Latest / Dishing with Stephanie's Dish / @SetTheTablePhotography

Transcript

@SetTheTablePhotography · Dishing with Stephanie's Dish

0:02
SPEAKER_00: Hello, everybody.
0:03
Welcome to Dishing with Stephanie's Dish,
0:05
the podcast where we talk to people in the food space.
0:08
SPEAKER_00: And today I have my friend Rachel White.
0:11
SPEAKER_00: And Rachel,
0:12
you're a fairly new friend of mine that I met on the set of our
0:16
food doll shoot
0:17
SPEAKER_00: that we did for the Taste Buds.
0:19
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
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SPEAKER_01: That was such a fun day.
0:21
SPEAKER_00: It was fun.
0:22
SPEAKER_00: And you and I had been followers,
0:25
but you know how you follow people on Instagram and then you
0:27
meet them in real life
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SPEAKER_00: and you don't connect the dots.
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SPEAKER_00: You have an Instagram handle called set the table photography.
0:34
SPEAKER_00: Yep, correct.
0:37
so i had followed you and then at the food doll shoot they had
0:43
asked if they could
0:43
have a food stylist there and i was like sure yeah great
0:47
whatever that'd be awesome
0:48
to figure out what food stylists do and how they do their magic
0:52
and then you were
0:52
there and i didn't put together that you were that person until
0:56
like at the very
0:57
SPEAKER_00: end of the shoot which was fun too yeah oh yes
1:01
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
1:01
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
1:02
SPEAKER_00: So thanks for being my guest today.
1:04
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:04
SPEAKER_01: Thanks for having me.
1:05
SPEAKER_01: I've been so excited about this.
1:07
SPEAKER_00: So you, yeah, you were a real delight to meet on that shoot.
1:12
SPEAKER_00: And usually when we do taste buds with Stephanie,
1:16
SPEAKER_00: which I should say is the TV show that I do on Fox nine in Minneapolis.
1:20
SPEAKER_00: And it's also,
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SPEAKER_00: I think in other markets,
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SPEAKER_00: I think we're going to end up in Chicago and Austin and some other spots.
1:26
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
1:27
um we don't have a food stylist on site like we have a super
1:30
small crew we mostly
1:32
shoot in my kitchen but in this particular shoot we were with
1:35
food dolls and they
1:36
were getting ready to promote their new cookbook pretty
1:38
delicious which i think
1:41
it's today and maybe it was yesterday but it ended up on the
1:45
new york times
1:45
bestseller yeah it's like number four on the new york times
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bestseller list it's so
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SPEAKER_01: fun to watch them succeed with that
1:51
SPEAKER_00: Do you remember at that shoot us talking about that?
1:55
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I do.
1:56
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:57
SPEAKER_00: And I was like, okay, we are going to manifest it.
1:59
SPEAKER_00: We're going to put it into the air right now.
2:01
SPEAKER_00: Cause they were saying, you know, we would really love this.
2:04
And for those of you that maybe don't know,
2:06
pre-sales on a cookbook are really important.
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SPEAKER_00: And when your cookbook goes live,
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SPEAKER_00: If you can get enough pre-sales, they all count towards that one day.
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SPEAKER_00: So you can get on the New York Times bestseller list.
2:19
SPEAKER_00: Now,
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food dolls with 8 million followers are in a trajectory of
2:22
their own and will
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SPEAKER_00: probably stay there,
2:24
SPEAKER_00: I imagine,
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SPEAKER_00: for some time.
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But for the rest of us,
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we would just be like,
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yes,
2:28
I could get there once.
2:31
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
2:32
So,
2:32
Rachel,
2:33
talk a little bit about what a food stylist does or what your
2:39
trajectory was.
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Well,
2:40
two things about how did you get here and then what's your
2:43
actual job?
2:44
SPEAKER_01: Sure.
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SPEAKER_01: So I have I mean,
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SPEAKER_01: as I think a lot of people do in the food space,
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SPEAKER_01: I have a very nonlinear storyline of how I got here.
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SPEAKER_01: I actually majored in communication and music in college.
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SPEAKER_01: thinking I'd do something in one or both of those areas.
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SPEAKER_01: And a year after my husband and I met in college,
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SPEAKER_01: we got married a couple of years after graduation.
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SPEAKER_01: And then a year after that,
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SPEAKER_01: we ended up moving to Tokyo,
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SPEAKER_01: Japan for four years,
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SPEAKER_01: which I know you were just there.
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SPEAKER_01: I loved it so much.
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SPEAKER_01: And when we went there, I did not have a job.
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SPEAKER_01: So my official title was trailing spouse.
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SPEAKER_01: And it's like the worst title ever.
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SPEAKER_01: It's like I hate everything about this.
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SPEAKER_01: But my husband was teaching at an international school.
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SPEAKER_01: And I just kind of was hanging out.
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SPEAKER_01: Like I did some subbing, didn't have anything else going on.
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SPEAKER_01: And hilariously, I bought...
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SPEAKER_01: My husband's name is Brad.
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I bought Brad a camera and I was like,
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you know,
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he loves taking pictures.
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SPEAKER_01: He's going to have so much fun with this DSLR,
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SPEAKER_01: walking around the city,
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SPEAKER_01: taking pictures of stuff.
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But of course he was working all the time and this camera is
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just sitting there collecting dust.
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SPEAKER_01: And I was like, I'm just gonna pick this up.
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SPEAKER_01: And I started photographing our food that we were eating.
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you know,
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when we'd go out,
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but mostly when we were just cooking at home.
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So I'd put together these dishes and take pictures,
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send them to our family.
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And then I started a food blog called Tokyo Terrace and started
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sharing everything on there.
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SPEAKER_01: And that was kind of where things began for me.
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SPEAKER_01: So the ball really started rolling at that point.
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SPEAKER_01: I got a recipe published in the Daily Yomiuri, which is like the
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one of the newspapers in japan and that was really exciting um
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and then from there
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i sort of went back and forth between do i want to be a food
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blogger or do i want
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to really focus on the more creative side of things and you
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know i had one of my
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kids in tokyo he's just turned 13 and then i had another kid
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three years later
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SPEAKER_01: And,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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SPEAKER_01: I was all over the place,
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SPEAKER_01: so I didn't really have a whole lot of direction for a while.
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SPEAKER_01: We also moved a couple of times in there.
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SPEAKER_01: And then in the last couple of years,
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SPEAKER_01: well,
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SPEAKER_01: I should say,
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SPEAKER_01: even though things were not consistent at that point,
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I was always involved in some kind of food styling or
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photography because it just
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SPEAKER_01: it was something I couldn't not do.
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SPEAKER_01: Like I had to be involved in it somehow.
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SPEAKER_01: It's like my life's breath to make food beautiful and
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SPEAKER_01: I love capturing that in any space, really.
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It can be the fanciest like five star dinner somewhere out or
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it can be like the
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SPEAKER_01: most humble thing that I made at home,
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SPEAKER_01: like a boxed macaroni and cheese with like some fun stuff on top of it.
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SPEAKER_01: I just love making stuff look pretty.
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SPEAKER_01: So.
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SPEAKER_01: That is kind of how I got to where I am now,
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which is I am focusing largely on food styling and I do some
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food photography.
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I do a lot of food styling assisting for other stylists in the
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Twin Cities area.
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SPEAKER_01: And so when I do that kind of work, my job is...
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SPEAKER_01: Basically to do some of the grunt work for them.
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So a lot of the little things that they can have like a bigger
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picture of what a
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SPEAKER_01: dish is going to look like.
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SPEAKER_01: And then,
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SPEAKER_01: you know,
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I get the job of like I've sorted tortilla chips before and
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like taken out the
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SPEAKER_01: broken ones.
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SPEAKER_01: So that's one aspect of my job.
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But again,
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it's like the whole point is just to make food look as
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appetizing as possible.
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SPEAKER_01: So you want somebody to look at it and say, I need that.
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SPEAKER_01: Like, I need to put that in my mouth.
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SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
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And then another part of my job is I do freelance food
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photography and styling like
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SPEAKER_01: as a package deal.
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So food bloggers will sometimes send me their recipes and I
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will photograph and
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SPEAKER_01: style them in my home.
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SPEAKER_01: And in that case,
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it's oftentimes old recipes that they want revamped so that
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they can post some
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SPEAKER_01: fresh photos of it.
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SPEAKER_01: And sometimes it's new recipes too,
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SPEAKER_01: but that's always something that I really,
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SPEAKER_01: I love doing that since my roots are kind of in the food blogging space.
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SPEAKER_00: And yeah,
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I think people don't realize that a lot of the Google AdWords
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algorithms and the
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SPEAKER_00: things you click on there,
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SPEAKER_00: we're always in a chase to make our content stickier,
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SPEAKER_00: let Google see it more.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
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SPEAKER_00: requires like updated photos,
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SPEAKER_00: updated text,
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SPEAKER_00: variations,
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SPEAKER_00: add-ons,
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all of those things over the course of years keep that site
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stickier and those
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SPEAKER_00: recipes more attractive.
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SPEAKER_00: So,
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SPEAKER_00: you know,
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SPEAKER_00: creators,
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like I don't want to go back and make something necessarily
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that I've made 62 times.
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SPEAKER_00: So it's fun to sub that out, I guess, as it were.
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SPEAKER_01: Yep, exactly.
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SPEAKER_01: And I've found too that a lot of,
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Okay.
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SPEAKER_01: food bloggers or recipe creators who have a website,
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SPEAKER_01: there's so much that goes into that that most people don't see.
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SPEAKER_01: I think if you're inexperienced in that area,
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you just assume that it's mostly just cooking and photographing
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the food and then
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SPEAKER_01: writing a blurb about it.
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SPEAKER_01: But there is so much behind the scenes that they're doing.
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SPEAKER_01: And a lot of people are just like,
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SPEAKER_01: okay,
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I need to offload this photography piece so that my brain power
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can go to some of
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SPEAKER_01: these other things like SEO and my Google ranking and
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SPEAKER_01: things like that.
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So it's really fun to be able to step in and say like,
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I got you like,
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let's do this together.
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I get to do what I love to do and they can focus on where they
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feel like their strengths are.
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SPEAKER_01: So it's really fun.
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It is this whole crazy space because I started like you started
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where I just
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started like taking pictures of food and I was making recipes
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that I liked and I
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SPEAKER_00: was recreating some of the stuff that our family made.
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SPEAKER_00: My mom...
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had died and I was like trying to re-figure out how she made
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her meatballs and that
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SPEAKER_00: sort of thing.
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SPEAKER_00: And then you're like, oh, this will be fun.
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SPEAKER_00: Let's just start documenting and blogging.
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SPEAKER_00: And then it becomes more fun.
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And also like at some point,
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if you get any work in the space,
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now it becomes a job.
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SPEAKER_00: Yep.
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SPEAKER_00: And that job grows.
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And then you start to find yourself like you have this imposter
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period of time,
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right?
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SPEAKER_00: Where, yeah,
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SPEAKER_00: You're just like doing this job,
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but you can't believe people are really like paying you money
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to do this job.
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And then like the cookbook things happen and the social media
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things happen.
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SPEAKER_00: And like, I am having this wonderful.
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real world experience in that i'm like backing in now to all
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the stuff i didn't
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know like all the seo and oh you need six images instead of
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just one and i was so
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focused on getting one good image now you know they're asking
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me for six i'm like
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SPEAKER_00: holy palomino i don't know yeah yeah
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SPEAKER_00: So it's just,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm almost for me personally,
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SPEAKER_00: I'm like backing into trying to be a professional.
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SPEAKER_00: And also like, there's so much about creating that's fun.
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SPEAKER_00: And when it gets unfun, I get real, just like, I don't want to do that.
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SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
9:55
SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
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And I think you mentioned like,
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uh,
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that feeling of,
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oh my gosh,
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I'm getting paid to do this.
10:01
SPEAKER_01: Like what the heck?
10:01
SPEAKER_01: And like when I started doing, um,
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SPEAKER_01: photography and styling and actually getting paid for it.
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That was back in like 2013 was when I started,
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this whole thing started in like 2008 for me.
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SPEAKER_01: And then by 2013,
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SPEAKER_01: I started getting hired for things and hilariously,
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SPEAKER_01: like my first job,
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SPEAKER_01: it was like,
10:23
SPEAKER_01: we'll pay you $25 a month for one recipe.
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SPEAKER_01: Anyway, I feel like if you don't put a high enough value on it, um,
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SPEAKER_01: it all starts to,
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SPEAKER_01: it takes away the joy that you feel doing it just in your free time,
10:38
SPEAKER_01: even because you just feel so bogged down.
10:40
And like it does,
10:41
it takes a lot of time and resources and you are always learning.
10:45
SPEAKER_01: And that takes,
10:47
SPEAKER_01: time and money to be able to put, you know, the effort into that.
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SPEAKER_01: But it's tricky.
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And it's hard when there's so many people like way back when I
10:55
started agreeing to
10:56
SPEAKER_01: something for $25 a month,
10:58
SPEAKER_01: like,
10:59
SPEAKER_01: I don't regret it,
11:00
because it gave me a really good experience and a better
11:03
understanding of how to
11:05
SPEAKER_01: put of how to value my time.
11:08
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
11:09
SPEAKER_01: But, you know, it's tough, because there's a wide range out there.
11:12
SPEAKER_01: And now,
11:15
SPEAKER_00: Like,
11:15
SPEAKER_00: I don't know how you do your accounting,
11:18
SPEAKER_00: but the food,
11:20
SPEAKER_00: like I just was looking year over year.
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SPEAKER_00: Food costs have increased in the Twin Cities 22%.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: Yep.
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SPEAKER_00: So in some of my arrangements,
11:29
SPEAKER_00: you know,
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I just buy the food and then I make the stuff and it's all
11:32
based in my pricing.
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SPEAKER_00: But food is getting to be so much.
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SPEAKER_00: I'm having to really calculate that in and how we're moving.
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SPEAKER_00: Do you usually calculate food in or do you?
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SPEAKER_01: So I,
11:43
SPEAKER_01: uh,
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SPEAKER_01: I typically will say like,
11:47
SPEAKER_01: unless I have everything on hand,
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SPEAKER_01: I will have whoever I'm doing the work for reimburse me for groceries.
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SPEAKER_01: Um, it just, it's easier that way because yeah, it does get really hard.
11:57
SPEAKER_01: Um,
11:58
SPEAKER_01: you know,
11:59
SPEAKER_01: people say,
11:59
SPEAKER_01: well,
11:59
SPEAKER_01: don't you just eat all the food that you,
12:02
SPEAKER_01: you know,
12:02
SPEAKER_01: but no,
12:03
SPEAKER_01: like I don't.
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SPEAKER_00: A lot of times when you're done working on it.
12:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
12:09
SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
12:11
SPEAKER_01: And like,
12:11
SPEAKER_01: you know,
12:11
I have a family of four and not everybody's going to eat
12:14
everything that I make.
12:14
And so,
12:16
yeah,
12:16
so I do,
12:17
I do ask that my clients reimburse me for the groceries.
12:21
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, sometimes they'll tell me like, I'd rather like,
12:26
have an Instacart delivery sent to your house or something,
12:29
and they'll just do it that way.
12:31
SPEAKER_01: But yeah,
12:32
SPEAKER_01: that seems like a pretty,
12:34
SPEAKER_01: like an easier way to go about it,
12:35
SPEAKER_01: especially as prices are changing,
12:36
SPEAKER_01: because then they can kind of say like,
12:38
SPEAKER_01: well,
12:38
SPEAKER_01: do I want to release control of that?
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And does that change what I want to do or like what I want to
12:44
use in the recipe or whatever?
12:46
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, that is definitely a challenge.
12:48
SPEAKER_01: And I don't think that's going to go away anytime soon.
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SPEAKER_01: So
12:51
SPEAKER_00: So in your work,
12:52
SPEAKER_00: like what,
12:53
SPEAKER_00: can you put a percentage on,
12:55
SPEAKER_00: like,
12:55
I just had this idea that most of the people that were hiring
12:58
you were like brands.
13:00
And it sounds like you're getting a significant amount of work
13:04
too from the bloggers themselves.
13:06
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
13:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
13:08
So I right now have two very consistent food bloggers that come
13:15
to me pretty much
13:16
SPEAKER_01: every month to have me do recipes for them,
13:18
SPEAKER_01: which is lovely.
13:19
And then I also recently just got hired at Lando Lakes as an
13:23
on-call photographer for them.
13:25
SPEAKER_01: So that's been really fun.
13:26
SPEAKER_01: So it's nice to have the kind of the juxtaposition of such different
13:32
SPEAKER_01: areas of food, because I feel like that helps me make some connections.
13:36
SPEAKER_01: It helps me learn a lot.
13:38
It really like keeps the job interesting because those are two
13:41
very different things.
13:42
Like the stuff that I do at Land O'Lakes is completely
13:45
different from what I do for
13:46
SPEAKER_01: these food bloggers.
13:48
SPEAKER_01: But it's all just so fun.
13:50
SPEAKER_01: I just love it.
13:51
SPEAKER_00: When you go to like a land a lake shoot,
13:54
SPEAKER_00: for instance,
13:55
SPEAKER_00: traditionally,
13:56
SPEAKER_00: how many people are in the room working on that piece of food?
14:01
SPEAKER_01: So I'm, I'm like three weeks into it right now with them.
14:06
SPEAKER_01: And
14:08
SPEAKER_01: They've got such a for the type of photo shoots that we're doing.
14:11
SPEAKER_01: They have such a wonderful team of people, and most of them are on call.
14:17
SPEAKER_01: Some of a lot of them are recipe developers by trade,
14:20
SPEAKER_01: and then they come in and help with the styling.
14:23
And so we all kind of have our hands in the styling piece of it,
14:25
which is actually really great.
14:27
SPEAKER_01: But I'm trying to think like today we had one, two, three, four.
14:32
SPEAKER_01: like four main people working on stuff.
14:36
And then we had a couple of assistants who were helping with
14:40
like cleanup and all of that.
14:42
SPEAKER_01: So,
14:42
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
14:43
SPEAKER_01: it's a,
14:43
it's a nice size group and it's more of a relaxed setting for
14:48
what we're doing.
14:49
SPEAKER_01: So it's not like a huge studio shoot.
14:51
I've been on a target shoot where it's like,
14:54
there's like 20 people in here and I don't know.
14:56
SPEAKER_00: It's so crazy.
14:57
SPEAKER_00: Cause like we're filming this TV show and
15:00
SPEAKER_00: And we literally have like three people and myself and that's it.
15:05
SPEAKER_00: And it's just, we're taking the pictures, we're doing the styling.
15:09
SPEAKER_00: It's just, it's crazy how it all works.
15:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:13
SPEAKER_00: Do you enjoy taking photographs or food styling more?
15:18
SPEAKER_01: Oh, that's such a good question.
15:19
SPEAKER_01: Oh, it's so hard.
15:24
SPEAKER_01: I do really love both.
15:27
I think some of it depends on the situation,
15:31
but if I had to really pick one,
15:34
SPEAKER_01: I'd probably say that I enjoy the styling part more.
15:38
I think I've just always had this thought in my head,
15:41
like you eat with your eyes first.
15:43
SPEAKER_01: And so no matter what I'm doing,
15:46
SPEAKER_01: whether it's for work or otherwise,
15:48
SPEAKER_01: I'm always trying to make it look as pretty as I can,
15:51
SPEAKER_01: which sometimes is a huge challenge.
15:53
SPEAKER_01: You know, like I was photographing lentil soup a couple of years ago.
15:56
SPEAKER_01: It's like, everything's brown.
15:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: With this.
16:00
SPEAKER_01: But in the end,
16:00
SPEAKER_01: like the,
16:01
SPEAKER_01: it ended up looking really beautiful just from a little,
16:04
SPEAKER_01: like a little garnish of parsley.
16:07
SPEAKER_01: And like,
16:07
you can add just these little tiny things that just take it
16:10
from being something
16:11
SPEAKER_01: totally boring and uninteresting to all of a sudden,
16:14
SPEAKER_01: like you can imagine taking a bite out of that bowl,
16:17
SPEAKER_01: even if it's just on your computer screen.
16:19
SPEAKER_01: And I think there's something so
16:23
just fulfilling about that and being able to like see the
16:27
difference that you can
16:28
SPEAKER_01: make with just these little touches.
16:31
SPEAKER_01: And I think some of that is I've always kind of dabbled in art.
16:37
And I think that being able to bring that into food styling
16:41
just makes it so special.
16:43
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
16:44
SPEAKER_00: When,
16:45
SPEAKER_00: when you're like having a dinner party or when you're at home,
16:48
SPEAKER_00: like just cooking for your family and
16:50
SPEAKER_00: Are there like,
16:52
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to like break it down to like tips necessarily,
16:55
SPEAKER_00: but to make the food look prettier,
16:58
SPEAKER_00: are there like some go-to hacks that you have?
17:01
Yeah,
17:02
I think one of the best things you can invest in is serving
17:07
platters that are simple.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: You don't want them to be too detailed.
17:12
SPEAKER_01: You don't need a bunch of stuff on them.
17:14
Like just have a few go-to platters that you can use like for
17:18
pasta or salad or
17:20
SPEAKER_01: because a lot of those you can use for multiple things,
17:22
SPEAKER_01: right?
17:22
So people are like,
17:23
well,
17:23
what do I use this giant bowl for if I'm not putting salad in it?
17:26
SPEAKER_01: Well, put like
17:28
SPEAKER_01: A bunch of noodles in there or I,
17:30
SPEAKER_01: you know,
17:30
SPEAKER_01: pile up some like grilled chicken or something,
17:33
SPEAKER_01: but have some pieces that you really feel that feel like a blank canvas.
17:38
SPEAKER_01: So when you put your food on there, the food really pops and stands out.
17:41
You don't want something that's going to take away from what
17:44
you're serving because
17:45
then everybody's going to be focused on the plate and not on
17:48
your beautiful food.
17:49
SPEAKER_01: Right.
17:50
SPEAKER_01: So that would be one thing.
17:52
SPEAKER_01: The other thing is don't be afraid of color.
17:55
So like if you are serving something that you're just like,
17:58
like what is happening here?
18:00
SPEAKER_01: Um,
18:00
SPEAKER_01: don't be afraid to add,
18:02
SPEAKER_01: even if it's not originally in the recipe,
18:04
SPEAKER_01: like add parsley,
18:06
SPEAKER_01: add cilantro,
18:07
add like if you do some parsley and like red pepper flakes on
18:10
top of something,
18:11
SPEAKER_01: even just a little,
18:12
SPEAKER_01: that just that little pop of color can make all the difference.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: When we were together,
18:17
SPEAKER_00: you like sliced some scallions and,
18:21
SPEAKER_00: you know,
18:21
SPEAKER_00: I would just chop up and down.
18:23
SPEAKER_00: You kind of sliced them on the bias and then threw that over and it just,
18:29
SPEAKER_00: that little cut made a big difference.
18:32
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:32
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
18:33
SPEAKER_01: And I think thinking about kind of thinking outside the box,
18:36
like how can you prepare something a little differently so that
18:39
it's a little more unique?
18:40
SPEAKER_01: Like one of my favorite tricks is in coleslaw to make carrot ribbons.
18:46
So you just take like a vegetable peeler and make long ribbons
18:49
out of your carrot
18:50
SPEAKER_01: and then like toss that in with the rest of your coleslaw.
18:53
SPEAKER_01: And instead of it all being those little matchsticks,
18:56
SPEAKER_01: it just adds another layer of like texture and color and it kind of
19:00
SPEAKER_01: add some variety that you wouldn't normally have.
19:03
SPEAKER_01: So yeah,
19:04
SPEAKER_01: just kind of thinking about different ways that you can mix stuff up,
19:07
SPEAKER_01: I think is always great too.
19:08
Are there people that you follow on Instagram that you're just
19:12
like obsessed with,
19:14
SPEAKER_00: or do you have to almost not look because you don't want to steal looks?
19:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's, it's hard.
19:21
SPEAKER_01: I think
19:24
It's not that I don't follow people because I'm worried that
19:26
I'm going to steal
19:27
SPEAKER_01: their look,
19:27
but it's more because of the imposter syndrome stuff that can
19:32
really creep in.
19:33
I think at one point I was following so many food photographers
19:39
and stylists and I
19:40
SPEAKER_01: was just like inundated with everything.
19:42
SPEAKER_01: And I just felt like...
19:44
SPEAKER_01: I can't find my style when I'm just consuming everybody else's.
19:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:51
And so I had to really take a look at that pretty closely and
19:56
try to figure out,
19:57
SPEAKER_01: well,
19:57
SPEAKER_01: what other influences can I bring into my social media life?
20:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:03
SPEAKER_01: that will help me in my work.
20:05
And so I follow some people who like do watercolor tutorials or
20:10
post about flowers,
20:12
SPEAKER_01: you know,
20:12
SPEAKER_01: and just like adding that variety just helps with my creative brain.
20:18
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
20:19
SPEAKER_00: My husband's a writer and when he's working on a book,
20:23
he like will only read nonfiction because he doesn't want to
20:27
get those fiction
20:28
SPEAKER_00: voices in his head,
20:29
SPEAKER_00: you know,
20:30
SPEAKER_00: like and the algorithms,
20:33
SPEAKER_00: you know,
20:33
SPEAKER_00: the more you look at something or follow something,
20:36
SPEAKER_00: the more it serves that up to you.
20:38
SPEAKER_00: So it's kind of hard to get out of that spiral.
20:41
SPEAKER_00: And like food is trendy too.
20:45
SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, we're kind of in this...
20:48
space where a lot of people like I'm just trying to think of
20:52
like food styling like
20:54
you know we had this swash of the hummus and then everything
20:58
was piled up on the
20:59
hummus and that was for like a swash of mashed potatoes a swash
21:04
of squash it was
21:05
just the shush and you'd see it in a restaurant and then it
21:08
started to get into the
21:09
books yeah yep yeah yeah so it's really easy for ideas like
21:14
that to stick which is
21:15
SPEAKER_01: not a bad thing and I think
21:18
SPEAKER_01: You know,
21:18
SPEAKER_01: there's a point where,
21:20
SPEAKER_01: obviously,
21:21
SPEAKER_01: if you're straight up copying somebody,
21:23
SPEAKER_01: that's not okay.
21:23
SPEAKER_01: But taking influences from other people's work,
21:27
SPEAKER_01: that's kind of how creative work becomes something new.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: You have to take something that's already existed and build on it.
21:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
21:38
SPEAKER_00: It's hard to do that, too.
21:40
And I think about that,
21:40
like,
21:41
sometimes I panic with recipes,
21:43
because it's like,
21:44
SPEAKER_00: did I see this somewhere?
21:46
SPEAKER_00: What was it the same?
21:48
SPEAKER_00: Was it like that?
21:49
SPEAKER_00: Like,
21:51
SPEAKER_00: It's it's kind of hard to know.
21:53
And in my first book,
21:54
I was sort of paralyzed because I was doing a lot of our
21:58
family's recipes.
21:59
SPEAKER_00: So it was like, here's Janice's potato salad.
22:02
SPEAKER_00: You know, can I actually make a change to her potato salad?
22:06
SPEAKER_00: And was it her potato salad or where did it originally come from?
22:09
And something becomes your own recipes just in and of itself
22:14
are kind of hard to track that way.
22:16
Yeah,
22:16
it is super hard because it does feel like,
22:18
well,
22:19
everything's been done.
22:22
SPEAKER_01: And we're making these little tweaks to make it our own,
22:24
SPEAKER_01: but it still feels like,
22:26
SPEAKER_01: nope,
22:26
SPEAKER_01: this belongs to someone else.
22:28
SPEAKER_01: And I've had this happen with my own recipes and,
22:31
SPEAKER_01: you know,
22:32
SPEAKER_01: we're all,
22:33
SPEAKER_01: I have developed a recipe and it's been around for a while.
22:36
SPEAKER_01: And then all of a sudden I'll see, I'll see something somewhere else.
22:38
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like,
22:39
SPEAKER_01: that's literally the exact thing that I made forever ago,
22:42
SPEAKER_01: which it used to bother me.
22:45
SPEAKER_01: But now I'm like, no, you know what?
22:47
SPEAKER_01: There are only so many combinations of stuff, you know?
22:50
SPEAKER_01: And part of the reason we come up with these ideas is because they work.
22:55
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, when you put...
22:58
flavors together that make sense,
23:00
like somebody else is going to think of it too.
23:01
SPEAKER_01: And that's okay.
23:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
23:04
SPEAKER_00: And also like,
23:05
SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
23:06
we haven't had all these discussions about cultural
23:08
appropriation of food.
23:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
23:11
SPEAKER_00: Like if you, I'll just use a taco, I guess, as an example.
23:17
So if you're making like what they call the gringo taco,
23:20
which is sort of the ground beef,
23:22
the white flour tortilla lettuce and tomatoes and you then if
23:29
you decide to make
23:30
like a more authentic taco maybe you're going to do like a pork
23:32
carnitas and you're
23:33
going to have cilantro and pickled red onion and pickled
23:36
jalapeno you know are you
23:38
appropriating a culture that that originated in and i'm glad i
23:44
personally have a
23:44
SPEAKER_00: really hard time with that because
23:47
Food is medicine and food is life and has been since the
23:52
beginning of time.
23:53
SPEAKER_00: And yes, every culture has a way of making something their own.
23:57
SPEAKER_00: But just the idea of what is a taco,
24:00
SPEAKER_00: whether it's a corn tortilla,
24:02
SPEAKER_00: whether it's a pita,
24:04
SPEAKER_00: whether it's a seaweed wrap.
24:07
I mean,
24:08
cultures have wrapped food in various things since the
24:11
beginning of time.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to really get hung up on
24:15
SPEAKER_00: who's, who made the original taco.
24:17
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, I just, I think it's gotten so hard.
24:21
SPEAKER_00: We're a global world.
24:22
SPEAKER_00: We're a global economy.
24:24
SPEAKER_00: We're globally influenced by food.
24:26
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
24:28
SPEAKER_01: And it is, it's very tricky.
24:29
I,
24:30
I have,
24:31
I'm not ashamed to say been called out for posting a recipe that,
24:37
and trying to say like,
24:38
you know,
24:39
I ate this in this country and here's my version of it.
24:43
SPEAKER_01: And I faced a lot of backlash for it.
24:46
And I think we're in a period of time where it can be very easy
24:55
to freak out at other people.
25:01
SPEAKER_01: And I don't think that that's always wrong.
25:03
I think there is a productive way to go about it and not
25:06
everybody is able to do that.
25:08
SPEAKER_01: But I think as long as it's coming from a place of like,
25:10
SPEAKER_01: Hey,
25:10
SPEAKER_01: I'm just going to let you know,
25:12
SPEAKER_01: like here I'm from this place and I grew up there.
25:16
SPEAKER_01: I understand this dish that you have posted the recipe for.
25:19
SPEAKER_01: And like, here are some things that you missed, you know?
25:22
Um,
25:23
but I literally like what's getting death threats from people
25:25
for this recipe.
25:27
SPEAKER_01: That's crazy.
25:27
SPEAKER_01: And it's like, I, I, I fully was ready to like learn.
25:32
SPEAKER_01: I was like, okay, great.
25:33
SPEAKER_01: Can you tell me how I, how can I fix this so that it's more authentic?
25:37
SPEAKER_01: And then I just never heard anything back,
25:39
which was such a bummer because I think if you're open and like
25:42
willing to say like,
25:44
SPEAKER_01: I messed up,
25:45
SPEAKER_01: but I want to make this right.
25:46
And I want to make sure that I learn what it means for this
25:51
recipe to be authentic and
25:54
SPEAKER_01: I think that we should be able to say like,
25:56
SPEAKER_01: okay,
25:56
SPEAKER_01: like let's have an open conversation about it.
25:59
SPEAKER_01: But you're right.
25:59
SPEAKER_01: I think when it comes down to something like a taco,
26:01
SPEAKER_01: that's just ubiquitous,
26:02
SPEAKER_01: it's really difficult to say like,
26:04
SPEAKER_01: well,
26:04
SPEAKER_01: we're gonna really narrow this down and we're gonna say,
26:08
SPEAKER_01: you know,
26:08
SPEAKER_01: you have to give all the details about where it came from and what year.
26:12
SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of that is really useful to learn about.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: And also, you know, there's a way to do it that is effective.
26:20
SPEAKER_00: I had to actually,
26:21
SPEAKER_00: this is kind of a weird story,
26:23
but there's a person that follows me on different channels and
26:28
different TV things
26:29
SPEAKER_00: that I've done.
26:30
And they're always freaked out that I'm not wearing my hair in
26:34
a ponytail or
26:34
SPEAKER_00: wearing a hairnet when I cook on TV.
26:37
SPEAKER_00: And I get it.
26:38
SPEAKER_00: You know, as a chef, they'll always start out like as a chef.
26:42
Well,
26:43
when I am making food on TV,
26:45
I am there as a person that's supposed to look good on TV.
26:50
SPEAKER_00: And I'm not cooking in a professional kitchen.
26:53
SPEAKER_00: And I'm not cooking food that anyone is going to be eating, actually.
26:56
So I'm there with my full hair trying to look like an
27:00
attractive person on
27:01
SPEAKER_00: television that you want to watch make food.
27:03
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:04
if I were to show up with my gloves and my hairnet,
27:08
that wouldn't be the same experience.
27:10
SPEAKER_00: And while it maybe bugs you,
27:12
I get it,
27:13
but you have to think of the context of which I'm preparing
27:17
this food.
27:18
SPEAKER_00: When we're on the TV show and we go into a professional kitchen,
27:21
SPEAKER_00: I do put my hair up because that's the standard that they have in their
27:24
SPEAKER_00: professional kitchens,
27:25
SPEAKER_00: which I understand.
27:27
SPEAKER_00: But every post, this person is just like, can you put your hair up?
27:31
SPEAKER_00: I don't understand why you don't have your hair up.
27:33
SPEAKER_00: It's gross.
27:33
SPEAKER_00: I don't want to get hair in my food.
27:35
SPEAKER_00: So finally, I just sent them an email.
27:38
SPEAKER_00: Oh, actually, no, I blocked them on Facebook.
27:40
And then they sent me an email saying the exact things that
27:44
they've been saying.
27:45
SPEAKER_00: And I was like,
27:47
do you realize that you're at this point bullying me about not
27:51
wearing my hair in a
27:52
SPEAKER_00: ponytail on television?
27:54
SPEAKER_00: And let me explain for the hundredth time why I'm not.
27:57
SPEAKER_00: And I'm not going to.
27:59
SPEAKER_00: And by the way, do you watch Rachel Ray, Ina Garten, Giada...
28:03
uh the pioneer woman i mean these are also people on television
28:06
we're not preparing
28:07
food in a commercial kitchen and your inability to let go of it
28:10
is now becoming
28:11
SPEAKER_00: something about you that i need to block and i need to stop having this
28:16
conversation and you are bullying me about this and i'm done
28:20
and she replied and
28:22
SPEAKER_00: she was like oh my gosh i didn't realize how this was coming across
28:27
SPEAKER_00: And okay, maybe you didn't.
28:28
SPEAKER_00: I'll give you that.
28:30
SPEAKER_00: But I'm also done having this conversation with you.
28:32
SPEAKER_00: And if it bugs you so much, you shouldn't watch.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
28:37
And it sounds like maybe she doesn't watch too many other food personalities.
28:41
SPEAKER_00: I don't even know.
28:42
SPEAKER_00: I just was like,
28:43
I cannot keep having this conversation and bring me down every
28:47
time I open up this email.
28:48
SPEAKER_00: So stop.
28:49
SPEAKER_00: So hopefully now it'll stop.
28:52
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
28:53
SPEAKER_00: And so that was kind of a long way around,
28:55
SPEAKER_00: which is to say that we're in a creative business doing lots of cool,
28:59
SPEAKER_00: creative things.
29:01
SPEAKER_00: I really enjoyed working with you on the food doll shoot.
29:04
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was such a great day.
29:05
SPEAKER_01: And that was the first time I had styled anything for a show.
29:08
So that was really fun for me to get to do because we did a
29:12
couple of shows after that.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: And I tagged along with them to help style their food for
29:17
SPEAKER_01: Well, we were on the Jason show.
29:18
SPEAKER_01: They were on the Jason show.
29:22
SPEAKER_01: What did you make on Jason's show?
29:24
SPEAKER_01: That was their Greek cowgirl caviar.
29:29
SPEAKER_01: It's so good.
29:30
I had a bunch left over after we made it and I had it for lunch
29:34
like every day that week.
29:35
SPEAKER_00: And it was really good, simple food and their book is pretty delicious.
29:40
Are you still posting on Instagram and where can we follow you
29:44
to stay up to date?
29:45
SPEAKER_01: Yes, I do still post on Instagram.
29:47
That's pretty much the only place that I update almost anything
29:50
at the moment,
29:50
but...
29:51
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, please, please give me a follow if that's interesting to you.
29:55
SPEAKER_00: It is at the table.
29:57
SPEAKER_00: Do you feel pressure about video?
30:03
SPEAKER_01: To start doing video, you mean?
30:06
SPEAKER_01: You know, I did for a little while, but I don't anymore.
30:10
SPEAKER_01: I think there's a point where you have to say,
30:12
SPEAKER_01: like,
30:13
SPEAKER_01: it's not that I don't want to learn new skills,
30:15
SPEAKER_01: but I also know when to call it.
30:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and you're...
30:20
SPEAKER_01: I don't need to branch out like that right now.
30:23
SPEAKER_01: If it becomes that way, then maybe I'll change my mind.
30:25
But I am very thankful to be working with a lot of women that I
30:32
really admire.
30:33
SPEAKER_01: And as long as I get to continue working with them,
30:37
SPEAKER_01: I am very happy with the skill set that I have.
30:40
And I'm so thankful to have all of those influences around me
30:44
all the time.
30:45
SPEAKER_01: Like positive female energy is just, there's nothing like it.
30:48
SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
30:50
it's funny too like i just think back to that food doll shoot
30:54
because we've stayed
30:54
in contact they've helped me with a couple things i've given
30:58
them some advice on a
30:59
couple things and they were so delightful just as people it was
31:03
great to meet you
31:04
you know you do a lot of this work solitarily in your kitchen
31:08
or alone and then you
31:09
get out into these spaces and you actually meet people you're
31:13
like oh this is so
31:14
SPEAKER_00: great they're so nice
31:15
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
31:16
And I think that's been the nicest thing for me over the last
31:19
couple of years,
31:19
SPEAKER_01: because,
31:20
SPEAKER_01: you know,
31:21
we so we lived in Japan and then we lived in Colorado and then
31:24
we moved back to Minnesota.
31:25
SPEAKER_01: I grew up in Minnesota, so it was coming home for me.
31:28
But we've been back here for six,
31:33
six years,
31:34
five years,
31:34
something like that.
31:35
But then,
31:36
you know,
31:36
we moved back in 2019 and then COVID happened like a year later.
31:40
SPEAKER_01: And I just had felt very disconnected.
31:42
SPEAKER_01: And I'd been watching this amazing food.
31:46
SPEAKER_01: scene,
31:47
SPEAKER_01: um,
31:48
SPEAKER_01: in the twin cities and just like for a long time,
31:50
SPEAKER_01: I'd been kind of watching it from a distance.
31:53
SPEAKER_01: And then we moved back and I was like,
31:54
SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh,
31:54
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to get to connect with these people in real life.
31:56
SPEAKER_01: And then stupid COVID happened and everything like got stalled.
32:02
And so the last couple of years have just been so lovely
32:04
because I really have been
32:05
SPEAKER_01: able to make wonderful connections like with Alia and Radwa and with you.
32:09
SPEAKER_01: And, um, you know, it's just been like life giving, um,
32:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, and I just appreciate it all so much.
32:19
SPEAKER_01: And,
32:19
SPEAKER_01: um,
32:20
SPEAKER_01: you know,
32:21
SPEAKER_01: since we've been talking about the food dolls,
32:23
SPEAKER_01: they're just,
32:24
SPEAKER_01: they're like such warm people.
32:26
Like I know people on social media have to have like a certain
32:30
way about them.
32:31
SPEAKER_01: They're like that in real life.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: Like they're just warm, lovely people.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: And like from day one, they're like, hug.
32:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:38
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, deal.
32:40
SPEAKER_01: I think we're going to get along just fine.
32:42
SPEAKER_00: And I felt that way about you, too.
32:45
SPEAKER_01: Like when I was comfortable with you as well.
32:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
32:49
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:50
SPEAKER_00: And it's fun.
32:50
SPEAKER_00: It makes the job fun.
32:52
SPEAKER_00: And as creators,
32:54
we need to stick together because we're all in this kind of
32:57
weird space and it can
33:00
SPEAKER_00: be a little isolating at times.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
33:03
SPEAKER_00: So it's really fun to chat.
33:05
A lot of the imposter syndrome stuff comes from is because it's
33:08
often such an
33:09
SPEAKER_01: isolated experience and you just get stuck in your own head.
33:13
SPEAKER_01: And then the more you're around other people,
33:15
SPEAKER_01: I think the more comfortable a lot of the time you end up feeling.
33:19
SPEAKER_01: And I would have thought it would be the opposite for a long time.
33:23
SPEAKER_01: I think that's how I felt.
33:24
SPEAKER_01: I was like, well, I'm just going to keep doing my own thing.
33:27
SPEAKER_01: at home because it feels less scary,
33:29
SPEAKER_01: but it turns out like when,
33:31
SPEAKER_01: as soon as I stepped out of my comfort zone and started actually,
33:35
SPEAKER_01: when I started assisting food,
33:37
SPEAKER_01: styling,
33:37
SPEAKER_01: assisting,
33:38
SPEAKER_01: um,
33:38
SPEAKER_01: and that got me out of my home,
33:41
SPEAKER_01: that changed everything for me.
33:43
SPEAKER_01: Um,
33:44
SPEAKER_01: it's been,
33:45
SPEAKER_01: I've,
33:45
SPEAKER_01: I've worked with Maren Ellingbo King a couple of times,
33:48
SPEAKER_01: actually quite a few times and Brooke Faudre.
33:51
And it's just like,
33:52
just these people who are so talented and so wonderful and,
33:55
um,
33:58
SPEAKER_01: I've just learned so much from all of them.
34:00
SPEAKER_01: It's just such a great.
34:02
SPEAKER_01: I love it.
34:03
SPEAKER_00: Well, it's been a delight to talk with you today.
34:05
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for being our guest.
34:07
SPEAKER_00: I'm sure we will cross paths again soon.
34:10
SPEAKER_00: I hope so.
34:10
SPEAKER_00: We better.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
34:11
SPEAKER_00: Maybe I'll start sending you recipes.
34:13
SPEAKER_00: I just.
34:15
I got my book today in its first form that I'm seeing like the
34:18
pictures and the
34:19
SPEAKER_00: recipes all together.
34:20
And I was thinking about you because you were such a good food
34:24
stylist and I've
34:24
SPEAKER_00: been doing it all myself.
34:26
And this is the last book I can do it myself because it's sort
34:30
of a cabiny rustic type book.
34:32
But I was like,
34:33
oh,
34:33
okay,
34:34
this is the last one you can photograph yourself,
34:36
Stephanie.
34:36
Yeah.
34:38
SPEAKER_01: Well, I'm there for you.
34:39
SPEAKER_01: So I appreciate it.
34:40
SPEAKER_00: All right.
34:41
SPEAKER_00: Thanks for being my guest today, Rachel.
34:43
SPEAKER_00: All right.
34:44
And I'll put your Instagram handle in the notes and people can
34:48
follow you at set
34:49
SPEAKER_00: the table photography,
34:50
SPEAKER_00: correct?
34:50
SPEAKER_01: Perfect.
34:51
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
34:51
SPEAKER_00: All right.
34:52
SPEAKER_00: We'll talk to you soon.
34:53
SPEAKER_00: Okay.
34:54
SPEAKER_00: Bye-bye.
34:54
SPEAKER_01: Bye.