Latest / Two Girls and a Cup of Wellness / Gut Health Signs with Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel | Ep 33
Transcript
- Crissy and Marie: Hey everyone, we are back for another Two Girls and a Couple Wellness Chats with Dr. Sophie. So excited to have you here. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Thank you, really excited to be here as well. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. So I met Dr. Sophie. Yes, please give Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: us a little bit year and a half ago now in London. We were at the Institute of Functional Medicine, the course applying functional medicine to clinical practice. That's a mouthful. And there was a group of us all at the same table and it was wonderful, all from different parts of the world. And we all bonded in that four days. Were they for four days? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I think three, maybe four. Three or four. Yes. Crissy and Marie: Three. Yeah. It was excellent. Yes. Well, it's cool when you hear people gather for when people gather for kind of like the same thing, right? To to learn, to grow, to become better. And it's hard not to to connect with people like that. And how cool is it that you're all over the world and we get to do this. So Sophie is coming to us from Amsterdam. And this is why I love online stuff so much because we get to bring your knowledge and your expertise to our community here in Florida and all over the States and now all over the world. So thank you. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, thank you. Really nice to be here. Crissy and Marie: Good, good. Well, I think we're gonna, you know, kind of dive in all things gut related. And this is a very hot topic and for a lot of different reasons. But I think, you know, obviously the research coming out that the the gut kind of is like our second brain. And I love that statement because I think people need to understand more and more how important our gut is and how important it is. To understand what we put into our bodies. and I'm gonna just start here because you guys are gonna make fun of me, but I really want everybody, because I'm sure people are gonna be on the same boat as me. When I go to your website, it talks about orthomolecular medicine. And I was like, that's a mouthful, number one. And number two, I what is that exactly? And so I think a lot of people may be thinking the same thing. So can you explain that? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. And I think you agree. It's in English a mouthful, but also in Dutch. So so I Crissy and Marie: Okay. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: still think to it's related to functional as well as as integrative medicine. So it's I think it's about really understanding what's actually driving someone's symptoms. rather than looking at symptoms in isolation and then Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: using nutrients, lifestyle, targeted interventions alongside conventional medicine. Crissy and Marie: Beautiful. So yeah, it's a real integrative approach. So Dr. Linus Pauling was the one who won two Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: times Noble Peace Prize. And he was known for vitamin C, replacing vitamin C in individuals that were missing it. So that's that's how I think about it. You know, we're putting back what the body doesn't have anymore without a synthetic medication, unless it's needed, right? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, exactly. Un unless it's needed. But it's sometimes here in the Netherlands at least people think like, orthomolecular medicine is only about supplements. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: But I feel that if it's just about supplements, you're missing the the root cause, you're missing the point, because it's about giving the body what it needs or what it's missing. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's a pretty cool concept. Yeah, it is for sure. I I think that's we need to get on board here in America. So what really was the driving factor to getting you into gut health? Because I I mean, I know that that's your passion and you're so amazing Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: at it, but what really drove you to that type of field or focus? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Okay, so I think we start in med school, where I always was really interested in finding a job or doing something that had a combination with thinking and doing. So I was thinking kinegology, gastroenterology, but then when I did like an internship in gastroenterology, the gut was really fascinated to me. And then I thought, okay, I'm not quite sure yet what kind of specialist I want to become. Let's do a PhD first. And in this PhD, I ended up partly also a little bit by coincidence in pediatric gastroanthropology. Because I didn't want to do a PhD in the lab or with RETS. I wanted to work with people. And I had that opportunity in the pediatric PhD. And it was also part here in the Netherlands, but I also went to the States for two years. so I was able to, I think, yeah, develop on multiple levels. And during those five years, I learned a lot about gut health, about treating kids with functional. Bowel problems like constipation, like fecal incontinence. But all parents asked me in clinic, okay, doc, but besides the medication, what are we going to do? What can we do? What can we do at home? What what do you know about food? And we didn't have the answers then. And that was the first. Little seed that was planted, like, hey, I'm a doctor and I know so much about gut health and prescribing medication, very specialized treatments, but not so much about nutrition, lifestyle, keeping healthy. And during that PhD, my daughter was born and she got very sick. She got a bacteria in her hip, a bacterial arthritis. When she was four months old, and I just stopped breastfeeding. Very interesting as well. and then she had she needed surgery and two months of IV antibiotics. Crissy and Marie: Wow. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: And then all kinds of symptoms started. And then I was at the other side of the table asking my colleagues, but what can I do? What can we do with what she's going to eat? What can we give her? And they told me, Sophie, you know the answer. We don't know. And that's when I started to look further, like, okay, but what's there should be more than just conventional regular medicine. And that's how I yeah, learned about functional medicine, more natural, complementary medicine. And then I started to yeah, study further myself. Crissy and Marie: It's so that's beautiful. It really is. And and my mind is like just having a moment of like, yes, it's always when somebody is in the experience for themselves or for somebody that they love Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: that it is eye opening and it's life changing. Like, wait Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: a minute, hold up. Right. And then that's what's going to encourage change and lifestyle changes and learning more and education. So wow, yeah. That's Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: that was just like a a moment for me. Wow. I love it. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. I yeah, we all have, I feel like, especially in medicine, we all have that one moment where we're like, wait a second. Yeah, yeah, I don't like this anymore. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: There has to be something else. And when you dive into the research and we when you stay current, I mean it's there. And I think I don't know how you feel, but I feel like in America we're at a pivotal point where Providers are realizing, wow, there's more, there's more, there's decades of research in hormones, metabolic health, diet, nutrition, lifestyle, exercising. It's it's like a pivotal turning point and it's it's exciting. Yeah. Right? Yeah. 'Cause we're so sick. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: It I th yes, exactly. And we're getting sicker. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. And so are the doctors and the nurses and right. So it's not just, you know, doctors now having just patients. They're turning into patients as well. And that Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: is the eye opening moment for hopefully, for our medical system. That'll be an a huge Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah, Crissy and Marie: eye and opening eye. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: and I I'm not sure if you see that in America as well, but here in the Netherlands we still have these, I think two groups of doctors who are really open to it and those who are just not there yet. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: And as and sometimes that could be challenging with working with clients or patients, because here in the Netherlands you have to work with your GP and it it's The question is in which team is your GP. Yeah. And the interesting Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. I mean I had this situation. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: interesting thing is that you mentioned that doctors are getting more interesting in interested in that that there's more, but I also I also treat clients who learn so much about their body, but also about food and nutrition, that they're going to study. the same orthodoxular medicine as I did, because they want to work in the field as well, because of their own Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: experience. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. I mean, we've we've interviewed some doctors in the past that have jumped ship, you know, was in conventional care for so long. And then it was like, okay, I I gotta make some changes for my own lifestyle and and I gotta scream that from the, you know, the top of the buildings to everybody else, too. So so what are some the main symptoms that you're seeing in a lot of your clients. So and and the only r the reason why I wanna bring that up is more so for for some of our listeners, if they're experienced something, then maybe that would encourage them to go see somebody. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Reach out. Yeah. I think I I see kids and adults. So that's what I r I really enjoy. So I think I s I see the babies the babies and the eldest patient I think is eighty-six. so it really depends also on age what kind of symptoms they have. In I see really young babies with like reflux or or eczema. Then I see kids with constipation and abdominal pain. And then I think most of the clients are still adults and they experience often Bloating, diarrhea, constipation. I think that's abdominal pain as well, but I think especially abdominal discomfort with changing in bowel habits and bloating. I think that's the main symptoms that we see here. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Yeah. I mean I guess it's the same here too, you know. But Yeah. And I I mean, do you think that well, I think you know the answer to this. Things are starting way before those symptoms happen. Little Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: things, right? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: And I think that's the part of my work I enjoy the most. To start with the symptoms and then go back with them. And I tell them, I want to make this timeline with you. I want to make a movie of what happened in your life. And I want to understand. I want to see all the important parts in that movie. To understand, okay, you have symptoms. But what's beneath it, what's driving the symptoms? Because that's what we want to find out and to support. Crissy and Marie: Right. Root cause, right? It's not the symptoms themselves. It's not the stomach. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Exactly. Road gas. Yes. Crissy and Marie: It's what's a lot of subconscious things. It's a lot of trauma. It could be nervous system. I mean, think of how closely tied the gut is to our nervous system and our immune system. Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Exactly. Yes. And sometimes we see that there is like that something happened not too long ago that we can pinpoint like, hey, this is important. But sometimes when we talk about a nervous system and trauma, it goes back like years. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: How is it that with let's let's talk about kind of like toddlers into maybe, maybe even teens? Because Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: as a parent, I know children are not so easy to switch their diets. They kind of get stuck. I know I have one child that eats really, really, really good. I have one child that eats absolutely terrible. They're now in their 20s, so I'm done. There's nothing Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Just Crissy and Marie: I could do anymore. But What do you do when you are, you know, you're working with the parents, but the child Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: is obviously you got to change some things in the diet. How do you work with a child that is kind of set in their ways or obviously doesn't want to change or it's hard like because their taste buds don't like everything that you're wanting to have them eat? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. I think it's it starts with explaining, explaining why. And I'm always trying to have the conversation with the kid as well, maybe not with the toddler, but with the teens. You can. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Yeah, teach and Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Teaching them, understanding them, educate them about the why. Yesterday I spoke to a teenager who was having a severe constipation and we did microbiome testing and other testing, but I said I also want to focus on just having a good fundament in daily life. So I want to discuss let's drink enough water, let's move. Let's eat fibers. And we made a plan. Okay, eat two kiwi fruits in the morning, for example. And she said, Yes, okay, I can work with this plan. And yesterday I spoke to her, and she said, For the first six weeks, I was so motivated. And I did all the things. And My bowel habits were amazing. But then summer happened, vacation happened, I didn't do the things we discussed, and now I'm back to what it was before. So I said, okay, that's that's okay, that's life. But we learned something that your gut can function and you can have regular bowel movements, but you have to pay attention. And she said, Yes, but my twin brother, he is just having smooth bowel movements every day. I said, Yes, but you may be twins, but your gut is not the same. And maybe You just have to support your gut. You have to learn your own body. And you have to learn what's working and how you can support it. So I think it's about Crissy and Marie: Yeah. And not compare. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: exactly and not compare. So I think Crissy and Marie: Mm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: it's really about okay, what do we know from literature that's that's working? But what is working for the kid who is in front of me? What little steps can we do? Crissy and Marie: Right. So you're really customizing it for that child and Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: making it easily or obtainable really for them to kind of stay Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Exactly. Crissy and Marie: on it. But it so it's hard for adults too. I was just saying that's exactly where I was going because as you're saying, but I fell off. I'm like, think about how many adults say the same exact thing. It's like it's just it's just doing it to where it creates and getting right back on. Like I I tell my patients, eighty twenty, go to Spain. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. I know. I know. I know. Crissy and Marie: Eat the cheese, have the olives, you know what I mean? And come home and let's get back. Cause that's life. Yeah. But it's it's it's that that you need to know that you need to get back on and not go right down to those bad habits. But what beautiful Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: awareness for that child at however Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: old to start already learning the power of what we eat and how it affects our body and to Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: just be in that experience and be like, okay. Right. So learning at such a young age is Fantastic. But I mean I I don't wish I don't wish then the constipation on her. But Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. No, no, no, no. No, and and what I also try to explain is the the 80 20 rule, but especially why I like the AD. Because that's your your your base or your fundament. And if you don't know your AD or you don't have an AD, you go everywhere. You don't know after Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: the weekends where to go back to. But if you know what's working. You can decide to choose something outside the A D because you enjoy it or you like it. But then there's always your habits, your root routines where you can go back to. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Coming back to the importance of routine and creating the daily habits, like you said, of knowing this works for my body, this makes me feel good. I feel more energized. I'm able to go to the bathroom more. It's we can't scream that enough, but a lot of people always complain, I don't have enough time. And Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: that one, that one gets me because Yeah. And that's where you need to assess. I I Like for me, I assess the willingness of the patient. If you're not willing to put in the work, like I can't like I can't do I can't gonna come over and cook for you as much as I'd love to, but you know, it's assessing Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I can force you. No. No. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: to make sure that the patient is willing to do it. So when you have someone come in, what's your first thing that you do? Maybe after the testing? Do you normally test right away or do you try removing things from the diet? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I prefer to just sit with them for an hour first. Because then we can discuss their symptoms, their health. We could dive into that root cause. And then we can decide to do what which testing. And Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: sometimes I also feel like, ooh, let's wait with testing. Let's first start with changing diet, changing habits. Because if you want, for example, do a gut microbiome test or hormone testing, if you change what you eat, what you do in a day, if you exercise or not, it will change your test. So I'd I like to start with a conversation. Crissy and Marie: Mm. Yeah, they say you can eat healthy for two days and it might affect your microbiome, which is fascinating. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: In twenty four or forty eight hours you're affecting it. Yeah. Right. Good and Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Yes. Crissy and Marie: bad. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I I always explain my clients like, okay, we're not going to do microbiome testing every week because we have to wait for a while to see what is the change of your habits in these months. Because if we go to the to the states and eat like the standard American diet, our microbiome Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: will change. If we go to Italy or Spain, I don't know, in in in a retreat or something, it will change as well. But it's about finding what your microbiome is after keeping like a regular diet or having a routine for a longer period of time, because it can Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: change. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I know I'm just letting that sink in for a second. I was just in Columbia. So I ate a lot of Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: yeah. Crissy and Marie: exotic fruit. So I wonder what's happening in my stomach. I was in the Cayman Islands and I probably didn't eat very well, but here we are. But since I've been back, I've been very good talking about the eighty twenty. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: it's fantastic. What are your power foods where you like these are the best? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: The prop bower fruits? foods. Crissy and Marie: Power foods where where you just think they're so amazing or powerful or full of all the good stuff. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Okay. I think there's not just one power food. I Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: think it's about diversity, about getting all the macronutrients in, but also about getting all the colours of the rainbow in. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: And also about we're humans, we have our routines, we have our favorite recipes, we have sometimes picky eaters, but just yeah, using little tweaks here and there to create more diversity, and by that supporting the gut microbiome, getting more fiber in, getting enough Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: protein in. I think it's about. Daily choices instead of thinking that one superfood will save save the gut. Yeah. Exactly. Yes. Crissy and Marie: Right. Yeah. Right. 'Cause the news is like it's the blueberries. Right. It's the lettuce. Don't eat the lettuce. Yeah. Right. You must have these protein bars that are full of soy isoflavins that now give men Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: too much estrogen. Yeah. Well, the the whole pro protein thing right now, that's a little bit much. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: Is it craze is crazy here in America. Yeah. You can go to Dunkin' Donuts and get a coffee with protein. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: wow. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Because they changed the food pyramid, so now it's all protein, protein, protein. It's very interesting. Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: it's yeah. I I mean we we have the protein hype as well here, but not I don't think as much. Crissy and Marie: You can get what is it? I saw Jell O the other day with protein. wow. Like a dessert. It's just not that anyone should be eating jello, in my opinion. No. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: No. Crissy and Marie: I'll tell a funny story. My husband just turned the big five and we went to a place and they came in and he is not a jello person. He's more of a chocolate person. And I was like, can we do a birthday thing for him? And they come out and they bring this jello dessert with a bunch of like whipped cream or cool whip inside of it. Cool whips. And my husband just looks down and you could see the pi have pictures and you could just see his face look of disgust. I was like, sorry babe, it's not chocolate. That's what we give patients in the ICU jello. yeah. Congratulations on your when my father my father was passing away, you know, and Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I'll have to find this first and Crissy and Marie: two weeks before in the hospital, it was insure, it was jello, it was pudding, it I was mortified. but it's Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: was anything that he could keep down, you know, at that moment. I wonder if the jello, because it's gelatin, maybe it came Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: from like the old bone broth. And then they just added the chemicals in with the colors. I wonder. 'Cause bone broth's very good. I'm gonna research it and let you know. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: That's an is that's an interesting idea. Yeah. That's good. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: Yeah, no, that that's that's not for me. But I do like the idea of having people understand the importance of diversity in their diet. Because it isn't it how much of your gut, like how many different types of fruits and vegetables or s seeds, nuts, whatever legumes that your stomach, your gut is wanting. What's like the n quote unquote number? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: So I think you hear multi multiple numbers. I saw you doing like five. Crissy and Marie: Well, I was just reading a book the other day that said fifty and I'm I said Monday after I get back to my kid. I don't know, I all these doctors say something different. But I really want Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: to sit down and write every different thing that I have. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I think I know where where the numbers came from because they did a study where they looked at different groups of people who ate 10 different plants, or 20, or 30, or 50, or 80. And they noticed that more different plants you ate, the higher I think the diversity of your gut microbiome was. But they noticed that the more you ate, the curve was less steep. So it was going into a plateau. And so the more different foods you eat, it's still better for your gut microbiome. But they also thought we need to come up with a number that is reasonable for people to follow. If we come up, eat 80 different plants a week, people are like, no, I'm out. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Kinda hard to do. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: So that's why they c yes, so that's why they came up with eat thirty plants per week. And here Crissy and Marie: Okay. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: in the Netherlands it was translated to eight e eight th eat thirty vegetables a week. But it's just plant based food. So it's spices, it's nuts, seeds, grains. So if you implement all those, I think thirty you will get there. Crissy and Marie: Okay. I think you can. Yeah, I feel like that's kind of doable. We'll do it. We're gonna do it next week. I know. We're gonna test it. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. And for the people who feel like, yep, that's doable, then you could try 30 different every week of the month. So that's 120 per month. So most Crissy and Marie: yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: people get up to I think 80, 90, pretty quick. But then Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: most people have to discuss like okay, what do we have left? What can we eat? Crissy and Marie: Mm. Yeah. it's kind of interesting because like if if we're trying to eat seasonally and we're Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: trying to eat locally, there's only so much I think that we Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: could but I like the idea. I think it makes it easier adding in spices and herbs. And is are legumes and beans included in that as well? Okay. So Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. And for example, cilantro, parsley, dill, then you already have three. And if Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: you add pistachio nuts, pine nuts, walnuts, you also have three. So if you make a salad, then you are add up. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Really add up. Right. Cause I had a lot of stuff in my ca my salad. Yeah. All right. I th okay. We're let's test that. Let's test that. Yeah. Okay. We'll let you know how it goes, how it goes. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Let's let's test if you get up to hundred twenty. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. I have a quick question before Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: go ahead. No, go ahead. No. Okay. So sometimes I know for myself and a lot of people that I know and love, after eating certain beans, like The stomach, we feel the bloating. We feel it just Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: doesn't like lentils. I absolutely cannot eat. My stomach goes haywire the moment I have any. is there anything in preparation that first of all we can do to prepare the beans so that our stomach can absorb it better? Or is it more just of a sign of there's some type of irritation and what's the word I'm looking for? Like Allergy, alert allergic reaction to it. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah, or or disbalance or something that there is a sign that there's something off. Yes. Crissy and Marie: Yeah, intolerance or yeah. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: So I think your first question, you can soak beans or lentils if you are going to buy them dried. But it takes more exactly, but it takes more time. So you need to Crissy and Marie: Right. Which you should. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: be standing longer in the kitchen. And if you buy, I think beans or lentils from a can, I sometimes also do when I want a quick dinner. Then you just rinse them. Yeah. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: Rinse them. Okay. I do do that with some things, sir. Sure. Okay. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: And I think if you notice that you're sensitive to beans or legumes, eat small amounts. And try to build up like increasing the amount bit by bit. So the advice is go start low and go slow. Because there are lots of there is lots of fiber in it. And I think there's also the idea that we wake up with a flat stomach, and at the end of the day, our stomachs should be flat as well. But we eat during the day. And it is normal that when you eat, fermentation happens and that some gas is formed. And that it is okay and really normal that you have you experience some kind of air. But there is a difference between, yeah, I feel that I've eaten lentils or legumes, or there is some fermentation and some gas is formed instead of the other end of the spectrum. I'm so bloated, I have to unbutton my jeans Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: and I feel horrible. So that's Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I think that's a spectrum. So if you are experiencing some gas, I think you're fine, maybe. just decrease the amount you're eating at once. if you feel really, really, really bloated, then there could be a that could be a sign of something that's not right. And the question is, it could be digestion, it could be a dysbiosis, that could be a few things. But then one of my questions would be, is it only with beans or or lentils or legumes, or do you have that with other types of food as well? Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Got it. That's great advice. And that's I I reached out to Sophie because that's what was happening with my mom. She would always complain of stomach issues. And then when she was here, she said, I'm pregnant at the end of the day. I'm so bloated. And then I saw her stomach grow. And and she's tiny. And I said, Wow, you really are pregnant at the end of the day. I think you have SIBO. And she's doing great now. All natural, all natural regime. Yeah. Okay. And she So what were some of the Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Great. Crissy and Marie: changes that she did? Well, I did a we used oregano and we used bitters and a a Jerusalem artichoke supplement to help moving 'cause she was constipated as well. So her specific type of SIBO was because her gut wasn't moving and then basically everything was backing up and all the bad bacteria that were imbalanced were just having a good old feast in there and producing massive amounts of gas. And it was painful. Yeah. But you know, she's on a very she's on a special, you know, diet. Where she can eat certain foods. And when she went off of it for a few days, she felt it. You know? But it t SIBO's, I Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: feel like I don't I mean, you're much more experienced than me. I'm still getting my feet wet with it, but it seems like it takes a long time. Can we Well you can feel better right away. She felt better right away when she started, but I think just like your patient who went on vacation, right? All the symptoms came back. So let's let's talk about SIBO for a second. Let's Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Yes. Crissy and Marie: Can we dive into that a little bit for again for some Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, of course. Crissy and Marie: of the people who are like, wait, what is that? Yeah. Sorry. Acronyms. What is CA? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Well is SIBO. Yes. So SIBO is a small intestinal bacterial overgrowth. So you have too much bacteria in the wrong place. So your microbiome should be in the large amount in a large intestine and not in that number or that amount in the small intestine. So something happens. Why by bacteria Think I don't like the large intestine, I'm going to make my home in the small intestine. And there the bacteria are going to do what they are always doing, ferment fiber. And in that fermentation process, gas is formed. And depending on what type of bacteria there are located in the small bowel, different types of gas can be formed. And one of the main symptoms. people exper with SIBO experience is a bloated feeling, distended belly, lots of gas, sometimes trapped, sometimes burping, sometimes flatulent. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Thank you for explaining that. Cause I I I know you've kind of mentioned that a few times and I'm like, okay, I think I know what it is, but right. It's just easy. That's okay. Well, this the the reason why I'm bringing up some of these things that maybe I might be a little confused about because then I know our community Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: can be, is that I think was it our first or second interview, not even interview, just a conversation chat at one of our first or second episodes. And Marie's husband, Paul, watched it and he was like, What's yogi? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: yeah. Any that sometimes generals like Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: Like and you know, things that we kinda take for granted that we think everybody knows, it's like, you know, sometimes it's people don't get it. So it's always good to just explain it. So thank you. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah, you're welcome. So it's kind of a disbalance that's located in the small intestine. And I see we see that more and more and more. Do you see that in the states as well? Crissy and Marie: A lot of people have stomach problems, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's it's our food. It's the chemicals I think, you know, that we use in agriculture and the s I think it's a combination of things. Yeah, and go on and on stress and Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, I wanna say lifestyle. It's that twenty-four seven. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: keep going, keep going, and not taking Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: time to rest and digest. And Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: we started with that we spoke about habits and routines and people not having the time for your advice. I think that's really important with the with digestive issues because it's rest. and digest and when you're running Crissy and Marie: yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: yeah it's and when your your your GI system is your sensitive spot it's just not a good match. So you need Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: to make space in your life to just breathe, to just make time Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: to eat. Crissy and Marie: Yeah. The siesta. We all need a siesta. That's right. But even just slowing down and eating. A lot of times I'll eat so fast when I'm standing or I'm sitting in front of my computer and I'm eating while I'm working. And when we do that, we're not consciously eating Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: and chewing our foods and appreciating our foods, right? So there's that sense of gratitude also for what we're eating. So this is a fantastic reminder for all of us to just slow down the rest and digest. And I always think about that when I'm talking about the nervous system. And I say it all the time when my yoga class is, but really when we're talking about eating, also it's smart to do. Like rest right after you're done eating so that your food and your body can digest and, you know, absorb what it needs and get rid of everything else that it doesn't. Yeah. Yeah. That's true. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. And I think even sitting down at the table, enjoy the dinner with sh or share it with people you love. I mean, that's Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: contributing as well. Crissy and Marie: Right? Yeah. Like the blue zones. Yep. I love my blue zones. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Hmm. Crissy and Marie: I do. We're gonna create one. Yeah. Yeah. So I have one more question. And Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: I I I I'm sure it's the same for you, but you you have your patients and you have situations and they're kind of guiding you and you're learning with them because we can't know everything. We can't. No Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. No. No. Crissy and Marie: we need to refer, we refer. But what do you feel your link with anxiety in the gut is? Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: I think there there's a that link is there. Crissy and Marie: It's out there. Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. And maybe I can ask what kind of anxiety do you mean? Crissy and Marie: Well, I've I've seen people that are getting this anxiety later in life and you can't pinpoint it. The hormones are balanced. You're talking about, you know, obviously the stressors, but then I start to to go to the gut and say, What is going on? Is there an imbalance? Are those short chain fatty acids these things not being Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Mm-hmm. Crissy and Marie: processed that we need our calming mechanisms? And Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. Crissy and Marie: then, you know, these patients will go to other People and they're prescribing other things. And I'm like, God, this is all gonna make it worse. You know, when you Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: say that, I come back to lifestyle and I come back to nervous system regulation and I come back to the vagus nerve and vagal tone in the body. And again, everything that we were just talking about. When you eat calmly and intentionally and consciously, your body is also feeling that. But when you're eating so fast and rapid, then you're in an You're in a dysregulated state in your nervous system too. So Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, yes. Crissy and Marie: whatever the the physical link is, I'm not sure, but I know it's definitely tied to the vagus nerve because it's the longest nerve, you know, running in the body from the head to the gut. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yeah. So yeah, and what I what I also see is that's why I asked about the anxiety, because what I see in a lot of clients with gut symptoms is that the symptoms are a trigger for anxiety. Because Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: the triggers, if it's just a sensation, I'm bloated. The end of the story. No, because they're bloated. They're going in their heads. What is it? What did I just ate? Is it the tomatoes? Is it my breakfast? Why am I so bloated? no, it's still there. It's not getting better. I feel horrible. So they're stuck in this loop. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: and I see that experiencing these symptoms creates anxiety, often related to eating foods. And they create a really restrictive diet with Only eating rice crackers or rice or carrot and zucchini and chicken because that's what works. And Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: they're so scared to eat something else because it might give them symptoms. And currently, also in the Rome criteria, gut symptoms are Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: described as disorders of the gut brain microbiome interaction. And that's what I often explain my clients. That it's this interaction. It's not often about focusing on one of them. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Just food or just supporting digestion. Let's not forget the brain. And I always explain them for me, it doesn't matter how we work on the brain. We have to find a way that works for you. It could be hypnotherapy, it could be. breathing exercises, it could be yoga, it could be something else, Crissy and Marie: Meditation. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: meditation, maybe working with a psychologist or but we have to work in this in in in this interaction, in this system. Crissy and Marie: Mm-hmm. So you said that the gut brain microbiome. No, gut yeah. Okay. All right. Okay. I like yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Yeah, you said it correct. Gut, gut, brain. Yeah. Crissy and Marie: And I'm like literally doing a triangle like you were doing. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: So just a a visual for those who are not actually watching the video. It's, Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes. Crissy and Marie: you know, those three points. yeah. Fantastic. Awesome. Very informative. Very informative. I really enjoyed this conversation. I think. just starting the conversation more so about the gut and the and gut health and microbiome and you know, spreading your your light and your knowledge and your expertise in such a beautiful and very easy way to listen and your beautiful voice too. Thank you so much. Yes. Thank you. Thank you so Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Thank you. Crissy and Marie: much. This is great. Good to see you. And I'm hoping to see you in the spring, right? Possibly. DC. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Yes, yes, I I hope so. Yes. A really nice Crissy and Marie: Yeah. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: conference. Crissy and Marie: Yeah, I'm excited. Good. I might have to sneak in on that. That's right. That's right. All right, Dr. Dr. Sophie Kuizenga-Wessel: Me too. Yeah. Then we can can meet each other live. Love it. Thank you. Crissy and Marie: Sophie, thank you so much. Until next time, guys. Bye.