Latest / Find Your Edge: Training, Nutrition + Longevity for Endurance Athletes / The Science of Lasting Motivation in Endurance Sports Ep 155

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The Science of Lasting Motivation in Endurance Sports Ep 155 · Find Your Edge: Training, Nutrition + Longevity for Endurance Athletes

• 0:37
  Coach Carlie: Hello, and welcome back to the Find Your Edge podcast.
• 0:40
  Coach Carlie: I'm your host, Coach Chris Newport, and uh technical difficulties.
• 0:45
  Coach Carlie: We're gonna make it this one today, you guys.
• 0:48
  Coach Carlie: I swear.
• 0:49
  Coach Carlie: Anyway, we've got a special guest today, Dr.
• 0:51
  Coach Carlie: Sarah Gordon.
• 0:53
  Coach Carlie: And um, let's see, how did we originally meet?
• 0:56
  Coach Carlie: I think that you sent an email to fellow Traffon coaches.
• 1:01
  Coach Carlie: Does that sound like ring a bell?
• 1:03
  Coach Carlie: You're like, I'm starting this traath on related podcast, and I would love to have some guests on.
• 1:09
  Coach Carlie: And yeah, uh, so I was like, oh, all things traffon related, of course, let's do the things.
• 1:16
  Coach Carlie: And you have got such an interesting journey, thus, the name of your podcast, right?
• 1:23
  Coach Carlie: So, Sarah, tell us a little bit about your journey in endurance sports, how that took you to your PhD, and how that eventually led to your podcast.
• 1:37
  Coach Carlie: That was a big question, by the way.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: So take it away.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, well, so to start, this is the first time I've been on the other side.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: Isn't it cool?
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_00: It's so fun.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yeah, you can a little bit.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I'm the interviewer, so this is good.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I appreciate the opportunity to be here, share my journey, and um, and hopefully inspire people through my story.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I know that the guests I have on my show, which is and Chris, you've been on my show.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm so grateful for that.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's called the PhD Journey Unplugged.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I meet such incredible people on the show, they inspire me so much with their stories, and so um, and I learned so much from that.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: So I'll try to share some of that wisdom with your guests.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: But so let's see, my journey.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I remember the first time I ran, I was 15 years old.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: Wow, I can remember it clearly.
• 2:36
  Coach Carlie: And so, yeah, what makes it stick out so much?
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: It was a beautiful because I love to run at night.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: It was a beautiful evening.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: It was the summer, probably summer.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_00: It was definitely warmer out.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, just the elements.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_00: I've always been about the elements.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: My license plate for years was for elements.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: I have a tattoo on my shoulders to strength and endurance.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's always just been part of me to be physically active and enjoy being out in the elements, running, whatever over the years that I've done.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: But I remember this first run, and I just kind of fell in love with it.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: It was maybe it was just what you feel, the runner's high, too.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: It just all came together for me.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: And so that has always kind of been in my life, even as I approached 60.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I still love it.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I had that all along for many years.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_00: Fell off the tracks here and there, but found my way back.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know how it works.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: And then in my 20s, uh, I always loved to swim, never competitively, but just love to swim.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_00: And in my 20s, I tried my first triathlon.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: It was the Rust and triathlon.
• 3:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I had I had an old Schwin bike.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that thing was heavy.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: It was like a it was like a steel tank.
• 3:50
  Coach Carlie: Yeah, but those things are like unbreakable, you know.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but like for your first triathlon, did it work?
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: No, I don't, but like for your first triathlon going up, you know, the hills and uh resting trathlon, which was it was which is still they still hold that race.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's a great race.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it was um it was hard.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: I was that bike and I had some words on that hill.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_00: But that was in my 20s, and then I just kind of went on and worked differently, you know, got my bachelor's, my master's, and raised my family and um worked, I worked in the government, I was a research analyst, I found my way into as a marketing director, which to a certain extent is market research.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: So I always kind of did research.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I was sitting in a job about six years ago, and I was like, you know, I think I really want to go for something I've always wanted to study health and human performance, exercise science, exercise physiology, and just go for it.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the kids were you know either graduating college or you know, in college, and uh it just seemed like the right time.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: And um, so I did it, took a leap of faith at age 53 and went back to get my doctorate in health leadership and health and human performance.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: Best decision I ever made in my life, totally shifted my life towards so much more alignment.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: I talk about on my show all the time how important it is to find things in your life that you enjoy, where you feel authentically yourself.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: And so that allowed me to move in that direction.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_00: And during that journey, um I was doing triathlon.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I I would see older, you know, I was doing I did a couple half iron and you know, some sprints, and I would just see older people at these races, you know.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know their exact age, but I knew they had to be 70s or 80s, or you could actually see on their leg, you know, sometimes.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_00: And I I really seriously thought to myself, um I wonder what motivates them to be so highly physically active at later stages of life.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: How did they get there?
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_00: How do they stay there?
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_00: What does successful aging look like?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: And those were just the questions that you know getting your PhD and or doing research, it just starts with curiosity and a question or questions.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_00: And those were my questions.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's that was the foundation of my dissertation research based on those questions.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: So I built the whole project based on what, you know, the exercise motivations of older athletes, 65 and older, and their perspectives on successful aging.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: So in that process, I made a lot of connections.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: I, you know, I just learned a lot um through the through you know the dissertation uh project.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: And um when I completed my doctorate, uh May 2025, um I really wasn't sure what I wanted to do with it, quite quite honestly.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought a friend of mine had a few years earlier said, You you should launch a podcast.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_00: No, I could never do a podcast.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: And then I completed my doctorate and I said, you know what?
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: I think I'm gonna try a podcast.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: And uh now I'm in my second year, approaching episode 77.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: I like you mentioned, I reached out to people through email.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_00: Hey, you want to come on my show?
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_00: The triathlon community was incredible, so responsive, so positive, so excited.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_00: And um, that so that's where I launched it, you know, within the triathlon community.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's um, and that, and you know, and just yesterday I'm gonna launch an episode uh later today, actually, episode 77.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: I just had a gentleman on my show who's a uh been living with cystic fibrosis um since uh to genetic um disease through birth.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_00: And his story is just one of like hope and resilience and motivation and passion and purpose.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm still I I'm having just I feel like whether you're on an Iron Man journey, a Traslan journey, an athletic journey, it's very similar to other people's journeys and how they can you know choose to live um positive, productive lives.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm you know, I'm spreading my wings a bit on the show, but um, but the message is the same uh you know throughout all the episodes.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's where I'm at.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's the journey.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: And uh the PhD journey, the name, it was because I learned and we'll talk about it.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: Uh we learn I learned so many lessons, so many lessons on that journey that are very similar to an athletic journey, an academic journey, a personal journey, a professional journey.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_00: They're very, all very similar lessons, you know, across all these different ways of living our lives.
• 9:08
  Coach Carlie: Okay, yeah.
• 9:09
  Coach Carlie: So tell us about some of those lessons.
• 9:11
  Coach Carlie: Give us give us some examples.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think, like you know, you're a triathlete and you coach athletes.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think you get to points in your life where you want to quit.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: You just want to quit something.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_00: You you're tired.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: There are lots of reasons, you know.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_00: When we get to that point, that breaking point, a lot of times it's fatigue, you're not getting good enough sleep, your life is out of balance, you are tipping the scale too much in one, maybe you're overtraining, you're not recovering, your nutrition, your hydration, all those things that make you it, you know, in influence optimal performance.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's the same in any endeavor in your life, whether you're um working in medical school, in law school, getting your PhD, an emergency room physician.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: It we call it the long game of human performance, right?
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_00: So the lessons I learned is that you have to set boundaries in your life.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Uh you have to, if you're getting to this these breaking points, which you know, burnout.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: We can all experience burnout as an athlete.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's professional, as a parent.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: When you're getting to these kind of breaking points, it's it means something's out of balance.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: So that's a huge lesson I learned.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: I learned it in very lots of different ways.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I made a joke.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: I I was fortunate enough to give the commencement address at graduation.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I I did, you know, my lessons learned, and I made a joke like when you feel like quitting, you know, to your audience, take a nap.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's a silly lesson, but it it's like really just take a nap.
• 10:56
  SPEAKER_00: You'll give it a fresh perspective on anything that you're any goal that you're going after in your life.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: So that was a huge lesson I learned about setting a friend of mine in school.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_00: The first time he said it, I thought, wow, that sounds so super selfish.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_00: But he's like, you know, you need to set non-negotiable time.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: Non-negotiable time is time that you, you know, it's just not, it's, it's, it's about you.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_00: If it's 15 minutes or it's an hour, however it works in your life.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody's lives and journeys are different.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: But so when I started to learn how to set non-negotiable time, which for me was, you know, early morning running or meditation or prayer, I mean, things started to get more in balance.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: So that's my first major, major lesson.
• 11:45
  Coach Carlie: Um are we getting a taste of this commencement speech?
• 11:49
  Coach Carlie: Because this is awesome.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: It was fun.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the other thing the other thing I learned was be open to learning.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: I've noticed like a lot of times people dig themselves into a hole because they just think they just know how to do everything.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: And if you keep yourself open to learning from other people, you you will be surprised how much it can, you know, improve your experience in whatever you're doing.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh, I don't know, just be grateful.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: Grateful.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: Marilyn, who uh Marilyn Ward, Dr.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: Marilyn Ward, who started my podcast with me, we used to always laugh, like, be grateful for the hard.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because you learn a lot.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: You learn a lot in the hard.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, lean into it sometimes.
• 12:35
  unknown: Yeah.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the obstacles teach us.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: There's a wonderful book, Ryan Holliday, uh, The Obstacle is the way.
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: I highly recommend it.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because we all have obstacles, they come at us in different ways.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um and so we we learn a lot in that.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_00: So that's the thing.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: Getting your PhD is a five-year goal, right?
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: And a lot of life happens in uh five years, and so you're challenged.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I've I've had guests on my show who've done like the Epic DECA, you know, or like JD Tramble or Carrie Mandel, who ran the World Marathon Challenge, seven marathons, seven continents, seven days.
• 13:17
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've had people that really challenge themselves, and you're gonna have every emotion and every feeling and every, you know.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: So just I guess the lesson there from the academic journey to the athletic journey is um have some fun.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, you're putting yourself in the hard.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_00: Enjoy it.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: Enjoy the journey.
• 13:43
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 13:44
  Coach Carlie: I know sometimes it can be hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel, if you will.
• 13:49
  Coach Carlie: You know, you just feel like the tunnel is so dark, and it's like, well, I know the way back.
• 13:53
  Coach Carlie: I could just give up, and you know, but like what's on the other side is so much better than you perhaps could have imagined.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I had a shift in my thinking, and maybe this might help your listeners.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: Probably in my third or fourth class, I I, you know, you go into hard things, whether it's you're training for an Iron Man or you're training for a doctorate, and you start to question, do I belong here?
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_00: Am I good enough to be here?
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Do I look like everybody around me?
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they call it imposter syndrome.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: And the truth is with all of that, like you're always gonna feel a little bit unsure of yourself when you're doing something for the first time or something new.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so when you shift your thinking to like, this is my journey.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: I'm here because I want to be here.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna learn from my community, and you know, I'm gonna be a part of it, but but ultimately I'm here because I want to be here, and it shifts your thinking, and you then you you enjoy the journey, you embrace the journey.
• 14:56
  Coach Carlie: So it was perhaps changes the trajectory a little bit just because you're um it's almost like your energy shifts.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: It does.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: You stop comparing yourself to other people.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_00: Listen, if you're at a starting line and you're looking around and you're like, oh, I'm not this, I'm not that.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, just stop.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: You're there because you want to be there, you're there because it's fun, you're there because you you worked hard to get there.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: You're there because you know, it's where you want to be.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_00: So when you shift it, yeah, your energy changes and you can um, I'm not saying these things aren't hard, right?
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_00: It's discipline, consistency, hard work.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: You need these things to achieve goals, you know, especially when they're lofty goals.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but when you shift your mindset to I'm here really because I want to be in this hard, it totally changes your perspective on life.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:52
  SPEAKER_00: It makes it so much more rewarding and fulfilling.
• 15:55
  Coach Carlie: That's awesome.
• 15:57
  Coach Carlie: So, mindset is one of them.
• 15:58
  Coach Carlie: And I know you talked a lot about motivation.
• 16:00
  Coach Carlie: So, what in your PhD process did you learn about motivation?
• 16:04
  Coach Carlie: And feel free to throw some like fancy terms at us.
• 16:07
  Coach Carlie: You know, like uh like FTP and PO2 Max and let's let's like you know, psychological terms that we have absolutely around.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I will tell you, just let me just as far as physical activity, I mean, I've had the guests on my show and I'm and I'm learning myself about it.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not, you know, a performance coach like like you are, but I know um VO2 max is associated with all-cause mortality, which means that the less conditioned, the more deconditioned your body is, you know, the the worse your ability to absorb oxygen in your system, the more likely you're gonna have other issues.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a strong motivator for exercising, the way we transfer oxygen efficiently through our, you know, physiological systems.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so I do love the science based of it all, of everything I've learned in terms of the neuromuscular system and the cardiovascular system.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_00: But my background's in psychology, and I find motivation fascinating.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_00: And motivation is highly complex.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, we're highly individualized.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_00: So what motivates you doesn't necessarily motivate me.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and it's very dynamic.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: So when you understand that, and when I say these things, just keep in mind that it's very individualized.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_00: But I study motivation within a theoretical framework called self-determination theory.
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: I just came home from a conference in Geneva, Switzerland, all on self-determination theory.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_00: There were practitioners and researchers from across the world who were there to talk about this theoretical framework, which can be applied to so many different aspects of life: sports, wellness, mental health, healthcare, K through 12, education, the business world, philosophy, policy, government, how governments, politics, how governments govern.
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's just a fascinating framework.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: And don't get me wrong, there's lots of theories out there and frameworks to study human behavior.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: But self-determination, and and I'll make the loop back to triathlon and what I found in my research.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: But self-determination theory says we have three basic psychological needs: the need for autonomy, the need for competence, and the need for relatedness.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_00: Autonomy means that we take actions in our life to do the things that we want to do, that we feel freedom, that we feel empowerment to take those actions, to be a trahlete, to be a PhD student, to follow the things that that bring joy and purpose and meaning into our lives.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's a process to get there, right?
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_00: We're not always there.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's a continuum to get to being a living a fully autonomous life.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: Competence is that you acquire skill sets in your life that allow you to do these things, right?
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: To to ride your bike, to transition quickly, to be a triathlete, to problem solve, to do all this to prepare, to understand pacing and nutrition and hydration.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_00: Those are skill sets.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's competency.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: And the more competent you feel in something, the more likely you have confidence in it.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_00: And enjoy it.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: And then the third is relatedness.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's community, it's sense of community.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_00: We all we're not meant to be isolated.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: We are social human beings.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: We we thrive in sense of community.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_00: So when you have autonomy, competence, and relatedness, you're more likely to be living your life more intrinsically motivated, which means that you are taking at your things like I compete against myself, I challenge myself, I want to live a healthy lifestyle, I I want to do this, that, or the other thing.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_00: So when you live more intrinsically lives, you're more likely to enjoy your life.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the ultimate goal is human flourishing and human thriving.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_00: So my research, I found a pattern with older triathlete using statements like, I do it because I enjoy it.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: I do it because it's fun.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_00: I love the camaraderie ship.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_00: I love to compete against myself, but I love to be in the community.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: Not things like I'm doing it for the reward of winning.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_00: Now winning feels good.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: We all know that.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_00: But that's not the driver, right?
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's not getting people uh training to the finish line and carrying them past the finish line to the next race that they sign up for.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's enjoyment, it's something that comes from within.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: And so I found that that in my research, um, a strong motivator, exercise uh motivator was enjoyment.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_00: Health benefits, physical health benefits of exercising, which we know.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: We know that there's so many wonderful um physiological benefits to exercising.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: And the third major theme in my research was um community, triathlon community.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, people excited to make new friends, excited to see existing friends, excited to travel, you know, through the USAT platform of worlds and nationals and seeing people, friends they hadn't seen in a while, um, training with older uh athletes, training with younger athletes, it just this whole sense of community.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so within self-determination theory, which was really beautiful, I had an opportunity presented in Geneva, is um it fits so my findings fit so beautifully with self-determination theory, you know, because autonomy is being a triathlete, competence is having the skill set to be able to do a triathlon, and relatedness is the triathlon community.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_00: And um, so it was it was it was a beautiful thing to see.
• 22:14
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 22:15
  Coach Carlie: Wow, I love that.
• 22:17
  Coach Carlie: And um, when I was on your podcast, we talked exactly about that, which was so cool that I was talking about like our club and our community and how we do our training camps to help people be more skilled, thus, you know, fitting fabulously into your framework.
• 22:38
  Coach Carlie: You know, we did that all intentionally, Sarah.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_00: You built it, you built it to work, you built it to be successful.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_00: And that's when you understand these things.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because ultimately we want people to be successful, we want people to enjoy their lives and to um have fulfilling lives.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like I always say on my podcast, like, so much of life is random.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right?
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: We there's so much we cannot control, but there's a lot we can.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_00: We can control our attitude toward things, we can control the actions that we take in our lives, the things we choose to eat, the activities we choose to do, the people we choose to connect with.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, um, yeah.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_00: So that's so cool.
• 23:22
  Coach Carlie: I love that.
• 23:23
  Coach Carlie: Wow.
• 23:24
  Coach Carlie: Um, has going through this process of doing your PhD made you shift your thinking in any way?
• 23:32
  Coach Carlie: I know you came in like super curious and with all these questions.
• 23:35
  Coach Carlie: Were there things that surprised you or um made you think differently, perhaps that's a great question.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_00: I have to think about that one.
• 23:52
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 23:52
  Coach Carlie: That's a good question.
• 23:53
  Coach Carlie: Yes.
• 23:54
  Coach Carlie: Next podcast we will be talking about this.
• 23:59
  Coach Carlie: Um, we we come in, like you said, just curious.
• 24:04
  Coach Carlie: Like, let me think more about this.
• 24:06
  Coach Carlie: And uh, it's also making me think of uh you and I have talked pretty extensively about Natalie Gribeau, which uh whom I had on my podcast was the eight-year-old uh role breaking um Iron Man champion.
• 24:21
  Coach Carlie: And I went into that interview, sort of having one notion about her, and then left being like, wow, that was not at all what I was expecting, and it was similarly great.
• 24:34
  Coach Carlie: You know, so yeah, I thought it in one way and then be like, huh, okay, all right.
• 24:41
  Coach Carlie: Like you had mentioned, like just being open and uh ready for just a different way of thinking.
• 24:47
  Coach Carlie: And I think it's so easy in this, certainly in this sport, and you know, so many people in this sport are just very hard driving in other areas of their life, and it's easy to put something in a box.
• 24:59
  Coach Carlie: Like, no, this is exactly how I address my FTP or how I address my ability to train for this event or that event or whatever.
• 25:10
  Coach Carlie: And if you give them other opportunities, it's almost like no, no, no, no, that overwhelms me a little bit too much.
• 25:17
  Coach Carlie: So it's almost like if I just stay in my lane or stay in my sort of fixed way of thinking, it almost makes the decision making easier.
• 25:25
  Coach Carlie: I see this in nutrition too.
• 25:27
  Coach Carlie: So um yeah, it's almost like it makes it easier in a way for us to stay stuck, possibly, and to not be curious.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_00: I feel like the answer to your question, the reason I was struggling with it a little bit, is something that C Steve Jobs um fame famously said.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um sometimes you can't connect the dots.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you really can't connect the dots looking forward.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: You can only connect them looking back sometimes.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: So for me to answer your question, I think the thing that's most surprising, I I loved the journey of learning.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I loved it.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_00: It was a joke amongst my peers.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_00: I I fell in love with the neuromuscular junction.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: I know it's silly, it's a little area within the body, within our physiology where there's a communication between cells that are involved in like motor, you know, neuron communication.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's just very like I really did fall in love with that.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: But so I love the academic journey, but here's what my connecting dots looking back told me.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: And may this help your audience.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's the journey.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: It's why my podcast is called the PhD journey.
• 26:46
  SPEAKER_00: It's why I always say strength for the journey within.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_00: I I think that we set our mind on goals and performance and metrics and data and outcome.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: But I I'm here to remind you, it's don't forget what you're learning on that that journey.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because yeah, I love have being Dr.
• 27:03
  SPEAKER_00: Sarah Gordon.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'm happy I got the PhD.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_00: I made great friendships.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: I learned so much in five years.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there were so many things that there's no way I just being curious about a question, there's no way I could have understood the gravity, the depth of what that experience would have brought to my life.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think for me, it's it was it's now when I look back on it all, it was it's just about the journey of life.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever you pursue, if you're going for an Iron Man, yeah, when you finish that Iron Man, it's gonna I mean, I haven't done one.
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_00: I can imagine it's like the best feeling in your life.
• 27:48
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 27:49
  SPEAKER_00: And then when you reflect on it, you you think about all everything that got you to that to that moment in life, you know?
• 27:55
  SPEAKER_00: So that that that's my answer there.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_00: I mean that's awesome.
• 27:59
  Coach Carlie: And that, I mean, I know you mentioned Iron Man, um, but that was how I felt after I finished my first draath on, which was a sprint.
• 28:07
  Coach Carlie: And I know so many people are like, oh, I'm just doing the sprint.
• 28:09
  Coach Carlie: I'm like, people, please stop saying that.
• 28:12
  Coach Carlie: Like fast.
• 28:14
  Coach Carlie: You gotta go fast.
• 28:15
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 28:16
  Coach Carlie: It's just it's not just a sprint or just a 5k, like, you know, own whatever event you're doing.
• 28:24
  Coach Carlie: But that's how I felt when I finished my first race of like, holy smokes, I did that.
• 28:30
  Coach Carlie: And the process that got me there, and the way that all the different puzzle pieces had to fit together.
• 28:37
  Coach Carlie: And um, and that started the that basically was the impetus to the company that I've grown today, is that everyone deserves to feel that.
• 28:49
  Coach Carlie: Like, holy smokes, I just did that, and to reflect back and be like, dang, that was hard, but also, whoa, look at me now.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, the the American College of Sports Medicine says it so brilliant, brilliant.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_00: I can't say the word brilliantly.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: Brilliantly, yes.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_00: I always struggle with some of my words.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they say that they they are the like governing bot, you know, they they put out position statements on recommendations for exercise, for healthy individuals, for you know, people managing chronic illnesses and whatnot.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_00: And they say that um the way they word it is um any any movement is better than no movement.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so the the philosophy is like wherever you are, whether you're doing a sprint, Olympic, a half iron man, an iron man, like wherever you are on that journey, on that, on that continuum of fitness, wherever you want to be at that point in time, maybe you you maybe you've tried it and you just you would rather stay in a shorter distance.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's more fun, or you know, whatever, whatever it motivates you to be where you're at, doing something is always better than doing nothing.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that with that philosophy is just give yourself some grace that like you know you're out there to have fun and to enjoy it.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the research is very clear on that long-term adherence to physical activity is enjoyment, or or long-term adherence to and I'm gonna broaden it, I'd have to research it, but I'm gonna just say, based on my own research, long-term adherence to anything in life is enjoyment.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so if you enjoy being at a shorter distance, then that's where you should be.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_00: And so um, yeah, I think that that's it's true, you know, just we're all very hard on ourselves.
• 30:45
  Coach Carlie: We are all so hard on ourselves, and as you're saying this, it's making me think of the journey of aging through sport through and in particular in through the lens of inurosports.
• 31:00
  Coach Carlie: Um, you know, I started as a runner and then got into Traphon, but you know, we just had our race this past weekend, and our youngest competitor was 12 and our oldest was 75.
• 31:09
  Coach Carlie: Like that's that's amazing.
• 31:11
  Coach Carlie: So freaking cool.
• 31:13
  Coach Carlie: Um but those journeys are different.
• 31:17
  Coach Carlie: And the 75-year-old, when he came to registration, yeah, we had swim caps for um swimmers who feel like they might need a little bit more attention in the water.
• 31:27
  Coach Carlie: So he was asking for a red swim cap.
• 31:29
  Coach Carlie: I was like, oh, you know, like are are do you know why you're asking for that?
• 31:34
  Coach Carlie: You know, rather than just being like, oh, red is pretty, and I don't want the blue one.
• 31:38
  Coach Carlie: So just like clarifying with him.
• 31:40
  Coach Carlie: He's like, he's like, well, I'm like a hundred years old, so I figure somebody better keep an eye on me.
• 31:46
  Coach Carlie: I was like, okay, seriously, how old are you?
• 31:49
  Coach Carlie: So um that I think in our heads, like, okay, well, when I was 12 or when I was 20 or when I was 30 or whatever, I did 15 Ironmans, or I ran five minute miles, or and then I had a hip resurfacing, or I had a knee replacement, or I had um, you know, death in the family, or something like that.
• 32:13
  Coach Carlie: And to your point, giving themselves grace to let activity and the sport or a sport look different and be different because it is all part of the journey.
• 32:26
  Coach Carlie: It doesn't have to be when you're 75, the sport is gonna look different than when you're 30.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely right.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's adaptability.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: You have to to be successful, I believe, in life, you have to be flexible and adaptable, right?
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: You have to give yourself some grace to say, at 60, I'm not the same runner I was at 15, but I still love running and I still can push myself to be the best version of myself at this age.
• 33:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_00: So when you come, when you make peace with yourself and you stop comparing yourself to past versions of yourself, you're gonna find so much more enjoyment in what you're doing.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's ultimately the goal is to enjoy the the activities that you have, you know, in your life.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I think when we compare ourselves to past versions of ourselves or to past performance, look, you can use it in terms of like wanting to be the I am all about wanting to be the best version of myself I can be, but you have to recognize that my your body is it's called sarcopenia.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_00: As we get older, our body changes.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_00: We we're not gonna live forever.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: We can't control that.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we can't control the actual biology and physiology and all the things that happen in terms of longevity.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_00: Now, there's a lot of really interesting research going on in terms of longevity, and we are living longer for sure.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_00: I have to double check that.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_00: At one point, I I read we were, I'm not sure.
• 34:02
  Coach Carlie: We we fell off a little bit in COVID, and now we're sort of rebounding.
• 34:06
  Coach Carlie: Going back to it, yeah.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but but we want to live those added years with good health.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_00: I always say lifespan doesn't necessarily equal health span.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_00: So we want to live those added years in good health.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_00: So um, yeah, so give yourself some grace, recognize that aging is a process, yeah.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and that physical activity, your mental health, your physical health, your relationships and your lives are all really important in terms of aging successfully and um and quality of life too, you know.
• 34:38
  Coach Carlie: And it seems like it ties into your dissertation about these aging traphes and maybe their motivation.
• 34:47
  Coach Carlie: Like how what did you see in that process?
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I know the big thing was enjoyment, but well, I love my I love my dissertation research so much.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_00: I so here's a lesson for your audience.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you just have to pivot, it's beyond your control.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: You can hem and haul all you want, but you gotta pivot.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_00: I was in my program for three years thinking I was gonna do aquatic-based exercise with Alzheimer's patients because I think that the water and exercising the water has tremendous properties for aging with good health and and just awakening, awakening our brains and our bodies.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I just I I love to swim, I love to be in the water.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I I'd witnessed some of the stuff with my father who had Alzheimer's, and I would take him to the pool, and he would wake up and I was like, wow, there's something to this.
• 35:40
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_00: And three years into the program, I was told, no, you can't do it.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: There for dissertation research study, it would have to have been a case study, which they don't they they don't necessarily like to do case studies for a dissertation research project.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_00: They like us, they like to challenge us with larger sample sizes.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and Alzheimer's, um, there's something called the institutional review board, which your study has to get approved through, um, is considered a high-risk population.
• 36:10
  SPEAKER_00: It it's doable, but not a little lofty for a PhD student.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_00: So I literally had to go back and look within to say, okay, well, what do I enjoy?
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: What would be interesting?
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_00: I'm seeing these triathletes at these races.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_00: And then then the questions started.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I went back, did the literature review, I found that there was a significant gap in the research with older triathlones that wasn't performance-based or talking about decline as we get older.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it there's all there's research on sports participation as we age, but not specifically older triathletes, and definitely not the way I studied it.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: So mine was the first study of its kind.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so, what did I find with successful aging?
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's all kind of interconnected.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think you can say it's anything siloed.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_00: I think we we know through research that physical activity is very important in aging.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, it has so many benefits.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we all we all know that.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_00: There's the the level, the recommendations, you know, I that's a whole nother podcast.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah to dive into all of that and what the ACSM says and what research is saying about all that kind of stuff.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um can you exercise too much?
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_00: Can you do anything too much?
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_00: Perhaps, right?
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_00: Injury, injury is a good signal, burnout, all those kinds of things.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: And then um, like I said earlier, um, beyond physical activity, and I uh in my research, I call it um uh healthy living.
• 37:46
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot to it cognitive health, physical health.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_00: Um, there's a lot that feeds into healthy living is this sense of community.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_00: I think as you get older, uh sadly, I do think there are older people later in life who are isolated.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_00: And I have a friend who ran a study um a little bit different than mine.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_00: He he looked at older adults who um had mild depression.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so, you know, there there is there is a a dynamic that older people who are who are isolated and they they suffer more things like depression and loneliness and things like that.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: I think social connection relationships, uh however they look in your life, um, you know, going to sports or craft, being creative or you know, like a community center.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's important.
• 38:47
  SPEAKER_00: I think it it it helps uh keep things such as depression and loneliness um at bay.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 38:53
  Coach Carlie: So and as you're saying this, I'm thinking about um again, Natalie Grabo, who part of her ability to race is because her um husband uh was in a health condition who was not able to help her.
• 39:12
  Coach Carlie: She had to lean on her kids and onto some of her other friends slash neighbors and other, you know, fellow athletes to help her with transporting her bike and making sure that she got to all the, you know, helping her put her things together.
• 39:28
  Coach Carlie: And, you know, obviously she built that degree of competence to do some of it herself, but um, you know, she needed a little bit of help.
• 39:36
  Coach Carlie: And yeah, I think that it seems to me that as we age, we want to reach out less.
• 39:45
  Coach Carlie: And that seems like what you're saying is no, you need to ask for help because whether you're gonna go to your crafting class and a bus is gonna pick you up, or your kid's gonna pick you up, or your neighbor's gonna be like somebody's gotta get you there.
• 40:02
  Coach Carlie: And the more isolated we are, and we see this very clearly in the literature.
• 40:07
  Coach Carlie: Uh, whether you're a former endurance athlete or a current endurance athlete or whatever you like to do, the more isolated you are, the shorter the health span that you have.
• 40:19
  Coach Carlie: And so, whatever it is that you choose to be passionate about and stay could stay in, it sounds like you've got to keep your community and ask and ask for support so that you can keep doing it and keep that um and keep that fulfillment.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_00: Because we also um I do say this often on my own show, you know, it's okay to ask for help.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's okay, you know, there's strength in asking for help.
• 40:52
  SPEAKER_00: I know people see it as a weakness, but it's not.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: It's okay to ask for help.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and there's so many wonderful people out there want to help you.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they they people thrive on helping other people.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_00: So it's like it's a beautiful thing.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um, that was the first thing I wanted to say.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_00: The second thing, um, I want to make this one point.
• 41:10
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, actually, I have two quick points.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I wanted to mention when you asked me about lessons learned as you were just talking.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_00: I was just thinking some of these things we go through in life can create stress.
• 41:21
  SPEAKER_00: And stress is really stressed.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_00: If you do everything right, you eat right, you exercise, you hydrate, you do, you're doing, you think you're doing everything right, but your stress levels, you know, chronic elevation of cortisol on your body, like it it wears on your body.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_00: And so, stress, like managing stress, that was a big lesson I learned in my PhD program.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_00: There was a lot of stress.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_00: I was a full-time caregiver while I was getting my PhD.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_00: And so a lot of my work was, you know, at night, late hours.
• 41:55
  SPEAKER_00: It just it was very out of balance.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it was a lot of the lessons there were to learn on to manage stress.
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_00: Back to aging.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_00: There's something in our cultures and society, and it, you know, there's a lot of diversity in our conversation depending on where you live in the world.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_00: So highly individualized, a lot of cultural diversity in how we handle things.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_00: There's a lot of diversity in our opportunities for living self-determined lives depending on where you live in the world.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_00: So all these kind of factors.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_00: But there is something that kind of penetrates, it's called ageism.
• 42:35
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_00: Ageism are these false assumptions that as we age, we we aren't supposed to live highly physically active lifestyles in sports.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 42:47
  SPEAKER_00: That that wasn't the narrative for a long time.
• 42:49
  SPEAKER_00: It was that as you retire and you age, you you slow down, you do less, you hit the recliner.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a whole new group of uh there's a whole shift now towards aging with with being active, highly physically active.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_00: And that's why I loved my research so much because the triathlon community, triathletes, older triathletes demonstrate this much more um vivacious way of living life.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: And it and it's really a beautiful thing to watch and to see and to f and to see it flourish.
• 43:27
  Coach Carlie: Wow.
• 43:29
  Coach Carlie: That and you start winning way more awards.
• 43:31
  Coach Carlie: I mean, just saying.
• 43:35
  Coach Carlie: Because that's fun too, like you had mentioned, right?
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_00: It is fun.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: It is fun.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it doesn't necessarily keep people in it, but it is rewarding.
• 43:43
  SPEAKER_00: We all feel good when we when we when we uh succeed.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I have a really good friend.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna give him a shout out.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_00: His name's Mark Michelson, and um he's doing amazing work.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_00: He's been the like he was in corporate wellness years ago when it was just being founded, you know, with the big companies like A IBM and all those companies are starting to put in corporate wellness programs.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: He has a platform which I love, and that's why I'm sharing it.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_00: It's called Ageless Rebel.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_00: Ooh.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 44:14
  SPEAKER_00: Ageless Rebel.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_00: And it's all about looking at these older years in our life in a totally different from a totally different different perspective.
• 44:23
  Coach Carlie: Yeah.
• 44:24
  Coach Carlie: So cool.
• 44:25
  Coach Carlie: Um, and great segue to your podcast.
• 44:29
  Coach Carlie: And uh Sarah, how can people get a hold of you and listen to more of our platform?
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_00: Well, number one, if you if you're interested in being a guest on My show.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_00: I would love to talk to you and hear your story.
• 44:41
  SPEAKER_00: I I love to interview people and talk to people and hear your stories of things that you've overcome in your life.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_00: Um and the resilience.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_00: I call my guests resilience warriors.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_00: You know, we just never give up and we find avenues and opportunities to live our best lives.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I would love to hear from you.
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_00: Um the podcast is on every major uh platform.
• 45:07
  SPEAKER_00: And um there's something out there called RSS feeds, which are podcast feeds.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_00: They're free.
• 45:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's a free podcast.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_00: So it's on everything like iHeartRadio, um, YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts.
• 45:20
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many now.
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_00: Listen notes, castbox, Rifonics, Podbag.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, all you need to do is search Dr.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_00: Sarah Gordon, the PhD Journey Unplugged Podcast.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: Cool.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_00: And um, and you can email me.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: You can email me.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_00: Um my email's a little tricky, so maybe you can just I'll I'll put it in the notes.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_00: But you'll find me.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_00: You can find me through Chris too.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_00: And um yeah, I thank you for this opportunity to share and and um and connect on your podcast.
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, love it.
• 45:49
  Coach Carlie: All right, so before we head out, what are maybe one to three things that you want listeners to really um walk away with?
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I've been asking all my guests lately this one question, and you're welcome to use it too.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_00: I ask them at the end of every episode now, what are you train?
• 46:14
  SPEAKER_00: What what are you training for?
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_00: What are we training for?
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_00: And you can answer it literally, figuratively, metaphorically, however you want to answer it.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what are we training for?
• 46:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say to answer your question, I don't know if I could come with three that quickly, but that one is good.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think I'm just I personally am training and want to empower people to live your best life.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it's a short journey.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we have so much that we cannot control.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_00: And so why not uh put things in our lives that nourish our soul ourselves that where we can thrive and we can shine.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I tend to think I'm biased, I think physical activity is absolutely essential to manage stress, to do so many positive things in your life for your overall health and well-being, your mental health, and um the forming relationships.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the whole look, the whole reason we're connecting is through triathlon and you know, relationship building.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_00: And so um that's my take, that's my my final, I guess, um, thought is um find those things.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you're, you know, we're assuming people are listening and they're right where they want to be.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_00: But if you're listening to this, if you find this episode somewhere and you're you're just not, you feel like your life is just not aligned, you're not happy where you're at, you know, start taking small steps to move your life forward.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_00: You you have the power within you, you have the strength for the journey within to move your life, to, to, to get it to where ultimately you find fulfillment and satisfaction and peace.
• 48:08
  Coach Carlie: I love that.
• 48:09
  Coach Carlie: What a great way to finish.
• 48:11
  Coach Carlie: Dr.
• 48:12
  Coach Carlie: Sarah Gordon, it was so lovely to have you.
• 48:15
  Coach Carlie: Thank you so much for being on the Find Your Edge podcast and for the depth and um insights into both your life and your dissertation and your beautiful podcast platform.
• 48:30
  Coach Carlie: So thank you.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for the opportunity and um thank you for, I don't know if your listeners know this, but you you've been a mentor to me.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I appreciate it.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_00: The first time we actually spoke, I was very intimidated because I knew I'd been doing this for a long time.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't know half of the things you were telling me I should be doing or thinking about.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_00: And what a great example of just putting yourself into uncomfortable spaces sometimes to continue to learn and to grow.
• 48:58
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm I'm really grateful for that.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: Awesome.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_00: You're welcome.
• 49:02
  Coach Carlie: And uh, even though it was such a such a short conversation, but you know, you I think your podcast has so many amazing lessons.
• 49:12
  Coach Carlie: I'm like, ooh, I need to reach out to all the people that she's talked to, but like just go to her podcast and listen to all these amazing interviews that you find this it's pretty phenomenal.
• 49:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, there have been some pretty incredible voices out there.
• 49:23
  SPEAKER_00: So everybody's doing a lot of really great stuff in the world.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_00: It's really inspiring.
• 49:28
  Coach Carlie: It is awesome.
• 49:30
  Coach Carlie: All right, well, thank you again.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_00: All right, bye, everybody, thank you.