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How to Get Clear On Your Value and Attract More Business · Mortgage Marketing Radio

0:00
In today's highly competitive mortgage industry, building profitable relationships with
0:04
the real estate agents is essential for success.
0:06
However, finding effective ways to secure agent relationships can be a challenge.
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Our new case study featuring loan officer Chris Cogill is a must-read.
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Chris has closed a remarkable 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals.
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And in this case study, he shares his proven strategies for building strong relationships
0:34
with real estate agents and leveraging those relationships to drive more business.
0:39
To get your hands on this resource, head over to LOKestudy.com and download your free copy
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of the case study today.
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You'll find actionable insights and practical tips that Chris used to close 36 million
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Don't miss out.
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Go check it out right now, visit LOKestudy.com and download your free copy today.
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Hey, everybody, what's up, Jeff?
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Zimphur.
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Welcome back to another episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio.
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So glad you are here.
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All right.
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So I am bringing back something I've done occasionally in the past.
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I want to give you a glimpse inside a small group gathering that we have once a week
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and I meet with a handful of elite loan officers who are committed to getting results, getting
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better and holding each other accountable in a safe, respectable, supportive way.
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And so what you're going to hear on this episode is a clip, not a clip, a call from our
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private group that we've got are basically our Mortgage Marketing Pro members.
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And once a month, what I do is I bring in a special guest into this small group.
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So they lead the call and Q&A takes place and so in the past, I've had top producers
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Renee Rodriguez, other notable author speakers, coaches and so forth.
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And on this episode, who you're going to hear is my special guest is Lizzie Hofer.
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And so this is, once again, our small group, people come to this call with the purpose
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of improving, right?
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And so Lizzie, in case you don't know who she is, you should know who she is, first of
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all.
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I mean, just some of the accolades that she's received is the number one female loan officer
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for most loans closed, most loans closed, Scottsman's Guide, number six, number one Latino
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Mortgage Originator from NAREP, top women's or, number two, top women originators from
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Scottsman's Guide, the list goes on and on.
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Units originated, number three, National Mortgage News, most loans closed.
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I said that, top purchase volume, number seven, Scottsman's Guide.
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So guys, I had her on the podcast about two years ago, 18 to 24 months ago.
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And at that time, she was on track to close 800 loans.
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Well, since then, in 2020, she closed over 1,000 loans.
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And you're going to hear her give her intro.
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And yes, she has a large team and yes, she's going to be honest.
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But by the way, she's the only one who originates those loans.
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You hear her breakdown, her team structure and so forth on this call.
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But I want to invite you to this call one is because obviously I want you to learn from
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it, right?
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Take notes.
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I've had people, my members who listened to this conversation and said they need to go
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back and listen to it two or three times because there's a lot in here in terms of you
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owning your value, identifying your value, right?
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And as you'll hear Lizzie described, that you are the prize as the loan officer.
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And I know some people struggle with that, right?
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And that's one of the things that I like helping people with is how do you increase your
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value proposition?
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One of the ways we do that is by an educational platform teaching agent classes, pouring
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into agents, helping them grow their business, helping them solve the mysteries of digital
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marketing.
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And you hear Lizzie as well.
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She personally does five or six classes a month herself over Zoom.
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So anyway, I thought it would be interesting to share this conversation with you guys.
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If you like it, if you're interested in it and you want to learn more, well, you can
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always go check out more information at mortgagemarketing.pro if you're interested to learn more about
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what we're doing over there.
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So that said, without further ado, let's get into this week's special look, listen inside
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behind the scenes with my very special guest, Lizzie Hofer.
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Lizzie Hofer, welcome to the call.
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Oh, let's forego the long intro.
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So Lizzie, the reason why I set that up and say that this way is because what I see from
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you, you know, and the two things I want to talk about here today with you is how do you
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scale and grow because a lot of people are in that stage of like hiring an assistant.
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And by the way, Jessica, I see Jessica's here.
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I thought you had a meeting Jessica to talk about you hiring an assistant.
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Anyway, she was here.
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So number one, a lot of people are in that phase of like, how do I go from, you know, 10,
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12, 15 loans to 20 to 30, whatever that is, right?
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I know you've obviously been there and done that more than once.
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And then secondly, I do want to talk about your YouTube channel because you're getting
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time and attention, right, from people on YouTube, clearly.
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So I'd like to talk about a little bit there, but I am grateful for you giving us your time
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and attention today, Lizzie.
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Well, thank you, Jeff, I appreciate you.
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It's always like refreshing when people start off being super authentic.
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So is the floor mine?
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It is all yours.
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I don't necessarily have a script or anything to set you up with, but people are going
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to ask questions, so put them in the chat or unmute.
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We got a real kind of active talkative bunch here.
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So yeah, a bunch of just for those who don't know, give the real quick backgrounder, you
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know, you know, the usual deal on your stats and all that.
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All right, guys.
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So I'm not going to assume that all of you guys know who I am.
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I am not somebody who studies loan officers in my free time, so I have no expectations
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there.
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So just you guys know, I have been in loans since 2002.
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I became a loan officer in 2008, in 2014.
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I got fired for my job as a top producer.
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At the time, my units were 167 units, which, you know, puts me in the top 1%.
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You know, a lot of things happened to me.
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One, I channeled a lot of dysfunctional humiliation into deciding to become one of the greatest
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that there ever were in mortgages.
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And so I used that and grew my business from 167 deals to 238 deals to 412 deals is high
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scales, 529 deals, 634, there was like eight something, nine something, we did 1300 loans
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last year for over 350 million, okay?
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So I will tell you that I do run a big business.
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A lot of that is, you know, just like you saw in the motivational video, making the decision
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to be different and staying super committed to that cause.
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Now I will tell you that I disagree with FinTech winning.
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So yes, they win in, if they win in scale and cheapness and fastness all the time, but
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where they do not compete with us is on expertise actually.
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So we can be experts at our craft and we can be the big connectors.
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So I, like my personal perspective is that we can all spend our energy being worried
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about what's coming, being worried about our competition, or we can figure out how to be
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uniquely different in the marketplace and where we can provide a shit ton of value.
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Like that's what we have to be focused on and there isn't a big company that is going
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to provide the same level of expertise as somebody who's been doing it for 20 years.
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Let's get real, we're competing with people making minimum wage who just know how to take
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a loan application, okay?
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That is not the same, it is not the same.
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And we know, first hand, the people do not live their life to qualify for mortgage loan.
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So what we have to be are people that understand the industry can give financial advice,
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can give wealth advice, can be the real advisors and not just app takers.
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So if you're somebody who's just used to taking apps, you probably should just join
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picking hormones now.
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If you're somebody who gives expertise who's really focused and committed on providing value,
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well then you will have a job, okay?
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And we will actually still make the big bucks, right?
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That nobody wipes out the best financial people.
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It's all the middle people, okay?
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So decide to be the best.
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So scaling business is fairly simple, so is marketing.
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And it's on the same principles, it's defining core values for your business.
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So it's deciding what we do here.
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So in my business, we help first-time home buyers.
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Right, we handhold it with the process, huh?
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We handle it for a second.
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Yeah.
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Okay, I want to go back up to decide to be the best.
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What does that mean to you?
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Because people often throw around, like be a financial advisor and all that kind of stuff.
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And that also hit home from yesterday sitting in there, listening to a lot of that.
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Like there are people, it sounds like you are one of them who are 100% committed to delivering,
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to being an alternative to a financial advisor in some, you know, from a essence standpoint.
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So, and I'm not saying that they're going to get like, you know, all that kind of Jeff,
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all that kind of Jeff's.
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But from the spirit of like you take seriously the responsibility you have in consulting people
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on a mortgage, is that for sure.
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So like I have, so first and foremost, guys, you do need to know about money.
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You need to know about mortgage-backed securities, how that function,
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what the world is like when they start talking about inflation, what will that mean to interest rates?
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Okay, like that's how we make ourselves different.
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So for me, I am an expert in mortgages.
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I can tell you what's going on in the marketplace.
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I can tell you what's going on in the economy, how it's going to impact interest rates.
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I can look at a 30 year fixed mortgage and tell you like if you did X number of things on your credit,
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this is how you're going to optimize your interest rate.
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This is how we get mortgage insurance down and I'm going to compare it with three different programs,
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just to make sure that we are getting you in the right program.
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Not to mention, I can explain things like ROI, like hey, your minimum cash investment is going to be
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$20,000. This house is $400,000.
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The market's appreciating at 5% at a minimum, right?
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You will have 100% return on your investment in one year.
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That's the way I speak to people.
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It is financial management, guys.
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Mortgages are people's number one liability and number one asset that they will owe.
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You guys have to take that seriously and that's a baseline.
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Like that's my opinion, that's a baseline.
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When I say that we're going to be the best, I'm talking all kinds of things.
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Like when people come to me for advice, they're coming to me for advice on how to repair their credit.
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What should their budget look like?
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What do I believe is a successful pathway to not being house broke?
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I identify their biggest challenges, their biggest fears, which is what I was going to tell you guys
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about defining who your client is and your core values, like what your business does.
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I know my first-time home buyers, I know they don't understand the process,
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I know they're scared about their credit, they don't have a lot of funds,
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and it is my job to teach them how to save it, how to budget for it,
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what assets will get them there faster, and what type of loan programs will achieve their goals.
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It is financial planning, it is financial management, and that's what I consider myself,
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and if you watch my channels, if you're following my social, I have a lot of people who tune in,
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because I explain really big financial terms in a way that people can digest.
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Right, and I have lots of loan officers, lots of realtors, and a ton of clients.
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And so this is how we differentiate ourselves.
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The guy who's the guy at Quickin is not going to compete with me, he's not the expert.
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True, okay, thank you very much for that.
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I'm seeing a couple questions come in, but keep going on your thread.
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You said you served as your primary client first-time home buyers?
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Yes, so I guys niche down as much as possible,
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because it's way more effective in marketing and way more effective for building a team,
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truthfully. So I deal with primarily first-time home buyers, and real estate,
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buyers, okay, that's who I market to, that's who I serve, that's it.
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And how do you draw the line in the sand, though, with that?
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If I did every first-time home buyer in Phoenix, I don't have enough staff to do it,
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that's why I draw the line. I'm not saying I don't do investments or refinances,
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I just don't market them, and my process and systems, my training, my financial advice,
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it's all to first-time home buyers, it's easier, and you get better by focusing.
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Right, got it. By the way, guys, if you got questions to start putting them in,
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I can see one question, was do you use mortgage codes or something similar?
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Yes, I use mortgage codes.
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Okay, there we go, Nick, that's for you.
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All right, so first-time home buyers, that's who you serve, that's what you're all about.
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Is there any specific, we'll get to YouTube channel, I guess, we'll kind of bounce all over
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the place, but your content, all that kind of stuff is all focused on attracting that audience,
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it's answering their questions. So first and foremost, once you decide who you're helping,
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you have to identify what their biggest problems are, what their biggest fears are.
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And what have you discovered are the biggest fears and problems of first-timers?
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It's like I just said, so credit assets, they don't know the process, they're scared of being
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house poor, a lot of millennials saw their parents go through bankruptcy, go through a foreclosure,
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go through a short sale, these are their biggest obstacles in home ownership.
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And they're fearful. Yeah, absolutely, that's probably a number one emotion for everyone buying
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in this market. Okay. Guys, you have to also understand what the news is saying, right? The
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news is talking about a housing bust every five seconds. Like the other day, there were 22 different
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headlines about how the bubble has burst in and the housing market is taking. Okay. Your clients
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are going to be asking you these questions. And if you are one or two follow-up questions
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away from falling apart, it tells you that you need to do more. If you expect the big bucks,
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if you expect to be in business, like for a very long time, you have to take the craft of knowing
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all of the data, the market, the industry, you, that has to be your passion.
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So we have a question about how your team is set up. How do you manage the leads apps
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and control your, like, where do you come into the process and where do you step out?
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Yeah, so I read it. So it's hard because my team size, so I'm, it's weird because in loans,
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people consider themselves like a loan officer with a team and then a brand, the team, like,
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I'm a branch at this point. Like, I just hard to explain. I am the only person that originates
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loans. So like, all the leads are originated by me. All the relationships are mine. I talk to
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every client, but I don't do every part of a loan. So like, I would not compare myself to somebody
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who like does all of the apps themselves does all of this, right? So I am a branch. So how it
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happens is I have a team of people who take and intake leads. They follow up on needs list.
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They take applications. They run to use. I have another set of people that pre-approved that
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client and then I have processors that take it from contract to close all the way.
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Got it. I have about 30 people. Well, I have 30 people in my branch. Not everyone works on my team.
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I have about 25 people that work on my team between openers, processors,
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you know, sales like reps, right? So I have loan officer assistance that are licensed.
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I have six sales loan officer assistance that help with leads and pre-approving.
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And we close about 88 loans a month. That's the average.
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Got it. Are you using any DPA with first-time home bars?
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It's generally a program that I show them. But again, when you're talking about expertise guys,
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a lease down payment assistance where I am from is not free. It has a three year recapture period
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and the interest rates in the mid fours and the rates that actual fees are about $1,500 higher than
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a regular loan. So oftentimes what we're doing is we're showing them an option without and then
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showing them an option without us giving them a credit towards a cost.
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So that's one way to outsell that guys. And your number one source of first-time home buyers is what?
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Real estate agents. How many and do you maintain those relationships yourself primarily?
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Thank you. So I have five big accounts and I have a database of three thousand agents that
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read my newsletter to an end to my social media.
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And last I checked with you, you were doing some type of advanced or classes or something, weren't you?
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I teach a bunch of Zoom calls. So I used to do in-person live events but with COVID that's
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become difficult. So now I just do a lot of Zoom events. So I probably teach five or six lunch and
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lunch. Do you guys hear that? Five or six. Yeah. All right. That's a lot of what these people
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here do by the way as well. Class, virtual and in-person. Okay. Want to talk YouTube?
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Sure. Let's talk YouTube. I'm going to do a screen share and bring up your channel here real quick.
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No, Janelle had a question. Yeah, it was about the down payment assistance.
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Oh, it was. Okay. Cool. Yeah. We got Kevin. Mike drop. Are you getting involved with a lot of
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the CDs at all? I do. I do a CD call with every client. Good question, Kevin. So that's 88 calls
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a month roughly, right? Yeah. What do you, what's your average hours in a given day or week?
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It depends on what's going on in my business, truthfully. So there's lots of times where I'm
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working 35 to 40 hours and then there's other times where I'm working 78. Like this week, I've
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worked like the last two weeks. I've worked a lot because my production managers was on her honeymoon
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and she took 10 days off. So that was pretty fun. No. I can imagine. All right. So Emmett, I'll get
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you a question in a second. Let me get to sharing her YouTube channel here. There we go. Desktop.
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All right. So I think last time I had you on the podcast, it might have been like 18 months
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ago or so. But if I remember correctly, you were just kind of getting going with that. Is that right?
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Two years ago. Yeah. About two years ago. That's how long we did it. Yeah. Yeah. It was roughly
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that. Anyway, okay. So we have a handful of people here who do YouTube as well. So here's the
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channel. Awesome. Tell us for anybody who is considering YouTube, you've obviously got a nice
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head start. I'm looking at your view count. Obviously, what have you learned so far about YouTube
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that maybe you could pass on to anybody who's considering it? Yeah. So YouTube is a commitment.
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No, stop. So you have to have a good scheduling time for like when you're going to record your
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videos. You have to have a process for who edits the videos, how they put them on. You want your,
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there's like some really good books like Daryl Eaves wrote a really good book on YouTube specifically.
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So do that. Got right here. Yeah. So I mean, for me, I will tell you the truth. I'm not as
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consistent as I should be on YouTube. Like there's several months where like I don't post any
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videos, right? Which and so like I just posted a video after not posting a video for a week after
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being really inconsistent. So like my view count is down. But like, you know, the video that I
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just posted, it was Wednesday will probably get like 2000 views, right? Which is pretty standard
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for my channel. And then like the best ones I have have almost 100,000, you know? And so it depends
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on the topic, but like the topic is like how to understand APR. You know, it's not like it's not
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super sexy stuff. It's very niche stuff that first time home buyers would have questions on. Yeah.
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You know, I was listening to somebody the other day and they're talking about like the philosophy
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or how you approach YouTube. And actually it was Kyle C. Graves and I love Kyle. Yeah. And he said
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that one of the things he learned was he stopped when like when it really shifted for him is instead
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of making videos for everybody or a mass audience, he was making a video for one person.
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And I'm looking at your content. I'm thinking like, hmm, that looks like it resonates as well.
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First time home buyers, right? How to qualify for a mortgage. Should you buy new rules for FHA,
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student loan debt? Yeah. And honestly, like I had a ton of moments about the very beginning of
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the year, like all of my videos were getting 9,000 to 10,000 views. And I got COVID in March and I
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just haven't been as consistent as I wanted to be. So I was like out for like almost all of April.
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So like it is just what it is. But like my I'm going to get re-committed to doing it.
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My like I don't I generate probably like I don't know like 10 leads a week on social media.
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So it's not a ton. I primarily do this because it serves my real estate agents and my database.
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Do you know what I mean? And that is where I see like, you know, 30% of my business.
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You know, so it's like everything I do has multiple purposes.
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But honestly, like if you were getting 10, like 60 leads, like quality, because these are leads
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that guys like also on social media, the quantity isn't that many, but they're all ready to go
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and they all want to buy. So like these people pre-approved, they buy with us, they're super committed,
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they're loyal because they found me and they chose me, you know. So the quantity isn't as many,
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but if you are getting like 50, 40 high quality leads a month, I mean that's top producing
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lead source. Yeah, and the conversion rates high as well. Like you said, hey, hey listeners,
23:04
it's your friend, Jeff. I hope you're doing well. I wanted to pop into your
23:08
ears for just a moment and remind you that if you're looking to quickly and easily get
23:14
more agent referrals, more quality agent relationships and do it without chasing, do it without
23:21
pay to play and do it with a predictability and a system that works every single month like clockwork
23:29
creating conversations between you and real estate agents that you choose who you talk to,
23:34
you get to decide who you work with or not, but one that actually generates referrals for you.
23:42
Every single month, so long as you follow the proven planning system, if that is something
23:46
that you're interested in and if you're looking into leveling up your digital marketing game,
23:52
well, perhaps you'd want to check out the mortgage marketing pro membership. Every single month,
23:58
we've got loan officers, teaching classes around the country, getting in front of agents at scale,
24:03
having conversations at scale and driving agent referrals.
24:08
You know, in business, there's a concept I learned years ago from Tony Robbins and
24:12
the two things I learned were, number one, if you want to improve your results, get better results
24:17
or more results more quickly, you need to apply the principle of leverage.
24:25
Leverage means the ability to do less and accomplish more with leveraged activities and then the
24:31
second principle is compression, right? To reach more people in less time and the concept of
24:37
talking to real estate agents instead of one to one, you go group. So imagine if you instead of
24:43
were one to one marketing to real estate agent, once the two Z, you were able to actually consistently
24:47
get in front of 10, 20, 30 agents every single time you want to do by hosting a class, virtual
24:53
learn person. And therefore, your conversation goals would happen much more quickly because you're
24:59
using the principle of leverage with compression, which combines with a law of large numbers,
25:04
you're going to get better results more quickly. So if you want to learn more about how do we do that,
25:10
go to mortgagemarketing.pro, check out the short video. This may be for you. That's up to you to
25:16
decide. And now back to our regularly scheduled program. All right, so we're going back and forth a
25:20
little bit with the questions because that's sometimes how it rolls here. People take a question,
25:24
put it in. That's awesome. So Janelle, who I know she's running a team, we want to unpack a little
25:29
bit about, and you can probably see her question there, how you started managing quality standards as
25:34
you brought out new team members, nervous face. Yeah, how do you keep the quality, right?
25:42
So I lean heavily on technology. So I have a sales force that is built out very extensively,
25:48
you know, to make sure that consistency is there. So I'm a big believer in that that cost me
25:54
like $80,000 a year to maintain. But for me, it's so important because we run a really big
25:59
business and you mess up enough deals for one account, you lose it. So that's high maintained
26:05
quality standards. It tracks conversions, response times. It, you know, there's a standard of
26:12
communication and professionalism because all the templates are drafted. But also it comes back
26:19
to the core values. Like for me, everyone knows what they are. We follow them. If you're ever
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going to be like written up or anything, it's going to be based on a core value. And I'm very
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committed to making sure that people are successful, but I do have a three strikes your outrule.
26:34
So like, let's say you did something, you messed up on a client situation, we've talked about it.
26:41
Great. It happens again. We're going to have a formal write up. And if it keeps happening,
26:46
like unfortunately, like for me, it's just like it's three times. Like it never really ever gets
26:52
past one or two, truthfully, thank goodness. But sometimes it does. And when it does, people know
26:58
that I will fire them. And it's not, there's no hard feelings. I just don't believe in pushing
27:02
a square peg through a round hole. I don't get mad. I'm not like losing my shit.
27:07
But I am just super clear. And people know how to win here. Like they know how to win here.
27:13
Do you do any pre-hiring assessment tools, discs or anything like that?
27:20
No, I'm not going to lie. No. I was trying to think about like I do have a unique hiring process
27:27
though. And I feel like if people are willing to go through it, then they're generally good. So
27:32
like if I'm hiring a processor, they turn in their resume. They have to turn in a cover letter
27:37
for an underwriter to explain conditions. I want to see their thought process. Right. So like,
27:42
just that is like enough to opt people out. And then if it's a salesperson, they have to record
27:48
a video of themselves explaining why they'd be a good candidate. And so like just then in there,
27:54
like lots of people just don't apply or they don't move past that point. But that's generally
27:59
speaking. And then for me, like when I interview people, I like to think I'm a good gauge of
28:05
character. So I ask questions like, you know, tell me about yourself. You know, what's the like,
28:12
what's the one thing that people normally get wrong about you, right? Like it's like the biggest
28:16
misconception. And whatever they tell me is the absolute truth, right? But people will tell you
28:21
their worst quality in that question. And it's like, can you live with that or not? You know,
28:30
my interviews by the time they get to me, they're very informal. I normally have snacks or I have
28:35
coffee, I'm trying to get them to feel like they have the job because I want to see what their
28:40
natural like habits are. So I mean, like, that's as far as I go. Got it. Okay. Good stuff. All right.
28:49
Some more questions coming in. Ryan, you saw my message back to you. We got to get you people
28:53
talking. Let's go, Mr. Miracle. Hey, hey, Lizzie. Thank you once again for coming on today and
28:59
providing so much value to the rest of us. But so yeah, I've been watching you, Kyle and hobby
29:04
here for some time now. Trust trying to see if there is an empty space of vacuum there.
29:12
I know Kyle's in my neck and the woods. But how long did it take for each of you? I know you may
29:19
not know their metrics, but generally speaking, how long did it take for you guys to have enough
29:23
people show up on the lives to make it worth your time? I so I feel terrible because
29:32
guys, YouTube for me is is is like a hobby. If I hate to just make that sound, I don't want,
29:42
like I do get a lot of leaves and yes, I have a lot of subscribers and yes, all the things.
29:46
But I'm not like they are. They're like hardcore committed, have the plan, the downloads,
29:52
the all the things. So I know that for me, it took like 23 videos for me to actually get traction
29:59
with my channel. And then like I think that you should just start doing lives even if there's
30:07
like five people that show up, that's five people you're talking to for 30 minutes. They'll
30:13
grow from there. I would promote them to your database. I would I mean, some like I get some
30:18
upward anywhere between like 30 and 100 people. That's not like oh my god numbers, but I still do
30:23
them every week. Like that's the one thing I have been consistent on is the YouTube lives
30:29
because I always get a lead. Like every single one, I get one at least still.
30:35
So you did 20 or so videos before my channel started even getting traction, yeah.
30:41
So is that static videos or is that live you did before certain videos? I just started doing
30:46
lives. Gotcha. Thank you. I know. But if you if you really want to know, both Kyle and Javier are
30:54
like the nicest people ever. If you message them, they will give you all the information.
30:59
Yeah. And Kyle's not an active loan officer, just so you guys know. So like,
31:04
it's it's not like you're competing for the same real estate agents, you know.
31:09
Yeah. Yeah. I'm gonna have him on as well.
31:14
Yeah. Kyle's just a great guy. Okay. So I'm going back to the questions here.
31:20
And guys, if you just want to unmute and ask your question, go ahead. Come on.
31:24
This is your chance. This is why we're here. James, I'm going to take your question.
31:29
Credit challenge borrowers, how do you handle them? Do you put them on a credit repair program?
31:34
Or what do you do? Send them to Sam Parker.
31:36
I know. We have our own people that work on credit plans.
31:40
Yeah. We just follow up on them. All right. Three questions in one, but
31:45
all right. Well, let's go with that one. What's the three questions in one?
31:48
So Amat, go ahead. Hi. First of all, you're you're doing awesome out there. I've been following
31:55
your computer content for a while. Three different questions. First of all,
31:58
production tiers as you were bluffing through, you know, 20 million, 40 million, 60 million.
32:04
How did your team make up changed throughout those transitions?
32:08
So first and foremost, you guys have to track the number of leads,
32:13
purse, and then leads to clothes, right? So for me, it's about, I mean,
32:22
I every LP one can manage about 20 leads, active leads at a given time,
32:30
so that they're actively following up on. And then an LP too, so like, people who take it from
32:36
contract to close, their metrics are 15 to 25 in their pipeline, depending on experience.
32:43
And then my pre-approval team can do like three to five, depending on experience.
32:47
So depending on what that looks like for you, you know what I mean, in terms of leads and
32:52
closings, the course says it's like five loans, closings for every one person you have.
32:59
But you have to track it. For me, it was, I always hire by leads. So if I'm getting more
33:04
leads, I'll hire, even if I don't have the closings. So I'm more of a leading metric person versus
33:10
a lagging, so I hope that helps. And there's a really good book called Traction, it's by Geno
33:17
Wickman. It's a really good book on metrics, so that way you guys can like run the numbers on
33:22
yourselves. And then it'll help you figure out what you need to scale. So like, most of you guys
33:27
just have to get better at converting the leads you have. If you had one or two percent more
33:31
conversion, you'd actually probably hit where you want to be in terms of goals. But then once
33:37
you're past like that, then it's about, okay, I need X number of referral sources. So like the
33:42
average realtor does a half a transaction a month. So I needed 42 realtors to start to get to close
33:49
15 to 20 deals, right? So like, that's what I was going for. So you just, you, you want to be aware
33:55
of what that looks like. And you know, how many leads they're producing. And then eventually,
34:00
you're going to just top grade over and over again. And I top grade with employees too. Like,
34:04
I'm always hiring at any moment in time. So like, we are always open for jobs because chances are,
34:11
I'll grow or somebody won't work out or somebody puts in a notice or whatever. So just like the
34:17
interviewing every week. Good stuff. Go ahead, Adam. Okay. You touch on some of this stuff. I'm also
34:26
a YouTuber. And like I said, it's set in your channel. Did you find a lot of your collaborations
34:31
with Javier and Kyle and those, use those to slingshot your, your view counts and where are your
34:37
views coming from? I know you said it's a hobby. I don't know if you really track that kind of stuff.
34:42
So I never did a collaboration, I haven't done a collaboration with Kyle. I used to, so how I did
34:49
YouTube guys is Javier wanted a loan officer on his lives on Saturday. Like that's what it was.
34:56
He wanted somebody to answer all the lending questions. And then like, you know, I mean,
35:03
it ended up being that like, I would do these lives. And then I would literally spend two hours
35:09
after the live answering all of these DM messages that I would get. And then I was like, well,
35:14
this is like very not time efficient. These people aren't even living where I live. They're like
35:19
all over the country. And I would feel obligated to respond to them. So then I was like, well,
35:24
I'll just start making my own channel and then answering these questions and then sending them.
35:29
So now if somebody asks me, I just hit the link and just send them the question.
35:34
So that's how it started with me. I wish I had you, I wish that at the time that I was doing that,
35:41
that I knew I wanted to pursue YouTube because my channel would be in a completely different place.
35:47
And like recently, Javier did a couple of lives with me. And that was super fun. And it
35:54
definitely does help the channel. So I would definitely say like getting like a Jeb Smith,
36:00
Christina Smallhorn, like there are people that love to do collaborations all the time. So I don't
36:05
know if you've reached out to them. Kyle will do a collab. Like there are people that will just do
36:10
them. I have it personally done them. Javier is a real try actively work like I'm his loan officer.
36:20
That must be a hoot. Okay. Emmett, part three or a question. Go ahead.
36:26
Part three about referral partners. And which is why I'm on Jeff's thing here. Basically,
36:32
you know, I know the core and others teach about targeting realtors for production. And I find here
36:37
in Florida, it just seems like your top 5% are all Zillow people. Like they just have a Zillow.
36:43
And then we all know who the Zillow is. So did you target the top realtors? Like where did you
36:49
target them? You said you're looking for 40 of them. I mean, it's hard to know where to aim
36:53
because they're just such a, just like you said, half a transaction apiece. Like where do you start?
36:58
And what do you target? Your title companies will keep track of people's productions. You generally
37:03
want to go for people who are closing deals. I'm going to say something and it's going to sound
37:08
really obnoxious. But I just, the thing is, it's the truth. I made myself the prize.
37:17
And like I market myself as like working with me is like the prize. And so it's different now
37:25
in my marketplace because like, like I literally walked into a meeting yesterday and there's
37:30
30 vendors and there's four lenders to this one account. And like two of the other people
37:36
refer to me as the queen of mortgages. And I laugh, but I'm like, you know what? My marketing is
37:41
totally working. You know, it's like that's what it is. It's like I come in and I give them a
37:47
full economic breakdown of what's going on. I know real estate stats like the back of my hand.
37:52
And then all of a sudden, I'm like the valued presenter at these real estate meetings.
37:56
And people can go, oh my god, she's the number one female loan officer or oh my god,
38:00
she's the number one Latino loan officer. Or they just have these things to be like people like
38:05
status. So you have to figure out where you can be number one in your marketplace and own that.
38:12
So there's a really good book called the 22 immutable laws that's marketing. It's like one of
38:17
the best books I've ever read in life. Like, and I read it and I was like, oh cool, where can I be
38:22
number one? Where can I do all the things? And like, what's funny is I'm not actually the number one
38:27
female loan officer anymore as of last year because the better mortgage now is like, but it doesn't
38:34
matter because I was first marketed. Everyone still calls it. And now I market myself as America's
38:40
favorite, like a female loan officer and people, it's still the same thing in their minds. Like,
38:46
it doesn't matter anymore. Well, there's a lot of lessons in there as well. First of all,
38:51
you decided to claim that. Like, you know, we've all heard the old cliche with branding is no one's
38:55
going to come along and name you the number one loan officer. Like, you have to claim it, you know,
39:01
and in love, I love that you bring that up as because it really makes me think all of us here,
39:05
I think to some degree, are wandering generalities. Right? I mean, good. I think a lot of people
39:14
are afraid to niche. They're afraid to be confident. They're afraid to be bold. You know, part of the
39:19
difference between giving information and expertise is an opinion. Like that video you watched at
39:25
the beginning of it was like, are you tired? You need to do this. They get in your face.
39:29
And I have never been, I'm not shy about having an opinion. I'm not shy about being myself
39:36
because I would rather people opt in fast or opt out fast. Like, it being neutrals the kiss of death
39:44
for business and marketing. Hey, man, you can't be for everybody. No, Nick, are you raising your hand?
39:52
Head on mute. Hey, Lizzie, I've been following you for a while. I really love your stuff.
40:00
You said you, you know, you picked a niche. You picked, it sounds like just one niche.
40:06
Was there, so I guess like two parts. One, why first time home buyers and have you considered
40:12
more niches or do you think that would dilute your marketing? So I think it would dilute.
40:19
I chose, so in that book, the 22 mutable, this is where I got niching actually from. I just,
40:25
like, it went full circle for me when I mentioned the book. So it says you need a target market
40:30
that is so big that you couldn't possibly do all of them in your marketplace.
40:36
And that's why I chose first time home buyers. And I think that the needs that first time home buyers
40:41
have are typically the needs of like a second home buyer or like somebody who's buying a move up house,
40:47
you know, they're, they're along the same lines. And I just, I don't, I'm not going to get into other
40:54
niches because if this is working for me, and I believe that if something's working for you,
40:59
you just improve on it 30%. So another way I scaled guys is I look at what's working for me,
41:04
and this is 100% the rule, like every quarter. I get all of my account pyramid. I figure out my best
41:10
accounts. I double down on what I mean. Number one marketing sources. I double down. And then
41:19
the least profitable accounts and or marketing strategies, I 100% duck without question.
41:26
What do you, when you say accounts, are you talking about people? Yes. So are we talking
41:31
individuals or are these brokerages? Brokages, people, like I'm not saying, hey, we're not friends
41:36
anymore. I'm just saying, hey, I'm not going to spend marketing dollars with you anymore.
41:41
You know, and or I'll just put them on my marketing list and just focus on other people. I do the
41:46
phase out. Yeah. Do you slowly just do the, you know, the back dance, the moonwalk, or do you
41:51
actually have that conversation of be like, hey, you know, we're in a marketing relationship. I
41:55
have the conversation. And like the thing is, I really, I'm a very like good communicator. So
42:01
if like I check these things all the time, like literally, I check leads daily, I check leads
42:07
weekly, I check leads monthly, I'm always going over 12 months rolling calendar, like I am hard for
42:13
with data. And so I have these conversations on a red. It's like, hey, like what can we do to be
42:18
earning more leads? What can I do to be, you know, providing more value? What can I do? Right? To
42:24
be the best partner for you. And if we're having this conversation and nothing is changing and I'm
42:29
not providing more value to you, again, like I said, I don't believe in squeezing a square peg
42:34
through a round hole. We're just not the right fit. It isn't about like, oh, you didn't give me
42:38
enough leads. It's like, hey, dude, I'm not effective in your place. Yeah. So let's talk for a
42:44
moment about the marketing spend. And I know last time we talked, you were doing some, I do a lot
42:51
guys. I spent like $50,000 in marketing annually. No, a month. Got. And so how does some of you
43:01
are mind blown, but get this. You have to spend money to grow your brand and business period.
43:07
And like sometimes the easiest, like entryway into a top team is to volunteer to pay whatever
43:14
their spend is, right? And if you bring in a lot of value, let me tell you, the spend is nothing
43:19
to what I get back. Like all of my accounts are, like sometimes I make $200,000 a month after
43:27
all of the expenses. Was it worth it? Yes. Yeah, you really have to look at it from the business.
43:32
You'd be paying for advertising, etc. If you're running, you know, your plumber, whatever,
43:36
you're going to run ads, you're going to pay for ads. Now, I think the challenge, though, with paying
43:39
for leads or co-paying, you know, with realtors is oftentimes it's the relationship that's wrong
43:45
going in from the beginning, whereas they are looking at you as a place to get, right? And you're
43:50
replaceable. So how do you address that? Well, again, I am the prize. And also it's your mindset.
43:56
Like if that was your mindset, like you're just going to go pay and they're going to give you all
44:00
of your leads, it's not going to work for you. Like it just will not work for you. How I go and
44:06
approach everything, guys, is I am their business partner. And if I am your business partner,
44:12
do I expect to like pay half of the bills for the leads that we are both getting?
44:18
Yes, I do. And I also expect that as my job as your business partner is to do my job above and
44:25
beyond just taking your apps and closing your deals. Like the way that I'm winning, guys,
44:32
is that truthfully, I provide more value and more substance than my competition period.
44:37
Like we were in a room of 30 vendors yesterday and like they're just all complaining.
44:45
And I'm like, okay, we can sit there and complain and they're going to be real motivated to send
44:50
us more leads. Or we could say, okay, guys, so here's what I think really works. This would be
44:56
super valuable to me, right? This is like what would mean more. Like, you know, for instance,
45:01
they want us to pay for more CE classes. And I'm like, hey guys, you know, I'm going to say
45:06
something a little controversial here, but it comes from a place of love, okay? The CE classes
45:11
have very little ROI for us centers. Now, I will continue to pay for the CE classes because you
45:18
guys are a valuable referral source for me, but just so you know, I consider that a donation
45:23
to your organization. Like that, it does not do anything for me. But here's what would do
45:29
amazing things for me, right? I would love it if you guys put some of this content online and
45:35
allowed for me to play a 30-second video, right, before it plays. Like, if you would allow me to
45:42
do that, that would actually bring me a ton of more ROI. And I never want to agree with me,
45:47
and it's a way better approach. And they liked it. Now, the other thing is I know that groups
45:52
number one thing is recruiting. And so I'm like, hey guys, like, here's one thing way for us to
45:58
help you recruit more agents. Here's another way for us to help you retain agents, right? And I'm
46:03
leading the meeting. I am their vendor. Let's get real. I am an affiliate. I don't run their
46:09
business. But again, like, people are afraid of confrontation. They don't know how to do it
46:14
correctly. They come from a place of scarcity versus abundance. And people think you're a
46:19
complaining whiner versus somebody who's advocating and getting what they need. Like,
46:25
and so you got to just understand your approach is everything and your mindset is everything when
46:30
it comes to relationships and ROI. If you come into it going like, what am I going to get out of it
46:36
versus what am I going to bring to the table? You will negotiate poorly, right? Because you won't
46:42
understand your own value. And you are never going to be taken seriously. Absolutely. You're replaceable.
46:48
So let me pause here for a second. I'd like to check with the audience.
46:53
Back to your statement about the prize is you. Like working with me is the benefit. Now,
46:59
obviously, that is a wonderfully strong certainty of a mindset. And if I can be honest,
47:07
I think some, maybe some people here, I don't know. I don't want to speak for anybody. Does anybody
47:12
struggle with that? With, okay, so you see a couple heads nodding. And I just know this from just
47:19
being around long enough and talking enough L.O.s. It's like they don't necessarily have that mindset.
47:24
Like, what's so great about me? So you guys, I'll tell you the truth right now. You do not have a
47:32
strong enough opinion and you do not know enough about the industry, enough about marketing,
47:36
enough about your business to really be valuable to other people. Like if it's an insecurity,
47:42
double down on that and get better. Like if you couldn't say absolutely to that question,
47:48
read more, listen to more podcasts, get more hardcore, like figure out what your agents number
47:53
want. Just go, hey, how can I provide more value for you? A lot of you guys are too scared to
47:58
actually ask for the real authentic advice or the opinions of your referral partners and then
48:03
you get defensive and then want to defend yourself. Like one of the best things about me is like
48:08
I'm super open to feedback. Like people will be like, hey, you guys totally screwed up on that. And
48:13
I'm like, oh my god, we did. That's horrible. I'm so sorry. Thanks for not firing me. Let me go
48:17
ahead of that. And then I'm like, hey, here's how that's never going to happen again. And oh,
48:23
by the way, I said the client to gift and I said you want to. Like, you know, it's just I'm really
48:30
open to feedback and people give it to me all the time, like all the time. Yeah. I love it. I just
48:37
just I know we do talk about that here in the group and that's part of the reason why everybody's
48:41
here and gets together is we're one of the ways we try and more add more value is it's through
48:45
the educational content, right, teaching and marketing, social media and all that stuff.
48:49
But we all, yes, you're right. We all need to get better at that and have a stronger value
48:54
proposition and be more confident. And by the way, I would also say that if you have a, I don't know,
49:00
you might feel differently about this Lizzy, but I do think that you having a kick ass process
49:07
while that sounds like a lot of fluff and hyperbole, people don't know that it's true until they
49:12
actually go through it. But compared to the average process for most LOs out there, once somebody
49:18
does experience it, if it does rock, then that is like how to compel you that you can also sell
49:25
on data. Okay. So Jeff, I would love to talk with you more offline because you and I have opposites
49:31
spectrum mindsets. So like you're like, no one can sell this. You guys, I like rip out the data
49:37
from my CRM and I'm like, look, let me tell you the average loan officer will call your lead once.
49:42
Right. And maybe twice if they're really good, I have 16 touches to follow up, not to mention my
49:48
average call response time guys is less than an hour for when I get a lead. And I can guarantee it
49:54
and I can show it to them. Do you think that makes a difference? Yeah. So I think I agree with you
49:59
that those are all sellable points. And I guess what I'm saying is is that if you don't
50:03
that data to back it up. Yeah. Right. I can pull it from the CRM like you're like, no, you can't sell
50:08
unless you can experience it. I'm actually saying, hey guys, like you can physically see this data.
50:15
And if you pull up the top like 1% in the marketplace, the ones that have the biggest growth year
50:21
after year are my partners. And I think you can pull them up themselves. What we're trying to do here
50:26
is to help everybody here have more conversations with the right agents who can appreciate that.
50:33
Here's what I'm going to tell you right because I want you guys to get this. I don't pick agents
50:39
based on their production. I pick them based on their like give a shit meter. Like if I meet an
50:46
agent and they're like, you tell me what to do and I will do it. I'm all on board. I coach agents
50:52
from the ground up, from the ground up, my number one agent I close 100 deals with for a year,
50:57
fourth year in the business. Okay. Like you guys, it's about like figuring out how you can sell this
51:06
stuff. Like most people wouldn't go, they go, well, I don't know how you sell process. Well,
51:10
how you sell processes, you have to get a system to track your data. Like you have to go, hey,
51:16
what is my competition doing and can I market this? Like when I read a Harvard study on follow-up,
51:23
right, you can Google it. But it was like people call people one time maybe twice if they're good,
51:29
eight times is actually statistically more likely for people to follow up with, right,
51:34
for people to answer the phone. And after if they answer after six times, right, they're more than
51:40
likely to proceed with going with you, right? So I'm like, okay, well, I need a system that at least
51:46
markets to people eight times, right? So I can get maximum conversion on dates, right? So I know
51:52
this. I use a Harvard study. I create my own process and I go to sell that. You cannot sell things
52:00
that people are not going to sell the opposite of. So you can't say I have great service because
52:04
what a no one's going to say I have bad service, right? People are going to say I have great follow-up,
52:09
but they're not going to have the tangibles which are, by the way, there's this study from Harvard.
52:15
People do X. This is what we're doing. This is our consistency. This is our pull-through rate.
52:19
This is our conversion. Here's what my other agents are saying about me in case you want to call them.
52:24
Like, do you treat this like a job interview? My point is like in order to own being the best,
52:35
you have to go and seek out what is the best. Like, we all go into different hotels, right?
52:40
You can, and they all offer the exact same thing. Guys, Motel 6 offers you a bed, a bathroom,
52:49
made service, cable, a pool, and maybe a continental breakfast, okay? The Ritz Carlton offers you
52:57
all those things except they're way nicer. It's an experience. People pay attention, right? So what
53:03
does the Ritz Carlton experience look like for you? And you cannot define it, guys, until you have
53:10
know what your agents' biggest problems are. Your clients' biggest problems are. And then what
53:16
you're going to do to fix it, and it cannot be generic. It has to be like bullet-pointed niche down
53:23
with data that you can support on it, and then you can sell on it, and then you can be the best
53:28
in that solution. When you are the best in that solution for their problem, are you a gift?
53:35
Yes. Are you the prize? Yes. That's how you get there. Got it. Of that. That deserves a
53:50
seriously. I love that. That's so amazing. We need to take ownership of it, and more importantly,
53:55
have a actual documented system with metrics that we can report on and sell. Otherwise, we're just
54:00
talking BS. You know, I'm the greatest, I have the greatest service. We close in 21 days.
54:06
If you have a lot of marketing book, we'll teach you a lot. It's like 100 pages, guys. Definitely
54:10
go buy it, please. Al Rice and Jack Trout, 22, and Mutable Laws. Yep. Classic. All right,
54:16
listen, we are almost out of time. So folks, if you have your one pressing with the one question,
54:20
you wanted to ask Lizzie Hofer, but you never had the courage. Okay, so here is it. It's from
54:25
Alex. Do you do coaching or do you recommend coaching? Hey, there's a question. I recommend the
54:30
core coaching. There you go. Recommends core. Okay, so listen, I know you're hourly's way high,
54:37
so we've already taken enough. I'm so grateful. People, was this worth it? Let's give a little thumbs
54:41
up wave. Are you grateful that Lizzie came? Seriously, more nuggets per minute than we appreciate it
54:50
very much. Thank you, Emmett, Alex, Janelle, everybody. All right, so if people want to follow you,
54:56
they just go to Instagram and follow you there. Check out your YouTube channel and, you know,
55:01
go out and kick some ass, Lizzie. I think that goes without saying you're going to do that no matter
55:04
what. Yes, guys, Lizzie with one Z. Okay. With one Z. Okay, got it. Awesome. Okay, everybody,
55:12
this is it for this session. We will, I believe we back next week, same time, same channel.
55:16
Get out there. Do some classes. Post your wins of the week in the Facebook group. Let us know
55:19
what you're doing. And if you need more help, I appreciate you guys. Hey, guys, so there you are.
55:24
There is a look behind the scenes into what a call would sound like if you were a member of
55:31
Mortgage Marketing Pro, right? Every single month we have a special guest. This month it was
55:35
Lizzie Hofer and you've heard her story. Hopefully you were impacted by that as our current members
55:38
were. You heard her say that she does five to six agent classes per month, mostly over Zoom.
55:44
Hey, if you've thought about doing agent classes, but are stuck with, well, where do I start?
55:47
What content do I produce? Should it be CE or not? How do I get butts in the seats? We've got
55:52
the solution for you, right? The members you heard on this call today are doing exactly that across
55:58
the country and they're getting fantastic results. Imagine if you could be in front of 20, 30 agents
56:02
at once instead of one or two, right? And then they schedule time with you on your calendar. How do
56:07
you do that? You follow a proven system. Want to learn more? Go to Mortgage Marketing.pro.
56:12
All the details are there. I appreciate you. We'll see you on the next one. Bye for now.
56:23
Hey guys, what's up? Real quick. You've heard about the Mortgage Marketing Pro membership
56:26
before and you just want to quickly remind you if that you're in a place in your business where
56:30
you simply need more purchased loans. You need to fill your pipeline with purchase business.
56:35
Let's just face it, agents are still a solid pillar of business and sources of purchase
56:40
business for you. Well, good news. Our Mortgage Marketing Pro membership helps loan officers
56:44
like you close more loans without the hassle of chasing agents or cold calling. Done for you,
56:50
agent classes, expert training videos, a marketing automation platform that automates the entire
56:55
process for you, everything you need to build your personal brand in your local market,
56:59
attract and convert agents into referral partners. Plus done for you proven marketing materials
57:06
and plug-and-play content to make promoting your class, getting agents, butts and seats,
57:10
partnering with affiliates, real easy. But that's not all. You'll also get access to our weekly
57:16
mastermind calls with top L.O.'s authors, speakers and coaches to learn the best strategies to
57:23
grow your business right now in today's market. And as an extra bonus for limited time,
57:28
for all new members, you'll get access to a database of 200 agents in your local market
57:34
that have closed anywhere from 8 to 50 transactions in the last 12 months.
57:40
And we'll provide that list uploaded into our platform for you so you can get off to a fast start
57:44
in reaching actually productive agents. So what are you waiting for? You can check out more at
57:49
mortgagedmarketing.pro, see more of the success stories there. And if you feel compelled to do so,
57:55
book a call, we'll have a chat. We'll see if it's a fit. Don't miss out on this opportunity to
57:59
take your mortgage business to the next level right now. Head over to mortgagedmarketing.pro.