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Red Flags in Dating · Gay Men Going Deeper

0:01
Speaker A: Welcome to Gaiman going deeper, a podcast by the Gaiman's Brotherhood that showcases raw and real conversations about personal development, mental health, and sexuality from an unapologetically gay perspective. I am your host, Matt Lancadell. And joining me today is Michael Diorio and Reno Johnston. Today we're talking about red flags in dating, and we're going to be exploring questions like, what red flags do you watch out for in dating, and why are these red flags for you? What red flags do you bring into dating, and how do you deal with red flags in dating? So what we want you to get out of today's episode is some basic clarity on what you might consider to be red flags and recognition of your own red flags and how you can best navigate red flags in your own dating life. If you're new here, please subscribe to the channel on YouTube. And if you're listening on your favorite podcast platform, please subscribe there. Leave us a review. It helps us get into the ears of the people who need us. Okay, red flags. This was an interesting journey to go down for the last week. We give our questions out at the beginning of the week, and then we have the week to kind of contemplate it. So I was thinking about all the things that piss me off about dating. Then I had to get humble and had to look at how I piss people off in dating. So what is a red flag for those of you who might not know what a red flag is? So these are essentially like behaviors that we would observe in others that could potentially lead to us getting hurt. They're often things that we would look at in someone else and say, that's a deal breaker. I don't want to go down that road. Okay. But we also have like yellow and green flags, too. So yellow flags are like maybe things that we're maybe observing and others that could potentially lead to getting hurt, but you're not quite sure. It might not be a deal breaker. It might be something that you could negotiate and compromise on. And then green flags are obviously things that we want to move towards. Like those are opportunities to develop safety and connection and trust. But today we're going to be unpacking red flags, and it might bleed into a little bit into yellow flags, depending. But I just wanted to kind of define that. So red flags are going to highlight toxic behavior and people really, I'm a believer. I don't like to label people as toxic, but let's be honest, there's toxic people in this world. There's people who are on the antisocial spectrum, narcissistics, psychopaths, sociopaths, these sort of things. These people can be toxic. And if we don't identify red flags in these people, then we could lead to getting seriously hurt, even injured. So they're also going to highlight things like cruelty, lack of empathy. It's an opportunity for us to observe how people treat us and how they treat other people. That's one aspect of red flags. The other aspect of red flags is they're going to show us misalignments. So things like values, morals, beliefs, that might be things like political views, religious views, these sorts of things. And again, some of them might not be red flags. They might bleed more into yellow flags. Depending on how extreme you are in your religious orientations, lifestyle, misalignments and lifestyle. Could be things like substance use, sexual preferences, sexual frequency, like how we show up, these sorts of things, how active we might be versus how inactive we might be, and then things like compatibility. So, like, an example of that could be like relationship structure. So if you're somebody that really strongly values monogamy, somebody who's polyamorous might be a red flag for you, might not be a good match for you. And it's really important to note that what is a red flag for Michael might not be a red flag for me. What's red flag for? Reno might not be a red flag for Michael. So we're all kind of showing up, and we all have different codes and morals of how we view people. And so it's important to note that. And then we all have red flags that we bring into dating. If you're somebody that's like, I don't have red flags, that might be your red flag, that you don't think you have red flags. So it is humbling when you start to do this work and you start to look at, okay, how have I hurt people in dating? How have people hurt me? There's usually an equal balance here. Let's be honest, folks. We're all victims and we're all perpetrators in life, but especially in dating, because people hurt people. We can't control what hurts somebody else. So somebody might see my way of showing up in dating as very hurtful, and they could see me as a red flag, but I'm just showing up in what is normal to me. Right? So, yeah, important to note that. And then with that being said, people are always giving us ample opportunities to get clear about what we will and will not tolerate and to set boundaries and make need requests on the things that if our needs aren't being met in dating. They're giving us these opportunities, or they're giving us opportunities to get the hell away from somebody if they're showing toxic behavior. So, people in dating, we're always getting opportunities to practice the things that most of us struggle with, especially if we're people pleasers. And then some of you might be wondering, why do I always attract avoidant people or toxic people or people who are this or that or anxious people? Some of us, in my opinion, if we grew up in homes where there was a lot of red flags, we might become desensitized to noticing them, recognizing them. So sometimes the work is to become a little less tolerant of red flags and start to become more sensitive to seeing them and recognizing them. So our upbringing can really, really be an indicator of, like, how connected we are to seeing red flags, how connected we are to having boundaries around people that do show and display these types of behaviors that are more red flag in nature. So let's move in to our first question. So what red flags do you watch out for in dating, and why are they red flags for you? Let's start with Reno today. Yeah.
5:23
Speaker B: So I want to preface by saying that, for me, this is all very intuitive. And so I actually really had to think about what I'm gauging for, because I really feel my way through life and through situations. So it's kind of a touch and go, touch and go, touch and go thing, and it has a lot to do with energy and engagement. So, like, how does this person feel? How do I feel, and what is the experience of being with them? Right. Those. I would say those are, like, major filters for me. Some of the red flags that I listed are, I noticed how they engage with the people around them and how the people around them respond to them and how they talk about other people and relate and refer to their own lives. That's something I definitely pay attention to. And a trick is to notice how they interact with. If you go to a restaurant or something like that, or you're engaging with someone who's in service, notice how they interact with those people. Right. That can say a lot. I notice how I feel when I'm engaging with them when I leave them and after I leave them. So, you know, how do I feel immediately after I leave them, and how do I feel a while after I leave them? I pay attention to those as well, because how I'm feeling can sort of be a red flag, you know, if I'm feeling sort of, like, drained or I don't know, just, yeah, if I'm feeling trash, like, that's probably a sign, you know, that maybe I want to distance myself. I notice how they react or respond to the moment and to whatever comes up, and also their responsiveness in general. And are they consistent? Because if that's missing and, listen, guilty sometimes, I'll be honest, then we may have a red flag and then some more playful ones. For me, I guess, were like, if he doesn't cuddle, if he's not into deep conversation, if he's not taking care of himself, we're definitely not going to work out. And funny enough, like, that used to be my type when I was a fixer. Now I'm like, nah, nah. Now I could change you. I could change you. No, I'm not trying to change anybody.
7:41
Speaker A: What did you do that helped you get away from that fixer?
7:44
Speaker B: Oh, my God. A lot of trying to fix, like, it was exhausting. It's just like, well, they say the definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result. So there was just a whole lot of insanity. And eventually it just hurt so bad and got so exhausting that I was like, I don't want to do this anymore. And I think simultaneously what was happening there was that I was evolving, and I was growing to value myself and doing the work required to love and honor and appreciate myself. And as that started happening, it was like, oh, well, I only want people in my life who love and honor and appreciate me and goo. Who do that themselves as well, or moving in the direction of that, at least, you know? And I say that with the utmost compassion, because a lot of those people, like, I still had love for, and I still have love for, you know, it's like, I. I really care and let my desire to fix, so to speak, be a testament to my caring heart. But also, like, that's just not how this works, you know?
8:52
Speaker A: So was there a shadow side to your fixer? Because I get it. There's altruism to it as well. It's like, we want to care for people, and we're, like, compassionate. But was there a shadow side to it?
9:01
Speaker B: Definitely. I mean, knowing what I know now, I would say, like, I grew up in a household with a lot of trauma. And my biological father, I didn't meet him until I was 33, I think, which is, like, a few years ago. And my dad, we had kind of a tumultuous relationship growing up, and. And then my mom struggled with addiction. So did both of my dads. And some of my other family members and the people in my environment. So I think wanting to, like, fix the people around me, wanting to, like, save my family, my siblings, just growing up in that environment, I think there was a shadow side to it is reconciling or like resolving that story or getting to live out of. It's like, oh, I couldn't fix this, but I can fix them. I couldn't fix them, but if I can fix him, you know, that sort of thing. And I think also, and you probably thought of this already, it took some of the heat off of me, you know, because if I, if I focused on fixing somebody else, then I don't have to work on myself. I don't have to look at myself. Right. So, I mean, that one was big as well.
10:16
Speaker A: I want to just honor you for a minute because, you know, growing up in a home and a household like that, where there was a lot of stuff, a lot of moving parts, and the fact that you turned out the way that you did and you're like coaching and you're sober and you're living like your best life, I think it's a testament to the work you've done.
10:32
Speaker B: Yeah. Thanks, Matt. I really appreciate that.
10:34
Speaker A: Mister. Michael, what about you? What red flags do you watch out for in dating?
10:38
Speaker C: I will say I used to have a long list of red flags, yellow flags and green flags. And as I have gotten older, that list shrinks and shrinks and shrinks. Because a lot of the stuff that I thought mattered doesn't matter as much. There are still some things on the list, and we'll get to that. But now, when I'm thinking of it, I love what Reno you had said about just, you know, how do I feel when I'm with him? If I had to, like, narrow it down, that's one of the main things. But ultimately, I want a man who can love me the way that I want to be loved and who can receive the love that I've got because I've got a lot of it to give. But, yeah, I used to have my list. My list was very, like, specific about all these things. And as I've gotten older, it's just not so much there anymore. Not as much. But there are some things that are still very much there and very much alive and, in fact, probably have grown some of my red flags. So I'm going to tell you, the one that comes up, the one I chose to discuss today is one that comes up a lot. So I'm going to trigger a lot of y'all out there. Also, I'm going to follow Rito's path and say, you know, me too. I'm not saying that I'm, I'm an angel here, but I noticed this a lot with guys that I'm dating. I think, are we all in the dating world? All three of us?
11:43
Speaker B: Yeah.
11:43
Speaker C: Ish. Ish. Yeah.
11:44
Speaker A: Okay.
11:45
Speaker C: Yeah. So it's alive and well. This is a really well timed topic. Okay. So I was trying to think about what this is called and I struggled to find a name for it. So I'll have to describe it. But I put it under the umbrella of what I call the inability to manage time. You might call it flaky, unreliable and unfocused. These things. Flaky, unreliable, unfocused. They like just immediate red flag. For me, for example, someone who is constantly late, always late or forgetting. Oh yeah, I forgot. I forgot. We're going to do that. I forgot about that. There's always late, never on time. Of course, guys, one offs are fine because shit happens. I get it. It's fine. But I'm not talking about the one offs. I'm talking about it is consistent pattern that they are late and they forget it. And then when we are together, they're easily distracted. They're looking at their phone, they're over here, they're over there. They're just not focused, not present to me. I also put this under. They lack integrity with their actions and their words. So if you say you're going to do something, do it. But for me that is like number one. I know how this is difficult for so many guys out there. If something comes out of my mouth, it is as good as done. There's no drama. It's done, it's done, it's done. There's nothing around it. There's no chance I'm going to forget, no chance I'm going to be late. Unless of course something happens. So when this becomes a habitual trend for me, I'm just like, I can't even do this. And not only is it a red flag, but it is extremely unattractive. Total boner killer. Like you can be a super hot guy and there might be some red flags and I'm like, okay, well maybe you're not long term relationship material, but maybe you're fun material. No, this is like you're dead to me. I can't deal with it. So that to me is my number one. And it gets under my skin. You can probably tell because this happens a lot. Like I'm dating guys who are, like, in their thirties and forties. I'm like, what? Guys, grow the fuck up. What is happening in the world? Like, get your shit together and rant.
13:26
Speaker A: Why is it a red flag for you? Let's go into the second part of the question. Like, where does this come from within you that it feels like it's very charged for you?
13:32
Speaker C: To me, if someone cannot manage their time, then the story is like, your life is probably a mess. You're probably all over the place. Like, you're probably not managing your mind. You're probably not managing your finances. You're probably not managing much really well. And time is. I do a lot of work on time management. Time is our only finite resource, the only one we've got. You can always make more money. Things come and go. Time is limited. So I'm not saying this like an impatient, rushy way, but. But the way that I go through life is when I'm present with you. If we're on a date, I'm with you, I'm focused. I'm present. You won't even see my phone. There's nothing going on. Like, I'm focused on you. This is our time. When I relax and I'm chill, I'm in my fun mode. I'm relaxed, I am chill. I'm in my fun mode. I create a very strong container around my blocks of time. Doesn't mean that I'm, like, super disciplined about, like, oh, it has to be from 04:00 to 06:00, that kind of thing. But when I'm in a space and I'm in that energy, I'm 100% in that energy, whatever, when you want to give me work mode, coach mode, podcast mode, play mode, date mode, so I see that as someone can't do that, then the story is you're not managing your mind. That's how I see it.
14:35
Speaker A: And then, so what does that mean about you? Like, if you were to say, because, like, they're over there, they're not managing their time, what is that? How would you possibly get hurt by that? Or, like, if it's a red flag for you, like, what is that? How does that interfere with you and your life?
14:47
Speaker C: Yes, yes, yes. Good question. Because time for me is, like I said, my most finite resource. So I'm very disciplined with my own time. I don't fuck around with my own time. And so someone else is going to come in and, like, disrespect that, like, by being late all the time or by not communicating things like, again, I don't want to make it seem like you can't be late, but there's a way to be late that's respectful. Like, oh, hey, I'm running late. It's going to be about a half hour till I'm there, you know? Fine, cool. Give me that. Heads up. I can find something to do. But it tells me that because I am so disciplined and I guess the word is sacred, my time is sacred to me.
15:19
Speaker A: Right.
15:19
Speaker C: People say time is money. Sure. Yes. But time is sacred to me. So, yeah, when people can't manage it, it's like, well, if you can't manage something that's sacred to me, then it's not going to work.
15:27
Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. The word that stood out, well, other than sacred, sacred is kind of on one end of the spectrum. And the other end of the spectrum, what I heard you say was disrespected, right? So if, like, somebody's not showing up in these ways, you feel disrespected, which is the opposite of, like, somebody's treating my time as sacred, right. So I think a lot of people are going to relate to that. I relate to that tremendously. And actually, one of the things I value most about you in being your business partner is that you are a man of your word. You get shit done. Like, and I'm the same way. Like, we're very loyal to our word and so, well, kind of blend what you guys said, and that's a lot of the my things. But, yeah, there's some real big ones that show up, and they're the top three I have is inconsistency, lack of transparency and poor communication. Those are all intertwined in the same thing. So people who are inconsistent and they don't show up, they are terrible at communicating. I was just relating with a guy, and it was just a nightmare. Like, honestly, just a total nightmare. And I'm like, so I just ended it. I was like, this is not going to work. Like, you're a horrible communicator. But again, in fairness to him, he had on his tinder bad texture. And I'm like, that should be my first right. I did. I dishonored my own red flag. I bypassed it. So he's actually telling me that he's a terrible texter. And I just, that will not work for me. Like, I am a very strong communicator. I need communication, especially as a demisexual. That's how I build up the yumminess is through texting and communicating and sending videos and pictures and things like that. Why is that important to me? Because like you, Michael, it just goes through a filter of I'm being disrespected. They don't value my time, they don't care about me, they don't actually want to build a connection with me. So I put it through the filters of probably I'm not enough or I'm being disrespected. Something along those lines moving too fast. People who try and create a faux relationship before it's actually at that stage. Like relationships are meant to have a developmental milestone point and somebody who's treating you as if you guys have been together for three months, but you've only been together for three days, it's like, okay, red flag for me because we haven't actually got the juices flowing yet. So how come you're talking about juices when they're not flowing yet? So that's a red flag for me because that's usually a sign that somebody has an anxious attachment and they're, you know, maybe they're people pleasing, which is another huge red flag for me. I tend to attract that a lot is people who dishonor themselves and they show up. They almost like vet me and they'll assess me and they'll be like, this is how he wants me to show up. And they'll mold themselves into that. And the kind of the downfall of having this podcast is exactly that. People can reach out and they can show up in what they think that I want them to show up as. And that is a huge turn off for me because I'm like, I just want somebody to be themselves, be authentic. Don't try and fit yourself into my puzzle piece because I can feel it. It feels inauthentic and it, so I love when somebody's authentic and people pleasing is the opposite of authenticity, in my opinion. Vanity, vanity, vanity, vanity. Like I again, was there, I was a fitness trainer. I was posting all sorts of scandalous and thirst traps and stuff. And I know the place in me that that was coming from, it was coming from a lot of shame and inadequacy. And when I see vanity and excessive amounts of vanity, I'm not talking like the odd yde know, shirtless photo here and there, but like, I just think that that's a red flag for me because I don't want to date somebody that needs to get their sense of self or their self worth from social media because that also leads to other problems. Like if you're going to get into a long term relationship with a guy that does that, he's going to have people thirsting over him constantly and he's going to be lured out into the social media world of, you know, like, it's so, it's just for me, it's not, it's not what I would want. If I was going to be getting into an open relationship with somebody, it would probably be less of an issue. But if I was going to be monogamous with somebody, it would be a red flag for me. And then drug and alcohol use is a big one for me because I prefer living sober. And I think at the end of the day, the ultimate, the relationship I want and that I'm seeking is a sober relationship where drugs and alcohol aren't, aren't used in the dating world. I'm fine with it. But if I were to actually settle down with somebody and build a life with them, I wouldn't want drugs and alcohol to be a part of that. So it's something that I'm always monitoring. It's kind of like a yellow flag for me. Uh, drugs is more of a red flag. Alcohol is a yellow flag for me. And then lastly, uh, hygiene. Like, it's just so, so important for me. So, you know, like I've said this on different episodes before I go on dates, I'm like, looking in their ears to make sure they clean their ears. Like, that's just who I am. I don't like uncleanness. I think cleanness is a green flag for me, so. And it also just shows how they take care of themselves. If they're eating McDonald's every day, it's like we're not going to be a good fit because, like, I want somebody who values health and hygiene.
20:00
Speaker C: So I love all those. Both of you guys had some really good ones that I would subscribe to as well.
20:06
Speaker A: Yeah. So hopefully, the listener viewer, you were stimulating. We're getting your juices flowing. So take a moment and if you have to pause the episode and just reflect, what red flags do you watch out for in dating? And then ask yourself, get a little curious, why are they red flags for you? I think it's important to take a look at that and if you want to continue these discussions with us. On the last Thursday of every month, we have our sharing circles, which are large format, where people can come in and just share to the large group. And we also have one, those happen on the last Thursday of every month. And then we have our connection circles, which are more intimate pods, just like Michael Reno and I will put you in groups of three to four and you can unpack these questions and hear from people in our community. If you would like to join those, you can go to gaimansbrotherhood.com and check out our event section to RSVP. If you don't have Facebook, you can always get on our email list and we will send you the zoom link to the sharing circle. All right, Reno, what red flags do you bring into dating?
21:03
Speaker B: Well, let me start by saying I don't have any red flags. Yeah, right. You know, it's funny, when y'all were talking about integrity and, like, time management and that sort of thing, like, I noticed I got a little, like, hot, but not like in the defensive way, more so, just in a vulnerable way. Because as I'm sharing red flags that I bring, I take care of myself, I take care of my space, I take care of my life. And also in a lot of ways, I can be very flowy and move very intuitively. And so it's not unheard of that I suddenly pivot. It's not unheard of that I show up late. I don't do this on dates, and I tend to avoid doing this when it's, like, really important. And if I think that I'm going to be late, I communicate that as best I can and as soon as I can. So I acknowledge that I'm a work in progress and I celebrate my effort. I celebrate and acknowledge my effort. Don't always get it right, but I get it right a lot more now than I used to. So these are red flags for me. But they. Sorry, they're not red flags for me, but they may be, like, for someone else. And what I said was like, I don't have red flags. I say that playfully because my view of myself, and I wrote this down, is that I am perfect, perfectly imperfect, whole, and ever evolving. And so I acknowledge that as I share what I'm about to share next. And some of you may be thinking, you're full of shit, just get on with it. And that's fine. That is totally fine. So something I'm evolving in is being hot and cold.
22:47
Speaker A: I.
22:47
Speaker B: And what this means for me is that sometimes when I feel hurt or insecure, I will close up, shut down, or distance in order to feel safe and to cope. And so my practice has been to lean into when that is happening, to lean into the person, to lean into the experience when that's happening. I don't always get that right. But again, I get it right more often than not.
23:12
Speaker C: These days.
23:13
Speaker B: Something else I'm evolving in is the story that I'm too much and how that can sometimes manifest as withholding my power. It can also manifest as insecurity, and it can occasionally manifest as defensiveness. If I notice that I'm in a state of mind or being that I'm too much and I'm projecting that onto my partner, then I'm relating to them in a somewhat defensive manner. Right. I have to defend myself or, you know, they think I'm too much, so I've got to tone it down and so my insecurity becomes about them as opposed to me, just like owning it. Right. So that's something that I'm working on. And thank God I have the awareness of that now. Something else I'm evolving in is my, and I said working on, and I'm also using the language of evolving in because this feels really important. I recognize again that I am, yeah, that this is an evolutionary experience. So something else I'm evolving in is my relationships to finances. So I make money, I enjoy money, I invest money in myself, I am generous with my money, and I love money. And also managing finances has been challenging for me. And so I grew up in a household where, like, my grandfather, he was great with managing money and sort of hiding it, but he didnt communicate, like financial education to my mother. And my mother watched my grandmother struggle. And so what I saw was a lot of people struggling with finances. And it took me some time and continues to take time to sort of learn to manage it. Im great at creating it, im great at spending it and having fun with it and all of that. But yeah, I would say those are some of my red flags. The other two, again, couple of fun ones. Well, one fun one. This one's not so fun. And I actually wanna. If anyone who's listening has experienced this as a result of being in connection with me, I apologize. I've ghosted in the past, and I don't feel good about that. You know, I don't feel good about that. Like, just going on a date with someone and then, like, it's not happened a lot. Cause it just feels so icky, but it's happened and I don't feel good about it. And it's generally because I was afraid to communicate to them that I just wasn't into it, you know, that felt uncomfortable for me. And so I own that, that it wasn't about how they would feel, it was about how I would feel, you know, because they think it's easy to be like oh, well, I just didn't want to make them feel bad. It's like. And there's another layer to that, which is you didn't want to feel bad. And so let's just, like, own that, you know? And lastly, I watched the real Housewives, and that might be a red flag for some of you, but I watched the Real Housewives, and I'm so excited that Beverly Hills is going to be on tv this fall. I'm stoked. So, yeah, that might be a red flag for you. I don't know.
26:17
Speaker C: For somebody else, it's a green flag, so.
26:19
Speaker B: Yeah, I know. And if it's a green flag for you, call me. Yeah.
26:23
Speaker A: What was it like to reveal that Reno?
26:25
Speaker B: All of it.
26:26
Speaker A: Like, all of it? Yeah. Like, what? What are you feeling right now?
26:28
Speaker B: Yeah. Honestly, relief. And I hope this, you know, I actually don't care how this comes across now that I think about it. Initially, I was like, I hope this doesn't come across as, like, arrogant or bane or something like that, but I'm proud of myself. And I love myself. I love that I just shared all of that. You know, it feels relieving and it feels empowering to acknowledge all of that and to acknowledge it publicly, to own it and just sit in that, you know, and be with it and hold it. So, yeah. Yeah. I'm glad you asked that question. Thank you. And it's also reflective of my awareness, my growth, my progress, my humanity, you know? Yeah.
27:11
Speaker A: So, yeah, thanks for being vulnerable and real with us.
27:15
Speaker B: Thanks, man.
27:16
Speaker A: What about you, Michael? What red flags do you put?
27:20
Speaker C: How much time we got? I was thinking it would be really fun to have our exes answer this question on this episode because that is.
27:27
Speaker B: Terrifying and exciting all at the same time.
27:30
Speaker A: Right? Yeah.
27:30
Speaker C: I mean, I'm all for it. I think it'd be fun and interesting. Okay, so, yeah, this was a great question. People will say that as you get older, you get more picky. And so as I've gotten older, I would say I see what they mean by that because I do, I think, come across as picky, and maybe I am. But oddly enough, I say I'm more open minded than I've ever been in terms of the kind of people that I would date. So it's kind of strange. And as I was just saying, I don't have as many red flags and yellow flags as I used to, just more open minded in general. But what I will say is that I know precisely what I'm willing to compromise on and what I'm not. This just comes with the years of being me and the work I do. So I know who I am. I know very deeply who I am. I've developed a very intimate relationship with myself, my needs, my desires, my boundaries. I have a very strong sense of self. I do come across, I think, very confident and confident. I express myself very directly. I have no problem saving. No. And I'm really good with boundaries. So when you put all that together, the feedback that I have received is that I can be intimidating and sometimes uncompromising. I get it. I don't think I'm intimidating, but I can see how others may have, who have not done that work on themselves, to know themselves deeply. They may have loose boundaries. I do not. No chance you're going to get through my boundaries. This is not happening. Um, I'm also very direct about my needs. Right. So, again, for a lot of people, they see me interacting in the world and like, wow, this guy's, like, a bit intimidating. He's a little bit uncompromising with what he wants and needs. Now, I know that I can compromise. I just know what I'm not willing to compromise on and what I am. There's many, many, many things that I'm willing to compromise on. Lots.
29:12
Speaker B: Tons.
29:13
Speaker C: But there's some things that I'm just not. And I don't even. It's not even a negotiation. Like, I used to be. Like, okay, well, let's just see. Maybe I'm wrong. I'm like, no, I'm not wrong about this. I know what I want. So that I would say would be a red flag. I've also had heard this feedback from, oddly enough, my mother. She watches everything I do and listens. I'll listen to this right now. And she's told me a few times, like, you know, Michael, you can come across a little bit intimidating with people. And I'm like, yeah, but, mom, you know what? To the right guy, he's gonna see this and be like, wow, that guy is like, I respect that. I love that about him. You know? Like, they're going to. They're going to find that attractive, right? I'll give you an example of how this works in the real world. This happened to me over the summer. So I'm the kind of guy who, in dating, I will see you if it's an appropriate time, if it's an appropriate environment, I will approach you. I will ask you out and ask your number. I'll ask for your insta, whatever that is. If that goes well, I will be the one to say, hey, you know what? I really like this. Let's go on a date sometime. It'd be really nice to get to know you. I will suggest a date. I will suggest a time. I will suggest a place. I'll put forth ideas. And if you don't like it, that's okay. You can put forth once either. I'm not saying it has to be this, okay. That's what I'm saying. I'm not uncompromising, but I will lead the way. I'll take your hand and I'll say, come with me. I got a perfect restaurant we can go to. It's the perfect vibe. It's quiet, great service, nice lighting. It's outdoors. All the things I love. It's perfect for a date. So I know the place. I'll make the reservation. I'll be there five minutes early. You know, I'll even tell you ahead of time because, you know, it was my suggestion that I'll pay it to my treat. That way. This question isn't lingering over us during the day like, I've got it covered, not a problem. And so during the date, I'll be very focused. I'll be attentive. You won't see my phone at all. It's not on the table. It's in my pocket, silent, not buzzing, not dinging, nothing. Right? That's just who I am. If I see something or someone that I like and I want to roll with it, I will lead the way. I'll pave the way. Some people will see that, as my ex used to call it, bulldozing. And I'm like, well, if no one else is going to do it, then someone's got to do it, and that'll be me. I have no problem taking that role. So some of you might find that intimidating, might find that bulldozing, but others of you are thinking, fuck, that sounds great. And so Im talking to you. Im talking to you people. If youre in that crowd, then like Renault said, give me a call. If you find that intimidating and bulldozing, then Im probably not your guy.
31:23
Speaker A: I love it. And I think it all depends on what youre looking for, right? If we use this notion of masculine, feminine, yin yang, whatever you want to call it, because that sounds like very masculine, youre showing up in a very masculine energy. If youre attracted to somebody who is in their feminine, I think that would be a really great approach and you guys would come together really well, which is funny because I see star as more a guy that's more in his feminine. But if you're attracted to masculine, like, a guy who's in more in his masculine, then it's going to be this. You'll just butt heads a lot, which tends to be my issue as well, too. It's like, oh, my, I'm so attracted to masculine men, but I show up in my masculine right as, like, a guard. Like, I do some guarding with it.
31:59
Speaker C: But, yeah, but it's not like if I did that with a guy and I asked him, and I said, here's the restaurant I go to, whatever, and he's like, oh, no, that's a bit too far for me. I don't go out of my way. Fine. Okay, cool. Then I'll find something else. Or, like, then you put forth a suggestion and I'm willing to go there. Right? Like, it's not like it's uncompromising. That's the part that I have a hard time with. Like, I don't like that label is uncompromising. I just know what I'm. But if he said to me, oh, no, instead of going out to a quiet restaurant, let's go to this nightclub. I'm like, no, I'm not going out on a nightclub for our first date. Absolutely not. And that's uncompromising. So it's a tough question. I like it, though, because for me, it's very nuanced.
32:33
Speaker A: Yeah. Do you attract a lot of people? Pleasers?
32:36
Speaker C: I used to, yeah. Because I think they would easily bend to me, which, again, they would call it bulldozing. And I'm like, well, you need to have a boundary or you just stand up for. Because if you don't stand up for yourself, I'm going to run right over you.
32:47
Speaker B: I love that you're so clear, too, about that. And I totally get that, you know, with my ex. And he would say this, we had to work through this because he would get so frustrated. I have my own rhythm. He has his. Like, this guy, so masculine. He wakes up in the morning and it's just go, go, go, go. Right? Like, he's like, talk about bulldoze. Like, he's just going. And you're like, you're either with him or you're not, but he's going. Right. And I love masculine men, and I loved that about him. Where we had issues, though, was I'm more flowy. And so, like, he's up. I'm still, like, in bed. Like, waking up slowly, taking my time, getting ready. Right? Like, it's a whole. I flow through life and I love that about myself. And so we had to communicate and just get on the same page. He's like, okay, I'm going to leave in the morning, I'm going to come back around ten, I'm going to pick you up and we're going to go. Right? Because then he's not waiting around, resenting me, blah, blah, blah. Because I'm like, I'm not doing anything wrong and neither are you. We just got to communicate. And now that you know my rhythm and I know yours, we're good to go.
33:58
Speaker C: I love that. That's exactly how it's working with the guy that I'm currently dating now. He's very much the same in that way. But you said it perfectly. We just communicate that out. He's like, well, I'm a lounger. I take my time. And we just talked about it. He was just here actually. And I'll just say, well, here's my one request, is that it's quiet. I just like my quiet mornings. I don't want tv or anything on really, really early. And he's like, okay. And what I want is just don't ask me any big questions or don't come at me with the day. Okay, cool. And it works. So that communication is really, really important. And I can respect that because it's not like we have to be on the same speed. It's like he will stand up for himself. He has no problem telling me, no, I'm not doing that. And that's what I respected, admired. You don't have to be like me, but just stand up for what you need and communicate that very clearly and we're going to be just fine.
34:43
Speaker B: Yeah, that's huge what you said. Advocating for yourself and your needs in relationship. Huge. One of the biggest lessons I ever learned.
34:52
Speaker A: Yeah, I love that. Communication for the win. That's why communication is so important. If you're not a good communicator, take some courses, get good at communicating because, right. That's the. Your relationship could have ended because of that, right? The resentments building. But no, your communication leads to problem solving. You figure out a solution and two people that maybe aren't the same can make a relationship work. Right. So I love it. It's funny that you say that, Michael, about having our exes on because I thought about that. I'm like, which exes would I bring on? And I should have a panel and it should be readdez flag screen flags. They can just tell me how amazing I am and they can also tell me how terrible I am, and it would be very humbling and it would be a great opportunity for me to test where I'm at with my nervous system.
35:35
Speaker B: So let's do this. I'm in.
35:37
Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, we'll have the conversation. So, yeah, the first one for me, and it's funny because this is the number one thing I look for in others is consistency, but I'm terribly inconsistent and more so just in what I want. I am pure Gemini, and in one moment I want this, the next moment I want that. It's a good example, is monogamy versus non monogamy. I sometimes want that, sometimes want this, and I'm always flipping around between what I want and desire because I can see the pros of everything. That's the thing with being Gemini, is we can see the benefit of everything. So I'm like, yeah, this could be really fun, blah, blah, blah. So I try my best to show up consistently and when I, but also when I say I'm going to do something and I'm a man at my word, like, I don't cheat, I don't, right? But I just have a hard time settling and committing because I tend to hold back for different reasons. And I'm sure there's many reasons behind that. Fear is probably one of them. I minimize people's importance to me. This is something that I've done as a way to keep myself safe as a kid. It's like lots of trauma, chaos in the home, blah, blah, blah, all the things. And dating became very challenging. I started choosing men that had a lot of red flags and things like that. So I learned to keep myself safe by not fully going in. It's like, oh, I'll, and then when I start getting scared, I'll be like, oh, well, they're this I like flaw find. It's like totally of things avoidant attachers do, they flaw find. And then when the relationship ends, it's easier to end because they're like, oh, well, they had all these flaws anyway, right? So that's a very toxic trait that I bring into relationships that I've been working on a lot and just trying not to do that. And actually my last relationship that I had for three months, I didn't do that at all. I was really proud because I outed myself. I said, this is what I do, and he knew. So, trust issues. Again, childhood trauma, it brought me to a lot of, I have a hard time believing that someone can be there for me and they're going to be consistently there for me. So I have trust issues that I bring into relationships. Fear of being betrayed. Fear of them not being there for me, I think, is probably the biggest thing, which is why inconsistency is probably a red flag for me because it's a sign that they're not going to be there for me. Unresolved trauma, I think this is a big one, and it has been for most of my relationships. Is this always creeps in? I've done a lot of work, though, lately, and it still shows up. I still have some unprocessed trauma that I'm working on currently. But it's fear. It's just I bring a lot of fear into relationships. I think that's a red flag because it immediately puts me on guard. So I can be guarded in relationships, I can be suspicious in relationships, which is all classic fearful, avoidant or disorganized attachment. You're going to bring a lot of fear into your relationships. I've heard from pretty much all my partners that I'm opinionated and rigid. But, like, to Michael, I know what I want. Like, I have very, very strong opinions because I know what I want and I know who I am and I know what works for me. I know what my needs are. But is there room for me to be a bit more flexible? 100%, yeah, because I can be quite rigid when things, you know, I want things to be a certain way. My house is a big thing, so, like, whenever I've lived with partners, it's become a thing. And I get really anxious because I'm like, my God, they're touching my things. They've moved that thing. And it's like, I can be really anal retentive like that. So, no, when I get into another relationship and we move in together, that's going to be a big part of my work, is just letting go, you know, surrendering. I have a nephew, he comes over and he spills all my workout stuff, and it's everywhere. And I'm just like, internally, I'm like, dying inside, but I'm just like, okay, Matt, breathe. Just go with it. He's having fun, and I just try and stay in the moment, but it can definitely get to me codependent. I can display codependents in relationships as well. This is something that I'm working on. It did show up in my last relationship for both of us, actually, and we had to bring voice to it and talk about it. And, yeah, I'm very conscious of all these things that I'm talking about. So I know when they come Online. And I'm like, okay, time to bring it into the relationship, talk about it. And humility is the thing I had to develop to get to that point where I could talk about all these things with people. And then the last one is Impatience. I am a very fast processor. I process Super Quick. And when people are slow, it just drives me bonkers. So, yeah, Reno, I would be like the guy you were dating. I'd be like, hey, I'm going for 3 hours to process, do all my things, and then I'll come back and we'll have to meet each other at the pace that we tend to work at. So those are Mine. And I'm sure there's more. I'm sure there's more.
40:00
Speaker B: Yeah. Okay, so I have a question for you. Which one of those was the most difficult to share, if you will? I don't know if difficult is the best word, but which one felt the most edgy to share and which one would you say you're grappling with the most currently?
40:15
Speaker A: The one that FeLt the MoSt Vulnerable to share would be unresolved trauma because I feel like, yeah, there's just so much of it. And I've been working so hard to. And I'm like, hey, like, enough already. Like, I just want it to be, like, gone. You know what I mean? And it's like, it's just like, so pervasive. So thats a very vulnerable one to share. And when it comes up and its just really intense, you know what I mean, to have unprocessed stuff like that. So Im working on. Im doing EMDR right now, and its actually helping tremendously. I wish I wouldve done it sooner, but everything has a time and place. But, yeah, ive done so much of the unearthing, the unrooting, like the done the grieving, all that. Like, im not really grieving right now, but whats happening is my left and right brain are, like, rewiring. So I think I had a lot of, like, overactivity in certain regions of the brain from just having a lot of trauma. And so EMDR is bilateral stimulation. So its helping retrain my brain that its like, okay, youre safe now come back to the present moment. And I think that was the missing piece for me because there would be little things that my brain would just start ping ponging. Itd be like, what the hell? Why am I going? This isnt a big deal. So now Im starting to notice, oh, Im not ruminating as much. Im more present. Im not making things, you know, big that don't need to be big. So it's really cool. I've only had four sessions of EMDR and I'm noticing a big difference already.
41:27
Speaker B: Wow. Thanks for sharing.
41:29
Speaker A: All right, and again, pause and reflect, people. Pause and reflect. What red flags do you bring into dating hand on heart like Reno's doing right now? And just enter a bit of humility and get curious about yourself and look at the ways maybe in which you've hurt other people or the feedback you've gotten. The ego might come on and be like, ugh, we don't want to do this. But it's a, it's really helpful when you start to understand these patterns within, because if you really want to find love and find a relationship, we have to be able to be humble and see these parts within ourselves and work with them. And speaking of this, this work, shadow work is what we call that. If you're looking to do shadow work or accelerate your personal development journey in this area, you can check out our coaching collection so you can learn how to heal and empower yourself at your own pace by getting instant access to 45 plus premium personal development coaching videos created by us as well as our healing your shame and building better relationships courses. You can head over to gaming goingdeeper.com for more info. And the healing your shame would be a great place to start because, you know, a lot of these things that we're talking about, red flags that we bring into dating, we can carry a lot of shame around these. So if we can start to understand shame and its role in these, it can really help. So some good opportunities for learning there for people that are more self guided and you want to do some coursework, that's a good place to start. All right, Reno, how do you deal with red flags in your own dating life?
42:54
Speaker B: I would say, generally speaking, three strikes. But there's a piece here where communication and awareness and compassion and boundaries are really important. So listen, like I said earlier, and this doesn't just apply for me. Like, it doesn't just apply to me, I think it applies to every being. I'm ever evolving. You are ever evolving. And I take that into consideration. We come into this world and it's messy and shit happens and that contributes to how we show up in the world and how we show up in relationships. And so I take that into consideration as I'm navigating these things. I wouldn't say I'm quick to cut someone off, but it used to be. But I'm very clear these days about what I'm into and what I'm not. And I advocate for that and I stand for that. And also I care about people. And so I will generally act accordingly and give you the opportunity. Give the person the opportunity. Give us the opportunity to kind of understand, come into awareness and clarify some of these things, create the opportunity for change, because I don't expect the people who I date and interact with to come in perfect and fully together and all of that. I know that relationships are one of the most amazing containers for growth and development. And so I just. I know we're not always going to get it right. If you're putting in the effort and I'm putting in the effort, then it might work. But if you have no interest in that, well, we've got nowhere to go.
44:36
Speaker C: So.
44:36
Speaker B: I'm not an asshole, but I'm clear.
44:39
Speaker A: Have you gotten good at having more difficult conversations because of this? Are you the kind of guy that will just say it like it is?
44:46
Speaker B: We talk, for sure. We definitely talk. I call things out. I call people in, and I want to speak to something you said earlier. I think as we're listening to this, I think it's really important to note that the goal here isn't to change yourself, to get the guy so much as you do it for you and because it matters to you. Because, like, these things matter to you and they're things that you value. And if they're not, well, then just keep being you and doing what you do and being how you are. If they do truly matter to you, then maybe you want to work on them, you know? But don't do it so you can get the guy. Do it because you give a shit about yourself or you give a shit about something, you know.
45:28
Speaker C: So. Well said, reno. I second all that. So, yeah, go back and listen to what Reno said. That's really, really good. Don't expect perfection. I think is great. I love that. I know that when I am talking, it might sound like I'm expecting someone to be perfect, but I truly am not. I know that I bring a lot of red flags, yellow flags to the table as well. We all do. Like Matt, it said in the beginning. But I will say this is a great opportunity to communicate with your partner or whoever you're dating, especially if you do like them.
45:56
Speaker A: And there's.
45:57
Speaker C: And there's some really good things going there. There's a lot of green flags on a couple. Red, yellow. Then use that as an opportunity to get even closer. So explain, hey, this is a red flag for me because just like the way we did here. You can even use this podcast as a reference point. Here's why this is a red flag for me. Here's why it matters to me. And then use that as an opportunity to develop deeper intimacy. Most of the time, I would say nine out of ten times when I've had these conversations, the person is completely unaware and they're like, oh, my God, thank you so much for telling me. Now I know.
46:24
Speaker A: Cool.
46:25
Speaker C: Like, great. I'll do. I'll try to do better. And then at the same time, I want to offer. I'm probably doing something that might be contributing to their lack of connection with me. And so I would invite that in. Like, okay, well, it's not just a one way street here. Let's use this as an opportunity to kind of, like, just check in on how we're doing. Like, is there anything that I am doing to make you feel disconnected from me and our path forward? If so, but let's open the door. Let's make this an even playing field. So it's not like me talking down to you saying, hey, you've got to change, because this is a red flag for me wagging my finger. It's more. So let's have an honest conversation about maybe how we're not always meeting each other's needs and how we could do better. And then, like reinal said, if that doesn't work, if you're not willing to do that, well, then it's a simple goodbye. All the best to have a great time.
47:04
Speaker A: Yeah. And I think it has to be followed up with behavior change. It's so important because I like that. I like that you're giving people an opportunity to change and you're willing to go to the places to have those conversations. It's a sign of emotional maturity, and I think it's important to offer that. But if behavior doesn't change and then we choose to stay with those people, I think there's a sign of emotional immaturity. Right. So it's like there's a fine line between tolerating these things. I think everything has to be. You know, it's like actions speak louder than words. Like, it's just the mantra for dating. Like, if somebody's telling you this, but showing up that, yeah, I like that. It's a very balanced approach, Michael.
47:39
Speaker C: Thank you. How about you, Matt?
47:41
Speaker A: So, again, it's just I'm so ping pongy. I'm like, okay. Because in one side of my face, I'm like, I kind of. I'm attracted to it. I can't even share this. But, like, guys that are like, kind of bad boy and have those kind of qualities, I feel, like, super sexually attracted to them. And this is like my kryptonite, but I know where it comes from. Like, it's, you know, like, my father left when I was younger. He was very avoidant. So I'm drawn to avoidant men. It's this whole part, it's a young part in me that wants to attain what I never could attain when I was younger, which is my father's whatever, attention or, you know, connection with him, like intimacy, essentially, with my father. So when I go after guys that aren't going to give it to me and then I have sex with them, it's like I feel like I finally attained it during sex, right? I never get the emotional, I never get the spiritual, I never get the mental. It's just the physical. So I've done a lot of healing on this thing, but it still shows up for me just because it's really hard to change that. The sexual draw to avoidant men is so charged for me. So how do I deal with red flags in dating? So the other part of me is like, I don't proceed and I have to cut people out. But what I'll do is I'll do a bit of investigating first before I disengage. I'll investigate and I'll, like, explore. But I've also got to know, like, that I have a very over understanding side. I'm highly compassionate and I want. I see that people are doing their best and that they can change and things. So I've been known to give people too many chances. So I also have to be mindful of that. And then I also have the thing that I talked about at the top of the episode of desensitizing myself to red flags. So I have to really, really look and like, see, because it's just so normal for my nervous system to be around those sort of things that ive had to really be mindful. So. Yeah, and then learning boundaries was a big thing around all this speaking up for my needs. This guy that I was just relating with was just terribly communicating. So I just called him out on it. And then two and a half days go by after id said, your communication is very infrequent is what I said. Are you organically like this or whatever? I was trying to be curious about his communication style. Two and a half days goes by, doesn't message me. And then we were supposed to hang out at 04:00 on the Sunday. And he messages me at like 03:00 and basically just gave me some like, whatever. And I'm just like, that's so right there. Like that's. You're just showing me who you are. Like, you're inconsistent, you're rude. You don't take other people's time into consideration. But then my mind goes to, why is he like this? I wonder what happened to him? Blah, blah, blah, right? Is he avoidant? Why is he avoidant? So I try and make up. So I got to be careful to not over understand people. It's like, no, he's showing me who he is, at least right now, his capacity, his maturity level right now, and it doesn't match mine. So I just had to say, you know what? I can't do this. I'm not even going to bother trying anymore. So it's hard to answer this question, right? There's so many ways to answer it at the end of the day. But I like a balanced approach. Get curious and then see. But if the person continues to show up and they don't change their behavior. See you later. I'm out. Any closing comments from either of you?
50:47
Speaker C: We could have done a whole other episode on this because there was so much more to share. It was really good.
50:51
Speaker A: Yeah, I agree. Well, I think we need to do green flags now.
50:54
Speaker B: Yeah, definitely.
50:56
Speaker A: Cool. Well, thanks guys for coming and sharing. As always, being vulnerable. Question two was a real doozy. I was like, ooh, this is interesting. It's going to bring up some stuff. So I'm glad you guys answered it vulnerably and honestly. I appreciate that. And thank you to listener viewer for chiming in on YouTube and letting us into your world as well. Just remember that this podcast and YouTube channel are listener and viewer supported. So if you enjoy what we're creating, you can support us by making a donation to the show using the link in the show notes. And you can also subscribe to early access on Apple and listen ad free and gain early access to episodes. All your support helps us continue making content for you and supporting our community. And we do thank you in advance of and if you want to come and have this conversation with us. This whole month we're talking about dating in the gay men's brotherhood. So come and talk with us in our sharing circles or connection circles. Those are all at gaymen'sbrotherhood. Dot under the events tab. Find it there. All right, much love, everybody.