Latest / Not All Business / The Truth About GLP-1s, From Someone Who Was There From the Start

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The Truth About GLP-1s, From Someone Who Was There From the Start · Not All Business

• 0:00
  You've seen the ads. You've heard the names Ozembic
• 0:03
  with Govi and Zepbound. Maybe you've asked your doctor
• 0:06
  about them. Maybe you're on them.
• 0:08
  But what do you actually know about how GLP ones work?
• 0:13
  Today we're talking to Doctor Linda Shapiro Manning, a
• 0:16
  physician with both an MD and a PhD who's been working in
• 0:20
  obesity medicine since before GLP ones were a household name.
• 0:24
  She was in the room when these drugs were first being developed
• 0:28
  and watched this go from a niche treatment to a cultural
• 0:32
  obsession. She's here to bust myths, give
• 0:35
  you the real answers, and remind us that your body is your
• 0:39
  business. So welcome to Not All Business,
• 0:42
  a podcast by two former CEO's who went from competitors to
• 0:46
  friends. I'm Blakely Graham and my Co
• 0:48
  host is Heather Cooper, and we're joined by our producer
• 0:52
  Clay Cornell. Now let's get down to business.
• 1:02
  OK, Blakely, I'm just going to start the show by saying you
• 1:06
  look beautiful today. I like your blouse.
• 1:08
  I like this glow that you have going on which is lovely.
• 1:13
  This is Heather trying to create a safe space for me as I
• 1:17
  switched out my backdrop a little bit and my lighting is
• 1:19
  all screwed up, but it's all good.
• 1:21
  I'll be drama today while I work it out, so I appreciate.
• 1:24
  There's a spotlight on you and we can just zoom like switched
• 1:27
  it Blakely, and you can say something very profound.
• 1:31
  Well, I hope that happens today. I've been waiting to be
• 1:34
  profound. Well, I'm going to, I'm going to
• 1:36
  set you up for this. You have a profound and very
• 1:39
  exciting announcement that I think our community is going to
• 1:42
  be very excited about. So why don't you?
• 1:44
  So profound, we have created a new community to talk about
• 1:49
  creating a safe space that you just tried to do for me,
• 1:53
  Heather. We created a community on a new
• 1:56
  platform. So we just opened the doors on
• 1:59
  Sub Stack. We're at not all
• 2:02
  business.substack.com and we did it for a few reasons.
• 2:06
  One, we needed a way to communicate with everyone.
• 2:11
  And so this enables us to communicate.
• 2:13
  So we have this great Casual Fridays newsletter that we send
• 2:16
  almost every Friday. Like I don't want to commit to
• 2:19
  every Friday because like, what if I want to take a vacation one
• 2:22
  week but it's almost every Friday, remember?
• 2:24
  When you got OK, You know what, Clay?
• 2:26
  I think when you edit this, I would love, I would love for you
• 2:30
  to like to flip back to that one day where I was like, yeah,
• 2:33
  we're going to be doing a monthly newsletter and I got
• 2:36
  slapped down publicly. Do you remember that?
• 2:39
  Blakely was like, no, you may not commit to that.
• 2:43
  I was like, never mind. We're not because.
• 2:46
  How many like corporate marketing departments have I
• 2:49
  worked in? And they're like, oh, we need to
• 2:51
  have a monthly newsletter and we write.
• 2:52
  Two to our customers and. We never do it again.
• 2:54
  It's so true. But I will say these
• 2:56
  newsletters, it's different. Like you say, newsletter, I go
• 2:58
  back in my mind 20 years ago to like a super long e-mail that
• 3:02
  people are like delete, delete, delete.
• 3:03
  This is very different. This is engaging.
• 3:07
  It's fun. Links.
• 3:08
  Yeah, it's just links. It's just links.
• 3:10
  It's like it gives you a link to our latest episode.
• 3:13
  It gives you a link to like what we're into or like what we're
• 3:17
  feeling or we have like a little Clay's corner from Detroit and
• 3:22
  he's going to give us like a link to something Detroit to.
• 3:25
  Keep everybody cool. No, it's, it's, it's like we
• 3:28
  need everybody cool. We need our listeners cool.
• 3:30
  We need to keep cool, so Clay's going to be, we should call it
• 3:32
  Clay's cool Corner. Which is cool corner.
• 3:35
  Do you know that that's that was actually the name?
• 3:37
  By the way, I'm learning that that's what the name is for my
• 3:40
  little section right now. Just making the stuff.
• 3:43
  Up but when I was a kid, when I was a kid, I told my parents I
• 3:47
  wanted to make a little website and they were like, well, we're
• 3:50
  going to actually have a website for our they have they had a
• 3:53
  ministry like and I was like, well, can I get like my own
• 3:57
  page? My dad was like, sure.
• 3:58
  And I was like, what do you want to call it?
• 3:59
  Clay's Corner. No.
• 4:02
  Way out. And so this is officially now
• 4:04
  becoming a real like my childhood dream is coming.
• 4:08
  Oh my gosh. Right now.
• 4:09
  Oh my gosh, there. Is a section on the newsletter
• 4:12
  Clay's Corner? Yes.
• 4:13
  OK. Yeah.
• 4:15
  So the newsletter is not like to forget newsletter.
• 4:17
  It's just like a little update. It's a little bit more of us
• 4:20
  personally. And like I last week, I put in a
• 4:24
  book that I just finished. So I thought was a really good
• 4:26
  book and I think people might be interested in the book.
• 4:29
  So things like that. It's not all business.
• 4:31
  In fact, it's so much more than the all business side of not all
• 4:36
  business that we're calling the community NAB, not all business
• 4:39
  unfiltered. Unfiltered.
• 4:41
  What, what unfiltered? That's dangerous for me.
• 4:44
  I'm going to start see, I can swear there, but I just, I want
• 4:48
  to try to tone it down here, OK? Yeah, got it.
• 4:51
  Yeah. So here's the deal and we went
• 4:53
  back and forth on this and you can blame me if you're mad about
• 4:56
  it, but there is going to be a paid subscribe or option.
• 5:00
  So it's not the newsletter's totally free.
• 5:02
  But I did want to create a space where people had a little bit of
• 5:06
  buy in a little bit of skin in the game.
• 5:09
  And you know, the trolls and the haters and the things and this
• 5:12
  all the weird comments that we get out in public on TikTok,
• 5:16
  they're hilarious and God bless them.
• 5:18
  And I, I, you got to laugh. I mean, I, I laugh that.
• 5:22
  One you pasted to me the other day, I was like, what?
• 5:24
  What is that even saying? It was like, was it funny?
• 5:27
  Yeah, so I love it. Two women who?
• 5:30
  Whatever. I was tragedy at its forest.
• 5:32
  Thank you for the motivation to keep going, you mother.
• 5:35
  Anyway, I just all of all of that to say, I did.
• 5:40
  We do want to create a space where there's a time tiny bit of
• 5:43
  skin in the game. I'm talking like the cost of a
• 5:46
  latte or something like. This a venti latte.
• 5:48
  A venti OK, so like 7-8 bucks, something like that.
• 5:51
  So a month just to create a space where it's like there's a
• 5:55
  hurdle. So it's not just anybody who's
• 5:56
  coming in, but we have heard from so many people about our
• 5:59
  guest list. Hey, how could we all get
• 6:01
  together? Like I listen to so and so
• 6:02
  sounds like should be a great friend, our listeners coming in
• 6:05
  and like we want to create a space where people can start
• 6:07
  talking to each other that's in a little bit more private
• 6:11
  contained community versus just out there on the comments and
• 6:14
  social media. So that's the reason for it and
• 6:17
  we're so excited and we hope you join us.
• 6:19
  We are but. There's a free version too.
• 6:20
  So like, don't let that stop you.
• 6:22
  Please come, yes. Although also please, please
• 6:25
  come. OK, Yep, see.
• 6:28
  This is not a profit making scheme by the way.
• 6:31
  This is just like grassroots listener sponsored.
• 6:35
  By the way, listeners can't help sponsored Blakely is on the
• 6:37
  floods. She's like Belle.
• 6:39
  Like she can't ask for money, Blakely only knows how to give
• 6:42
  money. If you want Blakely to comp
• 6:44
  personally do you. And if you want Blakely to cover
• 6:47
  your subscription cost, just DM her it's.
• 6:52
  True, it's true. We're flashing the the the her
• 6:54
  number on the screen right now. Only 100 pay my $8.
• 6:58
  OK. Blakely.
• 6:59
  She'll cover you. Just give it.
• 7:01
  I'm kidding. There's a joke.
• 7:02
  Join the community. Yeah, come on in.
• 7:04
  Yeah, there's cookies, cake. Yeah.
• 7:07
  Push ups. Yeah.
• 7:09
  Exactly. This is my I'm like, we're we're
• 7:11
  pitch slapping our we're we're pitch slapping our audience
• 7:14
  right now. We'll do a.
• 7:16
  Live a live pit for PUP pitch. I kid you not, this has made
• 7:20
  this has made me think of something that happened to me
• 7:23
  and normally the two of you come to the show with things that
• 7:25
  have happened to you, but something happened to me ever
• 7:27
  since. It's Clay's Corner live.
• 7:30
  Welcome to Clay's Corner Live. There's you.
• 7:32
  Know I'll put some just a sample.
• 7:33
  Just a sample, yeah. I got pitch slapped.
• 7:37
  You did? Yeah, I got yeah.
• 7:39
  I got pitch slapped pretty hard so.
• 7:42
  By the way, Pitch Slapped was our word of the week of the
• 7:45
  newsletter. Just another reason to subscribe
• 7:46
  just. That yes, it came from Sam
• 7:48
  Yarborough's episode where she coined that term.
• 7:51
  We're. Going to be talking about this
• 7:53
  sub stack so much that you're going to want to get in there
• 7:56
  because stuff is going to start not making sense.
• 8:00
  So anyway, I got pitch slap because we had a a major
• 8:03
  windstorm. Normally there windstorms are
• 8:06
  only in Colorado, but apparently they we have them in Michigan
• 8:10
  here too. And it was so much damage that
• 8:12
  shingles start flying off my roof.
• 8:14
  So I had to call roofing companies basically be like,
• 8:16
  hey, come give me a quote. Well, I won't name the company
• 8:21
  in particular, but one of the major roofing companies came to
• 8:25
  my house. They sent a very, what seems
• 8:28
  like a very nice young man came to my door, took some pictures
• 8:32
  of my house and then said, I need to come inside to talk with
• 8:37
  you about this. And I said, do we have to do
• 8:41
  that? Like, couldn't you just, like,
• 8:42
  tell me basically, like what the damage is going to be?
• 8:45
  And he's like, he's like, no, we got to go over some stuff.
• 8:49
  So I was like, OK, so then he came inside of my house and he's
• 8:55
  still there. Clay, I am still there.
• 8:57
  Is he living in your basement? I'm like looking off to the
• 9:00
  side. I'm like, no, he's, you know,
• 9:02
  I'm safe. Blink twice if you need help,
• 9:06
  OK? OK, so I hate this already.
• 9:10
  And I'll meet with you outside. I got a jacket.
• 9:15
  Wear a jacket. It's cool.
• 9:16
  I'll meet you outside. Right?
• 9:18
  Right. The damage is out there.
• 9:20
  What conversation do we need to have?
• 9:22
  You can see it. Right.
• 9:24
  You're the expert. Just tell me.
• 9:26
  Yeah, So he comes inside my house and I already staged like
• 9:30
  within 3 feet of the door, 2 chairs because I'm like, there's
• 9:33
  no way you're sitting on a couch.
• 9:35
  So he says are is there. What?
• 9:37
  Wait, Why? Why?
• 9:38
  Why won't you let him in all the way?
• 9:40
  Because. Because he'll never leave and it
• 9:42
  it's really crossing a boundary that he even wants to come
• 9:44
  inside. So you put in your foyer like
• 9:48
  some chairs and chairs. Weird.
• 9:51
  And I was like, and so I basically, I pointed at
• 9:54
  essentially A makeshift bench. I said, you can have a seat if
• 9:58
  you'd like. I'm going to stand.
• 9:59
  So then he he. Said I have a power move.
• 10:02
  I like it. I like it OK.
• 10:04
  OK, this is my home. OK.
• 10:07
  Yeah. And I got stuff to do.
• 10:09
  So anyway, I'm being very respectful.
• 10:12
  I said, feel free. You can sit down, but I only
• 10:16
  have about 10 minutes. What do we need to discuss?
• 10:19
  And he's like, oh, well, it's going to take longer than that.
• 10:23
  Excuse me. There's.
• 10:24
  Yeah. He's like, well, we need to
• 10:26
  discuss kind of like the future of, like, your family and, like,
• 10:29
  what you're looking for and like, this is the biggest
• 10:31
  investment in your home. And I was like, oh, I was like,
• 10:35
  oh, yeah, I'm not, I'm not interested in that.
• 10:39
  I just would basically like to hear like what you think the
• 10:42
  damage will cost so that I can sit down and think about it and
• 10:45
  then give you a phone call. And he's like, well, that's not
• 10:48
  really how we do things at this company.
• 10:51
  And I said, OK, well, it sounds. Are you sure there's no other
• 10:54
  option? He's like, well, let me call my
• 10:55
  manager. So I'm like.
• 10:58
  Are you buying a new car? So then he fakes a phone call.
• 11:03
  He fakes it. So totally staged phone call.
• 11:06
  He calls a guy who picks up the phone and he's like, hey, you
• 11:10
  got a second He's like, I'm in a meeting, but I could step out
• 11:13
  like what's going on? So and he puts him on
• 11:16
  speakerphone by the way, speakerphone the whole time.
• 11:20
  OK, I'll try to keep this short, but I wrote down basically what
• 11:24
  happens. So he so so he calls his manager
• 11:28
  and his manager is like, this is the only way we do it.
• 11:31
  You got to know all this stuff and this is sounds.
• 11:33
  Is there another time he could come back and you know, and, you
• 11:37
  know, discuss this and sit down. And he's like the guy in my
• 11:39
  house is like, is there a kitchen table?
• 11:41
  We could sit down And I said no, good for you.
• 11:43
  So it's weird. It is weird, right?
• 11:46
  OK, so then, so then the phone call ends and I said, I said
• 11:51
  let's you know, if there's any way you can do this in about 10
• 11:56
  minutes, I'm all ears. Otherwise it looks like we're
• 11:58
  not going to, this is not going to work out.
• 12:01
  And he says verbatim, don't you care about the people who are
• 12:05
  coming to work on your house? I need to tell you the company
• 12:10
  story. What?
• 12:13
  Like you're the asshole. What and so?
• 12:17
  We're mid pitch slap, right? Yeah.
• 12:20
  And I'm like, I'm, I'm feeling really kind of like worked up.
• 12:25
  And by the way, my my wife Ray is like listening upstairs.
• 12:29
  And she is. Losing it.
• 12:31
  Yeah, because her footsteps were a little louder and when she
• 12:35
  came down, she came down the stairs behind me and I'm still
• 12:38
  looking at the guy, like not losing eye contact, but I'm
• 12:40
  looking at the guy and he looks past me and it doesn't go well
• 12:44
  for. Him so OK.
• 12:46
  So I'm going to wrap this up. So we're we're mid pitch slap,
• 12:50
  he says. Don't you care about the people
• 12:51
  coming here? I need to tell you the company
• 12:52
  story. I said I don't really care about
• 12:54
  those people. I got to be honest.
• 12:56
  But I said I do care if they do good work and that, yeah, I I
• 13:01
  care about that. Yeah, you know, yeah, I want.
• 13:04
  Them to do a good job. Yeah, but.
• 13:06
  You don't need the whole back story of the how the company was
• 13:08
  founded, but we have them all. How'd you get them out of your
• 13:11
  house? So then I said it sounds like
• 13:13
  this isn't going to work out. You know, I was like, it just
• 13:17
  sounds like this is not going to work out.
• 13:18
  I have your contact information. I'll reach out to you if if I do
• 13:22
  have another time that we can get together.
• 13:23
  Wow. That's the worst story ever.
• 13:26
  I was my husband, by the way. Never would have made it
• 13:28
  through. We would have three new roofs by
• 13:30
  this point in the story. He would.
• 13:32
  Have been like absolutely come and can I get you a cup of tea
• 13:35
  can. I buy you a new roof and you a
• 13:36
  new. Roof And actually I do really
• 13:38
  care about my family's like well, thank you for asking.
• 13:44
  Can I pay more because to prove how much I do care about my
• 13:47
  family? I have some great stories later,
• 13:50
  another time, Clay, you keep going.
• 13:52
  So the so the big problem that I have now is that this is a major
• 13:56
  company that has a Jingle that you hear basically every day on
• 13:59
  the TV. And video.
• 14:00
  So I am. And now you have like PTSD
• 14:03
  Jingle triggers. Do it hum it for me.
• 14:06
  I want to see if I remember. Is it?
• 14:08
  Is it this one? This is.
• 14:12
  No, that's an insurance. This has to get cut this.
• 14:15
  Is horrible. Hey, I'll tell you what.
• 14:17
  On the sub stack, I'll hum this on on the sub stack.
• 14:21
  Yeah, OK, I'll hum it. Yeah, and everybody will know.
• 14:23
  OK. Or just list the name of the
• 14:25
  company. It's true.
• 14:26
  It's not defamation. You thank.
• 14:29
  Goodness, we have a lawyer. It's true.
• 14:30
  Thank goodness we have a lawyer. But you know what we have that's
• 14:32
  way better than a lawyer today? Like a gazillion.
• 14:36
  Petrillion, a zillion times better than a lawyer.
• 14:39
  It's a lot better. Well, better be a doctor
• 14:42
  because. My.
• 14:43
  Mom always says you can be a lawyer or a doctor.
• 14:45
  There's no other career. Oh man.
• 14:47
  God, are you disappointing? OK.
• 14:49
  Not my mom. It's like my dad.
• 14:52
  OK, can I go? She's a listener.
• 14:57
  Are you OK? We're going to find out.
• 14:59
  We're not only bringing on a single doctor, we are bringing
• 15:03
  on a double doctor. We're bringing on an MD and a
• 15:06
  PhD all in wrapped up in one person.
• 15:09
  We have today with us Doctor Linda Shapiro Manning.
• 15:13
  Welcome to the show. You know how every industry has
• 15:19
  that one relationship where both sides need each other, but the
• 15:23
  communication is just broken? In construction, that's general
• 15:27
  contractors and subcontractors. The invoices get lost, the
• 15:31
  budgets blow up, and nobody's on the same page.
• 15:35
  Well, Trade Agent fixes that. It's the AI layer that sits
• 15:38
  between GCS and Subs and keeps the whole thing from falling
• 15:43
  apart. Invoices, budgets, payments
• 15:46
  handled like magic. No more fights, no more finger
• 15:50
  pointing, and everyone can get back to actual building.
• 15:54
  Check it out at the Trade agent.com.
• 16:02
  Welcome, double Doctor. Double, double doctor.
• 16:05
  That's so impressive. You were like, wow, I don't
• 16:08
  think an MD is enough. Like I need to go be even
• 16:11
  smarter. So you went and got a PhD.
• 16:14
  Did you do the PhD after the MD or?
• 16:17
  I did. I did.
• 16:18
  I just like being on campuses, right?
• 16:20
  I mean, what's not to love about being on a campus?
• 16:23
  That's so true. The tests, the exams, the
• 16:25
  learning. I love learning.
• 16:31
  I would go to school all day if I didn't have to have answer a
• 16:34
  question live and have a test, yeah.
• 16:36
  So we were talking before we pressed record today.
• 16:40
  Listeners, I know we don't always get into the background
• 16:43
  of our guests to detail, but because of what we're talking
• 16:47
  about today, which is fascinating and very topical,
• 16:51
  we're getting into GLP ones. And Linda has been involved in
• 16:56
  this research before Clay, not before you were born.
• 17:00
  But you know, it's it's. Getting you were in.
• 17:03
  Diapers years and years and years and years.
• 17:05
  So I do want to give, Linda, I want to give you an opportunity
• 17:09
  to share a little bit about where your career started and
• 17:11
  how you ended up being one of The Pioneers of this very
• 17:15
  important medicine that people have tons of questions around.
• 17:18
  But that's like actually changing our culture in so many
• 17:21
  ways. So how'd you get started?
• 17:23
  Sure, sure. Well, so maybe it even gets back
• 17:26
  to the last question. So after my MD and doing my
• 17:29
  training in internal medicine, you know, we're really doing
• 17:32
  illness care, not healthcare. So then I I did my research post
• 17:37
  doc and stayed on for PhD in kinesiology, applied Physiology,
• 17:43
  really nutrition, metabolism, how the cardiovascular system
• 17:48
  works, how the autonomic nervous system works.
• 17:51
  These are big words, but really? They're very big words, yeah,
• 17:54
  but they're not acronyms. So you we can't make you explain
• 17:57
  them because they're not acronyms.
• 17:58
  So yeah, it's. OK, because we have Word of the
• 18:01
  weeks in our new newsletters, you better know.
• 18:04
  We can have a dictionary for Linda's episode.
• 18:09
  Sorry, go ahead. No.
• 18:10
  But really getting at right, how does the body work and how does
• 18:14
  it work in the normal state and versus in the disease state?
• 18:18
  So then when I started practicing, I, I really tried to
• 18:21
  do preventive medicine, you know, and diet and exercise to
• 18:24
  help lower cholesterol and blood pressure.
• 18:27
  And, and what actually ended up happening is there was a really
• 18:30
  great ear, nose and throat Doctor Who started referring me
• 18:33
  his patients who had sleep apnea and obesity.
• 18:37
  And so I was trying to help them with diet and exercise and they
• 18:40
  were the nicest patients and they were so appreciative,
• 18:44
  right? And they were really trying to
• 18:47
  get well and make making progress.
• 18:49
  And I really thought, OK, this is what I really want to focus
• 18:52
  on in my career. And so I, I really dove into
• 18:56
  obesity medicine, became board certified and it's left this
• 19:01
  large multi specialty practice, started my own solo practice in
• 19:05
  obesity medicine. This was all about the first
• 19:08
  decade of this century or Millennium.
• 19:12
  And and so actually it was 2008 when the first GOP one came out
• 19:17
  for diabetes. And so I started prescribing it
• 19:21
  for some of my patients and they came back and said to me, oh,
• 19:26
  this is what full feels like. I've never felt full before.
• 19:30
  And and that was really, you know, a light bulb moment and
• 19:34
  very different than old historic quote UN quote diet pills that
• 19:38
  just right, people never hungry, right?
• 19:41
  It's very different to say, oh, I'm never hungry.
• 19:43
  So I just don't eat. That's very different than oh, I
• 19:47
  eat and I get full with a reasonable amount of food.
• 19:51
  So GOP 1 is a hormone that our intestines make when we eat food
• 19:57
  and it goes into our intestinal tract.
• 19:59
  It signals that release. And it only stays in the
• 20:02
  circulation for a few minutes, but it does exactly the job.
• 20:05
  That should tell the body, OK, you've eaten now you should feel
• 20:09
  full, and you should release insulin to absorb that sugar
• 20:12
  into your blood. And you should stop making
• 20:15
  Glucagon, which is the hormone of fasting, right?
• 20:17
  And and you can slow down the rate at which stuff is emptying
• 20:20
  from your stomach because here I am in the intestines.
• 20:22
  I'm already getting it. So just, you know, let a bit out
• 20:24
  of time. That is physiologically how GLP
• 20:28
  ones work and that was exactly essentially what my patients
• 20:30
  were saying to me. And so really the decision came,
• 20:34
  do I stay in practice and see, you know, one patient at a time?
• 20:39
  Or do I shift and really see if I can help get this and other
• 20:43
  treatments available to more patients and how more people
• 20:46
  really understand obesity and and really help the masses so.
• 20:51
  So that is when you got tapped to come work to explain that
• 20:54
  that transition of moving into working on the drug itself.
• 20:58
  So first part of my career in clinical practice, first in a
• 21:02
  large group practice and I went into solo and towards the end of
• 21:07
  that time that I was in my solo practice, one of the drug
• 21:10
  companies who was working on developing GOP ones reached out
• 21:13
  to me and asked me to be on their scientific Advisory Board
• 21:16
  meeting and to be in that room with, you know, other people.
• 21:21
  I, I felt so much not on the island anymore, right?
• 21:24
  And really seeing that there was this future potential compound
• 21:28
  that with, I was tired of fighting with insurance
• 21:30
  companies for getting paid to do good work.
• 21:33
  And so that's sort of all what led me.
• 21:36
  And so within a year or so after starting to, to work with that
• 21:40
  company, they were hiring and expanding their team.
• 21:43
  And so it was a difficult decision to close my practice
• 21:47
  and walk away from my patients and sort of do this career
• 21:50
  pivot. But, you know, I, I really
• 21:52
  thought it was the right thing to do for, you know, greater
• 21:56
  humanity and, and more patients. And ultimately now here we are
• 21:59
  15 years later and starting to see some of that, the fruits of
• 22:04
  that labor. Yeah, it's it.
• 22:06
  That's a huge, huge shift. And I think, you know, it's
• 22:11
  crazy to me to think about that. That was 15 years ago.
• 22:15
  And So what was that like for you personally to have now just
• 22:20
  the everybody on the street understanding and pronouncing
• 22:25
  simagalotide wrong or what's the very same, but like everybody's
• 22:31
  now talking about this and you've been in it for 15 years.
• 22:34
  What was that shift like for you?
• 22:36
  Yeah. So early on the shift was
• 22:38
  interesting because still the, the two companies that you hear
• 22:42
  of the most about have been in the diabetes space for over 100
• 22:45
  years. And really since like the Nobel
• 22:47
  Prizes for the discovery of insulin and mark my words,
• 22:51
  actually believe in a couple years there's going to be a
• 22:52
  Nobel Prize for the discovery of GLP 1.
• 22:55
  So it it'll be fascinating. But so those companies were
• 22:59
  still very focused on diabetes, right?
• 23:01
  And I come in and they're like, Oh, you're the obesity person.
• 23:04
  Like, what are we supposed to do with you, right?
• 23:07
  And no one really gave me much credit, right?
• 23:10
  And then even to this point, 10 years ago, we got the first GLP
• 23:14
  one approved for obesity. And, you know, didn't really get
• 23:19
  a whole lot of, you know, uptick.
• 23:21
  And so now to your point to hear everyone talking about it and
• 23:26
  even these companies like, oh, yes, we always believed in this.
• 23:29
  And Oh yeah. We have these two.
• 23:32
  You've got to grind you a little bit.
• 23:34
  That's going to grind you a little bit.
• 23:35
  Yeah. OK, Now that it's fancy and
• 23:37
  famous and everybody in Hollywood is the now you're
• 23:40
  involved in. Yeah, we, we, we did this a long
• 23:42
  time ago. Yeah, right.
• 23:43
  Exactly. And even on, on, you know,
• 23:45
  social media and every like now people are these experts, right?
• 23:49
  Oh my gosh, yeah, you've. Been doing this for two days
• 23:51
  right so. I, I guess I don't understand
• 23:54
  why there wasn't an uptick immediately because obesity
• 23:58
  seems to me like a much broader reach than diabetes.
• 24:04
  So I so it, to me it's like more money, more money, more money.
• 24:08
  Why was there a slow up tick do you think?
• 24:10
  Yeah. So I think it's it's a perfect
• 24:12
  storm of things. So First off, the medicines that
• 24:15
  were approved 15 years ago were daily medications and they were
• 24:22
  getting a a magnitude of weight loss in the range of 10%, you
• 24:27
  know, 8 to 12% for some patients, high responders up to
• 24:31
  15%. But there wasn't a huge wow
• 24:36
  factor. So what happened five years ago,
• 24:40
  Remember exactly, literally maybe or six years ago, March
• 24:45
  2020 and all of a sudden we're going to stay home for a couple
• 24:48
  weeks and then what that couple weeks turned into and then what
• 24:51
  are you talking about? And we all got comfy in our
• 24:56
  elastic pants and, you know, at our delivery.
• 25:02
  And that was precisely in the same era that semaglitide was
• 25:07
  approved. So it was a once weekly.
• 25:09
  And then it's getting, you know, this 15% and higher weight loss.
• 25:14
  So, you know, so Fast forward now people have gained some
• 25:18
  weight during COVID or COVID restrictions are loosening and
• 25:21
  they want to go back and looked like they actually worked out
• 25:24
  and got healthy during COVID, not that they have people
• 25:26
  because we all became less healthy during COVID.
• 25:30
  And so, you know, and there was something that they could use
• 25:33
  once a week that was give getting them decent magnitude of
• 25:37
  of weight loss, right? And then it just sort of
• 25:40
  happened. And this is the same thing when
• 25:42
  I was in clinical practice patient, you know, any other
• 25:45
  health condition, no one says, oh, wow, Bob, your prostate
• 25:49
  looks good. What are you doing for your
• 25:50
  prostate, right? That's not what happens.
• 25:52
  But when people are losing weight, everyone notices and
• 25:56
  they say, oh, my gosh, what are you doing?
• 25:58
  And in my practice, I never advertise my practice.
• 26:01
  My patients would just say, oh, I'm seeing Doctor Shapiro, you
• 26:04
  should go see her too. And so when people say, oh, I'm
• 26:07
  doing, you know, Ozempi or Govi or whatever, then that's when
• 26:14
  it's really started going. And then the competitor product
• 26:17
  came out from the other company and then, you know, and, and now
• 26:21
  it's just all the rage. Yeah.
• 26:24
  So what do you think this is doing now?
• 26:27
  Thank you for that background, by the way.
• 26:28
  And we are so honored to. I mean, I can't think of a
• 26:31
  better person who can speak to this than you.
• 26:33
  So I really appreciate you taking time with us today.
• 26:36
  I'm I'm most curious now that it's all the rage.
• 26:40
  I had a conversation with my daughter and her friend last
• 26:42
  night. They're 20 years old.
• 26:43
  They're juniors in college. And they were both voicing how
• 26:49
  sad they are to see the body positivity movement, that they
• 26:55
  had both worked hard in their communities to help press
• 26:58
  forward and that curvy is OK and that there's, you know, all
• 27:02
  different types of bodies and shapes and sizes.
• 27:04
  And there had been a lot of ground that was made over the
• 27:08
  past five years when they were in high school until where they
• 27:11
  are now. And they're both said they're
• 27:14
  seeing it just disappear before their eyes because their friends
• 27:18
  are talking about getting on these drugs.
• 27:20
  We're seeing people taking it too far and it's becoming this
• 27:25
  kind of trend, this and Blakely, you mentioned the other day like
• 27:29
  a thin culture where we're now prioritizing this.
• 27:32
  And I'd love to hear from your perspective if you're seeing the
• 27:36
  GLP, is it because this is so accessible and people can get
• 27:40
  into unrealistic weights much easier?
• 27:42
  That's not maybe a eating disorder or something that was
• 27:45
  so shamed on before, but now it's seen as healthy.
• 27:48
  And what's the Where do you see this going?
• 27:52
  Right. And that's the part that there's
• 27:57
  still lots of work to be done and lots of room for
• 28:00
  improvement. And unfortunately, the the
• 28:04
  perfect storm created all kinds of chaos.
• 28:09
  And, and to that point, people who don't have obesity, you
• 28:13
  know, Hollywood types are getting access to this and then
• 28:16
  basically getting, you know, to underweight weights and then
• 28:20
  promoting that. And then others, right, are
• 28:23
  trying to, to mimic the same weight bias and stigma, obesity
• 28:29
  stigma, weight bias are very, very common, one of the most
• 28:34
  prevalent forms of bias and it, it impacts all aspects of
• 28:39
  someone's life. I mean, think about this.
• 28:40
  If, if you're on a plane and someone in a larger body is
• 28:43
  walking down the aisle, right, everyone's thinking, oh gosh, I
• 28:45
  hope they don't sit next to me, right?
• 28:47
  And the. Person my armrest or something?
• 28:49
  The person walking down the aisle knows that, but imagine
• 28:53
  that person 24/7 everywhere they go, they know that people are
• 28:59
  judging them. And to your point, when there
• 29:02
  was no effective or limited effective treatments, you know,
• 29:07
  bariatric surgeries, it's just highly effective.
• 29:10
  It's been around for a while, right?
• 29:11
  I mean, so we can have a whole other conversation about that.
• 29:15
  But when they were limited, then there was this body positivity,
• 29:21
  body acceptance, right? Like don't judge me just based
• 29:24
  on my body, which absolutely should hold.
• 29:26
  But actually now the reverse is happening because people are
• 29:29
  saying, well, there's the GOP ones.
• 29:31
  Why don't you just do that? Like, how can you let yourself
• 29:35
  be that? And then when people get the
• 29:39
  right, then how come you're not going further, how you're not
• 29:41
  losing even more? Why aren't you great?
• 29:43
  And so really this comes down to, right, it's no one else's
• 29:48
  business, right? Your body is your business and
• 29:53
  what you choose to do or not do with it now is your choice, and
• 29:58
  what you choose now could be different than what you chose in
• 30:00
  the past, might be different than what you choose in the
• 30:03
  future, and your body changes over time.
• 30:06
  I mean, none of us in our 40s and 50s have the same body we
• 30:09
  had as teenagers in 20s. And when we're 607080, it won't
• 30:13
  be the same body internally or extra only.
• 30:17
  And so we really need to just empower ourselves to do what we
• 30:22
  feel is best. And for some people, maybe if
• 30:27
  they seek out treatment and it's it's appropriate.
• 30:29
  And for some people, maybe they choose not to and they can
• 30:32
  change their mind and you know, so.
• 30:35
  I don't think our society is very historically good at
• 30:38
  supporting individuals like that.
• 30:40
  And so there's something here where I'm like, let everyone
• 30:44
  have it, like go take the pill everyday, take the shot.
• 30:48
  Because then all of a sudden we're all thin and we've ruined
• 30:52
  our strength, our ruin all the stuff.
• 30:54
  And then thin cultures out. Like maybe the pendulum just
• 30:57
  needs to swing. Let's all get scrawny and
• 31:01
  realize maybe that isn't our societal definition of beauty,
• 31:05
  our societal definition of strength.
• 31:07
  And I wonder if we could like think about it from like another
• 31:13
  angle. I, I know thin culture is not
• 31:17
  very body positive forward, but what about thinking about GLP is
• 31:22
  like, are they healthy? Like are they, are they strength
• 31:26
  forward? Are they helping?
• 31:28
  I know they're helping. You had an obesity clinic,
• 31:32
  right? So they are helping sleep apnea,
• 31:35
  they're helping diabetes. Are they helping?
• 31:38
  Are they're helping heart health?
• 31:41
  But are they safe for everyone? I guess is where I'm getting to
• 31:44
  like. Right, right, well, and, and to
• 31:46
  your point, instead of going from a, a thin culture or
• 31:50
  whatever, let's just go for a health culture, right?
• 31:53
  And let's have everyone try to the best version of their self
• 31:58
  physically, mentally, emotionally, right, everything.
• 32:02
  And so to that point, you know, it's funny, but right, our GOP
• 32:06
  ones right for everyone. Well, no, I mean, there's,
• 32:10
  there's nothing that's right for everyone except maybe oxygen and
• 32:13
  water, right? But right, people, people are so
• 32:19
  different, right? And, and even an individual over
• 32:22
  their lifetime, what works for them at some point is not.
• 32:25
  So I think if we could start focusing on and, and in the
• 32:30
  obesity community, we talk about these as beyond the scale
• 32:32
  victories, right? I like that.
• 32:34
  Beyond the scale victories, right?
• 32:36
  Yeah. And so that can be walking
• 32:38
  around Disneyland all day with your kids or your grandkids and
• 32:42
  a, not getting tired walking around and B, being able to fit
• 32:45
  into all the rides or whatever. If that's your goal, then great.
• 32:50
  You know, and, and nothing says you have to fit into a bikini
• 32:52
  to, to do any of that, right? So, so it that's really what we
• 32:58
  should be focusing on is people being able to live the life that
• 33:01
  they want to live in the highest quality that they can honestly
• 33:06
  in all aspects of their life. But how do we do that with
• 33:10
  because I mean, like, think back to Renaissance days.
• 33:13
  It's like, OK, the picture of, of health and wealth and success
• 33:16
  was a little bit more weight on your body because that meant you
• 33:19
  were wealthy and could feed and as and eat as much as you want.
• 33:23
  And then now it's moving into, well, if you have time to work
• 33:27
  out and you can afford to go to a gym and you can afford to eat
• 33:31
  organic and like all of these other things, then thinner and
• 33:35
  more fit is going to be an indication of success.
• 33:37
  And now with the cost of the drugs, it's like, I feel bad for
• 33:41
  people who are getting judged. Maybe they can't afford it.
• 33:44
  Maybe it's not covered by their insurance or, you know,
• 33:48
  whatever. There's all of these other
• 33:49
  factors where I think this bias, it's just instead of removing
• 33:53
  it, it's just shifting. And now it's like, who's wealthy
• 33:56
  enough to afford the drug to be able to be skinny?
• 34:00
  And then where's the standard ending?
• 34:02
  And that's really frustrating. Correct.
• 34:04
  And that's where unfortunately, because there's the cosmetic
• 34:11
  aspect of this and, and people will pay out of pocket for it,
• 34:16
  that sadly the prices on these GOP ones went up as hot just
• 34:21
  kept going up and up and up basically to what the market
• 34:24
  would bear. And when there are people who
• 34:26
  are willing to pay that much, then they the, the, you know,
• 34:31
  supply and demand. Supply and demand.
• 34:33
  Are we going to get to a place where there's so much supply
• 34:36
  that it forces it to go down? Yes.
• 34:39
  So this year is really a pivotal year.
• 34:42
  So sadly, unfortunately, last year some insurance companies
• 34:45
  were covering it and it was, you know, breaking the bank because
• 34:49
  the price was so high. And so they actually cut off
• 34:53
  formularies and a lot of patients this year got cut off.
• 34:56
  And so then what are they supposed to do?
• 34:58
  Like you wouldn't just cut off someone's asthma medicine or
• 35:01
  their seizure medicine or whatever, right?
• 35:04
  So now with, you know, there's, there's pressures.
• 35:07
  The price on these medicines is coming down.
• 35:10
  And it's very interesting because again, these two
• 35:13
  companies were the same companies who've been making
• 35:15
  insulin for a long time. And I don't know if you
• 35:18
  remember, but ten years ago, there's a big push that you have
• 35:20
  to lower the insulin prices. And it's very they know.
• 35:24
  The game. Interest.
• 35:25
  Exactly right. So now we're there, but they're
• 35:27
  lowering that, but there's new medicines coming out.
• 35:31
  And so part of it, you guys are both the the CEO's, you guys
• 35:34
  have the business mind more than I do.
• 35:36
  But you know, they can lower the price of these because then the
• 35:38
  new stuff is coming out and they raise the price on the new
• 35:41
  stuff, right. And then there's just.
• 35:43
  The pill version, I saw it like all through the Super Bowl.
• 35:46
  It was like add after add after add.
• 35:48
  It's like, OK, now we can take this pill and this celebrity's
• 35:51
  on it and the celebrity's on it. And that's the part that is
• 35:52
  just, I can't quite get it. Like, hey, I heard that it helps
• 35:57
  with menopausal bloat. If, if I can afford that, you
• 36:00
  think I'm not going to try that if it's actually going to make
• 36:02
  my stomach issues go away. Like there is 0 judgement for my
• 36:06
  end. I'm like if if as the studies
• 36:08
  are coming out and it's being proven that things can help, I
• 36:10
  am all for treating those symptoms right.
• 36:13
  Like so 0 judgement that way. But I don't like the piece of it
• 36:18
  where it's becoming the trend or, hey, everybody's doing it
• 36:21
  and hey, look how easy this is and where we would get to a
• 36:24
  place where we're not doing the workout or eating as much as we
• 36:29
  need. So then our body is.
• 36:32
  Right. Which is a different.
• 36:33
  Size. So exactly.
• 36:34
  So back to Blakely's question, right?
• 36:36
  And the safety thing, so if a person feels full or conversely
• 36:42
  not hungry, right, then they eat less.
• 36:45
  And in the end, right, it's still an energy balance.
• 36:48
  And that loss of thermodynamics hold, right, A person needs to
• 36:52
  consume fewer calories than they are expending.
• 36:55
  And it's not, it's not the same as eat less, exercise more, but
• 36:59
  you know, metabolism plays a role in what kinds of things you
• 37:01
  eat and so on and so forth. But to that point, if then you
• 37:06
  choose to eat less and you're not getting your essential
• 37:09
  vitamins, minerals, protein, fatty acids, then there are
• 37:13
  problems. And there are side effects of
• 37:15
  people losing a lot of muscle because they're not taking
• 37:18
  enough protein or they get some tingling sensations and and
• 37:23
  other side effects because they've actually burned through
• 37:26
  their reserves of their vitamins because vitamins are used for
• 37:29
  the chemical reactions of turning fat into energy.
• 37:33
  So if you're so that might be. A stupid question, but on that
• 37:36
  exact note of like, OK, so you needed more protein.
• 37:39
  Is it OK to get that protein through a protein shake?
• 37:43
  Or are there are we losing things where it's like, no,
• 37:45
  you're not eating like physical food that's breaking down and
• 37:48
  forcing your metasolam to work that way?
• 37:50
  Or can you? Is any form OK?
• 37:52
  Because I'm seeing all of these things like add 30 grams to
• 37:54
  protein to your water or because people aren't hungry, right?
• 37:58
  They're not feeling hungry anymore.
• 37:59
  So it's like, how are they going to get their protein?
• 38:01
  Is that the same thing? Well, so, right, so at the most
• 38:04
  basic level, right, there are what we call essential
• 38:07
  nutrients, vitamins, minerals, protein and fatty acid that our
• 38:10
  body needs to do the chemical reactions of of daily living.
• 38:15
  And so you need to get those things in and you know, in the
• 38:18
  most extreme sense, a person who's in the ICU for an extended
• 38:22
  period of time, right, we basically put the equivalent of
• 38:25
  a shake with all of those things into a feeding tube, right?
• 38:29
  There's. Yeah, yeah.
• 38:31
  Right, So, so that is a way to get it in, but in order to
• 38:34
  maintain health and actually, I, I love using this analogy.
• 38:38
  You have apple, applesauce, apple juice, let's say they all
• 38:42
  have the same calories, they all have the same vitamins, but you
• 38:45
  physically have to chew the apple and your stomach has to
• 38:49
  grind it and digest it. Whatever versus the applesauce,
• 38:52
  it's kind of already been blended up versus the apple
• 38:55
  juice that you're just drinking. But that nutrition and you're
• 38:59
  not getting any of the fiber, right?
• 39:00
  That apple is the better way to go as would be, right?
• 39:06
  All of your Whole Foods, vegetables, you know, eating
• 39:09
  your protein either as meats or nuts or legumes or whatnot.
• 39:14
  But at the same point, you don't have to have every one of your
• 39:17
  meals that way. So today I had a peanut butter
• 39:21
  and Jelly sandwich for lunch and a high protein chocolate milk
• 39:26
  with it, right. So it was sort of a little bit
• 39:29
  of both. So I had my high fiber peanut
• 39:31
  butter and my whole, you know, whole grain bread, but I got all
• 39:35
  of my, you know, nutrition in that shake so.
• 39:39
  You. That's amazing.
• 39:41
  You had mentioned earlier that this is a natural hormone.
• 39:44
  Our our, or, or maybe it's the production of a hormone.
• 39:47
  I'm going to get the, the terminology wrong, but does that
• 39:50
  play into like dopamine fixes as well?
• 39:53
  And, and where I'm going with this question is I've heard it,
• 39:57
  I've heard GLP ones can Curb Your appetite, but they can also
• 40:01
  curb things like alcohol and maybe be potentially applied to
• 40:09
  drug addiction or abuse. And I, I'm going to go out and
• 40:12
  say, does it also curb other pleasure seeking things like
• 40:16
  phones or sex or kind of all these myriad of not necessarily
• 40:22
  bad things, maybe bad in excess, but or is it truly limited to
• 40:29
  anything that goes through your digestive tract?
• 40:34
  Great question. You're very astute, Blakely.
• 40:36
  Good student. She's a good student, she just
• 40:39
  wants to be able to keep drinking, have sex and and doom.
• 40:42
  Scroll. OK, that's really the source.
• 40:45
  More societal. Question.
• 40:46
  The source is like don't. Take my time.
• 40:48
  Leaving don't take my sexy time and don't take.
• 40:50
  My time. So this gets into right the big
• 40:52
  words I was using and describing my my PhD and my post doc work.
• 40:56
  But there, there are neural connections from the gut to the
• 41:01
  brain and a lot of those are what we call homeostatic related
• 41:06
  to homeostasis, which is the balance of energy in, energy
• 41:09
  out, just like body temperature, right?
• 41:11
  We regulate our body temperature, we regulate our
• 41:14
  fluid balance, regular energy. And in those pathways in the
• 41:18
  brain, there's also side roads and like on and off ramps, like
• 41:24
  on the highway that merge into that, that have to do with
• 41:27
  pleasure and satisfaction and stuff, right?
• 41:30
  So we eat because we need to eat or we're going to die.
• 41:33
  But we, what we choose to eat is because we like it or we want it
• 41:38
  or whatever, right? So they're very tightly
• 41:42
  intertwined and in a, in a perfect balance, right?
• 41:46
  You're getting just enough stimulus for pleasure of
• 41:48
  satisfaction and you're getting just enough nutrient
• 41:51
  stimulation. And then you get this, you know,
• 41:53
  I am full, I am content, I am satisfied and whatnot.
• 41:56
  But sometimes when we miss one of those things for the
• 41:59
  together, then there's this craving or wanting or seeking
• 42:02
  and the pleasure and the reward and whatnot.
• 42:05
  And so that's how they all tie in together.
• 42:08
  And to that point, now that there's more clinical experience
• 42:11
  with the GLP ones, patients are saying, right, I don't have an
• 42:14
  interest in these other substances, nicotine and
• 42:17
  alcohol, whatever. So that research is currently
• 42:23
  evolving and we'll have more not just, you know, individuals sort
• 42:27
  of saying it, but like some controlled research data coming
• 42:30
  out soon to discuss that. But you're right, it almost
• 42:34
  seems endless in in how it might be beneficial.
• 42:39
  Endless. But then you also hear that you
• 42:44
  have to stay on it for that to stay true, right?
• 42:48
  OK. So let's yeah, let's let's get
• 42:51
  into a little bit of myth busting in that so.
• 42:55
  Yes, Myth Busters. I love it.
• 42:58
  So, yeah. All right.
• 42:59
  So back to Is it right for everyone?
• 43:03
  No, because not everyone is the same.
• 43:06
  Does everyone have to stay on it forever?
• 43:08
  No, because again, not everyone is the same, right?
• 43:11
  So we know people who will say, you know, I've, I've had a
• 43:15
  weight problem my whole life. I was the biggest kid in
• 43:17
  kindergarten. And it's always been that way,
• 43:20
  right? Then it's unlikely that anything
• 43:23
  they do to lose weight that then they could stop doing that and
• 43:26
  they would maintain because their biology just isn't.
• 43:31
  But we also know people who never had a weight problem in
• 43:35
  their youth. And then it was puberty or
• 43:37
  pregnancy or menopause, or they had an injury and they became
• 43:41
  inactive, or they went on steroid medicines for something
• 43:44
  or another, right? And that's the thing that
• 43:47
  flipped it for them. And so maybe they just need the
• 43:49
  GOP ones or whatever other treatment to reset it back, stay
• 43:56
  there for a while so all of these multiple mechanisms can
• 44:00
  balance themselves out and then slowly taper off and see if the
• 44:05
  body can now self regulate in its new normal.
• 44:10
  The problem is the companies who did the clinical trials did not
• 44:14
  want to do those maintenance studies.
• 44:18
  And one company told me it was not aligned to their commercial
• 44:22
  strategy. They said that out loud.
• 44:27
  Yeah, that's a problem. Yeah, that's a huge problem.
• 44:30
  And it goes back to the societal thing is, you know, if we think
• 44:34
  about in the 70s when everyone was laying out the beach and
• 44:39
  they have their tanning oil and you see the pictures, but
• 44:41
  they're smoking a pack a day and that's curbing their appetite
• 44:44
  and they're skinny and were they healthy?
• 44:46
  And then all of a sudden like no to cigarettes.
• 44:48
  Well, what did we introduce instead?
• 44:49
  We introduced ultra processed food and now and, and fast
• 44:53
  casual and fast food. And so we're always like trading
• 44:57
  these things and we're just in this like I'm just trying to, as
• 45:02
  I form an opinion on GLP, one which I don't know that I have
• 45:06
  formed yet because it's still so new is are we just trading from
• 45:11
  cigarettes to ultra process convenience, You know, snack
• 45:16
  wells before and now snack wells.
• 45:19
  I remember the snack wells. Is GLP like the new quick hit
• 45:25
  and and I'm I need to separate? I'm talking GLP maybe for
• 45:30
  personal. I don't even know how to say
• 45:33
  this without feeling like I'm judging someone someone.
• 45:36
  Who someone who isn't medically diagnosed as obese, you were you
• 45:40
  have not done that. So as someone who does not have
• 45:42
  that diagnosis. Correct, Yes.
• 45:46
  Is it, is it just another, are we, are we not getting to eating
• 45:51
  the apple? Like, are we skipping?
• 45:53
  Like let's go back, we need to eat the apple, but for some
• 45:56
  reason, myself included, eating the apples.
• 46:01
  Hard. You know, and I, I don't mind.
• 46:05
  The quick fix. There's a shortcut.
• 46:06
  Let's take it. Yeah, I.
• 46:08
  Hear but is that is that societally like, gosh, you guys
• 46:11
  were just doing it again. We're just putting more
• 46:14
  dingling, more cigarettes in front of you, you know?
• 46:16
  Yeah. So, so I think it's, it's the
• 46:19
  all or nothing quick fix mentality that's been
• 46:22
  problematic and there's nothing really exciting about
• 46:27
  moderation. And in all reality, right, You
• 46:32
  know, yes, when we went with low fat, it should have been lower
• 46:37
  fat than we were eating before, but not necessarily low.
• 46:40
  And all that did was then we went with high sugar and now we
• 46:44
  said, oh, Sugar's bad. So we should go lower sugar,
• 46:48
  which would then translate to higher protein.
• 46:51
  But no, we went all the way into high protein and and same thing,
• 46:57
  right? So now there's people who, I
• 46:59
  mean, I've seen these videos and for breakfast they eat a dozen
• 47:03
  eggs and a steak. You know, again, where's the
• 47:06
  apple, like. Like fish and.
• 47:09
  Salads any of these things out right so it I'm sorry that.
• 47:15
  Well, but you've been using statins that are ubiquitous
• 47:18
  though, right, to counteract these stake And so, so was GOP 1
• 47:23
  going to become ubiquitous like a statin, right?
• 47:26
  It it, there's the potential that right in Fast forward
• 47:30
  10/15/20 years when they're generic and there's, you know,
• 47:33
  formulations, right, that are more easily accessible that they
• 47:38
  might be in, in the same way, not only statins but
• 47:41
  antidepressant medicines, yeah, you know.
• 47:45
  I mean, you could kind of consider GLP one kind of mental
• 47:49
  health medicine as well, right? So, yeah, yeah.
• 47:53
  Well, OK, so where do you see this all going?
• 47:56
  I mean, you've you've been there since day one of where it
• 47:59
  started. So where do you see it going
• 48:01
  when it's affordable. Let's just like if we remove
• 48:04
  that hurdle for being able to get it, let's remove, let's
• 48:08
  remove demand problems and supply problems and you know,
• 48:12
  financial problems. Everybody has access to this.
• 48:15
  Where do you see that going for us as a culture?
• 48:18
  I love that world where everyone has access, so I, I do believe
• 48:22
  so There's I, I can't even tell you how many companies getting
• 48:26
  into the game now. Some see it because they really
• 48:30
  want to do good and they really want to innovate treatments and
• 48:33
  and make them accessible. Some see it as a a cash grab.
• 48:38
  Hopefully you know, the ones who really want to do good will be
• 48:40
  successful, but there will be more drugs that become
• 48:44
  available. There will be more GLP one like
• 48:47
  drugs even combined with other hormones from the intestine.
• 48:51
  There will be other non GLP drugs.
• 48:54
  Now that people are saying, oh, this can be successful, right?
• 48:57
  So that worked by other mechanisms.
• 48:59
  So back to them. Not everyone needs to go on AGLP
• 49:02
  one type Med. They could go on other Med if
• 49:05
  they need it. And when all of these companies
• 49:08
  are in the game, right, the competition will bring down the
• 49:12
  price. There will be more supply,
• 49:15
  access will be more available. And then it will be, I believe,
• 49:19
  treated like any other disease where, oh, you go and you talk
• 49:24
  to a qualified healthcare professional.
• 49:26
  So this will be the other thing. It will be part of medical
• 49:29
  school training, nursing training, dietitian training,
• 49:32
  pharmacist training, you know, personal exercise, trainer
• 49:36
  training. And, and then it won't be so
• 49:40
  much all about this type and whatever, it'll just be another
• 49:43
  condition that is treated. And there will be enough
• 49:47
  different types of medicines that hopefully good healthcare
• 49:51
  professionals will ask questions and based on the answers and
• 49:53
  medical history, they'll choose the appropriate treatments,
• 49:57
  right? And and.
• 49:58
  Not just about that for a second, because I know when we
• 50:01
  first had our talk a couple years ago, whenever that was one
• 50:05
  of the concerns and kind of red flags, you said for anybody
• 50:08
  considering a GLP, one was to be really careful about where they
• 50:12
  were getting it, where that facility was, sourcing it,
• 50:15
  making sure it's FDA approved, making sure you're working with
• 50:18
  a medical provider that's actually meeting you,
• 50:20
  understanding you instead of these compounding places that
• 50:25
  are. It's like you have 10 minutes
• 50:26
  online with a doctor and it shows up at your doorstep.
• 50:28
  So let's talk about that and the importance and the risks of
• 50:33
  doing this. Well, if you do choose that it's
• 50:35
  it's a good fit for you. How does someone do it well?
• 50:38
  Yeah, that's, that's a great question.
• 50:40
  And I like how you phrased it because there there's no fault
• 50:43
  or blame in people saying, well, look, my doctor, I I go in to
• 50:47
  talk to them and either they don't know what they're doing or
• 50:50
  they make me feel shame, right. So no one wants to have that
• 50:53
  experience and I try to go through my insurance and my
• 50:56
  insurance won't pay for it. So what am I supposed to do?
• 50:58
  So therefore, right, I tried to use one of these telehealth
• 51:01
  services and I try to get an affordable thing.
• 51:03
  So there there should be no issue with someone doing that.
• 51:07
  But in the end, you want what they get to be good quality
• 51:10
  healthcare and good quality medications.
• 51:13
  So those are certainly questions that you could ask the the
• 51:19
  telehealth provider like where are they sourcing it?
• 51:22
  What is the, you know, pharmacy they're getting it from?
• 51:25
  They will tell you, they should tell you whether it is a
• 51:27
  compounded smaglotite or tirzepatide or whether it is
• 51:32
  branded with Govi or Zepbound or, or the 2 brand names for the
• 51:36
  current obesity medications. The price will pretty much tell
• 51:40
  you the the difference, right? Typically the branded are more
• 51:44
  than 200 and typically these compounded are less than two
• 51:47
  hundred a month. And is there a risk with a
• 51:49
  compounded or someone? Is steering.
• 51:51
  Clear from that, OK. There there is so compounding
• 51:58
  how it came about and and why it's allowed is let's just take
• 52:01
  whatever that you know your your kid gets sick and they're gonna
• 52:04
  get penicillin and let's just say they actually have an
• 52:06
  allergy to that pink dye and the bubble gum flavor right.
• 52:10
  That the penicillin comes with Yeah, right.
• 52:12
  I mean, it's, it happens. So a compound pharmacy could
• 52:16
  take the active ingredient in penicillin, right, and make a
• 52:19
  formulation with the right dose or whatever for, for you or your
• 52:23
  kid. That's how it's supposed to be.
• 52:25
  And you and certainly the FDA can't regulate every single one
• 52:29
  of those things. So what happened again during
• 52:33
  this perfect storm with the the pandemic and everything was that
• 52:36
  the supply chain got disrupted. There was inadequate supply.
• 52:40
  So there's a loophole that you can use compounding to fill in
• 52:44
  when there's a supply issue. And then when the supply issue
• 52:48
  got resolved, it's been very difficult to to close that door.
• 52:53
  And so you'll see in the news, you know, there's all sorts of
• 52:56
  letters and litigation from the FDA and the manufacturers and,
• 52:59
  and all sorts of things. Some companies are doing it
• 53:03
  well. They're really getting, you
• 53:05
  know, making high quality products.
• 53:08
  They have high, you know, quality control, quality
• 53:10
  assurance and, and all the other things.
• 53:12
  And probably there's a bit of a price tag for that.
• 53:16
  And then there's some companies who are just doing it poorly on
• 53:20
  the cheap and, and, and there have been lawsuits because
• 53:24
  there's all sorts of other things mixed in batch to batch.
• 53:27
  You don't know if you're getting the same dose when they start
• 53:31
  mixing it in with vitamins. So then you think, oh, this is
• 53:33
  great. Now I get one injection and it
• 53:35
  has all my vitamins and whatever.
• 53:36
  Well, that's never been studied and we don't know if that
• 53:40
  actually is safe. That's.
• 53:42
  Where I'm getting worried about that as I'm hearing more and
• 53:44
  more friends and young women, like young girls in their 20s,
• 53:48
  like just doing it as cheap as possible.
• 53:50
  But what has been tested? Like what's if they want to make
• 53:53
  an appointment with one of these companies?
• 53:54
  What's the question that they need to ask so that they can
• 53:56
  understand whether or not this is a legit company or not?
• 54:00
  Is it, is it FDA approved or does the facility FDA approved?
• 54:03
  Like what is the exact question? Exactly so is the does the
• 54:07
  facility, when was the facility's last FDA inspection
• 54:11
  or audit? So that might be a good thing.
• 54:14
  And and where do they source their ingredients from the raw
• 54:17
  materials from? And the answer should be what if
• 54:21
  it if it's a good answer? Well, it should be, it should be
• 54:25
  North America or Europe, you know, to be safe where they're
• 54:28
  getting their, their raw materials from.
• 54:30
  And they should, you know, either be able to say yes within
• 54:33
  this time period that they recently had a, an auditor
• 54:37
  inspection or that they have some sort of a certificate of,
• 54:40
  you know, quality or, or passing or something of that sort.
• 54:44
  Thank you so much. Can I ask you one more
• 54:48
  questions? I think it's my, my last big
• 54:50
  question and it's about a word you said a few minutes ago.
• 54:53
  And that's shame. And I just know you, I know you
• 54:56
  think a lot about body talk and body image.
• 54:59
  And again, as I'm trying to come up with my opinion.
• 55:04
  And by the way, I would love to cut out the food noise of my
• 55:07
  head. And I, I guess I'm not
• 55:11
  clinically, but I, I grew up in the 80s and 90s with Kate Moss.
• 55:16
  Like I have my own body image thing.
• 55:19
  I live in Boulder for goodness sakes.
• 55:21
  Like there's the demand to be fit in this town and look, you
• 55:25
  know, all these things. But when I, when I get scared
• 55:29
  about is the food industry like spending so much money telling
• 55:34
  me snack wells, it's sorry, snack wells, I know you just
• 55:38
  changed your recipe. I shouldn't keep picking on you,
• 55:39
  but you know, this is good, this is bad, and I've got the pharma
• 55:44
  industry pumping all these commercials and I have. 21
• 55:49
  supplements that you're currently on.
• 55:50
  I'm getting down, I'm weaning myself off.
• 55:54
  It's 22, but I'm, I'm like down to, I'm getting there.
• 55:57
  I talk about that in the newsletter and then you've got
• 56:00
  the tech industry like admitting they're building the most
• 56:03
  addictive tech possible. And we were this like
• 56:07
  generation, first generation parent trying to raise our kids
• 56:12
  on it. And now we're like trying to
• 56:13
  pull back. But it feels too late.
• 56:15
  And I I know these guys have heard me talk about it before,
• 56:18
  but nothing makes me more angry than the recycling industry
• 56:21
  where you are like so much shame is put on me, like me as my
• 56:30
  demographic. Yeah, to not let my kids be
• 56:34
  addicted to phones, to eat the right foods, to not go on a GL
• 56:38
  P1 for a little bit of help. But yes, maybe because I, I'm
• 56:42
  not obese or and now and I and I have to like figure out what to
• 56:47
  recycle when we could be putting on societal guardrails and like
• 56:52
  stopping policy up the chain and being like, Hey, manufacturers,
• 56:56
  maybe we don't need to put Barbie in all that plastic that
• 57:00
  we can't cut out on Christmas and figure out how to recycle.
• 57:03
  Like there's all this stuff happening.
• 57:06
  And I guess where I'm going is it's all happening at industry
• 57:11
  and. All the.
• 57:13
  Shame is coming to the individual and I'm having a
• 57:17
  really hard time with it and I just wonder in your experience,
• 57:22
  what do you tell people that I feel the individual shame of all
• 57:26
  of this when and powerless to do anything at the industry level?
• 57:33
  No, that's, that's really, really great questions.
• 57:36
  And, and you're right, industry will do whatever they do and
• 57:39
  they'll as long as they can get away with it, right.
• 57:41
  And that's only when they're getting some backlash that they
• 57:44
  change. I do want to take this point
• 57:47
  because both Heather and likely you both have used the word
• 57:51
  obese. And I want to say that we need
• 57:53
  to wipe that word out of the vocabulary.
• 57:55
  So that's an adjective, right? And it's, it's not a nice
• 57:58
  adjective. So instead we use the term
• 58:01
  obesity as a disease, just like we say hypertension and diabetes
• 58:05
  and asthma, right? And.
• 58:07
  So it's a disease they suffer from obesity, a person.
• 58:10
  Has obesity, right? Exactly.
• 58:12
  Yeah. Got it.
• 58:13
  OK. I appreciate that.
• 58:14
  We'll take that. Pleasure.
• 58:17
  So with that being said, then the back to the question about
• 58:20
  industry, you know, there's that whole saying like think
• 58:24
  globally, act locally. And, and I really think this is
• 58:27
  the time of thing when we really can lean in and what is it that
• 58:31
  we can do? And even to the point, right,
• 58:34
  like with recycling, everyone buying new toys for, for their
• 58:38
  kids, and then it's in the packaging and that whatever, you
• 58:41
  know, I, I, I've heard an interesting thing, you know,
• 58:45
  back to I don't have kids. I just have the little fur
• 58:47
  babies. But so I'm, you know, I find
• 58:49
  these generations fascinating, But you know, this youngest
• 58:53
  generation, Gen. ZI guess not the, the little
• 58:55
  kids, the alphas, but the Z's. They actually are doing these
• 58:58
  tote bags where they put in like board games like that We used to
• 59:03
  play when we were kids, you know, sorry, and those kinds of
• 59:06
  things, right. And they have these like tech
• 59:09
  free nights, so right. And they're all into the 90's
• 59:15
  the way that we were into the 50s, right?
• 59:18
  Remember like Greece was so cool in the 50s.
• 59:20
  Now they think like Friends is so cool.
• 59:22
  So I think one thing that parents can do is go back to the
• 59:26
  things that we enjoyed doing before the tech and digital age
• 59:30
  and you know, and try to get your kids to do those things,
• 59:33
  Some of which is again, back to playing outside, right, and
• 59:37
  being physically active, but certainly doing other things,
• 59:41
  you know, paint by number and Mad Libs, like actually with a
• 59:45
  pencil and a pad as opposed to, you know, digital, like some of
• 59:49
  those things. I I think the kids would enjoy
• 59:51
  it and they would appreciate the time away from their screens,
• 59:55
  right and. I agree and I think it too helps
• 59:57
  them look when when I was with other real live bodies of my
• 1:00:03
  friends and looking at real people and real women's girls,
• 1:00:08
  their body compared to my body, I never thought twice about it.
• 1:00:11
  I never, you know, it's, it's when you're looking at the
• 1:00:14
  unrealistic things or the people who have access to 24/7 trainers
• 1:00:19
  and then. On top of that filtering where
• 1:00:21
  it's like they probably don't look like that in real life
• 1:00:23
  anyway. They probably shaved, you know,
• 1:00:25
  half a centimeter off their butt before they posted the picture.
• 1:00:28
  And so it's what is real and how are they, how are we
• 1:00:32
  communicating to our kids, the next generation of what's
• 1:00:35
  achievable? And just because you can take a
• 1:00:39
  pill and lose 30 lbs doesn't mean you should.
• 1:00:42
  And if you do need to, and if it that's part of your health plan,
• 1:00:46
  make sure that you are getting medical oversight, real medical
• 1:00:50
  oversight and don't get swept up into a trend just because to
• 1:00:54
  your point, Blakely, the industry is saying, hey,
• 1:00:56
  everybody's doing this. Hey, guys, look over here now
• 1:00:58
  look over here. This is what you have to do if
• 1:00:59
  you really care about your health.
• 1:01:01
  Take this pill, do this thing and like have your own stand up
• 1:01:05
  for your own personal agency, stand up for your body, your
• 1:01:08
  choice. Like you said, Linda, these are
• 1:01:10
  not things that you should be handing over to anyone to make a
• 1:01:14
  decision for you at all. There should be no corporation
• 1:01:17
  that's telling you what to do with your body and what to do or
• 1:01:21
  not to do, frankly, with your body.
• 1:01:23
  And we have to empower people to make those decisions and not be
• 1:01:27
  caught up in a trend. Right.
• 1:01:29
  I, I would agree 100%, you know, and does it feel right and is it
• 1:01:35
  getting you to a point right where the best version of of you
• 1:01:39
  is is coming out And I'm not talking about, you know,
• 1:01:41
  cosmetically, but you know, back to, you know, where some of
• 1:01:45
  these people are, are accessing. If you're getting your drugs
• 1:01:47
  from the nail salon, would you think of taking any of your
• 1:01:51
  other medications from the nail salon?
• 1:01:54
  No. Right.
• 1:01:55
  Is that real? Yes, oh, so.
• 1:01:59
  No, it is. When I did eyelash extensions
• 1:02:01
  for a wedding one day they had they had a little sign at the
• 1:02:05
  checkout. If you're interested in GLP
• 1:02:08
  ones, we can provide them to you at the eyelash extension place.
• 1:02:11
  Yeah. So.
• 1:02:13
  And I'm assuming that's like part of caught up in like a
• 1:02:15
  multi level marketing thing. Is that hitting GLP ones?
• 1:02:19
  Yeah, yeah, but but that's exactly it.
• 1:02:21
  Like, where are these people getting these things right?
• 1:02:23
  And if it doesn't feel right, then certainly don't do it.
• 1:02:26
  And then back full circle, Blakely, to your question about,
• 1:02:29
  you know, all the plastics and stuff.
• 1:02:30
  And like I said, you know, acting locally, I can't tell you
• 1:02:34
  over the past few years how much I've gotten involved in signing
• 1:02:39
  my name on these letters that go places, right?
• 1:02:42
  When you believe in something, right?
• 1:02:43
  And there are literally these, these different WhatsApp groups
• 1:02:47
  that you can sign up and it's like 1 action a day and you're
• 1:02:50
  just, you know, adding your, your name to it.
• 1:02:53
  And, but you know, it doesn't take much effort on your part.
• 1:02:56
  But, but now they're getting, you know, 10s of thousands,
• 1:02:59
  hundreds of thousands of signatures.
• 1:03:00
  And that's part of even what's getting the, the pull back on,
• 1:03:04
  on these medications and putting that pressure on it to bring the
• 1:03:07
  prices down South. There are some things we can do.
• 1:03:11
  We certainly could even be the leaders in putting together
• 1:03:15
  those groups and those petitions and otherwise.
• 1:03:17
  But I, I think we, you know, we have to get a little bit
• 1:03:21
  uncomfortable in order to kind of bring things back to a place
• 1:03:25
  where we're comfortable. Oh, I think that was a really
• 1:03:29
  good line, a really good line because I, I, I come full circle
• 1:03:34
  on what I was just saying. And I'm talking about industry
• 1:03:37
  versus individual shame, but also you're all you got.
• 1:03:43
  So, you know, you hear action absorbs anxiety.
• 1:03:48
  And at some point on all these things, like, yeah, you maybe
• 1:03:54
  I'm going to start a GL P1 tomorrow.
• 1:03:55
  Please don't shame me. And also, right, absolutely.
• 1:03:58
  Maybe I'm going to go fight for no more plastic Barbies so.
• 1:04:04
  You're just pissed 'cause you didn't get a Barbie, 'cause you
• 1:04:06
  got. Though I got the right called.
• 1:04:08
  Barbie right, size Barbie. Barbie right.
• 1:04:10
  Oh my God, very Linda, someday when you have nothing better to
• 1:04:13
  do, you got to go back and listen to.
• 1:04:14
  I just think it was our Christmas episode of talked
• 1:04:18
  about how her mom bought her a right size Barbie, which I fully
• 1:04:21
  support by the way. Did it come in plastic though,
• 1:04:24
  just like the other Barbie? Was it wrapped in a tie?
• 1:04:26
  I think it was. Before the arms got like, tied
• 1:04:29
  down, you know, they had like the twist ties back then, yeah.
• 1:04:34
  I know Clay's dying to tell us we have to stop recording.
• 1:04:37
  I know we're going to this is such a hot topic.
• 1:04:40
  There's so I just, there's so much I want to peel back.
• 1:04:44
  Well, I'm sure we'll be talking about this a lot more because it
• 1:04:47
  seems like GLP ones are only becoming more popular.
• 1:04:52
  I'm getting advertised them in between, you know, things on
• 1:04:55
  Instagram. So it's hitting your generation
• 1:04:59
  and sex as well interesting males in their.
• 1:05:03
  They have mail, Yeah. You can just buy them and they
• 1:05:05
  come in the mail, you know. Yeah.
• 1:05:08
  So what I mean to say is that it's very prevalent, and it
• 1:05:11
  seems like it's only gaining more steam and more attention.
• 1:05:14
  And so I would like to have Doctor Linda back on.
• 1:05:18
  Yes. Oh yeah, it's the first time
• 1:05:21
  Clay said that. Yes.
• 1:05:23
  Doctor Linda I. Don't want to wrap, I really
• 1:05:25
  enjoyed this conversation. Doctor Linda.
• 1:05:27
  I think we should if we can plan another episode.
• 1:05:30
  When? I would invite everyone to come
• 1:05:32
  on over to sub stack and like type out your questions and if
• 1:05:36
  we can fortunately get Doctor Lintette back, maybe we can.
• 1:05:41
  We should do a community question.
• 1:05:43
  Lives. That would be fun.
• 1:05:45
  Yeah, she's like. This is not in my contract.
• 1:05:49
  I know, I know, you know, in all of her spare time, she's got
• 1:05:53
  time to do a live with us. It'd be cool though.
• 1:05:55
  It'd be fun. I mean, we're asking questions
• 1:05:57
  that we genuinely have and I hope that's representative of
• 1:05:59
  what other people have, but I'm sure there's a million more.
• 1:06:02
  No, it would be my pleasure. Fine.
• 1:06:04
  Thank you so much. Thank you so much.
• 1:06:06
  All right, but before we let you go, I do want to ask you the
• 1:06:10
  question that we ask all of our guests and we do answer it
• 1:06:13
  ourselves, which is what brought a smile to your face this week.
• 1:06:16
  Oh, well, I, I'm also here in Colorado and I sorry everyone
• 1:06:20
  else, we're having fantastic weather.
• 1:06:23
  It's 80° in March, the sun is out.
• 1:06:27
  I I live in a neighborhood that has a lake and the Pelicans have
• 1:06:30
  come back. They're swimming on the lake and
• 1:06:33
  yeah, it's. There's a lake in Colorado.
• 1:06:37
  I that was our thought when we moved back.
• 1:06:40
  Yeah, I'll have to tell you. It's about halfway between
• 1:06:42
  Blakely and Heather. Oh, maybe we can do the live
• 1:06:46
  from here. No.
• 1:06:47
  Idea. Yes, live.
• 1:06:49
  From the lake, baby, Yeah. Live from the lake with Doctor
• 1:06:52
  Linda we even. Have the.
• 1:06:53
  Alliteration going It's it's it's planning itself.
• 1:06:56
  It's planning itself. All right.
• 1:06:58
  Blakely, Clay. Oh, do you want me to go?
• 1:07:01
  Yeah, OK. This weekend I said I'm not
• 1:07:06
  working one day. I was just like, I'm not like
• 1:07:09
  I'm not working at all. Good, I'm out.
• 1:07:11
  Emeris, we're getting out. Emeris is my my son, so he and I
• 1:07:15
  spent pretty much almost the entire day together and we like
• 1:07:19
  went to our favorite Mexican grocery store and got chips and
• 1:07:23
  salsa. We went to this like brand new
• 1:07:25
  park that was built right on the riverfront.
• 1:07:27
  We got to see the brand new Gordie Howe Bridge.
• 1:07:29
  Nice Canada. It's really cool.
• 1:07:31
  And it was. Just like.
• 1:07:31
  Oh, Gordie Howe from the Bare Naked Lady song.
• 1:07:35
  Well, he's a hockey player, yeah.
• 1:07:37
  And also in the bare naked. Lady Song. 789 I.
• 1:07:43
  Didn't know that he was in a Now I got to listen to that song on
• 1:07:48
  the bridge when I drive across it.
• 1:07:51
  So I'll ask you to send that to me.
• 1:07:53
  But we just had a nice day and then we went to my parents
• 1:07:56
  place. They live downtown and we just
• 1:07:59
  kind of hung out there and ate some food and chilled and then
• 1:08:02
  came back home and we like to play a little bit of video
• 1:08:06
  games. So we played a video game
• 1:08:07
  together, which is a nice day. So it was smiles all day.
• 1:08:10
  It was really nice. Beautiful.
• 1:08:12
  Yeah, beautiful Lakers. Just yeah, thank you.
• 1:08:19
  We got to cut that from the vocabulary as well.
• 1:08:24
  Does not. Have obesity?
• 1:08:27
  See. What I did?
• 1:08:29
  I'm not yes, happy a smile, not necessarily happy smile.
• 1:08:38
  What brought a smile to my face is my son committed to college.
• 1:08:45
  And I was like, oh. Shut the front door.
• 1:08:47
  Really awesome. Congratulations.
• 1:08:50
  Western Washington University in Bellingham, which is where?
• 1:08:55
  I am that's. Where you're from?
• 1:08:58
  Well, no, I mean I went to college there as well.
• 1:09:00
  So you live there? Yeah, which is kind of funny.
• 1:09:03
  He applied to 14 schools and he got into all but one, I think.
• 1:09:07
  And he chose the one that I went to and I was like, OK, but it's
• 1:09:10
  awesome. He's like a.
• 1:09:11
  Soccer The Western Washington Vikings.
• 1:09:15
  The Vikings, yeah. And.
• 1:09:16
  Their mascot name is Victor E Viking.
• 1:09:20
  I did not so cool, did not know that.
• 1:09:22
  Of course it's. A dude just kidding.
• 1:09:26
  OK, That's. I'm excited.
• 1:09:28
  I'm excited. Yeah.
• 1:09:29
  Congratulations on that for killing it.
• 1:09:32
  Yeah. Congrats, he's killing it.
• 1:09:33
  OK, fun. Mine was that it was Saturday
• 1:09:37
  just like Linda said, and it's been beautiful weather and my
• 1:09:41
  stepson had a friend over spend the night and these kids today,
• 1:09:45
  these kids today and their video games.
• 1:09:49
  But of course, that's what we anticipated them doing the whole
• 1:09:52
  day, right? But they woke up and they ran
• 1:09:54
  upstairs and they're like, hey, we're going to go for a bike
• 1:09:56
  ride because we want to go get these this new special game and
• 1:09:58
  we got to go try to find it. And so they went on a on a whole
• 1:10:02
  adventure. They got on their bikes and
• 1:10:04
  they've started at King Soopers, our local grocery store.
• 1:10:06
  They didn't have it. They said that might have it at
• 1:10:08
  the other store. And then they went all the way
• 1:10:10
  down to Target. I mean these boys are riding
• 1:10:12
  like 5-6 miles on their bike and then back into Old Town chasing.
• 1:10:16
  Down these. Special card games and they
• 1:10:19
  found it, thank God. So one of the stores had it, but
• 1:10:21
  they went to four or five of them.
• 1:10:22
  And then in the process, they stopped by a garage sale and
• 1:10:26
  then they called us and they're like, guys, this garage sale is
• 1:10:29
  like has a ton of vinyls. It must have been like an old
• 1:10:32
  record store or something. And so we and you have Nick, a
• 1:10:35
  record player. I know.
• 1:10:37
  And so we're like, no way. So we jumped in the car, ran
• 1:10:41
  over to the garage sale. Why didn't you go on your bikes
• 1:10:43
  a ball? It was because it was people
• 1:10:46
  were swarming. I don't have time for that.
• 1:10:48
  I got to fight elbow to elbow to get these vinyls. 2 bucks a
• 1:10:51
  vinyl in perfect condition by the way, 2 dollars $2.00 likely.
• 1:10:55
  That's why I was like. Get that anymore?
• 1:10:57
  I'm not wasting 20 minutes on a bike I'm going to get.
• 1:10:59
  I went there in 3 minutes and we got like 60 of them.
• 1:11:01
  It was awesome. That's cool.
• 1:11:03
  So so you. Bought 60 vinyls.
• 1:11:06
  Maybe like, I mean, yeah, like 2 big stacks, maybe 30.
• 1:11:10
  I don't know. I didn't.
• 1:11:11
  Count like the crates. Yeah, no, we had that's, yeah,
• 1:11:15
  it was so many like our, you know, we have that little holder
• 1:11:19
  for it. It's all full now of vinyls and
• 1:11:21
  they're really cool and they're old.
• 1:11:24
  And I, I bought Annie the musical.
• 1:11:28
  Annie. Did you watch that Annie?
• 1:11:30
  Yeah, because I know everyone when I was like 8 years old and
• 1:11:34
  I know. Every song, everyone yeah,
• 1:11:37
  played that one last. Life for.
• 1:11:40
  US. Hi, good job.
• 1:11:41
  Thanks. I liked I used to watch the
• 1:11:43
  gosh, I don't think it was the I think it was the movie version I
• 1:11:47
  used to watch. Of Annie.
• 1:11:50
  Well, yeah, I mean, what, were you rich enough to go see it on
• 1:11:52
  the stage? Nah, we all watched the movie
• 1:11:55
  version. Well.
• 1:11:56
  I'm saying they probably had like a VHS like the the play
• 1:12:00
  version or something. Original version I.
• 1:12:02
  Was watching the version, wasn't it a movie?
• 1:12:03
  It was always just a movie, wasn't?
• 1:12:05
  It but it got remade, right? It was.
• 1:12:09
  I mean, I know the Carol Burnett.
• 1:12:11
  Carol Burnett, One version. Yeah.
• 1:12:14
  This is Hannigan. Anyway, it was a ball, it was
• 1:12:17
  fun, and there's nothing better than a garage sale.
• 1:12:19
  And I used to go all the time and I need to go more because
• 1:12:21
  we're reusing stuff, so saving the planet.
• 1:12:23
  And also you're meeting your neighbors and they Blakely, you
• 1:12:26
  would be very impressed. They're selling everything
• 1:12:28
  because they're moving into their van, their Sprinter van
• 1:12:31
  are. They really not like.
• 1:12:34
  Because they lost everything. Just because it's a choice,
• 1:12:36
  they're going to just go travel the country in their.
• 1:12:38
  Van all themselves yeah, it's real I.
• 1:12:44
  Just got a cool van. No, no boldak noodles, no matter
• 1:12:47
  the. I got a story for you.
• 1:12:51
  Did I tell you I? Listened to that episode.
• 1:12:54
  You did, I have to tell you. Yeah, when I was a PhD student,
• 1:13:01
  right? So I was a student for a long
• 1:13:02
  time. I sold my vinyl.
• 1:13:05
  I sold my Michael Jackson thriller and police
• 1:13:10
  synchronicity. No.
• 1:13:12
  And I think I got about $1.50 or 2 bucks for that.
• 1:13:17
  So and what what I would pay to have the back down right?
• 1:13:20
  Yeah, yeah, so good. You'll pay $35 is what you'll
• 1:13:25
  pay for that police and then Michael Jackson, maybe 65.
• 1:13:29
  It's crazy how expensive they are.
• 1:13:31
  Yeah, that's analogue is cool. I mean, it's all coming back,
• 1:13:34
  right? So my kids asked for funny Sony
• 1:13:37
  Walkman's for Christmas last year.
• 1:13:40
  Whoa. Oh yeah, and also the digital
• 1:13:42
  camera thing. Yeah, Oh, that's what my
• 1:13:44
  daughter wanted. But you know what?
• 1:13:48
  Let it come back. Let it come, let it come.
• 1:13:50
  Absolutely everything except the skinny Kate Moss standard.
• 1:13:53
  Just we can bring it all back. Just except for that we can't.
• 1:13:57
  We can't. I just don't like the low rise.
• 1:13:59
  Well. I mean big hair.
• 1:14:02
  Well, when you have a belly roll that hangs over, I want.
• 1:14:04
  Big hair to come back. I love big hair.
• 1:14:07
  I want the biggest hair to come back.
• 1:14:10
  Really do it. Do you?
• 1:14:13
  Do you? Your body is your business,
• 1:14:15
  Blakely. If we've learned nothing today,
• 1:14:17
  OK, let's let's learn one thing today, Your body.
• 1:14:20
  Subscribe to this sub stack so you can hear all about how big
• 1:14:23
  hair is coming back. So, Doctor Linda, we always ask
• 1:14:28
  our guests, you know, what's the best way for someone to stay in
• 1:14:31
  contact with the guests who come on the show for you?
• 1:14:34
  What's the best way for people to be able to follow what you're
• 1:14:37
  up to? Sure.
• 1:14:38
  Well, you can track me down on LinkedIn.
• 1:14:41
  That might be maybe the the best place.
• 1:14:42
  And just my full name, Linda Shapiro Manning right there on
• 1:14:46
  LinkedIn. Thank.
• 1:14:48
  You OK? Great.
• 1:14:49
  We'll be sure to have that in the show, notes Heather Blakely.
• 1:14:53
  Anything else? Not.
• 1:14:54
  Just. TBD to be yeah TD, thank you.
• 1:14:58
  To be continued to be C. TBCTBC.
• 1:15:02
  To be continued, great start of a great conversation and really
• 1:15:06
  appreciate you. Yeah.
• 1:15:08
  Absolutely. Thank you so much.
• 1:15:09
  You're pouring into our lives and to our daughters and sons
• 1:15:13
  lives and it's going to be a wild ride.
• 1:15:16
  And I just really appreciate all the information because when we
• 1:15:18
  go into it with knowledge, we can make the best decisions that
• 1:15:22
  are best for us and our bodies. So thank you so much.
• 1:15:26
  No, that's fantastic. I love.
• 1:15:28
  That's a great way to end. And yeah, I mean that the gate
• 1:15:30
  is open, the doors are open, and now let's try to shape it into
• 1:15:33
  something that's really healthy for everyone.
• 1:15:37
  How's that? I love it.
• 1:15:39
  All right, see you next time. See you next time.
• 1:15:42
  Cheers.