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A Crash Course in Mortgage Rates and Options Trading · Mortgage Marketing Radio

0:00
Hey, what's up, Jeff Simphur.
0:12
Thanks for tuning in to this episode of the mortgage marketing radio podcast.
0:17
Hey, if you're a long time listener, thanks for coming back.
0:21
New listener.
0:22
Hope you're enjoying the content.
0:23
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0:26
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0:30
Leave us a review.
0:31
I'd love to know how our content is impacting you and helping you in your business.
0:35
You know how to do that.
0:36
That's just follow the prompts somewhere in the show notes.
0:38
It says like the podcast, leave us a review.
0:41
Appreciate that.
0:42
Before we get into this special week, this guest for this week is another success story
0:48
coming at you from the mortgage professionals within our my agent classes
0:53
community.
0:54
Guys, we want to reach more agents.
0:55
We want to expand our reach and reputation.
1:00
What's the fastest, most effective way to do that?
1:03
Is it social media?
1:04
No.
1:05
Is it cold calling?
1:06
No.
1:07
What is it?
1:08
You heard me say it enough repeatedly here.
1:09
I've interviewed over 300 of America's top producers eight out of 10 all have this.
1:13
This is how the top 1% get agent referrals.
1:17
They lead with education content in person and virtual events and classes.
1:21
I to reach agents at scale to move from being seen as a solicitor and vendor to a partner
1:26
here and solicit and driving conversations at scale.
1:30
Case in point, Kevin Bergeu.
1:32
What's up?
1:33
Shout out to you.
1:34
Philly man.
1:35
He's doing two different classes.
1:36
Today, he had 83 agents registered for winning strategies for buyers agents and tomorrow.
1:41
He has a live event database marketing for realtors.
1:44
He's a busy man.
1:46
He's reaching lots of agents.
1:47
He's driving lots of conversations at scale and positioning himself to win, to capture
1:52
market share and out value his competition.
1:55
He's doing it repeatedly just like you would be if you want to get into shape, get six
2:00
back abs, right?
2:01
Whatever that goal is, it's the consistency that builds the momentum over time.
2:07
That's how you crush it.
2:08
That's what we help originators do across the country, done for you agent classes, done
2:13
for you marketing, turned key social media content posts, emails, text messages, weekly
2:18
live coaching and community calls.
2:20
It's all there for you.
2:21
Now, one of the ref ad members that have been with us for over four years.
2:25
If you want to learn more, go to mortgagemarketing.pro.
2:28
I'm opening up my calendar to a few calls willing to talk to some people who are looking for this
2:33
type of solution.
2:34
It's not for everybody.
2:35
Ideally, you've been doing loans at least three years and you're closing at least three
2:39
loans per month or more.
2:41
You're coachable.
2:42
You're trainable.
2:43
You're willing to follow a proven system and willing to show up.
2:47
That's it.
2:48
Mortgagemarketing.pro.
2:50
This week, my special guest, I'm bringing back Dan Roch on the program.
2:54
If you know Dan at all, if you've been part of the mortgage coach, rate watch community
2:57
for any time, you know Dan.
2:59
Dan is like the Yoda of interest rates for years.
3:02
He's at this product called rate watch, which is a daily rate watch forecaster.
3:07
That's phenomenal.
3:08
He's got a very esteemed background in the mortgage space in lots of different ways.
3:20
First of all, he is probably amongst the most knowledgeable people that I have ever run
3:26
into when it comes to markets and rates and understanding what impacts them and communicating.
3:36
Having his ideas to help you be a better communicator in talking about the market and things
3:42
like that.
3:43
You can obviously sound intelligent when you're talking with people.
3:47
Dan's a long time executive leader in the mortgage and real estate industry and he is founder
3:53
and head trader at University of Options, which you're going to hear about it in part
3:58
two of our conversation, which is all about this cool, awesome platform that he's been
4:02
running for years.
4:04
That helps.
4:05
If you're looking to diversify and backfill the ups and downs in your income, I want you
4:10
to check out and listen intently to part two of our conversation where Dan's breaking
4:14
down how his platform with these amazing options, trading bots and futures.
4:21
You get to look over Dan's shoulder and invest in like Forex trading, proprietary FX bots,
4:28
futures trading and everything.
4:29
It's everything that Dan is doing himself to trade the market and win and on a very
4:35
low risk basis, by the way, and you're going to hear some of the success stories in this
4:39
conversation.
4:40
Part one is Dan and I are unpacking kind of what's happening with rates.
4:43
He's listening and you'll talk about why Dan strongly believes that 4% range interest
4:48
rates are in our future come 2025.
4:52
So I think you'll hopefully enjoy this conversation and follow the links in the show notes.
4:56
So without further ado, let's get into this week's show.
4:58
Dan, welcome back to the show.
5:00
It's been a while, Jeff.
5:03
It has been a while since that I don't even remember.
5:06
It's been so long I don't remember and I should have looked it up, but it's been a couple
5:09
of years it feels like, yeah?
5:11
Since you've had me on the show, yes, and of course we saw each other in Vegas and we
5:16
ran into each other, the Dallas airport.
5:19
The airport randomly and prior to that, it had been a long time since we've seen each
5:23
other, but for those who aren't familiar with who you are and what you do, what do you
5:28
want to tell them?
5:29
So I'm currently I'm CEO of and head trader for a company called University of Options.
5:38
We started that in about 2018 and it's grown really fast because of mortgage coach slash
5:46
trust engine.
5:48
I'm their chief economist going back to 08 and recorded, I guess at this point thousands
5:57
of videos and so lots of people got to know me and I got out of the mortgage industry
6:05
I think in 17 and then it's been just really fun since then.
6:12
Well for people who do know you, you have had for many years this product called ratewatch,
6:18
right?
6:19
Is that still in existence?
6:22
Yeah, really what that's come down to is it's an app which is actually owned by mortgage
6:30
coach.
6:31
I'm more like the spokesman I guess and then every morning I do the daily video which
6:37
goes into the ratewatch app and also I posted on five or six different Facebook groups.
6:44
Got it and so you're looking at the market every day, both stock market, interest rates and
6:49
all that kind of stuff and kind of giving your forecast.
6:52
You and I haven't prepared for this as this is how I usually fly.
6:57
So whenever I hear somebody talk about interest rates, you know that's a hard thing to forecast.
7:06
Here it comes, how would you score your accuracy of that?
7:13
You've been doing this since like, oh, eight, you said, yeah, well, there's a saying
7:20
a broken watch is right.
7:24
So I've never been wrong ever, ever, you make a four time way for it to come to you.
7:32
There you go, man.
7:33
Yep.
7:34
What's wrong with that?
7:35
Well said.
7:36
Well said.
7:37
The tough question I apologize, but it really just makes me curious.
7:40
Last question.
7:41
In fact, usually I'll follow on my sword before you can ask me.
7:46
So you know, recently I was with David Todd.
7:51
And I did boldly say that I actually believe the fourth quarter to the first somewhere in
7:57
that point and I gave all the reasons why and as a as a prognosticator, you learn to
8:05
be clear that there are certain things that have to happen for your forecast to be right.
8:10
So because we're factoring in GDP, we're factoring unemployment, we're factoring inflation,
8:17
we're factoring manufacturing, consumer balance sheets, money supply, so all of the stuff
8:27
factors in to, you know, to our forecast.
8:31
And so if a couple of things don't hit when you think they will, then you're going to
8:37
be wrong, at least for a while.
8:39
And for me, the, the economy just doesn't want to stop.
8:46
It's people, you know, we read that people are doing worse and it's harder and all that
8:53
stuff for them.
8:55
But basically if you look at retail sales and GDP and job growth and all that stuff, it's
9:00
continued well beyond any reasonable scenario.
9:05
And now we're beginning to see it now and jobs are always a last to go.
9:10
So now we're beginning to see job slip, consumer confidence, a slipping, deflation starts
9:15
becoming a concern, believe it or not.
9:18
So all the things that I feared would happen, they're coming, and I was just early.
9:24
Oh, what do you mean, they're, we feared to happen are coming, give us some examples.
9:31
Titer labor market, so job losses, job losses for sure, decreases in retail sales, those
9:41
are, you know, the big things, consumer spending, tomorrow we get the consumer spending
9:46
numbers, which are big, they, they're called PCE, which is personal consumption expenditures.
9:52
And that's a number of the Fed watch is much more than CPI.
9:56
So, okay.
9:59
So we saw the Fed do their first round of cuts, about a week or two ago, 50 basis points.
10:05
And then there's some chatter coming after that, such as they think inflation is too low.
10:10
And then there's the chatter about like they're going to be more aggressive with their rate
10:14
cuts.
10:15
Like what the hell's really going on?
10:16
Can you like, you know, clear the air a little bit about what you think moving forward
10:20
is going to happen?
10:22
Yeah.
10:23
So, personally, you know, for all of my loan officer friends, I'm glad that he cut a half.
10:30
But it, my opinion was too much.
10:34
And my weekly video this last week, I shared with all the reasons, they're, the condition
10:41
of money, like, like financial conditions index is the looser it's been since the 60s
10:50
while the Fed made a cut.
10:52
So only one time, 60 years ago, were the financial conditions that we deal with every day.
10:57
And it's, it's an index has a lot of stuff built into it.
11:01
It has never, well, one only one time has it been doing this well and the Fed cut.
11:07
So, so that was where that he, that he cut a half.
11:10
There were plenty of things that I believe he should have tempered that.
11:14
And you're seeing rates are not doing well since the half cut.
11:20
So, bond investors are.
11:36
And because on markets short, the Fed can only control the short end.
11:42
Fed funds rate.
11:43
And Fed funds rate will influence like the one year and two year treasuries.
11:47
Fine.
11:48
He has no influence up here on, on the long end of the yield curve, like, you know, 10 year
11:54
and 30 year.
11:55
The only way he's ever been able to influence that is QE, remember that quantitative easing.
12:01
And he was buying mortgages and he was buying treasuries.
12:05
He realized no matter what I do here, these guys do their own thing.
12:11
And so right now, bonds are clearly telling him a half was too much.
12:17
I don't trust you and I'm my one higher rates right now.
12:21
So really?
12:22
Yeah.
12:23
So a quarter would have been healthier and that's what I had told people.
12:28
Well, and so you're only the second person that I'm aware of who has said the same thing.
12:36
And yet there's all that external pressure.
12:39
You know, they say that that it's not a political position or whatever.
12:43
I mean, but you know, we got affordability issues, right?
12:45
All that kind of stuff.
12:46
Yeah.
12:48
So that's very interesting to think that that was the wrong move.
12:53
And so where do we go from?
12:54
It was weird coming from him because Powell's never been a Fed to surprise anybody.
13:01
You know, he's been known to be very slow and very methodical in his moves.
13:05
So I have to say it was just a surprise.
13:09
So some people, some of the chat I read was like, you know, we didn't see a huge relief
13:13
in interest rates because it was already kind of pre-baked in based on the talking we
13:16
heard.
13:17
True.
13:18
But then you saw them come out recently and talk about more aggressive cuts to come.
13:23
So are we expecting to see additional reduction in rates following future Fed cuts?
13:28
Yes.
13:29
Yeah.
13:30
The feds are seeing things that not every consumer can see.
13:36
Sure.
13:37
And when we come up to the next Fed meeting, if he aggressively cuts again, and we know
13:43
he's really concerned, whether he he voices those concerns or not, he did definitely
13:51
reference labor market slowing.
13:54
Yeah.
13:55
But is not I wanted right?
13:56
They tried to break the employment market.
13:58
Yes.
13:59
No.
14:00
Because the Fed's number one charter actually is monitoring and managing full employment
14:08
for the country.
14:09
That's like one of their main charters.
14:12
So the problem is this is a really challenge.
14:20
The Fed should stay out of everything.
14:26
They really are the worst.
14:29
And they don't mean to be critical, you know, at the human level, Paul's nice guy, I think.
14:34
But they have always been too late to cut.
14:40
If you look back in like, oh, five, oh six, things were really starting to cook.
14:46
The housing market was on fire.
14:48
And the Fed just decided inflation is a problem.
14:52
So the Fed started raising rates before the market crashed really.
14:59
There's always been a I think a wrong a false understanding that low employment and an
15:08
active economy equals inflation.
15:10
Hmm.
15:11
Wow.
15:12
It sounds healthy to me.
15:13
It never has.
15:14
This economy, good job market has never brought us inflation.
15:19
Inflation comes from too many people chasing too few goods.
15:25
Right.
15:26
Hmm.
15:27
It's interesting.
15:28
Yeah.
15:29
That was like Milton Friedman, you know, growing up as an economist, you can out here
15:35
in some Friedman.
15:36
Yeah.
15:37
Yeah.
15:38
He's amazing.
15:39
But it's very simple, right?
15:40
Too many people chasing too few goods.
15:43
Now look at what happened.
15:45
We stopped making everything and then we locked people in their room and then we stuffed
15:54
their pockets full of money.
15:57
And now you have people like going crazy, the rage spending was that was the word we
16:02
used back then they have pockets full of money.
16:05
They're bored to death.
16:08
And so they go out and they buy, but there's nothing to buy.
16:13
How manufacturing shut off all around the world?
16:16
Ships were stuck in ports and freight costs went to the roof.
16:20
It was taking some of the ships like eight, 12 weeks just to get to the dock and then there
16:25
was no place to put the trailers.
16:27
Right.
16:28
So once they started trying to gear up, it was too late.
16:33
You had too many people chasing too few goods or actually too many people chasing no goods.
16:41
Right.
16:42
Well, the inflation and when Powell said it's transitional, yeah, it is.
16:47
It always has been how long till the transition.
16:51
That's really the question.
16:52
Well, and that's like, you know, what we have in the housing market too as well, right?
16:55
Too many people chasing too few goods.
16:57
There's no inventory.
16:58
Exactly.
16:59
Exactly.
17:00
And so that's driven up price, obviously.
17:02
All right.
17:03
So that's an interesting geek out conversation.
17:04
I want to talk about the other thing you do as well, which I'm very intrigued with
17:07
so loan officers, whoever's listening right now, this is an opportunity.
17:11
I believe in multiple streams of income when possible, right?
17:14
It's important to have focus and yet we're in this business that can be cyclical and
17:19
I think we need to also consider, hey, how do I backfill those, those, those ups and downs
17:23
or can, how am I adding to my total portfolio, my retirement portfolio, right?
17:28
And I remember when I ran into the airport a couple of years ago, you're telling me
17:32
about what you're doing with the University of Options, which is like Forex trading with
17:36
proprietary FX bots, like what did he just say?
17:42
Like could you tell me that again?
17:44
So let's, let's jam on this for a second.
17:46
Tell me about what you're doing with University of Options.
17:51
What is that?
17:52
Okay.
17:53
So the original product was we taught people how to trade options and then once they had
18:02
enough knowledge, they could come into a live trading room with myself or with one of
18:07
our traders and literally we're calling out trades.
18:10
So they're seeing my screen and I'm saying, all right, if the price crosses this, I'm
18:16
going in and I'm buying that.
18:19
And so we say we're going in, remember it goes in, we say we're coming out, and remember
18:23
it comes out.
18:25
It's been really a successful program.
18:27
There's a lot more to what I just said and then just the live trading room.
18:33
And then we started teaching people how to trade futures.
18:39
There are tons of leverage in trading futures.
18:42
So for instance, for $500 account, you could pretty easily make a couple hundred a day.
18:54
It just doesn't take much capital to trade futures.
18:57
So then while this was going on, we started building bots.
19:02
So we have these auto traders that we tell people on the future side, the forex bots are
19:11
a different story.
19:12
But on trading futures, we tell people that use the auto trader as an auto pilot.
19:19
Don't just turn it on and then go away and leave it alone.
19:23
That's not a best practice for what I'm talking about for the futures.
19:28
Futures, when you turn the bottom, make sure you're sitting at your desk just so you can
19:32
watch it monitor it, et cetera.
19:35
So then from the futures, we recently launched a product called Flight Paths and we worked
19:46
on this technology for like two years.
19:48
And what the technology allows us to do is take my trades.
19:53
So you know, I've been doing this a long time, I'm a pretty good trader and places them
19:58
in our members account.
20:00
So literally the member can be doing whatever he wants and he'll see, oh, Dan just opened
20:04
a trade on his account because his trade.
20:09
So I place one trade with a daily goal of $100 with one contract.
20:16
That's what takes 500 in capital.
20:19
And that trade is executed across currently now about 300 accounts.
20:26
And they can trade as much as they want.
20:29
So for futures, you trade in what's called contracts.
20:32
So just think of a contract as a share of stock.
20:35
You can buy one, you can buy 10, you can buy 100.
20:39
We just need to know for every contract you trade, you should have $500 in cash.
20:46
So that's not much to prohibit somebody.
20:49
So I'm trading one because it's psychologically extremely simple to wake up in the morning
20:55
and know I just have to make $100.
20:58
Because the stress of doing this right now, it's unbelievable.
21:03
Like I didn't think I would feel this performance anxiety, but now that I have 300 people literally
21:11
benefiting or not from each trade I take, but the $100 daily goal is very simple.
21:19
It doesn't stress me out.
21:21
And so I trade one contract, they could trade 10.
21:25
We have members of trade 50.
21:28
So 10 contracts, if I'm making $100 in your trading 10 contracts, that's $1,000 a day.
21:35
And that's extremely realistic.
21:39
And how much time would that take from somebody like me, right, to do that?
21:43
So this is the deal in theory, almost no time at all.
21:49
If you turn it on in the morning and then we tell you usually to turn it off around 10
21:53
a.m.
21:54
Because we don't want your your bot running all day long.
21:57
And I take trades that don't necessarily want to take for hundreds of people.
22:01
So what we want people to learn, some of the terminology, we want to learn a little bit
22:10
about futures, so we sell the replicator with the futures trading program.
22:19
So you can start learning, learning the terminology, set it into your account, learn about how
22:25
to set up your simulator accounts, because we like everybody start on a simulator.
22:30
And then fire up the replicator, but we're finding it's just a lot more fun all around
22:37
if people first learn a little bit about trading before we just throw them in the replicator.
22:42
They're just lost and confused and scared otherwise.
22:46
Yeah.
22:48
So this is much more, well, I mean, it's a combination of active and passive, right?
22:52
Because you've got these bots and things like that and people are essentially executing
22:55
the same trades you are sort of a pseudo look over my shoulder thing, but it's done for
23:00
you.
23:01
Right?
23:02
Yep.
23:03
Hmm.
23:04
I'm reading you're good.
23:06
I finally found the share button, so we can show you a couple of slides if you want
23:11
about what we're talking about.
23:12
Yeah.
23:13
Yeah.
23:14
I'm reading your testimonials and stuff.
23:16
And I guess so there's two things we talked about options and futures, right?
23:20
Yep.
23:22
So for those that need a quick comparison on what is an option versus a future, right?
23:28
Like layman's terms.
23:30
So they're very similar.
23:34
They're both sort of derivative products off something else, but options options are cool
23:41
and the reason we started with options is the leverage.
23:44
So again, if you buy, if you wanted to buy 100 shares of Starbucks right now, then you
23:52
need to have that $10, $97,000, or just 100 shares.
24:01
So with options, you could do the same thing with probably $3 an option, $300 a contract
24:13
probably and a contract in the options world controls 100 shares of stock.
24:19
So you just can do so much more with so little capital.
24:23
And there's other byproducts of options that we teach that are really helpful for people
24:29
for managing their longer portfolios.
24:32
So an option is like you take a stock and the stock usually has options that trade with
24:39
it.
24:40
So instead of trading individual shares of stock, we're buying an option's contract,
24:45
let's say for $200 and we're selling it for $300.
24:50
And that takes very little capital.
24:54
Futures are different because they're more like tied to the NASDAQ or tied to gold or
25:02
tied to oil, they're not tied to a stock.
25:07
But they still do trade in contracts and the contracts do require very little capital.
25:12
Arth.
25:13
And I don't want to confuse that with commodities.
25:16
That's something different, right?
25:17
Like coffee and commodities are closer to futures for sure.
25:21
Yeah.
25:22
Like if you saw trading places, you can get a warning that orange juice market, right?
25:29
Those they're really trading futures, they're trading orange juice futures.
25:33
So as a mortgage professional listening, and I know you've got some clients who are
25:36
mortgage professionals because I'm reading your testimonials on the website.
25:40
Most of them are because that's a lot of people who know you.
25:43
What for those that are hearing this, they're like, that's interesting.
25:48
How can I possibly, because I got to go originate mortgages.
25:51
So how can I possibly add this to my investment strategy?
25:54
What advice or direction would you give them?
26:00
It's more of an income generating strategy than an investment strategy.
26:06
So the idea is to try to generate as much income as we can with as little as capital as
26:10
possible.
26:12
Like that.
26:13
But when you're a member, like, you know, I do a nightly market update, not bond, but stock.
26:19
You're going to learn so much about the broader markets and what drives things.
26:23
And I just, I love it.
26:25
When I look at our chat board, I'll say, I'll see something like, yeah, that was a liquidity
26:29
grab.
26:30
And this guy didn't know what liquidity was, you know, three weeks ago.
26:35
And that just makes me feel super good.
26:39
We just, we're really conservative.
26:42
We ask everybody to start on a simulator and start with just one small contract.
26:47
We have a whole plan to gear up.
26:49
So as you start trading bigger, remember, I said, I'm trading one one contract to make
26:53
$100.
26:54
Let's say they want to trade 10 contracts to make $1,000.
26:57
Right.
26:58
I don't want them to turn on their computer day one and putting in a 10 contract, you
27:03
know, a size, it's, it's just too scary.
27:07
So start with one contract and I'll, I'll make you a minimum of 500 a week.
27:14
And then so within, let's say, three weeks, you'll have 1500.
27:19
Along with your original 500, now add the second contract.
27:24
Now you can trade two contracts, which takes 1,000 capital, but you're going to make
27:28
money twice as fast now, you're going to make 200 today.
27:32
So that's, that's something where I can, like I said, in terms of time requirement.
27:36
Yes, there's the initial learning curve and you want to, you want, you want to understand
27:40
what you're getting involved in, right?
27:43
But, but are, am I executing trades actually myself or that's happening through your system?
27:47
You will be taught how to do that.
27:49
You'll be given the, the, the bots that will do that for you.
27:53
Okay.
27:54
So that's all you really need to do is, is let me run the replicator for you.
28:04
Well, you know, I mean, look at terminology.
28:07
So the reason why I want to have this conversation, it goes back to what I kind of set up as we
28:10
transitioned into this part of the conversation, which was income, right?
28:14
And backfill and the cycles and the ups and downs and, you know, I'm definitely all, like
28:18
I said, all one for you, focus on what, what you, you know, the key drivers, the key needle
28:24
movers that are going to impact your business as an originator on a real estate agent, if
28:28
you're listening to this.
28:30
And we know what those are.
28:31
And so a lot of you just need to go do that, by the way, I mean, right, truth be told,
28:37
right?
28:38
I mean, you know, this is a business owner.
28:40
I just came out of two days on site with Alex Hermosi where they do this and be a very
28:44
interesting thing for you to check out is two days intensive.
28:48
You go through LTV, CAC, you know, all this kind of stuff.
28:52
And you know, the big question is what's, what's the main constraint in your business?
28:57
And most, most business owners work on a lot of things in their business, but usually
29:01
it's not the thing they should work on, right?
29:04
Totally.
29:05
To grow sales and to, you know, be more profitable, et cetera.
29:08
And so that's my message to everybody listening right now is, you know, keep the main thing,
29:12
the main thing.
29:13
But Dan's platform, which, you know, I've been following now for two plus years.
29:19
And if you know anything about Dan, very intelligent understanding the markets and all that kind
29:22
of stuff, like if I was going to put my trust in, yeah, man, I got some, I can play around
29:27
with some money, you know what I mean?
29:29
To, to create additional leveraged income and it's only going to take me maybe a couple
29:32
hours a day.
29:33
If I'm following you correctly.
29:34
Is that correct?
29:35
Yeah.
29:36
Even a couple hours a day.
29:37
Yeah.
29:38
So that's why I'm bringing this to the surface guys and gals that are listening is, I think
29:42
it's something that might be for some of you, not for all of you, but for some of you.
29:48
And so we're going to put a link in the show notes and all that kind of stuff to go check
29:50
out.
29:51
UniversityofOptions.com.
29:52
There's a lot of great content on there.
29:55
But I, you know, I just want to make it clear that I'm not saying, oh, you should get
30:00
out of originating mortgages or whatever, you know, but I mean, if you can add an extra,
30:05
like let me just read a couple of these, I was on here.
30:09
Okay.
30:10
So this one, a couple of testimonials here, and you guys can go read these yourselves.
30:15
Like whoever this was, $27,000, like within two months, it looks like maybe three months.
30:23
What else we got here?
30:24
I'm up $700.
30:25
You know, what I like about this, here's another one, up a little over $1,000 last week,
30:31
up $3,000 so far this week.
30:35
What I like about it is we're not talking crypto type numbers, you know, we keep it conservative
30:43
and believable.
30:44
Yeah.
30:45
Yeah.
30:46
Exactly.
30:47
Believable and achievable.
30:48
And so anyway, this is just, there's, I get nothing for this, everybody, like there's
30:52
no like, you know, all money on the backside of this or anything like that.
30:57
So I think you should go check it out.
30:59
That's all I have to say.
31:00
Now, knowing that our audience is largely loan officers before we close out, anything
31:04
else contextually, you would want to tell people who are suggest, who are considering
31:11
learning more about this platform.
31:14
Well, there's, there's a benefit here that, you know, we haven't talked about, but understanding
31:23
the markets, it opens up so many doors.
31:27
So let me give you an example.
31:30
Real companies, if they're holding a thousand barrels of oil, let's say, for distribution,
31:37
do they have any price risk by holding that oil?
31:41
They do.
31:42
You know, let's say they pay $80 a barrel and then oil falls to 40, they're hosed.
31:50
They lost half of their net worth by the oil sitting in their, in their yard.
31:55
So what do they do?
31:56
They buy oil in the futures market.
31:59
That way, if oil does drop, they make a killing on their futures investment.
32:05
That's a hedge.
32:06
So just like your secondary marketing guy, he gets a loan and he hedges it.
32:11
Just in case rates go down, that would be terrible.
32:14
You know, they're sitting on a loan, they're having to pay you X and then all of a sudden
32:18
the loan is worth less.
32:21
So one of the strategies that I've done and taught, think about the peak crazy of this industry,
32:29
is that 22, 21, well, why was it so crazy?
32:35
Well, it was so crazy because rates were so low.
32:39
Now what if you were to have purchased bonds back when rates were that low?
32:53
It's actually, there's actually a security called TLT, which is fun.
32:57
It's like a stock, just like the stock, but it actually tracks with bonds.
33:05
So TLT back a couple of years ago was running like $147 a share and we taught our members
33:19
to sell short.
33:21
Because when things are that great, it's because rates are that low and it's going to change.
33:26
And so the more rates fell, the more wealth was built in our members that actually had pre-sold
33:33
into the bond market.
33:36
It's your hedging your career instead of just hedging your portfolio.
33:42
It's just kind of an example, I know it's all confusing.
33:46
And then again, it's the community is amazing, I've never seen anything like it.
33:53
Our whole team, every one of our teammates, I think we have 14 or so now, and they've
33:58
all come up through members.
34:01
And so it sounds like almost tried and overused, but it really is a family.
34:06
It's like the members really develop friendships and I love it.
34:10
All here that these two guys met up when they were in Vegas and they never knew each other.
34:15
So look at the minimum, yeah, at a minimum, I think somebody should check it out, right?
34:21
Because if you're smart, you're always looking for strategies for creating income or assets,
34:27
right?
34:28
And of course, additional income helps fill in the gaps when there are some market cycles.
34:31
So we'll put a link in the show notes once again, your universityofoptions.com.
34:35
But Dan, I know you're busy and it's a little bit of a crazy day there and I thank you
34:39
so much for taking time out from your day.
34:41
Hey, I hope you enjoyed this episode and got some education.
34:44
Check out the links in the show notes and we'll see you on the next one.