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Retail Media Roundtable - Travel Media: Unlocking New Growth Opportunities · IAB Europe podcasts

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Retail Media Roundtable, the podcast from IV that dives into the dynamic world of retail and commerce media advertising.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: In this special edition, powered by our partners Mirror Ads, we're bringing you fresh insight straight from the heart of the action, recorded live at our Retail Media Impact Summit in Amsterdam.
• 0:17
  SPEAKER_00: So whether you're seeking practical tips, strategic perspectives, or a deeper understanding of this fast-moving space, the Retail Media Roundtable is your go-to for timely and thought-provoking discussions.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: And in these exclusive live episodes, you'll hear directly from the experts and leaders influencing the future of retail and commerce media in Europe.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: So grab a seat at the table and let's dive in.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_01: Ram, I'm really excited.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: We're finally here together.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_01: We have been talking for close to a year now.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: It took a while.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: About travel media standards.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's a really exciting topic.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: But my question to you is why now?
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_01: Why is this important at this point in time?
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like you've been saying, travel media exists kind of before retail media.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: It's not a competition, but before, right?
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: About 20 years ago.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: There is this misconception of the fact that like travel is now following after the buzz of like retail.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_02: But frankly speaking, it's been there in different shapes and forms over the past 20 years, I would say.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_02: Some of our competitors have been actually running like travel media networks for the past 20 years.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_02: So we've been quite advanced in that sense already.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_02: Retail has helped us, though.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: Like in order to like when you go into the boardroom now and you talk about like commerce media, they're like, oh yeah, we were seeing like a lot of like in the news about like retail media, and that helps us as well in our conversations to scale.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: But it's it's a standalone, you know, like vertical.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: And uh to your to your point on like why are we talking uh about it, about it right now?
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_02: Travel is a very interesting vertical in the sense of it sits at an intersection of intent and transaction that's that's rather unique.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_02: So think of it yourself.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: Like if you book your travel, or I book my travel as a millennial, it takes me weeks, sometimes months, to actually like make that actual booking.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: So at the moment you get inspired all the way through that actual booking that you make, you go to different stages and you create a lot of like intent signals.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_02: Like you go check out reviews, you could check out different imagery, you could check out prices.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: So you capture like a full funnel where we use different advertisers at different points of that funnel to drive consideration.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and then actually, like when you make that booking, you enter into a totally new spend window.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_02: So, like the near non-andemic opportunity is big in retail, it's also like in travel.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but actually, like think of it when you just booked your travel, there's a lot uh of things that you need.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_02: Think about it, like sunscreen, clothing, uh insurance, credit cards, all those kind of like things.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: So um, why travel now?
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's very unique, it has its own sets of challenges and a lot of opportunities, and you can't just plot retail into a new vertical.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: So I reckon it's it's it's very important that we have a separate conversation about it because it's a very exciting opportunity and it requires um additional work to get it right in this one as well.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: So, to an audience that you that is used to hearing more about retail media as a concept, right?
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's retailers or advertisers, you've touched on one nuance, which is a long purchasing journey.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the other nuances you would get?
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, you're asking a person who's basically been working in travel its entire uh career uh to uh to think about like what the nuances are uh with retail.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to go.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Let's help each other give us a lot.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm in retail, you're in travel.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's a good thing.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you can just hand me down if I say things that are that are incorrect in that sense, but I've I've identified four different areas, so to say.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: So the first one I kind of like touched upon, right?
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a longer, more complex customer journey.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_02: You capture like the full funnel and different stages of the funnel.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_02: So we work with different types of advertisers.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: Think about um, first of all, destinations, so like tourism boards.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_02: They play a role up in the funnel, right?
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, like we're trying to help them inspire users on our platform or off our platform to actually consider also their destination.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_02: Uh they might not even be aware.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: So, like driving that incremental like consideration is important.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_02: Then we have accommodation partners.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, they actually play more of a role like in deeper down in the funnel, for example.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but they can also play a role up in the funnel uh when they need to promote a specific brand that they have.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: Then we have flight partners where they can play a role throughout the whole funnel.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but we know that it's a very important product for us at Booking.com because it's kind of an anchor product, right?
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: So, like once you book a flight, you'll also book an accommodation with us.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and then there's cars and attractions.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_02: So, what I'm trying to say is it is much more complex.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_02: You have different types of advertisers throughout uh the whole funnel, and then again, once you make that booking, yeah, you're ready to book all sorts of new type of products as well.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, point number one: more complex, totally different and very distinct, your customer journey with different types of advertisers compared to retail.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: Um, secondly, I tend to call this time-sensitive inventory.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, here you need to correct me if I say something wrong, but uh within retail media, you have an SQU and you can sell that today, uh, you can sell it tomorrow until it sols out, sells out, it's out of stock.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, in travel, you sell a room or a seat in a plane for a specific date.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: And once that date expires, the inventory is gone.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: You do not have the possibility to actually sell that inventory anymore.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_02: So you play a very interesting game between advertising on one hand, um, with yield, secondly, and then also uh uh with pricing.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: So those three things all come together in terms of like different type of inventory compared to retail, and then as well, there's this additional complexity that comes on top where a hotel has occupancy uh as well, and they need to optimize towards that occupancy.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_02: So the inventory is vastly different uh in that sense compared to compared to retail.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_02: Um, then the third element, uh, which is the advertiser base and predominantly the fragmentation that lives in that advertiser base.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, we've seen quite a few advertisers uh on stage today as well talking about retail and how they work with like some of the retail media networks.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_02: We obviously have accommodation as our you know a bread and butter, like in in Booking.com.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: And in order to unlock full partnerships with uh an accommodation partner, a big hotel chain, it is um a rather complex setup.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: So think about the fact that you work with an HQ, so there's an enterprise level conversation that you're having.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_02: Then there are regional offices in into an accommodation partner and hotel chain that you need to work with as well because budgets live on HQ level, they live on regional office level, and then they also have you know the the Hilton on the corner of the street here, for example, that has a budget as well.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: And you only can unlock the full partnership if you're able to also like work with those hundreds, sometimes thousands of hotels under one hotel chain.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a very fragmented space, and in order to unlock the full potential, you're gonna have to work with hundreds, thousands of hotels to get you know all those smaller budgets all together and unlock the full uh partnership, and therefore you need a lot of like great self-service capabilities and automation to do so.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: So um that that one is the third one, and then the fourth one is kind of an open door, but it's very much when yeah, a distinct advertiser set, a broad advertiser ecosystem where we're very relevant for.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_02: So I already touched upon you know the usual endemic brands, but then again, you know, the the near and non-endemic brands where you talk about yeah, insurances, clothing, sunscreen, etc.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's very distinct to travel and very different compared to retail.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_02: So those four ones.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you're right, it is different, but it is also very similar.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_01: And that's when I'm hearing you speak, I'm like the challenges are the same, the naming is different, the way you go at it is different.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but the fundamentals are the same, right?
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's what's really interesting is if we can call a cat a cat and we can get to the depths of what's slightly the nuanced within travel, maybe we can kind of collaborate closer in this industry and be able to set uh standards in advanced conversations in a joint way.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: Because what you're saying is fantastic.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I have to go at the headquarter level, I have to go at the local level, and I have to go at the regional level.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: And yeah, uh on the retail side, you don't have to do the exact same.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of times the budget is but there is a long tail.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_01: There's a long tail, there's also national and local budget.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_01: There's, you know, another interesting example when you were saying there's a tourism board.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I was having a conversation with a retailer who, a grocery retailer, and it's like, I have to go to the avocado council and sell to them, and then I have to go to the avocado grower and sell to them.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: So there's, you know, there's a lot of things that are similar.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and it and it's interesting to bring them to life.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: But when we were having a discussion about uh travel standards, some of the key um nuances that came to board is that long journey, right?
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: That long journey changes the attribution window.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: It changes how you can talk about YouTube brand, it changes all of that.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um and would you see?
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: So the travel standards were released, which is really exciting, and they're out there for public comment.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_01: We've we collaborated with a number of players.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: Broadly, yeah, yeah.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what do you think needs to happen next to keep on advanced advancing and scaling this um vertical?
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I and you're you're totally right in that sense.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's it there's uh travel brings its own complexities, right?
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I've spoken a little bit about yeah, sometimes it takes weeks and months for it to to for you to make that booking, but then people cancel, maybe even like a couple of months after.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and once they cancel, yeah, they might uh rebook and then stay two months later again.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: And there's also a difference between then the actual booking and the actual stay.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_02: There's differences between the kind of like taxes that we include in like the return.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and I know this is one of the things that's Oh my god, this is my favorite topic.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, resort fees can get very hefty in Las Vegas and like and in the Middle Eastern, for example, and there's just with those networks popping up and not finding like common ground, yeah, they've made their own definitions, right?
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_02: And that's very similar to retail, I believe, where we now come together to define those standards indeed like and and and come together.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: And how do we think about all these different things?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: What constitutes a conversion, right?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: Like what attribution window do we use in the upper part of the funnel compared to like when we're down in the funnel, and what attribution do we use once we start to unlock more near non-andemic?
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, I think the conversation's been super timely, and it's been great to actually get all the players around the table, and that's something that yeah, was super helpful for IAB to help facilitate.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I'm excited for what's coming there.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_02: But uh, we really need to get all of that right to build trust and to really have meaningful conversations with our partners about what was the transparent outcome and what can we improve instead of okay, how did it compare to like your competitor?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because is it apples to apples or not?
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: And we're still in that stage a lot where we need to have the other conversation.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, yeah.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: So certification is becoming a big topic within retail media.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: Do you see that coming to travel?
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: 100%.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: I think there's been some initial conversations about it.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um uh obviously, like it's a big topic here, you know, like uh at the summit as well.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, we're keen to start to engage on that topic as well.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's clear, and somebody also like needs to start joining these.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and it's a natural next step for our industry as well.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: Three years from now, yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_01: What would you need to see changing for the industry to keep growing?
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, three years is long.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe we make it to one year and make it a little bit more ambitious.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, fantastic.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: One year, one year.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: So my personal ambition, uh, retail becomes commerce media.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: Uh so uh I'm just a flip-flop at the IEB.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: We call it commerce, then we call it retail, then we call it commerce.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'm the only non-retail person, so but I mean it's my personal wish.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: But uh that that that set aside, um, a couple of things.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think within travel in general, and then I'm also looking internally like at booking, I think it's important that we build more sophisticated media capabilities.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: And by that I don't mean just more plain like banners, like that that's not what success looks like.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_02: We really need to add you know to the customer journey and we need to have a conversation with them, and we need to be able to inspire them and create uh create incremental demand for a destination or an accommodation, and that's by creating much more meaningful experience than just a plane banner or a landing page, so to say.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: So that's really important.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: I think in a year from now, we really need to be able to unlock more near non-endemic.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's a common theme here, also like within retail media.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: But I've I've I've had the privilege myself to work five years in our marketing department in booking.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: And if there's one thing that I've learned, travel audiences are scarce.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's a lot of people claim they have it, but they're actually not in market, and we have the ability to really like drive that agenda, and we have that audience, they're high-intent audience, and we can actually help improve the overall, you know, like targeting and capabilities in the industry by by helping our near and non-endemic brands.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: And and then the last one, well, I mean, let's let's make two more, and then the last one is about like the standards, obviously.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like in a year from now, we need to be in a place where we're really like coming more together with like the big travel players.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then the last thing is something that we've also discussed, but it's yeah, creativity.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_02: I really think we can play a much bigger role in like together with destinations to drive content, co-branded like efforts, like with tourism boards.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: There's so much nice footage to shoot, to inspire people with.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and we haven't got that exactly right yet.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: So that's something that I'm very much looking forward to in the year to come.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: So, four things if I hear you right.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, first of all, let's make this retail commerce.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: Second, standards, standards, standards.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's what we do at the IAB, and we're gonna keep on pushing together as an industry.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: Fantastic.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: Third, creativity, and that's been a big, big topic for everyone, and that's super important.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: And the fourth was I would near a non-endemic, and we can group that together with immediate capabilities.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: And you know what?
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_01: Near a non-endemic, thank you for that plug.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: Fantastic plug because this is something we just released in parallel with the travel standards.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_01: We would love for the industry to collaborate further on it.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: It is very retail focused, but hopefully we can make it commerce focused.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's a big topic of growth for everyone.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and like you said, audiences are scarce, whether they're on travel or they're, you know, a specific audience was in CE, etc.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_01: People claim to have them, but audiences that are really based on first-party shopper data are scarce.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: And being able to target them and make a unique difference as a near or non-endemic, and those are big words that only mean you don't sell that product yourself.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um would be I think changing for the industry for everyone to collaborate on that.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, with that, any final words?
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it's very refreshing to be here and to see a different side, you know, like of like the day-to-day that we have.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: So uh honestly, like thank you for organizing like this this this summit, the Retail Media Summit, and and bringing together a broader conversation beyond just only retail.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, and hopefully, like we can introduce more of like our travel counterparts or other parts of like the commerce media industry moving moving forward.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: But uh it's a pleasure.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you for having us.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Bran.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_01: This was great.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: And on we go to the rest of the day.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: There you go.