I feel like throughout this entire conversation you've been less concerned and correct me if I'm wrong with the individual toxins. you're less concerned with, you know, the load of mold or a paraben or a phalate or an organo phosphate, for example, or glyphosate, like all these things that we're talking about all the time. (44:45) >> You seem to be less concerned about that blue light. I'm going to throw in that you said that. >> So, you you seem to be less concerned about the bucket of toxins, which for somebody like me, I'm always like, "But wait, the bucket of toxins is increasing. Our food quality is going down. (45:03) people are using blue light more, they're up more, you know, >> tell me why you're not as concerned about that >> versus the nervous system and some of these other things, >> right? Well, I said in the beginning the nervous system, if it's not in homeostasis, if you're in flight, fight or freeze, it contracts and it doesn't release those toxins. (45:20) If you're in rest and digest, the body feels comfortable to release you. You can poop a lot more. Now, there are genetic considerations. There are epigenetic and genetic considerations. There absolutely are. We can't ignore those. But again, the genes are signaled by the environment. So there is some hope with that. Um I am concerned about them. (45:37) But I look at a diff in different goggles than other docs. So rather than looking at the individual labs and spot treating labs, the individual problems or toxins on the total tox test, I look at where these toxins are stored in the body. What filter or drainage pathway in the body is not accomplishing its job. Why are you know we can sweat out organo phosphate pesticides? We can sweat out PCBs. We can sweat out BPA. (46:00) We can sweat out certain heavy metals. >> So it's like if your sweat pathway isn't working, you're holding on to a lot. Bile. Bile loves lipophilic things, fat loving toxins. Yeah. >> The pathogens love mold loves the bile because or the interopatic pathway because it's fat loving >> loves the brain for the same reason. (46:19) So if I a lot of people estrogen problems, hormonal problems, itchy skin, mold problems, your bile is stuck. So, I focus on how can I unstick those drainage pathways to get the body working again because I can't fix you. I have to shake your body awake. Hey, you missed this, right? That's how I look at it with people is piecing I'm kind of pattern recognizing and Sherlock Holmesing their health by looking at their labs and putting a whole picture together for their drainage pathways. (46:46) And the key drainage path pathways just to reiterate that are going to be things like bowels, lymphatic, glimpmphatic, mitochondriatic. >> Glimpymphatic is the brain drain. >> So it get brain drain. >> Brain drain. Yeah, >> that's a new one. I haven't heard that one before. >> So it was coined by I can't remember the doc's name in 2012. Okay. (47:05) >> And it basically um it works while you sleep. >> Okay. The cerebral spinal fluid actually drains while you sleep and it drains into deep cervical lymph nodes in the neck into lymphatic system because everything's connected, right? >> So, lymphatic, lymphatic bowels, um, lungs, kidneys, bile, sweat, cycles for women, there's a lot. (47:26) >> Those are the big ones. Those are the big ones. >> All right, we're going to knock through all of them with one tip for everybody out there. I like it. Here we go. Lymphatic. One thing you can do to improve your lymphatic drainage system. >> I can give you a few. Breath. dry brushing, lymphatic massage, or you know, actually massaging the lymph nodes, the big six they call it. (47:44) >> Okay. Squash count. >> Yes. Yes. I love squash. Yes. >> All right. Number two. Uh this is probably too easy. Bile. >> Bile. So bile. >> Improving your bile flow. >> Yeah. I really like tadka for bile. Okay. >> Um I I actually do coffee enemas sometimes with people which improves the bile as well. >> Um so there's a couple different things. (48:04) I use a lot of bile salts for that. >> Okay. Third is again an easy one. Kidney >> kidney so hydration really really important. Half your body weight ounces every single day of filtered hopefully structured water and um kidneys hold a lot of fear in Chinese medicine as well. >> So it's it's really important to get hydration. (48:23) I think it's really important to work on the fear and the trauma as well too and you know really getting a UA every now and then your analysis to look at things too for people. >> See what's going on there. What are you looking for on that UA? >> A lot of people have interstitial cyitis that I see. So it's actually a histamine based problem. (48:38) it's releasing histamine in in the bladder interesting is what the issue is. But they'll think that they have a continued UTI and they'll always culture it. So I want to see what's growing. If there's nothing and they're having a lot of other histamine symptoms, it's more of an interstitial cyitis picture for me. >> Interesting. Okay. Bowel. (48:53) >> Bowels. So um colonics enemas. If I hit a roadblock and we can't get people open, nervous system regulation. Obviously you can't poop if you're not in rest and digest. And then I really like things like um aloe vera. Um, I love Oxy Powder by Global World Healing. It's ozinated magnesium. I love magnesium. Magnesium. Amazing. (49:12) >> Miracle. What do I call it? Miracle micronutrient. That's what we always call it. >> It sure is. >> Okay. Sweat. That's the most efficient thing to do. >> Infrared sauna. >> Sauna. >> Sauna. Infrared sauna. My favorite. Um, honestly, people will tell me, "I can't tolerate the heat. I have POTS. I feel like I'm going to pass out. (49:27) " I'm like, "We're going to trigger this pathway open. Just be brave for me. Let's get in five minutes." The first week, three times a week, five minutes. next week, tack on two more minutes and then we eventually break that sweat pathway open for them. >> And then you mentioned taking minerals with sauna. >> Absolutely. (49:42) Because if you are in nervous system dysregulation and your heart rates and blood pressure is affected, you don't have enough minerals. So I always have to add minerals back before I get people in the sauna and continue that through the sauna use. >> Gotcha. Okay, let's do one more list. I promise I won't do any more lists for you. (49:58) um detox genetics >> that maybe impair your ability to detox as efficiently or make you more susceptible to the environment compared to somebody else. >> Absolutely. So I mentioned one which is a GAD def mutation which makes you convert GABA the calming neurotransmitter to glutamate which is hyperexitatory and you guys don't need that. (50:20) Um, and then the other thing is the CBS mutation where they can't handle exogenous or outside sulfur based products like glutathione, right? >> Glutathione IVs make them anxious. Their heart rate starts going and that's usually because of that mutation. And another one that everyone's heard of is MTHFR. Yeah. So, problems methylating huge deal throughout the body, right? Um, a slow comp tea. (50:39) Sometimes you don't break down adrenaline and cortisol as well. That can be hard too. There's also a lot of different genetics for histamine as well, right? What are some of the ones that you've seen? >> So, DAO is one of them and that's the enzyme that actually breaks down histamine. So, when it's released into the bloodstream, if you have low DAO enzyme, it's going to stay in the bloodstream and affect you longer. (50:59) And these people are usually the kids who should have been put in a bubble as a kid. They have a high allergy load, lots of asthma allergies growing up as well. And then sometimes that turns into food intolerances and full-on histamine problems later on. What about some of the like CYP1s, A1, B1, some of the estrogen detox pathways? >> Absolutely. That too. (51:19) >> Now, are all like let's say you get a genetic report and you've got like four of those. >> Can we change it? >> Yes. >> And again, back to what how we started this conversation, right? >> These are just enzymes to get the function increased in them. We can do that. >> Wow. >> Yeah. (51:34) We get these enzymes to speed up and slow down for sure. Like MTHFR, right? That's an enzyme problem. My enzyme got burnt out from stress over the years. >> Fascinating. >> Yeah. >> Well, before we close out this super interesting conversation, >> I do want to touch again upon the role of trauma and grief and what it does to our physical chemistry and disease manifestations >> and leave folks with something that they can do if they have gone through a traumatic season. (52:07) like what do we want to tell them to do if they're grieving and having an issue there? Like how do we help them >> move through that trauma so that trauma doesn't like live within their body and then we're managing kind of all these other conditions. >> You know, if you have had something traumatic happen, often times it's like a snowball rolling down the hill that keeps picking up snow and you don't know how to stop these feelings and emotions that feel so out of control. (52:31) I know I was there personally, so I know exactly how they feel. Um, I would say if you can afford just a a few tests, blood work and maybe a couple other tests to look at things like cortisol and your inflammatory markers, that really matters because what the studies show is people in gratitude have lower inflammatory markers. (52:48) >> Wow. >> And so that's a huge deal, you know. I mean, you can really change your methylation and your stress. You know, people people hurt us, but people are the people who regulate us, too. And they fix the problem. They are the solution and the problem. And so if you can find a good community of people that can talk to, that you can be vulnerable with, that you can trust, that's huge for people that are stuck. (53:10) >> I think that people that have experienced trauma often isolate. Yes. And or they wear a coat of armor to make sure it never happens again. >> And unfortunately, that is the thing that can make them sick or you know, sicker. So I agree. It's especially as we go into maybe a holiday season or a new year, thinking about who that community is to make you feel safe. (53:34) Who are the people that make you feel safe? So that you hopefully can teach your body to feel safe. >> So you can bring down like literally dial the knob down on what you're describing that I call kind of this cortisol hum and allow the body to get to this healing state, this parasympathetic state where everything can reverse. (53:53) And I know that's all like easier said than done. So my hope is like find a healing community, start some practices that start to move this stuff out of your body, >> try things like neuro feedback, >> movement, >> movement. Oh my gosh. >> And then use this quick cheat sheet that Dr. Jess just gave us, right? Like this quick cheat sheet to open up your pathways to drain more effectively. (54:15) You're starting the process, but healing is always a process. It is never a one solution, one day thing. It's a start, stop. I made progress. Let me I I messed up. Let me start again. It's it's a constant journey. >> It's never linear >> and it's not linear by any means. >> I mean, but the good news is that like I hope we gave people hope here today because >> there's a way for you to heal. (54:38) There is a little bit more responsibility involved, but like you guys got this. You can do it. >> Definitely got this. >> All right. Well, this has been so great. I've enjoyed this so much. And it's such a different way of thinking about, you know, a lot of the diseases and stuff that we see in clinic. (54:54) But I'm going to leave you with one more question. Sure. So, what makes you whole? >> What makes me whole? >> Community. >> Community. >> I have the best friends and I have a great boyfriend and I have wonderful family. And so, like I'm extremely blessed. I know everyone can't say that, but I they those people save my nervous system in the end. (55:14) >> And they make you safe. Yes. feel safe as well. >> Oh my gosh. Well, if people want to learn more about your work and what you're doing, where should they go? >> So, I always say there are levels to doing this with me. Depends on who you are and what you want. But I'm on Instagram and social media quite a bit. (55:27) YouTube. So, if Dr. period Jess period MD on Instagram, Dr. Jessica Petus on YouTube and um that's free. I give a lot of information out to teach people on there. I really like teaching. Um I also lecture a lot of different conferences. I'm at Hack Your Health this next weekend in Tampa. (55:46) Um, and um, I have a community called Wellness Plus that people can do it themselves if and it teaches this protocol that I've just talked about on this whole podcast. Um, and then you can also see me virtually in clinic at Dr. Period or Dr. Jess Period Health. Um, and I have a whole team under there. So, if you want to see me oneonone, that's great, too. (56:06) >> Amazing. Thank you for taking time out to join us today to talk about all of these very important things, especially in the environment and the issues that many of us are facing today. And for everybody else watching and listening, thank you for taking time to listen to us at Whole Plus. (56:22) Don't forget we post new episodes every week. All right, before you click away, don't forget to subscribe. It's free and it helps more people find Whole Plus. And if you're already here, why stop now? Watch the next video right here on the screen. It's when you don't want to miss.