Latest / Auto Collabs / Customer Facing Implications with John Clavadetscher

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Customer Facing Implications with John Clavadetscher · Auto Collabs

• 0:00
  Kyle, I'm gonna let you say his name. [laughs] [upbeat music] This is Auto Collabs. [laughs] Oh, no.
• 0:16
  So we, uh, yeah, sometimes, sometimes we start a pod and we don't know we've started a pod, which is what Paul just did right now. And I'm gonna attempt- [laughs]... to say John Clavinetscher's- We'll go with that...
• 0:28
  uh, last name. That's good. Strong. We're, we're really excited to, to have him on today.
• 0:32
  And, you know, uh, the, one of the things that you have to do when you haven't met s- someone, uh, in person or, or throughout the industry, is you kinda gotta do the old, "Hey, I've looked at his LinkedIn perusal."
• 0:44
  Right. And what I'm really excited about with the conversation with John is kind of diving into the fact that, you know, he was early on with cars.com, and Vedder, and the whole team there.
• 0:56
  And then has taken this brief hiatus outside of automotive, which I think is a really distinct advantage for him coming back into automotive, understanding kind of the dynamics of retail and, and, and advertising and all of that.
• 1:09
  And so I'm just interested to kinda see w- the way he ties together the dots on, you know, his legacy, uh, understanding of the business, the, the, uh, the outside, uh, impression, and then, you know, coming back- [clears throat]...
• 1:21
  into the industry kinda like getting his feet wet again and, and tiptoeing into what's going on. Uh, interested to see what he says. I like anyone who's a practitioner, right?
• 1:30
  And the entrepreneur- uh, entrepreneurial nature of what he did with cars in the early days, and then what he did, um, with the screen company that is, like,
• 1:40
  thriving and succeeding, and then bringing that energy back in. Anyone who does that, like, I always move a little closer to those t- people 'cause I feel like they're my people. You know what I mean?
• 1:49
  Not just a theorist, but an actual practitioner. Um, those are the kind of people that just get me excited. It's, um, well, it gives, [laughs] I almost said substance that only comes from experience.
• 2:03
  [laughs] What does that attack? We're not gonna go there. But man, I'm excited to hop in. Uh, we hope you enjoy our conversation with John Clavinetscher. Uh [laughs] [upbeat music]
• 2:19
  John, thank you so much for joining us today. Um, you know, it's not every day we get to have a, like a deep conversation with someone that we've kinda just met but has a lot of industry experience.
• 2:30
  So, uh, excited to hear how this conversation goes. Great. It's an honor to be here.
• 2:34
  Really appreciate the, the community that you all have built and, and what you're doing for both automotive dealers and the automotive industry as a whole. So it's an honor, it's a pleasure.
• 2:43
  So, thank you, and it's great to have you here as well. So we were just been talking about the, the benefit of experience when it comes to disruption.
• 2:53
  To have seen cycles of disruption happen before, and to know that now when something else changes in an industry, you don't have to be the first one to, like, instinctively react just because you feel this need to have to do something.
• 3:07
  You actually have the benefit of saying like, "Okay, let's, we can, we can actually pause for a second and see which way this thing's gonna run, and so we can react and cut it off at the point instead of end up chasing it."
• 3:19
  What, what are you seeing this time around in, like, the disruptions that are happening in retail automotive and in digital, and, and how would you compare those to disruptions you've seen in the past? Yeah, yeah.
• 3:31
  Well, a- again, I'm super thrilled to be here and, and just to parrot what you all have done for the community as a whole, as you talk about these experiences and the ability to learn from outside and what's outside of auto, which I know is part of the vernacular of what you all do and what your organization provides.
• 3:47
  A- and it's, it's...
• 3:48
  I mean, we just, we should take great pride in what automotive has done across all verticals, um, from price contextualization to really being the first in search, putting the first 800 number on a classified listing.
• 3:58
  I mean, there's so many great examples of what auto has done that other industries have then borrowed. Think if we're at an inflection point where now we can learn from other industries as a whole.
• 4:08
  And so Paul, to your point specifically, you know, one of the key things that I have learned over the last four years once I left auto, was seeing about how retailers really embrace the first-party data, and really create a one-to-one personalized, customized relationship with their customers.
• 4:24
  They move away from this concept of sort of who owns the customer, right? So is it Coca-Cola that owns the customer, or is it Target that owns the customer that sells Coca-Cola?
• 4:34
  And it really focus on who is the customer, and what's the best way to put the right message, uh, to the right person at the right place, um, to provide that customization and personalization.
• 4:45
  And then Paul, to your, your other point is that, you know, your expectations outside of auto frames your, what you, what you want within auto. And so- True...
• 4:54
  auto then needs to evolve, and auto then needs to then see what other industries have done to then change the customer's expectation.
• 5:01
  That's, you just said the expectations you have outside of auto frame your expectations within auto. I feel like that should be on a plaque- [laughs]... on the wall at a Soduko Kyle. No doubt.
• 5:14
  Like- That is like, put it on a T-shirt and ship it. Someone clip that and send it. I mean, that's just unbelievable. So, well, but, and here's what I think a lot of...
• 5:23
  So, uh, uh, I think we probably need to give maybe the listeners a little bit of context, because you said- Yeah... four years outside of auto. You had a lot of history in auto.
• 5:31
  So I'd like to f- for you, one, to give a lot of, a little bit of context there. But, you know,
• 5:36
  a- after you do that, one of the things that I think a lot of people think is like, "Well, I've never worked outside of auto, so how you, how do you expect me to do that?"
• 5:44
  Maybe frame it up as like, hey, you've had work experience, career experience outside of auto.
• 5:48
  But really, uh, uh, from my perspective, everybody has experience outside of auto, and I think that's actually what you were probably leaning into in that, in that point, was like your, you personally, anybody that is a you in this conversation-...
• 6:03
  has a framework outside of auto of which to perceive auto in, right? Yeah.
• 6:08
  So walk through maybe your timeline, how you perceive it because of your career experience, but what you see as, like, people in general having that capacity. Yeah.
• 6:16
  Kyle, I'll start with the second question first because it's much more interesting and fascinating, uh, than, than my, my history.
• 6:22
  [laughs] Um, a- a- and what I would say is that, you know, y- I, I have a, a friend that has relatively older kids, and then they just, they just had a n- new young baby girl.
• 6:32
  And they've been outside of the diaper game and outside of the formula game for let's call it, you know, almost a decade.
• 6:38
  Um, if they look at their experiences with leading retailers, whether that is a CVS, a Walgreens, a Target, you know, for, for many of those last eight years, they never received messages for baby formula or diapers or things that were germane to di- babies, right?
• 6:52
  They would look at their app experience. They would look at their direct mail they received. They would look at their email communication from the retailer.
• 6:57
  And it really wasn't about the, you know, the baby formula or the diapers. And that baby hits, and she's comes into this world, and it's a blessing.
• 7:05
  And next thing you know, you know, the messages, the offers, the content is all customized to the individual person.
• 7:11
  And when you think about your experiences, whether you are a Starbucks app user or, you know, a American Airlines flyer, which I think both you all are from listening to your podcast, right?
• 7:21
  Y- you want that in-app experience to reflect your travel tendencies and what you experience. And it's that sort of ocular that then shapes your expectation within auto. You don't wanna be viewed as one of many.
• 7:32
  You wanna be viewed as one of one. And I think that's, that's, you know, significantly important. McKinsey came in to, uh, did some great research on this, um, about almost a little over a year ago.
• 7:43
  And two things that were fascinating by that. One is, you know, 76% of customers really want to be engaged by the retailer in a one-to-one customized, personalized way.
• 7:55
  Now, I'm sure that makes sense to this group and to the listeners, but what was actually, to me, was even more fascinating is that close to 81% or even greater number of people actually have a negative perception of the brand when they get treated in a very one to many or when they don't get treated in a personalized way.
• 8:12
  So not only- Hmm...
• 8:13
  does a personalized message really enhance the experience, but by going the opposite direction and sort of saying a very generic, you know, "Come in this Sunday for a great deal," that's not unique to the individual car owner, then that actually has a negative impression of the brand.
• 8:26
  So I think, to me, that, y- you're absolutely right, Kyle. Everyone is a customer. Everyone is a shopper. And, and you need to look at your own experiences in terms of what you anticipate and expect.
• 8:35
  And I think that frames it up for what we need to do in the automotive space.
• 8:38
  And quite frankly, what you've been doing with the community and the membership that you've been growing about really trying to get people to understand the strengths of other industries and bringing it in auto.
• 8:48
  Now, specific to, to my journey, um, you know, it's, it's a, it's a great reminder of the benefits of luck, persistence, and, and, and, and really getting to know some, you know, neat people is that, um, you know, I, I, when I, after I graduated college, you know, someone that I actually played basketball with in high school that was a lot older.
• 9:05
  He was one of those old, sort of 38-year-old, you know, individuals. [laughs] Uh, which I'd love to be 38 years old now. [laughs] Um, but, uh, he, he was a neighbor of mine.
• 9:14
  And, uh, his name is Earl Hesterberg, who actually just announced he's retiring from Group 1. But at the time, he was working for Nissan North America. And this is in 1995.
• 9:21
  And I, you know, called him up and said, "Hey, I'd really like to get in the automotive space. I really have a lot of admiration for the entrepreneurs that are dealers."
• 9:28
  And then he said, "I can't get you a job, but I can get you in contact with the right person." And I started in a call center where there was no computers, right?
• 9:35
  And you were just talking to people that are angry because they refused to change their oil for the first, you know, two years of the car. Engine seize. [laughs] You know, the engine blows.
• 9:43
  They need a new, you know, transmission. And now, you know, the company's not, uh, under warranty.
• 9:48
  And they have to talk to someone like myself that had good talk tracks, but really not a computer to kind of figure it out. But anyways, neither here nor there.
• 9:54
  I, I quickly realized- They were like, "Welcome to the automotive industry of, of which you love all these entrepreneurs." Yeah. "You're gonna love these c- you're gonna love these phone calls," right?
• 10:02
  [laughs] But, but, yeah, I quickly then got into the- Talk about motivated people, right? Yeah. [laughs] You're gonna talk to a lot of motivated people.
• 10:08
  [laughs] Well, I was motivated to, to, to, to, to, A, have a great appreciation for anyone that's in customer service. That's something that was- Sure... a lifelong lesson.
• 10:16
  And number two, I was motivated to leave that department and, and enter into- [laughs] Uh, and I got lucky because they, they really wanted someone to get into the internet. So this is now 1996.
• 10:27
  Um, and my only qualification there was that I was young. Um- Right... because they just said, "Well, you must know a little bit more about digital internet." But- Same qualification for social media people today.
• 10:38
  [laughs] Still the same. Same qualification. [laughs] Well, you know, you set the bar very high.
• 10:42
  So anyways, get into that, h- learn a little bit, meet John Hole, learn about Cobalt, learn about, at the time, Infinity Net and what they were doing with Y2K. And then eventually, um, transferred to Chicago from LA.
• 10:56
  And then I, I really wanted to be an entrepreneur. And so I, I, in 1999, early '99, I met Alex Better, who was the, who was the founder and, and CEO of, of cars.com.
• 11:06
  And then, uh, I started an 18-year journey, always working for Alex, being a part of an amazing group of people and teams and board members, and eventually going public.
• 11:14
  Um, and then I had the opportunity to, after, after that, and then leading the charge to bring my good friend, Joe Chir, on board from Dealer Inspire.
• 11:23
  I then had the opportunity to, uh, wanted to leave auto to see what other industries are doing, particularly as it relates to attribution and some of the neat things they're doing from one-to-one marketing.
• 11:32
  So started up a, a, a, a, s- small startup with a couple of friends. Um, uh, so early on, early innings, and some great individuals, some great board members.
• 11:41
  Um, got to join the team when it was, you know, just two people. Um, and then eventually went through a series of rounds, series of successful rounds. The company called Cooler Screens is doing amazing things.
• 11:50
  And eventually got to a point where I brought on someone to replace me, um, that, that helped develop and run Amazon advertising.
• 11:57
  So it took Amazon advertising from $0, like 10 years ago, to, to, you know, being part of a team that brought up to $31 billion. So at that point- [laughs]...
• 12:05
  you know, through the back of my mind, I'm wondering, like-Why isn't auto doing what so- what leading retailers are doing?
• 12:13
  And then through that process, um, had the opportunity to meet Mike Wethington at Outsell, meet- meet the Outsell team, talk to a lot of great dealers, and that's how I joined Outsell.
• 12:21
  And, and helping to, again, um, bring about what is outside of auto and, and then tie it back into auto and really helping that one-to-one communication.
• 12:30
  Not hearing just so many stories these days of people doing what you did. Being in auto, usually when people are in auto, they either stay in auto or they leave forever, right?
• 12:42
  And so I'm intrigued by the story of you leaving and coming back. When you left auto and did Cooler Screens, um, can you explain a little bit about what that product is?
• 12:54
  And, and then, like, you just explained, like, how you kind of came back into auto, but, like, I, I'm also curious to hear about, like, your perception of auto or any involvement in auto you had, like, after you, you started doing the Cooler Screens thing.
• 13:08
  Yeah. Um, r- real quick, you know, for Cooler Screens, what we do is we bring in digital displays into retail. So it's that sort of physical retail or phygital, phygital, physical digital, and bringing it in.
• 13:20
  And so it's very similar to the experience even at cars.com where, and I'm gonna kind of... At this point I'm gonna lose the dozens and dozens of listeners, right?
• 13:27
  But, you know, y- you have planograms, which is, uh, just a feed, and then you have imagery.
• 13:31
  And so you can actually take the images that instead of actually opening up a physical door and you see through it, and there might be frost or the milk stain, you could actually see a contextual view of the actual product itself.
• 13:41
  So we got in early with some of our investors. Our investors like Microsoft, uh, Verizon, which at the time owned, um, you know, Yahoo, and then we also worked with some of the leading retailers.
• 13:53
  And that's how I learned a lot about CDP, CDEP's data, normalizing data, and the one-to-one relationship. As it relates, you know, Paul, to, to the journey, um, you know, auto is incredibly addictive.
• 14:05
  I mean, it's, you know, it's, it's amazing group. Uh, some of the 30-day- Wow... best operators, some of the best entrepreneurs, community members, um, that, that are out there.
• 14:13
  And so once you have it in your blood, as I know you gentlemen do, it's hard to leave it.
• 14:17
  And so, you know, it'd be, like, the month end, and I'd be sort of itching for, "Okay, where's that sort of [laughs] month-end number and where are we with-" [laughs] The month-end fix, right? Yeah.
• 14:25
  [laughs] Sales and talking to your dealer friends. And, and so that was always there.
• 14:28
  But, but, but I mean, the, the other thing I, I realized, too, is I, I have a great appreciation and affinity for the dealer franchise system. I think it's under attack.
• 14:37
  And as I saw some people that I know and respect, both at Carvana, Tesla, CarMax, great organizations, but they really haven't also embraced this CDEP, this ability to have a one-to-one relationship.
• 14:50
  Because they don't get caught up in the tiers. They don't get caught up in, well, this is a tier one upper funnel communication versus a tier two middle funnel versus a tier three.
• 14:59
  Um, they understand it's just about the customer and what the customer expects.
• 15:02
  And so I started getting more and more energized about the opportunity to come back, work in the industry that I grew up and appreciated, but now having the perspective of the last four years of not being in auto.
• 15:11
  And then being part of s- a dialogue and a conversation, and being part of even this community to talk about, um, th- those customer expectations and how do we help. How do we help dealers?
• 15:20
  How do we help tier two agencies? How do we help manufacturers best con- connect and relate to the customers? Okay, so, uh, real quick, just a, a little bit of education.
• 15:29
  So if you don't know, these are new terms in automotive, but CDP, CD- EP, yeah... EP or XP. Like, there's, there's, people- That's right... call them different things.
• 15:39
  But, um, you know, customer data platform or customer data experience platform, um, i- is, is really the idea that, uh, you can have a unified customer data set that allows you to, uh, to organize those, those, those customers by a bunch...
• 15:56
  Like, basically any filter that you can attach an, a, like, either a line item or a column to that customer, and, and then, and then communicate with them one to one.
• 16:07
  So you're reconciling, uh, you know, all of their data to make sure that you have up-to-date addresses and emails and phone numbers so that the communication is quick and you know what their patterns of purchase are, so that you're c- communicating the right things at the right time.
• 16:21
  So I... That's, like, my really simplified down version- Y- you nailed it... because I wanted to get to this question. I don't wanna get into the weeds of that. But there's the simplified version.
• 16:29
  The, the question that I wanna get from that, which I'm kind of extrapolating from what you just said, is right now in automotive, what you see a lot is this, like, OEM tiered campaign, right? Targeting X customers.
• 16:42
  The, the, the tier two campaign, maybe it's a regional or a group level campaign targeting X customers with X message. And then you have the tier three layering in there, too.
• 16:50
  Whether it be on service or sales, sometimes they, uh, uh, sometimes, and actually more often than not, they're not just not in sync, they're actually combative to each other. Mm.
• 16:59
  So how do you see us reconciling that as an industry with a better unified customer data set? Right.
• 17:06
  So I think it, it, you know, we, we at Outsell, we, we, uh, we're really focused on transforming those, those r- those relationships. That's first and foremost, is that transformation of those relationships.
• 17:15
  I think where we... I- in one step back is that, you know, the company's been around for 17 years.
• 17:21
  It's, it's continually evolved, and we've been very blessed to have some of the leading dealers, dealer groups, and even, you know, agencies that have really guided us and directed us.
• 17:30
  So it's fair to say that we are s- built for and with the dealer community. So, um, i- it's, it's sort of that ocular.
• 17:37
  Where we put a lot of energy on, is if I can actually take your q- question, Kyle, and really focus on, like, even dealer groups, right?
• 17:43
  So what we could do is we could say, "Listen, there might be a, a customer that bought their used Ford at a Chevy store, but services at a Ford store, but they're getting different messages from the dealer group as a whole."
• 17:56
  Or maybe there's not even an ability for the dealer group to then communicate it broadly.
• 18:00
  So I'll use one that I'm sure this group knows, is, like, Germaine Automotive, who's been great at the forefront, and that group has helped us out dramatically.
• 18:08
  But there, they're able to send group messages that are very tailored and accustomed to the customer, as well as making sure they've-With their dealer community understand sort of who gets to send the messages and how does that relate so that the customer's not getting mixed messages.
• 18:23
  So that is an applicable use case that you can-- that we have been doing, doing successfully for many, many years. Hard stop, you know, if you put on the sort of the, the, the, the...
• 18:33
  What would happen down the road and sort of at least my, you know, viewpoint is that, um, at the end of the day, it all starts with the customer.
• 18:40
  So we don't have this today, but we would love to basically say, "Listen, at every integration, whether it's a tier one event, tier two or tier three, it feeds into who that customer is," and then allow the brands to then play within their swim lanes, but to best develop and, and, and, and, and, and nurture those relationships so they can get the outcomes that they want.
• 18:58
  Ah, man, I... Like, the holy grail of customer data for me is a unified customer ID across, like, tier one to tier three, at least in brand, right? Harder to do at large groups or scale or across brands, right?
• 19:14
  And that's, I, you, you know, playing at that. But at minimum in brand, having that unified customer ID and, and customer-centric data would be a game changer. Um- Right.
• 19:24
  And j- and just to build on that, that's what we have.
• 19:26
  We do have a unified customer ID within a dealer group, and we're starting to work where applicable, where we can make sure the dealers win, the, and the various different tier one, tier two can win, and how do we then exchange that ID so that, again, you're providing the best customer experience.
• 19:42
  Because really, at the end of the day, it's, this is what it's all about. This is what everyone's in this industry for is providing great customer experience. And right now, to your point earlier, Kyle, we are competing.
• 19:51
  Um, and, and we're not looking good when we do compete. And so how do we then do that by knowing where the customer is in her journey?
• 19:58
  Um, do you, do you perceive or do you know, you know, what the wasted ad dollar spend potentially is- Oh, that's a question... as an, as an industry, right?
• 20:08
  Because when I think about what you're talking about right now in this, like, hitting customer multiple times, the, the capacity for us to waste ad spend across tiers or even within a group or against stores within a group seems like it would be astronomical as an industry.
• 20:28
  Y- y- yeah. I don't-- I mean, if you look at the industry as a, a whole, right, so as both ad tech and, and martech, you know, you're-- I think the numbers are around forty billion.
• 20:36
  I could be off in auto on an annual basis in North America. But I think that's roughly it. And I don't know what it is in terms of waste, but I do know if you look at c- consumer packaged good retail,
• 20:47
  when consumer packaged good retail have this unified customer ID and markets towards the customer ID, they're able to shift a hundred billion dollars annually. Whoo.
• 20:59
  And they did this, this, this evolution in less than four years, but Kyle, it's exactly what you and Paul have been talking about.
• 21:05
  It's that u- unified customer ID that you can then see where the customer is in her journey, and then how do you best deliver the right message to the right person. Right.
• 21:13
  So that, you know, we can see does one customer prefer direct mail more than social, and then how do you make sure then you tailor that experience to that customer?
• 21:21
  When you say shift a hundred billion annually, what timeframe would you give that? Like, when, when did that shift occur? What, what time period?
• 21:29
  Yeah, y- y- it's a little bit-- So, so it happened from about, uh, twenty eighteen to twenty twenty-two.
• 21:35
  Um, a- a- and quite frankly, Paul, like, I would say retail benefited by Amazon because Amazon, if you think about who's the best at this unified customer ID, it, it is Amazon.
• 21:49
  Um, a- and so they forced the Walmarts, the Walgreens, the Targets, the leading retailers to-- they had to evolve.
• 21:55
  They had to not worry about, well, who has that sign-on ID because at the end of the day, this is about first-party data. This is, uh...
• 22:03
  A- a- and it's a little bit easier for retail because retail, there's one dominant CRM, which I think everyone on this call knows who that customer is, and there's one dominant-- In retail, it's POS, but it's like a DMS.
• 22:14
  Mm-hmm. And, and, you know, that's, that's actually, um, again, one dominant player.
• 22:19
  In, in, in, in auto, it's, it's-- there's really no one dominant player, no offense to anyone in either the CRM space or the DMS space, and they often compete.
• 22:28
  And, you know, Kyle and Paul, they're not talking about a unified ID. In fact, oftentimes- No. The opposite. No... it's against what they wanna do to do that.
• 22:35
  So the secret sauce of what Outsell does is that we do dial in to your DMS, to the CR- to the CRM. We layer on other third-party data, and we get this viewpoint of who the customer is. Yeah.
• 22:46
  And, and I'll tell you, one of the things that really kind of accelerated my desire to leave auto to learn, and that was really why I did it, was I remember I was meeting with the head of a agency, which shall na- name nameless.
• 22:58
  This is in about two thousand and sixteen.
• 23:01
  And I'm gonna, uh-- They were talking about how instead of buying target-rich, two-sided marketplace audience like Cars.com, and I, I got to listen to the podcast from Doug Miller, who I'm good friends with.
• 23:13
  Instead of going down that path, I was being told that, "Oh, you know what? We're gonna use our data management platform, a DMP, because we created really great lookalike audiences, and we can get cheap CPMs." Mm.
• 23:27
  Which then begged the question, like, "Well, what's your, what's your KPI? What's your criteria?" And like, "We want cheap CPMs." Like, really? You don't want outcomes. You don't want effectiveness. You don't want- Oh...
• 23:38
  positive brand equity. And like, no, you wanna- Yeah, you're trying to make this a fifty-minute podcast right now, aren't you? Nothing wrong. Right. Yeah, nothing wrong. You're trying.
• 23:44
  [laughs] Nothing wrong with c- cheap CPMs, but- No, I, so I, I apologize. But, you know- Uh, uh, you shouldn't apologize. No, like, you shouldn't apologize because you're just speaking the truth.
• 23:51
  Like, walled garden works for Apple, right? Yeah. It doesn't work for automotive DMS CRM. It just doesn't- That's right... and it's not going to work. And so you don't have to apologize at all.
• 24:02
  [laughs] So, so anyways, it was, it was-- I need-- At that point, I needed to learn because the other benefit of what a s- customer data engagement platform is, it's full cycle.
• 24:11
  Meaning, we know that that social ad paid off because we actually then pull and runYou know, a- and see. Now, we pull, but we, we dial into the DMS, we see the outcomes.
• 24:21
  And then you can then figure out, you know, what actually effectively moved the needle.
• 24:25
  And that allows, either through, and I hate to use the term AI, but either through AI or through, you know, just the, the dealer or the agency sort of playing with the dials to figure out, what's the most effective way to get the outcomes?
• 24:37
  And really, if you think about it, like, the... what makes auto so special, it's so outcome-driven, right? It's so customer-focused and outcome-driven, and yet marketing largely has not been about outcomes.
• 24:49
  It's been about other things and, uh, and what- Mm... CDPs can do. So I don't know the waste, but I would wager it's pretty considerable, particularly when you can start to layer in what the outcomes could be. Wow.
• 25:02
  Wow, that's incredible. But- Well, John, I'm telling you what. Well, I feel like we've- [laughs] Like, this... We, we went in and we, like, pulled back just a little bit of the peel, and we were like, "Look, look, look.
• 25:12
  Everyone look inside," and then we shut it right back up on them.
• 25:15
  [laughs] Um, but I, I'm excited to kinda hang out with you, uh, in, in just under a week from this recording and, uh, and, and get to know you and your team at Outsell more.
• 25:25
  Really appreciate you being, uh, here with us today and having a conversation.
• 25:28
  I feel like, I feel like you've opened up a little of a Pandora's box for a lot of listeners and, and hopefully people got a lot out of that today. So on behalf of myself and Paul, really appreciate you being on.
• 25:38
  Well, listen, it was an honor to be here. You should really, like, tr- truly wanna lean into what you've been doing with your community. Can't wait to, uh, meet you all face to face and to, and to be with you.
• 25:47
  I, I know that, uh, Outsell is sponsoring the event on Sunday evening, the, the kickoff, and so looking forward to seeing you there. And I can't wait to meet you and so many of your listeners in your communities.
• 25:57
  So thank you.
• 25:57
  [upbeat music] So I love the energy and the obvious, obvious astuteness to what is going on across all the different industries that are integrating technology and the retail mindset.
• 26:16
  Um, man, [laughs] I'm just excited about what they're doing, and I don't get that excited about tech. But the fact that he seems to be just grabbing from all these areas and saying, "No, no, no, no, no.
• 26:27
  We can do it here. We can do it here, everybody. Look, the pieces are coming together, right? We're gonna work together.
• 26:31
  We're gonna get there," just gets me excited that there are people like that working on those problems. Well, I do get excited about tech. [laughs] I know you do. I don't know if y'all knew that about me. You don't say.
• 26:40
  [laughs] Which is one of the reasons that I get excited about it. When I get excited about tech, honestly, I think it's mostly because you get excited about tech.
• 26:48
  And it's so much fun to watch people get excited about what they're passionate about. Well, and here's the thing. This is what's really cool because I, you know, I'm...
• 26:56
  I, I come from, like, just loving the sales environment and engaging customers, and that's, like, that's my passion. If I, if, if, if I get to be in a showroom, I love trying to find my way to talk to a customer.
• 27:08
  And so for me, like, tech and, and what he was saying in, in that understanding what a CDP or to s- or a CDEP or a CDXP, whatever, whatever version of that customer data platform that you wanna have, like, actually has customer-facing implications for the way that customers perceive your brand because of the message that you're telling them at the right time, at the right place, because of their interaction.
• 27:33
  Like, having tech inform a better customer experience, like a company like Outsell can, can do or like connected data platforms or customer data platforms can do, is, is so important in an age where that's what everybody's getting from all of these other, uh, you know, entities.
• 27:51
  You know, I think, like, I, I always explain to salespeople as I'm training, you know, your people that are coming in are experiencing life in a purchasing lane of Instagram ads, right?
• 28:00
  That everything they say, everything they do integrates into their, into their shopping behavior.
• 28:05
  And then we get them into the showroom and it's like whoosh, and we slap them across the face and tell them to stop shopping that way.
• 28:11
  And this is, this is a way for us to allow people to shop and, and integrate that into their regular behaviors like the rest of the world does, and I think it actually provides us with a better opportunity as an industry.
• 28:24
  Like, dude, for- forget the metaverse. We're, we are installing cheat codes on real life. Yeah. That's the impression that I get. That's cool.
• 28:31
  I'm like, you know, to get that level of intelligence to be able to, to, to act much more effectively, efficiency blows my mind. And certainly we hope you enjoyed this conversation as well right here on Auto Collabs.
• 28:43
  Uh, on behalf of Kyle Mountsier, Paul J. Daly, and myself, Michael Cirillo, catch you on the next episode.
• 28:49
  Sign up for our free and fun to read daily email for a free shot of relevant news in automotive, retail, media, and pop culture. You can get it now at asotu.com. That's A-S-O-T-U dot com.
• 29:02
  If you love this podcast, please leave us a review and share it with a friend. Thanks again for listening. We'll see you next time.
• 29:09
  [upbeat music] Welcome to Auto Collabs. Welcome to Auto Collabs. [laughs] Are we recording yet? Are we rolling yet?
• 29:27
  Not yet.