Latest / The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten / If Your Husband Takes Over The Emotional And The Physical Labor... Why?

Transcript

If Your Husband Takes Over The Emotional And The Physical Labor... Why? · The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten

• 0:05
  Hi everybody, and welcome to the Doctor Psych Mom show.
• 0:09
  Today we're going to be talking about how men now are,
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  especially young men, are supposed to be doing the
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  physical labor and the emotional labor and frequently this just
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  flips the entire script such that women really do not have
• 0:25
  much left to do it all and why this just doesn't really work
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  and is not a palatable or you know, effective long term
• 0:35
  solution for marital distress. We will get to that as soon as I
• 0:38
  tell you to subscribe. Most recent subscriber episode
• 0:41
  was why women Dream About their exes and there is over probably
• 0:45
  145 others by now. And so please do subscribe, join
• 0:49
  my Facebook group to follow me on all social media and yeah,
• 0:54
  that is what you should be doing.
• 0:56
  So anyway, I see a lot of young guys, they haven't drilled into
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  them that the woman is not supposed to do quote emotional
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  labor. And I've talked about emotional
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  labor and how I think that that's bullshit in many regards.
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  And people are just anything that you don't want to do now is
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  a called emotional labor. And some of it you don't have to
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  do, you don't want to do and you don't have to do.
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  So, for example, you know Christmas cards, you don't have
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  to. And if you don't want to, why
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  does he have to? Why does anybody have to, you
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  know, or emotional labor of talking to family members?
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  Or a recent one I saw was on having to put the child in the
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  clothes that were bought by a family member when the family
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  member visits. I didn't even know that that was
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  like a thing. And if you if certainly if I
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  remembered to do that, I would be so proud of myself, I would
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  definitely want the credit for it for sure.
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  And that's what the interesting thing is to me is like.
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  So if men become the one who does all of as much emotional
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  labor as possible and as much physical childcare as possible,
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  which it seems to be is very much the trend, you know, to do
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  bedtime bath time frequently solo, then what does the woman
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  do? You know?
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  So, and especially because rates of depression are higher in
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  women than they are in men, and I'm the 1st to say that I see it
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  all in my practice, I've struggled with depression.
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  Here's the thing about depression.
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  If you don't do anything, especially if you don't do
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  anything useful, it gets worse. So the bad thing that I see is
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  that a lot of women are being freed up by the man doing all
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  the emotional labor and all the physical labor to do nothing, to
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  lay down because they don't feel good or because they are a
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  highly sensitive person who needs recharge time.
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  I'm a highly sensitive person too.
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  I understand people need recharge time.
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  I understand that it's great to take a break and healthy the
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  break should not be the whole night, right?
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  And I'm seeing this happen more and more, and I have a podcast
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  about it. Are there really men who do
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  everything? Yeah, they are.
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  And that's also called enabling. So there are these videos by
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  these younger men on the Internet that where they're
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  trying to take off all the emotional labor from her.
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  And they're very they congratulate themselves by
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  saying, oh, I figured out everything to do.
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  So I can do all of everything that the kid eats.
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  I know everything that the kid needs.
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  I know everything. They can wear everything.
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  They could do everything at school.
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  I in fact have put myself to be the emergency contact so that
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  she is not bothered. And then and it's like what does
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  she do? Well, she does macro level kind
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  of decision making like where does the kid go to camp?
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  So how is this better? First of all, what is she doing
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  with her evening? But second of all, like this has
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  then swung the other direction. You know, we used to be in the
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  father's knows best kind of era in the 50s.
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  The man would say, oh, I think our son should go to this
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  boarding school and that was like pretty much his involvement
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  And she did all the day-to-day bullshit of making him
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  sandwiches and getting him, you know, doctor's appointments.
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  So now that's supposed to be the guy and the woman is supposed to
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  do all the macro level stuff. That doesn't make sense.
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  How does that make sense? It's still not in any way part
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  partners, you know those two people are not both respected
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  the same amount. You know.
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  So now and and I see it because a lot of couples will tell me
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  that the kid says, oh, I know like who the boss is.
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  The boss is mommy. How is that better than saying
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  the boss is daddy, which everybody knows is bad.
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  Now everybody knows that's bad. You shouldn't say the boss is
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  daddy. Why is it better to say the boss
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  is mommy? It's not So I see more and more
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  that it's flipping. You know, like the pendulum
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  swings and all sociological trends.
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  And now the man is up doing a lot of the shit work and isn't
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  allowed to make real executive executive decisions, but makes
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  executive decisions now to the level of what should the child
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  have for snack? Because that shit is boring and
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  she doesn't care, so she doesn't want to engage on it.
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  She wants to pick out like, you know, what are the fun family
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  activities we do? Where's the child go to school?
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  Where's the child go to camp and in terms of, you know, packing
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  the lunch box, you don't give a shit.
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  Nobody wants to do it. So now he does it.
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  And so how is that any better, right?
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  That's no better. If one person is in charge of
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  the macro interesting decision making stuff, the autonomous
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  agentic things that make you feel, you know like a like a
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  worthwhile person with a brain and then one person's only
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  supposed to be a set of hands. Why?
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  How is it better for one gender to be, for a different gender,
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  to be the set of hands? That doesn't make any sense.
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  And so and also the same emotional labour.
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  Now he is trying to take over her emotional labour by guessing
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  and mind reading what she considers to be emotionally
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  laborious, not being able to make his own decisions about it
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  still. So now he is put in the one down
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  role, whereas the woman used to be in the one down role.
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  You know, oh, we all have to be quiet when daddy comes home from
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  work because daddy wants to relax.
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  How is that different? I see that exact same thing in a
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  lot of the younger couples. I see that they got to be quiet
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  because Mommy needs to relax. Okay.
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  Kids can learn to be quiet sometimes, so that a parent can
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  relax. But if one parent's mental
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  health and need for quiet and solitude is always taking
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  precedence, and the other person is always managing the children
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  such that the other person doesn't get triggered or upset,
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  that's not a good situation. No matter whether we call it
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  what a man deserves when he gets home from work, or whether we
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  call it what a highly sensitive woman needs to recharge, it
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  doesn't matter. Because still, it's one person
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  is calling all of the shots and the other person is wrangling
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  the children and trying to keep them away from the other person
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  who they are, enabling to be kind of more difficult because
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  they're always getting that in any way that they're difficult.
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  The other person is trying to allow them to continue being
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  difficult in that way. So if the woman needs to lay
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  down for an hour in the evenings, that is usually
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  depression, you know, that usually is is there's something
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  wrong there. If you cannot get through your
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  evening without retreating for an hour of it, that's a problem,
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  right? Because think about he can't do
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  that. So in these households, he can't
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  do that. And again, sure, if he is more
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  physically strong and physically competent, great, that's
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  wonderful. It's really nice for him to pick
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  up the slack. If it were understood as that.
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  If that were considered, wow, that's awesome.
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  I'm the luckiest woman in the world.
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  However instead it's he's just basically doing the baseline and
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  I still do the high level management which is why I'm so
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  stressed out all the time. And of course goes without
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  saying that this couple is not having sex.
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  I mean it doesn't even, you don't even have to say it just
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  so obvious. And of course when you ask, it
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  is obvious they they do not have sex, but and that is because sex
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  is something for him and everything that is done for him
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  is bad. And I mean that is where things
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  are swinging, you know, that is truly where things are swinging.
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  Not in all couples of course, but in the younger, more
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  liberal, educated couples. This is what I see.
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  And that is that's the truth. And it it can't be right.
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  It can't be right because it wouldn't be right if it was the
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  woman for any woman. That said, my husband gets home
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  from work and he has to lay down for an hour while I try to do
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  all the stuff for dinner and bedtime and bath.
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  And then he comes out and he picks which of the things that
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  this is like normal on social media.
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  This is like great, Like if the man, the man lets her pick which
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  chore she wants to do, so then she always gets the one that she
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  wants to do. That's very nice if it was
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  appreciated, but it's somehow it's become the default that
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  that's that he should do the one that sucks more because why?
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  Because I guess he's a man. I don't know why.
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  So he does it and she gets to always pick the thing that she
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  would rather do. So she if if anybody said my
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  husband has to get home from work, he has to lay down for an
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  hour, then we get up and he picks which of the things he
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  wants to do with the kids, people would be like dump his
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  ass, What an asshole, what a Neanderthal, you know?
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  Doesn't he understand that we've, you know, things are
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  equal now, but yet I hear this as something very similar a lot.
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  And I say, but how is this in any way Even?
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  How is this one equal? And And sometimes it's really
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  not even interrogated because the woman feels so overwhelmed.
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  She seems to think that there needs to be some sort of
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  restitution made because she feels so overwhelmed.
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  It must be such an overwhelming situation, which he should then
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  help with. So that's where the logical
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  fallacy comes in. If you feel overwhelmed, that
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  doesn't not mean that something unjust is happening.
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  You can interrogate how you feel too and think.
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  Am I depressed? Am I anxious?
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  Is something wrong with me? That I find the normative
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  routine of a family to be massively overwhelming and I
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  need my husband to take over 3/4 of it minimum.
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  I mean that that is the truth. And it would be like a guy
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  saying I have to drink because this house is so crazy, these
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  kids are so loud, I have to drink every night.
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  Women would be like, that's a lie.
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  That's not true. But you know you have an alcohol
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  problem. You got to go get your alcohol
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  problem treated because and stop blaming this family.
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  Well, it's exactly the same thing.
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  If a woman says that she constantly feels so overwhelmed
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  that she cannot engage with the family as much as the guy can,
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  that's the thing to interrogate within her.
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  That's not a structural problem. The structural problem in her
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  family has already been obviated by him taking on the lion's
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  share of the stuff. She remains feeling overwhelmed.
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  That is an internal problem that's a depression, anxiety
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  problem even. And and there's certainly people
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  that try antidepressants and try therapy and it doesn't work.
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  But there's more people that don't even try it because it
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  does work for many therapy and medication and or it work for a
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  lot of people that don't even try it because they are framing
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  their issue with some sort of social gender issue and not
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  saying why do I feel so overwhelmed by something that
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  I'm expecting my husband not to feel overwhelmed by.
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  And I mean that. That is the question.
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  The question is why do I consistently feel unhappy,
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  Overwhelmed. Never want to have sex.
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  Never want to be intimate. Feel like every day is hard.
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  If you feel like every day is hard, you know?
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  And it's not like that you have a newborn baby or somebody just
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  died or you know you are in fact solo parenting for weeks because
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  your husband is traveling. You have no help.
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  Or it's like a real fire drill at work and you're an accountant
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  and you're coming up to April 15th.
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  Like, if this is just like the normal way that you feel is that
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  everything is hard or everything in family life is hard and there
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  is never a break and you never catch a break.
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  And no matter how much you give to your husband, you still feel
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  like you are responsible for the majority of all of the things in
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  the home or the upper level management of of things like
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  having to give him a list for the grocery.
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  Remember, you're the one who wants the stuff on the list.
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  So it's it's funny because sometimes the guy will get it.
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  He knows what he wants to eat, he knows what the kids want to
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  eat, but he doesn't know what she wants to eat because he's
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  not inside her head and frequent.
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  So. So for example, he'll go and get
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  all the stuff from from the store and she'll say no because
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  I don't like this and I don't like this and in fact I don't
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  want the kids to eat this or this even though they like it.
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  And so basically she goes and corrects it and says that he
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  didn't do a good job grocery shopping.
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  But Can you imagine? In the inverse, you don't really
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  have to imagine, because it was how things were years ago which
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  was equivalently on fair and LED to the way that things are now,
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  which has now swung the complete opposite direction.
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  But so that the woman goes grocery shopping, the man looks
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  in the fridge and says I don't like this, I don't like that.
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  You know what? You really shouldn't buy all
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  that garbage for the children. People would be up in arms.
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  You know, people would be like, what a Dick.
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  Why doesn't he just go grocery shopping then?
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  If he doesn't, you know, if he doesn't like stuff, you know,
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  fuck him. She's trying to.
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  She's trying to run the house. And does she have to know what
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  he likes? You know, if he changed what he
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  likes or if he liked a different sandwich, meat or whatever,
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  like, And why is he criticizing what she's doing for the
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  children? She's the one who went.
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  But think about how it would be now in the gender inverse.
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  He went to the grocery store. He should know what she wants to
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  eat. All he would have to do is
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  observe. It meanwhile, changes, like all
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  the time. Like anybody, any adult you know
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  likes to eat different things at different times.
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  Different things are in the season, what have you, you know?
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  And the kids, certainly he can know what the kids will eat.
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  Plus their kids, if that's in their lunch box, that's what
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  they're going to eat. But he didn't do it well enough,
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  because he didn't know this or that about the health, or about
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  this or or whatever she prefers. So it's turned into that.
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  It used to be that a woman dancing around to do whatever
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  the man preferred was bad. 100% agree no human being should do
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  that. Should be like the kind of slave
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  dancing around to make the other person happy and never getting
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  it exactly right and and protecting the other person from
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  having any sort of stress or anything.
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  But then of course it shouldn't be the other way either, right?
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  It shouldn't be that the man has to do that for the woman.
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  So what's happened is that because it was so bad when the
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  guy was in charge and acting very condescending and all of
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  that and you know, wait till your father gets home type of
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  thing that he's the head of household, you know.
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  Now it's switched the other way and it's equivalently unfair,
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  right. It's equivalently one person
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  just never really gets to rest because they are always try,
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  they're walking on egg shells around a difficult other person.
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  This is of course, not all couples, you know, obviously.
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  But this is a trend that I see. And if it resonates with you, it
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  would be time to get into couples counseling, right?
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  Because this is not going to go well.
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  And in particularly is not going to go well because there's a
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  complete absence of any affection because it turns into
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  that one is the boss and that one is the employee.
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  And that just does not really make for an affectionate loving,
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  certainly not sexual relationship.
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  Which is finally when some of the guys do come into couples
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  counseling and they don't even say anything about the imbalance
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  that's in the home or the fact that they never get to make
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  decisions or that they don't get to pick what emotional labor
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  even is. They just have to, you know,
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  execute it now based on whatever she thinks.
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  They do say though I haven't had sex in five months.
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  I mean they do say that. So you know it.
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  Don't wait until that point. If this sort of dynamic
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  characterizes your relationship, there are multiple things to do.
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  One of them is couples counselling.
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  One of them could be thinking more clearly.
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  Wait, hold on a second. Why does she get so upset by
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  everything, you know? I mean, is that normal?
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  You know, is is that truly a sociological condition, the way
• 16:46
  that she thinks? Or is she maybe depressed?
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  You know, when I think about it, should she really be sleeping
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  that much? You know, I don't know.
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  I mean, she she she seems to be unhappy, like, all the time.
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  Is she supposed to be unhappy all the time?
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  You know, probably not. Huh.
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  Maybe it's not what I think. Maybe it's not that I haven't
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  memorized the the emotional labour needs well enough.
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  Maybe she's depressed, maybe she's anxious, maybe she's
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  postpartum. And in that case, certainly
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  getting into couples counselling would help because a therapist
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  will be able to spot that and and and say what of her
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  behaviour is depression, what is anxiety and what is.
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  Maybe you really don't split as much of the shit as you think
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  you do. Maybe you may.
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  Maybe it is very important for her to, you know, tell you what
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  to do and when to do it because you have terrible ADHD and you
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  don't remember what to do. I mean, who knows?
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  But anyway, this could be a good one to think about, a different
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  way to think about a dynamic and certainly a trend that I have
• 17:46
  spotted and I hope you found it interesting.
• 17:48
  I'll talk to you all soon. Have a great day.