Latest / Health Unscripted / Ep 43. - TRT Chat With The Queen of Men's Heath, Ali Gilbert

Transcript

Ep 43. - TRT Chat With The Queen of Men's Heath, Ali Gilbert · Health Unscripted

0:09
SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to another week of Health Unscripted with Dr.
0:11
SPEAKER_01: D.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: I am Dr.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: Ashley Dwyer, and this week I have on the podcast my what do I'm what am I gonna call you?
0:18
SPEAKER_01: My friend, my health coach, my personal coach, my work wife.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: Your everything.
0:23
SPEAKER_00: I'm just your everything.
0:25
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
0:25
SPEAKER_01: And the queen of men's health, Miss Allie Gilbert.
0:29
SPEAKER_01: Yay! So excited.
0:31
SPEAKER_01: I haven't got Allie on because not only, you know, we normally work with women, like team BDN coaching works with women, but there are a lot of men who need the help and who watch my content.
0:42
SPEAKER_01: So I want to provide some for them and then also take away some of the stigmas in men's health that we always hear.
0:47
SPEAKER_01: And I'm, you know, as a former, former retired pharmacist, I have my own stigmas, which Allie has disproven.
0:53
SPEAKER_01: So I want to kind of talk about that a little.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: And then she is hosting.
0:57
SPEAKER_01: I want to get this out of the way real quick because it's gonna be huge.
1:00
SPEAKER_01: Actually, Ali, you're almost sold out, right?
1:02
SPEAKER_01: How many tickets do you have?
1:04
SPEAKER_00: Nine.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: Dude, okay.
1:06
SPEAKER_01: Nine.
1:07
SPEAKER_01: So in November, I think November 10th weekend, that weekend, right?
1:11
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
1:11
SPEAKER_01: Allie's hosting the Silverback Summit, which is a humongo, big deal for providers, coaches, everybody who like you can give it away, Allie, and talk about it.
1:22
SPEAKER_01: But out of, I think you had a hundred tickets, you have nine left.
1:24
SPEAKER_01: So if you're listening to this, I'm gonna put the link in the show notes to go check it out.
1:28
SPEAKER_01: You should come.
1:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm going.
1:30
SPEAKER_01: We're going.
1:30
SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be a blast.
1:32
SPEAKER_01: Talk about Silverback for a little bit for a second.
1:34
SPEAKER_01: Give them what it is.
1:36
SPEAKER_00: So it's literally like I call it the ultimate unfiltered men's health event because as the rest of this episode goes, I'm very unfiltered, um, quite direct.
1:46
SPEAKER_00: But also I wanted guys to have a place where they can get the truth surrounding the men's health topics that we're gonna discuss, that they always hear myths and misconceptions about.
1:55
SPEAKER_00: But I want to do it in a fun way, my way.
1:58
SPEAKER_00: So it's going to be the 9th through 11th of November in Austin at the Omni.
2:03
SPEAKER_00: And yeah, our VIP sold out, but we got nine regular tickets left.
2:08
SPEAKER_00: So we've got a mix of some formal talks, but also a lot of panel discussions and healthy debate and games and a lot of fun.
2:18
SPEAKER_00: And we've got you know, C4 energy sponsoring.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: So we're all gonna be jacked up in caffeine.
2:23
SPEAKER_00: I have a sex toy company sponsoring, so we'll have prostate massage tools, we'll have cock rings, we'll have everything that you can think of that is inappropriate to have an event, will be there.
2:35
SPEAKER_01: Yes, but that is what okay, and who who thought we'd start a podcast talking about cock rings?
2:40
SPEAKER_01: I did, knowing I was on it.
2:42
SPEAKER_01: I did.
2:42
SPEAKER_01: Um you're like, this is in my intro, actually.
2:47
SPEAKER_01: So I will say this is her second year hosting it.
2:50
SPEAKER_01: I went one day last year because it was kind of local in South Florida and was able to check it out.
2:54
SPEAKER_01: And if you've been to health conferences in the past, they can be a little boring and a little sticky with a bunch of professionals talking.
3:00
SPEAKER_01: This one is not because you do have games.
3:03
SPEAKER_01: There's literally a dildo microphone.
3:05
SPEAKER_01: Like there are, she's the boner queen.
3:08
SPEAKER_01: There are a lot of inappropriate but hilarious things that just keep it interesting and your jaw will hurt from laughing so much, but also walking away with a ton of knowledge, which I think everyone needs to hear right now, and we're gonna dive into in a second.
3:24
SPEAKER_01: But real quick, just a little backstory, and then I'm gonna have Allie.
3:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna have you give, like, you know, you've probably told your intro or your bio like numerous times by now, um, with all the speaking and public engagements that you do.
3:36
SPEAKER_01: But Allie and I connected through mutual friends, and then we hired the same business coach last year.
3:41
SPEAKER_01: So shout out to Jill Coleman, if she's listening.
3:45
SPEAKER_01: Um, we were in the same business mastermind, and that is how we met and connected.
3:49
SPEAKER_01: And then it's kind of like one of those days where you just like, oh hey, I'm Allie, I'm Ashley.
3:53
SPEAKER_01: We're both sarcastic and semi-crude.
3:55
SPEAKER_01: Now we're friends.
3:58
SPEAKER_02: That was easy.
3:59
SPEAKER_01: But that's what makes it great.
4:02
SPEAKER_01: So this year we do not have the same business coach, but we've connected.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: And then I hired Allie in June of last year, June or July, to be my own health coach, even though she predominantly works with men, because I needed someone to like yell at me and severely help me gain weight.
4:18
SPEAKER_01: I was very much, you know, I've talked about this before, but lost eight and a half pounds in a very bad relationship.
4:23
SPEAKER_01: She came through that too.
4:25
SPEAKER_01: You were in that tornado too.
4:26
SPEAKER_01: I was, yeah.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I could not gain the weight back.
4:30
SPEAKER_01: So through Allie's help and expertise and all of that, was able to put on like 15 pounds, 12 to 15 pounds, which is awesome.
4:38
SPEAKER_01: So we're still working together now.
4:40
SPEAKER_01: I told her she's never getting rid of me.
4:42
SPEAKER_01: And you know, she probably loves that, hates that.
4:44
SPEAKER_00: But I tell my coach, so probably something.
4:47
SPEAKER_01: I hope to have that same relationship with you in five years.
4:51
SPEAKER_00: You'll meet him and he'll be like, let me tell you the truth about Allie.
4:56
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I can't wait.
4:57
SPEAKER_01: That's in November.
4:58
SPEAKER_01: So see, you guys are gonna get to meet Allie's coach, and that's another thing.
5:01
SPEAKER_01: All coaches have coaches.
5:02
SPEAKER_01: I want to reiterate that on this podcast.
5:04
SPEAKER_01: But Allie, give me a brief, like you can give me a 30-second intro if you want for everyone listening, um, why you do what you do or how you got into men's health, because I know you started in golf and personal training and all of that.
5:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, I tell people it's because I have daddy issues and I really want to make dudes better than my dad.
5:21
SPEAKER_00: Um, so I use my pain for my purpose.
5:24
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, with an exercise science degree, everybody wants to train athletes, and you realize very quickly they're all broke unless you're at the elite level.
5:33
SPEAKER_00: So I realized in my hometown of Greenwich, Connecticut, there was a lot of very wealthy guys who played golf.
5:40
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, oh, these guys could afford to train their type A.
5:45
SPEAKER_00: That's kind of my people.
5:46
SPEAKER_00: Like, I like this.
5:47
SPEAKER_00: So I learned everything I could about golf fitness, and that brought me an all-male clientele.
5:53
SPEAKER_00: And that was back in 2008.
5:55
SPEAKER_00: So here we are today.
5:56
SPEAKER_00: I kind of dove headfirst into everything men's health, hormones, absolutely, you name it, I've known it.
6:03
SPEAKER_00: Um, and continue to learn about it.
6:06
SPEAKER_00: And I just love working with guys, I think because I am very broy.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: I am into man things.
6:12
SPEAKER_00: I'm a meat head, I like cars, stuff like that.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: Um, and my husband's very cool about all of it.
6:18
SPEAKER_00: So yeah, here we are.
6:20
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
6:21
SPEAKER_01: And I, you know, I was gonna say daddy issues, hello here too.
6:24
SPEAKER_01: And I always joke to Ali.
6:25
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, you work with all these men, find me a husband, find the other daddy issue queen, a daddy issue.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: Because Allie gets to hear my dating stories too, guys.
6:34
SPEAKER_01: She likes tries to live vicariously through me and it's a disaster.
6:39
SPEAKER_00: I know it's it's it's entertaining though.
6:41
SPEAKER_00: And some of us, you know, have only been married for two years, but there's a time where you're like, I need entertainment and I don't know what it's like to date anymore.
6:50
SPEAKER_00: And I just don't want to do that.
6:51
SPEAKER_00: I don't have to.
6:53
SPEAKER_01: She would like be so over that and so ADD that you'd be like, nah.
6:57
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, nah.
6:59
SPEAKER_01: So I first of all appreciate you taking time out of your crazy busy schedule getting ready for the Silverback Summit.
7:05
SPEAKER_01: And as I said before we even started recording, um, this is her third podcast of the day.
7:10
SPEAKER_01: I don't know if you're just on autopilot now with like what you talk about.
7:14
SPEAKER_00: Well, actually, they the all three have been completely different.
7:18
SPEAKER_00: So I won't be like, did I already talk about this or did I not talk?
7:21
SPEAKER_00: Like, I can't remember.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: So, like the one before you, I was talking about like endocrine disruptors with uh Johnny Slicks, the owner of the hair products that we use, their sponsor of the Silverback Summit.
7:32
SPEAKER_00: And then this morning was with Dave Lee, who's one of my speakers at Silverback.
7:35
SPEAKER_00: If anybody watches and wants to understand like the war on masculinity and testosterone and younger guys, Dave's specialty is with that.
7:44
SPEAKER_00: So you guys will meet him if you attend the summit.
7:47
SPEAKER_00: You will meet him, he will be there in person.
7:48
SPEAKER_00: He's from Australia.
7:50
SPEAKER_00: You'll actually meet both my coaches, Bedros and Luke.
7:52
SPEAKER_00: So business and and uh pleasure.
7:55
SPEAKER_01: I can't wait.
7:56
SPEAKER_01: And I'll be living in Austin, so by then, so it will be like a full-fledged experience.
8:02
SPEAKER_01: We'll be there for everything.
8:04
SPEAKER_00: So we don't need Uber.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: What do you need?
8:08
SPEAKER_00: You you'll be our Uber.
8:10
SPEAKER_01: Oh, I was like, why don't we need Uber?
8:12
SPEAKER_00: Like, what?
8:13
SPEAKER_01: Duh, no, I can drive and none nobody really drinks either, which is funny.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: Like an alcohol thing is something we could get into here too.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: But talking specifically about like men's health, diving into like the meat and potatoes of all of this, and why why I love what I've also learned from you is when I was a pharmacist, I like would get the prescriptions for TRT, right?
8:33
SPEAKER_01: Like you would get the Sipionate, you would get the gels and the creams and the patches and the whatever um coming in.
8:39
SPEAKER_01: Insurance never covers it, or if it does, it's like terrible, right?
8:44
SPEAKER_01: And I know you tell people like, do not use insurance.
8:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
8:49
SPEAKER_01: She likes shaking her head no for those on audio.
8:53
SPEAKER_00: No, sorry, audio people.
8:54
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the insurance is like if you need a ZPAC and need like a copay, that's it.
9:00
SPEAKER_01: But I was always like, I was always anti-TRT because I was like, oh, men have to stay on it forever.
9:07
SPEAKER_01: There's and the patients that I was seeing was also very different, right?
9:10
SPEAKER_01: Like it's your very unhealthy men, like who could do a bunch of lifestyle changes to get their testosterone up higher, and then they were just like taking this drug without really doing anything else.
9:21
SPEAKER_01: And so I had a really negative outlook on it and didn't really love it.
9:25
SPEAKER_01: Then learning, you know, what Allie does and her being more hormone therapy, less holistic.
9:31
SPEAKER_01: However, you still do GPP for TRT, which I'll let you explain.
9:36
SPEAKER_01: Um, but providing and bringing in the lifestyle factors with it, and then just learning how many men are actually deficient and low in testosterone, regardless of lifestyle.
9:46
SPEAKER_01: And so that's kind of what I want you to like dive into now is like, why is that a thing so like so why is that so common now?
9:53
SPEAKER_01: Like lower testosterone in men, like what is happening?
9:56
SPEAKER_00: Well, like in the 80s, um, the the average T level in guys was around 500.
10:03
SPEAKER_00: And then in the 90s, it started declining to like 400, and then in the 2000s, it's been like 300.
10:08
SPEAKER_00: And the labs have also lowered the ranges with that.
10:14
SPEAKER_00: Um, why is that?
10:15
SPEAKER_00: Well, hello, obesity, like hugely sedentary lifestyle.
10:20
SPEAKER_00: Guys don't move as much as they should or used to.
10:24
SPEAKER_00: Um, the chemical onslaught that I was just talking about with the endocrine disrupting chemicals that we used to think were like super woo-woo, and like if you don't touch, you know, the receipt, then that's weird and corny.
10:35
SPEAKER_00: And like, you know, carrying around glass containers and stuff like that is super dorky, but it's actually like true because we thought we were safe if we had BPA-free containers, but there's BPF and BPS, and there's all these other, you know, things associated with that.
10:51
SPEAKER_00: They actually tested like 10 million women in the 30s with BPAT use for birth control, because it has that detrimental of an effect on fertility and uh hormones.
11:03
SPEAKER_00: So combine that with not moving.
11:06
SPEAKER_00: If you don't move, then your body's like, Well, I'm just gonna accumulate body fat.
11:10
SPEAKER_00: And the more body fat men have, the more inflammatory they are.
11:14
SPEAKER_00: The more inflammatory there are, the body's like, Cool, well, I'm gonna suppress this hormone that makes you a man because we have too much of an inflamed state.
11:22
SPEAKER_00: So, therefore, we're going to lower that.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: And guys will not be healthy, and insulin resistance and high body fat obviously contributes to metabolic disease, and that's really one of the leading factors.
11:37
SPEAKER_00: And it's crazy because they they try to blame age and it's not age, it's really not age.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: Like, what is the age every now and then you'll see somebody, huh?
11:47
SPEAKER_01: What is the age where it actually like starts declining?
11:50
SPEAKER_00: Uh now, like 25.
11:52
SPEAKER_00: Well, before, like uh it used to it used to be like guys over 40 or over 50, right?
11:58
SPEAKER_00: So, like it used to be like if you had ed, you must be over 65.
12:02
SPEAKER_00: If you have low T, you're probably over 60.
12:04
SPEAKER_00: Cool.
12:05
SPEAKER_00: Now it's like I can look at a guy in his 20s and think, yeah, you probably have low T.
12:10
SPEAKER_00: Like if you go to Disney World, it's mostly like low testosterone people who look like a melted candle and they're wearing crocs.
12:18
SPEAKER_00: This is not a cool thing to do.
12:19
SPEAKER_01: By the way, Allie goes to Disney a lot because her husband Charlie loves it.
12:24
SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, Disney fan.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: So Allie gets first row seats at the what would you even call that?
12:31
SPEAKER_01: Like the melting pot of why America is the way it is.
12:34
SPEAKER_00: It's so bad.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: And honestly, like I stole one of Bedros's jokes because he was like, you can't be fat and wear crocs.
12:40
SPEAKER_00: Like you have to pick one.
12:41
SPEAKER_00: And he just went off on that this weekend.
12:43
SPEAKER_00: But like it is true.
12:45
SPEAKER_00: It is disrespectful to be overweight.
12:48
SPEAKER_00: Like, and the sad part is when there's overweight parents with kids who are just as overweight because you're enabling.
12:55
SPEAKER_01: You learn by example, right?
12:56
SPEAKER_01: Like, you have the same as your parents do.
12:59
SPEAKER_01: What about can you be overweight and wear toe shoes?
13:03
SPEAKER_00: No, that's not allowed.
13:04
SPEAKER_00: That's not allowed in my coaching program.
13:07
SPEAKER_00: Gloves are not allowed in my coaching program.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: You cannot say the word smoothie.
13:11
SPEAKER_00: It is a shake.
13:12
SPEAKER_01: It's a shake.
13:13
SPEAKER_01: You can't see, like audio people can't see, but like I have all these calluses and I'll have people be like, wear gloves.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: I go, absolutely not.
13:18
SPEAKER_01: No fucking way.
13:20
SPEAKER_01: No, no, that is birth control.
13:23
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: I actually I dated a guy who got like, he was so upset when I put my hand on his leg, he was like, it's so rough.
13:29
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, okay, this is not gonna work.
13:32
SPEAKER_01: I had a guy tell me I needed to file my calluses and put on lotion, and I was like, later, dude.
13:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm like, bro, you need to make some calluses.
13:40
SPEAKER_01: All right, yeah.
13:41
SPEAKER_01: Like, let me teach you how to get some calluses.
13:44
SPEAKER_01: So, okay, so what we said were sedentary lifestyle, which we see in women as well.
13:48
SPEAKER_01: So just the over, over the population's not moving.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: Everything is super convenient.
13:53
SPEAKER_01: We're not getting off of our asses, we're sitting in one place.
13:55
SPEAKER_01: Um, I will say the normalization of obesity is becoming a problem and like labeling it as a disease now.
14:03
SPEAKER_01: That's like a fucked up.
14:06
SPEAKER_00: Oh, that that where do I even start?
14:10
SPEAKER_01: Like I know, we're like stirring the pot now.
14:13
SPEAKER_00: If you guys go on uh my business coach Pedros Coolion's page, you will find plenty of tangents on men being overweight and fat.
14:22
SPEAKER_00: And and I think that even saying the word fat, like I still like will hesitate sometimes because I'm like, wait, that's like a bad word.
14:28
SPEAKER_00: Like I had somebody come after me for saying obese, and I was like, yo, obese is a medical term.
14:34
SPEAKER_00: Like I don't understand the problem with it, but it it's harmful.
14:38
SPEAKER_00: Now, can you be a larger person and be healthy?
14:43
SPEAKER_00: Yes, but does that mean large in terms of a lot of body fat?
14:48
SPEAKER_00: Probably not.
14:48
SPEAKER_00: Like literally, it is the most inflammatory tissue in the body.
14:51
SPEAKER_00: So you can't argue with the fact that it's causing all these downstream effects from a health perspective.
14:58
SPEAKER_00: So it's like, you know, they have a lot of these, like they they do it in Australia a lot.
15:03
SPEAKER_00: I don't know so much about the US, where there's these groups of female coaches who do photo shoots together to uh promote uh togetherness or femaleness or something.
15:14
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
15:15
SPEAKER_00: But they're supposed to be doing fitness, but it's not like fitness related.
15:18
SPEAKER_00: And it's a body positivity shoot or whatever, which like listen, if this helps and it makes you feel better about yourself, awesome, but you still have to do the work to get into a healthy place.
15:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: And it kind of segues into men who are overweight and inflamed looking at testosterone as a panacea for them, where they're like, this is gonna fix all my problems.
15:39
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that gets into GPP, which stands for what so GPP is uh a term in the fitness industry called general general physical preparation.
15:50
SPEAKER_00: And basically it prepares you, uh it's normally termed in sport or powerlifting or something where it prepares you for a special specialization phase.
16:00
SPEAKER_00: So if you're training for a certain sport, that would be your specialization phase.
16:04
SPEAKER_00: GPP is like the prepping for that.
16:06
SPEAKER_00: So prepping people to go on TRT sounds weird, but if you are a very overweight man, very unhealthy, yeah.
16:15
SPEAKER_00: But people are like, wait, I have to prep to go on this.
16:17
SPEAKER_00: Like, I don't get it.
16:18
SPEAKER_00: Um, and I'll I'll say why.
16:20
SPEAKER_00: But to get it basically the concept is to get a man very healthy and resilient more towards 15% body fat before he goes on testosterone replacement.
16:29
SPEAKER_00: And then I'll have guys say, Well, testosterone replacement changed my life, it allowed me to do all those things.
16:35
SPEAKER_00: And I absolutely, I totally get it.
16:38
SPEAKER_00: But anytime you inject an exogenous hormone in a body that does not want it, that's suppressing it for a reason, there are going to be unwanted side effects.
16:48
SPEAKER_00: It's not going to be a good experience.
16:49
SPEAKER_00: And what happens with guys?
16:51
SPEAKER_00: Test didn't work for me.
16:53
SPEAKER_00: I came off of it.
16:54
SPEAKER_00: My doctor freaked out because this was high and I felt this way.
16:58
SPEAKER_00: And therefore, they go back to the state that they were in before, where they have low mood, low energy, low libido, brain fog, all those things that come along with being low-T and depression.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say, when they get on the testosterone and they haven't prepped their body correctly, what are some of the side effects that they could start to see where it's shown because they didn't prep correctly?
17:20
SPEAKER_00: So going on testosterone naturally will increase red blood cells and hemoglobin and hematocrit and all of that stuff.
17:28
SPEAKER_00: That's normal.
17:29
SPEAKER_00: But if they're overweight, there tends to be a trend where that really catapults it into more dangerous levels.
17:36
SPEAKER_00: The problem with that is it can cause higher blood pressure, heavy breathing, all these things.
17:42
SPEAKER_00: It's just not a comfortable state to be.
17:44
SPEAKER_00: Water retention, stuff like that.
17:47
SPEAKER_00: Um, a lot of doctors will have a knee-jerk reaction and tell a patient to go donate blood so that they can bring down some of these markers.
17:55
SPEAKER_00: The problem with doing that too often is it can crash a guy's iron.
18:00
SPEAKER_00: So women, like we bleeding every month, like that's completely normal.
18:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, anemia on women is like standard.
18:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:08
SPEAKER_00: So it's like, well, hello, like, so if you're telling a guy to go dump like pints of blood every two months, sometimes I actually had a guy the other day who said his clinic had him dumping every month, which is like negligent.
18:22
SPEAKER_00: Like that's crazy.
18:23
SPEAKER_01: He's like, I feel every 56 days, like it's normally supposed to be every 60 days, every month, every month, damn.
18:30
SPEAKER_00: Every month.
18:32
SPEAKER_00: So is it it's a good Samaritan thing, do it like once or twice a year, but fuck every month.
18:38
SPEAKER_00: Like, so that's one of the problems associated with it.
18:41
SPEAKER_00: And so they may not feel so hot, and they'll think, well, testosterone doesn't work for me.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: So then, like, what are they gonna do?
18:48
SPEAKER_01: So, one of the other things that I really learned from just attending, like Ali, you speak a ton at these events and conferences.
18:54
SPEAKER_01: I've been to a couple of them of Perform Better, Coach Catalyst Summit.
18:58
SPEAKER_01: You know, you get invited to all these things, which is awesome because you're sharing so much knowledge that needs to be heard in the men's health industry and what they don't teach, and even in pharmacy school, right?
19:08
SPEAKER_01: They teach you start TRT, start an astrazole, right?
19:11
SPEAKER_01: Like start a uh, yeah, we're gonna talk about we're talking about those, but immediately start an estrogen blocker because you're gonna develop man boobs.
19:19
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh my God, the man boobs, you're gonna get them.
19:21
SPEAKER_01: So you have to start taking one like twice a week.
19:24
SPEAKER_01: And you would get those prescriptions in, and we would get those, and we'd be like, oh, there's no estrogen blocker.
19:28
SPEAKER_01: We have to call the doctor and like get one.
19:30
SPEAKER_01: And it'd be so crazy.
19:32
SPEAKER_01: Why can't I aromatase inhibitors?
19:34
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, why can't I think of the name of the drug?
19:36
SPEAKER_01: Like, hello, drug dealer here.
19:38
SPEAKER_01: But I've since learned with all the data coming out, and even what I've like learned and watched from you, like you don't need it because men, like you just said, men need iron too, men need estrogen too.
19:48
SPEAKER_01: So, can you like just speak a little bit?
19:50
SPEAKER_01: Like, what is the importance of estrogen in men and why shouldn't we be blocking it?
19:55
SPEAKER_00: So the funny thing is, um, men men have estrogen just like women have testosterone.
20:01
SPEAKER_00: Men don't really some guys don't know women have testosterone, which I found out on uh social media recently.
20:08
SPEAKER_00: Um for whatever reason, we don't need to optimize it.
20:11
SPEAKER_00: But men and estrogen, um, so I can I ask you, do you remember how much anastrazole cost?
20:18
SPEAKER_01: Oh god, no, but I can look at I still have the like pharmacy apps and stuff.
20:22
SPEAKER_00: Because I'm like, how much do these guys actually make off of it that they continue to prescribe it?
20:27
SPEAKER_00: So that came from the bodybuilding world where you know estrogen was the women's hormone.
20:32
SPEAKER_00: It's gonna make guys cry and it's gonna make them too emotional, it's gonna cause sore nipples and gyno and water retention and all this stuff.
20:39
SPEAKER_00: And come to find out, it's necessary for men because it's cardioprotective, it's neuroprotective, it really helps them maintain body fat levels in their abdomen, it actually helps their joints, stuff like that.
20:54
SPEAKER_00: So when you block or suppress it, you're basically putting a guy in the same state that a woman is in menopause.
21:01
SPEAKER_00: So in menopause, women lose estrogen.
21:03
SPEAKER_00: What happens?
21:04
SPEAKER_00: Osteoporosis, insulin resistance, belly fat, all those things.
21:10
SPEAKER_00: Same thing with guys.
21:12
SPEAKER_00: I had a guy on a consult yesterday, and he's like, I've been on, I went on testosterone for close to five months with another clinic, and I felt great at first, and then I felt awful.
21:24
SPEAKER_00: And then I lost my libido and my erection strength was actually starting to deteriorate.
21:29
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, that's interesting.
21:30
SPEAKER_00: And we went through his whole like audited his life because stress could like absolutely impact that.
21:38
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
21:38
SPEAKER_00: And I asked him, you know, all the stressors in his life and blah blah blah.
21:41
SPEAKER_00: And so we determined, okay, it could be that.
21:44
SPEAKER_00: And I asked him, Were you on anything else?
21:47
SPEAKER_00: Did the doctor put you on anastrazole?
21:48
SPEAKER_00: He said, Yes.
21:50
SPEAKER_00: Three milligrams a week, which is probably twice what mo yeah.
21:57
SPEAKER_00: So usually they come in one milligram pills and guys take.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: Take half once a week, right?
22:02
SPEAKER_00: Three milligrams a week.
22:03
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, okay, I think we found the culprit.
22:07
SPEAKER_01: He can't fall down.
22:07
SPEAKER_01: He's gonna break a bone, literally.
22:10
SPEAKER_00: And he's like, you know, that's funny you say that because that's when a lot of my joint issues started.
22:14
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, Yeah.
22:16
SPEAKER_00: So I think you can revisit testosterone replacement.
22:20
SPEAKER_00: Uh, I can introduce you to Merrick Health because they actually know what they're doing, and we'll get you on a competent protocol that does not include anastrazole.
22:29
SPEAKER_01: So I looked it up really quick.
22:30
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna go with the Walmart pricing because Walgreens is just like insane.
22:34
SPEAKER_01: But for 30 tablets, it's 110 out of pocket, or you can get good RX for like 20 bucks.
22:40
SPEAKER_01: So they're not paying much for 30 tablets if they're not using it that much, right?
22:44
SPEAKER_01: Like anastrazole is cheap, so they're not making too much.
22:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
22:47
SPEAKER_01: Um, but to go back on your one comment, I this is why I've definitely learned I was dating a guy who was taking testosterone, but also taking anastrazole.
22:57
SPEAKER_01: And his libido would be like in the toilet.
22:59
SPEAKER_01: And he's like, I don't understand why.
23:00
SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm on, I'm doing this, it should be good.
23:02
SPEAKER_01: I go, you have to stop taking your AI, like your, you know, the anastrazole.
23:07
SPEAKER_01: And he's like, Well, I'm gonna listen to my doctor.
23:09
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, Okay, cool.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: Like, have fun with that.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: And I was providing him, you know, me, I provide like the data and all this stuff.
23:16
SPEAKER_01: And it's like, okay, listen to your doctor.
23:18
SPEAKER_01: Clearly, you're feeling great.
23:19
SPEAKER_01: This is affecting your sex life.
23:22
SPEAKER_00: And and it's like, you know, I and I've had guys um question it and then you know, they don't understand.
23:28
SPEAKER_00: And and I'm really parroting, but also I've studied what one of my doctors, Jordan Grant, who has provided the literature and stuff like that, Dave Lee's also.
23:37
SPEAKER_00: He'll be at Silverback, yep.
23:39
SPEAKER_00: And he'll be at Silverback.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
23:40
SPEAKER_00: So it's not like my opinion that I'm giving them.
23:42
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, I have literature from PubMed to show you if you want to read it to talk about why it can be detrimental.
23:50
SPEAKER_00: And is there like outliers sometimes where maybe they might need some of it?
23:55
SPEAKER_00: Then sure.
23:56
SPEAKER_00: But the overwhelming amount of men who do not require it just based off a lab marker being high on paper.
24:04
SPEAKER_00: What I've learned from Jordan is that in women who are menopausal and in men, serum or blood lab markers of estrogen are not reflective of what is actually in their tissue because it acts as a peracrine hormone.
24:19
SPEAKER_00: So it's not an endocrine hormone in men and postmenopausal women.
24:23
SPEAKER_00: So basically it's obsolete to even run estrogen.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: He doesn't even run estrogen anymore because guys will see it in the red if they're on TRT and they'll freak out.
24:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, a big benefit of testosterone replacement is due to the conversion of test to estrogen.
24:39
SPEAKER_00: It's cardioprotective, neuroprotective.
24:42
SPEAKER_00: So, why do so many women suffer from heart disease and issues like that?
24:46
SPEAKER_00: Because they're losing estrogen during menopause.
24:49
SPEAKER_01: It also increases insulin sensitivity, which you super need for losing body fat, muscle mass, all of that.
24:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
24:56
SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah.
24:57
SPEAKER_00: I've had guys who, when they've come to me, were on anastrazole, gone through the process at Merrick, they've come off anastrazole, and they're like, oh my god, my belly fat went away.
25:08
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, hey, should be lying.
25:11
SPEAKER_00: Hey, you know, hey, how about that?
25:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and they could tolerate carbohydrates a lot better.
25:17
SPEAKER_00: And so it actually is a major battle in the TRT world because, like, even here in Florida, we have these clinics where you can just walk in and get the same protocol as anyone else with the starter pack.
25:29
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
25:30
SPEAKER_00: And an astrazol is part of that.
25:32
SPEAKER_00: And you know, guys, guys don't know what they don't know.
25:34
SPEAKER_00: And it takes a lot for a guy to get his blood work done or go to a doctor in the first place.
25:40
SPEAKER_00: So they're not going to resist what a doctor says because they probably just don't know how to uh argue, you know.
25:49
SPEAKER_00: So they're like, I'm just gonna take what he gave me and then be on my way.
25:52
SPEAKER_00: They really don't know.
25:54
SPEAKER_01: That's what here we're here for.
25:55
SPEAKER_01: I mean, honestly, pharmacists and doctors don't know either, unless you look into it and study it and and actually stay up on the literature, which you would think doctors would, but not the hormone clinics so much.
26:06
SPEAKER_00: No, no, and say, yeah, like the pharmacist, like, you know, like you guys can like do whatever you want sometimes.
26:12
SPEAKER_00: They'll like tell they'll tell the patient, like, yeah, you shouldn't be taking this much testosterone or blah blah blah, or like I've seen them change uh the script and the dosage randomly.
26:26
SPEAKER_01: I don't think that's allowed.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, they had to have called the doctor and annotated that because you could get in a lot of trouble for just like doing that, but that's insane.
26:34
SPEAKER_00: HCG was one of them that they I man, I wish I could remember the story.
26:39
SPEAKER_00: It was pretty weird.
26:40
SPEAKER_01: There's there's so many stipulations that they like allow us to do and not do.
26:45
SPEAKER_01: So it's almost like we're strapped by the law, right?
26:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
26:50
SPEAKER_01: And the DEA for controlled substances, which testosterone is so, but not only are you dealing with like that type of misinformation and everything, but we're also dealing with, and I kind of used to think of it too, as like TRT is like a massive anabolic steroid.
27:04
SPEAKER_01: Like if you take TRT, you're on juice and you're gonna get extremely jacked.
27:09
SPEAKER_01: Like, can we put that myth to rest too?
27:13
SPEAKER_01: Your face right now, I love it.
27:16
SPEAKER_00: Um, it in theory, it seems like yeah, this will make you more jacked.
27:22
SPEAKER_00: Okay, but what makes someone jacked in general?
27:26
SPEAKER_00: You have to lift weights, you have to eat.
27:29
SPEAKER_00: Pretty standard.
27:31
SPEAKER_00: Okay, so if you do that in combination with testosterone, yes, maybe it might happen at a a very slightly accelerated rate because it'll help augment recovery.
27:42
SPEAKER_00: But testosterone replacement is literally replacing what you should already be biologically producing.
27:48
SPEAKER_00: So if someone wants to go on superphysiological levels, because the legal limit to prescribe is 400 milligrams, nobody's even on 400 milligrams at a therapeutic dose.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: If you're taking six to eight hundred milligrams, yeah, you're probably gonna gain a lot of size really quickly.
28:04
SPEAKER_00: Doesn't happen with testosterone replacement.
28:06
SPEAKER_00: There are plenty of men who are on TRT, you would never ever think of it just by looking at them physically.
28:13
SPEAKER_00: Guys will feel better and and they might grow muscle easier because they can recover better, they can sleep better, they feel better, they're more confident, all of those things.
28:23
SPEAKER_00: And that's why they will end up looking the way they do.
28:26
SPEAKER_00: But it's not instantaneous either.
28:28
SPEAKER_00: Like I've had guys like three months in, they're like, when do I get jacked?
28:31
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, Well, calm your shit.
28:34
SPEAKER_00: It's like any other process.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: So I get why it can be thought of as like, you know, you're going on anabolic steroids because it comes in a needle or a cream, but typically because it's an injection, yeah.
28:48
SPEAKER_00: Anything associated with a syringe is like taboo, you know, except insulin or a zempic.
28:54
SPEAKER_00: Correct, yeah.
28:56
SPEAKER_00: That's not cheating.
28:58
SPEAKER_01: That's not cheating.
28:59
SPEAKER_01: Uh, that's like my own personal hell of a topic.
29:03
SPEAKER_00: We won't go there.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: We won't.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: But I will say TRT is not like men have to jump through hoops to kind of get a TRT prescription, even if they are subtherapeutic.
29:14
SPEAKER_01: And like Ali alluded to this earlier, where she was like, the ranges for the labs are getting wider.
29:18
SPEAKER_01: And I say this all the time with other lab values that we're looking at for women is like, yeah, your doctor might say this is normal, but in a functional human being level, like we'll take thyroid, for example.
29:30
SPEAKER_01: TSH is like 0.5 to four and a half.
29:32
SPEAKER_01: That's what they consider normal.
29:33
SPEAKER_01: But anything over two, you're having symptoms.
29:36
SPEAKER_01: It's kind of garbage.
29:37
SPEAKER_01: Like we want you closer to one, two, and a T3 above three.
29:40
SPEAKER_01: Doctors don't even test T3.
29:42
SPEAKER_01: So there's issues here with the lab levels and what are actually good.
29:45
SPEAKER_01: And so if a testosterone level of 250 is registering as normal, you're gonna feel like ass.
29:52
SPEAKER_01: Like you're gonna feel terrible.
29:54
SPEAKER_01: Um, you should optimally be like way higher, right?
29:59
SPEAKER_00: So that's why you don't want to go through insurance.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
30:02
SPEAKER_01: So men have to jump through hoops, but then a woman has like an issue on their hormones, and it's like, immediately let me give you birth control to fix this issue.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: That is something I am actually fighting so much against as well.
30:17
SPEAKER_01: Is like giving birth control as a band-aid.
30:19
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, it's it's not women and men are very different in that aspect, but um, it's so crazy how the medical industry just stigmatizes it all.
30:30
SPEAKER_00: Birth control is like, first of all, let's let's define like what an actual anabolic steroid is.
30:35
SPEAKER_00: Usually it's something synthetic that is a derivative of testosterone.
30:40
SPEAKER_00: Guess what?
30:41
SPEAKER_00: Birth control is synthetic.
30:42
SPEAKER_00: Like women are the biggest PED users in America, but no one like realizes it because birth control is synthetic.
30:49
SPEAKER_00: So they're like afraid to come off of that.
30:51
SPEAKER_00: They're they're okay to take that, but then they don't want to take like a natural real hormone.
30:57
SPEAKER_00: So I don't know that that like it it puzzles me, but but that's another reason you don't want to go through insurance because insurance, you have to qualify for low-t.
31:06
SPEAKER_00: You got to be below that 250 number twice in a row, which is absurd.
31:12
SPEAKER_00: So, can it be done?
31:13
SPEAKER_00: Yes, but then now you're basically regulating and giving your treatment over to an entity that is going to control your destiny when it comes to TRT.
31:23
SPEAKER_00: Like it doesn't make sense.
31:24
SPEAKER_00: You want to go cash-based with a company who knows what they're doing and knows how to manage it.
31:28
SPEAKER_00: Your GP does not know how to manage this.
31:31
SPEAKER_00: I don't care if he's your friend.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: I don't care if you can get injections for$20 at the pharmacy.
31:36
SPEAKER_00: Good luck getting somebody to manage it when something goes sideways or you're experiencing something wrong.
31:41
SPEAKER_00: Or there's other things that you want to add on to it that maybe will make you very optimal and healthy, but your GP just doesn't know anything about it.
31:49
SPEAKER_00: And then the problem also happens if your testosterone on your labs is too high, meaning it's beyond what some labs detect as 1500, your GP will freak out and say that you have to lower your dose.
32:01
SPEAKER_00: And it's a shit show.
32:03
SPEAKER_00: I've seen it happen way too many times that I refuse to allow that.
32:07
SPEAKER_00: I I will take guys and say this is why you have to invest in your health.
32:12
SPEAKER_00: Because is going to Merrick going to be more costly than getting it for$20 at your supermarket?
32:20
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: But it's not only money that um you're gonna end up saving in the long run, it's time, it's frustration, energy of doing the song and dance of going to doctor to doctor to doctor because you're battling somebody.
32:35
SPEAKER_00: And I've seen it happen so many times.
32:37
SPEAKER_00: That's why I get so worked up about it.
32:39
SPEAKER_01: And also save your relationship.
32:43
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:43
SPEAKER_01: If you get it fixed quick enough.
32:45
SPEAKER_01: Um, I will say really quick, because I know you mentioned Merrick too.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: If guys are listening to this and they're like, where do I even get started?
32:52
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna put all of Allie's info because she's definitely the men's health pro here.
32:56
SPEAKER_01: We don't do men's health at Team BDN coaching.
32:59
SPEAKER_01: Um, where can they, what should they do?
33:01
SPEAKER_01: What's their first step?
33:02
SPEAKER_01: Like, where do you suggest men go?
33:03
SPEAKER_01: If they're like, oh my God, my doctor doesn't know.
33:05
SPEAKER_01: What do I do?
33:07
SPEAKER_00: Come to me.
33:09
SPEAKER_00: Come to me.
33:10
SPEAKER_00: I will give you the silverback panel and you can go through Merrick Health and you'll deal with one of the providers and health coaches that I know who are assigned to my clientele.
33:20
SPEAKER_00: We will take care of you.
33:22
SPEAKER_00: You will have somebody to talk to who you can actually get a hold of, and you will be put on the right path and you'll be given the truth, and you'll be asked things like, What's your diet like?
33:32
SPEAKER_00: What is your training like?
33:34
SPEAKER_00: What is your sleep like, instead of let's see what these lab markers say.
33:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
33:40
SPEAKER_00: And what I like too is Merrick has their own ranges, which are optimal ranges versus you being thrown in with the rest of America because those testosterone ranges now are based on the guys who are super overweight, the guys who are 89 years old, the guys who are, you know, morbidly obese, like sick, all of that stuff inflamed.
34:01
SPEAKER_00: So, do you want to be looped in as average and normal with those people, or do you actually want to be a killer and level up your life and be considered a high performing human?
34:10
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
34:11
SPEAKER_01: I will say, so you heard that right.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: Go slide into Allie's DMs.
34:15
SPEAKER_01: It is her.
34:15
SPEAKER_01: She answers them.
34:16
SPEAKER_01: Go see what to do.
34:18
SPEAKER_01: Um, you guys have heard me talk about how I am also, you know, affiliated now with Merrick and we run panels for Team BDM through the women for this.
34:25
SPEAKER_01: So definitely get your labs done.
34:27
SPEAKER_01: They're not covered by insurance, but again, I kind of agree with this too.
34:31
SPEAKER_01: I think all things nowadays, which is unfortunate, that are worth it, and that you have people who actually know what they're talking about, do not deal with insurance companies because insurance is just a nightmare nowadays.
34:42
SPEAKER_01: And that's why health coaching can be a little bit on the pricier side, but you're actually getting people who care, who are responsive, who can give you the right information instead of just like, this is what the textbook says from 1980, and this is what we still follow.
34:56
SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, follow the Dash diet, Mediterranean diet, whatever.
35:00
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh God, it's so bad.
35:03
SPEAKER_01: My my biggest thing is um, we we get compared with like the dietitians through the hospitals because they're covered their insurance or their doctor's offices, and they'll tell you, like, here's a meal plan and 1200 calories.
35:13
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, absolutely not.
35:15
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely not.
35:17
SPEAKER_00: Dude, they've been doing that shit for like so many years.
35:20
SPEAKER_01: I don't know when they're gonna take it out of the textbooks, but kind of what you were saying, and I I we could preach this on different accounts, is just because it's normal now and you're considered normal, does not mean it's optimized.
35:32
SPEAKER_01: Like so many, I think I put this on my Instagram the other day.
35:34
SPEAKER_01: Like 74% of America is either overweight or obese, like 42% are obese.
35:41
SPEAKER_01: That is what's considered normal.
35:42
SPEAKER_01: That's the majority now.
35:44
SPEAKER_01: So if you're, I know you say this, if you even have a little bit of muscle on you or you work out, you're like considered a bodybuilder or steroids now, right?
35:52
SPEAKER_01: Like, what's your sauce?
35:54
SPEAKER_01: Um, we can talk, we can dive into the social media hellhole that we get now too.
36:01
SPEAKER_01: The comment.
36:02
SPEAKER_00: I will say, I will say, my friend Chris Cavallini did a uh podcast where he was saying one in three guys can't see their dick because their gut is in the way.
36:11
SPEAKER_01: All right, if you're uh if you're listening to this now, I want you to take a second and just look down, straight down, stand up.
36:17
SPEAKER_01: Can you see your dick?
36:20
SPEAKER_01: If not, call me.
36:22
SPEAKER_01: Fly to Nallie's DMs.
36:24
SPEAKER_00: And if you can, you still probably need me.
36:27
SPEAKER_01: Should that be your your tagline?
36:29
SPEAKER_01: Like, I I'll uh make you see your dick?
36:31
SPEAKER_01: Like what can we get creative?
36:33
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, well, Chris says that he's like, I can I can literally increase the size of your penis relatively quickly.
36:40
SPEAKER_00: So could I if you lose weight?
36:42
SPEAKER_01: How many, how many pounds do you gain an inch?
36:44
SPEAKER_01: What's that saying?
36:46
SPEAKER_00: Oh shit, I forget.
36:48
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: But I will say you you put out all this information and it's not always well received by the internet, by the trolls and the and the internet, I don't even know what we call them, keyboard warriors.
37:02
SPEAKER_01: So I want to ask you if you even know what's your favorite comment that you've gotten back that's been like an asinine comment.
37:10
SPEAKER_01: What's your favorite?
37:11
SPEAKER_00: Out of the over 2,000, uh God.
37:17
SPEAKER_00: Um I I've been I was called Jay Cutler, I think seven times that I know of.
37:23
SPEAKER_00: I mean, I ended up not reading all of them.
37:25
SPEAKER_01: That's insane.
37:26
SPEAKER_01: Like you have to go as him for Halloween.
37:28
SPEAKER_01: I just can't.
37:29
SPEAKER_00: Oh yeah, no, I have to.
37:30
SPEAKER_00: And I like totally leaned into that because I was like, all right, I I can I can throw self-deprecating humor.
37:35
SPEAKER_00: Um I think there was just more stupidity, like guys saying that, like, you know, why would women need to optimize testosterone if they don't produce it?
37:44
SPEAKER_00: Or stuff like that.
37:46
SPEAKER_00: And I'm just like, wow, you know, but it was funny because like, so we're talking about a clip that Mark Bell's podcast released, and just the way the camera is makes me look like way more jacked than I am.
37:59
SPEAKER_01: We're close up, yeah.
38:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and it's super close up.
38:02
SPEAKER_00: So if you know that like it was it was something I cut for, so it was actually leaner.
38:06
SPEAKER_00: If you see somebody on a camera who is leaner, they look bigger, but then when you see them in person, they're actually small.
38:13
SPEAKER_00: I'm less than 130 pounds.
38:15
SPEAKER_00: And these guys are like, you know, she's on like my level of testosterone.
38:18
SPEAKER_00: And and I literally say in the podcast, I am on six milligrams.
38:22
SPEAKER_00: If I remember to take my injections, which I really am sucking at.
38:27
SPEAKER_00: Like it's twice a week, it's like the littlest teeny bit.
38:32
SPEAKER_00: So it's like three to six milligrams a week.
38:34
SPEAKER_00: And they're like, you're on everything, you're on more than that, you know.
38:37
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, oh okay.
38:39
SPEAKER_00: They dismiss that I actually work out, but ultimately it it's they're they're very upset that a woman with masculine traits and looking a certain way is lifting more than them, is doing something that they want to do.
38:54
SPEAKER_00: And anytime someone's jealous or you have someone has something that you want, you're gonna do everything you can to tear that person down.
39:02
SPEAKER_00: And that's where that comes from.
39:04
SPEAKER_00: But it was eye-opening to like the level of hurt in America.
39:07
SPEAKER_00: I was like, fuck.
39:09
unknown: It's bad.
39:10
SPEAKER_00: The best part was when they start arguing with each other, and I was like, keep going.
39:14
SPEAKER_00: Like they're arguing with you, they're arguing with a bunch of my friends who went after them, and everyone's messaging me like two weeks later, yo, these people are still arguing with me.
39:23
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, keep it up, because we've got like 15,000, you know, whatever.
39:27
SPEAKER_00: There's half a million accounts that have been reached through this.
39:30
SPEAKER_00: That's crazy.
39:31
SPEAKER_00: Keep it up.
39:32
SPEAKER_00: It's crazy, yeah.
39:33
SPEAKER_00: But like I was like, damn, like the hate for this type of thing.
39:36
SPEAKER_01: I remember I was arguing with someone in the comments last week, and I remember he didn't respond because I don't remember my last comment, but I literally said something of like being the pharmacist and knowing like the doses or something, and he was just like, I'm done.
39:50
SPEAKER_01: But I couldn't remember, God, it was just it's eye-opening what people, the confidence people have behind a phone screen or a um keyboard.
40:02
SPEAKER_01: And all you're trying to do is tell people how to optimize their health and help men.
40:06
SPEAKER_01: And you have all these men who are so butthurt in the comments who choose to like rip apart your appearance, which I think is hilarious because if you do people do see you in person, you're like five, two, five, three, like yeah, I have a picture of you on my back, like giving you a piggyback rap.
40:26
SPEAKER_01: And people are like, who's this juiced out monster?
40:30
SPEAKER_00: Oh my god.
40:31
SPEAKER_00: It it's so funny.
40:33
SPEAKER_00: But then it's it's also like it's funny because now it it's kind of died down, and I'm like until they post something else.
40:40
SPEAKER_00: I know, until until someone drops another reel.
40:43
SPEAKER_00: Like anytime Merrick or or Mark Bell's dropped a reel, I've been like, but I kind of miss it because it was good engagement, you know, but it it also it provides me with ideas because I'm like, all right, well, this is where a lot of the misinformation is.
40:58
SPEAKER_00: This is the the stuff that people really don't understand.
41:02
SPEAKER_00: And people literally associate looking a certain way with taking steroids and don't understand how you have to train a certain way for years.
41:13
SPEAKER_00: I stepped into the gym when I was 15 years old.
41:15
SPEAKER_00: Like I'm 40, I'll be 42 next month.
41:18
SPEAKER_00: Like it's a long time, you know.
41:20
SPEAKER_00: Like people don't understand that.
41:21
SPEAKER_00: They dismiss that and they think that you can sit on the couch and inject steroids, which is another clip that was dropped where I was talking about that, how people think you can sit on a couch and inject steroids.
41:32
SPEAKER_00: And then people come at me and they're like, Well, there's studies.
41:34
SPEAKER_00: Okay, yeah, they gave a guy 600 milligrams of testosterone and he grew some muscle doing nothing.
41:40
SPEAKER_00: 600 milligrams.
41:42
SPEAKER_00: That's great.
41:42
SPEAKER_00: So you're gonna use that one study against what I'm trying to get across, which is the point of that.
41:48
SPEAKER_00: You can't just take TRT and then turn into the Hulk, like you were alluding to earlier.
41:53
SPEAKER_01: Which a standard dose, I think, is like 200 milligrams a week.
41:56
SPEAKER_00: Is that what they're still at the higher end, honestly?
41:59
SPEAKER_00: Like a lot of guys start at like 75, 200.
42:03
SPEAKER_00: And I'm at three.
42:05
SPEAKER_01: You're at three milligrams, but you're taking like I think they were also saying you were on like Annabar and Trent and all of these other things.
42:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
42:13
SPEAKER_01: Honestly, use it as a compliment.
42:15
SPEAKER_01: Like, look, I could teach you how to look like this too if you were a man.
42:20
SPEAKER_00: It was my friend Dan, like my friend Dan did a reaction video and it was really funny.
42:25
SPEAKER_02: I liked it.
42:25
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
42:26
SPEAKER_00: He pulled up some of the profiles of these guys.
42:29
SPEAKER_00: He called one of them looking like a bag of milk.
42:31
SPEAKER_00: I died.
42:34
SPEAKER_01: Well, there's one, there's a video I saw yesterday that I want to make a reel doing all of the things he says not to do.
42:40
SPEAKER_01: It's it's always like this this stereotypical feminine masculine thing, too.
42:44
SPEAKER_01: It's like if you want to be a woman, you should not be doing lap pull downs because it makes you wide and you have shoulders.
42:50
SPEAKER_01: Women should be thin.
42:51
SPEAKER_01: You should not be doing bicep curls because it gives you big arms and you should have thin arms.
42:56
SPEAKER_01: You should not be squatting because you'll get big legs and women shouldn't have big legs.
43:00
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, fuck off.
43:02
SPEAKER_01: Like, what?
43:03
SPEAKER_00: You'll never like appeal to anyone.
43:05
SPEAKER_00: And I remember saying, if I had my long hair, I had really thin arms, then people would be like, Well, who is she to talk about?
43:13
SPEAKER_00: Like men's exactly.
43:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
43:16
SPEAKER_00: So, you know what?
43:17
SPEAKER_00: Who who am I?
43:18
SPEAKER_00: But I know I'm not you, and you're not qualified to be up here, so fuck off.
43:23
SPEAKER_00: Like, yeah, whatever.
43:25
SPEAKER_01: I mean, you obviously practice what you preach in the like lifestyle at it, like working out, eating well, um, maybe not even eating enough sometimes, like yell at you to eat enough.
43:38
SPEAKER_01: Um, but I think I think this is why we need to keep having these conversations, and why I wanted to have you on the podcast too is to just like filter out all the noise that people will hear on the internet because the internet just gives everyone a microphone and a chance to be loud, and not everyone needs to be heard.
43:59
SPEAKER_00: No.
44:00
SPEAKER_00: No, and honestly, these people would not like if we're all in a room together, they probably wouldn't say these things to my face.
44:07
unknown: Of course not.
44:07
SPEAKER_00: I even said that, like I was trying to take different psychological approaches to answering some of them.
44:12
SPEAKER_00: Um, because Pedros was like, don't do what I do and troll the trolls.
44:15
SPEAKER_00: I was like, I already did.
44:16
SPEAKER_00: I'm sorry.
44:17
SPEAKER_00: But he goes as far to like add them as a friend and then like slide in their DMs and like talk to them.
44:23
SPEAKER_00: But I'm like, do you really though?
44:24
SPEAKER_00: You don't have time to do that.
44:25
SPEAKER_01: How does it have the time?
44:26
SPEAKER_01: That's what I was just thinking.
44:27
SPEAKER_01: How?
44:28
SPEAKER_00: But like one of them I said, you know, like, I'm truly sorry that you feel so deeply hurt by whatever it was that hurt you that you have to go after people you don't know on the internet.
44:40
SPEAKER_00: I hope you find happiness.
44:42
SPEAKER_00: That would provoke them to go further.
44:44
SPEAKER_00: So another one, like I would say, um, you know, you wouldn't say this to me to my face if we were in person, and it's pretty sad that you're doing it this way.
44:55
SPEAKER_00: And he's like, actually, if I was a friend of yours, I would definitely say it in person.
44:59
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, Well, you're not my friend, bro.
45:02
SPEAKER_00: No, I'm just kind of taking different like approaches to see how they respond as like a psychology experiment.
45:07
SPEAKER_00: Cause I was like, I really want to understand, like, you know, what if I came with humility and and was like, you know, you made me really upset and hurt my feelings.
45:15
SPEAKER_00: And they didn't give a shit.
45:16
SPEAKER_00: Like, they just want to make themselves feel better.
45:19
SPEAKER_00: And and like I was like, Well, you could be on a podcast too, just not this one.
45:23
SPEAKER_00: It's okay.
45:24
SPEAKER_01: I was gonna say, as a straight woman currently in the dating world, they don't care.
45:28
SPEAKER_01: No, not one bit.
45:32
SPEAKER_01: Just I I know we we joked about dating earlier, but just thank thank goodness you found like Charlie and the match and all of that, because that extrapolates so much into just it's not good.
45:46
SPEAKER_01: I don't even know where I was going with that, but it kind of also is why we hang out with the people that we do and why gym rats hang out with other gym rats, or you know, we end up dating other gym rats and things like that, is because it is a lifestyle, and the people who are so far removed from that lifestyle don't get it until they do.
46:04
SPEAKER_01: And you know, we're trying to get more people into that area so that the majority is not overweight and obese anymore.
46:12
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but I'm not gonna take advice from people living a life I don't want to live.
46:16
SPEAKER_01: Question for you on the men's thing, really quick, because I know I mentioned it earlier.
46:19
SPEAKER_01: Do you have male clients who are because I know I see it a ton in women?
46:22
SPEAKER_01: Do you have male clients whose doctors are giving them Ozempic or stemaglutide or anything like that?
46:27
SPEAKER_01: Like as much?
46:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
46:30
SPEAKER_00: My clients, I have maybe one or two guys.
46:32
SPEAKER_00: Um, but I don't have people like uh running to the to the med spa.
46:40
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, to the med spa.
46:42
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, uh not prescriptive, sorry, not um insurance-based, but yeah, compound based thing through.
46:49
SPEAKER_01: So do you notice with them that it really depletes their appetite too?
46:56
SPEAKER_00: So the guy that I have experienced using it is using it for cutting.
47:02
SPEAKER_00: So it's not because they because remember that my population is not really that overweight.
47:08
SPEAKER_01: Okay, true.
47:09
SPEAKER_00: So I don't deal with a lot of obesity or people who are new to the lifestyle that's swinging.
47:15
SPEAKER_00: So who are new to like the fitness lifestyle?
47:18
SPEAKER_00: Um, we don't have to like ingrain habits and stuff.
47:22
SPEAKER_00: So it's more, it's like a lot of bodybuilders actually use it for cutting.
47:25
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
47:26
SPEAKER_00: Because it helps take the edge off with dieting.
47:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that makes more sense.
47:30
SPEAKER_01: Um, so you wouldn't have like a ton that are transitioning off or what they're doing, but you do have a lot of men who come to you.
47:37
SPEAKER_01: And and I say this with women, so I want men to hear this before we wrap up this podcast who are under-eating.
47:43
SPEAKER_01: Men undereat a ton as well, right?
47:46
SPEAKER_00: Oh my God.
47:47
SPEAKER_00: Another reel that I got attacked on.
47:49
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it it's again the population I deal with are men who were trying to get really shredded, who had success, but can't get it to the next level, meaning they're maybe 20% body fat or lower, which the equivalent of a guy at 20 is probably a female at like 29 or 30.
48:08
SPEAKER_00: Um, so they can't really take it to the next level and they've tried and they've just cut calories constantly, or they come from more of a high-intensity CrossFit background, and they just keep adding exercise and all that stuff.
48:21
SPEAKER_00: So they tend to under eat for what they're performing for, and then they take up jujitsu, which torches calories and they don't eat enough.
48:30
SPEAKER_00: So the problem is that with guys who want to be shreddy, they'll be like, cool, I'm gonna cut calories and I'm gonna increase my output, similar to what women do.
48:39
SPEAKER_00: Then they run out of gas and then they become skinny fat, and then they hate how they look, so they try to go into a bulk.
48:44
SPEAKER_00: What guys will do that women will not do is they'll claim it's a dirty bulk, so they can eat whatever the fuck they want, but then they put on too much body fat and they don't like how they look, but they look good in clothes, but they don't look good naked.
48:56
SPEAKER_00: So then they crash diet that fat off only to not gain any muscle whatsoever and then feel like they're in the same starting position.
49:05
SPEAKER_00: So we rectify that by increasing their output, but increasing the food to match it, and then kind of mainlining a slight deficit, but it feels like a surplus for them because they've never eaten this much food.
49:19
SPEAKER_01: Right.
49:19
SPEAKER_01: And so over time they fill out, and that's like 2,000 calories for a guy.
49:24
SPEAKER_01: Like it's not even they're eating 1800, they're eating low too.
49:28
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
49:29
SPEAKER_00: The the women are magic women numbers, 1200 for guys, it's 18.
49:34
SPEAKER_01: So men, I say I say this joke now because Allie's gotten me up to eating like 2500 in maintenance, which is a catch 22.
49:42
SPEAKER_01: Because I'm like, I don't want to eat this much, but now I have to.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: Um, if I'm eating more than you, you're not eating enough.
49:50
SPEAKER_00: They they seriously, yeah.
49:52
SPEAKER_00: No, because like some of them have said something like she's eating this much, and I'm like, Yeah.
49:58
SPEAKER_00: And then I have guys who are like, Yeah, that's like an unheard of number to a lot of them because they are so used to living sub-2000.
50:08
SPEAKER_00: And then I get them to the point where now it's like obscene the amount of carbs they're eating.
50:12
SPEAKER_00: And I have one guy who I have at 625 several days a week.
50:16
SPEAKER_00: The other days he's at like 425 or 450, and he's struggling, and he just keeps dropping weight.
50:24
SPEAKER_00: And his last coach underfed him.
50:26
SPEAKER_00: I've increased his calories to 2300 over what he was eating.
50:31
SPEAKER_00: So we're almost at 4,000.
50:33
SPEAKER_00: He's like single-digit body fat.
50:35
SPEAKER_00: He's literally like the most insulin-sensitive individual I've ever met.
50:39
SPEAKER_00: He's 50 years old, he's a shredded monster.
50:42
SPEAKER_00: And I'm like, bro, you just got to eat more.
50:44
SPEAKER_00: Like, we have to get to a point where you stop dropping weight.
50:47
SPEAKER_00: Like, it's crazy.
50:49
SPEAKER_01: Well, that was almost like what happened with me.
50:51
SPEAKER_01: Like, it was just like rapid glycolysis, and we almost had to back off everything, right?
50:54
SPEAKER_01: Like we had to stop everything.
50:57
SPEAKER_01: I shared that this morning, where you know, people think it's also an instant process.
51:01
SPEAKER_01: And you get this with the men too, who men, you're just as bad as women.
51:04
SPEAKER_01: You're on the dieting hamster wheel too.
51:06
SPEAKER_01: You want results right away and to get shreddy and like what is it you say?
51:10
SPEAKER_01: Dick skin lean.
51:11
SPEAKER_01: That's your dick skin lean, yes.
51:14
SPEAKER_01: You want to get that way, but it takes a ton of time.
51:17
SPEAKER_01: And even when I hired you in June, I didn't actually start gaining until December because we had to actually like fix a bunch of stuff going on and eat and then take away.
51:27
SPEAKER_01: And then I think I was up to 450 grams of carbs at one time, and I was like, I have to drink my carbs.
51:33
SPEAKER_01: Like, I can't even eat all of these carbs.
51:35
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's what I tell them because they're you know, I have a lot of guys who are OCD and conditioned to not like eat things that aren't quote clean.
51:43
SPEAKER_00: So I'm like, you have to resort like when beyond 300 grams of carbs is usually when it's tough to eat it in rice.
51:49
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
51:49
SPEAKER_00: So I'm like, yo, honey, cereal, like granola, cream of rice, things that are very orange juice, like orange juice, yeah.
52:00
SPEAKER_00: Like Stan Affording loves orange juice.
52:02
SPEAKER_00: I know.
52:02
SPEAKER_00: Have at it, but they're like, cereal?
52:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, yeah.
52:08
SPEAKER_02: Cinnamon toast rice.
52:09
SPEAKER_00: What?
52:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
52:11
SPEAKER_00: Have some sour patch kids after training or something.
52:14
SPEAKER_00: Like, literally, when I posted that I I had two bowls of cereal with a Fairlife chocolate shake, like people were losing their mind and they're like, broke the internet.
52:23
SPEAKER_00: I gotta try this.
52:24
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, you should.
52:26
SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you get this too as a coach because you've been in the industry for so long.
52:30
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes things that are so common sense to you or so easy for you to do, like bowl of cereal with fair life, right?
52:36
SPEAKER_01: Is like, oh my god, to like a standard person who's just starting, and you're like, damn, I need to go back to the beginning to remember like what it was like to not know anything.
52:48
SPEAKER_01: That's my that's my flaw.
52:50
SPEAKER_01: I don't remember.
52:52
SPEAKER_00: I think about that when I go to like an airport lounge and I put like if Delta has actual what looks like grilled chicken and not rubber, and I'll put it in a cup and I get weird looks, to me, it's so normal.
53:08
SPEAKER_00: But like I realize to earth that that's weird.
53:12
SPEAKER_00: Cool.
53:12
SPEAKER_00: And explaining to new clients like how Instacart works, and you can order deli turkey and totally eat that and be fine and all of that, like it's a very, it's a foreign concept, but then that helps me realize like, all right, they don't really, they don't understand like what to get or how this works.
53:29
SPEAKER_00: It's just it's almost so simple that you overlook it.
53:32
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
53:33
SPEAKER_01: So even modifying menu items, like you know, sub out this or say no dressing, like you're allowed to do these things.
53:42
SPEAKER_00: Oh, I tell my I'm like, just send me the menu, I'll decide for you because they're terrible.
53:46
SPEAKER_00: Guys just need like strap structure and direction.
53:49
SPEAKER_00: So if you guys are married or work with or whatever with a guy, just provide specifics and then like two or three things.
53:57
SPEAKER_00: That's all they can handle at once.
54:00
SPEAKER_00: Ask one question, one question, ask one question at a time.
54:05
SPEAKER_00: I do it with my coaches.
54:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, I tell their clients, I'm like, if you're a female client, ask one question, wait till that one question gets answered, then ask the next question.
54:15
SPEAKER_00: If you ask three questions at once, you will only get one answered if that.
54:21
SPEAKER_01: So funny, but so true.
54:23
SPEAKER_01: Oh my god.
54:24
SPEAKER_01: Okay, real quick, because I don't want to make these episodes super long, but where can everyone find you on Instagram?
54:29
SPEAKER_01: How can they?
54:30
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna put everything in the show notes, but just if you're listening, um, where can they go to look at information on silverback?
54:36
SPEAKER_01: All of it.
54:37
SPEAKER_00: The Allie Gilbert.
54:39
SPEAKER_00: It's my Insta.
54:41
SPEAKER_00: Slide in there.
54:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, and then Silverback Summit is also an Instagram handle, but silverbacksummit.com if you guys are interested in that.
54:50
SPEAKER_00: But yeah, I answer all my DMs.
54:53
SPEAKER_00: Nothing's TMI in my world.
54:55
SPEAKER_01: So nothing is TMI, trust me, nothing.
54:58
SPEAKER_01: I do have one question I'm gonna ask you.
55:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm not, we've already talked about this.
55:02
SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna ask the other questions in the question box.
55:06
SPEAKER_01: I gotta, I have a little bit of like TG13 on my dot.
55:12
SPEAKER_00: I don't.
55:15
SPEAKER_01: Um one of the questions was does Nandrolone really help joints, or is that just what docs pretend so they can write the script?
55:25
SPEAKER_00: Um, yes, it does help joints.
55:28
SPEAKER_00: And I I like the the saying, is that what they pretend?
55:32
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
55:33
SPEAKER_00: Um, so they can write the script.
55:35
SPEAKER_00: Not a lot of them are very excited to write a script for that, but there are clinics that will provide that because it does help joint pain.
55:44
SPEAKER_00: But a lot of the times too, the joint pain is resulting from having very low estrogen.
55:48
SPEAKER_00: So if you're on anastrazole on TRT and you're thinking, oh, maybe I need DECA or Nandrolone, think, oh, if I'm on anastrazole, maybe that's the culprit.
56:00
SPEAKER_01: You need to just get off of that.
56:01
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
56:02
SPEAKER_01: Awesome.
56:03
SPEAKER_01: Ali, this has been great.
56:05
SPEAKER_01: Um, I know we kind of talked a lot about myths and stuff that has already been stigmatized, but I do ask at the end of all the podcasts with my guests, like if you had one thing that you want to tell people to just like like one thing that you think is um, why did I just forget the question?
56:23
SPEAKER_01: ADD brain, y'all.
56:24
SPEAKER_01: I I'm supposed to be the one that keeps you on track.
56:26
SPEAKER_01: And I need you to keep me on track because I cannot move.
56:29
SPEAKER_01: I cannot do this moving, packing, and like work at the same time.
56:34
SPEAKER_01: Um, something you think is super, super misunderstood in the fitness industry and the health industry that you just want to put out as a final message, what would that be?
56:46
SPEAKER_00: I know there's probably one.
56:48
SPEAKER_01: You have to pick one.
56:49
SPEAKER_01: We've talked about a lot of them already on the show.
56:51
SPEAKER_00: So I mean misunderstood, I think.
56:58
SPEAKER_00: I'm not good at these.
57:01
SPEAKER_01: You just you named like a million.
57:02
SPEAKER_01: You're like, I can't, I can't just pick one.
57:04
SPEAKER_01: Now you're like, I don't even know any.
57:06
SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's so many.
57:08
SPEAKER_00: Like, I think um, you know, protein intake is very misunderstood.
57:12
SPEAKER_00: Uh the GLP one drugs are misunderstood, testosterone is misunderstood.
57:18
SPEAKER_00: But honestly, like if we're talking to guys, I would say don't trust any insurance-based practices.
57:25
SPEAKER_00: Go to Merrick Health.
57:27
SPEAKER_00: Um and go to Meric Health.
57:30
SPEAKER_01: I was almost what just popped into my head, I don't know why, but I was gonna say, like, don't trust your boners.
57:35
SPEAKER_01: Just because you're getting wood doesn't mean that your testosterone is optimized.
57:39
SPEAKER_00: No, that that's a fantastic point because I always say, like, guys associate their test levels with their dick working.
57:45
SPEAKER_00: Your dick can work amazing and your test could be through the floor.
57:48
SPEAKER_00: How do you know the difference?
57:49
SPEAKER_00: If you have brain fog, if you have like your motivation's low and you just aren't excited about work or your family or anything else like that, like that can be a sign of low T.
57:59
SPEAKER_00: It does not have to just be associated with your boner.