Latest / The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten / When You Want To Stay Single After Divorce... Or When You're Ambivalent About Dating So Your Kids End Up Hating Your New Partner

Transcript

When You Want To Stay Single After Divorce... Or When You're Ambivalent About Dating So Your Kids End Up Hating Your New Partner · The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten

• 0:05
  Hi everybody and welcome to the Doctor Psych Mom Show.
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  Today we're going to be talking about who should just stay
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  single, you know, and not worry about finding a relationship.
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  And I will get to that as soon as I tell you to subscribe.
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  Most recent subscriber episode was on what you should expect
• 0:24
  from therapy and what is not fair to expect from therapy or
• 0:27
  not really useful because it won't happen.
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  And the there's there's 120 subscriber episodes.
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  There will be more out by the time you hear this.
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  And if you do not subscribe, you are missing over 30 hours of
• 0:42
  listening to my melifluous tones.
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  So you should definitely do that.
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  All right. So a lot of times I get people
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  in therapy after divorce and they don't really want to date
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  at all, and but they think that there's something wrong with
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  that or that they should be dating because maybe they want
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  to show their kids a happy marriage.
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  Marriage when they didn't have one before.
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  And so then they feel like they're like disappointing
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  everybody because people ask about them dating all the time.
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  They don't really want to date and it's actually been like a
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  while, you know, years really since the divorce.
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  And they just don't want to date.
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  They don't want to be in a relationship.
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  They find it to be a lot of bullshit for not much reward
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  now. Good.
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  I mean like. Fucking don't date If you do not
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  want to be in a relationship. Do not get into a relationship.
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  That's like the stupidest thing you could do coming out of
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  divorce because you just got free of a relationship and now
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  you want to go back in a relationship without even the
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  motivation to be in a relationship.
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  Definitely don't do that. It would be like having a baby
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  if you didn't want to have a baby.
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  Like that's not going to go well.
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  Like it's vest. That is high the definition of
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  high risk, high reward and it. You might not.
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  I mean, people do regret having children.
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  There are people that regret having children, and there are
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  plenty of people who regret getting married or getting into
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  relationships. So it is not real that, like
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  every relationship you get into, whether it's a parent, child or
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  a romantic relationship, is going to improve your life.
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  If you don't have the motivation to get into a relationship,
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  don't. So then you may say, how are my
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  kids going to learn about a relationship?
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  How are your kids going to learn about having sex?
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  It's not from watching you have sex.
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  How are your kids going to learn to be a lawyer?
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  If you're a doctor, it's not watching you be a lawyer.
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  Your kids can learn a lot of shit on their own, particularly
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  if they know that they don't have a template.
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  So those kids are going to be ahead of the game.
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  So here's the kids that are really fucked.
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  The kids that are fucked, unfortunately, are the kids who
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  grow up in a home that is loveless or fighting or just
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  kind of a bad marriage. But nobody mentions it's really
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  a bad marriage. And they stay together anyway.
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  And and maybe they mentioned it's a bad marriage, but either
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  way they stay together. And so the kid kind of learns
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  this is what marriage is. So that's bad because then you
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  don't know that you have to learn something else.
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  You don't understand that. You don't know anything.
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  Now, a child that grows up with a single parent, they know that.
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  They don't know about relationships.
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  So they may go into therapy. They may, like, be very
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  observant about other people's relationships.
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  They may do a lot of reading or something.
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  You know, they know that they don't know something.
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  If you grew up having a dog and you get a dog as an adult, you
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  are not gonna read a book about how to take care of a dog, you.
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  Assume that you know how to take care of a dog.
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  But let's say that your parents, like, never wash the dog.
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  Like, ever. Well, then you're probably going
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  to not wash your dog either, and that's not being a good dog
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  owner. But let's say you did not grow
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  up with a dog. Then you're going to read a book
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  about dogs and they're going to say, by the way, every so often
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  you got to wash your dog, and then you're going to wash your
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  dog. You're probably going to be a
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  better dog owner than a person who grew up with parents who did
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  not take good care of a dog but yet had a dog.
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  You see my point here. So if your kids, if you do not
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  want to be in a relationship, you may be and avoid an
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  attachment person. You may be somebody who really
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  just doesn't like sex or intimacy or touch.
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  This may have been a problem in the previous marriage and why
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  you got out of it. You may have been burned by, you
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  know, disappointments in a previous relationship.
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  You may just be a person who likes to do their own thing,
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  live their own life. You originally wanted to have
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  kids, Now you have your kids and you just kind of do not want the
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  emotional. Engagement and the time and
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  effort to spend in a romantic relationship.
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  OK, that's fine. So stay single And every so
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  often, say to your children, oh, it'll be interesting what you
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  decide when you're older. You know, you didn't really
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  have, you know, somebody to look at, really.
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  When your father and I were together, your mother and I were
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  together, then, you know, we, we weren't happy.
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  Obviously. We got divorced.
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  So, you know, and now I I am single and really intending to
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  stay that way. And so it'll be interesting when
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  you're older, you know you, you can think more about what you
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  want in a relationship. You could really start from
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  scratch. You know, it would be
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  interesting what what you come up with kind of because you
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  don't have a template, you don't have to say that more than like
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  a couple times over the child's lifetime.
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  But you know, you could say it just so that it's verbalized
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  that like you know, they do have a deficit in certain regard that
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  they would have to remediate. Just like if you're growing up
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  and a child is an only child, I was an only child, then you do
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  not know how to parent siblings. You have to do a lot of research
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  and a lot of observation and a lot of thought and talk to other
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  people that have, you know, grown up with siblings and
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  parented siblings. Because you have no idea.
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  You don't know if they're bickering, if that means that
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  it's the end of the world or that's just like shit that
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  siblings do. And over time you figure it out.
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  But in the beginning you really understand that you are at a
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  deficit. Because you didn't have a
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  sibling, so you don't know, right?
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  And it's the same kind of thing for kids that grow up.
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  And and by the way, your ex parent in this situation will
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  probably remarry. The statistics are likely that
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  one of you will and it's not you, so it's likely them.
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  So then you know your child could see a relationship between
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  their other parent and that person's potential partner,
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  right. So it's not all riding on you,
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  but. If you yourself know that you
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  are not going to have a relationship, then don't have a
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  relationship. It's so much worse when people
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  get into bad second marriages. Then the kid is like, what the
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  fuck? Like man, marriage really does
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  suck. The first marriage didn't work
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  out. The second marriage didn't work
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  out, you know, and that's not to say of course, if you get into a
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  relationship with somebody and it's not working out, then
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  separate from them again in your post.
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  Divorce relationships obviously don't stay in a bad relationship
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  by any means. Just so that.
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  Your kids see that marriages work out because that marriage
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  ain't working out, you know, so it's you would be lying.
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  And in that sense it isn't working out anyway.
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  But the point is like, do not pretend that being single is
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  somehow worse than it would be to be in a bad relationship.
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  And the relationship would probably be be bad if you do not
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  have the full motivation to be in it.
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  So then you can say what kind of people don't have a full
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  motivation to be in relationships.
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  Well, I I just told you, but I could explicate, you know,
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  further, right? So people who are avoiding
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  attachment don't really want to be in relationships.
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  They'd rather be independent and have, you know, the ability to
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  do anything they want anytime that they want.
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  This is big, particularly for women.
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  Men remarry quicker. So really, I'm addressing women
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  by this. Women are also the ones that
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  perseverate on whether they are giving their child a good
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  template of relationship more frequently because they think
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  about the kids more frequently. As I've talked about all the
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  time, the best dad in the world compared to the best mom in the
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  world. Whoever those paragons are, I
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  bet you that that mother thinks about the kids five times more
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  than the father does. That's just evolutionary.
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  It just is. Women talk about the kids so
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  much, they're. Some men that I have an
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  individual therapy, I don't even know their kids names.
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  I really don't. I've been working with these
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  people for a long time and you know, I mean it's it's funny
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  because it's so different. And I'm not saying they're not
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  good parents because they report on doing the things that they're
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  supposed to do and men don't really obsess over the kids the
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  same way for better and for worse.
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  But anyway with given that PSA. If you are a woman and you have
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  divorced frequently, this is me time.
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  This is time to basically have your second young 20s, even
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  though you're in your 40s, fifties or beyond and do
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  whatever the fuck you wanted. Especially if when if you never
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  got to do that because you had a strict family or you were
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  religious, or you got married young or whatever, whatever.
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  But a lot of women are like, fuck all y'all.
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  I'm going to take my sculpting class and I'm going to take my
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  hot yoga and I'm going to learn a language and I'm going to
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  travel in the summer when I don't have the.
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  Kids for a week or whatever, and I don't want to touch anybody.
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  I don't want to be near anybody. This is my first marriage ended.
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  I didn't want to sleep with him. He was an asshole anyway.
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  And now I do not want to get involved with other men.
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  But what about the lack of a familial, you know, a
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  traditional nuclear family for my children in this case?
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  You see, it's not going to go well, right?
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  Like you are going to start dating.
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  You're going to find something wrong with everybody.
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  Maybe somebody will be somebody you want to get involved with a
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  little bit more. But in reality, your priority is
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  100% the kids. So you know it's not going to
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  fully work out anyway. The kids are going to be
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  ambivalent about the person if you're not motivated to date.
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  And by the way, I mean, this could be a much more interesting
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  topic that I do. I'm not more interesting.
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  I don't want to shit all over this podcast.
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  Maybe you're liking it, but it equivalently interesting.
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  Although different direction for this or another podcast could
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  be. You know when women don't really
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  want to be dating, but then they do, so they're like half and
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  half they're in. So I'll say when women are
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  ambivalent about dating after divorce.
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  So the kids. And of being the ones who hate
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  the significant other because they're picking up on the
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  mother's ambivalence. And this happens much more with
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  women. So.
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  So for example, the mother wants to be in a relationship, kind
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  of, but she also wants to sleep in the bed with the kids.
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  So she sleeps in the bed with the kids, but then on nights
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  when the guy stays over, she doesn't.
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  So guess what? They hate the guy.
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  Obviously. Of course.
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  Literally usurping their place in the mother's bed.
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  Literally. Now the door is closed,
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  etcetera, etcetera. So of course they're going to
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  hate him. But really, why do they hate
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  him? Because she doesn't really want
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  to be in that relationship and to be single.
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  What she really wants is to be sleeping with the kids in the
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  bed. Ideally, if the kids were to
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  like, you know, if she were to be like Evie and out of this
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  world and be able to stop time, then you know she would go on a
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  date and then come back. Honestly, in the bed with kids.
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  But because she only has this one life and you cannot stop
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  time like Evian out of this world, then you know she kind of
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  is pretty, you know at odds internally about whether to
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  prioritize the dating life for the kids, and mostly it's the
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  kids. But then sometimes she wants to
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  date and the kids pick up on and embody this ambivalence.
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  Usually that manifests as an extreme hatred for the partner.
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  And I talked about this a lot in my podcast on Introduction,
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  introducing your new partner to your kids.
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  And I talk about how if the partner becomes really, you
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  know, embedded in the structure of the family and the children
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  learn to rely on the partner, then they like them.
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  You know, I mean. So for example, my own
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  situation, as I think I talked about in that podcast as well.
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  So my husband, who is my second husband, as all of y'all know.
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  He drives the kids around a lot, a lot more than I do, cuz like
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  I'm fucking exhausted at night. I mean, you try working with
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  eight clients in a day, right? So.
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  So like, I'm not gonna drive to do dance pickup unless, like.
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  I don't know. It was like threat of nuclear
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  Holocaust that I had to pick her up at dance and then we were
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  like fleeing the country. But I'm just like a regular day.
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  I'm going to be at home with the other two and he's going to pick
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  her up at dance because I can't. I'm so tired.
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  I mean, I could if I really had to, but I don't.
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  So he does. And so then she's happy and she
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  likes him because guess what, he's picking her up at dance.
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  So, you know, he's obviously very necessary in that because
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  he's driving a car to pick her up at her preferred activity.
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  This is just one example of of 1.
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  Child. But then if if let's say, let's
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  say he wasn't a husband or let's even say he is a husband,
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  because a lot of people unfortunately do marry people
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  that they are kind of ambivalent about.
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  So let's say it was a situation where I wasn't sure really if I
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  wanted to prioritize being a full family, including the
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  husband too, or if really I preferred being myself with the
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  children, you know, just kind of like a single mom with kids.
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  And I kind of do like that, but you know that I also love him.
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  So it's. Kind of this situation where you
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  know, I really and that a lot of people are in and that I'm
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  hypothetically putting myself in, in this hypothetical is that
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  I am really, it's in my mind. There's always a competition
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  between whether I want to be alone with the kids or whether I
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  want to be kind of including him.
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  So in that sort of situation, I would make sure to do all the
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  drops and pickups to all the extracurriculars, load everybody
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  up in the car because I have to drive and.
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  And then I would like tell him to go do whatever you want.
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  We're fine. So then they don't perceive him
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  as embedded in the network. They certainly don't perceive
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  him as instrumental or necessary.
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  They perceive him as somewhat of a, you know, a side figure that
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  shows up or not. But really, mommy is truly the
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  only one that we can rely on, right?
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  And of course, you know, my, my exhusband does all these things
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  as well, the drops and what have you.
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  I don't mean to say that. It's just me and my.
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  My husband, but you know their their father also does this
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  stuff, in case anybody thought otherwise.
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  But the the point is that in this situation, right, you see
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  so many ways that it could go or we could all go, but I could
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  make sure to always be the one to run out and pick her up and
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  give her a big hug and moderate the conversation such that he
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  doesn't really have his own alone conversations with the
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  children. Because somehow I'm always
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  there. This is something I see a lot of
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  people do. So if you get something out of
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  this podcast, it's this. If you want to be in a
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  relationship after divorce, be unambivalent about it.
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  And model that lack of ambivalence And that a true deep
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  yearning to be in a close relationship.
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  By embedding your perspective new partner in the family
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  network incrementally in order to show that this is somebody
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  who is valuable to you and. Will be a strong part of the
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  family, right? Or don't date at all, You know,
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  if you aren't ready to potentially or I mean by not
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  date at all, I mean don't date and involve the kids.
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  You can certainly on your time away, you know, like if your Co
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  parent has the kids, you could go do whatever you can have
• 15:33
  casual sex all up and down the wazoo, whatever you want, you
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  know. But once you start involving
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  your children and introducing them to people, be sure that you
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  are ready to make them a part of your family.
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  If you are not, be real and authentic with yourself and say
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  I don't really want to date with an eye on any sort of longterm
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  relationship. I prefer to be basically a
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  single parent. And I will, you know, also
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  understand that that comes with positives.
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  In as much as I do not have to deal with another human being
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  and all of the blended family bullshit, but also negatives in
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  that they may not see, you know, a happy, loving relationship.
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  But also it wouldn't be a happy, loving relationship if I'm
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  ambivalent and maybe I will be unambivalent in future as the
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  children get older. Maybe I go through therapy.
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  Maybe my my, the priorities change, or maybe I will just
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  kind of always be a single parent that has somewhat casual
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  romantic relationships, if any, in the time that I don't have
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  the children. And I don't have to apologize
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  for that because that is my choice and I am but.
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  But the only thing that I would in theory have to apologize for
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  is a very ambivalent situation in which I have not come to
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  terms with my own thoughts or feelings about this and instead
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  I'm doing what I think I'm supposed to do, but in fact I
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  don't. Don't want to then this would be
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  not want to have a full loving relationship that takes me away
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  in any part from the children at all.
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  And therefore the children pick up on that ambivalence and then
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  they end up hating the person or finding them to be useless or a
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  distraction or somebody who takes mommy away, etcetera,
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  etcetera. All right.
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  So this did take a little bit of a of a U-turn in the middle, but
• 17:18
  I think that will be interesting to most of you that are
• 17:21
  listening and I will talk to you all soon.
• 17:23
  Have a great day.