Latest / Massive Agent Podcast / Don’t Waste the Struggle w/ Mindi Kessenich

Transcript

Don’t Waste the Struggle w/ Mindi Kessenich · Massive Agent Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: On this episode, we're talking with an agent who just got out of one of the worst years of her entire life, but she's more focused than ever before.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_00: She was running a team of 12 agents over a year ago.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: Now that team has shrunk, but it's even doing better than before.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: What this agent has gone through is absolutely incredible, and you're gonna learn why she says, Don't waste the struggle.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: Today's episode with Mindy Kesnick is awesome.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: Let's go.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: What is up, guys?
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to episode 306 of the Massive Agent Podcast.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Dustin Brohm, here in Salt Lake City, Utah.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_00: And today's episode, Don't Waste the Struggle.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: What an incredible title.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: And wait until you hear this story.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_00: So Mindy Kesnick is one of uh she's an agent, you know, she's part of my team, part of my group.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: She's in Madison, Wisconsin.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: She was also, uh, you'll hear she was previously running a team of 12 agents called Mission Realty.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_00: She's the co-host of the Agent Rise podcast with Neil Mathweg.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I've gotten to know Mindy over the last the last two or three years, and I know that the last year for her has been quite a struggle.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_00: She, her and her family have gone through quite a bit.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: And she's going to be extremely transparent, extremely um open about everything that they've gone through because and the reason she was willing to do this, she knows that there are agents out there struggling with similar stories, with similar issues, and a lot of which haven't been confronted yet.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: And she's come out the other end.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, spoiler alert, she's come out the other end more focused, more excited, more on fire, and more ready to set big goals that she wouldn't have been able to earlier.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: She's so much stronger, and the story is so incredible.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: So make sure you listen through to the end because you don't want to miss any of this story.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: We tell it in a few different pieces throughout the throughout the interview today.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I no matter where you're at in your real estate journey, I think you're gonna learn a lot from it.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: Before we jump into the chat with Mindy, we got to give a shout out to Keeping Current Matters with the insanity of the markets, and well, it's it's really not insane anymore.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like it's it's not like it's up and down, up and down.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: It's just up.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's the problem, right?
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_00: The interest rates are just up.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_00: Now, home prices have been relatively stable, and in a lot of markets are still going up.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: I understand in some markets they're also going down.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: It just depends.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: But across the board, for the most part, nationally, prices are stable despite demand having gone through the floor.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I know that that demand has just transitioned to pent-up demand.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: It's not like people don't want to buy a house anymore, they're just sitting on the sidelines until it becomes more affordable in their eyes.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: So rates have gone super, super high.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: Trying to navigate all of this and not just like what's going on, but how to then communicate that with your clients.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: If you're trying to do that by yourself without the help of experts who spend literally all day, every day researching and projecting and forecasting, I don't know what you're doing.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: There's a tool available to you called Keeping Current Matters, KCM, and you need it in your tool belt.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_00: If you want, if you are serious about being a real estate advisor and being one of the agents in your market who is a guide and an advisor to help people who want to play, who want to get in the game, who want to buy and invest and and transact in real estate, if you're serious about helping them in this environment, you need to understand what the environment even is and what to expect, how long it's gonna last, what still works in this market.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: You need to know all that.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_00: And keeping current matters, they just send it to you every single day.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: They give you graphs, they give you charts, they give you uh everything visually to show your clients exactly what's happening because an educated client is an empowered client, and an empowered client take ac takes action.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what you need, and that's what keeping current matters is offering.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_00: You can try them out today by going to trykcm.com/slash BAM.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: I highly recommend you all do it.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: While you're while you're surfing the interwebs, go over to now bam.com and click on the BAMX community link.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: BAMX is an incredible community of like-minded agents, entrepreneurial agents, who are all forward thinking and all collaborative.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: This community is amazing.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: By being a member, you also get access to all of BAM's online courses and trainings.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_00: All you have to do is go to now bam.com, click on the BAMX link, and use code MASSIVE at checkout, and you'll get a discount off.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's 10% off the year.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: So for as little as$10 a day, sorry,$10 a month, not day.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_00: For as little as$10 a month, you could be part of the BAMX community.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_00: Every single agent I've spoken to who's a BAMX member wishes they would have joined sooner.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: They are impressed.
• 5:07
  SPEAKER_00: They would pay more for it.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: I haven't told BAM this.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Hopefully they don't listen.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know why they'd listen.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: It's only one of their shows, but yeah.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: Join BAMX right now.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_00: Use code MASSIVE to get yourself a discount.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: Let's jump into our chat today with one of the most open, transparent, and giving agents that I have been honored enough to work with, Mindy Kesnick out of Madison, Wisconsin.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure you listen through to the end.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_00: This is quite the story.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_00: All right, we are here with Mindy Kesnick from Madison, Wisconsin, team leader of the Mission Realty team and co-host of the Agent Rise podcast.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy, you have one hell of a story to tell today, and I'm excited for you to do it.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm honored that you'd be willing to do it here because I think your story, the struggle you've gone through, this year of suck that you're just coming out of and what you've learned from it, I think can help a lot of agents because a lot of agents are struggling right now and they're confused and frustrated.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: And this your story is unfortunately not unique to you.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think it's gonna be very helpful.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_00: So, Mindy, welcome to the Massive Agent Podcast.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_00: How are you?
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_01: Good.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm really excited to be here, and I I really hope that I can deal out some hope for other agents today because um I think on the outside things have looked really good for a long time, and today we're gonna kind of talk about ways that they were not great.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's a good way to set the table ways they were not good.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: So Mindy, you've been in real estate how long?
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, going on eight years.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: And then uh we teamed up, you know, we're business partners.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy's part of my team, she runs a team within my team, which is awesome.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_00: I I love saying that actually, Mindy.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm honored to have Mindy as part of our group, as one of the leaders in our group.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_00: And you started as a solo agent, but then you built a real estate team of 12 agents.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so what it was just a year or so ago, you had this team of 12 agents, you were building your dream house, you had bought an investment property in Florida, and you know, it looked like you were absolutely crushing it.
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_00: What was going on?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it definitely looked like I was living the dream, and uh to some degree I thought that I was until um, you know, last summer, as we're kind of, you know, we're packing up, we're getting ready to sell our home as as we're building our our dream home.
• 7:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um and it it kind of started to feel as though there was something going on within my marriage that I wasn't maybe aware of.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so you know, I was excited about about moving, taking the leap of faith to build our dream home.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_01: My husband and I always knew that we would do that.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_01: He's he runs an electrician, he's an electrician and runs his own business.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_01: And so that was just part something that we always knew we would do um with my, you know, my background.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: And and so we were moving towards that, but uh at the same time we felt very disconnected.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: Uh there was just, there was something going on.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_01: And and I didn't know what it was.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_01: All I knew is that we were under a lot of stress, you know, with the the plans and the decisions that were needing to be made for a custom home and packing up our the the homestead that we had lived in for 11 years.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: We were moving into an apartment, you know, a small apartment for our family.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: We had a puppy.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it was just like so much stress.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: And so I kind of just thought, like, you know, we're just both under a lot of stress.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then we kind of got settled and there was just something not right, you know, and I I was I was making decisions to build our home and pick out furniture, and I wanted to spare no expense because this was this was my dream.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_01: I worked very, very hard to accomplish it.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_01: And as I'm I'm working towards this, at some point it came to the point where I needed to figure out what what was what was going on between my husband and I and this this void that I was feeling.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: And it was just a feeling at this point.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, there was some red flags.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, as as I was, I was really focusing on our our finances because we were making a lot of very expensive decisions.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_01: We were upgrading things in our new build.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like I said, we were replacing furniture and I wanted my dream for, you know, I wanted, I wanted, I didn't want to spare any expense, but yet I didn't want to put us in a position where we couldn't afford to travel and spend, you know, money elsewhere.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_01: So it was a feeling, but I was also, you know, asking for help in different areas for our finances and not getting that financial support.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so it just something just felt really off.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: So I went ahead and I just had to look into it, you know, to to figure it out as I'm making all of these really expensive decisions.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I came to realize that my husband had been keeping a pretty big secret from me with his uh the the condition of his business or the state of his business was he had um he had survived COVID uh but barely and and actually not really because he had a a pretty big mountain of debt that I didn't know about from you know from COVID catching up on the business side material going yeah, on the business side of things, you know, we have we both have businesses, we both have separate business accounts, and so I don't look at his ledger, right, you know, at his checking account for his business, and he doesn't look at mine and we just kind of I just trusted that I I kind of knew what was going on and I didn't.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, he he had needed to do what he needed to do to survive through COVID, but but what I found out at this like very critical time of our home build and and all of that, that he had really he had racked up a lot of debt.
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so I had gone into this home build and all of these decisions thinking that we were in a very strong financial situation, and we weren't.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, it was um it was really scary.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_01: It was, I mean, you know, you can imagine.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_01: I I it felt like it felt like any other huge betrayal, you know.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: I he kind of looked me in the eye and lied to me just because he was so filled with shame and fear, you know.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: He thought he knew that like I there was a 50% chance that I was gonna leave at that point.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, there was a part of me that was obviously really upset and heartbroken and confused and scared and all of those things.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_01: And there was another part of me that was absolutely grateful and thankful because what I cared about more than this than our finances was was the state of our marriage.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I I knew that this was that void that I couldn't put my finger on, and so I was I was also filled with hope, and I also told him, and this was going to, it was almost a year ago to date, and I told him immediately, I said, I know this is gonna be hard, but I also know that this is going to be a testimony for us, for our kids, for our families, and for everybody else that we someday share it with, because I knew it was it was an answer to my prayers because I I just wanted a partnership back and I was feeling very, very lonely in my marriage because he was keeping this big secret.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, he was living in shame and fear and regret every day of his life because he knew that he had this elephant that I didn't know about and someday I would find out about it, and so that was like the that just broke us both wide open to do uh to both do some self-discovery and work on the things that we needed to work on at the time.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think I could imagine what that would feel like, you know, building your dream house.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, just buying a house, uh buying a larger house and having to furnish that.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh like I get it, because I did this last year, and uh you don't just want to furnish it with IKEA shit.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_00: So you don't buy your dream house and and then furnish it with IKEA stuff.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_00: So I and then finding out, oh, not only are you not in a good spot, you're in a horrible spot.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: I imagine a lot of marriages would have ended at that point.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_00: So first off, you're and you you're you and your husband are still together.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and actually we are we're thriving.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, when I I I shared with him that I had this opportunity to to kind of tell our story on this podcast, which this is a an a a massive agent exclusive because I haven't a lot of people in my world know of a part of the the worst part of or the worst year of my life, that is what I'm calling it.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: Um not a lot of people know about this side of the story.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_01: So when I, you know, when I told him about this opportunity to share, I I asked him if he, you know, obviously this is just as much his story as it is mine, and and how if he was comfortable with me sharing.
• 14:23
  SPEAKER_01: He's he's not an oversharer like myself.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, he gave me um permission to to share this, but one of the conversations that we had around me sharing it is that I'm coming from a place of such gratitude and pride and um hope that it's you know, it's not like I'm telling this story and we're still in it and we're fighting and we're trying to save our marriage.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: Like he he's been in intense therapy for the last year.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_01: I've been in intense therapy for the last year, and we have both been able to show up to our marriage as really more whole human beings that have a common goal of a fixing the mountain of debt, um, knowing it's gonna be okay, and also, you know, showing our kids like we've been very open with our kids about a lot of this stuff, and they've they you know, they for they thought for sure we were getting divorced because we were fighting a lot, you know.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: There, it's not like this was just smooth sailing from day one.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there were a lot of fights, a lot of fights happening in an itty bitty tiny temporary apartment.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so they, you know, they hurt a lot, but now they're seeing their dad get therapy, they're seeing me get therapy, we're sharing what we're learning in therapy, and and now they're seeing us probably sh have more affection towards each other than we've ever had before because we are just both so much stronger and so much more invested in our marriage.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, our marriage is so much deeper than it was before before there was a problem, you know?
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_00: I have I have so much respect for the both of you for your willingness to share this, but then I I hope you you know the spirit that I say this.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like Mindy, you it seems like I I'm not one of these people who's like, well, you know, it happened for a reason.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like but you seem so much more free and clear and excited now than before this happened.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like it before you were like you were running this team, but no, I think your word was it was awful, right?
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like you weren't exactly thriving as a team, at least with the fulfillment side of things, right?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: So it let's go back to there, because I I really want to focus on what you guys did to get through it and then what you're doing now after, because it's such an amazing story of you guys made decisions.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_00: First off, you made decisions and commitments that you were going to stay together and figure the shit out.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_00: And most people these days aren't willing to do that.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_00: We all know people that aren't willing to do that, haven't been willing to do that, that have divorced over less.
• 17:10
  SPEAKER_00: And so respect to you guys.
• 17:13
  SPEAKER_00: But let's talk a bit about why you're so excited and happy now.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_00: Like what what back then before this happened was was off.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think, you know, I know that I was I was I thought that I had big dreams last year, you know, before any of this happened, which we've only talked a little about half of the the worst year of my life because there's more after that, there's there's more that we're gonna that I'm gonna share and we're gonna cover.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: And and I am really grateful for it because, you know, um I'm you know, and and I have to just say that I'm super grateful for being a part of this team because, you know, c the conversation that you and I had a couple of weeks ago where I kind of shared this in a nutshell with you.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_01: I was having this breakthrough moment between you and my therapist.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: I I went I went back to back.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: I had a meeting with my therapist and then a meeting with Dustin Broome, and it was like, well, that was intense.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: But what I didn't really realized, no, no, it was so, it was so perfect.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: And it was just, it feels like it was all, it all fell apart so that it could all come together.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_01: Because, you know, I'll share what what else happened in the last year, but but just to say for now, this what what happened in that day in that moment is what I realized is I was finally back.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_01: I was finally healed enough.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: I did not waste any of the struggle.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: I cried through it, I hurt through it.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_01: I I called in sick to my team, you know, one week.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_01: I just was like, I need a minute, called in a partner, had him cover for me, and I sat with a lot of pain for a couple of days.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_01: And what I learned after that is that I had in those moments made such a drastic change inside that I could not go backwards.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: I literally could not physically go back to the person that I was a week prior.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_01: And with that um came so much healing.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_01: And now I I was ready, I was finally willing.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I took like a three-month sabbatical from real estate.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like I just, I was there for my team, I supported them, I showed up for them with everything that I had in me.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_01: But my personal real estate, I just had to put on the back burner because I only had so much energy in that healing time.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: And so I was ready to get back at it, excited again.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: But then I I I found myself in this extreme battle because my goals from a year prior weren't just too small.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: I realized I was playing small and they just didn't, they didn't fit.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I was wrestling with this.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I, you know, I scheduled a call with you and I was like, I don't know what's going on.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: And it was literally that day in that, in those conversations that I was having, you know, with people that were that I have access to to help me, that I was like, it's because those goals were for a person that I was a year ago, and I experienced more change and more growth in that year because of my struggles than most people do, I think, in five years.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: And I could not, I just could not wake up every day and work towards those same goals because they were just too small for the person that I had become.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: Jesus, you're firing me up.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh that was so awesome.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember that call.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you were sitting in your car and well, I was sitting here because this is where I do calls, but I I remember it so well.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: You you had some confusion.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it was it was you were like I I think you felt a little bit lost.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think lost is the word because of what you just said.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: You were you were trying to like like you had just gone through this year of shit.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like you I love how you said you didn't waste the struggle.
• 20:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's so that's such gold.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_00: But you you went through it, and then you were like naturally like you're like, okay, let's go back and start you know pick up where I left off.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: That is so amazing though that you realize there's something wrong with that.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's not what you want.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want to pick up where you left off.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_00: You you left off for a reason, and now you have a blank slate, and you can you can pick where to go from here.
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: So that's super cool.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and I imagine that that's where the excitement that I that I see in you and hearing your voice now comes from is this you're able to write your you know your bigger goals.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's just, you know, a year ago I I cared about my production numbers and I cared about achieving things that you know I thought really mattered at the time.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: And who I am now is just like I don't care about those things.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like I wanna make a difference, I wanna live large, I don't wanna be uh, you know, I don't want to just Be working for the next commission check.
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_01: I want to grow wealth.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: I want to, you know, I have I I feel like my dreams just sort of exploded and they I they just they're so much different.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: So then when I when I yeah, when I bring out like my journal that's a year old and I try to step back into the things that I was doing at that time to achieve those goals, I was just like, what is why do why did I care about that?
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_01: Because I I don't anymore.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: It these things don't matter.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_01: You know, life is short.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, that that I learned so much because what I did learn in the last year, it broke my heart.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then it and then I learned how to put it back together in a more authentic way.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I learned from my therapist that I was a people pleaser and I didn't know it.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: I had no idea.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_01: I would never would have said I was a people pleaser.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: I learned that I'm an overfunctioner and that um I didn't even know what that was or that it that that existed.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: I had no idea, which I think that is like vastly under talked, under like represented because it's I think a lot of us are, especially those of us chasing big dreams and real estate and things.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um and so then so I I learned these things about myself and then I made a decision to stop them.
• 23:18
  SPEAKER_01: And now I I am that person that I've always talked about and always coached other people about to have boundaries and all of these things.
• 23:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like I actually learned what that's all about through having to go through just the just this horrendous experience, which you know, like I said, my husband and I our what we went through was just the tip of the iceberg.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_01: It just got worse from there.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: Well, do you wanna do you wanna continue or um yeah, or or do you want me to reroute this?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_00: And because I I was going to ask you, Mindy, or I was gonna say rather, it's it's so clear to me now that you now have this wind in your sails.
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_00: And having I don't uh would you say that before all this you had a strong marriage?
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: Strong relationship?
• 24:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh well, I would say that I thought at the time, yeah.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: At the time, yes.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_00: In hindsight, you realized maybe not so not so strong.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: And so now you had a chance to strengthen it and really get close because you've gone through the struggle, you you you fought a war together, basically.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: With each other, which is cool.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: Um not like against each other, but with each other.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_00: And uh and now that you have if your relationships are not right, if you if at home you have stress and and struggle and you're fighting and you it you resent your partner or like if if it's not on point, it's a headwind, like it's holding you back subconsciously, it because it sucks your energy and you can't show up excited to kick ass and do what you need to do, especially in this tough environment.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_00: When you you you have this like anchor holding you back, and that's your your shit relationship.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's such a superpower when you have a marriage or a relationship that you you're not worried about, you're excited about, you're you're proud of, and it makes you smile because then you you're like you show up every day now, and I I know you do this, you show up now, like you sit down at your desk ready to do some work, and you it's like you smile.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_00: It's like you have this wind behind you knowing that's all good.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_00: It's and it's not talked about enough.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so I'm so glad that we're talking about this today.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_00: Would you uh mind sharing some of the things that you and your husband did during this one year of your strengthening phase, your one-year strengthening phase.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: It's not the worst year of your life, it's your strengthening phase.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: What did you guys do to get your relationship where it is today?
• 26:00
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we talked a lot more than than we ever did before.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that was one of my biggest struggles and my biggest hangups a year ago, you know, that summer that I was just trying to figure out, put my finger on it, you know, because I'm an overshare.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: I would share everything.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: I would share like thoughts that I was embarrassed about.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: I would share, you know, like everything.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I would get nothing in response.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, there's I heard one time that, you know, yeah, like there was just he just had nothing to share.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: He didn't, he didn't want, he didn't want to share dreams that he had.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know if he had any, you know, and I think probably at the time, yeah.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: It just it felt like it felt like I was talking to a wall.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: There was just there was no give and take, and it just felt very empty.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I heard somebody say one time that the loneliest person is not somebody who's single, the loneliest person is somebody who's in a relationship with somebody who doesn't communicate with them or talk to them or open up to them.
• 26:55
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where I was.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: I was just like, I am in a relationship with myself.
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's how I felt.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and so we started talking, but I think the the bigger thing is that he went and got some professional help and was able to then he talked to his therapist and then he would call me and be like, I owe you an apology, or or I learned this about myself, or I have to, you know, like he would just he started sharing things with me that he was always afraid to share before.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_01: And it just, you know, and and I was I I learned a lot about him and myself, and he did the same.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: And so now, you know, my therapist, this is a perfect example.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_01: What, you know, I told my therapist in the beginning, you know, all I'm asking for him to do is show me the financials, you know, and I don't think, you know, that's not asking too much because this is, you know, he did this thing and whatever.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: And my therapist helped me to understand that by me saying, Kevin, I just I need you just need you to provide the financials every week or every month or whatever, was like asking him to go out into the into a on a safari and wrestle a lion, right?
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like it it that was like me asking him for that specific thing was the scariest thing in the world.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: Where for me it wouldn't be because I'm I'm on top of my finances, like I'd be like, sure, no problem.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_01: Here it is.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm happy to provide it.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like learning how to respect your spouse from a from who they are.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you a lot of times you need a third party to help you understand that.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: So he's getting third-party help, I'm getting third party help, and then we come together and like, you know, it comes down to he loves affection, you know, like hugs and kisses or whatever.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm like a busybody.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so that we had this disconnect where he would never feel loved because I never went up to him and gave him a hug.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: And so we were able to talk about, I'm like, I said, take what you want.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: You want a hug, come up and give me a hug, and I will never turn you away.
• 28:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so just things like that.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: So like every day he's getting what he needs.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: You know, I'm getting what I need, which is for him to step into that role.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, and we're like, and then we get these little rewards like on a daily basis of like both of us feeling more fulfilled because we understand what each other needs and how to support each other in their needs, versus he's like, I need this, and I'm like, I will I need this, and now we're both just like we're just butting heads.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's been a lot of work, like, you know, self-reflection is is really important.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_00: Did you guys do any counseling together or were you each doing separate counseling and therapy?
• 29:44
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we did we did um couple, we were in couples therapy before I found any anything out.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because I knew I was like, we need therapy.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't know what's going on.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it was just a lack of, I just thought it was a communication thing, you know, issue or whatever.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_01: And so we had started, but it just, I mean, at the time we didn't know the route.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know the route.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: He knew, obviously, but I didn't know that there was this big secret.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you felt it.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and so I felt it, but I I, you know, you just you trust your spouse and you just don't know what you don't know.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and so we were doing couples therapy, and then when I found all of this out and I, you know, I felt betrayed, I felt lied to.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: I said, I need, I need to I need to work on me and figure me out.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: I and I need you to do the same.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_01: And then, and then maybe we can come back to hopefully couples count therapy.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: But right now, I just need my own therapy and I think you need the same.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and that, you know, a year later has just worked so well that at this point, I I don't, we don't, we don't feel like we need it.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't think that that's for everybody, but he and I have just done so much work on ourselves that we're both showing up so healthy to our marriage that it we just haven't needed needed that.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: Not to say that we we never would or that that wouldn't be the right thing for some people, but we just kind of both went into a deep dive.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it's things like you know, he didn't realize he never realized that he he never dealt with the loss of his mom.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And so, you know, then his his dad had a house scare, and then he reverted back and did some of these same patterns, and like neither one of us knew any of this.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: But but because he was consistently seeing a therapist, we would have a fight about it.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: He would go to his therapist, and now all of a sudden he's like, Oh, this is why I was treating you like that, because I was re you know, resorting back to uh, you know, uh um what's the word I'm looking for?
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I don't know.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: But I I know what you mean though.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_01: A defense mechanism.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he was he was reverting back to a defense mechanism that was protecting protecting him and then taking it out of me.
• 31:54
  SPEAKER_01: And then we got into this and then we were able to untangle it.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: And it was, you know, it's just it's a beautiful therapy is a beautiful thing.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_00: It really is, and uh it boggles my mind how there's still people that think it's weird or woo-woo.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_00: And and honestly, those people are the ones that need it the most.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like there's there's something and look, that's not me judging anyone, like that's just real.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_00: Like, if you if you are are just have this aversion or this like resistance to this concept of working through, like diving into the deep root causes of shit versus just like dealing with or you know, trying to solve the the symptoms of the deeper stuff.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_00: If you usually the thing that you're avoiding is where the the most progress will come from, like the most growth lies in the thing that you're avoiding the most, and so many people just they're like, oh, therapy's so weird.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_00: And plus, look, there's so many different ways of doing it now.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_00: There's so many different versions.
• 32:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like my wife and I haven't done like sit on the couch type therapy, but we've done like spiritual journeys and stuff with with you know stuff that I never would have thought in a million years we'd do, but like it's so freeing and powerful that I can't recommend some version of therapy or deep work highly enough.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: So that's incredible.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy, would you say that you're when you look back at the marriage you had prior, were you guys just kind of like coexisting, like living, like living together, or uh I imagine you're dating each other more now than you were then.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_00: Is that fair?
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and and he is asking me to go and do things that he knows I love.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'll never forget uh one one day he reached out and and said, Hey, do you want to go?
• 33:54
  SPEAKER_01: I think he asked if if I wanted to go hiking and then go and grab uh lunch, and you know, there was something else, and I think my jaw like dropped to the ground because I was like, Yes.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like I, you know, like it was almost like this honeymoon phase all over again because I was actually like he was recognizing how like what I love to do and ask and actually inviting me to do that, where if you know it feels like you know, you don't neither one of us have done that since like we were dating, you know.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: We always joke that like I, you know, I would always ask him to go out to watch the uh Badger basketball games and I hate basketball.
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like I don't but like you know, I I duped him.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like I um and so you know, he was like actually making an effort, and so he I haven't he hasn't done that in in a in a decade, more than a decade, you know, and so yes, we're both much more aware of the other person's needs, and I think for the first time in a very long time, if not ever, like really actually trying to um do things to make the other one happy.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_01: Where before it was just yeah, we were just kind of surviving and and you know, I I thought, you know, I was kind of carrying, I think, the household and the dreams and the visions and the, you know, like the the building of the house and stuff.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: I I was just kind of dragging him along, where now it feels like for the first time ever, we're really working towards common goals that we have, and and one of which is to fix the financial mess that he got us in, you know.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_01: And uh, but I I have an abundant mindset.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_01: I know that we it will take time, but I'm committed and I know that as long as we're doing it together, we you know, we'll make it happen.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_00: And you've learned so much, like everything you've gone through, you could look at it as just an expensive lesson, right?
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_00: Or an inexpensive lesson because you what you've gone through could have prevented something much more catastrophic.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_00: And in fact, now things are just gonna take off business-wise for both of you because you you don't have this anchor holding you both back, you know, and and your marriage is strong and on point.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: So now you have wind in your sails, both of you going into your business every day, and then you're what's so cool, Mindy, is your kids got to watch the whole process.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now they'll always I think it's such a great thing when kids see parents fight and make up.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: So my wife my wife actually taught me this because I used to think, like, hey, let's you know look if we have something to say, like let's go over here, like we don't need to do it in front of the kids.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: And we argue very little, but whenever we do, we do it in front of the kids, and you know, that their eyes are big, and then we quickly resolve it in front of them, and so we want to normalize that for them.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like, that's a healthy relationship.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: Like people who love each other still argue and still have disagreements, but I want them to see see us resolve it.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_00: So the fact that your kids got to see that is is so cool.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and that um that sort of is a good segue into just sharing a little bit of the rest of the story that uh of the the worst year of my life.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because my uh so when I when I found all of this out, it was the week before Thanksgiving, and um my dad happened to be coming into town and he was gonna be staying with us, and so there was really no way for us to hide this from him at this time because I was just learning of it.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_01: We're in this itty bitty um apartment, he's staying with us, we're getting ready to leave for New York.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: You're staying in the apartment, and yeah, he was staying in the apartment.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_01: We were we were heading to yeah, right?
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_01: I know it was like it was a lot, but he was we were heading to New York, so he was just gonna stay there.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: He was visiting family and stuff.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_01: But um, you know, I I wish that I would have recognized some of these red flags at the time, but also I again it didn't waste any of the struggle that that was waiting ahead.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because my dad told me that we that that what we needed to tell the kids was that I had overspent on the house.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so that we were gonna have that we were gonna be our finances were gonna be tight for a while because I had made some poor choices.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_00: Your fault.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_01: It A, we should lie to our kids, and then B, I should take the fall for something that did not have any part in.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_00: There's and yes, there's judgment in that.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah, as there should be, and as like I that should have been a bigger red flag to me, but my dad and I had not, um, I had not, I've not known my dad all that long.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't meet him until I was in my mid-30s.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_01: And around the time that we my husband and I had decided we were gonna build a house, he had asked me if I wanted to, you know, go in on some sort of joint real estate venture so that they would have a place to stay when they when they were gonna be up in Wisconsin for their summers.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so I said, well, the timing is not great because we're gonna build a house and we're gonna be putting all of our, you know, all of our eggs in that basket for right now.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so uh I had offered, which was a big mistake.
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_01: Hopefully, somebody out there can learn from this mistake.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_01: I had offered to let them finish out a portion of our basement that they could stay in for the summer months while they were up in Wisconsin visiting family, and then they would, you know, be somewhere warm in the winter months.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's really cold and awful here in Wisconsin.
• 39:46
  SPEAKER_01: So, um, so you know, this plan was a little bit in motion when I find out about this this situation with Kevin and and our finances and whatnot.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_01: And and then so my dad and his girlfriend decided to pursue this basement build out.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and there were a few boundaries, but not really a lot.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we were we had agreed to housing them for the summer months, and I had told him I needed we needed the three solid months to move in and get settled or whatever.
• 40:18
  SPEAKER_01: Well, long story short, he finds out that Kevin and I are fighting for our marriage because obviously in the beginning it was not as it was not butterflies and rainbows and roses like it is now, right?
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we we I didn't know.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know if we would stay together.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know if we would be able to come out of this as a couple or not.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_01: So at that time we're really kind of fighting for our marriage, and they decide to not only move in on top of us and not give us the three months, but they decide that they're gonna, she's gonna take a full-time job for two years and they're just gonna move in for two years straight.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_01: Into our new home.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_01: Quite without our without your approval.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_01: Without our knowledge, without our approval, without Yeah, how does that work?
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_01: It was it was rough.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, honestly, it made it well, and the thing about it is, you know, I learned a lot of lessons.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I went through a lot of heartache.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, honestly, I was I was fairly quick to become hopeful with Kevin and that whole situation because I just wanted my husband.
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_01: I just wanted a relationship with my husband, and I felt like this was actually going to be the ticket because I knew that he would need to get help if we were gonna make it through.
• 41:37
  SPEAKER_01: And if he were gonna, if he got help, we would be so much farther ahead.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_01: So I was relatively hopeful from the from the get-go, you know, to for the most part with Kevin in that situation with his business and all of that.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_01: The situation with my dad, however, made me want to put my brand new dream home on the market because I did not want to share my brand new dream home with my dad and his girlfriend and their dog and their boat and their motorcycle and their three cars and their trailers and all of this stuff that they just brought in.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_01: And and that was the hardest thing that I've ever gone through because I didn't know what to do.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_01: But the beautiful part of it is that that I got, I was thankfully had already hired this amazing therapist, and this therapist really helped me to understand because I immediately was like, what is my responsibility here?
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_01: Because I'm very, very self-reflective and I take a lot of accountability and a lot of really uh responsibility for the situations that I find myself in.
• 42:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought like that was my first thought was how did I let this how happen?
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_01: Like I have to be a part of this.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_01: And so through that, I learned I learned more through that situation than I did even through the situation with Kevin about the fact that I have been overfunctioning.
• 43:00
  SPEAKER_01: And it came out of, you know, when you when you mentioned the the root cause of things, it came out of abandonment issues.
• 43:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know, my my dad wrote wrote me off and I felt abandoned for 35 years of my life.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_01: And then I I, you know, I I he and I got a relationship and then and then this, you know, he kind of took, I mean, I gave him an inch and they took a mile and blamed me for it.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, and so there were there were so many, there was so much personal growth.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: And don't get me wrong, that my heart is still broken that that that that happened because our relationship at this point is is pretty much foiled.
• 43:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um he he lied to me through that.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_01: He um they they took advantage of me and then turned it around on me.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, um, he he made it very clear that he couldn't tell his girlfriend that I was right about the summer agreement because she's got anger issues.
• 43:53
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, I mean, just like mind blowing stuff, but like I I really learned.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: That I, that boundaries are not, they're not an option, especially if you want to accomplish big things in life.
• 44:09
  SPEAKER_01: You cannot be people pleasing and you cannot be overfunctioning and allowing other people to be making decisions for you, or and you cannot let that you can't let other people influence the decisions that you need to make in order to chase after your dreams and accomplish them.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because if you people please and if you overfunction, like I am a very high-functioning human being, I can accommodate other people's needs, but at the end of the day, I am worthless because I have given up, I have given everything that I have to people please other, other people.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: And guess who, guess who suffers that?
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_01: My family, my health, my husband, my marriage.
• 44:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and so I mean, I could go on for hours and hours and I will spare everyone those hours and hours.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_01: But the lessons that I learned through the therapy that I had to go through after my after this situation with my dad, after the situation with Kevin, you know, after the and and ultimately it's made me such a better team leader.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's through all of that that I realized I'm not a team leader for 12.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_01: I I can't, I can't, I don't have there, there's that, there's not enough of me to accommodate 12 agents different needs, you know, on my team right now, especially brand new agents.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like I just I learned so much about what what I can do, what I want to do, like who I want to be for the for the people in my life.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I've made some really drastic changes in the way that I function on a day-to-day basis.
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_00: I l I love that.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: So then, Mindy, over the last year, you've learned so much about what not to do as a team leader, what to do.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_00: You've made changes.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_00: You know, it sounds like you have the right butts in the right seats now, which means your team has has shrunk.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's that's huge too, because you didn't let the ego hit of like, oh, you know, I was a team leader of 12 and now it's whatever.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_00: And there's a lot of team leaders that the number of agents they have is part of their identity and part of their self-worth.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_00: And that's sad.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_00: But you have a leaner group now.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: But what are you doing differently now that you weren't doing then?
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_00: What's better, what's worse?
• 46:24
  SPEAKER_00: Talk us through this new mission realty, this new team setup that you have.
• 46:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I've I've changed a lot as a I mean, just I've gone through so many changes that I've just become a totally different person.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_01: And like I said, a year ago, yeah, I wanted a bigger team.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_01: I want the wanted the biggest team, you know, but now it just those kinds of numbers just don't it that those are surface level milestones that just don't matter to me.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I also I don't want to be leading agents that I'm not a good leader for.
• 46:56
  SPEAKER_01: And I know that I'm not the right leader for everyone.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not the right team for everybody.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_01: We run our team very, very different than than really any of the teams in my area, and I think most teams, because we're a coaching model and we're not, um, we're not like feeding agents Zillow leads.
• 47:14
  SPEAKER_01: That's I've never bought leads um and I have no intention of it.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so what I've learned, I think, along the way is that I cannot overfunction and people please my way to a successful team.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_01: I know every single day that I put my heart and soul into what I am providing for my team.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_01: And mostly that's just me.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_01: I am doing personal growth on a daily basis.
• 47:42
  SPEAKER_01: I'm learning as a real estate agent.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: I am taking, you know, leadership courses anywhere I can, whether it's podcasts or books or whatever it is, so that I can be the best version of myself.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: And the people that want to be around that and learn from me because that's who I am, those are the people that I will lead and that I'm a right, the right leader for.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_01: And the thing that I I think I did and I felt like I had to do when I had this team of 12 is I had to make, I had to do, I had to like make the them all drink the water instead of leading them to it.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the biggest things I've done is stopped, stopped blaming myself if an agent isn't successful.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_01: Because I know that every day I am doing something to help them.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_01: They know that I am always available to to do whatever I can to help them.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_01: I will, I mean, I will do whatever they need to help them succeed, but I'm not going to feel bad if they're not doing their stuff.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_01: Like if they're, if I'm offering this and they don't want to take it and they're not being successful, that's not on me.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I felt very, very much like it was my fault that those 12 agents were not succeeding.
• 49:01
  SPEAKER_01: And it's I think it's too because I was trying, I was trying to I was trying to force them to succeed.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_01: That's not how this works.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, I I'm looking for Mustangs and not donkeys.
• 49:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't want to have to beat you to succeed.
• 49:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I want when I started, I was ignorance on fire.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_01: That's who I am a good leader for.
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_01: You know, people who are ready to go and they trust me, they see my vision, and they, you know, they're ready to to saddle up and do the work.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: This is awesome.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_00: And this is I think this is just part of the process that leaders go through.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, I mean, I know I've heard a similar story from so many people that I look up to that you know they led the wrong way, you know, that they were they were or they would hire the wrong way, they'd bring the wrong people on, and they would try to like motivate people to take action.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_00: If you have to motivate people to take action, you have the wrong people.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you need to have motivated people and then just show them what to do, right?
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I've learned that.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_00: I used to not do that, I used to manage, and and now I lead, I guess, and and so do you.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it's so much more fulfilling, and then it's really freeing when you when you know that you're not looking for everyone to join your team.
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_00: You're not just looking for numbers so you can have X number of agents on your team.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_00: You're looking for the right people, and the right people will end up getting you the results that you were seeking in the first place with a much better lifestyle, right?
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so that's cool.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_00: I'm excited to watch what you do with it and where you go with it.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_00: And I've already seen some changes.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_00: I I know some of the agents on your team and so much potential, and and it's awesome.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_00: And um, so Mindy, with this new version of yourself you've created and everything you everything you've gone through, all this these new tools that you have, these new skill sets, the new mindset that you have, this energy and focus, what are you the most excited for moving forward?
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_01: Who I become in the next year and and five years, because I don't think that I realized how much growth that I needed or desired until I went through everything I went through in the last year and realized how small I still think.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_01: And that even though I I, you know, I I do have an abundant mindset and a positive mindset and stuff that that it was, I was still actually dreaming really small.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I was setting up goals that weren't weren't really small and not even necessarily aligned with who I think that I really ultimately was created to be.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm excited to see who I become and through that process, who I can bring up with me, like who I can inspire, who I can, um, whose lives I can change, you know, the agents that I can impact, because I don't need to impact them all.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_01: But if, you know, anybody that's willing to dream big alongside me and come, you know, just come alongside, I am, I am all in.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_01: That does not mean, however, that I am all in on helping agents that don't align with me.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_01: And that's the biggest shift that I've seen in myself is I I don't think that I would ever have any problem anymore saying, you know what, I don't think that you're the right, I don't think I'm the right leader for you uh right now, where before I would, I would never be able to say that.
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_01: I would, I would, I would try to figure out how to overfunction my way into being a leader for for any agent that joined my team, and I'm just not willing to do that anymore.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_00: That's such a huge breakthrough.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_00: It it really is.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it's it's no different than an agent that thinks they they have to work with everybody, that you know finally getting to the point in their career where you realize you can choose the clients that you work with.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_00: And you don't if someone's an asshole, you don't have to be their agent.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_00: You just I'm not the best agent for you, this person is, or if your personalities don't don't mesh, or whatever, right?
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_00: Or if you're a petty sports fan and they're the fan of the wrong team and you don't want to work with them, who gives a shit?
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_00: You can choose who you work with, and just the way you're choosing who you mentor and work with on your team, and I think that's really cool.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_00: So I've seen I've seen the mentoring you do, I've seen the agents who are not part of your traditional team, but are part of your organization that you still mentor and you still coach, and I mean you you have your coaching group and you have your podcast, and I see the impact you're having, and I think it's just going to dramatically increase because of the struggle that you and your husband just came out of.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I know it's not over, you know, that there's there's more, uh, more growth, but my God, the the tools that you guys have to deal with those things that come up now is just I'm so excited for you and your family and your team and to watch what you do business-wise.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'm I'm excited to see what comes to.
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_01: And even though um it was the worst year of my life, there was just so much.
• 54:20
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, even just moving, moving and building a house is enough, as you know, as it is, but but add all of those other things that we went through, uh, but I would not give it back for anything in the whole wide world, including the the financial issues, because I am I am better off with, you know, now with the ability to say just because we share blood doesn't mean that you that I need to allow you to be in my life.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and at the same token went with my husband saying that I am going to continue to choose you as long as you continue to choose you.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, and just I'm just so proud of him and and who he's become through all of this.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_01: So it's it's it's it was a horrible year, but I would not do anything, I would not give any of it back for anything in the whole wide world.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_00: Well, you're on fire now because of it, and that that's awesome.
• 55:17
  SPEAKER_00: But I really appreciate and applaud your vulnerability, your transparency, and your willingness to share because I know that there's a lot of people that have gone through versions of this.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I've held shit back from um from my wife.
• 55:32
  SPEAKER_00: I've I've held shit back from my girlfriend before that.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_00: Like, you know, I've learned hard lessons too.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that if we're all honest, we all have some version of that.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_00: The key is to acknowledge it, embrace it, and and confront it head on rather than just bury it.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_00: So kudos to you guys for doing that.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, Mindy, to wrap up the show, before we let everyone know where they can contact you, follow you, hear from you, learn from you, all of that stuff.
• 56:02
  SPEAKER_00: We it's been a minute since we've had a guest, but we've got to do the rapid fire questions.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I get yelled at by by listeners when we don't do them, so I don't want to get yelled at today, Mindy.
• 56:13
  SPEAKER_00: We're gonna do the rapid fire questions.
• 56:15
  SPEAKER_00: So these are either or you can elaborate if you want to, you don't have to, but we'll blow through them and then we'll let everyone know where they can find you.
• 56:25
  SPEAKER_01: Ready.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_00: Facebook or Instagram?
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_01: Instagram.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_00: Instagram or TikTok.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: Instagram.
• 56:36
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think Instagram or YouTube.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_01: What for what purpose?
• 56:40
  SPEAKER_01: For entertainment or business?
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_00: Whatever.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_00: However you interpret that.
• 56:50
  SPEAKER_01: YouTube.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_00: Books or podcasts.
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my gosh.
• 56:58
  SPEAKER_01: Books.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_00: You're a reader?
• 57:00
  SPEAKER_01: I I am a reader, although I listen to a podcast almost every single day too, so.
• 57:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I I do both.
• 57:06
  SPEAKER_01: If both, if both were an option, I would say both.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, fair enough.
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_00: Well, how about this one?
• 57:11
  SPEAKER_00: Podcasts or audiobooks?
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_01: Podcasts.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_00: Rental property or flipping.
• 57:26
  SPEAKER_01: Rental property.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_00: Nice.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_00: For the cash flow, of course.
• 57:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the appreciation.
• 57:32
  SPEAKER_00: Burgers or pizza?
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_01: Pizza.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_00: New York or LA.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_01: LA.
• 57:40
  SPEAKER_00: Uh baseball or football?
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_01: Football.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_00: Mountains or beach?
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_01: Beach.
• 57:46
  SPEAKER_00: Podcast or vlog?
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_01: Podcast.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_00: YouTube or Facebook Live?
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_01: YouTube.
• 57:53
  SPEAKER_00: Email or text?
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_01: Text.
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_00: Rich Dad, Poor Dad or Millionaire Real Estate Agent.
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_01: Rich Dad Poor Dad.
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_00: Uber or Lyft?
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uber.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_00: Gary V or Grant Cardone?
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_01: Gary V.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_00: He's he he's the he's the fan favorite.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_00: But um Yeah.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_00: Grant Cardone has a lot of fans.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_00: He he's growing on me actually in in ways.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_00: In other ways, not so much.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 58:16
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 58:17
  SPEAKER_00: I'm I'm not sure.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_01: It seems like his messaging is just very repetitive.
• 58:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like where Gary V's always kind of got something, some new nuggets.
• 58:25
  SPEAKER_00: Fair enough.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, fair enough.
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_00: Fair enough.
• 58:28
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy, where's the best place that agents can connect with you, talk to you, ask you a question, get mentored by you, listen to you, all that good stuff?
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_01: Instagram.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_01: It's just Mindy underscore Kesnick.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy underscore Kesnick.
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_00: All right.
• 58:46
  SPEAKER_00: And we will put that in the show notes.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_01: Which is spelled Kessinich.
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_01: Right?
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_00: Not difficult at all.
• 58:53
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy Kessinich.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_00: No, Mindy Kesnick.
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_00: So we'll link to it in the show notes.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_01: Spelled Kessinich.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_00: We'll link to it in the show notes.
• 59:02
  SPEAKER_00: We'll put it in the description of the YouTube channel as well if you're watching on YouTube.
• 59:07
  SPEAKER_00: And um I assume anyone who wants to get in contact with you just send you a DM.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_01: Slide into my DMs.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_01: I also have a planner on on uh Amazon.
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 59:19
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for actually, no.
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_00: Why did you wait until now to bring this up, Mindy?
• 59:23
  SPEAKER_00: You have this awesome planner.
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_00: I get asked so much about planning, like the a daily planner type deal, and I'm always like, uh Google it.
• 59:32
  SPEAKER_00: But you've created one.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_00: And is this for like with real estate agents in mind?
• 59:37
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, absolutely.
• 59:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's not to replace like, you know, your digital can uh calendar.
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_01: I don't I don't know how anybody doesn't have a digital calendar, but I do think that it's super important to document your engagements and things like that.
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_01: So it's like the daily planner is you know, setting up your three goal, three goals for every 12 weeks or 90 days, and then writing it down every day, what you did to work towards that, uh, how many engagements you got, what you're doing, um, what your top goals are, your top priorities.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_01: And then also, you know, what how what did you do for work working out?
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what what is your income?
• 1:00:16
  SPEAKER_01: There's a spot in there for income in and income out so that you can be cognizant of your finances every day.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_01: So it's got um, it's you know, got personal and business, you know, in mind because I think that those things are they play in so importantly together that I don't think you can just work on your business or just work on yourself, your personal growth to become successful.
• 1:00:40
  SPEAKER_01: You need them both.
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I agree.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_00: And there's something so powerful about actually writing stuff down.
• 1:00:47
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_00: I love all the digital stuff, I do digital notes and calendar, but having a written plan, written to-do list, written priorities, what goals, so powerful.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_00: So that's awesome.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_00: Where can people find that on Amazon?
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_01: It's called 90 Day Planner for Real Estate Agents.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_00: Genius.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it's$12.99 and underpriced.
• 1:01:11
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, it's genius and underpriced, Mindy.
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_00: Um maybe we should edit this part out and you can just tell everyone it's like$50 because it sounds more appropriate.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_00: But um no.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_00: We'll link to that in the show notes as well.
• 1:01:26
  SPEAKER_00: Make sure you send me the link for that.
• 1:01:27
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 1:01:29
  SPEAKER_00: And and like I said, I'm gonna make sure that I promote that in in the weekly newsletter and all that that we do as well.
• 1:01:34
  SPEAKER_00: So very cool.
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_00: Mindy, you are doing a lot of great stuff for agents, and I applaud you and honor you for paying it forward.
• 1:01:44
  SPEAKER_00: This episode was really you didn't have to do this, you didn't have to open up like this, you didn't have to share this this story, but I know you did it because you know there's others that can uh who can learn from it and um uh maybe even uh get inspired to take action and uh you know attack their own issues.
• 1:02:05
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you for being as open and transparent as you were today.
• 1:02:10
  SPEAKER_00: And being in business with you is a real honor, Mindy.
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you so much.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it was a pleasure.
• 1:02:16
  SPEAKER_00: I will talk to you soon.
• 1:02:16
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for being on the show.
• 1:02:18
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, you too.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_00: So if you've made it through to the end, kudos to you.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_00: The reason why I sh the reason why we dove so deep on the relationship part is because I know what a what a benefit it is to to not have strife and stress at home.
• 1:02:36
  SPEAKER_00: It it really is such a win in your sales, and it's something that's not talked about.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_00: I have never heard it talked about in the real estate business setting before ever.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_00: It's talked about in the personal development world, it's talked about uh it's not even talked about enough there.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_00: But if you are struggling in your business right now, I want you to take a step back and ask yourself, is your relationship with your spouse or partner on point?
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_00: If not, you need to focus on that.
• 1:03:03
  SPEAKER_00: Now, you don't only have to focus on that and forget everything else.
• 1:03:07
  SPEAKER_00: That's not what I'm saying.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_00: But what you do is the opposite is you forget about you're like, okay, well, the relationship will get better if we just make the money better.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_00: If we just get the business going, then the relationship fixes itself.
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_00: I hate to break it too, but it doesn't happen that way.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_00: So I would encourage you to do what you need to do, have some tough conversations, over-communicate, take ownership and responsibility for your own shit, because I'm telling you what, you are to blame for damn near everything.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_00: And uh I'm trying to decide if I'm gonna dive deeper than that right now, and I'm not going to because Mindy's story did enough.
• 1:03:45
  SPEAKER_00: I believe that that story reached the people it was supposed to reach.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_00: That's why we were sharing it today as detailed as we did, because I knew that there were agents out there who needed to hear it, and as and as long as that happened, as long as you heard the message, I'm happy.
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_00: So please share this with other agents because you know there are agents struggling with similar stories that have similar issues in their personal lives, that is holding them back like an anchor and preventing them from growing in their real estate business.
• 1:04:14
  SPEAKER_00: So please consider sharing this with any agent who you believe would get value from it.
• 1:04:19
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you don't even know who that's going to be.
• 1:04:21
  SPEAKER_00: So put it on your story, send it out in an email, you know, tell your team about it, put it out in your brokerage's Facebook or workplace group, and we'll be back next week with another great episode, another great interview.
• 1:04:34
  SPEAKER_00: I'm excited to bring to you guys.
• 1:04:36
  SPEAKER_00: It's gonna be a good one.
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks so much for listening.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_00: Take care.