Latest / Closing Sales in Nigeria - Sales For The Nigerian Business Person: The Sales and Marketing Blueprint / From Sales to Branding: Why Your Reputation Matters More Than Your Logo

Transcript

From Sales to Branding: Why Your Reputation Matters More Than Your Logo · Closing Sales in Nigeria - Sales For The Nigerian Business Person: The Sales and Marketing Blueprint

0:01
Hello and welcome to the show. Apologies before we begin
0:04
because it's that time of the year and the munchkins are home
0:08
in case you hear the noise bleeding in through the
0:10
background. So with that out of the way,
0:13
let's get straight down to business.
0:15
I'd like to start off with the listener shout out to Cameron
0:18
Shirley. Really interesting name because
0:22
OK, Cameron is male, but the only Shirley's I know are
0:26
female. So I'll need to ask him about
0:28
that during our conversation. But I, I forgot about that.
0:32
So Cameron Shirley is not really a podcast listener, but is
0:36
someone who has admired my work around personal branding and the
0:39
podcast. I mean, at least how he sees it.
0:42
And so he reached out so that we could chop it up concerning
0:45
personal branding because he's also into business development,
0:50
but for telecoms firm, a telecoms Internet company in the
0:56
US of A. And so I'd like to say, Cameron
0:59
Shirley, thank you very much for reaching out.
1:03
Even though you're not a habitual listener.
1:04
But still, it's nice to put a face to those people in other
1:09
parts of the world. Half my listenership base so far
1:12
seems to be American, although I'm wondering if really it's,
1:18
you know, 50% of you guys who listen to the show are American
1:21
or a bunch of you are just Nigerians in diaspora who happen
1:24
to be in America. So can't quite figure that out
1:26
yet. So Cameron, nice having the
1:29
conversation with you. The next time we chat, I
1:31
definitely will be asking you that that question about the
1:34
Shirley because in this part of the world, all the Shirleys I
1:36
know are female. So he reached out on LinkedIn
1:42
and we had a LinkedIn meeting. In fact, for me that was one of
1:47
the most notable things about the meeting because so far in
1:50
doing this whole, you know, work from home, remote work, you
1:55
know, blah, blah, blah thing that we're currently going
1:57
through right now. I'm used to Google Meet.
2:00
In fact, I prefer Google Meet. Some people seem to be Zoom
2:04
people, some organizations, OK, like every time we're planning a
2:09
project with the British Council that's on the media side,
2:12
photography and video and live streaming and all that, they
2:15
seem to be a Teams organization and, and let's see what else.
2:21
So I'm used to all those things flying around there.
2:23
And I did know that LinkedIn has this audio meeting capability
2:27
and video meeting capability. Sorry.
2:29
The audio capability on LinkedIn is for, I think that's for
2:34
events. Then the video capability that
2:36
they have is for meetings. So I was aware that it existed,
2:41
but yesterday was my first time trying it out.
2:45
Oh by the way, if any of you have to accept a LinkedIn video
2:49
meeting request, something you guys need to know.
2:52
I don't know if it's something peculiar to Android phones, but
2:56
I had to download some some something, I can't remember what
3:00
it was anyway, but it was pretty much an automatic thing before
3:04
the meeting started. So I hit the video link and
3:07
while I was priming up the video, it now said I needed to
3:10
download something, something, something.
3:12
I clicked on that it went ahead and downloaded and so then I was
3:16
able to to start the meeting. So just to let you guys know, in
3:22
case you're trying to do business with someone, the
3:24
person recommends a LinkedIn video meeting.
3:27
If the meeting is for 10, don't sign up at 10 since you have to
3:32
install this thing and you know how network can be in Niger now.
3:36
So my recommendation of the person says the meeting is for
3:38
10 is LinkedIn video and it's your first time doing it.
3:41
Maybe try and sign in 955 so that you have to click and then
3:46
nothing will download and you're good to go.
3:50
So LinkedIn video meetings another Ave. for connecting with
3:53
people. Give it a try, especially for
3:56
those of you who don't like giving phone numbers and e-mail
3:58
addresses to total strangers. Because I prefer to have phone
4:01
calls and I prefer to do Google Meet.
4:04
So I tried to get phone numbers for phone calls and for WhatsApp
4:09
or e-mail address so we can share the link.
4:13
And I noticed that some people are kind of hesitant giving out
4:16
that kind of information. So now you have more things that
4:21
you can add to your arsenal. If you're chatting with the
4:24
person on LinkedIn and you feel like a face to face or a voice
4:28
to voice or whatever will get the conversation moving.
4:31
Now you can just say, oh, since we're both online right now, how
4:34
about we have a LinkedIn meeting instead?
4:38
If you just look to the bottom right of your screen right now,
4:41
you see the icon. All one of us has to do is to
4:43
tab the icon and we're good to go.
4:47
OK, so even though the listener shout out out is out of the way
4:52
with Cameron and Shirley, still I wanted to tell you guys about
4:54
the discussion that we had because there were a bunch of
4:57
stuff that I think a whole host of us should.
5:00
A whole host of us should, what would I say, put our minds too?
5:06
Because the reason why he reached in touch, he's also a
5:09
business development professional, like I said, in
5:11
the telecoms and Internet space. But the reason why he reached
5:16
out was because he wanted to discuss personal branding
5:18
because of all the activity that he's been seeing, not just the
5:21
podcast, but my stuff on LinkedIn and all of that.
5:25
So he wanted us to discuss personal branding.
5:31
Now, I keep saying time and time again that I am not an expert on
5:34
any of these things. You know, marketing, branding,
5:38
what else? Copywriting, all these sorts of
5:40
things. Well, people still reach out and
5:42
ask for my opinion anyway and I do try to help, but so excuse
5:47
me, but the avenue, the lens through which I look at
5:50
everything is through a sales and business development
5:53
perspective. Because luckily since sales
5:56
selling, business development is a very broad profession, we do
6:00
have a lot to say about. So excuse me, we do have a lot
6:05
to say about different aspects of business.
6:07
So I went ahead and I gave it a shot.
6:10
So we're looking at personal branding online and offline.
6:16
So for him, of course, I did my sure thing, asking questions.
6:21
They had been receiving some training on personal branding at
6:23
the office, especially offline. So he had received lessons at
6:27
work that's provided by their telecommunications company.
6:30
Well, by the way, if you happen to be working for one of those
6:35
firms, companies whether in Nigeria or abroad where they do
6:39
provide these sorts of things, it's something you ought to
6:42
cherish because not lots of employers do that.
6:45
And I can speak especially from the Nigerian experience.
6:48
You're not going to have lots of Nigerian employers who pay for
6:54
coaching, personal development, professional development and
6:57
stuff like that for their staff. So when I do get called in by
7:00
companies here in Nigeria to do stuff, you know, train members
7:04
of the sales team and things like that, it's something that
7:06
I, that I point out, like, look, you guys are already here.
7:11
Whether you want it or not, this thing has already been paid for.
7:14
You might as well take advantage of this opportunity because once
7:18
you leave this organization, whether you leave on your own
7:20
terms, whether you get kicked out, chances are the next
7:24
Nigerian employer is not going to give a hoot about how you
7:29
learn on the job and how you're developed and stuff like that.
7:32
So for Nigerian employers who bring specialists like us in to
7:37
handle these sorts of things, I'd like to say kudos to you
7:40
guys. I know sometimes it can be a
7:44
bitter all I say. Some of you think you receive
7:49
bitter lessons at the end of the day because you bring in your
7:52
staff, You get someone like me to train the staff, The staff
7:55
receive the training, They hang around for six months, a year
7:57
and then they leave. And yes, it does seem like it's
8:02
unfair, but unfortunately, it's just one of those things that we
8:06
have to live with. But then again, this is
8:07
something you ought to consider. If you bring somebody in and the
8:10
person is at the 20% and the person stays with you for two
8:14
years, giving you 20%, is that really worth your money and
8:19
worth all the the stress? But if you bring somebody in at
8:22
20%, you bring me in to handle training and you're able to
8:25
boost the person up to 50%. Even if the person stays at 50%
8:29
for one year and then the person leaves, arguably you have
8:33
received the return in your investment because at least you
8:35
got somebody functioning at 50% for six months or a year instead
8:39
of having somebody stay with you at, you know, 20% for the same
8:44
amount of time. So, yeah, it's rough when people
8:47
take this training and leave, but I still think it's worth it.
8:51
There's a business case that can can be made.
8:55
And also, I think we shouldn't pay attention to the people who
8:57
leave. I think we should be paying
8:59
attention to the people who stay because there's even added
9:03
benefits from that because this these are people who remain with
9:07
the organization with the benefit of this training.
9:10
They help to inform the culture and they also help to raise the
9:14
level of what's that thing called, you know, they influence
9:19
the culture. And then there's also knock on
9:22
effects because they also get to train people in these
9:25
philosophies and things like that, people who come
9:27
afterwards. OK, so let's go back to what me
9:34
and Cameron Shirley talked about.
9:36
Or is it Cameron Shirley and I? I've never quite figured it out.
9:39
So let's see where were we? OK, personal branding.
9:43
He he's received some training in the office.
9:46
OK yes, the training that they received was mostly offline.
9:49
So how to build a brand offline, what to do when you're out live
9:52
networking and those sorts of things.
9:55
So I guess some of you might be wondering, especially for those
9:59
of you who came for this podcast because who found this podcast
10:02
and who listened to the podcast because you want to hear about
10:05
hardcore sales. So you're wondering why are two
10:08
sales professionals or two business development
10:09
professionals talking about branding?
10:11
There's me sales business development, and then there's
10:14
Cameron Shirley, also sales business development in the
10:17
telecom space. Why are we talking about
10:19
branding? The reason why folks like us
10:22
talk about branding from time to time, or employers like Cameron
10:26
Shirley's, employers who want to make sure that they're trained
10:29
up, try to train them on branding, is because branding is
10:33
essential for business growth. It is essential for sales.
10:40
The reason why branding is essential is because people have
10:43
to know who you are. People also need to know what
10:49
you do before they can buy from you.
10:53
Let me repeat that. The reason why we pay attention
10:56
to all these other things, yes, the reason why we're here on the
10:59
podcast is we're here for hardcore sales.
11:02
Tips, tricks, strategies, frameworks.
11:05
Yes, sales. That's what brought us here to
11:07
the podcast. But the reason why from time to
11:09
time we're going to discuss branding is because branding is
11:11
also essential. Because branding solves the
11:13
problem of people knowing who we are and knowing what we do.
11:19
Because people don't know you, they don't know what you can do,
11:22
they're not going to buy from you.
11:25
So that's the reason why we talk about branding from time to
11:28
time. Now, my advice to my advice to
11:30
Cameron was that he shouldn't get carried away by the floss,
11:35
the gloss, the reputation management, logo, font, colour,
11:40
brand positioning, blah, blah, blah.
11:42
All that if easy, all that technical stuff, all those
11:45
things are really, really important.
11:47
Definitely. And you will pay to it, you pay
11:49
attention to it later. But in the beginning we should
11:53
pay more attention to the substantive.
11:56
Sorry about that. It's a word I've not, you know,
11:59
I've not been able to put it on my tongue since law school
12:01
because I always talk about the substantive issues, I mean
12:06
substantive and meritorious issues of the case.
12:09
Yes. So pay more attention to the
12:11
substantive aspects of running a business and then the rest will
12:15
follow. Now, this is something that I
12:17
learned from my mom because she's a former marketer, a
12:21
former marketing and brand specialist in Lagos, Nigeria.
12:26
Well, she started off actually in 1985 with the Hilton Hotel in
12:30
Abuja. So excuse me, until about a
12:33
decade ago, she had stints with Troika Holdings.
12:37
Troika Holdings is one of the much more older legacy firms in
12:43
Nigeria. Troika Holdings had three
12:47
companies under it's what are they called?
12:50
Troika Holdings. Of course it's a holding
12:51
company. And then the should I say
12:54
children, OK, Troika is like the parent company.
12:56
Then the the children companies, if I can put it that way, or the
13:01
subsidiaries. I think that's the proper way of
13:04
calling them were MCNA, that's marketing communications and
13:07
advertising. The office used to be out at
13:09
Maryland. I'm not sure, Maryland in Lagos,
13:11
I'm not sure where, where they are now.
13:13
So there was MC and E marketing communications and advertising,
13:17
which was the, excuse me, the advertising firm, obviously.
13:20
Then there was the Quadrant. Quadrant was a public relations
13:24
firm. I think my mum when she left
13:28
Troika Holdings, she left as the CEO of of Quadrant.
13:34
Then the third one was, I can't remember, you know, I was, I was
13:39
a young boy back then, so I can't remember.
13:41
Anyway, so Troika. Yeah.
13:43
So mom see herself with her. Troika.
13:45
So she had roles in advertising. Sorry.
13:49
Sorry about that. OK, 10 minutes.
13:51
Let me see. OK.
13:53
Let me just blaze through. If she reaches 30 minutes, you
13:55
reach 30 minutes. OK.
13:59
Yeah. So she had roles in advertising
14:00
and marketing, public relations, branding.
14:02
But my mom is retired now and every time I want to discuss
14:05
stuff with her that are related to these sorts of things, her
14:08
response is don't bother me with academic stuff.
14:10
My brain is resting. So unfortunately for those of
14:15
you who've been here me talk about my mom and who think maybe
14:17
one day she's going to make an appearance on the podcast, It's
14:20
the chances of that are not going to happen because as far
14:23
as she's concerned, she's tired and her brain is resting.
14:26
So anyway, I got advice, good advice from her, watching her
14:29
work at the time, especially when Nigeria was going through
14:32
this thing on the President Lucia Gabasanjo, that was the
14:36
Project Nigeria thing, whether we're advertising on CNN and
14:40
BBC. And they were doing this whole
14:43
thing that the current president is also doing now about trying
14:46
to attract FDI, foreign direct investments.
14:50
You know, you want people to bring their dollars and their
14:51
pounds and their EUR into Nigeria.
14:54
So, you know, for infrastructure projects and things like that.
14:57
Also trying to make Nigeria seem like a tourist destination.
15:01
So I was at an event where my mom was speaking also to public
15:07
relations and branding professionals and that was in, I
15:11
think that was in Ibado back then I was in OAU.
15:14
So OAU Ibado, you know, distance is not, is not far.
15:18
So and driver just came by, picked me up and then I got to
15:22
hear mom. She talked and the thrust of her
15:25
talk, if I remember correctly at the time, was that, yes, it's a
15:28
good thing that we finally left the military era.
15:32
Moshe Gong Abasenjo is now in charge.
15:34
I mean, he's a former military administrator for Nigeria.
15:38
Why they called military administrators or I can't
15:40
remember what they used to be called.
15:41
Anyway, so OBJ is back as a president and it's good that
15:46
Nigeria is doing this campaign, this project, Nigeria and all
15:48
whatnot. We're trying to attract
15:50
investment and everything. But.
15:53
But his opinion was that until we paid attention to the
15:55
substantive, substantive aspects on ground, everything we're
16:00
doing will just look like film trick and people will not be
16:02
deceived. So you can't say Nigeria should
16:04
be a tourist destination if we have insecurity up and down, you
16:08
know everywhere as this guy said, that position, you know,
16:12
Bosa Bosa gunshot in at the air. So foreigners are not going to
16:16
come and do tourism here if every day is Bosa, bosa, Bosa.
16:20
So that was Mumsey's point essentially.
16:23
And people are not going to bring in their dollars, their
16:25
EUR, their whatever it is if there's political risk and all
16:31
these other things. So basically Muncie's speech at
16:33
the time was pay attention to the, to the substance of the
16:38
matter 1st and then the good things will follow.
16:41
So if you deal with insecurity and there's no more Bosa Bosa,
16:46
then people might say, you know what, let's go to Nigeria.
16:49
They have tourist destinations in Zaria, in this place, in that
16:52
place. Let's go and see the history of
16:53
Kano and let's go and see the old Benin city in the dual state
16:59
and all of that. So that was mum's opinion.
17:03
Take care of Busa, Busa and then tourism will come into Nigeria,
17:07
take care of political risk and all these other things.
17:10
And then inflows of FDI, foreign direct investments will flow.
17:16
So summary, that's what I told the chap that we have
17:21
substantive. Sorry, forgive me, show my law
17:25
professors if any of them are listening and they'll be angry
17:27
like this guy. You still can't pronounce his
17:29
word. OK, Anyway, so that's my that's
17:33
my oldest to the guy. Pay attention to the substance.
17:36
Everything else will follow. So our sales and business
17:39
development professionals, we already received training about
17:41
how we should talk, how we should address, how we should
17:45
find out what people want or need, how we can build rapport,
17:49
how we can negotiate, let's see what else, how to create
17:54
proposals, you know, things like that.
17:56
So if we just pay attention to every single thing that our
17:59
teachers teach us and we do it accordingly, a good brand will
18:05
follow from all that because you show up, you talk on point, you
18:09
dress on point, you do needs analysis on point, you figure
18:12
out problems on point, you create solutions on point, you
18:17
negotiate on point, your proposals on point, your 'cause
18:22
my relationship skills on point. You see what I'm talking about.
18:26
If everything is on point, your brand will also be on point.
18:30
So let's just pay attention to all the things that our teachers
18:33
and our coaches, our teachers. And so I will advise you guys
18:39
accordingly. So just stick to good
18:41
professional practice that your teacher is teaching you or that
18:45
your employer is teaching you. Over time, the reputation will
18:48
follow you and that is the beginning of a personal brand.
18:51
Of course, the definition of brand that I'm using in this
18:53
case is very limited. And I'm thinking of brand as
18:57
what people think about you when you're not in the room.
19:01
So brand meaning reputation. Now, of course, for those of you
19:05
who are MBAs or you studied biz admin, you know, in UNILAG or
19:09
whatever school, you will say boss, your definition of brand
19:13
is too limited. And yes, I will agree now my
19:17
definition of brand is limited, but for now, I'm sticking with
19:19
the definition that people can easily understand and follow me.
19:23
Later on, we can discuss more robust definitions of what a
19:27
brand is or whether there is such a thing as a personal
19:29
brand. OK, so yes, so that was my
19:34
number one advice to him then #2 I told him that this whole thing
19:38
of personal brand online is since the conception of brand
19:44
that we're looking at is what people think about you when
19:46
you're not in the room, what people say behind your back,
19:50
then what people associate with you.
19:53
So then managing online brand now becomes a matter of what you
19:59
talk about, what you post about, what you share about what you
20:04
repost about will be the beginning of what people now
20:08
associate with you. So if you're worried about
20:12
online brand or you want to be particular about your online
20:14
brand, you have to be particular about what are you talking about
20:17
online? What are you posting online?
20:21
And that will in turn create associations when people think
20:25
of some things or think of you. So for those of you who know me
20:30
live and in the flesh, you know about my dry sense of humour and
20:33
the dad jokes that I crack and also my off colour sexual jokes
20:38
and stuff like that. Now there's a time when I
20:40
actually share all that stuff on my WhatsApp and yeah, was really
20:45
popular sharing things like now on my socials because people
20:47
like all that kind of stuff. But I wonder, I had to give
20:50
myself a brain like, look, I am not trying to be a comedian.
20:56
So it profited me not to keep on sharing these kinds of things
20:59
online. So I stopped doing it so that I
21:04
wouldn't wake up. And then one day people would be
21:06
like, ah, you're the joke guy. Oh, oh, you're that sense of
21:09
humour guy. Or oh, you're that guy that
21:12
cracks jokes. But what do you do, by the way?
21:14
So I stopped doing that. So it's the same thing.
21:17
You want people to associate you with something, start talking
21:21
about nothing. Start posting about that thing,
21:23
reposting about that thing, sharing about that thing, you
21:27
know, whatever. And that will be the beginnings
21:29
of your online brand. But I told Cameron, some folks
21:34
want to wait until they become the specialist.
21:36
And I think that's a problem. Maybe in the old days you had to
21:39
be, but now I don't think you should wait because figuring out
21:42
the time to start will be difficult.
21:45
So let's say I wanted to learn everything about sales and
21:47
business development before I started the podcast.
21:51
Arguably, would I be doing the podcast now?
21:54
Some folks will say, no, you're not qualified because you have
21:58
picked up sales and business development on the go and you
22:02
are self-taught on some couple of things.
22:05
You didn't go to school, you didn't write a thesis, your
22:08
professor didn't certify you. So you can see how it's kind of
22:12
a slippery, you know, a sliding scale, like, where are we going
22:15
to start? So what folks like Gary
22:18
Vaynerchuk advises is you just use a strategy of documenting
22:23
and talking about things. As you learn, people will see
22:28
the specialty and the skills that you are acquiring and they
22:33
will go to you accordingly for that.
22:35
And then of course, folks like Gary Vaynerchuk, who else?
22:38
This former photographer also turned tech founder, what's her
22:44
name, Jasmine Star, and a couple of other people.
22:47
What they point out is that expertise is relative.
22:53
So me talking about sales and business development, I'm the
22:57
expert relative to you guys because I know more than you
23:00
guys. But of course, if I'm having a
23:03
conversation with someone more far, far along, let's say like
23:07
Dangote for instance, OK, no, Dangote has generalist expertise
23:13
in running enterprises. OK, maybe I might still be
23:16
considered a sales specialist if I'm having a conversation with
23:19
Dangote. But you get what I'm trying to
23:21
say that with my level of knowledge, skill and the
23:24
experience I've gotten so far in front of some people, hands
23:27
down, I'm the expert. In front of other people, we are
23:31
contemporaries. And then in the presence of
23:33
other people, they'll look at me and say, young man, you stay the
23:36
line, work a couple of years, no problem.
23:39
You can come and roll with the big boys and roll with the big
23:41
girls. So expertise is relative.
23:45
And so because of that, documenting and talking as you
23:47
learn is not a problem. So if you want to be your
23:51
personal online brand to be brain surgery in Niger, you want
23:55
to be the pre eminent brain surgeon in Niger.
23:58
But currently you're in year 2 medicine or let's say like this
24:02
guy that reached out to us yesterday, Adebulu, that reached
24:05
out to me. So you're Adebulu, you're in UI,
24:07
you want to be the preeminent neurosurgery specialist in
24:11
Niger. But currently you're in year
24:12
five, you still have two years before you graduate.
24:15
And after you graduate that two years, you still need to do 2
24:20
years clinical Abby. Now after two years clinical,
24:24
you now do 2 years. Is it residency, Abby
24:26
specialization? So someone who's in his own
24:29
position will need another. If my math is right, I think 6
24:33
years to qualify before you can even start positioning yourself
24:36
anyhow within the neurosurgery space.
24:39
So with Gary Vaynerchuk, his advice and with Jasmine Star and
24:45
people like that, what you would do is from this, your year five,
24:50
start talking about neurosurgery on your LinkedIn, on your
24:54
Instagram, start talking neurosurgery.
24:58
Share the things that you are learning ideas in your thesis,
25:02
you know, put it up documentaries you come across,
25:05
share them conferences that you're attending on
25:08
neurosurgery, put it up all these other things as you're
25:12
learning, as you go to go, just keep putting these things up on
25:15
LinkedIn, on Instagram, on everything and people now start
25:22
making those associations with between you and neurosurgery.
25:26
So if you take this approach, by the time you're done with the
25:29
six years, you know, two years qualified medical exams, 2
25:34
years, residency, 2 years, What was the other two years?
25:39
I can't remember. Nepal was one year.
25:40
NYSE by the time you've been doing this thing for seven years
25:45
and then, you know, mumsy and popsy, they're able to raise you
25:48
so that you go out to John Hopkins University.
25:51
Is that in America? I think you don't want to attend
25:53
John Hopkins in America and then you specialize.
25:55
So by the time you've been doing all this over the last 10 years,
25:58
as you come back to Nigeria now and you're setting up your own
26:00
neurosurgery practice, you can see how the brand will now
26:04
begin, you know, will now start to take shape.
26:07
It's because from year five, you've been doing some stuff
26:10
with your LinkedIn, with your Instagram, with your everything.
26:13
Everything has been adding and been adding and been adding and
26:16
been adding. And by the time you now
26:17
graduate, John Hawkins, you come back to Nigeria, you open up
26:20
your whatever, you know, certified like you're the guy or
26:24
you're the girl. You they say neurosurgery in
26:27
Nigeria, you're the person to go through.
26:29
It's because you've been following this much more organic
26:31
approach, documenting and talking about things as you
26:33
learn. So that was my advice to
26:37
Cameron, Mr. Shirley, don't wait until you're the expert.
26:41
You know, now start documenting and start talking about things
26:45
as you are learning. So that was my advice to him.
26:48
Do you want to achieve some sort of big branding in the telecom
26:51
space in America, in your city, in wherever you are?
26:55
Then start talking about these things, small, small as you are
26:57
learning. I went to go and visit a client
26:59
today. This was the problem, blah,
27:00
blah, blah. This is how we help them solve
27:02
it. Our product does this dot, dot,
27:04
dot dot dot, you know, bam, you post it, you know, small, small
27:08
as you're posting 2-3 times a week.
27:09
People are seeing after a year, if anybody's thinking telecoms
27:14
problems, they'll say, ah, that my guy Cameron, this is the kind
27:18
of thing he does. He has Cameron's number.
27:20
Just holler at the guy who will sort you out.
27:22
So that's how we start small, small day by day.
27:25
Then he had questions on how to be much more personable online
27:29
because he has noticed me to have also noticed, much to my
27:32
dismay, that people on LinkedIn are now talking about personal
27:35
stuff because I try to be more like, OK, well, I don't know
27:38
what the intentions are. Some people say it has the
27:41
effect of making it much more personable and likable.
27:43
So people are talking about stuff on LinkedIn so much to my
27:48
what's that word, Azisha Green or whatever to my disapproval.
27:52
People are talking about weight or LinkedIn.
27:54
You know, before I was 130 kilograms, I did this diet.
27:57
I did that diet now 80 kilograms to God be the glory.
28:01
People are talking about marriage, people are talking
28:03
about parenting, people are talking about personal
28:06
difficulties and blah, blah, blah.
28:08
And yes, I admit it does make people more relatable.
28:11
It makes people more personable. And I admit it definitely does
28:14
'cause people to stop, you know, when Madame is tweeting about
28:17
her marriage, about how, you know, how meteoric rise in her
28:22
careers, you know, may have caused some tension between her
28:25
husband at home and how they navigated those difficulties.
28:28
I'm like, I'm a young man and I have a wife.
28:31
We're both building careers. So definitely, if I see that,
28:33
that kind of thing. Yeah, me too.
28:35
I'll read now. So let me see what Madame has to
28:37
say. Oh, OK.
28:37
So Madame and her husband, they're having these quarrels,
28:40
too, the same sort of quarrels that me and my wife have.
28:42
OK, So. Yeah, people do stop.
28:45
People do read makes you more personable.
28:48
But in my own opinion, I stay away from that and I try not to
28:53
milk personal issues for business growth or career
28:55
growth. And I told him not to.
28:57
And to be honest, there I was listening to Honest Bunch one
28:59
day and there was this guy, I can't remember his name anyway,
29:04
but he was talking to Nedu Azubi and a bunch of them.
29:06
And they were talking about something.
29:08
And the person said that, look, we were in our own house.
29:11
You're the one that now use your own 2 left leg.
29:13
Are you posted about your husband and your marriage and
29:16
everything? Now that we are commenting,
29:18
you're saying that we should keep quiet and respect your
29:20
privacy, which kind of privacy was minding my business.
29:24
You're the one that now went to go and put your husband out
29:26
there. And you're saying that me, I
29:27
should keep quiet and I should not comment.
29:30
So these are some of the dynamics that I think we should
29:32
stay away from because I don't want to put my marriage on blast
29:35
on LinkedIn. And then people now start having
29:37
opinions and I'll be getting angry.
29:40
I mean, I'm the one who put it out there.
29:42
So why will I now start be vexing because I'm the one who
29:47
actually put it out there to begin with.
29:49
So these are some of the difficulties where I say like,
29:52
please, all these things about weights, relationship with your
29:54
children, work life balance, balance, marriage proposal,
29:59
personal difficulties. I'm dealing with this spiritual
30:02
evolution. Just I beg, just leave all that
30:05
stuff for now. My own opinion, Sha.
30:08
But of course, if you disagree with me, you want to be more
30:12
personable online, I will beg you.
30:14
Yeah, be personal, but leave your marriage out of it.
30:18
If you're a woman, don't talk about your husband.
30:20
If you're a man, don't talk about you and your wife issues.
30:25
Definitely, in my own opinion, leave your children out of it.
30:29
You know, people putting up photos of their children.
30:32
You know, my son just graduated everything, blah, blah, blah.
30:35
I really think that there's security issues involved in
30:37
these sorts of things. You put up your son's
30:38
graduation. So if I'm an Internet fraudster
30:41
and I'll know your son's name if I troll you long enough, I'll
30:45
know when your children were born.
30:48
I know the date of graduation and I know the school that he
30:51
went to, stuff like that. I'm beginning to get enough data
30:54
to build a profile on who your son or who your daughter is.
30:57
So in my own opinion, please, Marriage, leave your spouse out
31:00
of it. Children, leave your kids out of
31:03
it. Let's see what else.
31:06
OK, in my own opinion, another reason why there's no need to
31:10
even bring rope all these personal issues in is because as
31:13
you're talking about these things that you're learning on a
31:15
day-to-day normal normal as in things about your life will come
31:21
up anyway, just like how I'm inducing with you guys.
31:25
And I told you people about where I'm getting my ideas about
31:27
branding from. So that is where you know, all
31:32
these things start to pop up. You know about Mumsy and her
31:35
career in marketing and public relations or my dad and his
31:39
career in journalism in radio and television or my wife in
31:42
legal and a government regulator.
31:44
So you see these things already just flow as it is just from
31:49
normal level of you sharing content anyway.
31:50
And that's enough to make you more personable.
31:53
So I really don't think you should go out of your way to
31:56
start talking about these sorts of things.
31:57
But anyway, let me know over stress because for those people
32:00
who keep tweeting the tweeting and posting their children, I
32:05
don't think there's anything I'll say here on the podcast
32:07
that will change their minds. Yeah.
32:10
But I did point out one thing. The choice of medium that you
32:13
use can make you be more personable and might reinforce
32:16
your brand because there are some psychological benefits that
32:21
accrue to video and video and TV and audio radio that makes
32:28
people feel as if they know you more.
32:30
You know, that's what I'm trying to say.
32:31
If you're doing blog posts and pictures, people might not feel
32:36
you as if you're doing video, excuse me, video and audio.
32:41
Now, why this happens? There are different
32:43
psychological concepts or yeah, different psychological
32:46
conflicts at play. There's this thing called
32:49
parasocial interaction, and the parasocial interaction is this
32:53
one sided thing that happens where like you, you're just
32:56
doing your thing, but because you're on the media.
33:01
Just like when I was a boy, it was this guy Sonia Lizi.
33:04
Yeah. Sonia Lizi was on NTA.
33:06
Was Sunday Sunday Tonic, Sunday Sun?
33:10
Was it Sunday jump up at the Sunday Sunday Tonic or
33:12
something? He had the show that will come
33:14
on after that will come on after NTA news and they'll be talking
33:20
about stuff going on in Nigeria. And he had a real nice sense of
33:22
humor. To be honest, since I was a boy,
33:24
I didn't understand 90% of the jokes that he was cracking, but
33:28
he seemed like he was a real nice guy, like a real friendly
33:30
guy. And so it was one time they were
33:32
doing something in NTA and Sonia Lisa came through and me and my
33:36
siblings were ecstasy like Uncle Sonia, Uncle Sonia, Uncle Sonia,
33:39
Uncle Sonia and Uncle Sonia must have been like, who are these
33:42
kids? Where did these munchkins come
33:44
from? Like, I know you're not, but of
33:46
course he was a nice guy, smiling with us and everything.
33:48
Oh hello, how are you, How is school, blah blah blah.
33:52
So for my siblings, we felt like we knew the guy because we see
33:56
him every Sunday and now he's here like, hey, Uncle Sonny,
33:59
Uncle Sonny. And everybody was happy.
34:01
But Uncle Sonny is like, in his mind is like, who are you?
34:06
I know you're not. Please, you know of these
34:08
children. Can you come and carry these
34:09
children and beg? Let me move on because I'm going
34:12
somewhere else. So that's parasocial
34:15
interactions and parasocial relationships.
34:18
So these things happen. So there are a bunch of you
34:20
listening to this podcast now. You've been listening for
34:22
several months. Because of that, you feel like
34:24
you know me. You know about my munchkins, you
34:26
know about wifey, you know about my things I like or things I
34:30
don't like. You see me in public and I'll be
34:31
like, hey, Tavishima, Mr. T how far now, IB?
34:36
And I'll be like, oh, yeah, man, I'm cool.
34:38
Well, what's up? How you you know, And I'll try
34:40
to flow along. I won't like, what will?
34:43
The matter is I don't know you. You feel like you know me, but I
34:47
don't know you. So that's that parasocial
34:48
dynamic going on. So I told Cameron that, yeah,
34:52
these are some dynamics that help.
34:54
If you're on video and you're on audio, this partial shelfing
34:57
locks in, as in locks in real? Well, that's another way that
35:02
people can feel like they know you.
35:03
So don't hide behind the keyboard.
35:06
Put your face out there or put your voice out there.
35:08
It helps. Now, social priming is also part
35:11
of the dynamic that is going on because people like to make
35:15
connections. If you keep things
35:17
conversational, you stories, you know, this sense of intimacy
35:22
that is created. So like for those of you
35:25
listening now who are wives and you hear some of the issues
35:30
that, you know, small, small, small quarters, me and my wife
35:32
I've been having and you know, stuff like that.
35:34
When you see me, you know, there's some social priming
35:36
going on. You know, you'll be able you'll
35:38
feel like you'll be able to relate to me.
35:39
Like, OK, you're a knucklehead husband and I'm married to a
35:42
knucklehead husband. You know, that's already one
35:45
kind of connection. So social priming that one too.
35:48
Is there then Anyway, so those are some of the dynamics that
35:53
make podcasting, that make audio and all these things easy to or
36:00
easier rather to grow a brand. So summary, we've been over 30
36:08
minutes. Let me wrap it up.
36:09
My action plan for Cameron was this.
36:12
That is my action plan for you. If you are in a similar
36:14
situation as Cameron Shirley is, I told him #1 documenting and
36:25
talking about, that's your strategy.
36:27
So as you're learning, just they post, they go just on a
36:30
day-to-day, just be, just be flowing like that.
36:33
Don't wait until you're the specialist for content ideas.
36:37
I told him since you particularly want to be
36:39
personable and I have to tell him you're OK.
36:42
Sharp as in you know you're not bad clean shaven looking all
36:46
although he had a mullet and I thought that mullets were I
36:50
thought there's only certain kinds of Americans who grow
36:52
mullets, you know, like people in the and let me keep quiet.
36:55
Let me not say something now that when you saw someone so but
37:00
yeah, he looked all right. So I told him I look video will
37:02
work for you. You know mullet teen shaving
37:05
already I'm getting a sense of your personality because now
37:07
everybody's brave enough to be carrying mullet up and down.
37:11
So I told him video, you'd be more personable.
37:15
Then I also told him we have to repurpose content we have to
37:19
distribute. So I told him, as you're doing a
37:22
video, put your laptop to one side, open Google Transcribe,
37:26
and then hit play. As you're talking into the
37:29
video, Google Transcribe will now be transcribing everything
37:32
that you say so that when you're done, you take this
37:35
transcription. You will now be able to use that
37:38
and repurpose into a blog. So on Monday, you do that whole
37:41
thing. You put the video up on
37:43
LinkedIn. Bam, you now take the audio
37:45
transcription on Google Transcribe, you know, you know,
37:49
play with this small. You now release that on
37:51
Wednesday, but on LinkedIn. Then you now take Google Gemini.
37:58
The reason why I'm advising Google is just because it's
38:00
free, really. I'm not saying it's the best.
38:01
If you find ones that are better than that, then yeah, by all
38:04
means. But I recommend Google products
38:06
because it's free. If you have an Android phone,
38:08
it's already there. So Google Gemini, that's
38:11
Google's AI product. You'll now be able to take
38:14
nothing that you dropped on Wednesday and break it into
38:16
small, small, small blog posts because you can take one
38:20
paragraph and then stretch a bigger blog post into it.
38:24
And that's what you now drop Friday and you can now drop the
38:28
remainder for next week, Monday, Wednesday, Friday.
38:30
So you can see how you record one video.
38:33
And for now we do video. You get 2 weeks worth of content
38:36
because you're repurposing and republishing and re sharing.
38:41
So that was my advice to him. So you do it like this is not a
38:44
bad way to start. And over the course of a year,
38:47
two years, this thing starts to compound.
38:49
I also told him that he should not be afraid in the beginning.
38:52
Nobody's paying attention. When I started my podcast and I
38:56
put up the first one, I think maybe three or four people
38:58
listen to it. And for that I'm grateful.
39:00
Today were several thousands above that.
39:04
But I do know some people who episode 10, nobody listened as
39:08
even their babe, their girlfriend did not listen.
39:10
Mumsy did not listen, brother did not listen.
39:13
I know some people who started with zero episode one, zero
39:15
episode 2, zero episode 30, maybe episode 7, now one or two,
39:20
it happens. So I told him that you should
39:22
not be ashamed of, you should not be afraid.
39:24
And that's just how it is. Now, from what Gary Vaynerchuk
39:27
says and a bunch of other people, even Jasmine Star in the
39:30
beginning, nobody's paying attention, you know, they don't
39:33
know you. I mean, who are you?
39:35
Especially since in the beginning you're too shy, you're
39:37
too afraid. So you're not even repurposing,
39:38
you're not sharing. So I told him, don't be afraid,
39:41
just continue. They will show me.
39:43
I started with, I can't remember what was four or seven.
39:46
So my guy started with zero. It's just normal.
39:50
But bottom line, one thing I want you guys to take in mind is
39:55
this. Me and Cameron, we are sales
39:59
people, but we're talking branding.
40:02
The reason why we're talking branding is because.
40:05
Branding done right equals to sales.
40:08
And I want to stress this, please excuse me.
40:11
The whole point of the commutative arts in business is
40:15
to sell something. There are some people who just
40:17
cultivate brand for branding sake.
40:19
Cultivate brand, cultivate brand.
40:20
You want to blow then lots of Nigerians that become big brand
40:24
in quote but because they don't have anything to sell,
40:27
eventually they fade away. It happens.
40:29
If you just sit down 5 minutes and think, just think it, you'll
40:32
see that OK Does this guy who blew up like two years back,
40:35
where is he now? Self zero?
40:37
Nowhere because he had nothing to sell.
40:40
Don't be cultivating brand for branding sake.
40:45
Don't be hyping yourself for hyping sake.
40:48
The whole point of commutative arts marketing, the whole point
40:51
of marketing is sell something. The whole point of branding is
40:54
to sell something. The whole point of whatever it
40:57
is, is to sell something. So don't get carried away with
41:00
this whole thing of cultivating hype and cultivating a brand.
41:04
It's about selling something. Also another expectation.
41:09
Don't think that if you create a brand or if you tried start
41:12
trying to create a brand today, that tomorrow you're going to
41:14
get sales. Branding is a long term play.
41:19
So if you're trying to cultivate your brand now, January 2025,
41:26
let's assume that you're listening to this in January
41:27
2025. Don't assume that because you
41:30
started in January, in February, you're going to start making
41:32
sales. That's a long term play.
41:34
You're looking for something that will bring in immediate
41:36
money. We spoke about that yesterday
41:38
where we spoke about either yesterday or the day before
41:41
where we spoke about direct response copywriting and direct
41:45
response marketing. So this is your first time
41:46
listening to the show. All these things about content
41:50
and branding, like none of that is for you.
41:52
You want money now, now, now, now, now.
41:54
Then listen to yesterday's episode, direct response
41:56
marketing and copywriting, those ideas that you can start
42:00
executing in January and hopefully February, March, you
42:03
start seeing money coming in. So that's you pretty much, yeah.
42:09
Let me just wrap it up here. 40 minutes is too much, so thanks
42:12
again to everyone who reaches out from the show.
42:15
You get value directly from the podcast or indirectly.
42:17
Thank you very much for connecting.
42:19
Love hearing from you guys. Keep reaching out because I'm
42:23
trying to know who you guys are. I'm trying to get questions from
42:25
you guys that will inform the growth of the podcast.
42:28
Another reason why you guys should reach out now is because
42:30
right now you can talk to me directly.
42:34
Right now, I'm not a big brand. When I become a big brand, when
42:37
I be, when I hammer and I become a big boy, I'm going to become
42:40
inaccessible, not because I'm full of myself, but because then
42:44
my inbox is going to be flooded and my wife says I spent too
42:47
much time on my phone already. So for those of you who can
42:51
reach out to me now, because in a few years, I will hammer, I'll
42:53
be a big boy, there'll be too many messages and I won't be
42:56
able to hear from you guys. So that's all for today folks.
42:59
Connect with me on WhatsApp. The phone number is 08064662140.
43:05
Country code is +234. For those of you who are not
43:07
Nigerian, then also you can connect with me on LinkedIn.
43:10
My name is Tavashima Ayede, I'm the host of the show and you can
43:13
confirm the spelling of my name and the e-mail address from the
43:16
link. We're currently listening to
43:17
this episode. Thank you very much for your
43:19
time and attention. I'll catch you guys at the next
43:22
episode.