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Why Does Everyone Think I'm Fine? · Conversations Beyond Borders

• 0:03
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Hey there.
• 0:04
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I'm Susan
• 0:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And I'm Laura
• 0:08
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Hi, welcome to Conversations Beyond Borders.
• 0:10
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: This is our second season, and we're so excited to be having a different format this year.
• 0:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's going to be a lot more conversational.
• 0:19
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We wanna talk about the things that are maybe stored up in your head, but you rarely speak them out loud.
• 0:25
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So welcome.
• 0:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We're
• 0:29
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Welcome.
• 0:29
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Hey, Susan, I have a question for you.
• 0:33
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Why is it whenever anyone asks us how we are, our default is always fine?
• 0:40
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Why don't you think we feel like we can be honest with these people?
• 0:45
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I'm, I'm inclined to think that it's almost a learned behavior.
• 0:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Probably, probably something that, I don't know, when we, when we become young adults, I'm not sure why it's just become an accepted thing that we all do.
• 1:01
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: But in midlife, I think it's really an, an important question to ask.
• 1:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, agree.
• 1:07
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Agree
• 1:08
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, I, you know, I could say I'm fine today, and that would probably be an, maybe a lie without omission,'cause I had a full day.
• 1:23
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I had a full day of making furniture, building furniture with my daughter, and that isn't something that I would ultimately at the end of the day say,"Oh, yeah, I'm doing great.
• 1:34
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I'm doing just fine." But we do it.
• 1:36
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's a habit.
• 1:38
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: But what Laura and I wanna do, um, today is maybe jump into, uh, that discussion and that question a little deeper so that we can begin to think and maybe frame it up, um, a little bit going forward.
• 1:51
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: One of the things that came up,, doing the research was, you know, one of the reasons why people have a tendency to default to"I'm fine" is because we don't wanna feel like a burden.
• 2:04
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Amen
• 2:05
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We know we don't wanna feel like we're, we're giving somebody our stuff, and so it's just easier to say,"I'm fine," than to feel like we're giving someone else responsibility for, um, for our feelings.
• 2:23
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, that, you know, that kind of sounds like maybe someone else's comfort level, level is important, more important than ours.
• 2:32
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: True
• 2:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: we, by not burdening someone, it doesn't mean that we, we didn't need a conversation or that we didn't need the support
• 2:42
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 2:43
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: that
• 2:43
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Agree
• 2:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: find in a conversation.
• 2:45
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So I think, why do you think we accept this as a common practice?
• 2:52
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Well, I think, you know, going back to when we, when, when we were talking just, you know, talking about the, the burden piece, the other thing that just popped into my mind honestly is, um, some people just can't handle it.
• 3:05
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: You know?
• 3:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: There's, there's those around us, you know, that just can't handle us not doing well or handle...
• 3:14
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah
• 3:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: just don't know what to do with themselves.
• 3:17
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, but, but I, I just think there's been times, you know, at least for me, um, you know, it's if, if if I do answer the question honestly, I may fall apart.
• 3:32
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and I ain't got the time for that.
• 3:37
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I got too much to do.
• 3:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I'll fall apart when all the rest of the world's problems are solved.
• 3:42
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um-
• 3:43
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: think that's valid.
• 3:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think that's valid, and I think sometimes, um, you say I, I, I might not speak the truth to someone about how I'm actually feeling, I think that's kind of common with someone like my parents, that I'm sort of protecting them,
• 3:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 3:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes
• 4:00
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I don't want them, them to worry about me.
• 4:04
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 4:04
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: might, I might do the same with my adult children because we have this facade that somehow we're just always fine
• 4:14
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 4:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 4:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We're, we're the stability.
• 4:18
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We are the rock, and we can't, or at least...
• 4:23
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and I know it's not healthy for them to think that we're infallible, and it's not that we set out to make it look that way.
• 4:33
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's just, I don't want you to worry about me because I'm supposed to be your safe space, and I can't, you know, let you see me weak because then maybe you won't feel like I'm your safe space.
• 4:42
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right.
• 4:43
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, but
• 4:45
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah
• 4:46
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: definitely with the kids, I know that I personally would feel like they would, would feel less safe or less secure or less taken care of.
• 4:58
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Less taken care of.
• 4:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 5:00
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I agree.
• 5:00
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think there is something in that if, if, if there's a crack and if we're admitting that somehow, w- we're, we're struggling with something or suffering with something, that that somehow is going to impact them.
• 5:18
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And I know that week it was a particularly difficult week for me.
• 5:24
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: With Abby's move?
• 5:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: well, with Abby's move and, um, we lost, um, someone in our family, and Laura lost someone as well.
• 5:34
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: My father-in-law passed, and, um, a very good example of just, um, what we're talking about is I was in Starbucks and the young lady asked,"Yeah, going?
• 5:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: you doing?" And I'm like,"I'm good." I paused because of our conversation.
• 5:53
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 5:54
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I paused and I thought,"I'm not fine." And I think it's okay if we create the space for someone to be compassionate for us.
• 6:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 6:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Now, did you tell her?
• 6:10
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: When you paused, did you tell her?
• 6:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I did.
• 6:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Good
• 6:14
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: "As a matter of fact," I said,"I've just recently lost my father-in-law and it's been kind of a rough day." And her expression changed.
• 6:23
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Her, her immediately her body language changed, and it was wonderful to hear a- and to feel that sense of compassion from a complete stranger, but she knew what I was talking about, that we do all have rough days.
• 6:42
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 6:42
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: it's okay in midlife to admit that, you know, something might be tough because you didn't have best sleep or whatever may be going on in your body.
• 6:54
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And I think the more honest we are, the better.
• 6:58
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I just
• 6:58
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: for sure.
• 6:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and the thing I've gotta say, and the thing I've gotta say about what you did with, with that barista was you opened up...
• 7:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: One, you were vulnerable,
• 7:11
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: True
• 7:11
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: and two, you, you opened up the space for someone else to be compassionate towards you.
• 7:18
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right
• 7:18
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: and I think that we should probably allow that a little bit more, you know, especially with this age of tech and all of this, you know, disconnection that we have.
• 7:30
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Great
• 7:30
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: it's...
• 7:31
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: To, to allow even a stranger to be compassionate had to have given you a little bit of a feeling of being supported, even if it was
• 7:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: was
• 7:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: a little bit.
• 7:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: for.
• 7:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I was just cared for, and that somebody else cared, or
• 7:44
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Great
• 7:45
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: it mattered to them that I was hurting.
• 7:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 7:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think it's, it is.
• 7:50
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's an opportunity if we don't, if we don't express compassion, then we don't learn to also take it.
• 7:59
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So I think it, it, it goes both ways.
• 8:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 8:02
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: we could certainly talk about this one forever.
• 8:05
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, I wanna talk about another aspect, um, in our discussion, Laura, when we were getting ready t- for this topic,
• 8:14
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm
• 8:14
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: and that was the whole premise of not taking the time.
• 8:20
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, we don't have the time to fall apart.
• 8:22
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We don't, uh, we don't make the time.
• 8:26
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 8:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, we don't pause even to reflect for ourselves,
• 8:33
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 8:34
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: what am I really feeling?
• 8:36
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Am I really feeling fine, or what am I feeling?
• 8:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And I remember you saying to me,"I, I just never considered it.
• 8:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I just, I just kept rolling.
• 8:46
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I just kept moving." And that's hard
• 8:49
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right, right.
• 8:50
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: When we, when we were talking about, you know, the, the topic for this episode and, and, you know, the talking points that we wanted to discuss, um, and you asked that question, you put that question out, and I was a little mind-blown myself because it's like, what?
• 9:05
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: People actually do that?
• 9:08
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Stop, yes
• 9:11
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: to take time?
• 9:12
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, no.
• 9:14
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's, it's, for me, you know, there was, there was a time when my, when my family and my marriage was falling apart that if I would've taken time to reflect, I'm not quite sure I would've gotten out of bed.
• 9:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And if I didn't get out of bed, stuff wasn't getting done, you know?
• 9:30
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and you-
• 9:31
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: that, but you must have been telling yourself,"I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine." And, and, and that's, you, you didn't, we don't, we don't offer ourself any grace that we need the time recovery.
• 9:47
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, for sure.
• 9:49
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: For sure.
• 9:49
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and I, I will agree with that.
• 9:51
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I will agree with that.
• 9:52
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, and, and with, with that said, I mean, maybe part of that for me is a strategy and a coping mechanism
• 10:02
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Oh,
• 10:02
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: so I don't stop and reflect, right?
• 10:05
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's like that's the distraction.
• 10:08
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: The distraction is what's the next thing?
• 10:10
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 10:10
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And the prevention- We're falling apart.
• 10:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: so then...
• 10:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Exactly.
• 10:14
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Exactly.
• 10:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, agree.
• 10:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 10:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 10:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 10:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, that's, that's...
• 10:19
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, I think that's a, again, a common habit of, uh, as you said, of coping with, with such a busy time.
• 10:27
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 10:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, I think, um, with midlife women, we, we aren't stopping to check, but I know that, um, I don't know about you, but I'm always tired.
• 10:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I, I'm always tired.
• 10:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think, I think it's sometimes physically, you know, both you and I,
• 10:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep
• 10:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: um, care about and staying active.
• 10:53
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, but I think sometimes a lot of my fatigue does come from, from, yeah, th- the emotional side
• 11:03
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 11:03
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: of, of our, of our existence.
• 11:05
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So do we really know how we're doing when we say fine?
• 11:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You know, do you think that with all the sleep deprivation and the lower estrogen our energy factories aren't supplying what we need.
• 11:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: you and I have talked extensively about our ailments, our, our hip
• 11:30
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 11:31
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: and our knee issue,
• 11:32
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: yes
• 11:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: um, and all the fluctuations and nevermind, you know, the inflammation, and then you just sort of don't want to.
• 11:40
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 11:41
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: maybe we don't know if we're fine
• 11:45
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Well, and, and I would say that that's, that's ab- absolutely fair, you know?
• 11:49
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, we've-- we are, at least, you know, for me, I'm in a stage where I'm still learning what is going on with my body, how my body is negatively being impacted by all of the changes, the low estrogens.
• 12:01
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, yeah.
• 12:02
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I'm definitely ahead of you on that role.
• 12:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: so I'm trying to figure out what is that, right?
• 12:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: What, what is that?
• 12:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Like you said, you, you're, we're tired all the time.
• 12:12
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We're fatigued.
• 12:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We wanna keep moving'cause we wanna stay mobile and,
• 12:16
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Absolutely
• 12:17
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: and then when you're tired and you wake up exhausted, it's like, what is that, right?
• 12:22
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: What is that?
• 12:23
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, but, but definitely trying to figure it out.
• 12:26
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And so I would think that, I think that that's fair, that no, we don't always know, um, you know, that whether we're fine or not.
• 12:32
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 12:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 12:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And how do we, how do we stay motivated in life to be doing the things, um, that we know, you know, the eating well and sleeping well and moving.
• 12:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, how do we, how do we stay motivated?
• 12:52
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I find for, for, for me, motivation can be a real problem.
• 12:57
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, sometimes it's just easier to sit on the couch with a bag of chips.
• 13:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh, absolutely
• 13:02
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And I think maybe l- you know, some reflection might be a valuable thing to do at that point
• 13:12
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 13:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: see where I'm at and the why, you know, why we do what we do,
• 13:17
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, and, and that's, and that's a really good, that's a really good thought.
• 13:20
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, it's like, okay, when you're not feeling motivated to do anything physically and you wanna sit on the couch with that bag of chips, instead of the bag of chips, grab a notebook, you know, and, and reflect and write some things down,
• 13:32
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right.
• 13:33
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: and try to process some things.
• 13:34
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, if you don't have the physical energy to go out and do something, um, you know, just maybe just some light contemplation would, would at least be helpful in giving you
• 13:43
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 13:43
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: some direction
• 13:45
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, yeah.
• 13:46
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, another big reason I think that women in their midlife might say, you know,"I'm fine" on any given day is that I think we also minimize
• 14:00
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh, yeah
• 14:01
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: our own situation.
• 14:03
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We think everyone else, you know, their problems are bigger and they're more important, and we tend to minimize, what we're going through
• 14:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Absolutely.
• 14:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Absolutely.
• 14:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: You know, and, and speaking from my own experiences, you know, everybody, you know, raised differently, you know, different relationships, different life experiences.
• 14:26
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, never feeling important, never feeling validated, never feeling heard, right?
• 14:34
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: So, so if you grow up never feeling like you're heard, your voice doesn't matter, right?
• 14:40
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: So, so why would I even bother to tell you how I'm feeling when it's not gonna matter,
• 14:49
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 14:50
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think, I think we would both agree, um, as we've to build our relationship during the podcast, is that, um, we care a lot about people.
• 15:00
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes
• 15:00
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, we, we care deeply about our family and our friends.
• 15:05
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: but as my therapist reminds me, um, it's okay to love our friends deeply, to love them deeply, but certainly not more than ourselves.
• 15:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes, that's a very good point
• 15:16
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: that it's a, it's a classic position that midlife women put themselves in,
• 15:21
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 15:21
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: that somehow what we're going through is, is, is not as important.
• 15:27
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 15:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I do have to say I have a, a, I have an adult, um, daughter who, um, has been chronically ill since she was about eight years old.
• 15:36
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And if, if...
• 15:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I've learned a lot about empathy and compassion, but it's also been as we've through the decades realizing that there were no perfect cures in, in any of this, um, that She also needs to be given just what you're talking about, the power of expression and her own voice to be able to say, you know,"I need to find joy in my life as well."
• 16:07
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 16:08
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: um, I think you're absolutely right that depending on, on how we grew up and what our influences were, um, it is absolutely true that sometimes we think it doesn't matter
• 16:22
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 16:24
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Exactly.
• 16:24
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 16:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 16:27
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah, and, and to say that it doesn't matter might be a little harsh.
• 16:30
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's just like, if I'm not gonna be heard and it's not gonna be met with some sort of understanding, it, it just, to me, it's like, why, why bother?
• 16:41
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: You know, maybe it's not so that it doesn't matter, but it's more like, why am I even gonna bother if, if, if I'm not gonna be heard and understood?
• 16:46
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 16:47
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 16:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 16:49
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I hear you.
• 16:50
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, I think, I think because of, of, you know, what you have just described and what I know about you, um, you know, maybe, maybe, you know, we're saying we're fine because we are rewarded for being so strong.
• 17:08
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh, yeah.
• 17:09
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You know, like,"You're so strong.
• 17:11
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You got this.
• 17:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I don't know how.
• 17:13
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You did it all."
• 17:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep.
• 17:16
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right?
• 17:17
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 17:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: it, it feels good at first.
• 17:20
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It feels absolutely good at first
• 17:23
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 17:23
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Well, and, and I don't know what it was like in Canada in the'70s, but in the US we were going through a little bit of a feminine revolution, if you will, you know?
• 17:34
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And I was one of those latchkey kids.
• 17:38
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, you know, mom, m- now Mom went to work outside of the home because she had to, because my, my parents split up.
• 17:43
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, but, you know, it's, it's back then in the'70s it was this stupid commercial our listeners from the US will probably remember the Enjoli commercial about the woman bringing home the bacon and frying it up in the pan, and good Lord, of course, I'm gonna never let you forget you're a man, too.
• 18:03
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's like,"Woo-hoo, I can do it all." And, you know, perfectly, you know, business power suit, hair's done, you know?
• 18:10
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and so I think, I think back then, you know, women were starting to really be allowed some independence.
• 18:21
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, I, I did look up, and I, I wanted to write these down, but I looked up some of the stats and it was like, you know, women couldn't get their own credit card until like, like, like the late'70s or early'80s.
• 18:35
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: That's
• 18:35
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: to have a husband as the primary
• 18:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right
• 18:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: get their own mortgage.
• 18:40
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, that's been within the last, you know, 50 years,
• 18:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Mm-hmm.
• 18:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Mm-hmm.
• 18:45
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: you know, if...
• 18:46
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Or if even that.
• 18:47
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And, and so, you know, just giving this little bit of starting to get these allowances, if you will, um, by the patriarchy.
• 18:57
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, y- we, we couldn't show any weakness.
• 19:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Are we gonna get a, a step back?
• 19:02
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: We can't show them that we can't handle it.
• 19:05
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: No, absolutely not.
• 19:06
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I can remember when we were first married, and even when we had our first child, somehow I think my husband that I had an encyclopedia That, that, that had answers for all.
• 19:24
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You know, whether it be running the household, understanding the development of any of the children and what they were going through, and heaven forbid when things fall apart.
• 19:35
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I think, you know, I think there is this expectation that we should be fine and that we are so strong, um, and aren't we happy for it?
• 19:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 19:49
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right
• 19:50
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: always.
• 19:50
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It-- sometimes we don't recognize, like you said earlier, what we're carrying
• 19:56
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 19:57
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 19:57
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 19:58
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: So do you think it's because we have a uterus, we just know everything?
• 20:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's like this, it's like this oracle.
• 20:04
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's like this, this, I've got this magic organ that tells me all, and I'm just dialed into how to just magically whip up a meal and make sure the kids make it to practice on time, and everybody's grades are good.
• 20:18
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, really?
• 20:20
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right, right.
• 20:21
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: But I think I th- uh, you know, we're, we're joking about it, but honestly, you know, we-- I've even teased my husband, like,"Why do you think I can handle this?" That, you know, we moved to Colorado
• 20:34
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 20:35
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: from everyone and everything.
• 20:37
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Right.
• 20:37
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah, you guys changed countries.
• 20:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 20:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: did.
• 20:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, and it's been a blessing, but in the earlier stages when I have a seven and a five and a newborn, um, life was hard, and
• 20:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh yeah
• 20:49
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: traveled extensively.
• 20:53
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I honestly don't know how I always held it together,
• 20:58
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 20:58
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: but there was this expectation that I must,
• 21:02
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 21:02
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: that I had to, and that, you know, uh, coming home and how were things, you don't, y- it's just like a blur.
• 21:12
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm.
• 21:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: fine.
• 21:13
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I'm fine."
• 21:14
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 21:14
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: we, we've come up with that.
• 21:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We've come up with that mostly to just survive the reality of, of what we're carrying, I think
• 21:24
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Agreed.
• 21:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Agreed
• 21:25
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: there may be times, you and I have discussed, that maybe we just don't want to explain everything.
• 21:32
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh, no.
• 21:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: That taking that time, you're talking about time and fatigue, you know, that it's simply easier.
• 21:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: That it just might be easier to not explain everything.
• 21:45
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Exactly.
• 21:46
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Exactly.
• 21:47
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Well,
• 21:47
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: life's complex
• 21:48
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: it's not-- and some of it honestly is nobody's business, but at the same time, um, the stuff that might be, you know, you're, you're right.
• 21:54
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, it's just like, I don't want to...
• 21:56
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I don't have the energy for it.
• 21:58
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 21:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: it's not worth this becoming a conversation.
• 22:03
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, I'm already 10 minutes late to something else.
• 22:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, but, but it, it still doesn't do us any favors, right?
• 22:09
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I mean, it's not giving us, you know, a, a support group.
• 22:13
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's not giving us empathy.
• 22:15
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: It's not giving us any space or allowance for other people to, you know, lift us up or support us.
• 22:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: But, yeah
• 22:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: think a lot of women out there would agree that I just, I can't take the time, I don't have the space, I don't have the energy.
• 22:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, and so we just keep pushing those emotions down.
• 22:36
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep.
• 22:37
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: just keep,
• 22:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Stuffing them
• 22:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: just keep stuffing them down.
• 22:41
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And, um, I think that, um, there's, there, there's, there's probably times when you are annoyed or frustrated with someone and would prefer to really share the everything,
• 22:56
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 22:56
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: but, we don't.
• 22:58
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We
• 22:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, we don't.
• 22:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I, I had a therapist tell me once that women are really great about putting all of their stuff in pretty little bottles up on shelves in the bookcases behind them until those shelves are so full of those pretty little bottles that they come tumbling down.
• 23:15
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah I agree.
• 23:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I, I think that's, that's a really good metaphor
• 23:20
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 23:21
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: probably what we're storing over the years.
• 23:23
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, um, I suppose there's also if we, if we, if we wanted to admit it, there's also the occasions, um, when someone is asking us how you're doing, we might be afraid be honest because we don't want them to be fixing us.
• 23:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We don't want them to be, you know, deciding that there's, there's a number of solutions that we should follow.
• 23:54
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So maybe we're avoiding the interaction on purpose.
• 23:59
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: So are we specifically talking about the husbands now?
• 24:03
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: The ultimate fixers.
• 24:04
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I must fix all the things.
• 24:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: I'm the man of the house.
• 24:07
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Let me fix the thing.
• 24:09
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, no kidding.
• 24:10
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Well, I think, I think you and I, and even our second year of this season
• 24:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Mm-hmm
• 24:16
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: is a true example of how, I...
• 24:20
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: For Laura and I, um, I think it's a year of, of, of conversation primarily.
• 24:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's not a year of, of fixing and the five best tips
• 24:32
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No
• 24:33
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: the next self-care practice.
• 24:36
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, I think we're okay
• 24:38
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 24:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: the way we are,
• 24:40
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 24:41
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: having a conversation about historically what, what saying I'm fine might have, you know, looked like in the past.
• 24:51
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: We're hoping that this episode that you, that you just think about.
• 24:55
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Think about what you're doing and perhaps what your excuses are, and possibly what you would prefer to be saying and what you would hope would happen because of that
• 25:07
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah, absolutely.
• 25:10
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right?
• 25:10
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep.
• 25:11
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Agreed
• 25:12
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: been, you know, it's been so long that it, that it's automatic.
• 25:16
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: it, it does become a habit, and it does become a coping strategy, it does become, you know, it, it, it becomes the way, but it doesn't, it doesn't have to be.
• 25:27
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So
• 25:28
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No
• 25:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: you know, just giving yourself permission
• 25:31
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 25:32
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: to handle that differently as I did on that day of Starbucks.
• 25:36
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: I just decided to be honest,
• 25:38
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: No, I love, I love that you did.
• 25:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 25:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 25:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah, because how many"I'm fines" do they receive?
• 25:44
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And, and isn't, isn't relationships and interact real stuff about being honest with each other even if it's hard and
• 25:55
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 25:56
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You
• 25:56
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 25:56
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 25:57
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Well, again, the other thing that I love about it is I've gotta, gotta, you know, say this again, is especially now in our culture where we're so disconnected,
• 26:06
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right
• 26:06
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: be able to allow that, um, connection with someone on a very real level, especially if they're someone of a younger generation, right?
• 26:16
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Um, and, you know, I just think that's so important to, you know, give that to ourselves and, and to the other person that, you know, that you're interacting with.
• 26:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: So I, I love that you did that for a lot of reasons.
• 26:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 26:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 26:28
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So maybe the question isn't whether we're fine, it's maybe the question is whether we've gotten so used to saying it that we've stopped noticing what we're actually carrying.
• 26:39
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 26:39
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: And so maybe following this episode, you can take those moments of reflection that we talked about that are so important for recovery and for really understanding how you're really feeling and what you're going through and what you may need from someone else just by saying,"You know, it's been a rough day." And we've all had them.
• 27:00
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep.
• 27:00
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Oh
• 27:01
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: all had them,
• 27:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: yeah
• 27:01
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: and what an opportunity to, um, step up, um, for somebody else.
• 27:07
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So I think that's why we wanted to have this conversation this week.
• 27:11
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Absolutely
• 27:11
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: it's, it's an important one.
• 27:13
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's...
• 27:13
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: You're right.
• 27:14
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: It's relevant and, uh, given the lack of, of, of interaction and conversations that, that are going on, I think this is a good place to start.
• 27:24
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So
• 27:25
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yep, agree
• 27:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: yeah.
• 27:26
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Um, so maybe this week, maybe, maybe if someone asks you how you're really doing and you, know they genuinely wanna answer, what might you say?
• 27:38
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah.
• 27:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Right?
• 27:40
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Think
• 27:41
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah
• 27:41
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: What might you say?
• 27:42
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: How are you gonna let people in, um, with where you're at?
• 27:46
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yeah, be brave.
• 27:47
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Be brave
• 27:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Be, be brave.
• 27:48
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So I think we'll wrap it up this week,
• 27:51
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes, ma'am
• 27:52
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: and we hope you enjoyed our conversation'cause that's what this is, and we're glad you're in it
• 28:00
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 28:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Yes.
• 28:01
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And don't forget to find us on Facebook and Instagram, and you can find us on our private Facebook group, Conversations Beyond Borders With You.
• 28:10
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: And don't forget to like and subscribe and do all the wonderful things that help other people find us
• 28:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Yeah.
• 28:17
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: That really, that really helps us.
• 28:19
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: So until next time.
• 28:21
  laura_1_06-16-2026_185134: Okay, bye
• 28:22
  susan-poulter_1_06-16-2026_195134: Bye.