Latest / To All the Men I've Tolerated Before / Parasocial Relationships

Transcript

Parasocial Relationships · To All the Men I've Tolerated Before

• 0:21
  Speaker 1: Re tolerators. This is to all the men I've tolerated before.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: With Fanthley Katona, your weekly look at everyday misogyny. Today,
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: our guest is Tara Jabari, who is a rotating host
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: and producer of the podcast Media Maker Spotlight. Tara's graduate
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: thesis was on parasocial relationships, which is one of my
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: favorite topics that I don't know hardly anything about because
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: every time someone puts a mean comment about parasocial relationships
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: on the Internet, I take it very personally and am
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: worried that it's about me and the love that I
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: have for the dropout community and anyone who's ever been
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: on one Tree Hill. So we're going to clear the
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: air on what qualifies as a parasocial relationship, how socializing
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: has changed in the Internet age, and what that means
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: for misogyny. Welcome Tira, thanks for coming on on the show.
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: Thank you Natalie for having me.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: Why don't you give the listeners since you're a new guest,
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: a little bit of background about yourself and Media Maker
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: Spotlight and how you came to studying parasocial relationships.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Sure, what was the first part? A little bit background
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: on me? Yeah, okay, So I work a lot in
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: digital media. I studied media production and but it was
• 1:42
  Speaker 2: when social media really started picking up, and it's a
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: new thing and stuff. So while I wanted to be
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Martin Scorsese, people were all like, figure this new thing
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: called Instagram and Twitter, and we're like okay, And I went,
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: I'm from Chicago, and I went to Bradley University in Peoria, Illinois,
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: and I worked in a couple of places in Chicago,
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: and it led me to a year long thing for
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: New Zealand. And I got to work on documentaries in
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: Vanuatu and New Zealand. And I didn't get to go,
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: but they went to Tonga and then they gave me the
• 2:25
  Speaker 2: footage Samoa. They gave me the footage and I really
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: learned how to edit and all sorts of stuff. But
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: while I was in these smaller places, like not smaller
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: but for lack of a better word, excuse me not
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: being so PC but poor countries. It's very far in
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: the South Pacific Islands. They're so friendly and everything like that,
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: I was seeing that we could still communicate, but we
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: were also having a huge digital divide. So I thought
• 3:03
  Speaker 2: we can let technology and our digital tools unite us
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: and use it as a tool, but if we're not careful,
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: we can use it as a new addiction and abuse.
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: So I wanted to go back to school and learn
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: more about that so that we can make it as
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: a tool.
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: But not a new addiction.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: And so I ended up going to Georgetown University UH
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: for the Masters of Arts in Communication, Culture and Technology.
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: And you really only need.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: Two excuse me, three main like.
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: UH required courses and then the rest of the two
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: year program you really get to do what you need
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: to do. And so we had people from like anthropology
• 3:49
  Speaker 2: to marketing to like law, to you know, all sorts
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: of different people from different backgrounds who were interested in
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: either the communication, the culture or the technology route. And
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: I really liked that. I didn't know what I was
• 4:05
  Speaker 2: going to do. I was interested in copyright and IP
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: and things like that. And then I towards the end,
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: I did a lot more of independent studies. But then
• 4:20
  Speaker 2: I learned about something called parasocial relationships, and I was like,
• 4:25
  Speaker 2: what's this? This sounds like me too, So don't worry outly
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: and we'll get into the definition and what it really is.
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: But it's really got defined in nineteen fifty six when
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: television really became a thing more prominent in people's homes.
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: But it's basically para, meaning one sided. So it's when
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: a person, an audience member, really starts having a one
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: sided relationship with a media figure. So like, for instance,
• 5:01
  Speaker 2: there were statistics that showed that crime went down nationally
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: on Mondays when I Love Lucy was on, Like even
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: the robbers were like, I Love Lucy's on, work is
• 5:12
  Speaker 2: off tonight. You know, everyone really looked forward to certain things.
• 5:18
  Speaker 2: And when television really was introduced, you know, you had
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: the radio, but when TV in the nineteen thirties, but
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: the nineteen fifties, it became more and more common to
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: have your TV, at least one TV in a person's home,
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: and so people had two senses, their ears as well
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: as their eyes to form a relationship with people. So
• 5:44
  Speaker 2: like every Monday, we knew, Lucy's gonna make Ricky mad,
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: but he's gonna love her because she's Lucy, and all
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: you know, you were like looking forward to it as
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: well as your.
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: The news anchor.
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: Every night you looked, you were like, this person's gonna
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: tell me the news, my local news, the national news,
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: all sorts.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Of things.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: And by nineteen fifties, if you think about it, you
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: just went through two world wars, the recession not recession,
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: the Great Depression, you know, all sorts of things that
• 6:16
  Speaker 2: people really looked up to these people. So in nineteen
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: fifty six, they these scientists and researchers were really noticing
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: people were getting really attached to these people. So if
• 6:31
  Speaker 2: a news anchor, for instance, your nightly news anchor was
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: sick and a substitute would come on, the studio would
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: get like soups and phone calls and say, oh my gosh,
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: I hope they're okay. Here's a soup. This is like
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: a secret recipe. My grandmother taught me all sorts of stuff,
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: because it was as if your friend, your brother, your
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: distric or your cousin, your own friend, like as somebody
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: who actually knew was sick, right, and you wanted to
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: them to get better and things like that. So doctor,
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: I guess I'm getting into it now, Doctor Richard hold on,
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: let me get it up right now. Doctor Donald Horton
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: and Richard Wool were the two that really developed this
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: theory called para social interactions or relationships basically meaning it's
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: focused like the psychological attachment formed with the media, and
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: for them it was mostly the television personalities. And this
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: is really the laying of the foundation of what we
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: now really consider now with cinema, with musicians, with sports,
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: with social media like influencers and things like that. But
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: as I was reading about it, I also saw like
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: it hasn't really been updated, and so I wanted to
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: update it. But to your point, I was I decided.
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: I was like, I'm gonna really focus on this towards
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: the end of my graduate studies because I think it
• 8:13
  Speaker 2: is important. And my side went, oh, so you're just
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: writing your memoir or something, and I'm like, rude, rude,
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: rude father.
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: So I'm like, shut up.
• 8:28
  Speaker 2: So but it was interesting. You know, the most extreme
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: examples that we can think of of a parasocial relationship
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: that's not unhealthy is like the man who tried to
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: assassinate President Reagan because he had watched Taxi Driver dozens
• 8:48
  Speaker 2: and dozens and dozens of times in the theater and
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: associated Jodie Foster as her character who was a child
• 8:56
  Speaker 2: prostitute that needed saving and things like that. Now, by
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: the time he actually did this, Chrody Foster was a
• 9:06
  Speaker 2: student at Yale University. Right, she doesn't talk about it
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: to this day, but he tried. And when I actually
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: presented my studies and findings, which we'll probably go through
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: at a Washington, DC's Awesome con somebody I said, okay,
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: so we're open for Q and a somebody said, actually,
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: I'm a nurse, and when I nurses have to do
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: different residencies are sort of like they have to do
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: different departments. She's like, I had to do it at
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: the hospital at the again, I apologize not being very pecy.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: The insane asylum or the mental hospital. Yeah, that man
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: was in And I said, really because in my research
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: in I could be wrong, but like twenty fourteen, because
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: my studies were done in twenty seventeen. So in like
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: twenty fourteen, his family, his parents were trying to get
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: him sort of like approbation, kind of like let him out.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: He didn't go to prison. He went to a mental
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: institution and they said, will take care of him. He
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: was denied because the hospital and everyone was saying, well,
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: when you die, who's going to take care of him?
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: And he's still a threat to society and to himself,
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: so he has to stay in the hospital and she's like, yeah,
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: I agree with that. He's still not right in the head.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: And this is in twenty seventeen. She's like, I mean
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: I knew him before then, but probably that's correct. So
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: it was a very interesting thing that I actually met
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: a woman who actually worked at that hospital and knew him.
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, small world. I love that. I love chance to encounters.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: But I think one of the things that I have
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: on my outline is that one of the things that
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: we really like. Okay, it's cringey or whatever for me
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: to wish Sophia Bush happy birthday because she was on
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: my favorite TV show of the early two thousands, One
• 11:19
  Speaker 1: Tree Hill, and I saw a post that it's her birthday.
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: So I'm just gonna comment and be like, happy birthday,
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: And you know, I could be putting that energy towards
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: anything else this year. Actually, my mother shares a birthday
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: with Chelsea Davanta's of the Glamorous Trash podcast, and by
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: the end, by the time I wished my mother a
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: happy birthday, I had already DM Chelsea Happy Birthday, and
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: also told a stranger at the Art Institute in Chicago
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Happy Birthday because she meant shit. It was her birthday,
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: and then I went, holy shit, it's my mom's birthday.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: Totally forgot.
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I was like, there's something that's different about Chelsea's birthday.
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: What is it? Oh, it's my mother's birthday. Had written
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: it on all of my calendars, it is in my phone,
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: it's five thirty pm. And I'm like, hey, mom, hope
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: you're having a good one. Uh. But so there's like
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: the cringe element, but there's also like the safety element
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: when it comes to I'm going with fan obsession, with
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: the obsession that people get on their influencers, on their
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: reality TV stars, and I think a clear example of
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: where we saw it actually have effect in real time
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: on these people's careers or in time life is this
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: latest season of Love Island where people were getting removed
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: from the island because people were digging up racist tweets
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: that they had said or things that they had said
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: on podcasts or whatever, and they were bombing the internet
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: with like we know her and she did this and
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: all that, and people were actually leaving Love Island, which
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: is good on peacock, I guess, like, don't plap for.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: Oh y, Love Island is where you vote the day
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: of and like it's live sort of right.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: Yes, it love Okay, So I've only watched two seasons
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: of Love Island in real time. Well there's so many countries.
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: Okay, So I've only.
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: Watched Love Island USA in real time. But you have
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: to watch it. You don't have to, but it's on
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: every night but Wednesday and then like Saturday's are recap show.
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: And my understanding is what you're watching on Peacock is
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: what they filmed and edited and produced on the quick
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: on two days prior, so you're like two days behind them.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: I know. The turnaround. What a nightmare.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: I feel so bad for the editors.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, I would love to talk to a
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: Love Island editor to be like why why, Oh, that's
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: something I should like to I have a quick question.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: Sure, you said safety, mm hmm what do you mean
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: by safety?
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: So I think like the Jodie Foster thing right, that
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: man had. I know, I think I went away from
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: my original point because Love Island popped into my head.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: But so Jodie Foster was a woman who was just
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: like living her whole life by herself, no longer starting
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: a taxi driver, and was way older. And this man
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: had such an attachment and obsession with her that he
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: was willing to kill the president over it. I think
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: that the more recent thing I've seen is watching the
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: Dallas Cowboy Cheerleader's America Sweetheart docuseries and those women openly
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: talking about men who have air attacked their cars or
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: asked them how their dag are doing, or like, hey,
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: we saw your mom was at this grocery store. Does
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: she like to shop there or whatnot? And they assume
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: that those women are more than happy to have those
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: things happen to them, because in those guys' minds, they're
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: already friends and they're like sexy little mind girlfriends.
• 15:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a part where like, well, you signed up
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: to be you know, watched I should be able to
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: watch you anyway. Then also, but we watch you all
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: the time. Why is this not normal? And the reason
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: why it's not normal is I don't.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: Know you great? Why do you know my dog's day? Yeah? Yeah,
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: so that it is.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: That's the para aspect of it going back to all
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: the way back to like the nineteen forties and fifties,
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: where like that anchorman who got sick, or the studio
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: and all that stuff. They're like, we got like a
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: hundred soups and one hundred other calls and even more
• 16:04
  Speaker 2: letters by all these individuals. We don't know who these
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: people are. We just knew by statistics of the numbers.
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: Now we have a name.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: Natalie sent a soup, Tara sent a phone call, like
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: called us to see if the anchorman is okay. We said, yep,
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: he had a little bit of a cold. We just
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: didn't want him to get worse, so we had his
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: substitute come in. Thank you so much, you know, all
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: that stuff, but it and there's not much you can
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: kind of share. But also they're like, but you know,
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: like that Tara was really insistent and Natalie's soup is
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: really good, and they're like you ate it, and you're like, yeah,
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: because we don't. We can't have the anchorman poisoned. I
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: might as well try it, you know kind of thing.
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: That's probably what they had to go through because they
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: don't know who Natalie and Tara are. However, Natalie and
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: Tara know the anchorman, but they don't know the studio people,
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: and so it's a very weird kind of aspect of
• 17:12
  Speaker 2: I always kind of think of it. It's like when
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: you're you make friends at school and then they're like,
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: come over to my house. And you go to their
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: house and you meet their parents, and then you go
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: into the parents' rooms. They're like, we can go play
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: in my room, or we can go watch TV in
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: my parents' room. Right, Sometimes like the parents at a
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: TV and you're like, whoa, it's like behind the scenes
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: and like you only get to see it.
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, It's like when you spend the night at your
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: friend's house and your yea start fighting and you're like, oh,
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: this is what your home life's like.
• 17:45
  Speaker 2: Yes, and it's kind of interesting. You're like, huh so
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: it's but then it's no longer para social now they
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: know you.
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: It's it's no longer one sided. Right.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: It's a very odd relationship. And because in more recent
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: years we have social media, we have technology has grown
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: where it is literally in the palm of your hand.
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: So I always said you could watch something. Let's say
• 18:20
  Speaker 2: you're watching an episode of One Tree Hill on the
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: subway or you know, like even at the airport, right,
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: you downloaded it on your phone, you're watching it, you
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: look up and there's Sophia Bush also at security line.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: You're like what how of a mind fuck is that? Yeah,
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: and I'm crying and you're crying.
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: And all that stuff.
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: I'm crying and it has to And I'm sure they're
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: now being trained media personalities, as anyone who's on screen
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: probably is.
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: Being trained that.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: They're like, what is this? But if you're like, I'm sorry,
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: I just you were my favorite show and I'm watching
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: you guys now and it's been a really tough summer
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: and I just love you and all that.
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: Oh oh, of course, so you still.
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: Watch the show? Would you like a hug? Or would
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: you do you wanna a selfie? I still have some
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: time or something like that. You know, she probably has
• 19:18
  Speaker 2: a training like that.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: Or she's like, oh, okay, thank you, Well, I'm sorry,
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: I have to head to the fight. I'm really late,
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: but thank you so much for watching. I'm so glad.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: It's a comfort something like that, you know, So it's
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: kind of they're probably being trained for that, but it
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: is a mind fuck to be how and how is
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: that for children? I had an interview with a voice
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: actor who was in Oh, Forgeting Out Loud? I forgot it?
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: But it's he's mostly in television shows for children, so
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: their voice actor or you hear about it, for like
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: Tom Hanks and you know, He's parents are like, don't
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: you know that's Woody from Toy Story And.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: The kids are like, what are you talking about? You know?
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: And so he's like and then I have to kind
• 20:07
  Speaker 2: of animate my voice and they're like, whoa, that's creepy.
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: You're pretending to be Woody. And he's like, well, technically
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: I always am Woody, but they don't comprehend that Woody
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: is not real. So that's kind of He's like, yeah,
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: and it kind of saves my butt so that I
• 20:24
  Speaker 2: could still go to like in this example, go to
• 20:26
  Speaker 2: the airport with peace of mind, but it is tough well.
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: And I think a more recent example of that, and
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: I only know her because I have nephews who have
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: to learn their ABC's and talk is Miss Rachel, the
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: YouTube personality who became very big on YouTube and TikTok
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: during the pandemic because she was doing she had like
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: trained herself and gone back to school about speech therapy.
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: It's connected to her own kid somehow, and she was
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: making these videos about like colors and numbers and ABC's
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: and barnyard songs and all of it, and kids literally
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: love her. My nephew has never shown me the affection
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: that he's shown me Miss Rachel on the TV screen,
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: and I'm like, I'm a person sitting next to you
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: also singing Ronald McDonald.
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: But Miss Rachel also never tells him to eat his broccoli.
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: Correct, never told him no.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: Or even if she does it, never tells him no,
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: right because she's like, and don't forget kids, eat your broccoli,
• 21:31
  Speaker 2: but not when he's actually forced to eat the broccoli
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: in front of him, you know what I mean. Like,
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: that's the thing. It is interesting. So I was wondering
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: about the safety aspect of it because even to your point,
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: I had an example in my paper, and this is
• 21:52
  Speaker 2: kind of before I think it's before she got Quoe.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: Unquote canceled, but JK.
• 21:59
  Speaker 2: Rowling was always very responsive with fans online. I had
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: thought what you also meant was we could reach out
• 22:10
  Speaker 2: to our favorite personalities media figures, and there is a
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: chance that they could get back to you. And this
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: has happened a couple of times. One of those was
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: that I had in my paper was a young woman
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: or a girl had tweeted to writer JK. Rowling that
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: the Harry Potter series really meant a lot to her,
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: helped her during times when she was being really bullied
• 22:37
  Speaker 2: and depressed and all that stuff. Could JK. Rowling write
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: one of the spells? I don't know this, I don't
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: know the story very well. So it was something that
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: they say in a spell imporium is one of them.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: Anyway, in her handwriting.
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: Take a photo of it so that she could get
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: a tattoo of the spell in the handwriting of JK. Rowling.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: So Rowling does that and sends it to her through Twitter.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: Now that probably would not have been able to be
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: accomplished before, or not as fast before this digital age
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: that JK. Rowling knew of the specific person who's going
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: through this and why she needs this and yad YadA, YadA, YadA,
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: and to get her wishes done so fast that I
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: was thinking what you meant by the safety aspect of
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: parasocial relationship? Now also it's no longer parasocial.
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: Right because now JK has acknowledged.
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: You, Yeah, she knows your individual existence and you know, yeah, well,
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: then acknowledged it.
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: But that's a huge part of it too, is because
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: of the mental and emotional toll, always being a number
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: one as a normal person, as just like an everyday
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: person who's not very well known and just living their life.
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: My phone is always on do not Disturbed, because I
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: made a choice during the pandemic that I would actually
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: choose when I wanted to look at it instead of
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: being buzzed and alerted, but that I had to look
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: at it so I couldn't imagine being Arianomatic's host of
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: Love Island. We all watched her traumatic breakup on vander
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: Pump Rules constantly getting dms from women who have also
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: been cheated on, or people who love Love Island, or
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: people who are pissed off about the Love Island season
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: or whatever. And sure, you hire people to do that,
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: but I think it's like the mental and emotional awareness
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: that truly everyone truly feels like they know your business
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: and are owed your time and affection and attention.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: That's the other thing. They took this much investment to
• 24:50
  Speaker 2: watch your life, and how much of that life are
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: we actually seeing because we're not seeing you getting your
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: taxes done, We're not seeing you getting up in the
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: morning deciding what to wear. Oh, I decided to change,
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: I sweat so much because it's so damn hot.
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: I had to change, you know.
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: You like that kind of we're not seeing it all,
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: so really we're not saying everything, so's we're and usually
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: it's the power of editing. It really is the dramatic
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: aspects of a love life, right, like those dates that
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: they go on. I do remember. I don't know which
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: season this is, but I was staying with a friend.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: She was very kind of to let me stay with
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: her for like a month in New York City, rent
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: free kind of thing. But she wanted to watch Love Island,
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: and I was like, I ain't watching this shit. But
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: I would hear it because it's like basically a one
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: bedroom and so we kind of shared the bed, but
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: she would watch in the living room and I could
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: hear it. I'm like, I'm going to the bed and
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: I'm reading a book, but I would end up dreaming
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: with their voices and I'm like, God, damn you Athena,
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: I'm watching the damn show. And it was the girl
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: who's Persian and then the guy Rob who has like
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: a snake tattoo. I called him snake tattoo.
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: Oh, so the most read like last season, last season,
• 26:21
  Speaker 1: I think it is.
• 26:23
  Speaker 2: And then I don't remember what her name was. She
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: was Persian.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: Leah like, okay, Leah, yeah.
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: Because I'm Persian, so I just remember. Oh. Then they
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: always bring in a couple of new people after a while,
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: right because they need like fifty episodes, and we were
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: catching up, but we were also sort of getting towards
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: the end, like catching up and all this. It was
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: somebody who really only speaks Spanish, I think, and she
• 26:51
  Speaker 2: ends up with him.
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: I think.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: Anyway, They were like, are you nervous about the language barrier,
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: and so Leah goes about like no, my family's like
• 27:02
  Speaker 2: your onion and they speak farcie.
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: It'll be fine.
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: And Nathin was like, what a stupid What does that
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: have to do with anything. I'm like, I guarantee you.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: They asked her this question fifteen times and she said, no,
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: it's not a problem, No, it's okay, No, it's fine.
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: They kept wanting a stupid quote, and that's the quote
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: that they chose. I guarantee you. They wanted her to sound.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: Stupid, and I do have I do have a parasocial
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: relationship with Leah because I love to use her phrase,
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: you really did your big one. When people do something stupid,
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, you really did your big one?
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: Oh so she kind of yeah, because she's such a sweetie, yeah,
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: you know, and everyone liked her. She was really close
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: towards the end.
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: It was so funny. Yeah, she was in the top three.
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: I liked the couple who won too. But yeah, Leah, which.
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: Was like a sibling to the basketball player.
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: Right, yeah. Well, and so that leads into sports where
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: it comes right.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: When it coositions and sports you never want to touch.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: No, the way that people's entire day week mental status
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: will hinge on what a bunch of guys in a
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: jersey do or don't do the night before. And I, like,
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: I famously do not sport. I do not like sports.
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: I know, I tru Any information that I've ever gathered
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: on a sport I've dumped right out of my head.
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: The only time I've enjoyed sports is Challengers, and it's
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: mostly because that movie's horny. I still haven't seen it.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: Oh oh yeah, that was a sport. I was in
• 28:45
  Speaker 2: a will I realized it.
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: And uh so when a couple of years ago for
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: the Super Bowl, when Roku had the brilliant idea that
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: in the middle of the Super Bowl. Roku would make
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: it like your wife had turned on the note book,
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: and then we got dozens, hundreds, thousands of stories of
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: women or children talking about how their dad reacted and
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: it was like punching the wall, going after mom, throwing
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: remotes at the TV, screaming at their kids. Because Roku
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: had this brilliant commercial idea where it's like, oh, we'll
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: pretend like the game is still happening, but then it'll
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: flip over to the notebook, like your wife got sick
• 29:29
  Speaker 1: up the Super Bowl game, and then like oh yeah, So,
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: I mean it did its job because it did trick
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: a lot of these dudes. But the immediate response of like,
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: what was.
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: The point of the commercial though.
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: I think just to sensationalize Roku and be like, and
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: that's why you should always be in charge of what
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: you're streaming or whatever. The tagline was, I don't watch
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: the Super Bowl. I don't know if I ever.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: Ex I thought it was the commercial of Girl, Little Girls.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: Oh No, what happened was the commercial is Roku. So
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: you're watching the Super Bowl and Roach somehow slices in
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: their footage of the Super Bowl and then it cuts
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: into the notebook like someone has changed the TV. And
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: before the commercial is done, men are already having a
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: dramatic reaction and they're punching walls and they're streaming and
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: they're beaming to their kids or whatever, and they're cussing
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: out their wives. And then you're just a woman in
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: danger looking at the TV, going, look, it's a Roku commercial.
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: Like I didn't I didn't switch over to Netflix. This
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: is all like Roku and Roku's like flashing on the
• 30:48
  Speaker 1: screen like be in charge of your own streaming destiny
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: with Roku or whatever their tagline was. And yeah, and
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: I was like, I don't know if I could ever
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: be watching anything and my power cut off or something happens,
• 31:06
  Speaker 1: my nephew turns on Bluie or whatever, and I'm so
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: enraged that now I'm screaming. I'm screaming because what if
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: I don't see the big men in their big jerseys
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: tackle one another.
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: Well, I think I didn't want to touch sports. I
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: concentrated on television shows. But I think for music because
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: a lot of relatives, including my own mother is a
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: classical pianist, but many relatives or musicians, so I sort
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: of know that world. I don't speak it things.
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: And I am a fan. Yeah right.
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: If there's a like a Little Miss Sunshine is a
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: comfort movie, I know that movie Heart Goodfellas. I also
• 31:59
  Speaker 2: get really offended when people are like, oh, the Godfather,
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: all the Men. I'm like, no, it is such a
• 32:04
  Speaker 2: chick flick. No one gives it enough credit. It is
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: the best. Honestly, fuck the men.
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: It is such a girls movie.
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: Why does everyone hate on the Godfather? Honestly?
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: Oh my god?
• 32:17
  Speaker 2: But like, I do get passionate about stuff, and so
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: like when people are not letting me focus on it,
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: like if it's on TV, for instance, or if I
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: hear a song like Amy Winehouse is Back to Black
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: or something like that, and you get to the part
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: where it's gonna get to the part where you're like,
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: this is where I'm gonna cry. This is it, and
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: then somebody changes it. You're like, what the fuck? I
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: kind of get it. I don't understand it for a sport.
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: I'm like, they literally have been walking running around, back
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: and forth, back and forth. I don't care, but I
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: can put it into that context and I'd be like, Okay,
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: for some reason they care.
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: That's so funny because we were at the Ludacris concert
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: on Friday, my sister and I and my sister for
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: the entire week was going who's your house keeper? What
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: you keep in that house? From roll out and he
• 33:15
  Speaker 1: cut this on off and switched it up right before
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: that line, and she's like, I get to scream my line.
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: I've been practicing. I know, oy sols answer for yourself. Yeah.
• 33:32
  Speaker 2: See, now you could not be parasocial and you can
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: get on his dms. But now Instagram has made it
• 33:39
  Speaker 2: a little bit harder.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Don't worry.
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: You can make it as a comment and what the hell, I.
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: Can tag him on anything I want until Ludacris answers
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: for himself sends my sister a cameo of him going
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: who's your housekeeper? What you keep in that house?
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: Exactly exactly and maybe you can get some answers. But
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: music and sports there is a heightened I can kind
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: of understand with music. The music is a very interesting one.
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: And actually one of the things that I had read
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: towards around the eighties when I was reading about parasocial relationship,
• 34:19
  Speaker 2: there was a woman who was in love with Elton
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: John at the time. Elton John had come out as bisexual,
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: he had first come out as heterosexual or like you
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: never commented about it. By the eighties, he said, I'm
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: bisexual kind of.
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
• 34:40
  Speaker 2: And so she's like, but I just know, I don't
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: remember the article. I'll try and find it if you want.
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: It was something like She's like, I just know that
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: if he met me, he would know I'm the one
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: for him. Huh.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: And I was like, oh, honey, wait until you get
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: them the nineties and the two thousands.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: Because he gave yeah with a husband.
• 35:02
  Speaker 2: With a husband and everything. But it was like, you
• 35:05
  Speaker 2: something about his music and the way he sings and
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: he performs. She just speaks to her. There's all sorts
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: of There was a music video of Selena Gomez's Oh
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: Can't Keep My Hands to Myself that mus I think
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: it was that music video, and I was like, I'm
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: just talking about the music video.
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: I'm not talking about her music.
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: I'm not talking about her just the music video, which
• 35:34
  Speaker 2: is like where she's like breaks into this famous model
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: or actor's home and she's like breaks into his home,
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: tries on his stuff, and then he comes home and
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: he ends up in bed with her. That's the music video,
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: and I was like, that is an extreme example of
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: parasocial relationship. No longer parasocial. He finds her beautiful and
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: it works out for her. Right. That's that was my
• 35:58
  Speaker 2: breaking it down, and I was going to do it
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: for a fan website called The Game of Nerds, which
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: I write for often, and they said, I'm sorry, we do.
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: Not do musicians.
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: We get so many hate and I'm like, but i'm not.
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: I'm not criticizing her or the song. I'm just breaking
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: it down to explain parasocial and they're like, you can't.
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: We can't.
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: People will take it and they're like, you hate Selina
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: You No, I'm not. I'm not. I like that song
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: and all sorts of stuff. So I was like, okay,
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: So I actually put it on my own website to
• 36:30
  Speaker 2: kind of explain an example of an extreme example of
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: parasocial relationship. But is interesting. They're like, no, we refuse
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: if anyone wants to actually talk about musicians, yeah.
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: In any context. Well, because I mean, the big elephant
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: in the room when it comes to the parasocial relationships
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: found within musicians is Taylor Swift and her swifty army
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: mm hmm. Like the Swifties could literally probably either destroy
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: or say the world depending on what Taylor told them
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: to do, because there's so many of them and they
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: come from all walks of life. I am one. I
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: love Taylor Swift's music, but I very rarely find it
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: enjoyable to talk to other people who enjoy Taylor Swifts
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: music because you can't. I love talking about music. I
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: love talking about the different parts of music, breaking down lyrics,
• 37:24
  Speaker 1: what that meant to me, how it plays into my
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: story or whatever. You can't talk to a Swifty about
• 37:30
  Speaker 1: Taylor Swift music because it just becomes part of the
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: over ARCA. And I say that you can't, and we've
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: done it three times on this podcast.
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: But but are they also Swifties.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: Yes, okay, but they were friends of mine, SWIFTI as
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: I had vetted them. But you truly can't because people
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: get so bent out of shape about it. And then
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: my frustration comes from, well, now you've in valley dated
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: the fact that I'm a fan of this person, because
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: now people who think I'm a whack a doo like you, like,
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: now I'm getting shit because you're all wacka doos. And
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: now men and my sister and my family just love
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: to tell me how much her music sucks because they
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: want to see if I'm going to be a whack
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: adoo about it.
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: Well it also, I mean, that's like where they just
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: want to tease you because they're like, calm.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: Down, a I'm not a swiftie. Yeah. I liked one song.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: What was it? Was it?
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: Style? Style is a good one, and it was because
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: they did it to a Game of Thrones plotline. But
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: I but for me, but to your point about dissecting
• 38:51
  Speaker 2: lyrics and things like that, I was also speaking to
• 38:54
  Speaker 2: someone who is a musician who was explaining the Rake
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: versus is it Kendrick Lamar that feud, for instance, because
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: I don't know music right, So she's like when So
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: she was having me listen to the music and then
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: she's like when he goes a minor and I'm like, oh,
• 39:15
  Speaker 2: is that a mind like that's how a minor sounds.
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: She's like yeah, I'm like, oh that is clever, that's funny,
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: and she's like, yeah, that's it. That's the why.
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: That's why.
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: One of the reasons why Kendrick Lamar is considered one
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: of the best rappers and best musicians alive today and
• 39:30
  Speaker 2: I was like, I don't know. I don't I wouldn't
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: know that. Thank you for explaining it to me. Why
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: do people believe that Taylor Swift is one of the
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: best lyricists musicians?
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: I don't speak this language.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: For me. If I like the song, it's usually the
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: sounds that I hear. I rarely listen to the lyrics
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: unless I hear it so many times then I start
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: paying Like back to Black, It's it's the emphasis in
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: her voice. I've never taken cocaine. I've never let alone.
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: What's the line?
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: She's like, I like puff and you like blow.
• 40:13
  Speaker 2: No, So I've never even done pot let alone blow,
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: you know, like, I was like Ray and then she's
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: talking about Ray and I'm like, is it Ray Charles?
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah?
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: He had good voice, you know, Like, but I'm not
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: really paying attention because her voice, she's in so much pain.
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: And when you're in pain, you want to hear that
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: voice because she's singing it for you. And so that's
• 40:36
  Speaker 2: something that I and not only that, but the instruments
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: and the notes that they do for me. That's that's
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: what I like about music. If you asked me about
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: the lyrics, fuck if I know. So, so that's why.
• 40:52
  Speaker 2: And so I asked about that for Taylor Swift. She
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: was like, listen, I'm a fifty year old black woman,
• 40:58
  Speaker 2: don't know. I don't know why people are obsessed with
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: Taylor Swift. Personally. I don't think she's that great. But
• 41:08
  Speaker 2: I can tell you more about this Kendrick Lamar or
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: Eminem or this and a couple of other people. This
• 41:16
  Speaker 2: is not my genre. I was like, fair enough. Then
• 41:20
  Speaker 2: I asked somebody else who's a swiftye and she sort
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: of explained it on top of and she works in PR,
• 41:28
  Speaker 2: and I'm like, isn't this a great PR stunt though?
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: That her and her team And this is also why
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: I'm not a Swift Sea. It's a lot of work
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: that she puts little hints in albums or in songs
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: that kind of tie into the next one. So like
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: song one, by the song ten, you're like, oh, that
• 41:51
  Speaker 2: was a clue to song ten, and if you get it,
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: you'll find the secret message or something like that, like
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: it's a scavenger hunt or something like that.
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: God the Tolerance, No, it's literally the Lord of the
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: Rings of music. You have to know the lore.
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and so it was like, that's somewhat of it.
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: And then I was like something about a red scarf
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: with Jake Jill and I don't freaking know all sorts
• 42:17
  Speaker 2: of stuff as well as just building off of it.
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: And always everyone underestimates the power that females have in
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: consumerism and and just in everything right, because at the
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: end of the day, I think who made a billion?
• 42:38
  Speaker 2: Was it a billion dollars in concerts? Was it Kendrick
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: Lamar or Drake? No, it was who Taylor, Taylor Swift
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: and Beyonce, two females whose majority fans are female.
• 42:49
  Speaker 1: Waste. Between Taylor Swift, Beyonce and then the Barbie movie,
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: we all but saved the movie theater.
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: And that's true, Barbie. I guarantee you will be studied
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: in not just film school, but in a lot of
• 43:05
  Speaker 2: different kinds of classes, business school, things like that, because
• 43:11
  Speaker 2: they took a huge chance. Is it a perfect film, No,
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: But I think it is a great example of how
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: several big companies, I think it was Warner Brothers and
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: then Mattel putting several million dollars into it and made
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: a big profit off of it. And it was very
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: much female led, female driven Yes, there was a co
• 43:40
  Speaker 2: writer that was male but was the partner of the
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: female who was the head director, producer. Everyone was pretty
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: much female that was the lead. Never has that been
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: done before, not to this scale and to make a
• 43:58
  Speaker 2: return and to have that much diversity on screen. The
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: president of Barbie was a black woman.
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: Come on, Isa Ray. Yeah.
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: And I was like, and I what I liked about
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: it was that they didn't make it a big deal.
• 44:14
  Speaker 1: No. I think honestly, when that happens in a movie
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: and no one bats any on it, especially with like
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: queer relationships or whatever, and it's just a normal part
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: of the movie. That was Dan Levy's big thing about
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: anything David did in Ship's Creek, And he was like,
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: we just wanted to live in a town where being
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: queer wasn't all that out of the ordinary, and no
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: one was going to do anything about it. Yeah. And
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: I think that the Barbie movie and the Taylor Swift
• 44:48
  Speaker 1: and what they had in common is is that they
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: both knew how to tug on my nostalgia like endorphins
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: in a way where and they also knew how to
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: get like all hyped up in my like I'm every woman.
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: It's t alling' me. But they tugged on the thing
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: about Taylor Swift and millennials is she does leave like
• 45:12
  Speaker 1: she leaves like her lower easter eggs, but she also
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: leaves like a lot of just like millennial easter eggs.
• 45:18
  Speaker 1: So you'll be like listening to this folk song and
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: then she'll go, but I hit come back stronger than
• 45:23
  Speaker 1: a nineties trend, and you're like, oh, we're actually in
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: the present and it's nineties baby, and it's just fun
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: for me. Also, she says lines like, uh, give me
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: back my girlhood. It was mine first about being in
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: a relationship with John Mayer when she was nineteen and
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: he was, however older he was, and when as a
• 45:48
  Speaker 1: woman who grew up in the throes of girlhood and
• 45:51
  Speaker 1: all that comes with it. When I sing that song,
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: I'm like mad for all of us. I'm mad for her,
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: I'm mad for me, I'm mad for every woman who's
• 45:59
  Speaker 1: ever had girlhood stolen. And it's all of us at
• 46:02
  Speaker 1: some point. And so she plays on that a lot,
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: like it's that.
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: Part she can make it kind of universal.
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, And she welds that parasocial relationship that she has
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: with all of us, like an iron fist, Like you
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: might not be the chosen one who got her to
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: comment on your TikTok after the Ariostour concert, but five
• 46:26
  Speaker 1: people were, and like she'd send her mom out to
• 46:29
  Speaker 1: like feel like pick a person who's having a good time,
• 46:32
  Speaker 1: they can meet me after the show or whatever. And
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: it's just like all of these little secret things that
• 46:37
  Speaker 1: she's doing that keep me hopeful that one day, I
• 46:41
  Speaker 1: guess it could be me, Like instead of a twelve
• 46:44
  Speaker 1: year old, please let this thirty six year old come
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: to the fund meeting greet with the cookies.
• 46:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it is smart and and
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: it works music musicians and music. It's very difficult, very personal.
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: So I went to Ludacris on Friday and that was
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: wonderful and I got to get sweaty and bump and
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: grind like it was two thousand and five and I
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: had the best time. But the week before I was
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: at the Kesha concert. And I have such a strong
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: parasocial relationship with Kesha because I literally lost friends arguing
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: and debating about her court case about doctor Luke and
• 47:27
  Speaker 1: how in no way did whatever contract she signed or
• 47:31
  Speaker 1: whatever high school she dropped out of or however many
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: times her mom was or was not in studio with her,
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: should that have ever led up to her continued abuse
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: and that you know the way that we talk about
• 47:46
  Speaker 1: her drug use and her alcohol use, and I'm like,
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: I don't think we talk about it in the correct
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: way because a lot of that wasn't consensual on her part.
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: They were drugging her and keeping her drunk a lot
• 47:58
  Speaker 1: of the time, I'm sure, yeah.
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: Or even if they weren't, it's probably she was using
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: them to cope.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: Correct. Yeah. So, Kesha is one of my high goddesses.
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: She's one of my strongest heroes. I've thought men, women,
• 48:15
  Speaker 1: babies alike about the validity of Kasha in her career.
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: She secretly, not secretly, but she has a high a que.
• 48:23
  Speaker 1: She's so smart and she's one of the nicest person ever.
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: It's like Lady God. I always use Lady godadys this
• 48:30
  Speaker 1: example where it's like Lady Gaga did a lot of
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: wa could do things, and she wore Robbie on herself.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: And she did that on purpose, but she did.
• 48:37
  Speaker 1: It on purpose because the moment she made enough money.
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: And Bradley Cooper did it too, with all of the
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: hangover franchises. As soon as they made enough money, they
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: went bet and now I do whatever the fuck I want. Oh.
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: I heard that Lady Gaga was saying, I do this
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: so that when I walk on the street to get
• 48:54
  Speaker 2: my groceries, no one's gonna bother me.
• 48:56
  Speaker 1: Because no one knows it's me.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: She purposely moved her face so like contorted it and
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: all that stuff.
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: That was one thing.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: One thing I do really liked about Kesha and that
• 49:08
  Speaker 2: song is it Pray?
• 49:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, praying praying.
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: The way she wrote that song, it spoke to so
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: many people in so many different levels. I was like, damn,
• 49:20
  Speaker 2: she's good.
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: Well when she's singing it. At the concert that I
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: was at, I was standing next to my sister, who's
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: not as big of a Ksha fan as I am.
• 49:28
  Speaker 1: I'm over here having a religious experience. She's very happy
• 49:32
  Speaker 1: for me. She's patiently waiting for your Love is my
• 49:35
  Speaker 1: Drug to come on so she can dance a little.
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: I'm having a religious experience. And I was like, oh
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: my gosh, Onmily is going to think I'm crazy because
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: here's Kesha singing praying from a very healed place. Because
• 49:48
  Speaker 1: her entire tour is crafted around the idea that now
• 49:52
  Speaker 1: she is free of her abusers and the abusive system
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: that put her through so much. And I'm still singing
• 49:59
  Speaker 1: pray like doctor Luke hit me yesterday, and I'm angry,
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: and I'm like going nuts. I'm so angry. It's the
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: same way that Taylor Swift to start singing the ten
• 50:10
  Speaker 1: minute version of All Too Well in a very healed mode,
• 50:13
  Speaker 1: and I'm crying and adding fuck use and screaming angry
• 50:19
  Speaker 1: because of I guess all of the things I didn't
• 50:21
  Speaker 1: work out in therapy when I could afford to go
• 50:24
  Speaker 1: at it go. That's the things we didn't get to.
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: But my parasocial relationship ended with Kesha at the concert
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: because she came directly to me and she held both
• 50:37
  Speaker 1: of my hands, and she looked in my eyes and
• 50:40
  Speaker 1: she sang to me. And if I had been more
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: with it instead of just being so in awe that
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: this was happening to me because we weren't sitting up
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: front or anything, she came down into the crowd and
• 50:52
  Speaker 1: she made her way back to our section, and she
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: came right for me. I would have taken the opportunity
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: to just go I'm so fuck be happy for you.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: I'm so like, it's such a relief to me and
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: other women that you get to now create on your
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: own terms. And you're afraid, like, I'm so fucking happy
• 51:10
  Speaker 1: for you, but instead I'm just screamed singing at her
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: while she's and I think she sensed it. She sensed
• 51:15
  Speaker 1: it because we're lucky.
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: As much as the music of the musician unpacks the
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: listener in these moments of live performances and stuff, Why
• 51:27
  Speaker 2: do you think I do think that she was drawn
• 51:29
  Speaker 2: to you to be like she's happy for me, Natalie,
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: or she doesn't know your name, possibly, but she's like
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: this person this song really means something to them. Are
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: they're really happy? I'm singing this so comfortably.
• 51:43
  Speaker 1: Now, and I so My para social relationship with Kasha
• 51:48
  Speaker 1: ended because she anointed me, and I spent an entire
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: week telling people I'm changed, I'm evolved. Let me touch
• 51:54
  Speaker 1: the babies with the hands that have touched Kasha have touched.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, we met and my mom and I love
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: an actor called ruper Penry Jones, and I met him
• 52:06
  Speaker 2: after a play he did in London, and he like
• 52:09
  Speaker 2: hugged me and like we have a photo of him.
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: You know, so we call that coat the ruper Penry
• 52:14
  Speaker 2: Jones coat. Like, no one's allowed to touch that coat.
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I got home and before I took my like,
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: I was outside in the summer and I'm gross and
• 52:25
  Speaker 1: covered in glitter shower, I like made my cat come over.
• 52:29
  Speaker 1: I was like, let me pet you with the hands
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: that touch Kesha, because we must bless the familiars with
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: the magic powers that I have been given come by.
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: I would freak out, Oh my god.
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: And my sister like, did she actually hold your hands?
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: And I was like yeah, and I think I was
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: on the JumboTron and she goes, no, I was just
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: watching you.
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: And I was like, did she get the video?
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: No? Here's the thing. My sister's My sister's real chill
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: about things, and I'm trying to be really cool about
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: the fact that I know that if my best friend
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: had been at Lakesha COmON, she would have facetimed my
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: mom been on TikTok live, I would have had shots
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: and video and pictures from every angle.
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: Did you go and look for anyone.
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: I've been comby Tikkok?
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: Now you know what it's going to stay in your mind?
• 53:16
  Speaker 1: Better because now I get to ignore the fact that
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: I was sweaty and my hair looked gross and all
• 53:22
  Speaker 1: of it, and I just get to feel like I
• 53:24
  Speaker 1: was beautiful and I was perfect, and I was covered
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: in glitter and she loved me.
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: And it goes if we could kind of shift because
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: you wanted to go about misogyny and the difficultness of
• 53:40
  Speaker 2: not just parasocial relationships and just that stuff. What my
• 53:45
  Speaker 2: kesha if you will, or I say, Mike Calisi, my everything.
• 53:52
  Speaker 1: Is Angelina Jolie.
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: Yes. And one thing is that people have been arguing
• 54:00
  Speaker 2: with me about the oh she forced bread Pitt to
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: cheat on his wife and all sorts of stuff. Now
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: being I'm I was like, let's be unbiased. I have
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: many lawyers in my family, so I can do this.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: I was like, there was the court case or the
• 54:21
  Speaker 2: FBI even got involved with their private plan and all
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: that stuff. And I was like, and this is the
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: scary part. And like my friend, who is a swiftie
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: and is in PR she works a lot with movie
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: stars and stuff like that.
• 54:40
  Speaker 1: She was telling me.
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: She's like, I haven't worked with them, but I heard
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: like Angeline usually is not really nice to people in Hollywood.
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: I actually have known people who worked with not just
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: un but like NGOs and stuff like that, and I've
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: said Angeline has been great, so me, Tara. My assumption
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: is that Angelina doesn't like to play the Hollywood game.
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: She does it so that it gets the recognition, like
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: to help with the causes that she cares for. That's
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: what my guess is. But uh, but Brad is great
• 55:15
  Speaker 2: in Hollywood, and he is great pr He's had it
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: for the last what forty years, He's sixty or something,
• 55:23
  Speaker 2: and that's fine. I'm sure he's I would like to
• 55:28
  Speaker 2: think that he has gone through AI alcoholics anonymous and
• 55:32
  Speaker 2: has become a good person, better person, a good father,
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: all that stuff. But here is the difficult part that
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: people don't really acknowledge. I was like, let's go with
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: the facts, Okay. The reason why she has filed for
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: divorce in the first place, from what we can find,
• 55:56
  Speaker 2: I don't know for sure, but they got married and
• 56:01
  Speaker 2: they had a private plane. They were caught arguing on
• 56:06
  Speaker 2: the plane. I think this is in twenty sixteen, and
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: he was drunk. She tells the children go like, you know,
• 56:15
  Speaker 2: ignore us, you know all that stuff. Their eldest Maddox
• 56:21
  Speaker 2: tries to defend her. He hits Maddox, then he hits
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: Angelina all sorts of stuff, and eventually they land and
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: Angelina takes her and the kids to a hotel and
• 56:38
  Speaker 2: she files for divorce. I think, I think the next
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: day or very soon after. This is probably not a
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: one time incident, at least not with her, because it's
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: probably not. Anyone who's been through an abusive situation or
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: knows people who've been in an abusive situation, or in
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: something where a person has an abuse or alcoholic dependency
• 57:04
  Speaker 2: or drug dependency kind of knows that this is a
• 57:07
  Speaker 2: cycle that happens. But when he gets I think again,
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: this is an assumption. When he went after the kid
• 57:17
  Speaker 2: or one or more of the children in his haze,
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: She's like, oh no, no, no.
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: No more.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: Then they had to get proof because they were minors
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: in the situation. I guess the FBI had to get involved.
• 57:34
  Speaker 2: FBI did get involved. They needed witnesses. The flight attendant
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: as well as the pilot were asked. They confirmed what
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: Angelina was saying and even what the children were saying.
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: Because they confirmed what Angelina said, Brad Pitt stays quiet
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: and his PR team try and shut it down. They
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: leak that Angelina used PR called paparazzi when they were
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: first dating. Okay, even if it's true, all right, that's
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: not really relevant to the case at hand. But it's
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: their job as a PR person to bad mouth the accuser.
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: They're doing their job, and Brad, being trained in Hollyweird,
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: knows to keep his mouth shut and to look pretty.
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: He did his sit.
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: UPS's, he has his good genes, and he's now going
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: to rehab after this weird. For some reason, it's a
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: long legal case. The FBI has decided there's not enough
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: evidence Brad is innocent. Now they're divorced. I don't think
• 58:59
  Speaker 2: it's still fine because because Brad. I don't think Brad
• 59:02
  Speaker 2: is also pissed because she sold her shares to their
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: winery and all sorts of He's prolonging it for a
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: few things, but the main thing was that airplane ride.
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: And I said, regardless, Let's say, for the sake.
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: Of argument, Angelina is a bitch on set. She's terrible
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: to work with.
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: All right, Let's say that's for the sake of argument. Okay, fine,
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: what does that have to do with the fact that
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: a flight attendant, a pilot, and multiple the children young
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: enough to not really be manipulated either way, or you know,
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: like there's a wide range in their age differences. Right,
• 59:43
  Speaker 2: all have agreed Brad was inebriated, was violent against their mother,
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: the mom, Angelina, and against at least one child that
• 59:55
  Speaker 2: was still a minor at the time, let alone a human.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: And yet he is proven he was considered innocent under
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 2: the eyes of the law enforcement. I was like, so
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: if Angelina Jolie, who is pretty privileged, if you know,
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: regardless of what you think, for the majority of people,
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: you would think she is a beautiful woman, beautiful person.
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: White.
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 2: She's mixed a bit, but for the most part she's white, money, fame,
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: and she's still is not believed and everyone, not everyone,
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: excuse me, many people will still go, yeah, but you
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 2: are a cheat, like you're a whore and you make
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 2: men cheat, make men cheat.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 1: Isn't that something.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: Let's say, Okay, yeah, you're like whatever, that like a
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 2: mythological creature that makes the people turn into stone or
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: makes people do what they didn't want to do. Okay, fine, again,
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: in this case, what does that have to do with anything.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: So and the fact that Brad Pitt is a white male, argue,
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 2: very handsome, you know all that stuff. Let alone, wealthy,
• 1:01:31
  Speaker 2: Let alone is Brad Pitt. And he gets scot free.
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: Now he gets into rehab. He says he's been clean,
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: all sorts of you know, sober and all, and he's
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: been trying to work and gain a relationship with his children.
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 2: I hope that's true, but it's still that's the that's
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 2: still what we're going through. So if any of them
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: were a person of color, which some of their children are,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: if any of them had not a lot of money,
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: which many many people on the planet don't, don't have
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: the resources for the best lawyers, or for therapists and
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: counselors and all that stuff, this is the damage that
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: can happen. And that's what's the sad part about it.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: And I.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: Do think Brad Pitt is a great actor. He is
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 2: one of my favorite actors. I seen in almost everything
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: he's ever done. I love Angelina Jolie since I was
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: twelve thirteen years old. Everyone also gave me shit. They're like,
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: she's weird, she kisses her brother, she has sex with
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: her brother, and all that stuff, And I'm like, she
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 2: also is the only one who's been telling me about
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: what's going on in Sierra Leone, you know what I mean.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: Like I just I was like, there's something more out
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: there and I knew it.
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 1: And she was the only one who's speaking to me.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: But that's me.
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: You go ahead and watch your whatever. But this is
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 2: the problem with that is that they keep this division.
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: And it's mostly because she's a woman.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: I think, yeah, well, and you know, we talked a
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: lot about how like parasocial relationships are people feeling positively
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: about someone, But my god, there's so many instances, especially
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: if you're a woman on the Internet, where the parasocial
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 1: relationship is that the person in your DMS or your
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: comments has just decided, through their own detective work, that
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 1: you're a bad shitty person and has now made it
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: their life mission to tell you that you're a bad
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 1: shitty person every day and tell everyone that they know.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 1: Do you know who's a bad and shitty person? Chapel Rowe.
• 1:03:45
  Speaker 1: And it's like, okay, why.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: Like right, well, And also I think it's losing a
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 2: sense of empathy.
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 1: It truly is, because while parasocial relationships technically should have
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: humanized I love Lucy to us more like to be
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: able to watch I Love Lucy but also recognize that
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 1: Lucy was Lucy o'ball was a full fledged person outside
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: of I Love Lucy. It's a cognitive dissonance. It should
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: have me like, it should have humanized people to us,
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: but instead it's like this selfish beast takes over our head.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: And it's like, well, I pay five dollars a month
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: to watch Dropout TV, and that means that Abria Engar
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 1: should say hello to me every time I am in
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: her Instagram comments like she doesn't have a life or
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 1: a husband or a dog or literally a million jobs,
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 1: Like she has a million.
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: Jobs, yeah, which is one of the reasons. Like Eminem's
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 2: song is it Stan? Yeah, And like you find at
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: the end of the song he like writes a letter
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 2: to Stan. He's like, I'm sorry it took me so long,
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: but you know, yeah, it's nothing personal. It's nothing personal,
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 2: and they do appreciate it. But people are also very
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: self absorbed and not self aware. It's a whole other thing.
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 2: That's that's one of the it's these little steps.
• 1:05:18
  Speaker 1: Number one, I should stay off Reddit, but sometimes I
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 1: hate myself and I want to look but you can.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 1: You can put anything in Reddit and there will be
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 1: an entire section of the Internet dedicated to people who
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 1: are fans of this thing. And what are they doing
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: the entire time? They're just bickering amongst one another about
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 1: someone's hairstyle or a line, or whether or not the
• 1:05:41
  Speaker 1: show should have hired this person or whatnot. And I'm like,
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: what are you doing? What if we just what if
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: it wasn't my business what they were doing production wise,
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: because I just want them to make the TV that
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: I pay five dollars a month for.
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 2: Like right, yeah, it's yeah, And sometimes it has its
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: usefulness because there's those redheits that are just for fun,
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: for fun funzies, you know what is it? Those lost
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: connections are sometimes really funny.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 1: You're so funny. Also TikTok, because it'll whittle you down
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: to your bear's soul and be like, these are people
• 1:06:19
  Speaker 1: that you'll like. I've made more friends off of TikTok
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: than any other social media platform.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah. There. The algorithm for that one is scary good,
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 2: scary good, and.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: Yet I just eat it up and keep giving it
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: my own.
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 2: And I think that's the other thing is you just
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 2: need to educate yourself on how these are run, so
• 1:06:38
  Speaker 2: that you're like, oh, why am I buying this product
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: or why am I voting for this person? Is it
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 2: because I really did did my research and did I
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 2: really is a gut feeling.
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 1: Or is it?
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: Was I persuaded that kind of thing is just sort
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: of these you have to be a little bit more
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: careful about it, and that was one of the things
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: that I wanted to to make sure and study that.
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 2: And that's why I really like that. You're like, I
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 2: owe him always on do not disturb. I choose when
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 2: I get on my.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: Phone, I choose. I'm on my phone a lot still,
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: like I'm no hero, but.
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 2: These baby steps it's my thing of like I also
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 2: will like most of I think all of my social
• 1:07:21
  Speaker 2: media apps, none of them have access to my camera,
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 2: my location, my microphone, and when I need it, I
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 2: have to go into my settings give it access, then
• 1:07:34
  Speaker 2: go back into the app and get in. And I
• 1:07:37
  Speaker 2: was like, those small steps of those few extra seconds
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: make you really think. You're like, you're about to go
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 2: on live or you're about to do share this thing?
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 2: Are you sure you want this to be up there?
• 1:07:50
  Speaker 2: Because once you send it, it's no longer under your control.
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: It's owned by the platform.
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 1: And people have made it their hobby and their passion
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 1: to find shit out on you. Like, as soon as
• 1:08:02
  Speaker 1: you get like a little bit of success, a little
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 1: bit of like attention anything, someone's gonna be there to
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 1: find the really bad thing that you said in nineteen
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: ninety nine, like, and they're gonna find it.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 2: They still have, you know. I used the example of
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 2: like Obama. They had found a photo of him and
• 1:08:21
  Speaker 2: I think it was the eighties maybe seventies where he
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 2: was smoking marijuana, and I was like, so you had
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: people who were supporting him, They're like.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: What, look, he's one of us, most of us did.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: Those who weren't were like, marijuana was not legal, so
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 2: he was doing something against the law, and he's running
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: for president, you know like that, And I was like,
• 1:08:45
  Speaker 2: is it fair? No, it is not. Do you think
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: George Washington was a saint? Do you think Thomas Jefferson was? No,
• 1:08:52
  Speaker 2: we know who they weren't. But it also is sort
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: of it's not fair, and it's getting worse about this stuff.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: It really is. And also I just like I don't
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 1: feel like that's good for your mental health or your
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: soul to be so dead set on bringing someone down,
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 1: and like people have heard me say on this podcast
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 1: that like I can mean girl with the best of them.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: I can. I am a Capricorn. I will come to
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 1: the fight and the battle prepared. But I I couldn't imagine.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: I mean, I'm even trying to think of some idiot
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 1: celebrity that I don't particular. Okay, Chris Prat my arc nemesis,
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 1: Chris Pratt my enemy, my enemy, I hate him. And
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: Nikolashay from Love Is Blind. I daydream about that. I
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: thought it was the wife that no one likes. No
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 1: I hate Nick, and I think that if we saved
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 1: Vanessa from Nick, we'd love Vanessa. I think it's him.
• 1:09:57
  Speaker 1: I think I get the very very when he was
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 1: mean to Jessica Simpson, Like we just know that. So
• 1:10:04
  Speaker 1: if I I daydream, I write journal pages. I live
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: for the moment that I will get to bully nickoliche
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 1: in person. And I thought it was gonna happen at
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: the Cincinnati Arastour because he's from Cincinnati, And I was like,
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: I'm going to bully Nickolache in the streets of Ohio.
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: Oh. I was like at the Aras.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: Yeah, at the A because celebrities were going to their
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: hometowns to go to the Aras store, and I was like,
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: I'm going to bully Nickolache in the street of Ohio.
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 1: But he wasn't there. But I truly I'm like, let's
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: get a pttention going that I get to be on
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: Love is Blind and it's not to find love. It's
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 1: literally just to bring Nickoloche down. But I don't actually
• 1:10:45
  Speaker 1: have the time to comment on his Instagram every day
• 1:10:48
  Speaker 1: that I hate him and I want him to be fired,
• 1:10:52
  Speaker 1: and I in fact, the worst I've ever done is
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: yesterday I threw up at my stories, like what's the
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: worst thing we've ever seen on reality TV? And my
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: personal friend, a very good best friend of mine wrote
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: Nickolache's face and I left for five minutes and then
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 1: I posted it on my story.
• 1:11:10
  Speaker 2: I was like this, did you shock him?
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 1: I should have? I was like, you knew exactly how
• 1:11:17
  Speaker 1: to get me Nickola's face, Like I was like, oh,
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 1: but yeah, I don't have time. I have done one
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 1: podcast episode with Chris de Rosa about how like I
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 1: would just really like it if we never saw Chris
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 1: Pratt again. I don't care what he does. I hope
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: he's safe, but I never want to look at you
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 1: no more. I do not see the appeal. I don't
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: see the appeal. I don't like him. I don't buy
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 1: anything that he has to say about how he loves
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: his homophobic church. But is it homophobic? Like I don't
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: buy it, like go away, go away.
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I know, I was like a celebrasion of churches.
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 2: Say it, dude, it's.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 1: Jesus.
• 1:11:56
  Speaker 2: It's a no win win argument.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 1: Move on because also, like as a Capricorn with ADHD
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 1: and a praise kink, I will hyper focus on bullying
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 1: Chris krat on the internet every day if I let
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: that become my hobby. So actually, what I'm doing is
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: holding back, and that's on growth.
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: That is growth, that's.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 1: On emotional well being. Out of everything we've learned about
• 1:12:22
  Speaker 1: parasocial relationships and the way that socialization has changed because
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: of the Internet, what is one takeaway that you think
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 1: that people should hold on to, like a lesson that
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: you would like to impart to listeners.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: I actually had notes and you never got to well,
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 2: one thing is.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: In my thing.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 2: I actually did a series of interviews, which, by the way,
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: when you need to do. You have to do an
• 1:12:51
  Speaker 2: internal review board for graduate school and PhD. And I
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 2: was like, Jesus, this is more complicated than that stupid
• 1:12:59
  Speaker 2: contract and shades agree. Anyway, one had a very good quote,
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 2: and i'll quote you from one of the interviews that
• 1:13:11
  Speaker 2: I did, said, I think the whole concept of parasocial relationships,
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: the idea of the one sided relationship, is kind of
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: going out the window because there's this whole extra category
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 2: now that has no name, where you can have this
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 2: tenuous acquaintanceship with people that were formally untouchable and unreachable,
• 1:13:34
  Speaker 2: and there's a huge amount of gray area. It doesn't
• 1:13:37
  Speaker 2: seem to quite fit in with parasocial relationship because sometimes
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: it is a two way, but it is not a friendship.
• 1:13:45
  Speaker 2: It is not a strong relationship. It's something else. It's
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: something built purely off of some form.
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 1: Of digital media social media. End quote.
• 1:13:56
  Speaker 2: So I think that's what we need to kind of consider,
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 2: is it's no longer parasocial, but it's not a relationship.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 2: And to be aware of it, especially if you don't
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: have any mental disorders like those extreme examples where the
• 1:14:15
  Speaker 2: person wanted to kill the president.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 1: And all that stuff, but it's sort of.
• 1:14:22
  Speaker 2: You know, if you're like, I have to stand up
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: because Taylor is my girl, and you want to be
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 2: violent towards other people, it's not normal. Move on and
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 2: it's okay that they have a different opinion and kind
• 1:14:41
  Speaker 2: of go from there. But like it's sort of recognizing
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: that so that you have a healthier relationship and that
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 2: media and the online relationships have also offered us a
• 1:14:54
  Speaker 2: way to expand our own relationships with fans, you know,
• 1:14:58
  Speaker 2: and that's been really nice. So that like, while you
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: your sister and your family are like you're such a
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 2: loser as a Swiftie, you have a bunch of other
• 1:15:08
  Speaker 2: Swifties that are like, no, that's all right, girl, I
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 2: just made you a bunch of bracelets friendship bracelets, because
• 1:15:13
  Speaker 2: that's a fan thing. That wasn't her right.
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 1: No, Yeah, she has a lyric and you're on your
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 1: own kid, and it says, so make the friendship bracelets.
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 1: Take the moment and taste it. So when the arastour
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: started to get underway, people were like, we should trade
• 1:15:28
  Speaker 1: friendship bracelets because we love on your own kid. And
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 1: it's another like ridiculously emotional song for me because like
• 1:15:37
  Speaker 1: I have to always been on my own tailor. So
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 1: thank you for writing a song for me to cry too.
• 1:15:44
  Speaker 1: So I still make I mean, I've been making friendship
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 1: bracelets for the gaming convention that I'm going to next
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 1: week because I go to a lot of the shows
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 1: and I play a lot of the games, like just
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 1: by myself, because my family's not interested in doing any
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 1: of the activities. So like to endear people to me,
• 1:16:02
  Speaker 1: I give them a trinket. I'm like, Hi, I'm Natalie.
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 1: I'm a really big fan of you and I loved
• 1:16:08
  Speaker 1: your work on Critical Role. Here's a trinket. Thank you
• 1:16:13
  Speaker 1: so much for performing for me and giving me a
• 1:16:16
  Speaker 1: moment of your time, and maybe a selfie like that's sweet. Yeah,
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 1: so the friendship racelet stuff has actually gotten me so
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 1: far in my parasocial relationships becoming real relationships. There you go,
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 1: So Taylor did that for me. But yeah, there is
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 1: this weird gray area when it comes to like the internet.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 1: Because Rosie O'Donnell saw one of my tiktoks talking about
• 1:16:43
  Speaker 1: her in the movie Sleepless in Seattle, and I had
• 1:16:47
  Speaker 1: never seen Sleepless in Seattle, so I was like, oh
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 1: my gosh, it's my friend Rosie and like that was
• 1:16:52
  Speaker 1: a very short part of the clip I had clipped
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 1: on for the podcast, and she like wrote, hey friend,
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 1: it's me Rosy, and then she followed me. And I've
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 1: been telling I like everyone, I don't know if you
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 1: know this, but Rosie O'donald and our friends, like we're friends,
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 1: Like she is my entire childhood. I do watch the
• 1:17:11
  Speaker 1: Rosio Donald show. She does daily updates on TikTok and
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 1: she just calls them like her Tuesday Day rambles or something.
• 1:17:18
  Speaker 1: I watched them religiously, like I'm on a phone call
• 1:17:21
  Speaker 1: with my grandma. I'm like, I got to check in with.
• 1:17:24
  Speaker 2: Rosie her stand up special to raise awareness on female
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 2: heart attacks. Yeah, oh gosh, it's brilliant.
• 1:17:35
  Speaker 1: Gosh, I need to honestly, what I need to do
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: is to do an entire episode about like how how
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 1: a few choice men decided that we shouldn't love Rosi
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 1: o'donald anymore.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 2: Let's all be on it.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: Okay, let's get that well the view and Trump you know,
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 1: you know it didn't work, No, it didn't. I love
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: literally ten toes down always for Rosie, like and.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 2: She's not a perfect person.
• 1:18:05
  Speaker 1: No book movies were better when Rosie was in them.
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 1: I'm gonna say it.
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 2: You know, but it's just no one's perfect. That's the thing.
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 1: That's the thing. And I think, like that's my biggest
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 1: lesson in takeaway, Like I could spend the rest of
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 1: my life being mad because someone that DMed me once
• 1:18:28
  Speaker 1: did a disappointing bad thing. And I kind of am
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: mad at Nellie for playing the inauguration. And I did
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 1: bring it up when I was at the Ludicris concert.
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 1: I was like, you know, last year we went to Nelly,
• 1:18:39
  Speaker 1: and now I'm mad at him.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 2: You know, Oh, did you watch his show with a Shanty?
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 1: No? But I've also seen clips of that to be
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: where I'm like, I'm also mad at the way that
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 1: you talk to a shanty Nellie I got, I'm kind
• 1:18:51
  Speaker 1: of mad at.
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 2: It was the perfect thing to watch because it was
• 1:18:55
  Speaker 2: again a nostalgia thing. And it ends with He's like
• 1:18:58
  Speaker 2: I was asked to do inauguration.
• 1:19:01
  Speaker 1: I'm like, I think he does, doesn't he Yeah, he
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 1: does it.
• 1:19:04
  Speaker 2: And his wife and mother in law were like hmmm,
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 2: they're like what do you think.
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 1: They're like, next question. Yeah, They're like, don't do it.
• 1:19:16
  Speaker 1: But everyone needs a paycheck, so I don't know.
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 2: I was like, again, to his point's done is done.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 2: It's a paycheck and it's and it's also like.
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 1: We got any.
• 1:19:28
  Speaker 2: Yeah, And I was like, I kind of agree with
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: him in that way, but yeah, I get it.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: But I think, like, honestly, I think that one of
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 1: the reasons I love Rosi O'donalds so much is because
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: I got to watch all of Rosi o'donald's movies and
• 1:19:43
  Speaker 1: television appearances and whatnot, and that was the only thing
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 1: I got to know about her, Like I didn't know
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 1: all of the rest of it. And I think we're
• 1:19:51
  Speaker 1: so like flooded with information and it's like, I'm just
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 1: trying to see a Jurassic Park movie because Jonathan Bailey
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 1: is weird, slutty little glasses and that's it. That's the
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 1: only information I want for the entirety of the run.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah I get that, Yeah I can. I'm getting so
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 2: much of the Superman movie.
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 1: And I was like, me too, which one is this guy? Oh?
• 1:20:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he was in Pearl.
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 1: He was in Pearl. But also my favorite little weirdo,
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 1: Nicholas Holts in it as Luker. He's my favorite little
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 1: weirdo him and Dan Stevens.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: Oh Dan, Yeah, do you remember when he was a
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: brunette ye and sensibility.
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 1: I remember when Dan Stevens was just like the soft
• 1:20:39
  Speaker 1: handed guy in like Downtown Abbey. And now he's my
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: favorite little horror.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 2: Will you know where?
• 1:20:46
  Speaker 1: Oh he's so he has done and I'll tell you. Yeah,
• 1:20:52
  Speaker 1: why don't you go ahead and do your manifestation. I've
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 1: gone on the Dan Stevens tangent before on the show.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: The people know what scary movies he's done. I think
• 1:21:01
  Speaker 1: of him looking for his sister.
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 2: Anyway, Okay, we'll discuss this later because I haven't seen
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 2: them all. But okay, oh, my manifestation. You know, I
• 1:21:10
  Speaker 2: have a I have a bad history with manifestations. But
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 2: all right, let's just just like in general, Yeah, it
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 2: can be for anything, manifest that all night dreams come true.
• 1:21:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. Sometimes I'm like, I just hope that Britney
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 1: Spears is having a good day. I just wondering.
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: No, I'm selfish. I want to be selfish. Well I
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 2: have not been very selfish selfish, and I damn will
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 2: want to be. I know what my dreams are and
• 1:21:45
  Speaker 2: I know be careful what you dream for?
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 1: Wish?
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 2: Oh, wish for?
• 1:21:49
  Speaker 1: So I didn't say wish, I said dream for yep.
• 1:21:52
  Speaker 1: So I want to manifest my dream. Are you just
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 1: ending it at your Yeah? Come true? There you go.
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 1: That's what we have. And I hope that Pretty Spears
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 1: is having an okay day. That's great. And I hope
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 1: that someone is looking out for Amanda Vines and I
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 1: hope that every day. I just hope that someone kind
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: is looking out for Amanda Binds. Yeah, well, Tara, thank
• 1:22:16
  Speaker 1: you so much for being on the show and dealing
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 1: with all of the tangents and everything that came with.
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 2: I'm the queen of tangents. Don't worry about that.
• 1:22:24
  Speaker 1: Let the listeners know where they can connect with you
• 1:22:27
  Speaker 1: and start building their parasocial relationship with you.
• 1:22:31
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, shut up. Yeah, So I am on
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 2: most things at at Tara underscor Jabari and I have
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: a couple of podcasts, Media Maker Spotlight who was She podcast?
• 1:22:48
  Speaker 2: And Safe Passages on Substack, which is about digital wellness
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 2: and travel.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 1: So there you go, all right, and tolerators, you can
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 1: continue our parasocial relationship at men. I've tolerated pod on Instagram.
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: Natalie K one two four, Instagram and TikTok, and I
• 1:23:06
  Speaker 1: always invite you to write to all the men I've
• 1:23:09
  Speaker 1: tolerated before or Natalie Kay one two four in any
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: social media app that you might be on and see
• 1:23:14
  Speaker 1: what happens. But Instagram and TikTok are the ones that
• 1:23:18
  Speaker 1: I check uh and remember, tolerators, you don't have to
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 1: smile through anything you're tolerating, including wanting to be so
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 1: excited because you're a fan of someone's work but having
• 1:23:29
  Speaker 1: the Internet tell you that that's actually weird and you're
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 1: in a toxic parasocial relationship. Smiles are for joy.