Latest / Dishing with Stephanie's Dish / Jason Derusha

Transcript

Jason Derusha · Dishing with Stephanie's Dish

0:15
SPEAKER_01: Hello,
0:16
SPEAKER_01: everybody,
0:16
SPEAKER_01: and welcome to Dishing with Stephanie's Dish,
0:18
SPEAKER_01: the podcast where we talk to people that are obsessed with food.
0:22
SPEAKER_01: And Jason Derusha, I don't know how you feel about being introduced as being obsessed with food.
0:27
SPEAKER_01: I probably should start with that you're a very professional broadcaster first.
0:33
SPEAKER_00: I'm pretty obsessed, though, so I think it works.
0:35
SPEAKER_00: I think it works.
0:36
SPEAKER_01: Jason is the host of Drive Time with the Russia from three to six on WCCO radio.
0:43
SPEAKER_01: And you may have known him from making the leap from being a TV news anchor to a
0:49
SPEAKER_01: broadcaster over in the audio space.
0:53
SPEAKER_01: And you and I are friendly.
0:55
SPEAKER_01: We like see each other at things and we chat and you've been super helpful for me
1:00
SPEAKER_01: in my freelance journey.
1:02
SPEAKER_01: But I just really wanted to chat with you about like, how's it going?
1:05
SPEAKER_01: Most people,
1:06
SPEAKER_01: I think,
1:07
SPEAKER_01: see the idea of being on like the evening news and then going to AM radio as a step back.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: But I thought it was super fascinating for you and I'd just love to see how it's going.
1:17
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:18
SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you.
1:19
SPEAKER_00: And I appreciate you asking me.
1:21
SPEAKER_00: It is I had to get over my own sort of mental block as to whether or not this was a step back.
1:29
SPEAKER_00: And also, like, is that even a relevant question?
1:32
SPEAKER_00: Like, who cares if it's a step back?
1:34
SPEAKER_00: Right.
1:35
SPEAKER_00: But all of these things are sort of wrapped up in.
1:41
SPEAKER_00: Oh, gosh, it just goes back to like when you're a kid, right?
1:44
SPEAKER_00: Like, what was your vision of yourself?
1:47
SPEAKER_00: Is it okay to stop and say, like, I think I've achieved what I need to achieve?
1:54
SPEAKER_00: And that sort of,
1:55
SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
1:56
SPEAKER_00: it was an emotional decision for me because very much my identity was wrapped up in
2:02
SPEAKER_00: being the TV news guy.
2:04
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
2:04
SPEAKER_00: And probably for my first year at WCCO Radio, when I would do events, I would...
2:10
SPEAKER_00: I still like sort of struggle with how do I introduce myself and even stuff like
2:14
SPEAKER_00: talking to my my kids about,
2:19
SPEAKER_00: you know.
2:21
SPEAKER_00: As an alum of Marquette University.
2:24
SPEAKER_00: When I was the morning news anchor, like there was some prestige with that.
2:31
SPEAKER_00: When you are the afternoon radio talk show host on AM radio,
2:37
SPEAKER_00: it's just a little different for a younger generation.
2:40
SPEAKER_00: I will say this, releasing yourself from sort of the burden of
2:46
SPEAKER_00: of your own self expectations is incredibly liberating and doing something because
2:53
SPEAKER_00: you want to grow and you want to challenge yourself and you want to be sort of okay
3:00
SPEAKER_00: at something and then get better.
3:02
SPEAKER_00: Oh my gosh.
3:03
SPEAKER_00: Like it has been so invigorating for me.
3:06
SPEAKER_00: I'm so glad I did it.
3:07
SPEAKER_01: It's such a weird thing, too, because I came from radio and did then go to TV.
3:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
3:14
SPEAKER_01: And people act like TV is like the Holy Grail,
3:19
SPEAKER_01: but yet you've been doing something for 15 years over here.
3:23
SPEAKER_01: And the mediums are both broadcast, but the way you interact with people is super different.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
3:28
SPEAKER_00: Yeah,
3:29
SPEAKER_00: I've found,
3:30
SPEAKER_00: you know,
3:30
SPEAKER_00: morning news and talk radio have a little more in common than when I was on the
3:35
SPEAKER_00: nighttime news.
3:37
SPEAKER_00: I remember when I was the good question reporter in the 10 o'clock news at WCCO TV,
3:42
SPEAKER_00: when I went to the morning show,
3:43
SPEAKER_00: all of a sudden there was this much more personal,
3:46
SPEAKER_00: intimate connection with the audience and doing talk radio is like next level of that.
3:51
SPEAKER_00: We're on television.
3:53
SPEAKER_00: People got little glimpses into my life.
3:55
SPEAKER_00: And on radio,
3:58
SPEAKER_00: all last week,
4:00
SPEAKER_00: and we're recording this in early September,
4:02
SPEAKER_00: but when I was at the Minnesota State Fair,
4:06
SPEAKER_00: people were coming up to me,
4:08
SPEAKER_00: wishing me good luck at dropping off my oldest at NYU.
4:12
SPEAKER_00: Because they knew...
4:14
SPEAKER_00: This weekend I was going to New York to drop off my oldest.
4:17
SPEAKER_00: Like they just have that relationship with you, which is really fun.
4:21
SPEAKER_00: I mean,
4:21
SPEAKER_00: I think I've always had maybe more of a personal relationship with the audience and
4:26
SPEAKER_00: like the traditional,
4:28
SPEAKER_00: you know,
4:28
SPEAKER_00: stand on Mount anchor desk and deliver the sermon sort of TV news anchor.
4:33
SPEAKER_00: That's never really been me,
4:35
SPEAKER_00: but it's just different when you have three hours to talk to people,
4:38
SPEAKER_00: you know?
4:39
SPEAKER_01: One thing that's really struck me as a talk radio fan,
4:42
SPEAKER_01: and I have been for,
4:43
SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
4:44
SPEAKER_01: my whole life,
4:45
SPEAKER_01: really,
4:45
SPEAKER_01: from the time that my dad made me listen to WCCO in the fifth grade on the drive to school.
4:52
SPEAKER_01: I'm very impressed with how you handle this time that we're in where politics is so
4:59
SPEAKER_01: polarizing and people are just so open.
5:03
SPEAKER_01: feeling their feels all the time and really need to share those feelings with you.
5:07
SPEAKER_01: I just was noticing on a post that you did that someone was mad that you weren't at
5:12
SPEAKER_01: the state fair on labor day.
5:14
SPEAKER_01: And it's like,
5:14
SPEAKER_01: wow,
5:15
SPEAKER_01: people,
5:16
SPEAKER_01: but also I love the way that you,
5:19
SPEAKER_01: you let people have their opinions,
5:21
SPEAKER_01: but you also don't let them abuse you.
5:24
SPEAKER_01: And I think there's a difference.
5:27
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's tricky.
5:28
SPEAKER_00: I mean, in TV news, I spent 25 years trying to get the audience to trust me.
5:37
SPEAKER_00: And part of that is, especially in morning news, you want to be liked.
5:43
SPEAKER_00: Not that you shy away from asking tough questions, but you want to do it in a likable way.
5:48
SPEAKER_00: That's what the audience wants.
5:50
SPEAKER_00: And here in the talk space, it's
5:55
SPEAKER_00: It's hard.
5:56
SPEAKER_00: It would be very easy if I were a left wing talk show host or a right wing talk show host.
6:02
SPEAKER_00: And then you just play the hits.
6:04
SPEAKER_00: You are essentially KDWB of political ideas.
6:08
SPEAKER_00: You play the top 40.
6:10
SPEAKER_00: You people know what you're going to do and you do it.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: And they like it.
6:17
SPEAKER_00: And people see in me what they want to see.
6:22
SPEAKER_00: So if they want to be mad at me and they are Republicans and you're like,
6:30
SPEAKER_00: you can make a line between Trump supporters.
6:32
SPEAKER_00: I try to with Republican listeners like, look.
6:37
SPEAKER_00: I am open to many Republican ideas.
6:40
SPEAKER_00: I'm not open to Donald Trump.
6:42
SPEAKER_00: Like, sorry, he's disqualified himself for me.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: That is not something I talk about a lot on the show, because what's the point?
6:51
SPEAKER_00: Other than making yourself feel, you know, good, I guess.
6:55
SPEAKER_00: I always think of my show as like the Thanksgiving table growing up where my uncle was a lawyer.
7:06
SPEAKER_00: He went to Madison.
7:09
SPEAKER_00: My grandfather was a hardcore Ronald Reagan Republican.
7:15
SPEAKER_00: And everyone would duke it out, and everyone was welcome to join in.
7:19
SPEAKER_00: You were sort of expected to join in.
7:21
SPEAKER_00: And it was fine.
7:25
SPEAKER_00: Today we've taken,
7:26
SPEAKER_00: and I get it,
7:27
SPEAKER_00: some of the issues we're talking about are very fundamental issues to different people,
7:32
SPEAKER_00: right?
7:33
SPEAKER_00: It's a very white male sort of privileged position to say,
7:38
SPEAKER_00: like,
7:38
SPEAKER_00: most of these issues for me are not life and death.
7:42
SPEAKER_00: But I also think it's not good for political discourse that we've turned everything into life or death.
7:49
SPEAKER_00: And I don't I don't know that that what does that get us?
7:53
SPEAKER_00: Do we have better discussions?
7:54
SPEAKER_00: Do we have better participation?
7:56
SPEAKER_00: Do we have better policy because we've turned everything into a fundamental life
8:01
SPEAKER_00: and death,
8:01
SPEAKER_00: good or evil question?
8:03
SPEAKER_00: I don't see a benefit to it.
8:06
SPEAKER_00: So I try not to do that on my show.
8:10
SPEAKER_01: I have noticed a change in you from when you first started broadcasting on the station.
8:16
SPEAKER_01: And I thought this was interesting because as a TV news person,
8:20
SPEAKER_01: you weren't supposed to have a lot of personality.
8:23
SPEAKER_01: You were supposed to be fairly impartial and just like a blank slate of the news.
8:28
SPEAKER_00: The news is the star, right?
8:30
SPEAKER_00: The news is the star, not me.
8:32
SPEAKER_01: And I think it took you a little while to find your rhythm of what to push,
8:37
SPEAKER_01: what buttons to push,
8:38
SPEAKER_01: how hard to push.
8:40
SPEAKER_01: And I'm really pleasantly surprised and encouraged of the progress that you've made.
8:46
SPEAKER_01: I think you're just doing great.
8:48
SPEAKER_00: It's so nice.
8:50
SPEAKER_00: It's so nice of you to say that I have had a tremendous coach at the radio station.
8:57
SPEAKER_00: And the thing I miss most about TV is the team.
9:01
SPEAKER_00: And I was more, I don't know, I,
9:05
SPEAKER_00: Coworkers called me the CFO of our morning show, and that stood for chief feelings officer.
9:13
SPEAKER_00: My job was to sort of keep the trains on the track and make sure everyone felt heard and validated.
9:19
SPEAKER_00: And I didn't always tell people they were right, but they always were heard.
9:24
SPEAKER_00: And so my job was to lift everybody else up.
9:26
SPEAKER_00: Well, in radio, it's just it's me and a producer.
9:28
SPEAKER_00: That's it.
9:30
SPEAKER_00: And we have a brand manager who's like a program director of WCCO Radio, Brad Lane.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: And he's been tremendous.
9:41
SPEAKER_00: you know, and you can talk to any of my managers over the year.
9:43
SPEAKER_00: I've always had good relationship with managers, but I generally don't like to be told what to do.
9:52
SPEAKER_00: Typical media broadcaster, right?
9:56
SPEAKER_00: But in this case, like I needed guidance.
9:58
SPEAKER_00: I needed coaching.
9:59
SPEAKER_00: I didn't really know how to do this.
10:01
SPEAKER_00: I knew how to host and I knew how to interview,
10:04
SPEAKER_00: but I didn't really know how to navigate talk radio today,
10:07
SPEAKER_00: which is different from talk radio 10 years ago.
10:11
SPEAKER_00: 10 years ago, if you could frame the issue well, people would call in.
10:15
SPEAKER_00: Today, people react to talk radio sort of like they do a Facebook status update.
10:22
SPEAKER_00: They want to know your take and then they'll react.
10:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
10:25
SPEAKER_00: Well, that took me a lot of work because, you know.
10:32
SPEAKER_00: do people really want to hear my take?
10:34
SPEAKER_00: Is my take valid?
10:35
SPEAKER_00: Do I have, you know, it's all of those issues.
10:38
SPEAKER_00: And even as someone who's always had sort of an outsized personality in town,
10:44
SPEAKER_00: I still had that doubt of like,
10:46
SPEAKER_00: do I really,
10:47
SPEAKER_00: do I know what I'm talking about?
10:48
SPEAKER_00: Why are people really in heat?
10:51
SPEAKER_00: The way Brad phrases it is he's like, what is your show about?
10:55
SPEAKER_00: What is your show about?
10:56
SPEAKER_00: And a lot of people ask me that.
10:58
SPEAKER_00: What is your show about?
10:59
SPEAKER_00: Which is such a funny question because you and I both like grew up listening to talk radio.
11:04
SPEAKER_00: So like I grew up in Chicago, WGN talk radio was part of my life.
11:08
SPEAKER_00: And then there was an FM talk radio, The Loop in Chicago.
11:12
SPEAKER_00: That was more comedians, a little more edgy, a little younger.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: Um,
11:17
SPEAKER_00: and you're like,
11:18
SPEAKER_00: talk radio is about,
11:20
SPEAKER_00: well,
11:21
SPEAKER_00: fundamentally it's about whatever the host wants to talk about.
11:25
SPEAKER_00: So like, you know, your show that you do, what is your show about?
11:30
SPEAKER_00: Well, like the subject matter is food, but like, it's really about your lens, what you care about.
11:39
SPEAKER_00: And that seems so egotistical.
11:42
SPEAKER_00: You're like, oh, it's all about me?
11:44
SPEAKER_00: But it kind of is, right?
11:47
SPEAKER_00: That's kind of what it is.
11:48
SPEAKER_00: So it took a while for me to learn that.
11:50
SPEAKER_00: Honestly, I would say it took a year of doing it five days a week until I really got comfortable with it.
11:57
SPEAKER_00: And I still feel like I'm good, not great.
12:01
SPEAKER_00: Whereas after 25 years of TV, not being arrogant, but I think I was great.
12:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
12:07
SPEAKER_00: And so it's kind of fun to not be great at something and learn it.
12:13
SPEAKER_00: I've enjoyed that.
12:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
12:15
SPEAKER_01: And I think it's revealed a lot about you as a person that is hard to tap into and
12:23
SPEAKER_01: to be vulnerable and to let people see that side.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: Particularly, we're performing these
12:31
SPEAKER_01: shows in a really polarizing time and in a time where people just, they go after you.
12:38
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
12:38
SPEAKER_01: the amount of personal attack that hosts receive on something as benign as a food show,
12:45
SPEAKER_01: it's real.
12:46
SPEAKER_00: I'm surprised by it, to be honest, and I'm a very online person, so I shouldn't be surprised by it.
12:52
SPEAKER_00: But what's happened and certainly you get it from people listening to you,
13:00
SPEAKER_00: but the people who actually listen get it.
13:04
SPEAKER_00: For the most part, like there's some attack, but mostly the listeners.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: All during the fair,
13:10
SPEAKER_00: I had people coming up telling me that like they disagree with me politically,
13:14
SPEAKER_00: but they really like how I do my show,
13:17
SPEAKER_00: which that's the best.
13:19
SPEAKER_00: But part of the challenge with the digital world and the social media world is,
13:24
SPEAKER_00: you know,
13:24
SPEAKER_00: like I said this to someone this morning,
13:26
SPEAKER_00: how much of my energy am I supposed to spend on someone who doesn't listen and
13:33
SPEAKER_00: never will listen?
13:35
SPEAKER_00: So all day, every day, both the Republicans and the Democrats run against the media right now.
13:41
SPEAKER_00: The media is the media.
13:43
SPEAKER_00: Where's the media?
13:43
SPEAKER_00: Why doesn't the media say this?
13:45
SPEAKER_00: Why is this the headline?
13:46
SPEAKER_00: Why are you framing it this way?
13:48
SPEAKER_00: Media,
13:48
SPEAKER_00: media,
13:48
SPEAKER_00: media,
13:49
SPEAKER_00: media,
13:49
SPEAKER_00: which is sort of interesting considering supposedly no one cares about the media
13:53
SPEAKER_00: anymore and no one lets no one reads,
13:56
SPEAKER_00: no one subscribes,
13:57
SPEAKER_00: no.
13:57
SPEAKER_00: So you're like, but but it's a great boogeyman, right?
14:00
SPEAKER_00: Like.
14:01
SPEAKER_00: if you run against the media you don't have to confront the fact that your
14:04
SPEAKER_00: candidate maybe sucks right like it's my fault um and that's been a bit of a
14:11
SPEAKER_00: challenge for me to figure out like
14:15
SPEAKER_00: Obviously, I want to convince people to give my show a chance.
14:20
SPEAKER_00: But I think most of the people who are engaging in sort of a negative way are not convincible, right?
14:28
SPEAKER_00: Like they're not.
14:29
SPEAKER_00: So how much of my energy am I supposed to spend on that?
14:32
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
14:33
SPEAKER_00: It's a bit of a challenge.
14:34
SPEAKER_01: Well, and I do think they listen.
14:36
SPEAKER_01: I think that people love to have feelings and emotions.
14:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, true.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: Not sure where to have them or they are in a place in their life where they're
14:49
SPEAKER_01: lonely or they're othered or whatever the case may be.
14:53
SPEAKER_01: I think sometimes people tune in just to feel something because they see inside.
14:59
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
15:00
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
15:01
SPEAKER_00: And you get I don't know, like.
15:04
SPEAKER_00: I always try to remember that there are, and the same is true of callers or texters on radio.
15:10
SPEAKER_00: There are a lot more people who are listening, who are lurkers, right?
15:15
SPEAKER_00: Like that's what we would call them on Facebook or Twitter, the lurkers.
15:19
SPEAKER_00: So by modeling sort of reasonable,
15:24
SPEAKER_00: friendly,
15:24
SPEAKER_00: but passionate discussion,
15:27
SPEAKER_00: I think there's some benefit to that for the people who are observing and don't
15:32
SPEAKER_00: want to jump into the mess.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: Do you ever think about getting off Twitter?
15:36
SPEAKER_01: I know a lot of media personalities have.
15:39
SPEAKER_00: I do.
15:40
SPEAKER_00: I do.
15:41
SPEAKER_00: But mostly I enjoy it.
15:44
SPEAKER_00: Like mostly I get positive interaction out of it.
15:47
SPEAKER_00: I've started to curate it a little more.
15:49
SPEAKER_00: Like I mute a lot of people that
15:51
SPEAKER_00: You know, if I feel someone getting my blood pressure rising, I'll just mute them.
15:55
SPEAKER_00: It's OK.
15:56
SPEAKER_00: Like they don't need like block.
15:58
SPEAKER_00: I don't need to do that.
15:59
SPEAKER_00: But like I and people who I have a policy, if you call me or my family a name, you just get blocked.
16:08
SPEAKER_00: Like there's no I don't need that.
16:11
SPEAKER_00: So I do think about it.
16:14
SPEAKER_00: It is one of those things where you're like the upside of something like Twitter acts.
16:23
SPEAKER_00: The upside is you get a lot of audience.
16:26
SPEAKER_00: I have, I don't know, 80,000 followers there.
16:28
SPEAKER_00: Certainly most people don't see all of that stuff and who knows how many are relevant.
16:33
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, a normal tweet of mine might get seen, might get, you know, 10, 20, 30,000.
16:38
SPEAKER_00: Like that's pretty good.
16:42
SPEAKER_01: It's also so immediate when you're on the air.
16:46
SPEAKER_00: Oh, for sure.
16:47
SPEAKER_00: It's amazing.
16:48
SPEAKER_00: I never think about leaving.
16:51
SPEAKER_00: I think about, and I have adjusted what I will post about.
16:58
SPEAKER_00: Just because it's not really fruitful for the most part.
17:01
SPEAKER_00: And you think like, is my voice needed on this topic?
17:05
SPEAKER_00: Not really.
17:06
SPEAKER_00: So do I need to weigh in on a lot of political type things?
17:09
SPEAKER_00: Not really.
17:11
SPEAKER_00: So I've sort of cut down on that.
17:15
SPEAKER_00: But you're right.
17:15
SPEAKER_00: Like from a listening standpoint, from a breaking news standpoint, it's amazing.
17:20
SPEAKER_00: It's unparalleled, frankly.
17:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I would agree with that.
17:24
SPEAKER_01: You took a weight loss journey and I think you lost 40 pounds last I checked.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: And you've always been someone in the food space.
17:34
SPEAKER_01: Did that feel conflicting for you to do the weight loss route and at the same time
17:41
SPEAKER_01: be championing and talking about all the food?
17:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, people ask me all the time.
17:45
SPEAKER_00: They're like, how do you eat this much?
17:47
SPEAKER_00: I'm like, well, I'm, you know, I'm sharing, I'm taking bites, whatever.
17:51
SPEAKER_00: I do think about it, right?
17:53
SPEAKER_00: I think the reason that I lost weight was so I could live, not so I could hide.
18:02
SPEAKER_00: and so i don't really feel conflicted about that the truth is though could i have
18:07
SPEAKER_00: lost that weight by eating out four nights a week probably not yeah so it is a
18:15
SPEAKER_00: challenge of eating out i certainly am a little more careful now and how i order
18:20
SPEAKER_00: and the way we used to you know some of this like covet has changed it but a normal
18:26
SPEAKER_00: night for us back in the
18:29
SPEAKER_00: Pre-COVID days would be you go somewhere for drinks,
18:33
SPEAKER_00: go somewhere else for appetizers,
18:34
SPEAKER_00: go somewhere else for a main course and go somewhere else for dessert and drinks.
18:39
SPEAKER_00: And thinking about that while I was on the weight loss journey,
18:41
SPEAKER_00: like I was probably eating four thousand,
18:44
SPEAKER_00: three or four thousand calories a night just in that,
18:47
SPEAKER_00: like not lunch,
18:48
SPEAKER_00: not breakfast.
18:49
SPEAKER_00: And so that's not sustainable.
18:51
SPEAKER_00: But can I do that occasionally?
18:52
SPEAKER_00: Sure.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
18:53
SPEAKER_00: Why not?
18:54
SPEAKER_00: So I what the biggest thing I was conflicted about is the weight loss journey that I took.
18:59
SPEAKER_00: You know, I've always been like sort of an organic whole foods farm to table type eater.
19:04
SPEAKER_00: But to lose weight quickly and sustainably, it's difficult to do it on whole food.
19:11
SPEAKER_00: It just takes a lot longer.
19:13
SPEAKER_00: Now, I was eating whole foods.
19:14
SPEAKER_00: It wasn't like a liquid diet or anything, but like it is.
19:20
SPEAKER_00: Success breeds success.
19:21
SPEAKER_00: And when you start, when you lose that 10 pounds in two weeks, you're like, Oh, I can do this.
19:27
SPEAKER_00: And then you do it.
19:28
SPEAKER_00: Like for me,
19:28
SPEAKER_00: I needed that other people,
19:30
SPEAKER_00: you know,
19:30
SPEAKER_00: maybe you can lose 40 pounds in two years and do it by eating more salads and be
19:35
SPEAKER_00: more careful,
19:36
SPEAKER_00: but like getting the protein you need and the nutrients and all of that,
19:39
SPEAKER_00: it's,
19:40
SPEAKER_00: it's just difficult.
19:41
SPEAKER_00: If you go on a severe calorie restriction diet, it's difficult.
19:45
SPEAKER_01: It's interesting too,
19:46
SPEAKER_01: I think for what we're seeing in the media now,
19:51
SPEAKER_01: like everyone,
19:53
SPEAKER_01: not everyone,
19:53
SPEAKER_01: but a lot of people are on the weight loss drugs and taking the shots.
19:58
SPEAKER_01: Many people are talking about it.
19:59
SPEAKER_01: Many people aren't.
20:00
SPEAKER_01: Some are talking privately.
20:02
SPEAKER_01: And as someone who's a bigger person, like I'm not obese, but I'm a size 12 or 14.
20:09
SPEAKER_01: Usually I think about like, can I manage my weight with a magic like pill and do that?
20:19
SPEAKER_01: Like that feels like it could be amazing.
20:21
SPEAKER_01: And then they're also finding that with the reduced inflammation,
20:24
SPEAKER_01: people are happier,
20:25
SPEAKER_01: less depressed or sex.
20:27
SPEAKER_01: It's like, oh my gosh, is this the miracle drug?
20:30
SPEAKER_01: But then at the same time,
20:32
SPEAKER_01: as people who champion the food space,
20:34
SPEAKER_01: can you make food the devil in that situation and still talk about it?
20:41
SPEAKER_01: It's something both my radio partner and I have talked about a lot.
20:46
SPEAKER_00: It's tricky, right?
20:49
SPEAKER_00: I am cheering for small business.
20:52
SPEAKER_00: I'm cheering for creativity, for innovation.
20:57
SPEAKER_00: So I'm cheering for that.
20:59
SPEAKER_00: Food is, and I love food.
21:01
SPEAKER_00: We love eating out.
21:04
SPEAKER_00: We love the experience of it.
21:07
SPEAKER_00: But food is really, I mean, food is the vessel for all this other stuff, right?
21:13
SPEAKER_00: So is it, do I love, love, love?
21:17
SPEAKER_00: the particular dish or do i love the experience so i think like you know you and
21:25
SPEAKER_00: your radio partner stephanie and i uh i think the three of us have sort of a
21:30
SPEAKER_00: similar approach as to what makes restaurants uh fun and what makes eating out fun
21:37
SPEAKER_00: and it's really it's more the social experience the room the way you feel the
21:41
SPEAKER_00: people you're with like yes good food
21:46
SPEAKER_00: technique, all of that matters, but the other stuff matters more.
21:51
SPEAKER_00: And so when I was losing weight,
21:53
SPEAKER_00: my wife and I,
21:54
SPEAKER_00: you know,
21:54
SPEAKER_00: we had to sort of radically re-envision what we were going to do for fun.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: Because we knew like, you know, what would we do on a Saturday if we had a day free?
22:05
SPEAKER_00: Like go to a, maybe go to a tap room or maybe go to a bar.
22:11
SPEAKER_00: It's like, we can't do that.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: So we're like, all right, let's go for a hike.
22:15
SPEAKER_00: Or, you know, you're trying some different stuff.
22:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
22:18
SPEAKER_00: It's interesting as you age too, right?
22:20
SPEAKER_00: Like it's, I can't eat the way I did 10 years ago.
22:23
SPEAKER_01: And also like I became recently aware,
22:27
SPEAKER_01: which why it took so long,
22:28
SPEAKER_01: I don't know,
22:29
SPEAKER_01: of like that what I view as fun is always food related.
22:34
SPEAKER_01: It's always my go-to thing.
22:36
SPEAKER_01: And I don't think about like, oh, let's go have a bike ride.
22:40
SPEAKER_01: I think about let's go have a bike ride to this brewery or this orchard,
22:44
SPEAKER_01: or it's like the destination,
22:46
SPEAKER_01: not the journey.
22:47
SPEAKER_00: We're trying to like, you know, we went to a show at the Guthrie a couple of weeks ago.
22:53
SPEAKER_00: It's like, oh, and we loved it.
22:54
SPEAKER_00: And it's like, OK, let's like let's remember to kind of, you know, sprinkle the other stuff into it.
23:03
SPEAKER_01: I want to just thank you for some of the folks you've had on Derusha Eats.
23:08
SPEAKER_01: I was thinking about Manny from Manny's Tortoise.
23:14
SPEAKER_01: 25 years Manny Gonzalez has been over there doing the work and
23:18
SPEAKER_01: i was just really taken aback when he said never been on the radio in 25 years and
23:23
SPEAKER_01: i thought well good for you for having him on and wow why did it take us so long
23:27
SPEAKER_01: you just there's so many great voices out there and so much more to our food scene
23:33
SPEAKER_01: than the typical you know james beard award-winning chef right yeah yeah that was a
23:40
SPEAKER_00: lesson i learned in my tv years of doing stories on restaurants
23:45
SPEAKER_00: the audience resonated with like the neighborhood pizza place a lot more than the
23:53
SPEAKER_00: James Beard award type place.
23:56
SPEAKER_00: And like, I don't know.
23:58
SPEAKER_00: I think about that often, right?
23:59
SPEAKER_00: Like people get more jazzed about mama's pizza in St.
24:03
SPEAKER_00: Paul or Latta Latta's where they've got like the diamond is sort of the diamond shape cut.
24:12
SPEAKER_00: You know, people resonate with that more.
24:14
SPEAKER_00: And that makes sense, right?
24:16
SPEAKER_00: Like it's the reason the Cheesecake Factory back in the day was like the biggest
24:21
SPEAKER_00: restaurant opening of that year.
24:23
SPEAKER_00: Because people don't like feeling dumb.
24:26
SPEAKER_00: They don't like looking at menus where they don't know what the ingredients are or
24:31
SPEAKER_00: they don't know how to say it.
24:33
SPEAKER_00: And neighborhood pizza places are awesome, right?
24:36
SPEAKER_00: Like they support the softball teams and they support the youth soccer teams.
24:44
SPEAKER_00: And so I've always tried to give those guys a voice.
24:48
SPEAKER_00: It is it is a balance of like, how do you keep it?
24:55
SPEAKER_00: So what really helps me is my producer, Dan Cook, does not care about restaurants at all.
25:01
SPEAKER_00: He doesn't care.
25:02
SPEAKER_00: He is Mr. Meat and Potatoes.
25:04
SPEAKER_00: He doesn't know anything that I'm talking about.
25:07
SPEAKER_00: And so when I do an interview where he's like, oh, that was really interesting.
25:10
SPEAKER_00: Like he loved the Manny Gonzalez interview.
25:13
SPEAKER_00: And you're like, OK, that's really what I'm trying to do.
25:16
SPEAKER_00: So I do think about that a lot.
25:19
SPEAKER_00: Like I definitely light up with the classics more.
25:23
SPEAKER_00: So like the Bill Kozlak from Jack's.
25:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that was a great interview, too.
25:28
SPEAKER_00: Like those ones always sort of get me going.
25:34
SPEAKER_00: So it's something that I think about like this month we're going to have Murray's,
25:40
SPEAKER_00: Tim Murray,
25:41
SPEAKER_00: and we're going to have J.D.
25:43
SPEAKER_00: Hoyt's.
25:44
SPEAKER_00: But we're also going to have a case Johnson who just has this,
25:52
SPEAKER_00: you know,
25:52
SPEAKER_00: chicken tenders type restaurant.
25:55
SPEAKER_00: So like I try to think, you know, can we have more women on?
26:00
SPEAKER_00: Can we have more people of color on?
26:02
SPEAKER_00: Do we have the classics who don't get the love on?
26:06
SPEAKER_00: Like I'm always trying to think of that stuff.
26:09
SPEAKER_00: The new, new, new, the new, new, new.
26:11
SPEAKER_00: I always get nervous about on broadcast because if you're reading my stuff in
26:15
SPEAKER_00: Minnesota monthly,
26:17
SPEAKER_00: you opt in.
26:18
SPEAKER_00: If you're going to a new place,
26:19
SPEAKER_00: you know,
26:20
SPEAKER_00: like Jason may love it and you may go on another day and it might be a train wreck.
26:25
SPEAKER_00: And that's sort of buyer beware.
26:28
SPEAKER_00: If you go to a place in the first two or three months, that's going to happen.
26:32
SPEAKER_01: Do you feel like a food reviewer?
26:34
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
26:34
SPEAKER_01: that's your title technically in Minnesota Monthly,
26:37
SPEAKER_01: but I feel like you've carved out this other seat for yourself.
26:41
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I always feel a little awkward considering myself a critic.
26:44
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's the easiest way for people to understand it, but I'm not doing as much reviewing anymore.
26:53
SPEAKER_00: And part of the problem with reviewing versus recommending is that
27:00
SPEAKER_00: To really critically review a place, you need to go three times.
27:05
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: You just do.
27:06
SPEAKER_00: It's not fair to roast somebody.
27:08
SPEAKER_00: And I can write a review and do the old, you know, crap sandwich with like, this was good.
27:16
SPEAKER_00: This was good.
27:16
SPEAKER_00: Oh, this needs a little work.
27:18
SPEAKER_00: This was good.
27:19
SPEAKER_00: And I feel okay doing that on one visit.
27:22
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, mostly people want to know where to go and what to order.
27:29
SPEAKER_00: And so because I don't have the budget to really adequately review.
27:36
SPEAKER_00: You got to do what you can do.
27:38
SPEAKER_01: No media company is going to send you 10 times like they used to send Ruth Reichel at the New York Times.
27:44
SPEAKER_00: So I just try to carve out my area.
27:47
SPEAKER_00: I think people know that I'm honest.
27:49
SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to deceive them.
27:50
SPEAKER_00: I'm not going to puff up a place that's not good.
27:54
SPEAKER_00: But if I never talk about a place, you probably know why.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
27:58
SPEAKER_00: I don't like it.
28:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
28:00
SPEAKER_01: and it doesn't help sometimes,
28:02
SPEAKER_01: I think,
28:03
SPEAKER_01: either to pounce on a place once everyone's identified that it's not great.
28:07
SPEAKER_00: No, and there is, I think there is a space for like informed recommendation, right?
28:13
SPEAKER_00: We have like the TikTok, Instagram world of like,
28:16
SPEAKER_00: this is open.
28:17
SPEAKER_00: Woo.
28:18
SPEAKER_00: Like you have that.
28:19
SPEAKER_00: And that has its usefulness too.
28:20
SPEAKER_00: Like people like to chase that.
28:22
SPEAKER_00: That's fun.
28:23
SPEAKER_00: But I try to be like, all right, I'm going to, I'm going to give you an informed recommendation.
28:30
SPEAKER_00: It's not quite a review.
28:31
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
28:32
SPEAKER_00: I, I try, I,
28:34
SPEAKER_00: I try.
28:36
SPEAKER_00: It's a, it's a tricky thing, right?
28:38
SPEAKER_00: Like what does the audience want?
28:39
SPEAKER_00: Do people, people always say they want critical reviews, but like just not about their favorite place.
28:46
SPEAKER_00: I don't know that people really want critical reviews.
28:50
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
28:51
SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: What's next for you.
28:53
SPEAKER_01: You've launched your sub stack.
28:55
SPEAKER_01: I've got 10 minutes left.
28:57
SPEAKER_01: And in that 10 minutes, I want to know what's next.
28:59
SPEAKER_01: And also the most embarrassing thing in your refrigerator.
29:07
SPEAKER_00: Um, so what's next for, for me, I am hoping to launch like a more unified brand.
29:15
SPEAKER_00: I have like all of these different things under my umbrella and none of it looks the same.
29:21
SPEAKER_00: None of it has the same logo and you're like, what are we doing here?
29:26
SPEAKER_00: I'd like to unify things a little bit.
29:29
SPEAKER_00: Um,
29:30
SPEAKER_00: you know,
29:30
SPEAKER_00: the sub stack,
29:31
SPEAKER_00: you sort of inspired me to switch over to sub stack from doing like a MailChimp
29:36
SPEAKER_00: email I was doing.
29:38
SPEAKER_00: I've loved that outlet.
29:41
SPEAKER_00: Um,
29:42
SPEAKER_00: so that's been really fun,
29:44
SPEAKER_00: you know,
29:44
SPEAKER_00: trying to figure out like Minnesota monthly pays me to write,
29:47
SPEAKER_00: like I got to write for them.
29:49
SPEAKER_00: Like I'm not saving it all for the newsletter.
29:51
SPEAKER_00: Like, how do you make that work is something that I'm sort of working on.
29:56
SPEAKER_00: But I would like the other thing that I would like to launch and I do release my
30:01
SPEAKER_00: restaurant interviews and podcast form.
30:04
SPEAKER_00: And over the next year, I sort of want to figure out, like, what is the right way to do that?
30:10
SPEAKER_00: Should I be, you know, I experimented.
30:12
SPEAKER_00: I did an interview with Samewati where we taped it ahead of time instead of doing it live on the radio.
30:19
SPEAKER_00: And so I spent 45 minutes with him asking questions.
30:22
SPEAKER_00: And so it was a longer podcast.
30:24
SPEAKER_00: And I think people liked that.
30:26
SPEAKER_00: So trying to figure out, like, how do I do the radio?
30:29
SPEAKER_00: You know,
30:29
SPEAKER_00: I'm doing three hours of radio a day,
30:31
SPEAKER_00: so it doesn't leave as much free time as,
30:34
SPEAKER_00: you know,
30:35
SPEAKER_00: my family jokes that I work three hours.
30:37
SPEAKER_00: But you're like,
30:37
SPEAKER_00: well,
30:38
SPEAKER_01: an hour,
30:39
SPEAKER_01: a half of prep for every hour on the radio takes a little bit of reading and
30:43
SPEAKER_00: planning and all of that.
30:45
SPEAKER_00: um so that's you know i i'm the the concrete plan is relaunch jason to russia.com
30:53
SPEAKER_00: there's that website was built like eight years ago i'd like to freshen that up so
31:00
SPEAKER_00: brand refresh website refresh those are the big plans for the next year try not to
31:06
SPEAKER_00: get fired during this political stretch don't get cancelled okay what's
31:11
SPEAKER_01: embarrassing that's in your fridge
31:14
SPEAKER_00: Oh, what is embarrassing that's in my fridge?
31:16
SPEAKER_00: There's currently a bottle of Kirkland sparkling rosé in my fridge.
31:23
SPEAKER_00: But it is kind of good.
31:25
SPEAKER_00: It's kind of good.
31:26
SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's a little embarrassing.
31:29
SPEAKER_00: That's funny.
31:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
31:32
SPEAKER_00: I like it.
31:33
SPEAKER_00: That's probably the most embarrassing thing in there right now.
31:37
SPEAKER_01: You know what else is kind of interesting about you?
31:39
SPEAKER_01: And I work for freelance myself.
31:43
SPEAKER_01: So I'm 1099 everywhere I work and I see myself as my own company, my own brand.
31:51
SPEAKER_01: I also see you as seeing yourself like that.
31:54
SPEAKER_01: And that's interesting to me and a shift for you.
31:56
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, at some point that might be where it goes.
32:00
SPEAKER_00: I will say, like, as someone sort of new to the side hustle world, it's exhausting.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's really hard.
32:09
SPEAKER_00: Like you're pitching yourself all the time.
32:11
SPEAKER_01: It's very hard.
32:13
SPEAKER_00: And, you know, trying, there's something to be said for like every two weeks, like the check comes.
32:20
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:21
SPEAKER_00: Regular job.
32:22
SPEAKER_00: It's kind of nice.
32:23
SPEAKER_00: So when you're,
32:25
SPEAKER_00: you know,
32:26
SPEAKER_00: when you're pitching yourself a lot for a thousand bucks here or for a trade out,
32:36
SPEAKER_00: like,
32:36
SPEAKER_00: oh,
32:37
SPEAKER_00: okay.
32:37
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
32:39
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, I don't do a ton of that, but like it does get exhausting.
32:45
SPEAKER_00: And then you have different you have different clients who have different needs.
32:49
SPEAKER_00: So like,
32:50
SPEAKER_00: you know,
32:50
SPEAKER_00: one of the things I'm struggling with right now is there's a there's a restaurant
32:54
SPEAKER_00: owner who owns,
32:56
SPEAKER_00: I don't know,
32:57
SPEAKER_00: five or six different local restaurants.
32:59
SPEAKER_00: I love these restaurants.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: So he asked me about like doing influencing for him, doing a little digital campaign.
33:07
SPEAKER_00: And the trick is, at what point, if I'm getting paid, how many restaurants is that okay for?
33:18
SPEAKER_00: Do people start doubting my reviews or my recommendations?
33:23
SPEAKER_00: How do you keep integrity in what you're doing, but also keep the lights on so you can do it?
33:31
SPEAKER_01: It's a line, and I don't have the answer because I've struggled with it myself.
33:36
SPEAKER_01: All I...
33:37
SPEAKER_01: can say is if you are approaching it with integrity,
33:43
SPEAKER_01: but I don't know when someone sells an endorsement for you on the radio station,
33:47
SPEAKER_01: they're making 80 grand and you know,
33:49
SPEAKER_01: you're making $5,000.
33:50
SPEAKER_01: So I did an endorsement for Certix,
33:54
SPEAKER_01: which I know you've done and people still,
33:58
SPEAKER_01: I mean,
33:58
SPEAKER_01: people will associate me with Certix till the end of time.
34:02
SPEAKER_01: And it's great because I love the family.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: And that's why I did the project that I did,
34:07
SPEAKER_01: because I really enjoy them as people and stewards of Northeast.
34:11
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, it does close doors.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, was it worth it?
34:15
SPEAKER_01: I don't know.
34:16
SPEAKER_00: Right.
34:17
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
34:18
SPEAKER_00: It's a little tricky just trying to figure that out.
34:21
SPEAKER_00: And like if I were not writing for Minnesota Monthly, then I wouldn't even worry about it.
34:27
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it would be different for sure.
34:28
SPEAKER_00: But like in the Minnesota Monthly thing is opens a lot of doors for me.
34:34
SPEAKER_00: Right.
34:35
SPEAKER_00: When you say you're the food writer.
34:37
SPEAKER_00: I mean, how many food writers are there for regional magazines across the country?
34:42
SPEAKER_00: Fifteen, ten.
34:43
SPEAKER_00: I know there are not that many.
34:45
SPEAKER_00: So like so that's sort of a job where it's like it pays for itself.
34:51
SPEAKER_00: Like who cares that I don't get paid that much for it?
34:54
SPEAKER_00: It opens so many doors.
34:56
SPEAKER_00: So but then if you're not going to cash in on those doors opening, what are you doing?
35:00
SPEAKER_00: So like trying to figure out.
35:02
SPEAKER_00: it, all of that stuff is, I spend a lot of time thinking about that.
35:06
SPEAKER_00: Me too.
35:07
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
35:07
SPEAKER_00: Just trying to keep integrity and also like make things worth your time.
35:14
SPEAKER_01: And with that, as my free zoom subscription is winding down.
35:19
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
35:20
SPEAKER_00: That's, that's all we're doing.
35:21
SPEAKER_00: How many free, like I edit my video on a free video editing.
35:27
SPEAKER_00: Yes, sir.
35:27
SPEAKER_01: We have three minutes left to wrap it up.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
35:32
SPEAKER_00: I invoice using Google Sheets.
35:35
SPEAKER_01: Yep.
35:36
SPEAKER_00: No, my accounting is like my emails and, you know, it's all a trademark.
35:41
SPEAKER_01: Yes, it is.
35:43
SPEAKER_01: But it's been super fun to spend time with you.
35:45
SPEAKER_01: And just to I wanted to just tell you you're doing a good job and tell you I've
35:50
SPEAKER_01: noticed that there's growth happening and that I think what you did took a lot of courage.
35:55
SPEAKER_01: And I've been a fan.
35:59
SPEAKER_00: That means a lot,
36:01
SPEAKER_00: especially coming from you,
36:02
SPEAKER_00: because I just respect kind of the way you have conducted your business and figured
36:07
SPEAKER_00: all of this out.
36:09
SPEAKER_00: And I think both of us sort of follow what we think is fun and then hope the
36:14
SPEAKER_00: business type things sort of follow.
36:16
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's worked out OK, I think, for both of us.
36:19
SPEAKER_01: So far, so good.
36:20
SPEAKER_01: We'll knock on some wood that we're not both fired in.
36:23
SPEAKER_00: That's right.
36:24
SPEAKER_01: That's right.
36:25
SPEAKER_01: All right.
36:26
SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Jason.
36:27
SPEAKER_00: Thanks, Stephanie.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: Where do you want people to follow you?
36:32
SPEAKER_00: Instagram is good.
36:35
SPEAKER_00: Instagram or Facebook is probably the best way, right?
36:38
SPEAKER_00: Like they can get my radio show podcast is everywhere.
36:42
SPEAKER_00: So we upload every segment and all of that.
36:44
SPEAKER_00: So those are probably the best.
36:46
SPEAKER_01: All right.
36:46
SPEAKER_01: Well, thanks for being on and I really appreciate your time.
36:50
SPEAKER_00: Thanks, Jeff.
36:50
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
36:51
SPEAKER_01: Bye-bye.
36:51
SPEAKER_00: See ya.