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Mastering Team Building in the Mortgage Industry · Mortgage Marketing Radio

• 0:00
  Hello, my friend. This is Jeff Zimfer. Welcome back to another episode of the Mortgage Marketing
• 0:03
  Radio podcast. Before we get into this week's special guest, I have another win-of-the-week
• 0:08
  success story coming to you from one of our members' advising classes in this world where
• 0:12
  we are trying to scale our reach, get in front of more realtors at scale without chasing
• 0:18
  coal-calling paying for leads. How do you do that? You do it with a one-to-one approach, leading
• 0:22
  with education classes and workshops and events that put you at the front and center that
• 0:28
  build your agent attraction machine so you don't have to chase. And agents are drawn to you because
• 0:33
  of the value you're bringing them. Shout out to Wesley Terrell, who just recently did our AI
• 0:37
  workshop at a real estate board. So, Wesley is doing a great job in building his personal brand,
• 0:41
  his local market, and he's getting invited by their local real estate boards to come teach classes
• 0:46
  to real estate agents and get this. They're promoting the class for him. He shows up. He follows
• 0:51
  our proven system, our trainer approach to be able to be the messenger and share valuable content
• 0:56
  agents take and implement their business. But most importantly, he's building a platform that
• 1:02
  puts him in front of one to many large groups of agents at a time so he can apply the law of leverage
• 1:08
  and multiply his results and therefore get more conversations and get more relationships and
• 1:14
  referrals. And that's what we do in my class. So, shout out to Wesley. He just had 18 agents
• 1:19
  attend the AI on fair advantage. And Wesley goes on to say they were engaged. They asked lots of
• 1:25
  questions and it was a trial run for the new real estate board. So, here's what they said afterwards.
• 1:30
  Let's schedule some more classes. But they love the class. They love the content. And now,
• 1:37
  what's a Wesley's job? It's to get in front of these agents and do the follow-up to make the calls,
• 1:41
  to have the conversations, to ask the question about, hey, would you like some help implementing the
• 1:46
  ideas from today's class in your business? And now you have a reason. Now you have a purpose-driven
• 1:52
  platform that separates you from the rest that shifts the call dynamics from not about products
• 1:58
  in place at the beginning to, how do I help you in your business? So, if you'd like to learn more
• 2:03
  about what we do, I want you to check the link in the show notes. Our platform is called my
• 2:07
  agent classes. You can also go to go.myaginclasses.com. Check that out. Or the links in the show notes
• 2:14
  very simple. It needs to just tap on it. There's a brief video there that gives you an overview of
• 2:18
  what the platform is. And it also shares with you some other success stories from people who have
• 2:23
  been doing this for some time. So go ahead and check that out in the show notes. And now onto our
• 2:28
  special guest. Question for you. Are you stuck doing it all in your mortgage business? You
• 2:34
  do in the marketing, the originating, the processing, and you're wondering if you're burning out before
• 2:38
  you ever reach that next level that you know is there for you? It's common, right? Chasing deals
• 2:44
  into your pipelines full and then drowning in files. Well, new business activities dry up. But hey,
• 2:48
  what if growth, what if your next level of growth wasn't about more hustler grind, but it was
• 2:53
  actually hiring the right help at the right time? Welcome to the mortgage marketing radio podcast,
• 2:57
  where we help mortgage professionals get more clients, close more loans and grow their business.
• 3:01
  My name is Jeff Zinfer. Today on the show, we're tackling the question, how do you know when it's
• 3:05
  time to hire and how do you avoid hiring the wrong person? And to help us answer that, we're joined
• 3:10
  by Irene Dufert, she's a veteran originator and longtime coach who's worked with thousands of
• 3:16
  loan officers, team leads and branch managers on exactly this topic. So in this episode,
• 3:21
  we're going to talk about three primary things. Number one, how to know when it's time to make your
• 3:26
  first hire. Number two, how to leverage the disc profile. And what are the exact disc profile
• 3:32
  traits that make or break your next team member? And why most hiring failures start with you?
• 3:40
  Not the person you're hiring. We're also revealed the one mistake that keeps the loan officers
• 3:43
  stuck in a cycle of overwork and missed opportunities plus how to break free from that grind for good.
• 3:50
  So if you're ready to scale your mortgage business without sacrificing your sanity and stick
• 3:53
  around for this episode of mortgage marketing radio.
• 4:07
  Irene, welcome to the show. Thank you, Jeff. I'm glad to be here.
• 4:11
  Good to connect. You have been around for quite a while in this space and I've kind of watched from
• 4:16
  afar some of what you do. And so I wanted to have a conversation today because I think
• 4:22
  you bring a unique perspective and viewpoint to this industry, particularly when it comes to
• 4:30
  growing a team, managing a team. How do you know when you should hire? Because you've been helping
• 4:34
  people do that for quite a while. Yeah. Long time. I did it as an originator and I also did it as
• 4:40
  a coach for the last 14. How many people would you say roughly, whether it's group or one-on-one,
• 4:47
  loan officers, team leads, branch managers, how many people have you in your career you think
• 4:52
  interacted with at some level with a conversation that was coaching oriented? I would say at least
• 4:59
  a thousand. At least a thousand. So you've probably seen some patterns, things that people repeat
• 5:05
  clues if you will. So you've got a captive audience of loan officers at various levels. Some people
• 5:13
  have, you know, L.O.A.'s and various team members and some people don't. Some people are just,
• 5:17
  you know, the one or one person shop. But how do you know? Like, what would you see that the common
• 5:25
  pitfalls or mistakes that are repeated from somebody who doesn't have a team yet? Let's just say that
• 5:32
  and they're trying to do it all. The biggest thing is trying to do it all themselves and they're
• 5:37
  working 50, 60, 80 hours a week depending on how many loans are closing and it's that inevitable
• 5:44
  cycle. They go, they go get business, the business comes in, they stop going to get business and then
• 5:51
  they take care of the loans and then they have a dry pipeline again or a lower pipeline. I should
• 5:56
  say not all of them get a dry pipeline, but it can dry up pretty quick if you're not doing the
• 6:01
  activities that got you there. Okay. Okay. Do you think people put off hiring help
• 6:07
  longer than they should? Yeah. I do. And you know why I think that? Because I think they're afraid
• 6:13
  to put the money out and they think, oh, man, I have to pay all this money in an annual salary.
• 6:19
  But what happens is they don't actually have to put a whole amount of money in an annual salary.
• 6:25
  They're going to hire someone and they might be out a month or two at the beginning. But then
• 6:30
  if that person is the right person that they hire, that person actually ends up bringing more
• 6:35
  business, making them bring more business in because they're taking care of things that they
• 6:39
  were taking care of before. And so now they have more freedom to go out and get more loans coming
• 6:44
  in the door and bring more clients than that they can help because that person is helping them now.
• 6:50
  So where would you recommend in terms of units that somebody start to get really serious about
• 6:57
  bringing in help? I think it depends on the type of loans they do and it depends on their market
• 7:03
  and their efficiency. If they're able to still go out and get loans while they're doing that,
• 7:08
  great. But usually I see it right around five loans a month somewhere around there. They need
• 7:13
  to start really looking for someone because at five, they're pretty busy. They're doing it all
• 7:19
  and all the way up to processing and some of them even process their own loans. And so it's a lot
• 7:24
  to do and still go out and get business. Plus they're running their own business as well, the business
• 7:29
  the business end of it even. What's the first role in this may vary, but generally what's the first
• 7:34
  role I should hire for? A loan partner. And the reason the loan partner is because they need to be
• 7:41
  somebody that they can rely on that they can trust that will take care of things when they're
• 7:46
  out getting business and when they're out meeting with different people agents and people that can
• 7:50
  bring business in. What would describe to me what a loan partner does then? So there's
• 7:56
  several different models that they could do, but they could take the first call. They could
• 8:01
  make an appointment for the loan officer. Then the loan officer has a loan consultation with them
• 8:05
  and they can do everything else in the background. They can run the credit, get it all prepped,
• 8:09
  have the loan officer do the consultation, convert the buyer to say yes, I want to work with you
• 8:14
  and then take it from there as soon as the buyer is converted and they're going to work with them,
• 8:19
  then they get they'll finish up the loan application, all of the they get all the documentation,
• 8:24
  everything that is done from that point all the way to a contract. When the contract comes in,
• 8:30
  of course, the loan officer can look at it, review it, make sure everything is good, and then it goes
• 8:35
  and gets prepared for the processor. So the loan partner can do all of that.
• 8:41
  I know you and I have talked on our previous call about different profiling tools to identify the
• 8:47
  right person in the seat and you have definitely seen the stories and I've definitely talked to
• 8:52
  loan officers over the years about the people that they go through and how many times the first
• 8:59
  hire was the wrong hire. So how do we help avoid the wrong hire? There's a couple ways. There's
• 9:06
  a lot of questions that need to be asked. When you're setting up the ad that you want to put out there,
• 9:10
  it has to be the right ad that's going to attract the kind of people that you're looking for,
• 9:14
  and then when you interview them, you need to have a list of questions that you're going to ask
• 9:18
  them that have to do with what exactly you're looking for as a loan officer because if they don't have
• 9:23
  the right vibe, if they're not talking to clients the way you do, if they don't have the experience,
• 9:28
  they're not going to do you much good. Always suggest that people find someone that already has
• 9:32
  experience so that they can just come in, figure out, you know, you guys can decide, figure out how
• 9:38
  you want your team to work, what exactly you want them to do, and then they know exactly what to do,
• 9:44
  but they have experience. Yeah, there's a lot to unpack right here. My mind has got a few different
• 9:50
  questions. First of all, how do I know the right questions to ask? Well, you ask the questions about
• 9:56
  the type of person you're looking for. You ask questions about the experience that they have,
• 10:00
  go through scenarios with them, see if they really know what they're doing because they can say
• 10:06
  they know what they're doing, but if you test them on it, then it's going to be a much better fit
• 10:12
  for you. Yeah, often I've heard that, and I've probably been guilty of this myself, is when
• 10:17
  hiring somebody to perform a task, you don't have a very clearly defined process or method of operation,
• 10:23
  and that oftentimes is leads to being frustrated with the hire, but usually it comes back on you,
• 10:30
  the hiring person. I agree. 100%. I've done it myself. We've all done it right at some point in our
• 10:36
  careers, but what I've learned is that the first thing, that's what I should have said the first
• 10:41
  thing was when you asked me, because the first thing is clearly defining what you want that person to do
• 10:45
  before you even do an ad. You have to know exactly what you're looking for in that person, because
• 10:51
  they may be good at some things and not good at others, and so you want to make sure they're good at
• 10:54
  the things that you need them to be good at. So that's the first thing. Yeah, so you said experience,
• 10:59
  make sure they're good at what you need them to be good at, which comes back to experience,
• 11:02
  and then running them through some questions or scenarios. So I'm thinking, would you have them do
• 11:08
  like some test mock loan structure and setup, or like how would we test for, you know, understanding?
• 11:15
  Absolutely. I would have them do a mock setup of a loan scenario. What I used to do before I,
• 11:22
  you know, before I, when I was originating, before I became a coach or anything, and I did it for
• 11:26
  my own team, is I had a file back in those days, they were actually paper files. I had a paper file
• 11:32
  that had everything crossed out of it, and they had to do a test to see if they were good at it.
• 11:37
  And I remember I had this big old thick file, it was like an FHA file with the
• 11:43
  C in child support and all this stuff, and I had a processor who was looking for a job.
• 11:48
  In this case, it was a processor, and she came in from Las Vegas, and she came in and said,
• 11:52
  I'm looking for a job. I know you're not hiring, but I know what I'm doing. I can do a great job for
• 11:57
  you. So I said, okay, let me, you know, she was really looking, and she had just come into town. So she
• 12:03
  gave her this file, and I said, here, I'm putting this loan together. Can you put it together for me?
• 12:08
  She sat at my desk. I was right there, and she put the whole thing together in less than an hour,
• 12:12
  and it was this thick. And I said, you're hired. He was the best processor I ever had.
• 12:19
  Wow. That's great. She clearly knew her role. Yes.
• 12:23
  Hmm. One other thing should people do in preparing to identify the right person to minimize
• 12:31
  pain in the hiring process? Yes. So clearly defining the job position, making an ad that's
• 12:38
  attractive to the right person, meaning if you're looking for somebody that you don't want them to
• 12:43
  be, that you want them licensed, but you don't need them to know loans. I mean, to go out and be a
• 12:47
  loan officer, there's a certain types of ads that you can do. And I'm happy to share with people
• 12:53
  if they want to reach out to me, but there's certain types of ads that you can do that will attract
• 12:57
  the right person. And then talking to them, having the conversation with them, letting them know
• 13:04
  what you're looking for, asking them questions. You know, the best people ask questions, the best
• 13:09
  people in any possession, in any profession, they ask a lot of questions and they find out about
• 13:14
  people. Instead of just letting the hire talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, you ask them questions and
• 13:20
  then really listen for the answers and see if they're a good match for you. I would make a list
• 13:26
  of everything that's important to you as a loan officer. What do you want your loan partner to do,
• 13:31
  your loan assistant, and what's important to you that might not be important to somebody else?
• 13:36
  Are you fast paced? Are you slow paced? Are you do you want somebody that's really going to take
• 13:41
  a look at the file and earn the loan and really give it their all and really go through with
• 13:46
  a fine-toothed comb? Are you looking for somebody that's more quick paced? Everybody's different, Jeff,
• 13:51
  that's the thing. What they're looking for. Right, what's a loan officer's looking for is different.
• 13:56
  Yes. If I'm correct, you're a believer in the disc profile? Yes, I am. I'm certified in the
• 14:02
  disc profile and it really helps. It's only part of the equation. It's not everything.
• 14:07
  Well, a previous company I used to work at, they used the disc profile a ton in coaching and helping
• 14:15
  their loan officers identify the right role for these L.O.A.'s and other roles. Yes.
• 14:20
  And they had them take an assessment, a disc profile. I had a time. Would you recommend that?
• 14:24
  Absolutely. I do that every time and I've helped hundreds and hundreds of loan officers go through
• 14:29
  disc profiles. Probably thousands of disc profiles over the years because they were looking for
• 14:34
  people and I would help them when I was coaching them find the right person and I would help them
• 14:38
  by looking through the disc profile and it was so easy to use that as a tool.
• 14:43
  Yeah, let's break that down a little bit because I remember the person that I was working with,
• 14:47
  they were pretty adamant about if the person ranked in these certain categories such as,
• 14:52
  so it's the disc. It's the driver, right? The high, what's the eye again? The eye is the interact.
• 14:58
  Interactive. So the real people, person loves to talk, social, and then the S is like
• 15:02
  steady and then C is like consistent, right? Or conscientious. I forget what they are exactly.
• 15:07
  But I remember one of the red flags, if you will, and the colors, of course, the eye was yellow,
• 15:12
  the DD is red, etc. If the person applying for a loan processor was a high eye, that was a red flag.
• 15:21
  Yeah. There'd be on the phone all the time and real friendly and all that kind of stuff.
• 15:25
  I'm not going to get their word.
• 15:26
  Real chatty. Wanted to make friends and go hang out at the water cooler.
• 15:33
  Yeah. So what do you think are some of the, if we're talking about a loan partner,
• 15:37
  where they're, give me the quick hit loan partner. How would you identify their job primarily?
• 15:42
  Their job or their disc profile? Okay. No, their job first and then we'll break down
• 15:47
  disc profile. Yeah. So a loan partner would be, they could start at the beginning or they could
• 15:51
  take it as soon as the, the loan officer has spoken to the client and then they take it from
• 15:57
  there and they take it completely off of the loan officer. Their job is to make sure it closes.
• 16:03
  Absolutely. Their job is to make sure that that client is taking care of beautifully throughout
• 16:07
  the whole process that they feel wanted and cared for and they get the loan done efficiently.
• 16:12
  Okay. So that the loan officer doesn't have to worry about it. So a loan partner does interact
• 16:18
  with clients and partners. Yes. So we do want some degree of people skills. Yes, we do.
• 16:25
  So we want some level of an I. Yes. Absolutely. We also want some level of a D, right?
• 16:31
  Somebody who can be task oriented and get the job done. Yes. Somewhere not too high, probably a
• 16:37
  25, 30 somewhere max out of 100 out of 100. Okay. Yeah. So the lower end of a D, but not so low
• 16:46
  that they won't get stuff done and they can't make up their mind about stuff because it's the
• 16:50
  driver mentality. So you don't want it so high that they want to be the boss, but you want it be,
• 16:56
  you want them to be a supportive driver, but a driver. And you want them to ruffle feathers
• 17:01
  and piss a bunch of people off your underwriter and others, right? I don't know about that.
• 17:07
  What I do want is for them to take care, good, great care of the clients and make sure that the
• 17:13
  underwriter and the processor, they're following up with them as well.
• 17:18
  Talk to the underwriter. So how would, so how would somebody know then? Let's continue that
• 17:23
  thread of the L of a loan partner, a L.O.A. Same thing, right? Long officer. Yes. They're interactive.
• 17:29
  Yeah. Yeah. Using the disk profile or what qualities or traits have you seen be best
• 17:37
  and you can do some ranking or whatever, you know what I mean? But just like how do you know
• 17:40
  when you when you've got a good loan partner personality wise? By looking at the personality test
• 17:46
  at the disk test. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm certified in three areas of the disk test, not just the DISC,
• 17:53
  but also the values and the motivators. So all three of them. And I never I don't like looking at a
• 17:59
  disk with just the DISC because that doesn't tell the whole picture, but motivators, what motivates
• 18:04
  them and also what kind of interactive skills do they have. And so if I'm looking at just the DISC
• 18:12
  just to make it simple, the D for a loan partner that that talks to clients and everything would be
• 18:18
  anywhere around 30 or less of a D, but not below probably between 30 and 40 somewhere around
• 18:24
  there. And then and this is the very general generalization, but the I needs to be above 50, but not
• 18:32
  past probably 65 or 70 because otherwise they're going to be chatty on the phone all the time.
• 18:37
  They're the life of the party. And so you want them to be friendly, but not overly friendly where
• 18:42
  they're constantly on the phone. Like a loan officer is usually a high eye. Yes. Yes. And then in S,
• 18:48
  on the steady, we want them up past 70 somewhere between 70 and 80 somewhere around there because they
• 18:54
  really want security. Want a they don't want to go out and get business. They don't want to be on
• 19:00
  the commission only. They want to have that security and steadiness. And they can calm people down.
• 19:06
  And you want someone like that on your team for the S. And then the C for a loan partner, I don't like
• 19:13
  to see a C higher than a 60 or 65 somewhere at the max. And the reason for that is because they will
• 19:20
  take forever to get anything done. They won't release the file to the processor because they're
• 19:25
  looking for perfection if it's too high. Really? So is it about perfection more than control or
• 19:31
  both? It's it's about perfection. Just they're they're concerned that they want to make sure that
• 19:37
  they're conscientious of perfect. That's right. Yes. You know, it's going to be really good.
• 19:41
  Yes. So and they can be overly focused on accuracy, slowing the file down. Yes.
• 19:48
  Even though you have to be accurate, right? I mean, it's an important part of the job. But some
• 19:53
  people are just too afraid also when they make errors, right? And then when you have to coach them
• 19:59
  on the errors and they just, you know, just friggin shrink. Yes. Yeah. You don't want them to be
• 20:05
  afraid to release the loan to the processor. The processor is the second set of eyes in my opinion.
• 20:10
  They're the ones that have to double check what the loan partner did anyway. So it's okay to release it.
• 20:15
  But the processor will let them know if there's something they could have done differently. Then
• 20:20
  they'll let them know and then they can do it that way next time. But they've got to release that
• 20:23
  loan. Otherwise, it sits on their desk basically and doesn't get to the processor in time and that's
• 20:28
  what holds things up. Okay. All right. So that's for an L.O.A. That was good. I'm kind of putting
• 20:33
  you on the spot here. So I appreciate this a lot. Let's say for processor, right? That's kind of
• 20:39
  a different profile. So again, putting you on the spot, but to what degree could you assign some
• 20:45
  profiling around the disk profile for a processor? Yeah. And so for the disk profile,
• 20:51
  it needs the red, which is the D. The D. It needs to be at least 40, 50, 60 somewhere in there
• 20:59
  because they're going to take control. Some processors have a really high D. And those are the
• 21:04
  processors that have a high D and a high C. Those are the ones that can be kind of nasty. They're
• 21:10
  like, get on it now. And they're not nice to people sometimes. And so that's not a good combination
• 21:16
  for processor. But kind of a high D somewhere in the 70, 80, D, but they can't try to take over
• 21:25
  from the loan officer. That's where you have to be really careful. This is where the other parts
• 21:30
  of the disk profile come in, the values and how they interact with people. That's why I don't like
• 21:38
  just using the DISC. But if we had to, that's where I would put them on the D. Yeah, I realize,
• 21:44
  again, this is very off the cuff in one dimensional. There are deeper aspects of the disk profile,
• 21:49
  which I agree. I remember going through those when I was going through some similar training.
• 21:53
  Those were actually much more revealing because like you said earlier, it's about what motivates them.
• 21:57
  Yes. And what their values are, how they do things and how they care about people and that type of
• 22:02
  thing. Hey, are you tired of cold calling realtors and feeling like you're getting nowhere with my
• 22:06
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• 22:11
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• 22:21
  community of loan officers sharing exactly what's working right now. Here's a quick win from one of
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  our members. I joined it because I was tired of doing business the way that regular loan officers
• 22:32
  have been doing it in my market, which is just making the core calls every Monday and Friday,
• 22:37
  checking with real estate agents. I had done that for years and it seemed like everybody was doing
• 22:41
  that. I need something different. And I wanted to find a way that I could work with the agents that
• 22:46
  I want to work with. I wanted to find a way that I could have a captive audience every month,
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  every couple of weeks, where I could find agents that were like-minded and that wanted to work with
• 22:55
  me as well. So it's probably brought in. I'm just guessing here, but it's probably brought on in
• 23:00
  the three years I've been back with the program. It's probably brought on. I'd probably say about
• 23:05
  $40 million in volume since then, right? And it's led us some massive relationships. I wouldn't
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• 23:27
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• 23:32
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• 23:37
  in the show notes now back to our show. Yeah. All right. So we got the D for a processor should be
• 23:42
  higher. I give me a quick, quick hit on that. I don't think it needs to be. It depending on whether
• 23:47
  they're talking to clients or not. If they're talking to clients, it should be like a 50. If they're
• 23:51
  not talking to clients, it could be very low. It could be 25, 30 somewhere around there. It's kind
• 23:57
  of in the middle for processors. And then the S needs to be pretty high like 1670 because they want
• 24:08
  security as well. They're not looking to go out and get business or anything like that. And we want
• 24:13
  to make sure that they're steadfast. That they're steady. That they can be counted upon. And then the C
• 24:18
  for them should be I would say somewhere between 50 and 75 see most processors will be in the 90s.
• 24:29
  I've noticed that. They'll be in the 90s. But they also take a long time to get things done.
• 24:34
  So that's why I always say as a as a loan partner, you don't want a really high C because it will
• 24:39
  take forever. But as a processor, I've seen them high in the 90s. And as long as they've got the
• 24:46
  rest of their work stuff together and they're organized, they can still take more time by having
• 24:53
  a high C on that loan and make sure it gets in right. Yeah, as long as it's meeting the timelines.
• 24:59
  Yes. Yeah. So and to your point about a C being upwards of 90% and that's because they're
• 25:05
  heavy on compliance. It tend to be a little bit more analytical, which I guess is a good thing when
• 25:10
  it comes to processing. Yes. Yeah. For processors, you want the C to be higher. For loan
• 25:16
  partners, not as high because the processor is the one that's going to take it, take the final
• 25:21
  thing into the underwriter, the final loan. All right. Let's, if we can, can we touch on motivations
• 25:26
  for a second? What motivates people based on? And again, this is all based on hiring.
• 25:30
  We know a loan officer typically is motivated by money. That's one of the things or competition.
• 25:35
  I wish I had my book. I'm looking over here. My three ring binder. I'd whip that thing out.
• 25:39
  It's been a couple of years. What's normally here is all packed up because I'm moving.
• 25:43
  I totally, right. And we should have should have let each other know I'm going to grill you on
• 25:46
  the disc profile. When it comes to, so I'm thinking about the loan partner L O A.
• 25:58
  We want them to, depending on how you pay them, right? I assume that if an L O A,
• 26:02
  you would, there'd be some kind of a bonus structure for them to motivate them.
• 26:06
  There can be. Yes. Yes. There should be a salary plus bonus.
• 26:11
  Not everybody agrees that a bonus should be paid, but I think it helps motivate them to do
• 26:16
  really well and to get get it in by the deadlines. Well, all right. Let's just say it's not money.
• 26:21
  There's other ways to acknowledge them or fulfill that values. Yes. One of my favorite things is
• 26:26
  just random bonuses. Even if you do give them a bonus, let's say they're doing a great job and
• 26:30
  you want to do something special for them. Something that matters to them. Find out something.
• 26:35
  I've heard of a loan officer that found out that their loan partner wanted to go to this
• 26:40
  concert, but really couldn't afford to go. So he not only got the concert tickets for her and
• 26:45
  her husband, but he also gave her half a day off. And it was a little bit of ways from their house,
• 26:51
  gave her half a day off and got a hotel room for them so that they could have an evening out to
• 26:55
  themselves. That girl will never leave him because she is so happy with him. There's been a bunch
• 27:03
  of different things like that. Another person bought something that they saw their loan partner
• 27:07
  was looking at online and couldn't afford it or didn't want to spend the money and he went and
• 27:12
  bought it for her. Just things like that that are random that show, but you have to know what
• 27:17
  matters to the person that you're working with. It really takes paying attention.
• 27:24
  And you can find out what really matters by having them take this disc and values
• 27:29
  the husband, right? Yes. The other thing that's important besides the disc, Jeff, and I know we
• 27:34
  hadn't talked about this before, but the languages of appreciation in the workplace.
• 27:39
  There's a book called Five Love Languages by Gary Chapman. Anybody who's married,
• 27:43
  probably heard of that one. Yes, for sure. I remember, boy, that opened my eyes. I think I read that
• 27:48
  in like 25 years after I was married. It was really great. It really did open my eyes about a lot
• 27:53
  of things that I really never put two and two together of why your spouse acts a certain way or
• 27:58
  wants us, you know, needs certain things in their lives of appreciation. But anyway, he also wrote
• 28:03
  it for languages in the workplace. And so I recommend that every loan officer take that assessment,
• 28:10
  have their team take the assessment. So when we do wow training, we give them the assessment to take
• 28:17
  and then we tell their loan officer, we give it to their loan officer so that they know what their
• 28:20
  language of appreciation is because sometimes we're talking in our own language and that person is
• 28:26
  not speaking the same language. And so if we know what motivation, talking about motivation,
• 28:31
  that's why I brought this up is if we know what motivates them, sometimes you give a bonus and
• 28:38
  sure money's great, but it would have meant more if you'd written them a really nice note or
• 28:44
  sent them a text or talked about how great they're doing in front of everybody else because that's
• 28:49
  the language that they speak. So there is different languages that they could speak and that's one of them.
• 28:54
  So it's not always money. No recognition, acknowledge me.
• 29:00
  Yes, time. It's another one. Yeah, acts of service.
• 29:07
  Yeah, it's so funny. Think about the disc profile. This is instructive. It was very revealing to me
• 29:14
  and you know, I'm 25 years married now. My wife and I, you know, thank you. We've had a few
• 29:21
  conversations about this, but one of the, I remember there was this time where when last I took the
• 29:26
  disc profile, I was high on the D in the I and I think the I was just a bit higher than the D and
• 29:31
  what my wife didn't understand was before she was aware of the disc profiles, like when I was in
• 29:36
  task mode, it was like get the hell out of my way, you know, and it wasn't and but as you know,
• 29:45
  people on the outside perceive that to be is, oh, he's being a real tool or geez, why do you have to
• 29:49
  be so blah, blah, whatever. And what they don't understand is like, no, the D, the high D has a
• 29:54
  task and come hell or high water. They want to complete that task. Yes. And they don't see that how
• 30:00
  their behavior, which their entire look is like, I'm just completing this task. I'm not trying to
• 30:06
  upset you or be a jerk. And they don't recognize that that's how their style and communication is
• 30:11
  coming off. Yes, that's driven. They're driven and they're going to get it done no matter what.
• 30:16
  Yeah. And so what you can learn as a result of that, both you and the other end of that is like,
• 30:20
  oh, he's not purposely trying to be a jerk and and and and trigger me and all that kind of stuff.
• 30:28
  He's just in his high D mode. And now when there's that understanding, I'm not saying you should
• 30:33
  live there. I'm saying you should also develop skills to be able to adjust your communication style
• 30:38
  because that's that's true mastery, right? Is when people can adjust their communication to better
• 30:43
  map to the person they're interacting with. Yes. That's the key. Yeah. And that's where that
• 30:49
  self self awareness comes in is when you start to realize that's why I act like that when I'm in
• 30:54
  this situation, you know, you know, it's interesting when people read their dis profile. I always say
• 30:58
  because the one that I give is like 60 pages, 70 pages, something like that. And I always tell
• 31:03
  loan officers it's a book about the person. So if you if you're doing it for your team, it's like
• 31:09
  they've written a book about them. And so have them read it first. See if they agree with it.
• 31:14
  Most of the time they do agree with it. There are maybe a few little things that they may not
• 31:18
  agree with because they're not self aware in some cases, but it really tells all about them.
• 31:24
  And it's amazing. If you look at that and read it, especially if you only have one loan partner
• 31:29
  and it's just you and that loan partner, you really should get to know who they are and become more
• 31:34
  aware of what's important to them and what motivates them by reading their dis profile.
• 31:39
  Yeah. And whoever's listening to this, you should take your own disc profile if you haven't.
• 31:43
  And it's if it's been a while, like a few years, you should you should consider updating it.
• 31:48
  Yes. Do you believe also, you know, how these personality traits, I've heard it said that these
• 31:53
  are relatively set personality traits. Do you believe that? Did you think that over time,
• 31:59
  people's traits can change? I think that they're somewhere set, but I think we can learn to manage
• 32:06
  according to who we're talking to. And I think that's why there is a primary. And there's one
• 32:11
  that there's two. There is one number that is your primary. And there's another number that when
• 32:16
  you're under the gun, when people are looking at you and watching you, you can adjust it higher
• 32:22
  low, depending if some people, if you look at them, they don't adjust at all. They're just pretty
• 32:27
  stubborn. They're going to do what they do. But some other people can really adjust between what's
• 32:33
  natural for them and what's adaptive. Yes. Very situational. Yes. And so it's a skill, I think.
• 32:42
  Yeah, it is a skill. And again, it's self awareness and it's understanding it's all about
• 32:46
  effective communication. And so back to my wife example, like I could continue to say, well, that's
• 32:51
  just how I am. I'm trying to get the job done, right? Well, that's not very empowering for her,
• 32:55
  is it? So I'm the one who needs to learn to adjust a little bit. Yes. Or communicate about it and
• 33:01
  say, I'm in tact mode right now. Right. Which is actually what I started saying to her. I'm like,
• 33:06
  honey, I'm not trying to be. I've done the same thing with my husband. Him and I both have taken
• 33:12
  turns doing that. Yeah. But it's cool too, because that can really minimize a lot of arguments and
• 33:17
  hurts. Yes, it really can. And having like a little trigger with the person that you're interacting
• 33:23
  with, whether it's your spouse or someone you work with, having a trigger word that you can say,
• 33:28
  just like saying, I'm in task mode right now. I don't mean to sound harsh, but I'm in task mode
• 33:33
  right now. Or you can even say it before you get to that point, I'm going into task mode now.
• 33:39
  And then they will know that either to leave you alone and let you get it done, which is what
• 33:44
  probably what should happen. But my husband and I do that sometimes I'll I'll say something or
• 33:49
  he'll say something when we're in the middle of something else, you know, like I'll interrupt him
• 33:54
  when he's reading something or something like that. And then he'll he'll just he won't answer
• 33:58
  me the nicest way possible, you know, the perfect way. And I'll and I'll realize that that's what it
• 34:04
  is. But he'll also tell me, I'm sorry, I'm just in the middle of this right now. Let me finish it.
• 34:08
  And then I'll you know, I'll answer what you're what you asked me. Yeah. So we become aware over the
• 34:14
  years. We've been married 45 years. So we have a lot of practice. Yeah. Two crunos to you.
• 34:23
  Thanks. It's pretty fun. It is. I just happened to I was digging deep here into my files. I was
• 34:29
  able to open up some a loan officer's a disc profile from back in the day. When was this 2018 that I
• 34:35
  did this one? I'm looking at this loan officer who was a good producer. But I want to we'll move on
• 34:40
  in a second. But I love the fact that the dimensions of value and motivation because this is for you
• 34:45
  listening or for who whom you might hire. We talked about are they money driven or whatever.
• 34:50
  There's these other categories, which I am now cheating because I haven't opened in front of me.
• 34:54
  But it's, you know, are they individualistic? Are they more regulatory? Are they aesthetic? And those
• 34:59
  may sound, you know, like very vague. But when you get into the disc profile and you read the
• 35:04
  definitions, like economic, just to be clear, once one thing I learned, economic isn't just about
• 35:08
  money. It could be about competition or bottom line oriented. Exactly. Too many people think
• 35:14
  that's just about money and everybody loves money. But that may not be their primary motivation.
• 35:20
  Yeah. And then there's this other one, which is high regulatory. Uh-huh. You have a strong
• 35:24
  preference for following established systems or creating them if not as. So if you're all about
• 35:31
  I need systems, have somebody take the disc profile and see where they rank on the regulatory scale
• 35:37
  of those values? Yes. All right. I know you have some resources you like to use for people.
• 35:43
  Did you want to share any of those when they're thinking about how do I get a disc profile?
• 35:48
  Yeah. So as far as a disc profile, you can go to the Tony Robbins site to get a
• 35:51
  dis profile. There's some other, there's a bunch of them. You just look it up and you can
• 35:56
  purchase a disc profile. I think the one with Tony Robbins is free. But you can just go Tony Robbins
• 36:01
  dis profile and find it. But that's a great way to get a dis profile. The other place
• 36:06
  that and you can put it in the show notes is the assessment for the language of appreciation.
• 36:13
  That one is a really, really good one. I think it's $15 a piece. And I would get, if I was a
• 36:18
  loan officer right now, I would get one for everyone on my team. In fact, I do have one for
• 36:22
  everyone on my team, my loan training, my loan team training team so that I understand
• 36:27
  what motivates them and to speak in their language. That's, I'm going to try and find that.
• 36:32
  Does the assessment, the language of appreciation? Yes. Language of appreciation in the workplace.
• 36:38
  And so I can send you the link if you want it. Sure. The good, the good old Google or AI will
• 36:43
  find it for me. Can I see it right here? Is that also related to Gary Chapin? Yes, he wrote it.
• 36:49
  Okay. Okay. Yeah. The five love languages. Okay. Cool. Yeah. I think that's a great tool.
• 36:53
  All right. So it all starts with that self-awareness. If you're thinking about hiring,
• 36:56
  get clear on what role it is you want them to do. And then you've got to get clear on who is the
• 37:00
  right person for that role. And don't, don't sacrifice the right person just because you're in
• 37:06
  some short-term pain. That's a big one, Jeff. That is it because you'll end up being in more pain.
• 37:13
  If you get the wrong person on your team, you'll end up being in more pain. But don't let that stop
• 37:17
  you. There are ways to find out how to get the right person. And so if anyone wants to reach out to
• 37:22
  me, they can schedule a free discovery call on call with Irene.com. Okay. I'm going to make a
• 37:29
  note of that. We'll put that in the show notes as well. Call with Irene.com. Let's quickly talk
• 37:34
  about then how you help people listening either get ready to hire, how they build teams, how they
• 37:40
  grow to the next level with people. What do you want to tell us about that? Okay. So we have a
• 37:44
  couple of classes that are live virtual classes that they can send their loan partners to.
• 37:49
  While training is the big one. That's the signature class that we have. And it teaches them how
• 37:53
  to wow clients so that they never want to go anywhere else. And we talk about self-talk, we talk
• 37:59
  about teamwork, systems processes, checklist is a big one, having checklist. And also just
• 38:07
  all of the things to communicate with clients, how to communicate, how to talk to people, how to
• 38:12
  read people, how to get over call reluctance. Like if they don't want to pick up the phone to talk
• 38:18
  to people, they can get over that. I'm not talking about co-calling or anything like that. I'm talking
• 38:22
  about their normal job. A lot of people don't want to get on the phone. And so we teach them how to
• 38:27
  get over that call reluctance because a lot of people have reluctance just to pick up the phone
• 38:30
  instead of texting or emailing, how to have a sense of urgency. All of the things that the loan
• 38:35
  officers over the years have told me that their loan partners need to have or they're lacking.
• 38:40
  Those are the things that we put into it and they can go to LoneTeamTraining.com to find out
• 38:45
  more details on each of the classes that we have. Yeah, you've got three primary ones. You've got
• 38:51
  the wow training, you've got client conversion training, which is I think a must for everybody
• 38:57
  because it's all about conversions. And then the loan assistant bootcamp as well.
• 39:02
  Yes, and that one is an online course for we originally designed it for loan assistance to come
• 39:07
  in. They learn everything from A to Z in a bootcamp about how to actually do the loans. Take a
• 39:13
  talking loan application, all of that. We have that. And then recently I started helping loan
• 39:17
  officers hire people. So I have a service where I personally will walk them through the process
• 39:24
  and help them by interviewing their final candidates as well. Wait, you will interview the candidates?
• 39:29
  I will interview the candidates. Yes, not all of them. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes,
• 39:36
  but that's great. Really? How many on average should be on a final list? Three max?
• 39:44
  Three or four. I've done three or four. I've done up to four.
• 39:48
  Okay, all right. So your website once again is LoneTeamTraining.com. We'll link that up in the
• 39:54
  show notes. You can learn more about the different workshops and trainings that you guys have there.
• 39:57
  But it's pretty in depth. Yeah, we worked real hard on it and it's been helping lots of people
• 40:03
  over. We've been doing it for six years now. But I'm starting to get the word more out about it
• 40:08
  because it's really sad when you have something really good for people and you're not letting
• 40:11
  them know about it. Yeah. And so I need to let more people know about it because it's a really
• 40:16
  good thing. It's helped hundreds of people. I think we've trained over a thousand people.
• 40:20
  Wow. Congratulations. Well, it's not something that's often brought to the surface because
• 40:24
  obviously normally what we see out there is, you know, the social media, how to build a brand,
• 40:29
  do video and all that fun stuff. Yet what I think is underserved or under-promoted is what you're
• 40:35
  doing, which is inside the business versus the external, right? How does the business run,
• 40:40
  the efficiencies, the operational structure and so forth? Because like, unless you have that right,
• 40:46
  forget about generating leads because they're just going to come in and die. You know what I mean?
• 40:50
  Or get lost in the system. And if your conversion isn't right, if your operations and your
• 40:55
  processing isn't right, then that's the that is the constraint. That's where the leaky bucket is.
• 41:01
  Yes. And that's what holds loan officers back from hiring a loan partner.
• 41:06
  Is they want to make sure they're the right one? It holds them back from going out and getting more
• 41:09
  business. Yeah. And it's sad to see that happen. There's no there's no reason for it and and
• 41:16
  I'll walk them through it. That's awesome. It's a great service you offer. I appreciate you being
• 41:21
  on today's show Irene. I want everybody to do this. I want you listening. You want you to check
• 41:25
  the links in the show notes. Go to her website. Check it out. Take a dis profile or assessment profile
• 41:30
  that we've shared with you here today. And we're going to put a link to your both your LinkedIn and
• 41:34
  your Instagram. Thank you so much, Jeff. I appreciate you having me on. What I want people to do is
• 41:39
  I want them to DM you on LinkedIn or Instagram and say, Hey, what was the one big takeaway you got?
• 41:46
  And what is the one thing you applied? Whether it's the dis profile, whether it's the appreciation
• 41:50
  assessment, whatever it is, and check out her free content as well. Irene, thank you so much for
• 41:55
  being here. Thank you, Jeff. I appreciate you. I appreciate all you do for the mortgage community.
• 42:01
  It's amazing. Well, you know, this is just it's a labor of love, right? We're just here to serve.
• 42:06
  Yes. Absolutely. All right. Well, listeners, you know what to do. I already gave you the instructions.
• 42:11
  Go do it now. And if like this episode, share it with somebody else who might find value in this.
• 42:15
  And I will see you on the next one. Bye for now. See you later. Okay. That's it for today's episode.
• 42:20
  Before we wrap up, I just wanted to remind you about my agent classes, your proven system to
• 42:25
  double your agent referrals in just 90 days. Imagine never having to co call again,
• 42:30
  instead building real lasting relationships with top producing agents who want to send you business
• 42:36
  with done for you presentations, marketing automation, weekly coaching. It's all designed to make
• 42:41
  growing your business easier and fun. So if you're ready to take control of your agent referrals
• 42:46
  and grow your income, visit mortgagemarketing.pro or check the link in the show notes.
• 42:50
  And while you're there, don't forget to check out the success stories from other mortgage
• 42:54
  pros who've already seen incredible results. Thanks for listening and I'll see you on the next episode.