Latest / The Chris and Mike Show / #166 - Joseph "Apache Joe" Proctor

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#166 - Joseph "Apache Joe" Proctor · The Chris and Mike Show

0:12
Welcome YouTube and Twitchers welcome.
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YouTube and twitchers. I always look at the upload
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percentage when I first start to see if my internet's being wacky
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or not. Yeah.
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What's up there, boys and girls? This is Chris and Mike.
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Sure. I'm Chris.
1:01
He's Mike. And this is Joe Apache.
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Joe coming on the show today, talking, going to talk about all
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kinds of fun things from from running to health to fitness to
1:09
recovery. He's he's he and I kind of live
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in the same neck of the woods in the East Valley, which is kind
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of cool. We met in a Facebook group
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dedicated to fellow fathers. So we pulled them on the show
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because why not? How are you, Joe?
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Well, I'm doing good. Thanks for having me guys.
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You are very. Welcome, man.
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So let's now, so I, I kind of just kind of pointed out who you
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are. So let's talk a little bit about
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what got you in to, you know, all the things fitness related
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and health related, because there's always a reason why
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somebody goes down that path, especially when you're as
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disciplined as it in it as you are.
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Like myself. I did it because when I stopped
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drinking, I needed I needed something else to fulfill that
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addictive personality. So it just was a natural
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progression to turn into working out.
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And then, you know, 20 years later, here we sit or here I
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sit. Hey, hey, Mikey, we have a we
1:59
have a long time listening. It always pops on our show.
2:01
Mikey, the Mikey Castillo did. So he just chimed in and said
2:03
hello. So saying hello back.
2:06
Go ahead, Joey, introduce yourself.
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Give us a little bit of a background, who you are, what
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you're all about. And you know, we don't need to
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talk about your CIA stuff and your you bet your Blackwater
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special OPS business thing that you do.
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We'll just keep that hush hush. Don't tell us where the bodies
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are buried. No.
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So my name's Joe and I grew up in a town east of here called
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Apache Junction. That's how I got the nickname of
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Apache Joe. I ran.
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That's where my first band practiced.
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No way where at. That's go ahead, Mike.
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I'm trying to remember what Rd. I turned off out there.
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It was a he lived in a trailer Park Community out there.
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I think it was an over 55. Oh, yeah, there's a bunch of
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them. I was a banker out in Apache
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Junction for a while, and my clientele was a lot of retired
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folks. Most of them were retired.
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Yeah, yeah. See, I, I lived out there.
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Interesting. Go ahead.
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Go. No go.
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Ahead I was going to say yeah, I, I lived there until I ran
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track in high school and and for my freshman year of college and
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I decided to start drinking. Turns out I was really good at
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drinking. So I like really good at that.
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And the worst part was I didn't I didn't have hangovers and I
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wasn't like a jerk and I drank so like afterwards people would
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be like, Joe, that was the most amazing night ever We had so
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much fun. It was like, yeah, it was great
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let's do it again. And I did for a lot of years.
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So and then I, I, I got married and we had our, we had our first
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kid. We did a home birth and I
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thought I would be a really good dad.
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Yeah, we did a home birth on all of our brats, so.
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So, so, so stop there. Yeah.
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How does the home birth think? How does, how does the home
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birthday play out? Because you can't.
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There's no epidural, right? Dude, there's nothing.
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There's absolutely nothing. There's there's a crunchy
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granola lady sitting next to your wife going, you've got
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this. You've like that's all they're
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in and there's a tub of water and that's it.
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Like it's. Like it's 1832 again.
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Yeah, so there was a movie, there's a documentary called The
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Business of being Born. And I watched this with my wife
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and it's all about hospitals and Western medicine and how
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whatever, right, I'm going to get too into it.
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And my my wife goes, Oh my gosh, that's, that's what I want to
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do. And so we decided to go to the
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home birth route and we're, we're about 13 hours in of like
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very hard labor. Like, she is like in a rough
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place. I'm like, oh, my God, what have
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I done to my wife? Like I thought I was the worst
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husband ever because I'm just sitting there like, you're doing
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good, honey. And then afterwards when when
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our son was born, I was like, are you OK?
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And she's like, I wouldn't have done it any other way.
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And then we did two more kids that way.
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It was. Yeah, yeah.
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So with with with traditional like when women have babies in
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general, like the first was always the hardest.
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My wife's had two. So was it the same with with you
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guys? The second third, a lot easier.
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Yeah, So the second was much easier.
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The third was more difficult. The baby was still in its sack
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when it was being born, so it didn't come out as easily.
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It was the IT wasn't like an easy, easy labor, but it was a,
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you know, it was a safe enough birth, but it was like all all
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of them were all of more heart than I thought it was going to
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be. It was kind of crazy, but she
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did. She did great.
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Let me ask you this, Joe, just because that's what we do here
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and now. We went down this road.
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Yeah. Is the midwife the only legal
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ramification? You know, what's the legalities
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of doing it at home? Oh yeah, so you have to be
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healthy. So if he goes the midwife route,
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you can get a doula, which is like a cheering coach for you
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alongside the midwife. The midwife's usually got some
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medical degrees, whether it's a nurse or whatever, but you have
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to be healthy enough. You have to be within a certain
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age group and a certain weight limit.
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You can't be, you know, there's, there's got to be all these
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boxes you can check off. And if, if everything goes well,
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yeah, it's when, when my brother, when my brother got
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pregnant, when you got his girl pregnant years ago, the first
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thing I thought of was he didn't have health insurance.
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He wasn't in the best part of, you know, best place of life.
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And I thought, how's he going to have this baby?
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And I thought, wait, we've been having babies for a long time.
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Like, humans have been doing this thing for a while.
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Like, I'm sure she'll, she'll figure it out.
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And it's, yeah, it's, it's pretty cool.
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Well, that's what just sparked my curiosity.
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So if you and your wife just wanted to do it by yourselves,
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is that legal or no? I don't know, but my my new
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favorite phrase, my new favorite phrase, I like to say is what
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kind of American would I be if I asked for permission?
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I'm joking. I wouldn't do this with the kid,
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right? Like that's just a Amen.
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I love that. Yeah.
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So this came this came this this came to mind when you were
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sharing your story about the person on in the background.
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You know, do it you. Can do it.
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You can do it. Yeah, you can.
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Do it. Yeah, that was me.
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That was the whole. Time you can do it.
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You can do it, you can do it. Sorry for that.
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I couldn't do it fast enough when you're telling the story.
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But that's the first thing that popped my mind because my wife
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was giving birth to to both our kids.
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I'm was I was sitting looking at the wall and and I'm sorry.
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So she's she's birthing that way.
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I'm this way now. I got the hand.
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I'm like, you're good, babe. You're good, babe.
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Because I didn't want to see it. I had no, I had no desire to
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watch my children pop out of the canal, man.
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Yeah. I'm like, I'm good.
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I'm good. I.
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Was the one that I caught him. Oh.
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God. Yeah, I know.
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Really. First row C, dude.
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Yeah. And so my second one, my
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daughter, who was the easy one, she came out and as she came
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out, I couldn't pull her out because there was a cord wrapped
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around her neck. And I thought, OK, I'll just
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take this cord. And we're we're doing a water
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birth, so I can't pull her out of the water.
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I have to keep her in the water. And so I'm like, OK, I'll just
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unwrap this cord. This cord is wrapped.
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I couldn't even get my finger under this cord.
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And I didn't want a lawn mower, my wife to death and RIP this
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kid out. So I was like, I don't know what
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to do. That's when the midwives jumped
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in and took care of it and everything was fine.
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So luckily, luckily, the midwives, you know, were there.
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But it was, yeah, kind of a spooky scenario.
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Yeah, yeah. See my spooky scenario after our
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daughter was born, I left to tell everybody, hey, you know,
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and I came back in and open the door of the room and she's still
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exposed. But it's it's it's just flowing
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blood. She she was bleeding out.
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And I'm like, oh, fuck. That night turn went right to
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the bathroom. They had they had they grab sky,
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put her in an incubator. She's gone.
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Which we didn't realize it was a traumatic birth at all, right?
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So finally they one of the nurse comes, gets me.
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She's like, you can come out of the bathroom now.
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I was like, I don't need to see that.
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I'm like, I'm good, you know? And then she explains what's
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going on and she had she hemorrhaged or something.
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But then they fixed it. And so did all, you know, all
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good. But yeah, when you're 25 years
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old, I think right to come around the corner and this super
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high thing, whoa, I just had a baby.
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Prepared for that. Oh my God, it's just nothing.
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I mean, literally, I'm, I'm not kidding, everywhere in your
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mind. Oh God, it took forever for me
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to to come back to that. You know, how do I say this
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delicately? To engage in one of those those
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things you do with your spouse, you know.
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In a positive. Manner S it.
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It took me a while to like get OK, you know, but yeah, that so
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I can't imagine home bursting man.
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That would be freaky, especially what you just said about your
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daughter in the court. And yeah, that's you know, I
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don't. Kudos to you man.
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I couldn't do it. I can't even watch that stuff on
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TV. I'm just not built like that.
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Yeah, it was it. Was I have to look away.
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Even when it's on television, I can't.
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The only reason my wife and I did it is because there was no
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other option like my wife. Like people always say oh I
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would have taken all the drugs I could and my wife said so would
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I if they were offered to me like we were at home.
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Like the only reason I didn't take an epidural is because no
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one was there to give it to me so.
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Right, so so hindsight. 2020 she would have at least won an
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epidural. No, no.
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So the epidural takes away a lot of stuff.
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There's this crazy high that happens after a woman gives
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birth that I didn't know about. And if you're not, if you're not
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doped up or, you know, loaded up with drugs, you don't feel it.
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So a lot like if you're out in the wild and you give birth,
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you're not going to lay down for three days and be worthless.
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You have to continue to live, right.
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So my wife was up for a day and 1/2 for like on all three of our
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kids after she gave birth. She was, she wasn't moving
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around, but she was awake. She was like, she had this
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crazy, she was crying. She was happy.
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She was, she was high as a kite. And it was like the midwife
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said, yeah, this is this is what happens when you don't do it in
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the hospital. You get this crazy rush of, you
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know, some chemicals or whatever.
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Endorphins dope me kind of like after you, after you, you, you
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hit your target, you set out to run a mile under 6 minutes and
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you hit it and it's just. Like I could do anything.
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Yeah, your body just dumps those chemicals naturally.
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Yeah, Yeah. Wow, that's interesting.
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Yeah, that's interesting. OK, well, so just all just a tub
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in the living room and. And open your legs.
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Honey, we're gonna have a baby. Yeah.
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Right. Yeah, it was funny on the last
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one. She was, she was in labor for so
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long. And she was like, well, this is
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it. And she looked at the midwife
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and she's like, OK, I tried. The midwife's like, yeah, you're
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not done. You don't get to just say I'm
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done. Like this is you have to keep
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going. So the midwife says, we'll be in
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the living room waiting for you. And he's like, Oh my gosh.
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Oh. Yeah, wow.
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So how long, how long, how long? How long was the third one labor
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wise? The third, so the labor wise on
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the third one was also about 1314 hours.
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But the funny, the second one, when my wife's water broke, she
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didn't immediately go into labor.
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And usually when your water breaks, you go to the hospital,
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right? And right when you go to the
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hospital, the first thing the doctor does is check the wife to
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see how dilated she is. And the second you check your
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wife, you've you've breached that entry.
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And once you breach that entry, the the hospital has 24 hours.
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We ought to get this kid out in 24 hours.
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That's a deadline, right? So we didn't breach anything.
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We just knew her water broke. So my midwife says, well, go for
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a walk, go on a date, go whatever.
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I took the next day off of work and we're sitting around waiting
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for this day to show up. Nothing.
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I had to go back to work the next day because my job didn't
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give me maternity leave at that time.
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I had to go back to work the next day.
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And I'm at my office going, like, is my wife going to have
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this kid or not? Finally that evening when I came
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home, she goes, OK, I think we're going to have a kid.
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And it was like on the third day after her water broke, it was
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the kid showed up. Wow.
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Wow, that's amazing, man. Yeah, that's yeah.
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Exercise is a funny thing because we did that with Sky
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Sky's. She broke water with Sky and she
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wasn't, she was like 2% dilated and like 12% of faced.
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It was stupid. So we went walking around the
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hospital and yeah, yeah, there's yeah.
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Get on a trampoline, get it out quicker, Yeah.
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That's a TikTok video. So now that we've opened up the
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world of we've opened the world of birthing.
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So let's let's take from there. So we were and I was kind of the
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same way when I was drinking too Joe, just so you know, I never
13:15
really had hangovers. I was never really a jerk.
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I was a functional alcoholic. So I, I always thought I was a
13:22
life of the party that, you know, my wife has different
13:24
opinions to that, which is fine, but that was my thing too.
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I'd I never had a hangover. I never woke up, you know, I
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woke up a few times, you know, probably a dozen times over the
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years of like what I do last night.
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But it wasn't. It wasn't.
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I feel like hangover. I never felt right it right.
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It is because we had a guy on the show a while back that he
13:46
was an alcoholic too and, and he's recently been sober, but
13:49
he's like every time you get hammered and drunk, you're,
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you're, you're taking away the next day you're.
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Like you're robbing from tomorrow.
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You're robbing from tomorrow. That's a good job, Mike.
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Way to pull that out, Rob. Which I thought was brilliant
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because I never looked at it that way.
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But you absolutely are robbing from tomorrow.
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That's why I have a hangover. It was brilliant.
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Yeah, because you're not going to, you're not going to function
14:08
the next day if you've drank so much that you were, you know,
14:11
blackout drunk. So take take us down the path of
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of, you know, a little bit of your your alcohol fun and let
14:18
you just stop and how. I really, I really liked
14:21
alcohol. It was, I was good at it.
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And I remember there was a time in my 20s where I just took a a
14:25
quick break. I thought, am I, am I drinking
14:27
too much? My dad was an alcoholic.
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He drank a 12 pack every day. He was like an everyday thing,
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but and he never, I never knew when he was drunk.
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He was just always drinking beer and that's that's what he did.
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But I remember I took a break from drinking and I told my
14:40
buddy who I just met after I stopped drinking, I told my
14:43
buddy all these crazy drink, you know, drunk stories and he goes,
14:46
man, I feel like I just missed the fun Joe.
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I was like, oh man, that sucks. I don't want to hear that so,
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but no, I so I started drinking again when I moved, I moved back
14:57
to Arizona and from Colorado. And when I moved back, I started
15:00
hanging out with my old buddies and I was drinking and it was
15:03
life of the party again. And then my first son showed up
15:08
and I wasn't drinking as much. Things had changed, but it was,
15:10
I still felt I was, I was on head meds.
15:13
It was like I didn't, I was very depressed.
15:15
I wasn't I wasn't just wanting life to get better.
15:20
I just want it to be over. It was like I was counting down
15:23
for for time to get done. It was like, and it was this
15:25
crappy. I didn't I didn't fantasize
15:28
about it, but I had suicidal thoughts that just played in the
15:31
back of my head like like elevator music, like it's all I
15:33
thought about. And I wasn't yeah, and yes, it
15:36
was like wherever I went, I knew how I could end it.
15:38
If I go here, there's a tall building.
15:40
If I go home, I have a firearm. If I yeah, there was like if I'm
15:43
driving, I can like it was. And I don't know why this was,
15:47
but for 10 years, my yeah, for 10 years, my wife harped on me
15:52
about food. She goes, you know, food might
15:55
be the reason why you're so depressed.
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I know you've been on these head meds and I know you're seeing
16:00
the the shrinks and the psychiatrist and everyone
16:02
they're giving you the medicine, but maybe it's food.
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But my wife's not a doctor. And so I didn't listen to her
16:07
for 10 years and then we never. Listen to our wives.
16:11
Yeah, I know. Until we have to.
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Yeah. And then when my youngest son
16:14
showed up and he started eating solid foods as a little guy, we
16:18
found out he was celiac. So we had to get rid of gluten.
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And gluten is in everything that tastes good.
16:24
Everything. Everything.
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Like everything. So I I used to eat cereal
16:30
nonstop. Like cereal was my my staple.
16:33
So I, I couldn't, I couldn't have, I had gluten in the house
16:36
and I wasn't going to be that guy.
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That was like, there's daddy's food, there's the kids food,
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right? Like if it's, if the kids are
16:42
being healthy, daddy needs to be healthy.
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And it was after six months of eating gluten free and being a
16:48
real, real asshole to my wife, like I was, I wasn't purposely
16:52
being mean, but it was like I remember saying, I remember
16:55
saying, I used to say stuff like, well, I guess I'll just go
16:58
to sleep so I can dream about the stuff that I like to do.
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All right, I was like, what the hell are you talking about?
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There was like after six months of not eating gluten, I started
17:05
to wean myself off of the head meds and started to like join a
17:09
gym and and started to get healthy.
17:10
And I was like, wow, maybe, maybe food was the reason she
17:13
was. Maybe she was right.
17:15
Yeah, it's crazy, right? Yeah.
17:18
It's crazy how much food we learned.
17:19
We learned a lot about the food and what you eat.
17:21
When we had a guy named Nate Palmer on the show, a physical
17:25
health guru and there was like breads, you know, and Whole
17:29
Foods and stuff. Like I always knew about that
17:31
kind of thing, but I didn't really understand it.
17:34
So when we had Nate on, it's like, holy shit, that's amazing.
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So we had stopped Nikki and I had stopped doing the breads for
17:39
a while, probably about a month or so, just to see the dynamic
17:42
of the change with it and it and still to the to this day, we're
17:47
not heavy into the breads anymore.
17:48
I still, I still do burritos, homemade burritos and stuff from
17:52
time to time. My daughter makes some fantastic
17:53
tortillas, but for the most part I'm it's not a daily occurrence
17:56
with tons of bread and and because it it the the way it
18:00
makes you feel is crazy. I had.
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No idea. Realize, right?
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That's what I'm saying. You don't realize what is doing
18:07
to your body until you stop. Yeah, and just like not having a
18:12
hangover. I was never overweight, so I
18:15
never thought food was my issue. I was like, well, I'm not a fat
18:17
guy. Food's fine, right?
18:18
I can eat whatever. I can eat whatever I want.
18:20
I used to say that shit all the time.
18:24
Well, I think to Chris's point, we done, we didn't understand
18:27
for a long time. And to your point, that the food
18:31
we were putting in our body is what was causing the
18:33
inflammation. Yeah.
18:34
It wasn't that we were overdoing.
18:37
You know, in some cases, sure, you're overdoing it, especially
18:39
for you guys. You know, when you work out too
18:41
much, you know, when you pushed it too hard.
18:44
But you would have never dreamed in a million years until the
18:46
last probably 5 or 10 years, when science caught up with
18:50
medicine, right, that food was actually causing these problems.
18:55
I've dealt with dietary restrictions my entire life.
18:58
I'm allergic to dairy. My mom's allergic to seafood.
19:00
She's allergic to nuts. You know, we have to be super
19:03
careful when we go out to eat. Or, you know, to your point, at
19:07
the grocery store, you got to read every label.
19:10
Yeah. You find out what is in what
19:13
when you can't have a certain thing.
19:14
And gluten is way worse than any of the two that I just
19:18
mentioned. Or three.
19:19
Yeah, and we didn't do the, we didn't just slowly wean all the
19:23
gluten out of our out of our pantry.
19:24
We went through with like a a garbage can was like got rid of
19:27
everything. And the whole time I'm in the
19:29
back, I'm like, no, like my cereal.
19:32
I've got a box. I've got a box of Cinnamon Toast
19:34
Crunch in my car that I got as a gift five years ago from a
19:38
buddy. And I leave in the back of my
19:40
car just in case the apocalypse ever shows up.
19:42
But like, I look at it and I remind myself, you're not
19:45
allowed to eat that crap. Well, you said it, Joe, gluten
19:49
is in everything. It's just you people have no
19:53
idea until, like you said, somebody stands in front of you
19:57
and says you can't have gluten anymore.
19:59
Now you're going through the grocery store and it's like.
20:01
Christ, I can't have anything. Yeah, it's crazy.
20:04
Thank you. Yeah, well, and that goes back
20:08
to, I'm sure you've seen the pictures online that surface
20:10
every now and then like a, a beach scene in 1970, right?
20:14
Right. Yeah.
20:14
And everybody's, everybody's, everybody's leaning to fit.
20:16
Just saw. And there's, there's, right.
20:18
And they're not, they're, they're, you don't really see
20:20
the overweightness. You don't see the obesity at
20:22
all. It's just leaning fit.
20:24
I mean, you're not, they're not supermodels, male or female, but
20:26
they're not, they don't have the spare tires.
20:28
They don't have the extra baggage.
20:31
But the food was so much cleaner back then.
20:33
Yeah, and that goes back to Nate's point.
20:35
When he was on there, we didn't have all that processed food.
20:38
Right then, right. Everything is just super
20:41
processed now. Mm hmm.
20:44
Yeah, the food, the food I eat now is super simple and I, I
20:47
know a lot of people wouldn't like it, but it's like, I'll
20:50
make a like a bowl of ground beef and I'll put honey in it
20:52
and that'll be my breakfast like, or, or bacon and eggs.
20:55
Like it's yeah, like it's like super simple.
20:57
And at 1st, at first I still craved McDonald's.
21:00
I still craved the garbage food. Like I still knew that, but it
21:03
was after a long enough time now, like I know if I had a Big
21:07
Mac, I would my endorphin, I would go bananas, right?
21:09
It would, it would taste amazing, but I don't, I don't
21:11
let myself do that. But after a a while of not
21:14
eating it, now I'm craving a bowl of ground beef.
21:17
Now I'm craving just a a plate of bacon.
21:19
That's it. Like it's I.
21:20
I think it's just rewired your brain.
21:22
Yes to to. Say that that's pleasure.
21:25
Now that's your pleasure center. But that takes a while, I think,
21:29
Chris. 'S side.
21:30
It wasn't an overnight sort of thing.
21:32
What? Is.
21:35
It 90 days 1000 times right Reprogram a habit, right?
21:40
Right. So, so I'm going to have to try
21:43
the ground beef and and honey. That's interesting.
21:46
I've never heard of that. Because I, I, I, I could tell
21:48
you my diet and you'd be like every day.
21:49
I'm like every day except for dinner.
21:52
I might, Nikki used to hate it from when we, when I first
21:54
started it, but I'm like, I'm the easiest person in the world
21:56
to shop for when we go shopping. It's like, I need this.
21:59
Yeah, that's it. Yeah, yeah, we have that in
22:01
common. I'm pretty much a creature of
22:03
habit because I I can't have a lot of things right.
22:07
So let's go back to your drinking Apache Joe.
22:10
So if you're the life of the party, come back to Arizona.
22:12
And I had the same thing when I stopped drinking, man.
22:14
All my friends like whatever, man, it's not going to take
22:17
you're you're just going to stop for a while and then because.
22:20
Secretly, everyone wants you to fail.
22:23
And then, you know, ironically enough, I don't, I don't really
22:26
have any of those friends in my life anymore.
22:27
I had to hang out for a. While but then yeah, that's
22:29
right. And yeah, but yeah, so go ahead,
22:32
continue that that path because that was that was interesting.
22:35
Yeah, so it was, it was actually once, once the food changed and
22:40
I I found the gym, my son came home from jiu jitsu practice and
22:46
I hadn't run in 23 years at this point.
22:48
I had, I had been working out, but it was I wasn't a nut.
22:52
And my son came home from jiu jitsu practice and he said, my
22:55
coach said, if I want to be better than others, I have to
22:58
train harder than others. And I said, oh, I like that.
23:01
And he said, will you go run with me?
23:03
And I said, oh man, yeah, I guess so.
23:07
We, yeah, I, I didn't have a leg to stand.
23:09
Like I didn't know why to say no.
23:10
And I said. Yeah, sure, because you can't
23:12
say no to your son. I know.
23:13
Yeah. We went, we went for a run and
23:15
it was like after that run, it wasn't easy, but I I kept, I
23:18
kept doing it. And then I, I started, I went
23:20
out and got a pair of running shoes and kind of went, I went,
23:23
I went downhill from there or uphill.
23:25
I don't know what you must say. Yeah.
23:28
That's awesome. So, so once, once you, you got
23:32
the you got the food. So once you got the food, you
23:34
got the you. You weaned yourself off the off
23:37
the head meds. The head meds and the next big
23:39
thing. Yeah.
23:41
The next big thing was nose breathing, which sounds silly,
23:44
but it was nose breathing. I've been watching you.
23:47
I've been watching that. You do that on Facebook, Dude,
23:49
that freaks me out because I have asthma.
23:51
So I've. Yeah.
23:52
Same here. I've I've I used to have asthma.
23:54
Really. Yes, OK, OK.
23:57
So. This is unfortunately.
23:59
This is for me. This is for me.
24:00
And I, I might still do. I don't say I will anymore,
24:04
right? I'm, I tell myself I'm cured.
24:06
I tell myself with my depression and my anxiety, I'm cured.
24:09
I was never broken. I might have been lied to and
24:12
just maybe tricked that I was I had asthma or tricked that I had
24:16
depression. Maybe I just believed it.
24:18
I don't know. But when I got into nose
24:20
breathing, I read this book called Breath, and it was all
24:24
about just nose breathing and different, different cultures
24:27
and how, like, nose breathing was a big deal, even like a lot
24:30
of Native Americans, when, when the babies will sleep, they'll
24:33
hold the mouth of the baby's clothes just so they'll breathe
24:36
through their nose. Yeah.
24:38
Which I thought was, I thought was kind of crazy.
24:40
Yeah, so I went for, I was supposed to meet up for my very
24:43
first group run. It was out at San Tan Mountain
24:46
and I was supposed to meet up with this huge group run.
24:48
I was super excited. I was like, OK, I'm healthy
24:50
enough to run with these other people.
24:52
Like I'm I'm ready to go and I show up to the wrong place and
24:55
it's just me and I'm pissed off and I'm upset and I said all
24:58
right, I'm going to do this crazy nose breathing thing and
25:01
I'm out running by my. Side of the mountain did did did
25:03
you show up on the wrong side of the mountain?
25:05
Yes, so I was supposed to show up on the 1st.
25:06
Time I went outside first time? Yep, Yep, Yep.
25:09
First time I went to Santander to do the same thing.
25:11
Yep. Yeah, so I'm out there running
25:13
by myself and I'm kind of pissed off that I'm doing this.
25:16
And what I will do is I would nose breathe for 5 minutes as
25:20
I'm jogging and it would. I wouldn't run fast, but it
25:24
would. Be.
25:25
After, after the first, I would say 5 minutes of it, there's
25:29
this crazy rush of like fear, you know that where you can't
25:33
get that satisfying that last breath to make you feel like I
25:38
can breathe as you're running, you're doing that.
25:41
It feels like you're about to die.
25:43
But if you can continue to keep like keep your mouth shut and
25:46
keep nose breeding, all of a sudden you'll get this rush of
25:48
like something and instantly you're like, whoa, I'm a good
25:51
father. Like I'm a great husband, I'm a
25:53
good son. Like big things happen.
25:56
So I would, I would run and I would like do this nose breeding
25:59
thing. And then once I did it for about
26:01
5 minutes I would I would breathe for one minute just as
26:04
fast as and hard as I could. And then at the end of that I
26:08
would scream everything out. I would hold my breath, I would
26:12
Sprint as fast as I could and I would be holding my breath as
26:17
while I'm sprinting and while I'm sprinting, my vision starts
26:21
doing this like it just starts shrinking down and I can see
26:24
less and less your vision. Yes, like I'm, I'm holding my
26:28
breath. I'm I'm my, my fingers are numb
26:30
like my, my head's tingling like, and I'm running while
26:33
holding my breath and like all of a sudden, like everything
26:36
starts coming and I'm scared to death.
26:37
It feels like I'm about to die. Finally, at the very end, before
26:40
I fall over, I take a big inhale and I blurt out whatever the
26:45
hell is in my is in my mind or in my heart or in whatever.
26:47
And I blurt out I found myself out here and I lose a crime,
26:52
right? And I thought, whoa, that was
26:54
neat. So I do it again.
26:55
I do it again, right? And I blurt out I'm a good man.
27:00
Oh my gosh. The last time I do it, I blurt
27:04
out they'll need a fucking helicopter to find my body when
27:07
I'm done with it. Whoa, maybe I'll back.
27:10
Maybe I won't tell the wife that one.
27:12
Yeah, but crazy runner's high. Crazy runner's highs.
27:18
Really. OK yeah, because I don't, I
27:20
don't ever really get runners high.
27:21
I, I, I hear about it every now and then.
27:24
You know, Nikki and I probably done since 2015 about 100, you
27:28
know, half, half marathons, you know, trickle in, you know, 65 K
27:33
10K things like that. But only a select few times did
27:36
I actually feel that right. I didn't you know, some people
27:39
feel it every single time, but I just.
27:41
And like she gets it all the time.
27:43
I just, yeah, and I've I've tried, I've tried.
27:47
I didn't realize that was a science to the breathing thing.
27:49
I've tried running with just through my nose.
27:52
I don't I probably didn't do it long enough to actually
27:55
experience what you experience. So as I get back bent into bed
28:00
of cardio shape, I'm going to have to start instilling that
28:01
and see how it how it works with me.
28:03
Because I was wondering, I was wondering what the lung.
28:06
So when I first got into nose breathing and I found out that I
28:11
looked up what culture was ran with water in the mouth.
28:14
And the first thing that popped up was the Apache Indians used
28:17
to run with water in their mouths, you know, while they
28:20
would go out running and they used to call themselves spirit
28:22
runners. And I was like, whoa, like my
28:24
nickname's Apache Joe. Like this feels very spiritual.
28:27
This is crazy, right? So I'm telling my buddy this and
28:30
he goes, you know, the Spartans used to run with water in their
28:32
mouths for 10 miles and spit it out at the end.
28:35
I was like, whoa, that's crazy, right?
28:37
Then the next day, the next day I go, the fuck makes a Spartan
28:41
better than me, right? I was like, maybe I could do
28:43
that. Yeah, right here.
28:45
Crazy stuff, right? So for the past two years at the
28:49
Lost Dutchman Marathon, I've run the Lost Dutchman Marathon with
28:52
a mouthful of water and spit it out the end so.
28:56
No shit. That's awesome.
28:57
I don't know. I don't know what the Guinness
28:59
Book of World Record is. I have to give them 12 weeks
29:02
heads up to come out and watch me.
29:03
I'm going to be doing it again in February.
29:05
But yeah, I'll take a drink of water, I'll put some tape on.
29:10
And the last time I was running, I put tape on too.
29:13
Yeah. So I'll put water in and I'll
29:14
put tape on and I'll put Apache Joe on it just so because if you
29:18
run with just water in your mouth and people don't know why
29:21
you can't talk to them. And you, you look like a psycho,
29:24
right? So if I have a piece of tape on,
29:26
you know, OK, here's the reason this guy's not talking to me.
29:29
So. But the, the last time I ran it,
29:32
I'm running and I hear these two guys behind me during the race
29:35
going. There's no way anyone could do a
29:37
whole marathon without drinking water.
29:39
And I turn around, I've got this tape on my mouth and I go,
29:42
they're like, oh, that's not a Kachi Joe guy.
29:46
So you thought so you did the whole marathon with it?
29:50
Yeah, 26 mile. Fuck, dude.
29:52
Yeah, that's crazy. I want to do a 50.
29:53
K yeah, but. Yeah, yeah, 26 miles.
29:56
Wow. I had heard that about the
29:57
Spartans. I've never heard that about the
29:59
Indians. That's.
30:01
Yeah, I never heard about either, you know, learning,
30:05
learning. Man, that's crazy.
30:07
Now you did Now. I definitely wouldn't recommend
30:09
it on a fast run like I run. I do master track meets.
30:13
I wouldn't be doing any half miles with that.
30:15
But on the low slow runs, yeah. I love the wild and the mouth.
30:21
Wow, that's yeah. Wow.
30:24
Tape. That's extreme, man.
30:26
Yeah, yeah, it's called. Hostage.
30:27
So when you're so so when you're done with the full marathon, the
30:33
first time you did it, you tape it off the tape, you spit out
30:35
the water. I mean, are you, are you
30:37
dehydrated? No, no, I, I load up with water
30:41
beforehand for the week before. I'll usually drink quite a bit
30:44
of water and salt beforehand. But yeah, it's, I don't want to
30:48
say I would never recommend people not to run with water,
30:51
but I do believe we might. We might think we need, I don't
30:56
want to say we think we need water more than we do.
30:58
But if you look around, everyone's got a water bottle.
31:01
Everyone's walking around with their giant Stanley full of
31:03
water. And like, you know, as a kid, we
31:05
had the hose or we had water fountains.
31:07
And now my kids see a water fountain.
31:08
They're like, oh, gross. I won't drink out of water
31:10
fountain. And so you will if you're
31:11
thirsty enough. Like if that's the only thing
31:13
you've got, yes you will. Yep.
31:17
Yeah, I do. I drink a lot.
31:19
I don't walk around with Stanley, but I probably drink a
31:21
gallon of water today. But I've always done that.
31:23
It's I mean, that's probably the reason why I think I never had
31:24
hangovers because every time I was drinking, yeah, the 12 to 18
31:27
beers in the three or four Sacha Jacks, I would I would have one
31:30
of these filled up with water, you know, during, during, you
31:33
know, watching the baseball game.
31:34
So that was the biggest reason that people I think have
31:37
hangovers is because they're dehydrated.
31:39
And I just never was, you know? Yeah, yeah, most people are
31:42
drinking water while they're drinking alcohol.
31:45
Right, right. I know I was weird like that.
31:47
And one, I have one other friend that does that in my entire
31:51
life. Two people, yeah, yeah.
31:53
I don't know if anyone doing that either.
31:56
Yeah, that's, you know, Chris, I always had.
31:58
Water the whole time he was in the band, so I'm a witness to
32:01
that. And then I have another friend
32:02
that does the same thing, but in 52 years I've only met two
32:05
people that do that. Yeah, but he's right.
32:09
When we went to New York years ago, it's it's because it's,
32:13
it's, I think it's part of the Arizona climate, right.
32:14
Because when we were in New York for I think 7 to 10 days, we'd
32:18
get back to the to the the hotel.
32:20
I'm like, I'm drinking water today or I hadn't, I hadn't
32:24
aside from like lunch because I don't drink soda.
32:28
I had never been a big soda drinker.
32:30
It's just tea and water for the most part.
32:32
So, but it's, that's a weird little caveat that you don't
32:34
realize it. Like we, we would walk around
32:36
New York and Natural Museum, go to all those things and, you
32:39
know, grab a bottle of water when we're eating lunch.
32:40
But then aside from that, it's like.
32:42
We didn't. When did we drink water?
32:43
So I think it has a lot to do with it.
32:45
Yeah, I think it has a lot to do with Arizona.
32:47
For sure, you know. Because I thought you're walking
32:49
around all day, Mike. But it's hot, you know, And we
32:53
sweat especially. Dry.
32:54
Dry as hell, yeah. It's really dry.
32:56
It's really dry. So we because we, we're, we're
32:59
all ADHD because we're squirrel in moments here.
33:01
So we, we have your third kid, you, you, you change your, your
33:06
food takes about six months to clear through that.
33:08
You get off the head meds. So when do you actually stop
33:12
drinking? Is is, is is it a specific
33:14
moment? Like most of us Alcoholics, we
33:16
have it. OK, this is the thing that
33:17
turned me. Or was it just like gradually
33:19
you walked away from it? It was kind of nice.
33:22
It was, it was kind of gradually less and less in my life.
33:25
I I would drink it. It was to the point where it was
33:28
I would only drink on the weekends but it wouldn't even be
33:30
a lot. My wife was still drinking at
33:33
the time and when she would drink she would drink a lot.
33:35
But it was we were at home, we didn't drive anywhere.
33:37
None of us got belligerent right?
33:40
But then when we got into this health journey and both of us
33:42
started started working out and eating right.
33:45
And even though we were drinking less, my wifes like this,
33:47
there's no beneficial reason for this to be in our life.
33:51
Like there's, there's no, there's no reason.
33:52
We have it. So she's like, I'm done with it.
33:54
I'm like, good for you, good for you.
33:56
And then it was after like it was like maybe 2 get togethers
33:58
at the house. I would have like maybe two or
34:01
three beers. I'm like, I'm not having enough
34:03
beers to where I'm enjoying this.
34:04
Like I, in my mind, it's like, let's have a bunch of I'm not
34:06
like, no, no, no, the kids are here.
34:08
My wife's not drinking. I can be, I can try and keep it
34:10
together. And it was after like 2 get
34:12
togethers with friends. I was like, why am I doing this?
34:14
Like this makes no sense, but it was so nice to be.
34:17
It was so far removed from my life at that point.
34:19
I could just walk away versus I wasn't in the depths of that.
34:22
I wasn't rock bottom. I wasn't, you know, drink, drink
34:24
driving, stuff like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
34:28
She, mine was. Mine was a blow up and my wife
34:31
and I've been together 31 years and it didn't start out alcohol.
34:35
It took me a while, but we just had a we had a blow up and I
34:39
woke up the next morning and we never argued.
34:41
We still don't ever really argue.
34:43
And I kind of one hand how many times you've argued in 31 years?
34:47
And she was always right. Yeah, but we had, we had a blow
34:51
up and I just the next morning I was like, fuck, man, something's
34:53
got to change. So I googled a A and off I went,
34:55
you know, but it was, it was. That's interesting.
34:58
It's cool that you just kind of gradually, because Nikki stopped
35:00
drinking too as soon as I stopped and we went through our
35:02
stuff and she stopped drinking at home completely.
35:07
It makes. It so much easier if both of you
35:08
do it. Same with the food.
35:10
Same with the food, right? Like if if you got your food and
35:12
she's got her like it's not going to work.
35:14
Especially if I wake up in the middle of the night and I'm
35:16
right in the kitchen, right? Or if I'm drinking like it's not
35:19
good if it's in the house. Right, No, agreed.
35:23
I have I have hyperparathyroidism and so I we
35:27
watch the show on Netflix called What the health.
35:28
Have you ever seen that? Yeah, it's a good it's a good
35:33
documentary. What the health like instead of
35:34
what the fuck replace fuck with health.
35:37
Yeah, I'm sure somewhere still. But there's a lady on it that
35:40
had hyperparathyroidism and she went vegan and I'm like, well,
35:43
I'm going to miss for years. It's dead meat, so why not try
35:46
it? So Nikki being Nikki, she went
35:48
on the journey with me, but about 3 months into she's like,
35:50
oh hell no, I'm not doing this. But.
35:53
But to her credit, she still helped me find things that were
35:58
vegan and, and because I wanted to do it to see if it kept my
36:02
calcium levels at Bay, which it did.
36:04
Ironically, I did it for about 18 months religiously.
36:08
And then I, I, we were, we were training for her.
36:11
We're training her to do a full marathon and, and we had a 10
36:13
mile run day. And I just, I, you, I felt like
36:16
after, because you have to eat so much protein, vegan protein.
36:19
And it's, it's so heavy and it's, it's, you feel like shit.
36:23
You, you, you you you. You're swollen because of it,
36:26
which doesn't make sense. I've never seen a vegan that
36:29
doesn't look. Right, they don't.
36:33
Realize that they look sick, but yeah, they do.
36:36
Whenever I hear someone say whenever I hear someone say that
36:39
they're going to do this vegan thing, it usually starts off if
36:44
they do it for six months to 18 months, it works great.
36:47
Like it, it, it, it, it almost like does a reset on the body.
36:50
And then if you go to healthy eating, it works great.
36:54
But when you see, and I, I don't mean to talk shit about, you
36:56
know, but when a lot of times when you see vegans that are
36:59
5-10 years into it, they, they don't, they don't have the
37:03
healthiest, they don't look healthy.
37:04
And I'm with you, Joe. I'm not sitting here talking
37:06
shit. I told we joke before we got on
37:09
the podcast. Of course I smoke.
37:11
I drink a little bit. I do things that aren't good
37:14
too. But I subscribe to Walt Whitman.
37:18
Everything in moderation, including moderation to say to
37:22
yourself I cannot do something to me, this is only for me, I'm
37:28
not I I hate when people make blanket statements but Chris
37:32
just said it with his condition. His diet is going to require him
37:35
to be different than me, to be different than you.
37:37
There is no perfect diet for everyone.
37:40
So when a vegan says this is the way to live, you're wrong just
37:45
as much as me saying eating meat is OK too, right?
37:49
It might not be for Chris, it might not be for Joe, but it
37:52
might work for Mike, right? I can't have dairy.
37:55
Dairy might be the best thing for another body, right?
37:58
You bet. So you're going to your doctor
38:01
say that we were never intended to eat dairy?
38:04
That's not true either. Every human is different.
38:08
Yeah, I so I on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday I work from the
38:11
office and on those days I will drink black iced coffee and I've
38:18
got a little thing of salt at my desk and I'll take a spoonful of
38:21
salt whenever I get like, hungry.
38:23
And so those days I won't eat until I get home and have
38:26
dinner. Yes.
38:27
And I'll have dinner. So when I have dinner, it's a
38:28
big dinner, right. Whether it's hamburger or
38:31
whatever, but and it's probably about two meals worth.
38:34
And so Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, I just do a 24 hour
38:37
fast, right? And I feel that works out great
38:40
for me. But I know fasting doesn't work
38:42
for everyone. It doesn't work for a certain
38:43
females, right? Like so if someone's asking me
38:45
diet stuff like well I know it works for me really well, but I
38:49
I cannot recommend it for everyone.
38:52
I can do it for not that long. I like it for a little bit
38:56
shorter period of time. I have to eat a little bit a lot
38:59
of times a day. That's just how my body works,
39:02
right? I don't overeat, you know?
39:03
I weigh 154 lbs. I'm not overweight by any means,
39:07
but I do require like 5 meals a day.
39:10
They just have to be small. Yeah, you know, I.
39:12
Don't know what it's on the age that I am fast when I on the
39:16
days that I fast. At first I was AI don't want to
39:19
say a mean guy, but I had a little more bite to me and I
39:21
would go into the office and people would bring in Donuts or
39:24
I would smell. They would come back from the
39:26
cafe and I would smell it. Now.
39:28
Now when I see it or smell it, I feel like a fucking animal.
39:31
I'm like, yeah, not for me. I don't need that shit, right?
39:34
Like I've got this like sort of mentality.
39:38
I like that. I'm the same way.
39:40
I, when I got to the point to where where I turned like like
39:43
once I had neck surgery and that was done, then I could work out
39:46
without pain again. We went, we turned, we found
39:48
Isagenix. So we went down that path and it
39:52
went from October of that year of 14 to February of, of 15 that
39:57
I went from like 211 lbs to 168 like high school weight, but I
40:02
was skinny. I wasn't, I didn't have the
40:04
muscle mass. So once I got back down that
40:07
base and it took years to build the muscle and all that kind of
40:09
stuff, which is cool. But as as we as we evolve from
40:14
from eating shit like everybody does, you know, at some point in
40:18
time of life to starting to eat healthy, you definitely say the
40:21
swing in in your mindset. So to your point being in real
40:25
estate, Realtors eat like shit, man.
40:27
And all the events are doughnuts and pastries and yeah, right,
40:33
right, right. So it's the, the, the sugar rush
40:36
and all kind of pleasure, right? So I had that guy that would
40:39
walk into my office with a, with a box of Krispy Kreme, a Krispy
40:42
Kreme doughnut box. They'd open it up and haha,
40:46
carrots and celery and cucumbers and shit.
40:48
Because I would just get the box and bring it in the, in the
40:52
table in the back. And like, you know, they open it
40:54
up. Like what the fuck is this?
40:57
That's why I love this guy. But it but it's, it's you got to
41:02
rewire your brain. Like you said, if, if you went
41:04
to McDonald's right now, man, you'd be off the hook, right?
41:06
And little man, my grandson, every now and then I have him
41:10
for weird spots in the day. He loves chicken Nuggets and
41:12
stuff. And I could easily just grab 1/4
41:14
pounder with cheese. But I don't, I don't do fast
41:17
food. I don't do junk food.
41:18
We just, it's so far removed from our lifestyle, number one,
41:22
because it's shitty food, but #2 it's so stupid expensive to eat
41:25
out now that it's just, it's not even, it's not even a thing.
41:28
I mean, I make my lunch and take it to work every when I go to
41:30
the office. Just that's.
41:32
The one good thing about fasting?
41:33
Change you have. Be a lazy ass when it comes to
41:35
making your food because you don't make that much.
41:39
Right, Yep, right. Yeah, I've done the, I've done
41:42
the 24 hour fast. I haven't done it like you're
41:44
doing it on the level of of, you know, three days.
41:46
So I wanted to ask you about. That that's all I'm doing is a
41:49
24 hour fast three days in a row.
41:51
OK. So on month, yeah, yeah, I
41:53
haven't done, I haven't done any fast longer than 24.
41:56
I know it's beneficial. OK.
41:58
I haven't. I haven't gone there yet, Yeah.
42:01
I did a when we when we first did the Isagenix we did 50.
42:06
It ended up being 52 hours, but with with with isogenish, when
42:10
you do, they call it a cleanse. So you're.
42:12
What is they? Have these little products I
42:16
don't know how to explain it really it's shake it's shake
42:20
based like you we we we wake up you have a shake for breakfast
42:23
and then you just follow this kind of regiment but it's it's.
42:27
It's it's like a food plan. Protein shake, yeah, yeah.
42:30
Protein shakes, things like that, vegan, non vegan, whey
42:34
protein, stuff like that. It's it's it's supplements, for
42:38
lack of better term. Got you OK.
42:40
And it worked. I mean it worked really good.
42:42
But my thing is and my problem isn't as part of the addiction,
42:46
when I see something that works, it's just tunnel vision.
42:48
That's it. Like I'm not I'm not turning
42:51
around. I'm not that's it.
42:52
When I saw that Isagenix had the benefit it had, I kept doing it
42:57
probably for 2-3 years. And then it just got to the
42:59
point to where it's like, OK, don't do I willing to keep doing
43:02
this. Like I need to start building up
43:04
and muscle mass and things like that.
43:05
So I, I ended up, you know, weaning off.
43:08
I still have protein shakes when I get done working out just to
43:11
have them, you know, but not to the level that I was.
43:14
But when Isagenix cleanses, they call them cleanses.
43:17
They would have these little, I don't want to promote them
43:19
because we're not getting anything out of it, but let's
43:21
see if I can pull up their website and, and show you.
43:24
It's, it was pretty cool though. I mean, it, it, it legit, it had
43:28
these weird little things you would take every couple hours.
43:30
There was a plan that you would do with it and you just follow
43:35
it. And it's like anything else.
43:36
If you follow the plan, if you follow what what's laid out in
43:39
front of you, it works right And but you have.
43:42
Your health. A lot of people exactly.
43:44
And a lot of people wouldn't, you know, it's it's a weight
43:47
loss thing. So it's like a it's it's, it's
43:49
before Ozimpec became what it is.
43:51
Ozimpec, however, you say that, but yeah, this kind of stuff.
43:55
So you have you have your shakes, you have performance
43:58
proteins, you have the different things that balance your body.
44:02
You have their natural snacks and things like that.
44:05
It's all this stuff, right? So it promotes health.
44:08
It was a it was a local guy in Arizona who did it and he kind
44:12
of came up with it and it obviously he's.
44:14
Got the big building off the two O 2.
44:16
Yes, Yep. OK.
44:18
Yeah, Yeah. That's.
44:18
Where he actually lives, Yeah, he lives.
44:21
Or at least he did. He lived on, you know, where
44:24
Bachelor High School is, obviously.
44:25
Yeah, yeah. So, so if you take, if you take
44:29
Val Vista past rigs towards Hunt Highway, there's, there's one of
44:34
those county island houses. He lived back there at some
44:38
point in time, giant outside metal structure barn, which was
44:41
his kind of laboratory where he just started touring around with
44:45
stuff. And you know, it's, it's, it
44:50
promotes health, but it promotes health in an, in the most
44:53
natural way you can is a, because you know, we all know,
44:56
we've talked about it on the show.
44:57
And I'm sure you have the same type of thing with what you've
44:59
heard about ozipic and shit. It's a quick fix.
45:01
It's like you're going to lose massive amounts of weight, but
45:04
it's like having that surgery, you're going to lose massive
45:07
amounts of weight. But then what happens then?
45:10
So back to what you were doing. You're screwed.
45:12
I was just kind of wondering this is.
45:15
There was a documentary, I think it was on, I think it was on
45:18
Netflix, and it was about The Biggest Loser and, and about how
45:22
people. Did too, yeah.
45:24
Yeah, that that dude that got his stomach stapled or whatever
45:29
had the procedure and then had the procedure of getting all the
45:31
skin removed and then went back to £500.
45:35
It was heartbreaking. It was like, man, you like now
45:38
not only is his stomach stretched out even further, his
45:41
skin stretched out even further. And he, the I, and I remember, I
45:44
remember in one of his interviews, he goes, there's
45:47
diets that say you can't eat breakfast.
45:49
What kind of life is that? And I'm like, I, I don't eat
45:52
breakfast or lunch, but I love my life, right?
45:54
And I look in the mirror and I go, you're an animal.
45:56
I love the way you look, right? And I see this guy and it's like
45:58
my heart breaks form like that's, that's, that's a harvest
46:01
life. But part of part of and I, I
46:05
agree because that was it was, it was quite a shock watching
46:08
that and seeing he's because he's bigger than he ever was on
46:10
the show. Yeah, yeah.
46:11
And just sitting there, the way he was sitting there, it's like
46:14
he's got to be miserable. But I think a lot of it has it's
46:16
mind. There's something wrong
46:17
mentally, something happened. Not a lot of it, All of it.
46:20
Right, Yeah, OK, Yeah, we had, we had a guy on was it Justin
46:24
Willoughby? Willoughby £600 guy and, and and
46:28
he dropped when he was 19 years old.
46:29
He was £600. Now he's he's 1199, 70.
46:33
That's right, he lost. £600. Oh, that's right.
46:36
That's right. Oh my.
46:37
Yeah. So.
46:38
And he had a really good guy. Yeah.
46:41
Go ahead. He had a doctor, Joe, that
46:43
volunteered to do that skin removal.
46:46
Yeah. And I'm not sure if he said it
46:48
like this, but what I got out of that episode was, and you know,
46:53
we follow his journey on Instagram and Facebook too.
46:56
He is so careful to not do what we just described of that
47:00
documentary. Like he's hyper aware of the
47:03
gift that he was given of a second chance at life, just like
47:06
I am just like you are, just like Chris is.
47:09
And that's why we do this is to let people know there's life on
47:12
the other side of whatever was killing you, right?
47:15
So that's a great example is Justin is the opposite.
47:19
He embraced the gift that he was given and the second chance at
47:23
life where this guy just basically ate his feelings back
47:27
into the recliner. Yeah, yeah, big time, big time.
47:32
So here's here's one of the things that that I'm not going
47:35
to get on the isogenic soapbox, but this is, this is what it is
47:38
isoline performance protein. So this is kind of what will you
47:41
start with because it, it keeps you full, it helps you, it helps
47:45
you just get in the mindset of, of healthier eating that kind of
47:50
stuff. So it's a 280 calorie shake.
47:52
It gives you all the rundown of what's there.
47:54
It's 36 grams of high quality protein under, under a natured
48:00
way from grass fed cows, superior amino acids.
48:04
So it's, it's, it's, it's totally it's, it's, it's, it's,
48:07
it's helping shift your mindset from what you think you're doing
48:10
is right, but it's really not. So then you kind of go this
48:14
route. Right away I can't have it
48:17
though, so that's. Where but they have but they
48:19
have vegan. That's why I'm bringing it up
48:20
because I I I when I went vegan, I I stopped the way ones and
48:24
went to having the vegan shakes because it obviously reasons
48:29
because when I went, I just stopped the whole the whole all
48:32
the dairy stuff. And eventually my vegan stopped
48:36
because of Nikki and I is running.
48:37
And one of the weeks I I we had a 12 mile run and I'm like, I
48:41
can't, I can't do that again. So I had chicken three times
48:43
that week and it was like lights out, man.
48:45
I was like, holy shit, I'm running on there.
48:47
Yeah, isn't that funny when you chicken Cherian?
48:50
Yeah, when you feel fueled up and healthy, like running's not
48:53
so bad or it's not as bad. Nope.
48:56
Nope. And yeah.
48:57
So then it was vegan everything plus chicken.
49:00
Yeah, it was chicken Cherian. Well, I I think one of the
49:04
biggest lies that we were ever told was that red meat is what
49:07
was killing us. Yeah.
49:09
That's all I eat now. That's all I eat.
49:11
My hamburger. Look at the food pyramid now.
49:13
It's upside down, right? So meat's at the top and grain
49:17
is at the bottom. Yeah, so really, all you, all
49:20
you eat is, is is dead cow. Hamburger, yeah, I'll eat, I'll
49:24
eat, I'll eat bacon a lot. I'll eat eggs a lot.
49:26
But like, so it would be a a keto style diet.
49:32
OK, so there are certain carbs. Yeah, there are certain carbs
49:37
that I'll eat, but it's only on the weekend and it's only
49:40
homemade cookies or pancakes that my kids make.
49:42
And we use a special type of flour that doesn't have gluten
49:45
in it. So yeah, it's kind of nice.
49:47
OK, Yeah, no, Yeah. You gotta eat the kids cookies,
49:50
man. No, Yeah.
49:51
I love the fact that you run. I love the fact that you run
49:54
with your kids, man. I love that.
49:55
Yeah. Yeah, so my my longest race was
50:00
about a year ago. It was a Javelin 100 and it's
50:02
out of McDowell Mountain and it's a it's 100 mile race.
50:07
And from miles 60 to 80, I got to pick up my wife and she got
50:12
to run with me for those 20 miles, right.
50:15
And so for those 20 miles, I was a wreck.
50:17
I was like falling over. I was like, like, I couldn't
50:20
take a leak without falling over.
50:22
I was, I remember I would stop in the middle of my run and I
50:25
put my arms up like this and my wife's like, what are you doing?
50:28
I'm like, I'm trying to get comfortable.
50:29
I don't know what the hell I'm doing.
50:30
Like I was, I was weird, right? But then I dropped her off at
50:33
mile 80 and from mile 80 to 100, I got to pick up my 13 year old
50:37
son at the time, Memphis. And he ran the last 20 miles
50:39
with me. And just knowing that Memphis
50:41
was there, knowing that my baby son was watching me, I was, I
50:46
think there was nothing out of. Her, yeah.
50:47
Like that was, yeah, I was. I wasn't.
50:49
I wasn't doing this. Crap or anything, I was a
50:51
monster. It was great.
50:54
That's awesome man. That is very cool.
50:57
Anything else you want to talk about?
50:58
We got about 10 minutes left. You know what, recently I just
51:02
got back into track meets by about two months two years ago.
51:06
And track meets, there's, there's this group of runners
51:09
called the Masters, and it's just a bunch of old guys that
51:12
didn't stop doing track meets after high school.
51:15
And I think that might be my new favorite thing.
51:17
I like running long. I don't.
51:19
I like what running long distance does for me, but I
51:21
don't say I would like it. I like running short distance.
51:23
I like sprinting. That's fun.
51:26
OK, so is this is this one of your track meet pictures?
51:30
Yes, that's at the, that's at the one that I almost broke the
51:33
there's an Arizona State record for old guys for the half mile
51:38
and I was less than half. I was less than a second away
51:40
from it. Right on.
51:44
I used to run the 800 in high school.
51:45
That was my race. Yeah, same here.
51:47
That's that's what I'm I'm on Team USA.
51:49
Actually I got to run at worlds last year for Team USA.
51:52
Oh sweet. Nice.
51:53
Yeah, right. On Yeah, right on.
51:55
That's your. That's your daughter.
51:56
That's another. Son, that's Memphis.
51:58
He's got long hair. He goes to a school that's very
52:02
it's got a lot of people in a certain religion.
52:04
I won't say what it is, but I'm in Gilbert, so we can probably
52:06
connect those dots. He gets made fun of for having
52:10
long hair. He gets made fun of for his dad
52:13
not going to heaven, right. He gets made fun of for his
52:15
family not being the same. But it's it's kind of nice when
52:18
he's out running with me. He's yeah, he, he, he, he
52:22
doesn't. He doesn't care about those
52:23
things. Or at least he doesn't talk
52:24
about him. Yeah, yeah.
52:26
You know what? My human.
52:28
Yeah. Go ahead, Mike.
52:28
Sorry. You know what my defense
52:29
mechanism for that was, Joe? Because I had long hair for a
52:32
long time, too. Yeah, I would just find
52:34
something about you that I didn't like and pick at that.
52:38
So teaching. That so OK that picture go back.
52:41
Which one? The, the one where it hit this
52:44
one right there and I, I, I don't want to talk about it too
52:47
much because we're not really supposed to, but the one before
52:50
with him and I with our shirts off, that was at the, that was
52:53
at our first sweat lodge that I got that one.
52:56
And so I, yes. And so Memphis was there.
52:59
He's got long hair. He was also there with another
53:01
young boy that had long hair. He was a native kid.
53:05
And so that was that was one of my proudest nights is when
53:08
Memphis made it through this, his first sweat lodge.
53:11
So, so, so so we're going to wrap the show up with that
53:14
because I've sweat lodges have always fascinated.
53:17
So what what entails that? I mean, obviously the sweat
53:20
lodge, you go into a big thing that's hot as hell and you just
53:23
sit there and sweat. I mean, is it?
53:26
People ask like. Details on that.
53:28
Kind of yeah. People ask is it like a sauna
53:32
and I said yeah, kind of like a 5K is the same as 100 mile race,
53:35
right? You're both running, but it's,
53:38
it's way different. And I thought so the very first
53:41
sweat lodge I went to was just with, with me and a bunch of
53:44
other men, right. And when I went there, this guy
53:47
goes, have you ever been to 1? I said, no, but my name is
53:49
Apache Joe and I like to run during the day and I'm blah,
53:52
blah, blah, right? I'm trying to be this thing.
53:54
And he goes, you've never been this hot in your entire life.
53:56
And I go what? And we got in there and the flap
53:59
closed and I realized I've never been this hot in my entire life
54:04
and I'm about to die. When we left one of the last
54:07
sweat lodges, I was looking at my knuckles to see if there were
54:10
blisters. Like I thought it was that I
54:12
thought it was that hot. When I was covering my face, I
54:14
thought I had blisters on my hands like it was, it was hot
54:17
hot. So it's but but something
54:19
happened. It's almost like 100 mile race,
54:20
like when you put yourself through something that difficult
54:24
or running with water in your mouth.
54:26
When you put yourself through something, something that
54:28
difficult, you get a rush of maybe it's just like, Oh my God,
54:31
I didn't die and that's what I'm so happy about.
54:33
But it's there. There's something to it.
54:37
Yeah. So, so like in in the midst of
54:40
that, you know, kind of like, you know how people will take
54:43
mushrooms and they'll drop acid and go.
54:46
To the and stuff. Like that is it that do you have
54:48
a right? Do you is is it kind of like AI
54:50
don't want to say, OK, I don't want to say religious, but
54:53
spiritual like. Absolutely.
54:54
The very first. Time total, spiritual.
54:56
The the very first time when that flap closed and I got
54:59
scared, one of the guys before said hey if you get scared,
55:03
don't, don't feel ashamed if you have to get low.
55:06
And I thought, I'm not, I'm going to get low.
55:08
I'm Apache Joe. I'm super strong.
55:09
We get in there and I realize I'm a bitch, right?
55:12
And I'm scared to death. And I get down.
55:14
I get down on the ground. I'm laying on the mud on the
55:17
ground and I'm, I'm like this close to crying.
55:20
And I hear a woman's voice say what?
55:23
The sweat of your brothers and Mother Earth will keep you safe.
55:27
Whoa. And that's like, I always
55:28
remember that. And it was the sweat of the
55:31
other men in that lodge that kept the ground wet.
55:34
And it was Mother Earth that just left the, the air maybe 5°
55:38
cooler down on the ground. That made me feel safe.
55:40
Like it was it. It was.
55:42
It was huge. Yeah.
55:44
That's fantastic and obviously this is the family.
55:47
That's that's the group, that's the gang.
55:50
Yeah, yeah, that's the crazy woman who had home births
55:53
without epidermal. That's right.
55:54
That's my Caitlin. She got me healthy.
55:56
Yeah, she she stuck with me. She saw potential.
55:59
Thank God. Yeah.
56:03
And that's Memphis. Yeah, right.
56:05
Yeah. And then we got Marlo, my
56:07
daughter, and then Mac is my youngest son.
56:11
Cool. Yeah, right on man.
56:13
I was trying to find a picture of your of your mouth taped
56:16
Apache Joe, but I couldn't. Yeah, yeah, I.
56:20
Thought that'd be a fun a fun little thing to end with.
56:23
Apache Joe taped mouth shut. It's.
56:26
The only. Time it's been it's been well,
56:30
that's OK, you know, but you are telling a story in a sense, man,
56:33
because you're you're people are like, I mean, if OK, so because
56:36
I've done the I've done the Dutchman 3 or 4 times, not the
56:40
full. I've never done a full.
56:41
I was going to do a full and then all of a sudden COVID hit
56:43
and then I was going to do a full and then realized I stress
56:45
fractured my, my right 2nd metatarsal, my right foot.
56:48
So it's just, you know, I'm just not supposed to run a full
56:50
marathon, which, you know, whatever.
56:53
But if I would have been running in, in the Lost Dutchman and,
56:55
and, and you, you passed me or I passed you, I would totally be
56:58
like, what the fuck? Yeah.
57:01
Oh, I got second. So in my age group I got second
57:04
place. Yeah, with the tape.
57:06
With water in your mouth. That's amazing.
57:08
How old are you? 43.
57:11
How old 43 OK, what's your what's your what's your best
57:15
marathon time? So I've only ran it with water
57:19
in my mouth. I don't know what my regular all
57:20
out marathon. Oh yeah, but 33330?
57:24
Wow, that's amazing. What about 1/2?
57:27
So I've only done 1/2 and I think it was 130.
57:31
I don't know what, but I didn't do water in my mouth.
57:32
That was that was the first race that I did that was just so but
57:34
my half, but my half mile at 43 is at a 2O3.
57:38
So that's where my half mile is. And I did a mile.
57:41
I did a mile a couple months ago at 4:49.
57:44
So yeah. OK, my, so my best mile at 53
57:49
years old was 555. And I did them back-to-back
57:53
there, there. Thank you, thank you.
57:56
Well, the reason why is my son's a Marine.
57:58
And so he, he had messaged me one day.
58:00
He's like dad, I did, I did a mile and 6 minutes.
58:03
I'm like, OK, I'm going to come get you.
58:04
He's like, OK, old man, it took me, it took about 18 months.
58:08
It took me 18 months because I started my best was like like
58:11
838. So it worked its way down.
58:13
And they were, they were benched, they were indoors.
58:16
There were benchmarks with Orange Theory Fitness and they
58:18
were I used to do back-to-back workouts.
58:20
So the first, the first benchmark day was at the Gilbert
58:24
East. And I did it 5 minutes, 55
58:27
seconds and then that, that class in and I drove to the
58:30
Queen Creek 1 and did it again. And I actually set the treadmill
58:33
this time faster and I still hit the same time.
58:36
I was pissed. I'm like, what the Hell's up
58:37
with that? But 53 years old doing, yeah,
58:40
doing, you know, and I was so happy with it, which is cool,
58:43
you know, so. Yeah, I'm.
58:46
Worried my son's getting faster. And faster every time.
58:49
There's this hill. There's this hill on this Mesa
58:52
out of pass. Every time we go there, I race
58:55
him and every time I put him in his place.
58:57
But last Saturday, it took a lot longer for me to put him in his
59:00
place. I thought, geez, this might not
59:02
be happening this way for too much longer.
59:05
That's Memphis. That's Memphis, right?
59:07
Yeah, he's 14 now. Yeah, right on.
59:09
Right on. Memphis is going to catch you,
59:10
man. But that's the thing.
59:12
See, once he catches and passes you, then your motivation is to
59:15
be is to turn that shit around, catch him, and pass.
59:18
I can chase his ass, that's right.
59:20
Yeah, because my son was like, there's no way to.
59:22
And you can he back up there? There's the boot camp picture up
59:25
there. But he's like, OK, old man.
59:27
And then I kept texting him when I was creeping, creeping back,
59:30
creeping back. He's like, he's been supportive.
59:33
Yeah, you know, let's go. Yeah.
59:36
When I, when I, when I, when I screenshot the, I had somebody
59:39
at the at the Gilbert E behind me and they, they had the video
59:43
going. So when I, when I hit the mile,
59:45
it showed it right there. And so I sit up to him and he's
59:47
like, damn Dad. That's awesome.
59:52
Winning. Yeah, well, that's Apache.
59:55
That's Apache Joe. So for the use and error, for
59:57
those of you in Arizona, if you're if you're a runner and
59:59
you see a guy running with tape on his mouth that says Apache
1:00:01
Joe, don't, don't ask him a question.
1:00:04
He's busy. He's got one in his mouth and
1:00:06
he's running through his nose, which can't talk, which is quite
1:00:09
impressive. You're great.
1:00:11
Great humor to talk to you, man, Great laugh.
1:00:13
Resume. I I followed you for a while on
1:00:14
Facebook, so I'm so happy you decided to come on and join us
1:00:17
here. Yeah, thanks for inviting me.
1:00:18
This is great, guys. This is awesome.
1:00:20
Yeah, yeah. And you're welcome to come back
1:00:22
anytime you want to because that's who we are.
1:00:24
We love having a conversation with cool people like you.
1:00:26
We always wrap up like this. So if you're feeling depressed,
1:00:29
suicidal, you know, just in the wrong mindset, you know, go out
1:00:33
for a run, go workout, go scream in a pillow, go journal, go
1:00:36
write, call somebody to talk to you to help change your mind
1:00:39
and, and the minds that you have at that time.
1:00:41
If if you can't text 988, somebody's there standing by
1:00:45
waiting to talk you off the Cliff.
1:00:46
Tomorrow is a better day with you in it because somebody does
1:00:48
love you, whether you believe it or not.
1:00:50
And with you not being here, you're going to leave a hole in
1:00:52
somebody else's heart For the Chris and Mike show.
1:00:54
I'm Chris. He's Mike.
1:00:55
That's Apache. Joe.
1:00:56
Until next episode. We'll see you.
1:00:59
Thanks again, Joe. Thank you, Joe.
1:01:02
Love it, brother. You can stop it.
1:01:04
You stop it, Mike, so we don't double stop this time.
1:01:21
On. Your journey, the place where
1:01:28
you will go behind your eyes. Take a moment.
1:01:40
Look. Until.
1:01:42
You see it, fight the battle and tear the.
1:03:14
Come down here, we haven't found solely in the exam from
1:03:20
fighting. Wait for the day.
1:03:24
When it's closer out there and. Put in the wind, you ain't no
1:03:29
creature. We're playing fire.
1:03:32
You should, you put it on the almighty day.
1:03:37
You got a dream. Who in your life to keep up
1:03:42
solely every day? Take your trip behind your eyes.
1:03:50
Feel the soul evolution now. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
1:04:00
yeah, yeah. Take a moment.
1:04:04
Let's see you see him fight the battle with you more clear.
1:04:35
You gotta, you gotta. You gotta, you gotta, you gotta.