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The 1-Message-a-Day System That Fills Your Pipeline · Mortgage Marketing Radio

0:00
Michelle, welcome back to the show.
0:03
Thank you for having me.
0:04
This is special.
0:05
Being with you in person.
0:06
Yes.
0:07
Very.
0:08
You're in Vegas.
0:09
Feel very full circle for me.
0:10
We're both here at the Mastermind Summit.
0:11
Yes.
0:12
This is the first time we're meeting IRL in real life.
0:14
Is that cheesy to say now?
0:15
I don't know.
0:16
But yeah, because we've known each other since 2019, right?
0:20
Crazy.
0:21
And that was when you were first on the podcast, I believe.
0:23
Second podcast I was ever on was you in 2019?
0:27
Well, we're glad to have you back.
0:28
And it's a rare air where somebody comes back for the third time.
0:32
I feel honored.
0:33
So, you know what I mean?
0:35
So it's because you have a lot of value to offer.
0:37
So let's do this.
0:38
Let's jump right in, right away.
0:41
For anybody who doesn't know, what would you like to say that you help people do on social media?
0:47
Great question.
0:48
So I teach mortgage and real estate professionals how to understand the power of leverage to create opportunity through social.
0:54
So this is not about virality.
0:55
This is not about how we get more followers.
0:57
How do we do any of that stuff, which I'm sure will unpack?
0:59
It's really about understanding that that stuff doesn't pay our bills.
1:03
It's very cliche saying, right, that likes don't pay our bills.
1:06
But what really does is creating value because creating value creates opportunity.
1:10
But I have some ways we can talk about that.
1:13
But at the end of the day, the long story short is teaching mortgage and real estate professionals
1:17
and really entrepreneurs in general.
1:19
How to outbound prospect through the social channels.
1:22
The big three Instagram Facebook and LinkedIn, which I'm sure we can unpack a little bit as far as you know,
1:26
how does that work and are they different?
1:28
Because yes, they the answer is yes, they are.
1:30
But understanding what leverage means when you're looking at social because most people will say,
1:35
yes, I get business from Instagram or yes, I get business from social or yes, I try to get business.
1:40
Wait, do you have two buckets, some that do and some that don't?
1:43
But most of the time the people that are coming to me are very much so in that bucket of,
1:48
I've been putting time and effort and energy into this and nothing's happening.
1:51
And I feel like I'm missing something.
1:53
And so that's where understanding leverage and understanding outbound prospecting through social really comes into play.
1:59
Okay, so there's a couple of nuggets in there.
2:01
I went on pack for sure.
2:02
But let me first tackle this.
2:03
When people come to you, you said you they're missing something.
2:06
Is there a pattern you see or top one or two things?
2:09
Absolutely, like two biggest things.
2:11
Number one question is I can't seem to grow.
2:13
Can't figure out why I'm not growing from my audience.
2:15
Correct.
2:16
Correct.
2:17
Which is the attachment to virality, right?
2:20
They're attached to how many followers they have.
2:22
They feel like followers create this.
2:24
Oh, well, I've grown.
2:25
So that means I'm doing good.
2:27
So you think that's a mistake.
2:28
I don't think it's a mistake.
2:29
I think it's the wrong question.
2:30
Okay.
2:31
So I'm not saying that that doesn't matter.
2:33
Okay.
2:34
But I'm simply saying that that's not what we're in it for.
2:36
You know, if you look at my social, I have 12,500 followers, but that's been since 2018.
2:41
Yeah.
2:42
So it's been a long six years, seven years almost to get from, I don't know what I started
2:46
with like 900.
2:47
Well, we all started zero, right?
2:49
Yeah.
2:50
I mean, I, I converted a personal one into a business one nine year or eight years ago.
2:55
And decide, Hey, I'm going to do this thing.
2:58
And that takes a lot of time, right?
3:00
But the point is, so again, I'm not saying it's wrong to care about that.
3:04
But that question of, I want to grow my following is not the right question to be asking when
3:10
it comes to you, how do I make social work for me?
3:12
That's my point.
3:13
The second big question is, Michelle, I'm not getting any engagement.
3:16
Like I, I feel like my content's good, but nothing's happening.
3:19
And I just feel like all I do is create content in it.
3:21
And I know my videos are fun or I have this every Friday or I do this type of content
3:26
every whatever day.
3:27
And it's so fun for me to do, but I feel like no one's seeing it.
3:31
And that's a super common question.
3:33
And so that then in turn creates two questions that I asked them, which we can talk about.
3:38
Yeah, I was going to ask you naturally, if that's the wrong question, what's the right
3:41
question?
3:42
Yeah, so when they ask me that, there's two follow up questions that I have of them.
3:46
Number one, are you sending a message to someone every single day that you don't know?
3:51
Right?
3:52
So the engagement question becomes a big conversation.
3:55
And you know, this is like a broken record for me because I swear I say it every single
3:58
time, but it's so important.
4:00
Are you sending a message to someone that you do not know every single day through one
4:04
of the big three platforms?
4:05
Or frankly, if you're a newer to this, doing it through all three, right?
4:07
I mean, sending someone a message to someone you don't know on Facebook, a message to
4:11
someone you don't know on Instagram and a message to someone that you don't know on
4:14
LinkedIn.
4:15
Okay.
4:16
Now, who that is is another part of this conversation, but doing that, are you sending
4:21
a message every single day to someone that you do not know through one of the big three
4:25
platforms?
4:26
I'm going to guess the most of the time the answer is no.
4:28
100%.
4:29
Yeah.
4:30
Very rarely.
4:31
Is it a yes?
4:32
I would say 99.7.
4:33
And yes, I'm making that number up, but 99.7 people, percent of people are going to say
4:36
no to that.
4:37
Second question is, are you breadcrumming?
4:39
So meaning are you creating exposure for yourself in a hyper-local environment?
4:45
And that's almost always no too.
4:47
And what breadcrumming means is we're commenting on content that is hyper-local to where we want
4:52
to be.
4:53
So if you're a real estate agent, if you're a mortgage professional, if you're an entrepreneur,
4:57
you know, selling sourdough bread in a local city, right?
5:00
The idea is, are you creating a breadcrumming trail for people to find you and follow you?
5:04
Okay.
5:05
So some people will say, yes to that, some people will say, well, yeah, I like in comment
5:09
on things here and there, but the problem is that there's zero strategy.
5:13
They just sort of wake up one morning and they're like, I'm just going to comment on
5:16
10 people's content.
5:17
And there's a lot of those strategies out there, right?
5:19
I'm sure you've heard of them.
5:20
10, 10, 10 and all that stuff.
5:22
Not bad.
5:23
But again, we have to create structure around it and we have to create an intentionality.
5:27
My favorite way of describing it is strategic alliances and strategic ways of looking at
5:33
something that says, is this serving me and understanding what my outcome or what the
5:38
outcome is that I want, which ironically, we're here at Mastermind Summit and that's
5:42
a big part of my keynote tomorrow.
5:43
Oh, awesome.
5:44
All right, lots of things I want to chase down here.
5:48
Let's go back to, are you DMing?
5:51
How many was it?
5:52
At least one?
5:53
At least one person.
5:54
So who do we DM and what do we say?
5:55
Yeah, strategic alliances, that's why I use that phrase, right?
5:58
So the way I look at it and I'll say this like as simple as possible.
6:03
Every morning when I wake up and I say, I have one job today, which is to send a single
6:08
message to someone that I do not know, I ask myself, who could that be based off of relationships
6:13
that I have?
6:14
Right.
6:15
So who am I leveraging to get to that new relationship?
6:18
It's just six degrees of Kevin Bacon or whatever, I mean, I guess.
6:22
But in my mind, it's, I have this amazing relationship with Jeff Simper.
6:26
Who does he know that I don't know?
6:28
Who has Jeff, like the way my brain would work is if Jeff is one of my levers, right?
6:32
Someone I can leverage.
6:34
Then I look at his profile and I say, who has he recently tagged himself with?
6:38
Who has he recently been present with?
6:40
Who has, what event has he been at that I maybe haven't spoken at?
6:43
Maybe I haven't been a part of maybe there's somebody there that runs something that he
6:47
has a really good relationship with that I can create an opportunity out of it for myself.
6:52
Now what that opportunity is, you have to have a very clear delineation between what's
6:58
my goal of sending this message and what do I want the outcome to be, right?
7:01
So I have three buckets, podcasting webinars and in-person speaking gigs.
7:05
All three of those things create the result that I want, which is a lead for myself, right?
7:09
So one single daily act in one of three or with one of three goals equals what I need
7:16
at the end of the day to put money money in my bank account, which is a lead.
7:20
So your outcomes are podcasting webinars and speaking engagements.
7:24
That's what you hope, that's your ultimate North Star.
7:27
Correct.
7:28
If you're a merge professional, honestly, those all three of those things could be the
7:30
same exact as mine, right?
7:31
You should be getting on.
7:32
I had this conversation at lunch today.
7:34
If you're a merge professional in our business right now, your goal has to be one to many,
7:40
not one to one, not saying one to one is an important and not saying our time together
7:44
right now is not insanely valuable.
7:46
But if you want to grow right now, it's got to be one to many.
7:50
A very good friend of ours, Cindy Erman, she did an amazing presentation on the concept
7:54
of one to many for a merge professional that's in the trenches right now.
7:58
What does that look like?
7:59
So again, if you're a merge professional listening to us right now, how do you go one to many
8:03
through social?
8:04
You find an opportunity that is going to get you in front of a mass population.
8:10
That could be teaching to an entire real estate office.
8:12
That could be teaching, you know, if you can teach CE great, you know, and again, you got
8:17
to get over here if you're a public speaking, but that's another conversation, which I'm still
8:20
petrified of public speaking.
8:21
You just wouldn't know.
8:23
That's a box breathing behind the stage, but and hopefully no one can feel that when
8:28
I come out, but so yeah, one, one goal every day, which creates one of, or which falls
8:36
into one of three buckets, which creates the ultimate outcome, which is the opportunity
8:41
for me.
8:42
So if you're a merge professional, it could be a realtor relationship.
8:44
So your goal is a realtor relationship.
8:45
Your goal is a vendor partnership, financial planner, CPA, divorce attorney, whatever it might
8:49
be.
8:50
And your goal could be the office branch manager of a big real estate office or getting
8:56
on podcasts.
8:57
Like honestly, a merge professional listening to this has more buckets than I do, if you
9:01
really think about it, they have even more opportunities that they can go find.
9:05
But again, the key is being very strategic about who you're trying to do that with.
9:10
So a podcast would, for example, be if I'm a loan officer here in Vegas, I might want
9:14
to find a real estate agent who's hosting a podcast or a local, you know, local oriented
9:19
podcasts.
9:20
Like what's happening in Vegas or something that would be relevant for me to find somebody
9:24
who interviews local and small businesses in your area, right?
9:27
I have a mortgage friend who lives in Kansas City.
9:30
He started a podcast and all he does is the interviews business owners all across the
9:34
city of all across the city, right?
9:37
And small business owners, big bit, he interviews basketball players for, you know, football
9:41
players like college, college team kids, just creating a really cool show that locals,
9:48
borrowers in Kansas City would want to listen to, right?
9:53
So if you think about it that way, if you're a real estate agent, you're going to want
9:56
on that show, right?
9:58
So that creates the lead comes to him.
10:01
So I could have backed that, but all right, well, that's, that's good.
10:05
Let's keep going.
10:06
So we talked about, let me ask you this.
10:08
There are people is saying, as you know, and or watching, who need help starting with
10:15
the who.
10:16
So meaning there are people like if I don't have the who, if I don't know, like, you
10:20
know what I mean, I want to be strategic with who I'm going to contact.
10:23
Can I also just do some search functionality on Instagram or wherever to find some of
10:27
my target people?
10:28
Yeah.
10:29
So the way I'll tell you to do it is build a spreadsheet.
10:30
I build them for all of our clients when they're going through this part of our program.
10:34
Five days of the week, each of the five days you have a different category.
10:37
Okay.
10:38
I hope in the morning you look at that and you say, this is the, this is the lane I'm
10:41
staying in.
10:42
No pun intended for foreshadowing.
10:44
You got different lanes, right?
10:46
You're saying you stay in your lane because we're talking about something which is a very
10:51
cliché term, but it is so popular in the social realm, which is shiny objects in
10:55
your room.
10:56
Right.
10:57
It's very easy to get on Instagram or to get on LinkedIn and get on Facebook and be
10:59
like, what the heck did I just do for two hours?
11:02
So for me, I don't have that kind of time.
11:04
I got a very busy schedule and a very full day and I have a four year old.
11:07
So you guys do the math, right?
11:09
I don't have that kind of time.
11:10
So I have to be very strategic about where I'm spending my time on that day.
11:14
So if I have one opportunity and or if I have one message to send, I have three buckets
11:20
of what the outcome is and with one result that I'm after, right?
11:25
Now all of those three for me are very strategically one to many on purpose, right?
11:31
Because a podcast is one to many, a webinar is one to many, a speaking engagement is one
11:35
to many.
11:36
One of your days could be office, real estate offices.
11:41
So who are the people who are running those offices?
11:44
Now you could say, I'm going to go find the office on Instagram, I'm going to go find
11:47
the office on LinkedIn.
11:49
But I would tell you to go to the person that runs the office, not the office page.
11:54
Why?
11:55
Because most likely it's ran by a social media manager or somebody and it's not your
11:58
gatekeeper.
11:59
So you have it.
12:00
Maybe you have a day in your tracker where your only goal is office owners and find the
12:06
people.
12:07
And you probably know the names.
12:08
So it's like identify people of leverage as well of influence, right?
12:11
Well, you're going to have to identify your own personal levers.
12:14
That's step number one.
12:15
Right?
12:16
Yes.
12:17
But we've already named a number of people in your backyard as a lot of us are listening
12:19
to this right now.
12:20
We've named broker owners, team leads, office, you know, all the people, the financial
12:24
advisors, people run a podcast, but levers, let's be clear.
12:27
Leavers are people you could name drop because you have a relationship with them, right?
12:32
So levers are your bridge.
12:35
So if I'm DMing you, give me an example in real life.
12:37
So if you and I know Cindy, but I don't know you, okay.
12:41
So let's, I'm going to flip it backwards because I, or else I'm going to get myself confused.
12:46
I don't know you, but I know Cindy.
12:48
I look at Cindy's Instagram every single day.
12:50
I look at Cindy's LinkedIn every single day.
12:52
She tags herself with this person.
12:53
I'm like, who is that person?
12:54
I don't know.
12:55
So I click on that person's profile.
12:57
Who are you?
12:58
What is your role?
12:59
What do you do?
13:00
Oh my gosh.
13:01
You're also connected to this person, this person, this person.
13:02
I consume your content for all of a minute and a half.
13:05
I can do it pretty quickly.
13:07
And then I send you a message saying, clout a little bit.
13:11
I have to make sure that you're like, oh, Michelle's the real deal.
13:13
But usually the way I do it is based off of someone that you know, that I know you know
13:18
that I've done something for.
13:20
So I'm looping that into the message.
13:23
But then I'm name dropping our lever, which in this case we're using Cindy as a fun example.
13:28
I would name drop Cindy to you and Cindy would then say most likely to you if you reached
13:33
out to her directly.
13:34
You would back me up.
13:35
What was you?
13:36
I'm not trying to put you on the spot, but let's keep going.
13:38
What was you say?
13:39
I give you some context of like, hey, Jeff, I saw you had an amazing episode with Cindy
13:43
Erman recently on your show.
13:45
She's one of my absolute favorite people.
13:46
I actually recently had her on my show.
13:48
I have a really cool podcast that I interview people only that are using social as a prospecting
13:52
tool or as part of their prospecting for their companies.
13:55
I would love to get on a call with you or zoom with you and see if there's some synergy
13:58
between the two of us because I have a podcast.
14:00
You have a podcast that might be fun.
14:02
Okay.
14:03
Cool.
14:04
I have a pretty strong call to action, which is a big issue for a lot of people, but instead
14:08
of just saying, Hey, are you free next week?
14:10
I'm going to say, Hey, Jeff, like, do you got some time on Monday?
14:12
My morning is a little open between 10 and 10 and 12.
14:15
So all right.
14:16
So that's nailing it down.
14:17
That's the who?
14:18
That's the what to say as an example in there.
14:21
And you're clearly right out of the gate going for a called action, which you just mentioned.
14:27
Some people have a hard time with you.
14:28
But the reason I say that is because some people, when they have a hard time with it, they're
14:31
doing it half-ass backwards.
14:32
I hope I can say it like that.
14:35
So you can see a preview of a message that someone sent me to you, right?
14:39
And especially on Instagram or like if I'm on my cell phone and I get, I know that I
14:42
got a message.
14:43
I can like swipe down without clicking on it and I can see the opening.
14:47
It's just of what it is.
14:48
Yeah.
14:49
So most and I had a client who did this and I swear it was like the biggest unlock for
14:53
him.
14:54
So we set him for you to go prospect.
14:55
We taught him all the things, taught him leverage.
14:57
He had done a great job at listing out his levers, crushed it on that side of the
15:01
assignment.
15:02
So we're like, great, Tim.
15:03
His name is Tim.
15:04
You're free.
15:05
You can go prospect.
15:06
Do it.
15:07
He sends us an email.
15:08
He sends me an email about a week later.
15:09
I sent 17 messages.
15:10
Michelle and not a single one of them is responded.
15:12
And a lot of them have left me on red, meaning they've read it and haven't responded.
15:16
And the ones that I got a couple of responses that were auto replies.
15:19
And I said, great.
15:20
Okay.
15:21
So we have an issue here.
15:22
Let's get on zoom.
15:23
He's a coaching client of mine.
15:24
Let's get on zoom.
15:25
Get on zoom.
15:26
I asked him to show me the messages.
15:27
I want to read them.
15:29
The very first sentence of his message was, hey, Jeff, I'd love to get on a call with
15:34
you next week.
15:35
Insert the rest.
15:36
Right?
15:37
He did a great job with leverage.
15:38
He named job the right person.
15:39
He created some clout in the middle of the message, but I didn't get to the middle of the
15:43
message.
15:44
I didn't even get to that.
15:45
Yeah.
15:46
Exactly.
15:47
It was a pitch from the first word.
15:48
Right away.
15:49
And how many of those do we get on LinkedIn every single day?
15:50
How many of those do we get on Instagram every single day?
15:52
So again, how you frame this is very, very important.
15:56
Hey, Jeff, my name is Michelle Burmick.
15:58
I know you probably have never heard of me and that's totally okay, but I just saw you
16:02
had Cindy on your podcast.
16:03
Cindy's been on mine.
16:05
You love Cindy.
16:06
You now most likely are going to feel real weird and guilty almost if you don't respond
16:10
to me.
16:11
That's the power of association.
16:12
Yeah.
16:13
Yeah.
16:14
I like that.
16:15
But the framing of the message can be done.
16:16
Yeah.
16:17
Framing is super bad.
16:18
It's very important because yeah, it's that first three seconds and it's probably even
16:21
less than that when you're seeing just that truncated message.
16:23
So step one is who are your levers?
16:25
Who are the people that you can confidently name drop and use quote unquote to get, to
16:30
create a bridge to the next person?
16:32
So levers.
16:33
You want to keep going?
16:34
No, go.
16:35
No, what's next after a lever?
16:36
Oh, oh, yeah.
16:37
So who are your levers?
16:38
Step number two, right?
16:39
Yeah.
16:40
Is what are the categories that you need to be pitching, quote unquote, in or what are the
16:43
categories?
16:44
As I mentioned for me, right?
16:45
What are the goals that I'm trying to accomplish, which is podcast webinars and speaking
16:49
major.
16:50
Correct.
16:51
So every real estate person, any entrepreneur, you and me are very similar, most likely.
16:55
Honestly, you and me might be identical in that sense because you should be getting
16:59
on other people's podcasts too.
17:01
You have your own.
17:02
It's the easiest in, right?
17:03
You've interviewed a ton of people.
17:04
I don't know how many hundreds of episodes you have, right?
17:08
But those are levers for you based off of the relationships you have to get to the next
17:11
one for you to go on their show or for you to go on a show that that person you've interviewed
17:16
has been on that you haven't been on.
17:18
So step number one, find your lever, step number two is categorize your outcomes, right?
17:23
What do you want out of it?
17:25
So that's where the Excel spreadsheet or that's where like you're, I call it the engagement
17:28
tracker, right?
17:29
Having your five days of the week, what categories are you putting in each of those five days?
17:33
And then your daily act, which is kind of step three here, is sending one message to someone
17:38
in each of those categories every day and doing it ideally through leverage.
17:42
It seems like an easy system to follow, right?
17:46
There's categories, outcomes seem simple, but why do, why does nobody do it?
17:51
Well, I think a lot of people haven't put it into the proper structure and framework.
17:54
Number one, I think a lot of people get on, you said this earlier, we get on social media.
17:58
The first thing we do is we get lost.
18:00
We get scattered.
18:01
We're not your word intentional.
18:03
We're taking down the same rabbit.
18:05
We just live in a noisy, noisy space.
18:07
Exactly.
18:08
Yeah.
18:09
And all of a sudden you're like, oh my gosh, like that video and 12 minutes later, you're
18:12
like, what the hell they get on here for?
18:13
Right?
18:14
Or what was I supposed to be doing right now?
18:15
Right.
18:16
That's the first, first and foremost key takeaway is the category, you know, the structure
18:21
you just laid out.
18:22
Number one, but really the bigger overarching is to be intentional and actually block this
18:25
on your calendar.
18:26
Very strategic about who you're, who you're doing it with so that you can only designate
18:31
because people ask me, well, how long should I, you know, give this every day?
18:35
Yeah.
18:36
I spend five minutes, 10 minutes a day doing it total.
18:40
That's it.
18:42
Now I don't have to, like just so we're clear, I don't have to bread crumb anymore.
18:45
So I do want to get into the breadcrumming side of things because I'm in a different
18:49
place in my career than I was when I first met you in 2019.
18:54
In 2019, I had to send that message.
18:56
I had to breadcrumb my butt off, right?
18:58
And you know, it feels very full.
18:59
I'm going to do my best not to cry, but I'm a very emotional person in general.
19:03
But meeting you in 2019, being the second podcast I was ever on, what an honor, right at
19:08
the time, but you don't understand that that became the next one for me became the next
19:13
one for me.
19:14
Because I understood that I now had leverage, I had built it, right?
19:19
So sometimes you have to get the first one.
19:21
And that's hard for some people, but every, even me back in 2019, I knew how to create
19:27
leverage.
19:28
I just had to get turned down a few times in order to get the one, yes, you should expect
19:33
to be turned down by the way.
19:34
100%.
19:35
Yeah.
19:36
Right.
19:37
And I was brand new into the mortgage space.
19:38
I was this young girl that people were like, who are you and what's your message?
19:41
And I remember the first podcast I was, I was ever on.
19:44
I will say I got turned down six times before I got a yes.
19:48
And once I got the yes, he even told me he said, you know, at the very least, let's record
19:53
it.
19:54
See how you do.
19:55
And if it turns out good, I'll publish it.
19:57
I don't, I didn't think he was going to publish it.
19:58
I was like, I remember getting off of it and just being like, did I do okay?
20:01
Was that, was that fine?
20:02
Was I valuable?
20:03
Like, you know, all the impostor syndrome type questions, he posts it.
20:06
He actually releases it into the world six months later, I get a message from him saying,
20:10
Hey, I've been following you and watching what you're doing and you're doing what I told
20:14
you to do.
20:15
And I was like, well, thanks, because yeah, like I'm in it to win it, quote unquote, right?
20:19
Like I want to grow my company, but getting the first one's hard and, but once you get
20:25
it and what's crazy is most people and, you know, we're in this conference together,
20:31
there's 500 people in there, every single one of those people, if you and I sat down with
20:35
them and asked them, Hey, who do you have in your life that you could name drop right
20:39
now to create a relationship with someone that you don't know?
20:41
It would take somebody a second, probably.
20:44
You shouldn't take more than a second because you probably have one right now, but, yeah,
20:48
but exactly, exactly, right?
20:49
So, but those people would probably need the marinade for just a second, but we are walking
20:54
around with levers in our life every single day.
20:56
Yeah, that's such a good point.
20:58
Of course, it reminds me of the book, Who Not How, right?
20:59
Yeah, I do, but breadcrumbing just real, very quickly breadcrumbing is leaving a
21:04
trail everywhere.
21:05
Yeah, unpack that a little bit.
21:07
So breadcrumbing is very simple, instead of one-to-one messaging, which is what I'm talking
21:10
about, sending one message every day to somebody you don't know, which takes five, seven minutes
21:14
max.
21:15
You're in the Starbucks line.
21:17
You're pick up line waiting to pick up your kid.
21:18
There's zero excuse to not do it, and anybody that has one, get an executive assistant
21:22
or hire someone to clean your house for you, so you have five minutes a day.
21:27
But breadcrumbing is one to many on social, right?
21:31
So that means I'm calm and you and I do this on LinkedIn all day every day, right?
21:34
We are like commenting on other people's content.
21:36
And then you wake up and you're like, oh, I have seven friend requests on LinkedIn.
21:38
Why does that happen?
21:39
Because I'm breadcrumbing.
21:40
I'm leaving a trail of Michelle comments on people that I love and trust and their content.
21:46
You post something of value and I like what you post.
21:49
I comment on it.
21:50
Someone else who doesn't know who I am sees it, who's this Michelle chick?
21:53
Well, I love Jeff.
21:54
So who's Michelle?
21:55
They obviously have a friendship.
21:57
Comment on it.
21:58
Now I have a new friend request or a new follow request or whatever you want to call it.
22:02
That's called breadcrumbing.
22:04
So doing that every day, I do it on LinkedIn pretty heavily now because I've been putting
22:09
a lot of emphasis on LinkedIn in the last six months for me personally.
22:12
Instagram is always going to be my favorite platform.
22:14
It just truly is.
22:16
But LinkedIn is a place where I haven't put a lot of energy over the years that I now see
22:21
an opportunity there for me with where I'm currently out in my career, especially with
22:24
a book coming out that I'm trying to focus on.
22:27
But breadcrumbing is that one to many acts.
22:30
Now it could be 10 comments a day.
22:32
It could be 20, but doing it intentionally on people's content where if someone sees
22:37
the comment, the relationship is clear, right?
22:41
I'm not going to just comment on someone that I've never heard of them ever in my life
22:45
without spending a few minutes understanding who they are so that I can leave an intelligent
22:51
comment.
22:52
Because at the end of the day, yeah, I want that new person to see my comment that doesn't
22:54
know me because that's an end to a new person.
22:56
But I could totally go on a 20 minute tangent on this, but I'll stop there and just say
23:01
it's a name trail, right?
23:03
And if you're doing it on Instagram, it's the same concept.
23:05
If you're a mortgage professional trying to create real estate agent relationships in
23:08
a local town or in a state for that matter, who are some of the top agents, great, this
23:14
is a great example, who are some of the top agents in your area that are using social
23:17
well.
23:18
They don't need to be the highest producing.
23:19
They need to be using social relatively well.
23:22
Now why is that impactful?
23:24
Because likely other realtors are looking at that realtor saying, wow, this realtor is
23:28
killing it on on social.
23:30
I'm going to try to learn something from them and they're going to see your comment.
23:34
Yeah.
23:35
Don't go sending.
23:36
I did this.
23:37
I did a keynote for a sales rally for a mortgage company recently.
23:41
And it was a two day thing.
23:42
So day number one was like breakout sessions.
23:44
Day number two was like the main keynote.
23:46
And in the breakout sessions, I was talking about creating these connections and like doing
23:51
breadcrumbing, finding mutual relationships, all this stuff.
23:53
And it was an hour of like training, right?
23:56
Next day, I'm in the keynote segment and in the Q and A, a lady raises her hand and
24:01
she's like, Michelle, I did what you said to do yesterday.
24:04
I sent 200 friend requests, but here's what happened is I got shut down like Instagram
24:09
shot me down.
24:10
And I was like, that is not what I said to do.
24:12
Let's be clear.
24:13
But go to her right, she was doing, she was taking action and trying to implement what
24:17
I was saying.
24:18
But again, you can do it.
24:19
You can certainly do it wrong.
24:21
Quick hot take, you're talking about the commenting thing and I agree.
24:26
And I would think most people would like to understand this by now, but most of the
24:28
commenting, would you agree, still is pretty weak?
24:30
Oh, it's horrible.
24:31
It's a dry vice.
24:32
Right.
24:33
I mean, it's so annoying.
24:34
Don't just DM me with a heart to my story and expect me to respond because there's
24:38
nothing for me to respond to there.
24:40
Or they use the, the, the, the, the, the templated responses, like on LinkedIn, people do this
24:45
all the, you know, how they prepopulate.
24:47
Yeah.
24:48
Oh, that was great.
24:49
Awesome.
24:50
You know what I mean?
24:51
No thought or energy into it.
24:52
Yeah.
24:53
Yeah.
24:54
So what would you like to tell people about that about like if you're going to really like
24:56
think about this, it's engagement, you know what I mean?
24:58
What does that mean?
24:59
It means like you and I both have a great mutual friend, Grant Wise.
25:02
He was my coach for many, many years and I absolutely love him.
25:05
But what I can tell you is he taught me something that will live with me forever, which is live
25:10
in the land of curiosity always, right?
25:13
What does that mean?
25:14
That means ask more questions than statements, right?
25:16
So live in this land of, well, tell me about that, like asking questions about it.
25:22
And when you're leaving a comment, you're not necessarily wanting to ask a question per
25:26
say.
25:27
But when you're in a one to one DM conversation, the worst thing you can do is send a sounds
25:31
good thanks period or awesome cool period exclamation point and expect for the person on the receiving
25:38
end of your message to actually do anything with it.
25:41
Because I always think of this as if you give a statement, do I have a reason to reply?
25:48
Is there any meat there for me to reply to?
25:51
In most cases, no, but if you ask a question, you can ask weird questions that will likely
25:55
get one word answers, but we won't unpack that for now.
25:59
But just live in this world of more questions because the curiosity, it almost makes the
26:04
person again on the receiving end say, I feel like a butt head if I don't respond to this
26:08
because this person is obviously putting time into it.
26:11
And they very rarely get somebody who's truly curious as well.
26:14
But I'll tell you that first message is everything.
26:16
Yeah.
26:17
All right.
26:18
Let's change it up here a little bit.
26:19
You've just laid out an awesome framework that anybody can take and implement in their
26:22
own business to grow their followers, to grow their engagement, to lead to relationships
26:28
ultimately.
26:29
More importantly, followers is a total residual, right?
26:33
Meaning like an after effect of all of this.
26:37
What I ultimately want every one of my clients to do, anybody listen to this, even if they
26:41
never hire me or never hire another coach for this, is sending one message a day every
26:45
day for 365 days.
26:47
Your business will not look the same as it does right now.
26:49
That is not a theory that is not a hypothesis that is like a freaking fact.
26:55
And I feel like you can attest to what you've seen me accomplish over the last five years
27:00
and understand that that is fact.
27:02
Let's just imagine that in a real world if you met a single person every day, right?
27:05
For at the end of the year, right?
27:07
Nobody's really actually doing that in real life, but you can on social media.
27:09
You can and you should.
27:12
For sure.
27:13
All right.
27:14
We want to get a little spicy.
27:15
Yeah.
27:16
Want to mix it up a little bit?
27:17
Before we hit record, we started talking about this concept of truth and lies in social
27:20
media.
27:21
Right.
27:22
We just shared some truths.
27:24
What do you think is a bunch of bullshit out there relies that you want to set the record
27:26
straight?
27:27
How I want to start carefully, I want to tread lightly right, but there are a lot of
27:35
people that are selling the wrong thing to the mortgage world, to the real state world,
27:41
to the aunt, anybody who's trying to use social and I see it every single freaking day when
27:46
I open Instagram or when I open LinkedIn, right?
27:49
Which is, here's all these cool viral hooks to help your videos go viral.
27:53
Or here's the best way to make seven second reels that are going to like all that stuff,
27:57
right?
27:58
Right.
27:59
And I'm not saying that those are not good things, right?
28:01
I'm not saying that I haven't learned a ton of those things and have implemented some
28:05
of those things.
28:06
What I am saying is that if that's all you care about, and if that's where you stop,
28:12
meaning like you create content in that mindset and then that's where you stop, you're going
28:16
to end up calling me, you're going to end up calling another person that, you mean
28:20
if you stop at the hook, meaning it's just like, okay, you got them there.
28:24
But what's next?
28:25
Correct.
28:26
Like, where's the depth, right?
28:28
Where's the like, who is this person and why would I hire them versus the person creating
28:33
the content is just very focused on follower growth, virality, virality, like they're just
28:38
missing the point.
28:39
You just said something there.
28:40
Most people don't really think about why would I hire you?
28:44
Most people are posting on social media, kind of what you talked about a moment ago with
28:46
no intention with just the fact that I feel I need to be there.
28:49
I don't know what the hell I'm doing, but I just better post some shit or else I'm going
28:53
to miss out.
28:54
Like, downloadable social media content calendar off the internet, national and chocolate
28:57
day and national take like all those were hot for a while, man.
29:00
It was, but that's my point is I really truly believe and I'm a god person.
29:05
So forgive me, but I really believe I was put on this planet to have a very big voice.
29:09
And I feel like I have finally found it.
29:12
And I think part of that is understanding that you got to call a bluff or call a spade
29:16
a spade.
29:17
And that stuff is great.
29:18
Having a content strategy is great, but there is a much better way that ultimately leads
29:24
to what we truly really need and care about.
29:28
And the root of that is being a real human being.
29:33
But what I want to say is these sample content calendars are good if you have no freaking
29:37
clue how to get the first post out, right?
29:40
If you're in this like I'm just like paralyzed and not sure where to start.
29:44
It gets you flowing.
29:45
At least you're reflecting some muscles.
29:46
It's getting you flowing.
29:47
Like you got as Cindy said today on stage, it's putting reps in, right?
29:52
You're putting reps in, but where the real, real change happens and where the real value
29:57
happens is my content strategy and when Michelle, when Michael makes content, I take a relationship
30:02
like this, a conversation like this that I just had, a meeting I just had, and I create
30:07
content based off of that, right?
30:09
Why?
30:10
Because you and I are having a really cool conversation right now and the first thing,
30:13
one of the many things actually, but the first thing that came to my mind is hold on.
30:17
How do I turn this into a post based off of how you queued me up on this podcast, right?
30:23
So I'm reverse engineering and you'll hear me talk about this a lot when it comes to
30:27
what we'll get to.
30:28
But I reverse engineer every conversation.
30:31
I process it and I say, so Jeff's my ideal audience and for those who are watching you
30:35
saw me, I just close my eyes, but that's like literally what I do is I sit there and
30:39
I say, how do I reverse engineer this and create a piece of content that is going to add
30:43
value and credibility to me for the next one versus I'm just going to go create content
30:50
to create content.
30:51
But I don't really know who I'm serving, whereas I know you're who I want to be serving.
30:56
I know that the next podcast that I want to get on, I want to make sure I have a little
31:00
bit of a different message or a secondary message, right?
31:03
So I'm like, how do I take this conversation and create content that will then get a yes
31:09
when I ask for another podcast or help confirm I'm going to get the yes for the next speaking
31:14
gig or whatever it might be.
31:16
So when you say reverse engineer, you're thinking like even from the caption, the thumbnail,
31:22
what may be the text that's on the thumb, the whole thing.
31:24
I'm thinking like, what even is the content I'm about to make?
31:28
I have pillars, right?
31:29
Which I everybody needs to have kind of categorically like some ideas of what type of content they
31:35
should be producing.
31:36
Value series is the number one most important one that I teach in my world.
31:39
I coined the term back in 2019.
31:41
It's essentially a five part video series where you combine passions and pain points.
31:44
What are some of the things you enjoy doing outside of work?
31:46
How do you combine that with the pain point of your ideal client, right?
31:49
So if you are one of my ideal clients, hypothetically podcast host, what pain points does a podcast
31:57
host have about who they want on their show?
32:00
And then how can I use this to create a caption and a piece of content that says to the next
32:06
podcast host who reaches out or who sees my content, hey, Michelle's not just going to
32:11
come on my show and talk fluff.
32:13
Michelle's going to get deep and real and that's the type of guest that I want, right?
32:17
So the pain point for podcast guests in most cases is they don't just want to guest for
32:20
the sake of getting a guest.
32:21
Right.
32:22
I get emails all the time, hey, Michelle, we have this great person for your podcast.
32:25
Dilly, right?
32:27
Like that's not what I want.
32:29
For sure.
32:30
So I reverse engineer what the actual piece of content is value series is just one of the
32:34
four based off of a pillars or the pillars.
32:37
Okay.
32:38
Um, I think that's, that's, you know, in terms of truth and lies, that's probably a good
32:43
one.
32:44
A takeaway.
32:45
Another lie.
32:46
If I can just be super fast and about it and Candid is, uh, take, go ahead is the in house
32:50
marketing stuff has got to stop.
32:52
What do you mean?
32:53
The templated cliche has got to stop and corporate.
32:56
Here's what's happening with the market.
32:57
Forgive me for ruffling feathers, but I've been known to do so, um, never, um, I've been
33:03
known to do so, but I had an amazing meeting a couple of days ago, right, actually right
33:07
before I came to Vegas, um, with a leader of a, of a large mortgage company and she's
33:12
like, Michelle, I think you're, you're the reason I'm going to let go of the in house marketing
33:17
team.
33:18
Wow.
33:19
And I said, I don't want anyone to lose their job.
33:20
That's not what I said, right?
33:22
I just think that that $50, $55,000 position, whatever you're paying the lady or gentleman
33:29
at the front desk or to help, you know, all of the, and there's a mutual friend of ours
33:33
that, um, I won't name names right now, but I'm going to tell you off air because it
33:36
just made me remember it, um, she was a great example of a very, very valuable human being
33:41
that had a ton of knowledge, but she was so stuck in this role that she wasn't allowed
33:47
to help individual and officers create an individual identity, right?
33:50
She wasn't allowed to do that because they didn't give her the runway, right?
33:55
So she wanted to, she felt like she was in a street jacket and she was making $55,000
34:00
a year for a company that should have been paying her a hundred grand to have more
34:02
time or to give her more freedom to support these loan officers on an individual level.
34:08
So this company that I had a meeting with, they, the, the woman said to me, Michelle, I'm
34:13
going to let those people go and I want you to come in as a fractional leader and just
34:18
coach this team on what to do.
34:20
And then we're going to hire someone like you to be full time in the office.
34:24
And I want you to coach them.
34:26
I was just like completely blown away by the conversation and honored.
34:29
But at the end of the day, I was like, I don't want anybody to lose their job.
34:31
Right.
34:32
They just need to do it differently.
34:33
Yeah, exactly.
34:34
She could probably be trained a thousand percent, but, but again, the company isn't supporting
34:39
the training or the growth.
34:41
They're saying, Hey, this in house marketing content is better than nothing.
34:44
And this is a Baltimore word I'm doing.
34:47
I think you'll be at momentum builder later this year, right?
34:49
I'm doing a keynote at momentum builder on indifference.
34:51
And so that's, that's where I'll go here for just a moment.
34:54
That in house marketing content in the company's mind is we're checking the social media
34:59
box.
35:00
Go us.
35:01
But what happens is all you're doing is creating a massive amount of indifference in
35:05
your audience.
35:06
Because if you look at a mortgage company, how many of those L.O.s that work for that
35:09
company all have the exact same shit?
35:11
Exactly.
35:12
And we see it every single day, but nobody wants to call the bluff.
35:14
And I'm calling the bluff because it's got to stop.
35:16
It's not helping.
35:17
In difference, what does indifference mean?
35:19
Indifference essentially means I don't care enough to say yes, but I also don't care enough
35:22
to say no.
35:23
So I'm kind of like me.
35:24
I could go either way.
35:26
But how do we overcome indifference or what has even happened in the first place is action
35:31
is drive or driven by emotion.
35:34
I said that backwards, but action is driven by this sort of tug or emotional feeling.
35:40
And if I don't feel anything, I don't care.
35:44
There's no sense of urgency.
35:45
There's no decision that needs to be made.
35:47
There's no like, oh my gosh, like wow, Jeff, I didn't know that about you.
35:52
Holy smokes.
35:53
I want to know your more of your story.
35:55
Great example.
35:56
When we watch the TV shows Love Island, which is like this big pot.
35:58
I don't watch it at all, but I have a ton of girlfriends that watch it.
36:02
And I used to watch the bachelor and the bachelor at way back in the day.
36:06
I run a company and have a four year old.
36:08
I don't got time for that shit anymore, but for me, the biggest thing about that and
36:12
why that's important is when we watch those shows, what happens, right?
36:16
We immediately go and we try to follow them all on social or like, oh my gosh, like I
36:20
want to know what's going on with this person or what are going on with that person.
36:23
And that's an emotional driven decision.
36:28
One of my favorite shows is Alone, the TV show on Netflix.
36:31
I think it's on Netflix mostly, but if you're not familiar with the show, they basically
36:35
pick 10 to 12 people.
36:37
They drop you in the middle of nowhere.
36:38
One of my favorite seasons was they picked 12 people and they put them in the middle
36:41
of nowhere in Patagonia and you have nothing but your backpack and then you get a list
36:45
of things and you can choose 12 things off the list that you get to bring with you and
36:48
that's literally it.
36:49
No food, no water, nothing, right?
36:52
And they drop you in this random ass place.
36:54
You have to make your own shelter, find your own food and the idea is the last person
36:59
standing wins a million dollars.
37:01
But the key is, or the interesting part of it is you have no idea when someone else drops
37:06
out.
37:07
So you have no clue if there's 10 people left, four people left, like you just don't
37:09
know, right?
37:10
So you truly have to be the last man standing by pure grit and determination and desire,
37:16
right?
37:17
And frankly, discipline and knowledge and all of those other things, but mental game
37:20
has to be there, all that stuff.
37:22
I always joke, my husband was a green beret and I was like, baby, you'd crush that.
37:26
And he's like, I have a four year old now, babe.
37:27
I wouldn't be able to do that.
37:29
Before we had kids, I bet he would have been just fine.
37:32
Because if you watch the dads, a lot of the dads struggle with like being gone from
37:35
their families on the show, even though they're like bad ass dudes, they struggle with
37:39
the emotional detachment from their family.
37:42
But what I was going with all of that is what happens as we watch the show and the first
37:46
thing we want to do is we want to go follow them on Instagram because we're like, what
37:48
are they up to now, right?
37:50
That emotion is what drives action.
37:52
So when you create indifferent type in house marketing content, you're basically telling
37:58
everybody to go somewhere else.
37:59
Pretty much.
38:00
Yeah.
38:01
There's no reason they connect or follow you.
38:03
So yeah, you pretty much don't exist and we'll connect with somebody who might be a little
38:06
more engaging with their content on social, even if it's controversial.
38:10
Well, hey, controversy sells.
38:12
All right, real quick.
38:14
I want to make sure we have make time to talk about this amazing accomplishment that you
38:18
have.
38:19
You're about to birth into the world, not not a second child, right?
38:23
I wish, but no, but your book, right?
38:26
The black line.
38:27
Yes.
38:28
Only about the title and then whatever you want to share about the book.
38:31
Why a book?
38:32
Why now?
38:33
What are you hoping to accomplish with the book?
38:34
I'm probably going to cry.
38:35
So forgive me.
38:36
We have tissues in there.
38:37
It's a fear.
38:38
We don't got water though.
38:39
All the time.
38:40
I, the day I graduated from college, you probably remember seeing this video.
38:44
I posted it on LinkedIn, but I was on another podcast episode, mutual friends of ours from
38:49
the knowledge tube.
38:50
And they invited me up to Portland and I got to do this really amazing in person podcast
38:54
with them.
38:55
That was like two and a half hours long.
38:56
It was insane.
38:57
But it was so fun and they asked me this question, they're like, where did this come
39:01
from?
39:02
You know, like most people don't just wake up one morning and they're like, I'm going
39:04
to write a book today.
39:05
Like that's not typically how this happens.
39:07
But the day I graduated from college back in 2012, I told my dad that day.
39:13
And I remember it like just yesterday as if it had literally just happened.
39:16
I said, Dad, I'm going to write a book someday.
39:18
I have no idea what it's going to be about.
39:20
I don't know what the title is going to be.
39:21
I don't know what the point of is.
39:22
Autobiography is at nonfiction is I have no clue.
39:26
All I know is I feel like there's something in my body that has to come out.
39:30
And it's almost like this little girl that's screaming for something.
39:36
And I don't know what that is.
39:37
Right.
39:38
I do now, but I didn't at the time.
39:40
And so I said, Dad, I'm going to write a book someday.
39:42
I have no idea what it is.
39:43
I just feel like I have a voice.
39:44
And when I find it, I'm going to let you know.
39:46
And fast forward from 2012 to 2025, where we sit today, there have been four very big
39:53
storms in my life that I speak about very openly, one of which I've never spoken about,
39:58
but I'm not afraid to.
40:00
First and foremost was when I graduated from college, I retired from swimming, swam for
40:05
20 years, and I had a massive identity crisis.
40:08
All of a sudden I went from, I've been an athlete literally since I was five years old.
40:11
I had a coach.
40:12
I had practiced to be two.
40:13
I had something I had to do like I had a trajectory of where my life was going.
40:17
And all of a sudden that was taken away not because of any bad thing, but just I graduated
40:22
from college.
40:23
And I was in the middle of a four years out from a quad, meaning I had a full four years
40:27
before the next Olympics, which meant I was either going to train for another four years
40:31
and try to make Olympic trials and try to go to the Olympics or I was going to go get
40:35
a job.
40:36
And the reality of it is I wasn't quite good enough to go to the Olympics and I knew that.
40:40
And I made that decision of today, I'm going to go get a job.
40:44
So I went through this big identity crisis.
40:47
I ended up in a very unhealthy relationship after that that I, you know, we're still
40:54
friends to this day.
40:55
This particular gentleman and I are still friends, which is great.
40:59
But I got very unhealthy physically.
41:01
I had gained about 25, almost 30 pounds, which for I'm only five three.
41:05
So that was a lot for a very small frame.
41:08
And I had been shredded my whole life, right?
41:11
So to go from that to not that.
41:14
Or as a day where my dad called me, I was living in Michigan at the time.
41:17
And my dad called me and he said, honey, are you sitting down on like, no, dad, I'm getting
41:20
ready to go.
41:21
Like, what do you want?
41:22
You know, like, and that was my first problem as I should have shut up and like, talked
41:25
to my dad more.
41:27
But my dad was like, honey, no, please sit down.
41:29
I need to tell you something.
41:30
And I was like, okay.
41:31
So I was like, okay, then I'm sitting down and he's like, honey, I have stage four non-hotch
41:35
in Symphoma and I have six months to live.
41:37
And I was in Michigan.
41:38
I hadn't been home since 2012 or 2008.
41:41
I went to college in 2008.
41:43
I hadn't been home since then and it was 2014.
41:46
So I'd been gone for what is do my math six years.
41:49
I felt like shit.
41:50
You hadn't seen your dad for six years.
41:52
No, I hadn't been home, meaning like I hadn't lived at home in six years.
41:55
I'd seen my dad plenty of times.
41:56
But I was always the girl who was like, I'm never moving back home.
42:00
Like I'm super independent.
42:01
I went from Southern California growing up to Rutgers, which is as far away from home
42:04
as I could possibly go without going out of the country.
42:07
Very independent person.
42:08
I always have been that way.
42:10
Second child syndrome maybe, I don't know.
42:13
But my dad said that to me and my whole world stopped.
42:17
Everything stopped.
42:18
I immediately got on my computer, tried looking for flights.
42:21
And my dad said something to me and I'll never forget this ever because how could you?
42:25
He said, honey, yes, you can come home.
42:27
We'll help you move home.
42:28
Yes, I understand you want to be home with your dad, all this stuff.
42:31
But what I actually really want is I want you to go find fitness again.
42:35
And I'll never forget what he said.
42:36
But he was like, I don't even care if it's bad men, just find something.
42:40
And I was like, oh my gosh, dad, okay, in the moment, he was, he was truly just trying
42:45
to get his daughter back to who she was and who she had always been.
42:49
And so I remember getting in my car driving to the ex-boyfriend's house, which is stupid,
42:53
but how many of us can relate to that?
42:56
Driving to the ex-boyfriend's house and I'm like, shit, my gas light is on.
42:58
I got to get gas.
42:59
So I stopped in a parking lot or a gas station parking lot to get gas.
43:02
And I'm crying mascara everywhere, like I looked at disastrous.
43:06
And I noticed when I looked up waiting for the gas to fill that there was a crossfit
43:10
gym in the parking lot.
43:11
And I had heard of CrossFit.
43:12
I had lots of friends who had gotten into it after college from retiring from swimming.
43:17
And I was like, I don't really know what that is, but I'm pretty fit.
43:20
So whatever.
43:21
I'll just walk in.
43:22
So I walked into the CrossFit gym and I'd be lying to the back of the gym to the person
43:26
who appeared to be in charge.
43:27
And I said to the guy, I was like, I'm coming in tomorrow.
43:29
I'm going to start.
43:30
Your best athlete, what time is class?
43:33
Sure enough, I came back the next day, started CrossFit.
43:36
And there in lies my next almost seven year journey with CrossFit, became a very elite
43:41
CrossFit.
43:42
Almost went to the games and that in turn turned into storm number two for me.
43:49
Storm number two, number three, number four, I'll skip two and three for sake of time and
43:54
tell you that there was some suicide conversation happening in my life.
43:59
There was a domestic abuse situation for me that turned into a five year relationship
44:04
and leaving him 80 days before I got married, which cost my family $50,000.
44:09
And then CrossFit was taken away from me because of the structure of going to the CrossFit
44:13
games.
44:14
It had changed again, another identity crisis, which leads to a suicide conversation,
44:20
which then in turn two months later leads to me meeting the love of my life and meeting
44:23
my now husband.
44:25
And fast forward to storm number four is I lost November, I lost our second baby.
44:35
I'm trying not to cry.
44:39
In the middle of a miscarriage that took 14 months to create in the first place, God gave
44:45
me the message.
44:46
He gave me my voice.
44:48
And I called a copywriter who I had been recommended to and we had kind of had a couple of meetings
44:52
and I was like, I know that this is all my heart, but I'm not really sure.
44:55
I'm not clear, but it's good to know you.
44:56
It's good to have the contact.
44:58
I called him and I said, Steve, I'm ready.
45:00
I got it.
45:03
And there in turn lies the creation of the black line and the black line essentially documents
45:09
four storms, but in parallel to how I've built my entire company, which is the black line
45:16
is a straight line on the bottom of a pool.
45:19
If anyone is ever swam, you know that that is how you make sure you go the shortest distance
45:24
from point A to point B.
45:25
It also makes sure you don't veer off into someone else's lane, Chinese objects syndrome.
45:29
If you get it, it also becomes that visual metronome where for me in a lifelong relationship
45:36
with untrustworthy people and other things that had happened to me personally over those
45:41
years, the black line was really the only friend I had for a very long time.
45:47
And so it was this trustworthy thing that if I just followed it, eventually I would get
45:51
to the other side, I would do a flip turn, turn around and come back and I would finish
45:54
the race literally like the event I was swimming, right?
45:57
So as it relates to work, when I had a miscarriage, I'll never forget this, but one of my very
46:03
closest and best friends in this industry calls me the day after obviously she knows that
46:07
I'd miscarried, which was a very, very traumatic experience for us because it took six weeks
46:13
for a doctor to diagnose that that was what was happening.
46:16
So it was horrific.
46:18
I wanted for women have miscarriages and yes, I was a little over nine weeks, so I was
46:23
by no means like full term or any of that, but doesn't take away from what happened or
46:29
losing a baby that you fought so hard to make in the first place.
46:34
But I'll never forget this.
46:35
She calls me and she's like, Michelle, you've gotten really far away from who you are.
46:40
In those six weeks, I couldn't work.
46:42
Obviously I was barely prospecting.
46:44
I didn't have enough money in the business bank account to make payroll again unless
46:46
I went and found a bunch of money like that's where I was at because I was so wildly depressed
46:52
from going through this experience.
46:55
So she says, Michelle, you got to get back to who you are and you are relentless and you
46:58
have to go back and be that person because she's in there, right?
47:02
And so that is the black line as it relates to the book on the business side, which is
47:07
the black line in my mind is the prospecting side of things.
47:12
It is the black line or the prospecting aspect of modern sales, right?
47:18
Is how I look at it because the black line concept is follow the line, do exactly what
47:24
I'm telling you to do.
47:25
Send one message every day for 365 days and your business will not look the same as it
47:29
does currently in a year.
47:32
So the black line concept, right, is if you follow it, which is the plan that we've laid out
47:37
for the first half of this episode, you will grow your company, you will grow your business,
47:41
you will do more loans.
47:43
I will grow my company, right?
47:44
November was one of the worst months in my company career ever, right?
47:49
And I've been a business for almost 11 years.
47:52
June in hopefully, right, May, we're in June right now, but May was the second best month
47:57
of my entire career.
48:00
June was the first month as an entrepreneur, which we can all relate to this.
48:03
June was the first month, June of 2025, the month we were sitting in was the first month
48:08
I started the month in the green ever as an entrepreneur, meaning I didn't start the
48:12
month having to go or in a deficit, having to go find money in order to not be in the
48:19
red, right?
48:20
July will likely be, even though I'm going on vacation for eight days, July will likely
48:25
be the biggest month of my career.
48:26
So how does that happen in November?
48:29
I lose a baby and I have a friend call me and say Michelle, you got to get back to who
48:32
you are.
48:33
From the November through, you know, January, February, I don't remember the exact date,
48:39
but I every single day without fail, there was not a day Saturday or Sunday that I did
48:44
not send a message to someone that I didn't know.
48:46
I laid seed after seed after seed after seed after seed after seed and I just did not
48:51
stop.
48:52
I didn't stop.
48:53
So black line is for me sending one message every single day without fail through leverage
49:00
to someone that I didn't know.
49:02
And six months later, we're having a very different conversation and no, I'm not pregnant
49:06
again.
49:07
I wish I was, but we are obviously excited about what God has in store for us.
49:15
And that's great.
49:16
That's what it is.
49:17
Thank you for sharing that story.
49:18
I know it's not always pleasant to relive all that, but I think it really helps.
49:22
And you talked earlier about connection and for people listening right now, like, yeah,
49:28
I'm connected with Michelle.
49:29
I don't know what was the most impactful thing you've heard on this episode so far because
49:33
I'm certain there's going to be more than one.
49:37
I don't even know where to go from here because it's like, I'm impacted by the story here.
49:41
I'm getting welled up.
49:44
I guess how do we put a bow on this?
49:47
I think my takeaway is I'm just sitting here letting this kind of wash over me now is
49:50
like, what would you like to say for somebody who might, we can all relate to veering off
49:58
of the black line and getting lost.
50:00
Maybe somebody today was inspired.
50:02
So what would you like to say to them final words of like, if you've been lost, if you've
50:06
been confused or if you're feeling lack of direction, it's been a tough two, three years
50:10
in this industry.
50:11
Everybody can say like, what would you, how would you like to close yourself?
50:13
It's an amazing question and you framed it perfectly for where I think you were going
50:18
to go.
50:19
So I'm like, my brain was, what should I say, right?
50:22
But here's the thing is right.
50:23
The mortgage industry has been really hard for the last few years.
50:25
We all know it as a business owner that serves the mortgage industry.
50:28
We've felt it.
50:29
I'm sure you felt it just the same.
50:31
There is a way out of it.
50:33
There is a path out of it.
50:35
And you have to ask yourself, what is your black line, right?
50:39
What is the one thing that you have to do every single day to get yourself out of it?
50:43
All of the other things that you need to be doing in a daily, on a daily basis to run
50:46
your company, those things are not going to change, right?
50:48
Yes, you need structure.
50:49
Yes, you need to schedule time for fitness and all that stuff.
50:53
You commented on a post recently and I've been quoting you like so much.
50:57
I was going to say relentlessly, but a lot on, you know, the old flex used to be Rolexes
51:03
and Range Rovers and the new flex really is fitness and I really believe that.
51:07
And we had a conversation at two nights ago at dinner where I was talking about you and
51:10
I said, Jeff commented on something.
51:12
I posted it was an article.
51:13
I posted on LinkedIn and you said, you know, it used to be Rolex and Range Rovers and really
51:17
the new flexes fitness and I couldn't agree more.
51:20
So long story short, all of those things are still going to be there, right?
51:23
We need help with systems and processes and how I'm sitting here in the middle of needing
51:27
help with systems and processes for the trajectory that I'm on, especially with writing a book.
51:32
I've never written a book before.
51:33
I don't know what to do.
51:34
Like I'm learning as I go.
51:36
But my black line has never changed, which at the end of the day, what is a mortgage professional,
51:41
what is an entrepreneur?
51:42
What is anybody who sells anything or is in a service-based business need?
51:46
We need leads, right?
51:47
We need opportunities that create top of funnel leads for us to sell to.
51:52
So how do we get those?
51:53
And that is the black line.
51:54
The black line is you must prospect every single day with intentionality.
51:58
You must send one message without fail to someone that you do not know through leverage
52:04
and you will not be in the same position that you currently are in 365 days.
52:08
So that ties back to the very beginning of our conversation, which is one message a day
52:14
in one of those three buckets or with the intention of getting one of those three things,
52:19
which in turn creates what we all need at the top of our funnel, which is a lead.
52:23
So the leads, the leads are out there, man.
52:24
And are you taking action?
52:26
And I know you'll be here for my keynote tomorrow.
52:29
So what is your black line?
52:31
You got to ask yourself that question and you got to get back to it.
52:34
I love it.
52:35
Yeah, that's fantastic.
52:36
I think that's an excellent point to go out on because at the end of the day, we're all
52:40
in this industry, ultimately, yeah, if we're not moving the chains forward, so to speak,
52:46
right, in our business and making progress and generating leads and we got to make money
52:50
so we can support our families and do all the things that we want to do.
52:52
So I love the fact you laid out a very simple framework for people to copy here and implement
52:57
their business.
52:58
So for those who do want to connect with you, where would you like them to connect?
53:01
Anywhere Instagram, Facebook, LinkedIn, Burma Media, social on Instagram, LinkedIn,
53:06
Michelle Burma, Michael, Facebook, Michelle Burma, Michael, but you know, you can't pre-order,
53:10
not quote unquote, buy the book yet as far as pre-order is concerned.
53:14
But if you'd like to be on the pre-order list for when we are officially available for pre-order,
53:18
which will be very soon.
53:19
We're working on a early August 8th, hopefully.
53:22
My son's birthday is August 25th.
53:24
So our goal is to have a book in my hand that I am physically holding by August 25th.
53:30
I think we'll be a little ahead of that, which is awesome, but you can DM me the word book
53:33
and I'll just add you to the pre-order list because that way once I know you all know.
53:38
Right.
53:39
So to minimum, follow you on all the socials, DM her the word book, right, to get on the
53:43
pre-order list.
53:44
And lastly, once again, if this was an impactful message or one key takeaway from this, just
53:48
let us know.
53:49
Comment on Michelle when you follow her, let her know, send her a DM.
53:53
And that's it.
53:54
We appreciate it.
53:55
Michelle, thank you so much.
53:56
Thanks for having me, Jeff.
53:57
All right, everybody.
53:58
You know what to do.
53:59
Take care.
54:00
We'll see you on the next one.
54:01
Bye for now.