Latest / Mortgage Marketing Radio / Ep #5: Michael J Maher

Transcript

Ep #5: Michael J Maher · Mortgage Marketing Radio

0:00
In today's highly competitive mortgage industry, building profitable relationships with
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real estate agents is essential for success.
0:06
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This has closed a remarkable 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals.
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0:35
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0:39
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of the case study today.
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Welcome to another edition of Mortgage Marketing Radio.
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This is your host, Jeff Zimfer.
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And I can't tell you how excited I am for my special guest here today.
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It's been a number of years since we've spoken.
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I know you know who he is.
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He's out there in the space every single day making a difference for mortgage professionals
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across the country.
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Before I bring him on, a quick intro, Michael Mayer, father, realtor, author, speaker,
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coach, and mentor, referred to as America's most referred realtor.
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You may know of Michael from his best selling book, The Seven Levels of Communication.
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How to go from relationships to referrals.
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If you haven't gotten this book yet, I don't know what rock you've been living under,
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but go out and get a copy of this book today.
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It's got a 91% of the reviews on Amazon are five star rankings.
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You don't see a lot of books that get a five star ranking.
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That consistently over 400 different reviews on Amazon.
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So obviously, the market has spoken.
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People love what Michael's talking about.
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We're going to dive into it.
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So a couple of quick quotes here from people you may know in the industry.
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Todd Duncan.
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What does Todd say about Michael's book, Seven Levels is the most reliable and sensible
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business building system I have seen.
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Dave Ramsey, Financial Guru.
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If you want to win in business, this book will show you how.
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So without further ado, Michael Mayer, welcome to the show.
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Wow.
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I want a great intro and thank you, Jeff.
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Always good to speak with you and thank you for the opportunity and the privilege to
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be on today.
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Fantastic.
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No, we're love that.
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We love to have you.
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I know you're extremely busy.
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And we want to really jump right into it.
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And you know, as obviously we're speaking to mortgage professionals and I'm sure some of
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the folks listening have heard of you probably have your book and then there's a percentage
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who have not.
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So I want to dive into this, you know, this overall concept of, you know, what you call
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the generosity generation or Gen Gen for short.
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So first question is why, you know, there's a lot of mortgage pros right trying to get
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notice and get attention today.
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Why is the generosity generation or, you know, unpack that a little bit.
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What is that about and why is it relevant today?
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Yeah.
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So the generosity generation was actually a reaction to the consumer.
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The consumer in the early 2000s got really tired of the where number one focus and the
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superstar and the rock star advertising and it was, you know, all about me.com.
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And that's especially in real estate.
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It was all about me.com everything was, you know, it was about you go to their website.
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It was their name.com and then it was them in the front with their arms out wide, you
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know, like look at me, you know, and, you know, what happened is that the consumer got
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tired of the greed.
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They got tired of the Brigadotio and in about 2005 they started to change to the point
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where they, they, they were not reacting to the number one.
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They were not reacting to that.
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They, in fact, it was repelling them and they were starting to become more attracted
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to humility, authenticity, vulnerability and truth because they weren't being told the
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truth.
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They thought inron was the truth.
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They thought the mortgage professionals and the, and the mortgage industry and the banking
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industry was telling them the truth and doing a good thing for them.
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And you know, the big short movie is, is definitely revealed a lot of the behind the
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scene scars and ripped the band off a little bit again.
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But it's one of those where what I found is that the more humble and the more vulnerable
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and the more authentic and real I was in the marketplace, the more generous I was, the
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more referrals I got and the bigger my business got and it was easier and more cost effective.
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Okay.
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So the generosity generation is the yin and yang reflection from the ego era.
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You know, the 90s and early 2000s was what I call the ego era and it was all about
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me.com and then it, it flipped to the generosity generation because the consumer wasn't looking
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for you.
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They were looking for the solutions that you provide.
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So you know, townhomes and over the park, Kansas was searched 100,000 times more times
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than Michael J. Mayor.
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So the generosity generation is just come about from that and the generosity generation is
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stuck, you know, and people are calling themselves members of the generosity generation and
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you know, we've got, you know, over 100,000 strong who are considering themselves members
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of the generosity generation and they are ambassadors in the generosity generation.
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Okay.
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So how would I, as a consumer or if I'm a mortgage professional listening to this, how
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do I recognize someone who is a member of the generosity generation?
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What are some of the things they do to stand out?
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Wow.
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Great question.
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So the first thing is they come into the relationship not worrying about themselves.
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You're going to find that they're full of self-efficacy, that they're self-actualized.
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They're so comfortable with themselves because they know that the 100% of the focus of
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the conversation is going to be on you.
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You might not even recognize that they are a member of the generosity generation until
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afterwards when you go, wow, that person was really interested in me and I spoke 90%
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of the time and they only spoke 10% of the time.
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In fact, I'm not even sure what they do.
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That's what's so great about this is this isn't something that you do to people, right?
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This isn't about scripts and dialogues that you memorize and try to trick people into
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moving towards you.
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People naturally move towards you because of your interest and the more interested you
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are in the other person, the more interesting you become and the more interested that person
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becomes in you.
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It's based on questions versus answers and that's the power of the generosity generation.
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They're going to notice also that they aren't bragging and all over talking about their
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successes, though I will tell you that early on, if they've just started to implement the
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generosity generation and their business is rapidly growing, like we've had a lot of
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coaching clients have happened, then there is early on, they want to tell their friends,
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they want to post on Facebook about how good they are doing, but eventually that wears
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off and they know they're doing great, so they don't have to portray it out there.
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The other thing is this is the person that is kind of, yeah, that Jeff or that Michael
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or that mortgage professional is so nice, is so kind, aren't they great?
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If they're awesome, more people will be starting to say how awesome they are instead of
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somebody, a mortgage professional telling people how awesome they are, other people are
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saying how awesome they are and that makes all the difference in the world.
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That's the root of the generosity generation.
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That makes a lot of sense and I think anybody listening to this would agree and I think
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that rings true to your point about the fallout with the banking industry, the financial
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meltdown years ago, et cetera, I really kind of revealed this renewed interest of desire
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for more as the word you used as authenticity in the market.
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I think we're all seeing that.
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You're obviously engaging with realtors and mortgage loan officers across the country on
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a daily basis.
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What are some of the systems tools or how would somebody start to reposition their business
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from the generosity mindset?
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What are some specific action steps they would take to show up differently?
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Yeah, great question.
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Instead of going in with a brochure and a packet and telling someone how great your quality
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service is and you can close in four days and you have all these wonderful loan products,
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put all of that on the back burner and don't worry about it.
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Focus instead on how you can add value, instead of answering, instead of going in thinking
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that you have a lot of questions and the way to just simply go in and ask the realtors
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or ask the financial planners or CPAs that you want to do business with, just get genuinely
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curious about their business, about their lives, about their lifestyles and look for opportunities
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to provide proactive generosity in our program.
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We teach, we have three principles and we have a formula.
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The formula for success is generosity plus appreciation equals prosperity.
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So focusing on generosity and appreciation leads to a more prosperous life and lifestyle.
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So under that we have three principles.
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The three principles are give first, give thanks and give back and please notice how those
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align with the success formula.
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Give first is proactive generosity.
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Give thanks is appreciation and give back is prosperity.
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So the give first is asking enough questions to find out a way that you can surprise the
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other person by providing value in the world.
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There is two forms of generosity.
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There is reactive generosity and there is proactive generosity.
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Active generosity is fantastic.
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Somebody has an illness or a loss or a devastating tornado or hurricane or tsunami or earthquake
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hits.
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We are phenomenal as a human race in trying to build them back up to somewhat of a normal.
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That's reactive generosity.
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We are trying to bring them the universe of human one up to somewhere close to normal.
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Are we going to be able to do it?
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In a lot of cases no, but we want to help bring them up a little bit because they have been
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knocked down.
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Well, that's reactive generosity, that's phenomenal.
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What we focus on is proactive generosity.
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Active generosity is give first and being in a way that you have two equals meeting for
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lunch or on a phone call and you give them something that will help them make their life
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better, help them achieve a goal, help them conquer a challenge, help them enjoy their
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life more or enjoy an interest that they love more.
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If they love fantasy football, then you send them information on how to be better at fantasy
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football or you connect them to people you know who run fantasy football leagues.
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You listen in such a way and then act on what you've heard in a generous way.
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What happens in that case is with proactive generosity is you've actually taking this
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universe of human nature and karma and yin and yang if you will.
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When you've helped them, you've added value to them, they go above normal that you've
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given them something they weren't expected so they're at a higher level.
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What happens is in the universe, once a homeostasis, it wants balance.
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What happens is something comes back to you, generosity leads to reciprocity.
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What this is, is this constant daily practice of proactive generosity puts the world at your
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favorite, puts the karma in your favorite.
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You've got all these people who are looking to reciprocate to you because you've provided
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so much value to them over time or in some cases over a few minutes and when that reciprocity
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comes, we teach that, listen, you need to teach and train those who want to give back
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to you, who want to reciprocate the generosity that the number one way, the finest way to reciprocate
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is with referrals because it's the truth.
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It's the truth that people can give back to you in many, many ways.
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We need to continue to educate them that the number one way is through referrals and
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the beauty here is that when they reciprocate with referrals, your bottom line goes up,
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your profit goes up and we all know that the most profitable businesses are referral-based
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businesses.
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Well, profitability is your business having money but there's something even better is
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that the more profitable your business is and the less you have to work hard to do that
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and the less you have to swallow your dignity to do that, then you start to experience prosperity.
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So generosity leads to reciprocity, reciprocity leads to referrals, referrals lead to profitability
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in your business and profitability leads to prosperity.
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Well, here's what's cool.
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Prosperity leads to more generosity, a higher and more powerful generosity and the cycle continues
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because higher and more powerful generosity leads to higher and more powerful reciprocity,
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higher and more powerful reciprocity leads to higher and more powerful referrals, higher
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and more powerful profitability and higher and more powerful prosperity, which of course
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leads to more generosity.
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Okay, thank you for that.
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Let's do this.
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Let's bring it down to the street level because conceptually, I think, it obviously it
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makes sense, right?
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We're talking about reciprocation.
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We give before we expect something to return.
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So I for some time have taught and I know this is actually talked about in your book, ways
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to actually boots on the ground level that mortgage law officers can actually start to
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build that reciprocity or that generation exchange, that value exchange with real estate
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agents.
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One way that I've taught for years how to do that is by giving lunch and learns and hosting
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presentations that add value.
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So what other ideas are you coaching law officers on?
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What they could be doing to really demonstrate that in their local market?
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Yeah.
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First of all, quit pandering, right?
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Quit chasing.com, truly, quit pandering, quit seeing yourself as a servant of the referral
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of the realtor, right?
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Is look at yourself as a partner.
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Jeff, I know that's something that you mastered, right?
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You didn't see yourself as unequal or lower.
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You saw yourself as an equal, as a partner, as someone who can add as much value to them
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as you can.
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So that's the first thing is quit pandering, putting yourself in that position.
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I mean, here's the other thing is quit cold calling.
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A cold calling is a form of pandering and pandering is coming from a weak spot.
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You have to cold call.
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That's what a realtor thinks.
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You have to cold call.
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You must not be a top producer.
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You must be new.
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You're cold calling.
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So quit pandering, that's the first thing.
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The second thing is when you get these meetings, when you get the opportunity, is, I just
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saw this.
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You know, I just literally saw this where this guy wanted to get everything in about
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his business and about how he was different, and that's the problem with how his training
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is being taught these days, is it's about your USP or your UVP, right?
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Unique value proposition or unique selling proposition or proposal, if you will.
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And the fact of matter is, is the ultimate USP, the ultimate UVP, is generosity.
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It's generosity.
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It's first seeking to ask questions instead of answering questions, is you're the one
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who asks and actually expresses interest in the other before you're, who cares if you
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can close in seven days or 11 days.
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And by the way, for those of you posting on Facebook that you closed in 11 days, quit
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it.
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No.
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Yeah.
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Let me pause you there, because I know some so long officers would probably argue that.
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I mean, I just talked to somebody the other day where they literally, you know, they're
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can close in like eight, ten days.
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And why is that not perhaps a competitive advantage or does that not, you know, gel with, you
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know, giving value, if you will, who can't close in ten days?
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Well, I mean, so, so to kind of play that out, you know, the role here, I mean, there
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are definitely some brokers out there who cannot.
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So the feeling is is, hey, mom's superior because, hey, I can close in ten days and you can't.
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So I got a better value prop.
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You're saying that's maybe, so when it closes in 12 days, so when you, oh, then you come
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back, right?
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And you close in 12 days, you failed, right?
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Right.
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Right.
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What do you mean you can't close in eight days?
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You close that guy in eight days, you know, why can't you close me in seven?
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My credit score is higher in his.
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I think the big point here is that that, while that may be kind of a nice feature, that's
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not the true basis of a real relationship and a value exchange.
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Exactly.
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I will tell you, I mean, I just literally, I watched this, I, somebody paid me a lot of
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money to come in and run, run an event and essentially run a mastermind.
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And it was, it was just so funny to watch like all they wanted to do is, is, is grill
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these hundred million dollar producers, the average on my panel was a hundred million
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producers, my coaching class, right?
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And they, they, so it's just like they just grow.
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So, you know, who do you use for your mortgage for it?
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What are you looking for in a mortgage professional?
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What, what, you know, everything was leading down the path of, oh, come on, right?
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Here we go.
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We do these questions and then they're going to tell me how they're different, which is
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exactly the path it went.
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Okay, funny enough.
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Then at the very end, I mean, we wrapped up the mastermind.
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We were all getting ready to go.
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I was talking to the, to the, the, the super producers on the panel and we were, I was
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talking to one of them about a situation that they had.
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They had a situation where this, this one client had a, you know, a movie background
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and, and, you know, kind of doesn't have the standard W2s, right?
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They, they, they kind of go project to project.
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And in talking with that, the loan officer happened to be a part of the, the circle that
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we were talking in and they're like, we can do that, right?
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And all of a sudden, these super producers who were totally turned off by, you know,
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by what they had said earlier, held in their face, they were, that's the deal, right?
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Is that now they had a solution for a problem that this agent had?
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Well, if I hadn't been asking these questions about what's your biggest challenge right
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now, then the loan officer would have never got any business.
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I mean, yeah, that's a key distinction right there.
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If I heard you correctly, what you're saying is they spent all these, this time asking
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questions that weren't specific to how they can help them in their business.
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And when somebody finally asked that question, they was like, aha, we found something, right?
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We can help you with.
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Yeah, the difference here is it wasn't a sales question.
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I mean, you know, what, what, you know, what are you looking for in a mortgage professional?
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Come on.
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If you're a mortgage professional, I shouldn't know by the way.
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We know.
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Yeah, exactly.
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And we know the shoe's going to drop, right?
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We know if whatever I answer, you're going to tell me how you fit those three things,
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right?
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Right.
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And it's just like, I mean, I could see them roll their eyes as we were having this
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lunch.
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And I was just like, I wanted to kick them underneath the table and go, no, no, no, no,
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no, you know, but here's the thing.
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So in the end, I'm asking all of them.
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Like, you guys, you guys rocked it on the panel.
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You did a great job.
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You know, you got everything going on, but let me ask you, you know, what's your biggest
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challenge right now?
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I really want to know.
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And so they were telling me their challenges.
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And one of the challenges, the mortgage professional who hired me could, could solve.
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Hmm.
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And it took that question about that, I mean, that's a personal question.
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What's your biggest challenge right now?
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Yeah.
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And so this is a really great point to hang out here for a second because it's so true
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that, you know, it's great as the fact that you can close in 10 days and that may help
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on a certain percentage of deals and that's all well and good, but not everybody needs
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to close in 10 days.
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You know, you talk about in your book about becoming a lighthouse and that resonates with
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me so much because I think that's really the point of differentiation.
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And that's what we are both talking about here is when you're coming from that place
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of how can I help setting aside my, you know, I've got to get alone on my pipe or I close
23:52
in 10 days or I'm great because of this or that or, you know, in house, whatever all
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the usual laundry list of features that you throw at people, that is kind of like, you
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know, people have a defense shield built up to that and all that stuff just bounces off.
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But when you start asking those heart-centered questions about, you know, hey, how can
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I be a lighthouse?
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How can I serve?
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That's what you're talking about.
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I think that's where you begin to reposition yourself as a mortgage professional and you're
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now seen as you said alluded to earlier, I don't even know what he does.
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Now you're seeing as not a mortgage person, but as somebody who's really trying to make
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a difference for your local agent community.
24:30
But that's the key is that they become more interested because you're not acting like
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everyone else.
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All these mortgage professionals are in general, are pandering, even the top producers
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panda in some ways and it's just like, quit it.
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You know, I think if you just are real and you honestly get curious about how to help
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that realtor other than mortgages, right, what if I told you the way to get mortgages
24:59
was to quit worrying about mortgage conversations, right, what if the way to get mortgages was
25:04
actually to just have conversations with people about what matters to them.
25:11
So that's the difference, right, we do things completely different.
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This is a truly a revolutionary approach to sales.
25:18
We do it differently and here's the beauty, it works faster, it feels better and it works
25:26
for the longer term.
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I totally agree with it, I'm a believer and that's why I wanted to have you on because
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I think this message needs to be shouted loud and clear and I don't know why it is,
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I mean, people still aren't getting it, right, they're still, maybe because you said
25:43
that the training still exists out there, go hit the pavement, they're still people
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teaching coal-calling, you know, I'm on who always says, hey, it's not, I'm not saying
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coal-calling never works, I'm just saying it sucks and it's not a highly leveraged activity
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and you're really not coming from that place of, like you said, you immediately are putting
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your, that's the, this is just a light that went on for me.
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If you're doing the same thing every other loan officer is doing, you immediately set
26:10
yourself up to lose.
26:11
That's right.
26:12
Yeah.
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Yeah, I'm a cardiologist, I really feel that way.
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I'm a cardiologist.
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I cure callus tarts and the sales training for hundreds of years have forced sales people
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to callus their heart, they've had to callus it, like toughen it up from rejection, they've
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had to toughen it up from doing things that their dignity would never have them do otherwise,
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door knocking, right, cold calling, these kind of things.
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And what we do is we allow people to have businesses that make them feel good, you know,
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doing good leads to doing well and it's, it's I cure callus tarts, I, I make it so
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that you know what, not only do you not have to toughen up your heart and, and see rejection
27:03
every day, but you're actually going to get love from others by loving on others.
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And, and it, it's not fluff, I want that to be that this is not fluff, this is not theory,
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this is strategic, it is tactical, it is purposeful, it is not done with everyone.
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You are not out practicing proactive generosity with everyone.
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You have specific people who are you, who you are proactively generous with.
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The other thing is that nobody's teaching proactive generosity, we're the only ones.
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The flip, the other side too, is too often what happens is people want to reciprocate,
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they want to help you, but they have no idea how.
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They just don't know how to help you, or they say something like, well, how can I help
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you?
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And, and what does the normal person do?
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Oh, you know, don't worry about it.
28:01
And trust me, they, they won't worry about it.
28:03
But what we teach is that when somebody wants to reciprocate, you say yes, somebody says
28:09
how can I help you, you say referrals, somebody says what can I do for you?
28:13
You say referrals, because that's the truth.
28:16
So give people a way and a reason to, to help you.
28:19
But the thing is, what if you had, you know, a hundred people a month who were asking you,
28:26
how can I help you?
28:27
Would you like that?
28:28
Yeah.
28:29
Who wouldn't?
28:30
Yeah.
28:31
Yeah.
28:32
So the way to do that is to ask a hundred people a month how you can help them.
28:37
It's that simple.
28:38
So, so, all right.
28:39
Let's pause.
28:40
So, so, so a real world application of that is what makes them, make call your past
28:44
database.
28:45
Send the thank you cards.
28:46
I know you talk a lot about that.
28:47
What are some more, you know, ways to get that flow happening?
28:51
Yeah.
28:52
So, tons of ways, right?
28:53
So, so the handwritten notes are a great follow up tool.
28:56
And the handwritten notes are great for continuing the conversation.
29:00
And honestly, it, it should be a part of every professional's repertoire, right?
29:05
A handwritten note is, is it, it should be standard practice for everybody.
29:10
It just, it just should, just part of the habits.
29:13
And it's good for, like you meet with someone, a handwritten note can actually create another
29:20
reason for another call or another appointment.
29:23
And it, and it continues the, the conversation and building of the relationship.
29:29
You know, where you're going to get the most bang for your buck is, hey, listen, observing
29:34
on Facebook, observing what happens in people's lives, and then dropping a handwritten note
29:40
that's out of the blue.
29:41
I'll give you an example just from Monday of this week is, I had a client who I found out
29:47
who got a new dog.
29:49
They got a Jack Russell Terrier.
29:50
Well, interestingly enough, well, I don't know if you're familiar with Jack Russell Terriers,
29:54
but they should be called Jack Russell Terriers because they are a terror, especially when
30:00
they're younger.
30:01
And I will tell you that in the wrong hands, a Jack Russell can tear up a house, tear
30:06
up a family and tear up a kid.
30:08
So I went to Amazon and there are a lot of books on the history and the training and the
30:14
care of Jack Russell Terriers.
30:17
And so I got a couple of those books and I sent it to them.
30:21
Now I, you know, they'll be delivered today or tomorrow, so I don't know what the reaction
30:26
on that was, but it cost me like, I think it was a total of $9.99, less than 10 bucks.
30:34
And boom, out of the blue, I sent them a couple of books on a specific thing that had just
30:40
happened in their life.
30:43
You know, and it doesn't always take money or that kind of thing.
30:47
It's thought plus action that is the formula for success, have the thought, right?
30:53
And sometimes you're going to need your computer to trigger the thought.
30:58
Like one of the things that we do for all of our clients and all of our clients are doing
31:02
for their clients is the day before the birthday call, right?
31:07
And the day before the birthday call is, I mean, people have talked about maybe doing
31:12
a birthday call or, but in today's world, how are most people communicating on birthdays?
31:18
They're posting on Facebook, right?
31:20
They're saying happy birthday and in today's world, nobody reads them all.
31:24
I mean, none of them mean anything, right?
31:26
That's so funny about quantity over quality is, or quality over quantity is, when there's
31:31
a quantity, there's no quality, there's no meaning, right?
31:34
So how do we, how do we become the quality answer in a world of quantity?
31:39
And the way we do that is different to ourselves in little ways that are better.
31:43
And that's the formula, so the formula is the day before the birthday call.
31:47
So Jeff, when's your birthday?
31:49
May 31st.
31:50
So May 30th, I get a reminder on my CRM, right?
31:56
It pops up and says, Jeff's birthday is tomorrow, give him a call.
32:00
So I call you and I say, hey, Jeff, I just, listen, I know you're birthdays tomorrow and
32:06
I am full of appointments tomorrow.
32:08
I'm literally booked solid all day long, but I could not let my day tomorrow come and go
32:15
without calling and wishing you the happiest birthday ever.
32:19
I hope you have an awesome day tomorrow.
32:21
I hope it continues through the weekend and I hope this is your best year yet.
32:25
Have a great one.
32:26
I just wanted to call and say happy birthday.
32:28
Click.
32:30
Wow, yeah, that stands out.
32:32
So what, so why?
32:34
By the way, how much did that cost me?
32:36
About 30 seconds of your time.
32:38
Yeah, yeah, okay, so that's a good thing now and it cost me no money.
32:42
Right, right.
32:44
So what's the benefit?
32:45
What is the power of that?
32:46
Well, I can tell you just, you know, even walking through that, you know, kind of scenario.
32:49
I mean, the benefit is you completely isolate yourself as being totally unique and different
32:54
and the fact that you cared enough to call in advance, make time out of your busy schedule.
33:00
You obviously put it in the context that, you know, unfortunately won't be able to call
33:03
tomorrow on your actual birthday, but it just says that you were thinking about me and
33:08
that's authentic.
33:09
Mm-hmm.
33:10
Yeah.
33:11
And so here's the other thing, you know, there's two places to be if you want to be memorable.
33:17
You can either be first or you can be last.
33:19
If you're in the middle, you're not going to be memorable.
33:21
Well, with a birthday, you don't want to be last, so you want to be first.
33:25
Here's the other thing that's cool.
33:28
Facebook explodes on your birthday, May 31st.
33:32
Here's what's cool is your first thought in the back of your head is, oh, that's nice,
33:38
but they didn't call Michael, Michael called.
33:42
Right.
33:43
So with every 200 posts on Facebook, you get a little positive zing.
33:51
Yes.
33:52
Yes.
33:53
No, that's power.
33:54
I love it.
33:55
I love it because it's a very, very simple, you know, the old Jim Roan thing, right?
33:57
It's simple to do, it's simple not to do.
33:59
Yeah, that's all my things are simple, right, because I'm a really simple person.
34:03
I am like the champion for average or below average people.
34:07
I am.
34:08
I mean, because people can look at me and they're like, dang, that guy does not look like
34:12
an exact Jeff Zimper and I don't thank God, right?
34:15
I mean, you're a sharp looking guy and me, I'm like a little overweight, a little short,
34:22
you know, a little less intelligent, a little, I mean, I'm like the average guy.
34:27
And all my stuff is super simple that when you add it all together, see, I don't, I
34:32
get over 500 referrals a year and I would say that we're the most referred coaching and
34:37
training company in the nation.
34:39
I would say that with and I would include Canada in that and and now here's the thing.
34:46
Are we the biggest?
34:47
No, we're not.
34:48
Right?
34:49
We're not.
34:50
But I would say we're the most referred because the way is other, what's funny is, is
34:54
if you want to work with a coach, wouldn't you want to coach with the most referred coach?
35:01
And that's who we are.
35:02
Right?
35:03
I mean, we don't do any advertising.
35:05
You know, other companies are using internet marketing to add, what's funny is the referral
35:11
people are using internet marketing to grow their business, isn't that interesting?
35:16
Now it's not that we don't use internet marketing, but the biggest majority of our coaching
35:22
clients are referred to us from our current coaching clients.
35:26
And I would say we might be the only coaching company in the nation where we have more
35:30
current clients than we have former clients.
35:34
And that's something I take a lot of pride in.
35:37
We have longevity.
35:38
People coaching with us for four years, for five years, for three years, a lot of two years.
35:44
And you know, we keep them.
35:45
Why do we keep them?
35:47
We're always going above and beyond.
35:49
So you know, it's one, here's another, you know, one another nugget, right?
35:53
We're like, you know, what's the tactical?
35:55
So we do the day before the birthday call and I will tell you, I just got a message yesterday
36:00
from a top producer out in New Jersey.
36:02
He did it.
36:03
He got an immediate call back and ended up, it turns out that his sister, the sister of
36:08
the person who called him, is going to be looking for a move.
36:12
They're going through a divorce, unfortunately.
36:14
But the sister is going to be looking for a house.
36:17
This is the mortgage professional who got the referral.
36:21
So and then the other one is if you're not doing anniversary calls, then you're missing
36:28
out.
36:29
You've got to do an anniversary call to the buyer who closed, but not just the buyer
36:35
who closed.
36:36
You should call either the day before or the day of and call the agent who was either
36:44
listing it or the buyer side, whatever makes the most sense for you and say, listen,
36:50
I don't know if you know it, but Cindy, this is Cindy's two year anniversary for her
36:57
house.
36:58
We first of all want to call and say happy anniversary to you for working on that.
37:03
I know we work a lot together nowadays, but at that time, we were still developing our
37:08
relationship.
37:09
So happy anniversary on that.
37:10
But here's the other thing.
37:11
You may want to call Cindy.
37:12
At two years, she could now sell the home and retain all the equity.
37:20
So we're not only calling the the borrower or the buyer.
37:25
And here's what's so funny is that there's still refinances happening.
37:29
I mean, there's people that, yeah, I mean, I could tell you story after story of people
37:34
who are moving up and keeping the same payment.
37:38
Well, you know, so that one thing does so many things with that one phone call.
37:43
And I love the fact that you're saying call the agent as well because we all know, right,
37:48
there's that percentage of agents that aren't making those calls to their past database,
37:51
which is why or none.
37:52
Yeah, right.
37:53
We don't need to get into the stats on that.
37:56
But what's really cool about that is this addresses them.
37:58
Sure, you hear this common issue or complaint from loan officers, which is, you know, how
38:04
do I get more referrals to my realtors?
38:06
Well, you just gave a great example right there.
38:08
If you went to your past database and just called them all on their home buying anniversary
38:12
the day before, versus sending out your standard templated newsletter, right?
38:18
Yeah, definitely right.
38:20
No, 100% right.
38:21
Your newsletter's not getting read anyway, quit sending it.
38:25
I mean, that's the truth.
38:26
It's not the truth.
38:28
I mean, so it's, I mean, seriously, realtors, same with you guys, quit sending your market
38:33
updates, nobody cares.
38:35
It, it, they don't.
38:36
I mean, why do we send a market it?
38:38
It's the only thing we know to send.
38:40
And it's what the market has said and the industry has said to send nobody cares.
38:45
How about those recipes, though?
38:47
Oh, you know what, you know what, send it along with the seeds.
38:50
And I'll grow my own recipes, right?
38:53
It's like what the end of magnets, you know, it, it's a, I'll tell you, we're in a
38:59
funny industry that we will buy whatever shiny squirrel comes up next.
39:03
And, you know, QR codes were made famous for how bad of a flop they were in real estate.
39:08
I mean, it's, it's, it's just one of those where, you know, I, I wish the talking
39:13
house would come back.
39:16
It's, it's, it's one of those where it's like, we try, here's what's really sad is we
39:21
have coaching clients who explode, like literally go from getting four
39:26
referrals a year to getting a hundred referrals a year.
39:30
And they make all this money and then they go and buy a website.
39:35
And it's like, what are you doing?
39:38
Well, I've got all this money.
39:39
I need to expect, no, just keep it.
39:41
Pay the government.
39:42
It's all good.
39:43
And then it's like, here's the other thing.
39:46
Why not reinvest in your sphere in your repeat referral and sphere?
39:52
That's who got you here, but that's what we do.
39:55
We take all that is an industry.
39:56
We're so screwed up.
39:57
We take the money we make from our referral sources and from our
40:01
repeat clients and from our sphere.
40:03
And we reinvest it in shiny, blanky lights and things that never get us any
40:09
business.
40:09
I mean, as much attention that's been paid on internet, website marketing and
40:14
internet leads and Zillow leads and all the things, all the attention
40:19
internet leads actually went down last year.
40:23
You know, I'm wondering if the attraction there, Michael, is because people
40:26
are trying to outsource the manual labor.
40:29
Yeah.
40:30
Yeah, because what you're talking about, you know, does require, you know, that
40:34
quote manual labor.
40:36
Now, if you, if you call making some phone calls manual labor, right, to pass
40:39
clients, well, then maybe we need to work on perception.
40:42
But I, I think that's why people tend to go to that bright shiny object
40:45
stuff because they're like, man, if I could just automate this and like get
40:48
all these, you know, I could go to the beach more.
40:51
Yeah.
40:52
Well, here's the thing is you can make calls from the beach.
40:55
That's true.
40:56
So that's, that's a, and there's a happy medium.
40:59
There's a, you know, doing nothing and making a lot of money will not work.
41:04
Right.
41:05
But the problem is that's what we see, right?
41:08
When people are, are a true success, quote unquote, we see them when they've
41:14
got all the leverage in place.
41:16
But what we didn't see is them working their butt off for years, right?
41:21
So there's no such thing as an overnight success.
41:24
And the whole thought of doing nothing and making a lot of money is a myth.
41:30
But here's the thing.
41:32
You can do a few little things and make a lot of money.
41:36
So, so the key is doing the little things that make you a lot of money.
41:41
One of those is phone calls.
41:42
One of those is events.
41:44
If you're not doing events for your business, you're missing out.
41:48
Oprah made her money by being generous with events, with audiences.
41:54
That's it.
41:55
She took an opportunity, which is an event.
41:58
She had an event, which is a show.
42:00
And she was generous to the people in that show.
42:04
And she's now, if not the richest woman on earth, one of them.
42:08
Yeah.
42:09
And it was based on generosity plus an event, which was her show.
42:14
So take an event, add generosity and you'll explode.
42:19
It's the, and I will tell you that that's the secret sauce to what we teach is
42:24
we teach people how to get hundreds of referrals through client appreciation parties
42:29
and events small and large throughout the year.
42:33
And we have all of our coaching clients put together an event schedule that turns
42:38
out hundreds of referrals a year when they were getting maybe 20 or less in years before.
42:46
Awesome.
42:46
So if you're more professional, you should be partnering and getting an event strategy.
42:51
You should have the ability, bring in a certified meaning planner or bring in someone
42:56
who is a party planner or loves to be a plan parties as part of your differentiation strategy
43:04
to approaching realtors.
43:06
And then when you meet realtors, say, why don't you have a client appreciation party?
43:09
We'll do all the planning.
43:11
We'll set it up.
43:12
We'll, we'll, you know, we'll do everything all you have to do is show up.
43:17
And, and that is a differentiator.
43:20
Yeah.
43:21
You know, it's, it's, I mean, housewarming parties.
43:24
Same thing.
43:24
There's so many leveraged, leveraged activities like that.
43:27
As you know, I'm a big believer in events and you talk about doing little things to make
43:31
a lot of money makes me think of Jim Rohn again, right?
43:34
Little hinges swing big doors.
43:36
That's right.
43:37
Yeah.
43:37
And so that's what I love about your actions is that it doesn't require a huge investment
43:42
of, of money.
43:43
It just requires a little bit of your time and to be smart with it.
43:46
So I think that's awesome.
43:47
Man, great stuff today.
43:49
I know you've got to run.
43:50
So I don't want to keep you too late.
43:51
We could keep talking like for hours, 20, 2016, the year of the sphere real quickly.
43:57
What do you want to close out with?
43:58
Where do you want to direct people who want to learn more about you?
44:01
Hmm.
44:02
Well, thank you for that.
44:03
You can always check Facebook.com slash referral guru.
44:07
Referral guru is the, is the slash.
44:10
But I wish somebody else chose that for me many years ago.
44:14
And, and unfortunately, you can't change it once you get over, you know, 50,000 fans or whatever.
44:21
So Facebook.com slash referral guru is a great start.
44:25
Check, check out referco.com.
44:27
You know, one of the things that we're launching this year and the year of the
44:31
sphere is, is, is a model that I truly believe is going to revolutionary, revolutionize
44:39
how people do repeat and referral.
44:43
So, so that's coming out this year.
44:45
And I'm very excited about that.
44:47
You know, we've also got 30 mornings.com, three zero mornings.
44:52
M-O-R-N-I-N-G-S.com, where we're helping people create their ultimate morning
44:58
ritual and give themselves an hour head start on every day.
45:02
So instead of during the day, feeling behind or feeling overwhelmed, they feel
45:07
ahead and they are ahead and they feel under control.
45:11
And so 30 mornings.com has been a raging success, thousands of people already
45:18
signing up to be a part of that and would love to, would love to welcome.
45:24
And one last thing, Jeff, is we need mortgage professionals in our referral
45:29
database. We have a free referral date.
45:32
It's free, yep.
45:33
And I know a lot of people charge to be part of their, their referral database.
45:37
But we have so many referrals going between members that we need mortgage
45:42
professionals from the United States and Canada.
45:46
And they can sign up for that for free at free referral database.com.
45:53
And tell them to make sure to put in there that the cities that they serve
46:00
because that is, I mean, we have a frustration point is that we have people
46:05
who want to, I just got a referral for Camden, New Jersey.
46:08
They want to, they want to get a mortgage.
46:11
They want to buy a home for their college aged kid who's going to school in
46:17
Camden. And we, you know, we don't have a lender in the area.
46:23
And this, this happens every day.
46:24
So my team has a frustration with placing mortgage referrals.
46:28
And for refires, we have people who, you know, want to
46:32
refi and they come to us because they trust us.
46:36
So free referral database.com.
46:38
They can sign up there.
46:39
They get into our database.
46:40
I trust them because, you know, they're with you.
46:44
So if they're, if they're interested in the mortgage market, uh, institute,
46:48
then guess what?
46:49
They're, they're, they're our kind of people.
46:51
You're our kind of people.
46:52
Oh, thank you.
46:53
I'll make sure I put all those links in the show notes so people can look to
46:56
that. So you'll find that in there easy to get connected with Michael.
46:59
Sounds like a great opportunity to, uh, get exposure to what you're doing over
47:03
there, which I know is making a big difference.
47:05
So thank you for your time.
47:06
I know you're incredibly busy.
47:08
Keep doing what you're doing, man.
47:09
You're, you're, you are a lighthouse in the industry.
47:12
So thank you.
47:14
Well, and Jeff, thank you too.
47:15
You, you are as well.
47:16
You let your light shine.
47:18
You stand strong and tall.
47:19
Uh, you help people and guide them.
47:21
And there are some people, uh, who don't necessarily need your, or I help,
47:26
but they're submarines, right?
47:27
They're the low of the low.
47:28
So we're not worried about them anyway.
47:30
It's the ones that need our help that we'll shine our light and help, uh, to no
47:34
bound.
47:35
And, uh, you know, here's the thing is, is I really appreciate what you do, Jeff,
47:40
and, and the value that you provide every single day to this industry and,
47:43
and you're making it better.
47:44
So thank you.
47:46
Well, thank you.
47:46
I think both of us were cut from the same cloth.
47:48
We're just trying to make a difference and do it authentically, you know?
47:52
So thank you for listening today.
47:54
Once again, the mortgage marketing radio and, uh, is your host, Jeff Zimphur.
47:58
We will see you on the next show.
48:01
Bye for now.
48:11
Thanks for listening to mortgage marketing radio.
48:14
One more truth in mortgage marketing.
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Get more free training and resources at mortgagemarketinginstitute.com.
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