Latest / Recruiting Evolution / FDE+ | Turn Routine Recruiter Calls into a Revenue Engine with Jamie Lupo, Founder - Lupo Advisory LLC
Transcript
- Jamie Lupo [00:00:00]: Reference checks and quality control calls are honestly the easiest, most natural, and most overlooked ways to grow your desk. And honestly, the quickest. Not through cold calls, not through hard sales or awkward and painful business development calls that you're not comfortable doing, but through conversations that naturally open the door to new business. to new job orders and to true relationship building. Kortney Harmon [00:00:31]: Hey guys, Kortney Harmon, host of FDE. We're bringing you a special series of episodes called FDE Plus. Those are going to be highlights from our recent virtual conference where hundreds of you joined us for an incredible event focused on boosting revenue for 2025. Each of these sessions is packed with valuable insights, expert discussions, and actionable strategies to help you drive growth in your business. Whether you missed the live event or want to revisit each session, we've got you covered. We're going to drop each of these 10 live events to wrap up our year and kick off the new year right. So let's dive into today's session and uncover the key takeaways that will propel your success in the coming year. Stay tuned and let's dive in. Kortney Harmon [00:01:25]: Today, obviously, Jamie Lupo is here. You're going to hear from Kim Henderson, Tricia Tamkin, Maya Huebner, Donnie Gupton, Chris Heston, and then we close it with a roundtable today. That roundtable is people that are running firms and operations leaders and VPs. So, you get to hear from all those people today, and I'm so excited to kick this off. So, Jamie is— she's joining us. She's starting us off strong with someone who has spent 18 years inside of LHH, one of the world's largest talent solution organizations, trained thousands of recruiters, rebuilt struggling offices, and turning flat years into record-breaking ones. So now, as the founder and CEO of Lupo Advisory, Jamie takes that institutional knowledge directly to agency owners and recruiters who want to scale their desk without burnout. So Jamie's sessions today is around a premise that sounds Almost too simple. Kortney Harmon [00:02:18]: You can grow your commissions through sales easily and organically, and she's going to show you exactly how. We're going to talk through this, real frameworks, process control, candidate qualifications. So if you've been grinding harder without growing faster, you need to hear this. So do me a favor, connect to Jamie on LinkedIn. And Jamie, thank you so much for spending your morning with us here today. Jamie Lupo [00:02:39]: Thank you. Thank you so much. And good morning, everyone. Good morning. Kortney Harmon [00:02:43]: I'm going to jump off, so I'm going to let you talk. Anybody who has questions for Jamie while she's talking, throw them in the chat. Jamie, you can answer them as they come, or at the end I can jump on and we can talk through those. But keep your questions ready so we can make this interactive. Jamie does not have a slideshow. She's going to just talk to you today. So Jamie, kick it off. Jamie Lupo [00:03:02]: I'll be back. Thank you, Kortney. Thank you. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Hi, Mom. Thank you all for joining me this morning. I don't know if you're all on East Coast time. Jamie Lupo [00:03:15]: If you're on West Coast time, extra thank you. This conference has been so, so good so far, and I'm honestly just truly thrilled and quite honestly honored to be kicking off day 2 with you all. So thanks. Kortney gave me a great intro, but for those that I haven't met, I'm Jamie Lupo. As Kortney mentioned, I recently founded my own company where I consult with small to mid-sized staffing firms who may not have the resources or honestly the bandwidth, but absolutely understand the value and the need for continued strategy, training, coaching, leadership development, operations and process improvement, and all that kind of good stuff for their teams. I've been in staffing for over 23 years. I spent 18 of those at, uh, as Kortney said, at LHH, one of the largest global staffing firms. Shout out, they are the best. Jamie Lupo [00:04:07]: Where I started there as a recruiter, then I moved on to a sales rep, then onto a manager, and then finally into a strategy where I partnered with teams and leadership to help grow, help identify revenue opportunities, and honestly rebuild offices across the country. And over that time, I watched thousands of desks succeed and sadly thousands quietly stall. And one thing kind of always stood out. It was that most teams believe that their biggest problem is sales, and they're not always wrong, but they think they need, you know, better emails, better cold calls, better pitch decks, more leads, more marketing, more tech, more, more, more, more. And while that is absolutely a piece of the puzzle, not the— I don't think it's the full picture. And so, since this whole conference is all about the relationship-powered revenue engine, that is exactly what's missing in their sales, the way that we build and ultimately leverage relationships. And I think most recruiters are sitting on probably the 2 most valuable pieces in staffing, in staffing sales, and completely wasting it. Every time you meet a new candidate, And every time you make a placement, essentially the 2 things recruiters should be focusing on more than anything else, those 2 activities, interviews and placements, hold the keys to the castle and ultimately to the bank. Jamie Lupo [00:05:41]: But so we're going to cover references and quality control calls, but not in the way you're used to. I promise what I teach you today, you are not Doing with your teams or leveraging these activities in the ways that I'm gonna teach you today. I think what we all know is with these calls, you gain instant credibility with the hiring manager and with the candidate. They trust you. They're grateful, they're open. And what kills me is thinking about what most recruiters do with these opportunities. They send a quick email that says, just checking in to see how things are going. Or they make a 30-second call that sounds like a painful formality for honestly everyone involved. Jamie Lupo [00:06:24]: But those moments, reference checks and quality control calls, are honestly the easiest, most natural, and most overlooked ways to grow your desk. And honestly, the quickest. Not through cold calls, not through hard sales or awkward and painful business development calls that you're not comfortable doing. But through conversations that naturally open the door to new business, to new job orders, and to true relationship building. So today I'm going to show you how anyone in staffing, whether you're a recruiter, a salesperson, a manager, an executive recruiter, whatever you're in operation, anybody can turn those routine calls into an everlasting revenue engine. We're gonna talk about how references can uncover hidden hiring needs, increase your fill ratio, and decrease your time to fill. We're gonna talk about how QC calls can expand accounts, honestly, without even really pitching. And third, the exact word tracks that turn simple check-ins into new opportunities. Jamie Lupo [00:07:34]: Something that's really important to me is making sure that people can walk away from this with Real word tracks and real actionable things to take to their desk immediately. So at the risk of being the bearer of bad news, if you are waiting for clients to call you with their next job order, you might end up waiting a very long time. It's not 2020 when job orders were just falling out of these magical money trees like we had for a bit. And winning teams, I think, have really returned to what's always worked. Kortney Harmon [00:08:05]: Mm-hmm. Jamie Lupo [00:08:05]: which is the hunting and the farming for buyers. You know, well, that's the bad news. The good news is if you learn how to leverage these relationships that you already have, you'll never run out of business. So I wanna start off by sharing a story. As I mentioned, I started as a recruiter and organically grew into a salesperson, sort of unbeknownst to me. So early in my career, I was, as a recruiter, sitting at my desk in this massive global staffing firm, minding my own business. And one of our VPs was in town and she comes up to my desk and whispers to me that, like, so she said, Jamie, I just got the most recent, uh, revenue rankings and you are number one. You're the number one recruiter in the entire company. Jamie Lupo [00:08:53]: So if you're in a staffing firm every year, you typically have, you know, we called it All-Stars, others call it President's Club. And you go and everybody, they have like their big gala night when the awards come out. And I was gonna be the girl. I was gonna be the girl on the stage doing my Taylor Swift moment of like, oh my God, me? I didn't know. Thank you. And so we're sitting there at the table and I'm so excited. So when all the recruiters who earned their way to this amazing all-expense-paid company trip make their way up to the stage, I was gonna be the one. I was gonna be told I was the best. Kortney Harmon [00:09:25]: Mm-hmm. Jamie Lupo [00:09:26]: And that all of my hard work, honestly, it hasn't been for nothing. I lived for that stuff. And so I was so excited and they bring up all the recruiters and they don't call my name. And so I'm at this table in my little gown and I turn to my boss and I'm mouthing every expletive you can imagine. I'm looking at him like, and he's just like, I don't know. I don't know. He's just panicking. So next they call up all of the salespeople. Jamie Lupo [00:09:53]: And my name is called and I'm brought up to the stage for that one. And I'm like, what the heck? There must have been a glitch in the matrix or a spreadsheet crossed over or just a typo or whatever it is. And I didn't get my Taylor Swift moment because I wasn't the number one salesperson. I was the number one recruiter. And so I was just so confused and I, you know, made sure to make my boss's life hell for the rest of the trip. But, but as we get back to New York, my boss is a VP at the time. pull me into an office and they pull out my reports of my revenue and they say, take a look at this. Do you notice something here? And what we noticed was that my sales revenue had surpassed my recruit revenue. Jamie Lupo [00:10:34]: And without me even noticing that I was just organically selling by, you know, I'm talking to clients all day, every day as a recruiter, but I'm actually still skill marketing and doing all the things that you do. And unbeknownst to me, I had grown my revenue so much that I was now a salesperson. So I want you to keep that story in mind while we're working together this morning. And I'm gonna start now with my references strategy because that's honestly what I'm most passionate about and I just love them so stinking much. And then we're gonna end with the QC call strategy. So references, I think it is very fair to say most recruiters Hate, if not dread, references. They see them as an administrative task. They wait until the last minute to sort of like check the box. Jamie Lupo [00:11:26]: It honestly, if we're even doing them at all. References are what got me from good to great. They got me from a $300K desk to a $700K desk in a recession. They were probably the most calls I made in production in all of my roles. Sales and recruiter. And I was a recruiter for— I did, um, my practice area was HR, supply chain, admins, that kind of thing. But I'd call accounting's references, I'd call legal's references, I'd call marketing's references, I'd call temp ones, I'd call perm ones. I didn't care as long as it was a professional reference. Jamie Lupo [00:11:59]: I know it's gonna be the warmest call I can make. And I think everybody kind of knows that references are the most returned voicemail that you could possibly have. The, Average business voicemail gets returned less than 5% of the time. That's painful to think about. Roughly, is that 1 in 20? But reference calls are statistically known as the most returned voicemail a recruiter can leave because you're not selling and you're not asking for help for yourself. You're asking for help for someone who they personally know. And If I'm being honest, I just simply, I don't like cold calls. Some folks, good salespeople, they rock those out so well and they like live off of that. Jamie Lupo [00:12:40]: That was not my jam. But references, references work. References and QC calls are how I went from a recruiter to a salesperson without even realizing it. I built relationships with these people that, and that's how I would get new contacts in my, I think in production at that company, I was in like production for like 10 years. I was with them for 18. I was a 7, 7-time in a row all-star President's Club, whatever you wanna call it, participant. And I've never once used ZoomInfo. Uh, I have no clue what that site even looks like. Jamie Lupo [00:13:13]: I've never used Demandbase. I've never used any sales contact database. I've never even used LinkedIn Recruiter. My candidates have all the existing contacts I need to muster my accounts. I attribute all of my sales success solely to QC calls asking for referrals and references. So let's get into it. I think it's important to remember that all too often we sort of forget that we barely know these candidates that we then send out to our very hard-earned jobs, especially these days when everything is so virtual, especially interviews. Safe space, real talk. Jamie Lupo [00:13:54]: I think at best we're having 20-minute phone conversations with essentially strangers, and then we're out there matching 'em to jobs and trying to get fills, but we have no clue about them really other than what they told us. And they can tell us whatever the hell they want, quite honestly. But it's up to us to verify their skills before we go out there and sort of, you know, stamp our name on their efficacy. So one of my favorite word tracks that I use with candidates to actually get references from them with no pushback, because that is a huge piece of the puzzle as well. I always say, most people, this is me pretending I'm on a phone. Most people are not comfortable talking or bragging about themselves, and that's normal. Plus, I've only known you for about 20 minutes, but your past manager has known you for 3 years, let's say. That is who we want helping us speak about your work quality and your skills on your behalf. Jamie Lupo [00:14:51]: But pause. What if their last manager was from like a brief temp job and they're like, oh, they barely know me. It's, they don't know me for that long. It's not gonna work. And they've, you know, only known them for 3 weeks, 3 days, 3 months. I mean, we all know that's even better. And so the word track I will say to them is, I'll say the exact same thing except with this twist. I will tell the candidate, that person can speak to how you jumped in and completed the project under the deadline, or how quickly you picked up their internal database. Jamie Lupo [00:15:22]: So, the candidate now sees the value in sharing names and starts really honestly offering more than I even needed in the first place. And that obviously only helps me and my team with more sales. sales opportunities. And so, a quick side note, if a candidate, after me being that kind of honest and transparent with them, if they're still being a little sketch after all that about giving me names and numbers, to me, that's a huge red flag. And they just helped me realize that I really need to proceed with caution on this one. And that's a win-win in my book. So, I use references to increase what I call selling off the desk and, you know, selling as a recruiter in 2 ways. One, if they were a temp, that's an immediate lead call that I'm making disguised as a reference. Jamie Lupo [00:16:11]: And we're gonna get into the, the word tracks there. And then second way is if they were not a temp, but you know, it's a regular old reference from a long-term manager. That's how I'm building my own sales contacts with almost zero chance of stepping on toes of any other sales colleagues. 'Cause that's where it can kind of get messy when we're trying to get recruiters to do sales. Or if they're not comfortable with it and they want to pass it off to a salesperson that they're afraid of stepping on each other's toes. But typically I would say, I mean, don't quote me on this, but like 90% of the time they're all brand new contacts. So I mentioned 2 ways. Let's start with the first one, a true sales call, a lead disguised as a reference. Jamie Lupo [00:16:53]: So references can take a lot of time and recruiters are Wicked busy. So I always suggest changing your approach. I think all too often we call the reference, we go through all the questions, and then we spin it into a sales call. And by that time, the contact is so over that call. We've had them on the phone from, you know, anywhere from like 10 to 20 minutes already. They gotta go. And this is frustrating for you. When our candidate's reference is also a competitor lead, I do not call and get the actual reference info. Jamie Lupo [00:17:28]: Why? Because after that 10 to 20 minute call, and then I say, I wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't ask, when was the last time you worked with a staffing firm? Which is what everybody says. They're gonna lie to me. Kortney Harmon [00:17:41]: They are. Jamie Lupo [00:17:42]: They're gonna lie to me and they're gonna say that they don't use staffing firms just to get off of this godforsaken, never-ending call. And honestly, now I'm annoyed and frustrated and lowkey, I probably never wanna try that sales call again. So if I'm trying to get, you know, a recruiter to dabble into do some more sales, cuz we need to grow revenue, and I ask 'em to do the, the reference call and it's a warm call and blah, blah, blah, and they do it the old traditional way, you're not gonna get them to really wanna make that call again. So I changed my approach and I changed the approach with the teams that I work with and It is flawless. So I'll call the reference and I say, hi there, I just finished interviewing Rachel and I was so excited about her. I wanted to jump in right away and start calling her references. Today, I simply just need to verify Rachel worked where she said she worked, she is who she says she is, and if she did a good job there. I will follow up with you For a more in-depth reference as we get closer to finding Rachel her new job. Jamie Lupo [00:18:46]: So this call can be fairly quick. Just to verify, Rachel was a temp through Robert Half helping on a project with you for the past 5 months. Is that correct? I am purposely asking a closed-ended question. I am steering them to admit and acknowledge that they used a staffing firm to hire a temp. Once they have confirmed this info, I then say something like, perfect. I'm eager to start marketing Rachel to my clients, but before I do that, I always like to dot my i's, cross my t's. Thank you for the help. Hey, how did Rachel do? Why did the assignment end? How did you like the experience with Robert Half? What didn't you like? What other roles have you reached out to staffing firms to help you with? What are the other departments? And I keep going until they stop me. Jamie Lupo [00:19:35]: This is where I push my favorite expression of just one more. I ask just one more question until I get the boot. I applied that just one more to everything. If I'm, you know, having a bad day of calls, I make just one more to try to get me over the hump. If I'm trying to work on a bill rate, I add just one more dollar to see if I can get them there. If I need client visits, I add just one more to try to get my desk over. It's how I'm constantly pushing myself. And I'm doing this on the phone with clients. Jamie Lupo [00:20:01]: I'm asking them just one more question until they stop me. Because honestly, if you say, oh, just one more question, you could say that 30 times. Like, they're not going to stop you. So I implement— after that, I then implement my sales tactic. I already set myself up for a callback when I said, this will be a quickie, but I'll call back for a more formal reference when necessary. They think I'm doing them a favor by saving them time upfront. They're not wrong-ish. So a few days later, I call back and I say, I have a position I think Rachel would be great for. Jamie Lupo [00:20:35]: It's a recruiter position. Can you talk to me a bit about how many roles Rachel would handle there at a time? What was her offer-to-acceptance rate? You know, I'm doing the whole thing. So it sounds like I'm doing a reference, and I am, which is my job. But one, I'm also getting Killer intel for my submittals on Rachel to my open jobs. And 2, I'm also getting amazing desk knowledge about this company. And 3rd, I'm building a relationship with this hiring manager. Or you can call them with and take another approach. Let's say you actually do have a great job order and wanna submit Rachel. Jamie Lupo [00:21:14]: You know, maybe the first time it was sort of just kind of bluffing to try to get a reason to call back. But maybe you actually do have a really solid job order and you want to now use this time. Let's get like real sizzle for our skill market, for our submittal of Rachel. So I'm going to call that reference. Then I'm going to say, I have a role I think Rachel would be great for, and I want to get her submitted ASAP. This client, I'm going to tell them about it. This client needs someone who has worked on projects with teams before. I know Rachel mentioned she did that in our interview. Jamie Lupo [00:21:45]: But I wanted to ask you from a managerial standpoint, how does she perform working with others and collaborating on big projects? Here's what happens by asking the question in that way. The answer will be the game changer for your candidate submittal. So let's say you're working on this order, this, you know, or they have to work in projects against other agencies. Another recruiter will submit a submittal that says something like, Rachel has experience working with teams on projects. Great. Yours is going to say, I spoke with Rachel's last manager this morning about her experience working on projects with a team, and he said she truly shines in group collaboration. She's great at the brainstorming part, but was also crucial when it came to keeping everyone on task and assigning deadlines to ensure they hit their target. And because of Rachel, They finished their project 2 weeks ahead of schedule. Jamie Lupo [00:22:41]: I mean, that's a game changer. That is what will turn submittals into starts. If you've got a job that where a client isn't getting back to you, it's not because usually because they're so busy. It's usually because they didn't— your candidate didn't speak to them. Submittal wasn't enough. And if that's what's happening to you, call that candidate's reference, get that information and get it to your contact. That is what will Revive these lost orders. It is how you will fill more jobs and how you will increase your fill ratio and decrease your days to fill. Jamie Lupo [00:23:15]: These are the kind of things that truly, like I said, they turn submittals into starts. Okay, so now here's where the fun sales part starts to happen. Obviously you got Rachel the job, so what are we gonna do next? We're gonna call that reference back again and you say, Thank you so much for taking the time to talk to me about Rachel's experience. It was worth it because she starts her new job on Monday. I'm so excited for her. She's thrilled, and she knows that this would've never happened so quickly if it wasn't for your help. This is one example of how my firm does things a little differently than other staffing firms. You have been amazing, and I would honestly, I'd really like to continue to partner with you and your organization. Jamie Lupo [00:23:58]: When was the last time you worked with a staffing firm? So from a sales perspective, you've already built a relationship. You guys are already partners together. We got Rachel her new job, and this is how sales, how the sales relationship just kind of evolves. You know exactly what that person hires for because you just placed the profile. You can now start to skill market similar candidates. You can notice what software they use, what strengths they mentioned stood out to them in the reference check call, all those kinds of things. And this is why I love references. They not only help improve my fill ratio, but they naturally create sales relationships. Jamie Lupo [00:24:48]: It's like 9 birds with 1 stone. And all of this comes from a call that you honestly, you already have to make. You're just making it better. So for me, the entire point of sales or recruiter selling, it's not to add more activities to your day. It's for you to do more with the existing activities in your day, the things you already have to do. So if you think of sales calls like references, referrals, and QC calls, You will naturally increase your sales because of your skill marketing. It's gonna become a natural part of your process. Every single reference call I make, I basically have a hiring profile cheat sheet right in front of me. Jamie Lupo [00:25:33]: I have the resume of their past employee. I have the answers to the test. So every call I can skill market a similar profile, and that's how I built my own book of business. With new contacts without stepping on any sales exec's toes. References, they are the best. Okay, on to my second favorite part of, of sales that makes it easy is the QC call, the quality control calls. This is another money in the bank activity that gets either honestly fully ignored or fully slept on. I had my team of strategists, do audits on how the company was doing in each geo market across all different practice areas, across all different tenures and all different roles. Jamie Lupo [00:26:22]: And the results, honestly, they broke my heart but uncovered a huge opportunity for growth. If we had, let's say, 500 temps out on assignment, we uncovered That maybe, maybe 10 to 20 of those candidates and clients had received a QC call in the past 30 days. Not 10 to 20%, 10 to 20 total. And it gets worse. Of those 10 to 20 check-in calls, they were doing just that, checking in. And that's great. That, don't get me wrong, our candidates and clients deserve to feel taken care of and heard and Given an opportunity to share their feedback, and that is crucial. It's a crucial piece of the QC call. Jamie Lupo [00:27:11]: But the amount of no news is good news we saw in the notes was like a gut punch. I think we all know that's honestly rarely true. No news actually scares the heck outta me. And in staffing, we work our tails off to turn Job orders into placements and commissions. And I just don't understand why we would not protect the money that we already have coming in. So here's my approach to QC calls. First, we start with a call to the candidate that we have placed, checking in, seeing how everything is going, but with a twist. I'm asking the expected things like, how's everything going? Uh, is it, you know, what we expected? Anything you need clarification on? All that good stuff. Jamie Lupo [00:28:02]: But actually, side note, I need to mention my approach to staffing is transparency versus honesty. They sound the same, but they're really truly not. Transparency is telling someone something upfront to instill trust and security. Honesty is telling the truth when asked. If ever asked, and it can lead to insecurity and distrust. Transparency is my lifeline. I don't know who I would be in business or in life if I didn't lead with transparency. This is a bigger concept, and I'm happy to elaborate on that to anyone who has questions. Jamie Lupo [00:28:40]: Just hit me up after. But I mention this transparency because it's crucial in this QC strategy to know that I have already told my candidate When they got the job that I will be making these calls. I'm telling them upfront. I'm never trying to surprise my clients or candidates. Surprise party, fine. Surprises, not so much. They know I'm going to check in at the end of the first day, the first week, and biweekly thereafter. I have already told them what I'll be asking, why I'm asking, and we've even discussed a time of day that's best for these kinds of conversations. Jamie Lupo [00:29:17]: You know, I'm not doing a QC call at 10:00 AM when they're on their assignment and they're at work and at their desk, and now they're on their cell phone talking to me now versus not telling them ahead of time, likely getting their voicemail when I call, and then being caught off guard and not prepared with the intel that I want when we talk. Okay, so that's my whole little spiel on trust versus transparency. We're leading with transparency. So We are on our prescheduled candidate QC call asking all the normal questions, but then I'm asking just one more. When I'm asking, how's everything going? I'm following up with, how's your manager been? How's the work going? How's the team? Because I'm going to use all that intel for either myself or whomever on my team to share on the client QC call. And then I'm asking them, what other managers are you getting to work with? So for example, I report to Linda, but I also work with Larry, Rick, Andy, Dana, Lori, and tons of others. I could give you the whole company org chart if you asked me, but if you never ask, you never get. So Rachel tells me she loves the job so far, all the good things. Jamie Lupo [00:30:31]: Her manager's the best, so helpful, yada, yada, yada. And then she tells me she's also gotten to help with, let's say, the procurement manager on a side project. And so now I'm responding in a big way. I'm saying, that is awesome. I love that. What's the project? Do you like it? Is the manager being good to you? I'm being protective. Do you like them? Oh, good. Hey, what's their phone number? I want to call them and thank them for being so great to my candidate. Jamie Lupo [00:31:01]: And boom, on my required check-in call with my candidate, I already got a new contact at the company. And mind you, this works for temp and perm placements. It can be, you know, the person on your direct hire position that you staffed has been there for, you know, a week, a month, and you wanna check in and see how it's going. You've got a contract that's— you've got fall-offs for 30 days, whatever it is, you wanna make sure that you're protecting that investment. There's almost No world where you're interacting with one manager at a company. You're always gonna be having exposure to a couple of folks. And this is my foolproof call to make when I'm stuck in sales and I need new people to call. I need some fresh blood and I want it in a warm way. Jamie Lupo [00:31:44]: So, okay, next the recruiter or the salesperson, whomever calls their client and shares the great info about How much Rachel is loving the job, how helpful you've been, how happy they are. How's it going from your point of view? These are all best-case scenarios, obviously. Maybe we're sharing some bad news, whatever it may be, but we are protecting our investment. And again, transparency. I'm telling my client I'm gonna be calling and checking in. I tell them ahead of time. The last— I'm telling them exactly that the last thing I want is for you to be frustrated or, you know, suffering in silence until you're so over it that you wanna fire my person. Or even worse, God forbid I didn't check in because I don't wanna be annoying. Jamie Lupo [00:32:31]: And then some other agency calls and you're like, yeah, actually I have someone I think I need to get let go of. And then I've lost your business entirely because I was too scared to check in and I didn't wanna bother you. So these calls are— I'm telling my client, these calls are your time to tell me what's working or what's not working so I can fix it for you. That's what me and my team are here for. It's part of what you're paying for. So now it's warm and fuzzies versus annoying and unexpected. Transparency is currency. I cannot express it enough. Jamie Lupo [00:33:05]: And it takes a little longer to express these things, but you get everything much faster. So if I have to spend a little bit more time upfront, To fill a job faster, to get new contacts faster, to, you know, not be chasing a voicemail forever. Fine by me. Okay, so we've done our QC call with our candidate. We've gotten a new contact. Now we're gonna call that procurement manager and we're gonna call them really kind of simply just calling to thank them. I was, you know, we're gonna say like, I was just checking in with Rachel today and she was telling me how much she's loving this side project with you. Thank you. Jamie Lupo [00:33:41]: Thank you for making her time there even better. You have no idea how much that means to her and to me. You know, it's, yeah, I'm making, I'm really making a meal out of it. Like, you know, starting a new assignment can be tough and, you know, they don't know anybody and this makes it so much better and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And honestly, I might even leave it at that. I'll, you know, exchange an email address so they can let me know if there's a problem or whatever. But I sometimes I like to keep it sort of nice and no pressure. Because I know I'm going to be calling them back. Jamie Lupo [00:34:09]: But either way, they're now getting added to my call plan. You needed help, and I'm going to use that intel on my next follow-up calls with you. So I'll check in in like a week and see if they need someone full-time. You know, how's that project going? Is it taking more time than you thought? Do you maybe need another temp of your own to help with this work? What else is on their desk that's not getting the time it needs? I'm uncovering their pain so I can offer solutions. If in this scenario, our girl Rachel is a temp, I'm really driving home the whole, who else are you working with questions with Rachel on every single QC call? Because maybe, you know, week 1 she didn't meet anybody else, but week 3 she did, and week 5 she did. So I'm, I'm really driving that one home. Because I want to do. Yes, it's, it's, you know, for the obvious reasons that I wanna get as many contacts as possible and, you know, grow my book and blah, blah, blah. Jamie Lupo [00:35:05]: But also mainly because I want to do everything I can to keep Rachel working. So maybe her assignment is scheduled to end in 2 weeks. I'm not just calling her manager to try to extend her, but I'm also gonna call the other folks she's helped during her time there. And I'm going to call and say, hey, I just wanted to let you know Rachel is slated to wrap up her assignment in 2 weeks. I know she's not technically your employee, but I didn't want you to be blindsided or put in a bad way if she's mid-project on something for you. Then I'm selling based off of their response. And maybe Rachel's current assignment is ending, but maybe we need to create a new one for this contact. When they hear she's leaving, suddenly all of this work that she's been doing for them flashes before their eyes and they realize it's all going to end up back on either their desk or their team's desk. Jamie Lupo [00:36:03]: But to not even know this info and not even get to ask because we never sent— or no, because all we did was maybe send an email or we never even checked in. That's such a waste of time. Again, maybe you're not doing the activity, so you're Saving time? No, it's a waste of time and a massive waste of, of, it's just a revenue miss. So maybe I don't extend the assignment or, or get a new order, but I'm stoked I got new contacts who I know used a temp and I can continue to then skill market talent to based off of real experience. QC calls are a team effort, and when done strategically, they immediately give life back to a stale desk. So before we wrap, and I will go into the, the chat for a second and look at the comments. Before we wrap, I wanna leave you with something practical because this talk shouldn't just be interesting. Hopefully it should make you money. Jamie Lupo [00:37:04]: So here's a 7-day challenge for anyone listening. For the next 7 days, do 3 things. First, Ask for 2 references from every candidate you interview. Not 1, 2. And I think a lot of the times when we're asking for references, people will say, you know, for compliance purposes, we have to have it. I can't place you unless I have 2 references done. Those are almost like threats, and there's no what's in it for me. There's no WIFM for the, the candidate. Jamie Lupo [00:37:31]: So use this framing, the one I had mentioned earlier. I've only known you for about 30 minutes, but your manager has known you for years. That's the person who can really help speak to your unique strengths. That one small shift will instantly expand your network of hiring managers. Second, treat every reference call like a discovery call. After verifying the candidate, ask just one more question, and then one more, and then another. And it's questions like, how did the assignment end? How was your experience working with the staffing firm? What other teams use contractors? What roles are hardest to fill? This is how recruiters can sell without sounding like they're selling. And third, call one active placement this week, a true QC, quality control call. Jamie Lupo [00:38:20]: Ask, what surprised you about the hire? Where were they adding the most value? What skills does your team need more of? Those conversations reveal Real hiring needs before the job order even exists. And if you do this consistently, 3 things will happen. You will increase your fill ratio, you will grow hiring manager relationships, and you will generate new job orders naturally. And the best part is that you didn't need to add a single extra activity. You just made the calls that you already have to make. You just made 'em smarter. And if you do this for 7 days, And it works, I beg of you, don't stop. Keep doing it because references and QC calls are not administrative tasks that you have to do for compliance. Jamie Lupo [00:39:07]: They are the most powerful revenue engine on your desk. Kortney Harmon [00:39:11]: This is actually one of my favorite topics, guys, because this is the easiest call. I know Jamie threw some stats out there about what happens and what is going on, but I'm going to Can you answer that question? Jamie Lupo [00:39:26]: Here's how you would relate this to references for full-time permanent hires when they may or may not have used search firms before. I use them the exact same way. I like references for permanent hires even better because they're typically— we're staffing for higher-level positions. So, you know, when I was doing staffing for admins and that sort of thing, I would get camp counselor reference or, you know, the target manager reference, and those I can't really do much with. But when they're full-time permanent positions, we're usually getting higher-level quality references, and I'm doing the exact same thing. I am asking them, 'cause that's a potential hiring manager. As long as they are a manager of a sort, I can turn it into a sales call doing all of those same tactics. I'm gonna say, you know what, Mr., Mrs. Jamie Lupo [00:40:09]: Reference for this full-time job, I just wanna make sure that, you know, Rachel is who she says she is. I'm gonna start skill marketing her. I wanna start getting her work immediately. As I get closer to finding her something, I'm gonna give you a call back and and do a real more in-depth reference. And I'm just gonna keep doing the exact same cycle. And then I get them the job. And as I wanna submit Rachel to jobs, same exact process. That's why all of these things and the amount of times, 'cause I used to run temp teams and, you know, executive recruiters and search teams would say, well, it doesn't work for us. Jamie Lupo [00:40:41]: And then I ran search teams, direct hire permanent teams, and the exact same process works. Kortney Harmon [00:40:47]: Is there any other questions for Jamie so I can put them in? I'm, I'm talking to Jamie. Jamie Lupo [00:40:51]: Read your lips. This is interesting. I felt like I was yelling at her. Kortney Harmon [00:40:56]: She was hard of hearing for some reason. I apologize. Any other questions? Brooke, thank you for that question. Amazing. Jamie Lupo [00:41:03]: Any other questions? Jamie, thank you. Bye. Thank you. Kortney Harmon [00:41:10]: It's all right. Technical difficulties. Have a good day, Jamie. Courtney Harmon [00:41:16]: We hope you found today's session insightful and inspiring. Remember to stay tuned in the upcoming weeks as we'll be sharing all of this amazing content of our virtual conference. If you miss any part of it, don't forget to subscribe to our show so you don't miss anything upcoming. And if you like this valuable content, if you enjoyed this episode, please feel free to share it with your network and leave us a review on your favorite podcast platform. We'd love to hear your thoughts. Together, we're building a community of growth. And learning. Until next time.