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The Truth About Big Tech Money From Someone Living It · She's On The Money

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud or
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: the Order Kerni Whaltbury and a waddery woman. And before
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
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  Speaker 1: would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through.
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  Speaker 1: As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: the storytelling of you to make a difference for today
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: and lasting impact for tomorrow.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Let's get into it. She's on the Money.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: She's on the Money.
• 0:57
  Speaker 4: Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
• 1:00
  Speaker 4: that let's you be pervy about other people's money habits
• 1:03
  Speaker 4: for educational purposes, of course.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome back to.
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  Speaker 4: Another one of our money daries where I get the
• 1:08
  Speaker 4: absolute pleasure of talking to one of our beautiful She's
• 1:10
  Speaker 4: on the Money community members all about their journey. This week,
• 1:14
  Speaker 4: we got a message and it sounded exactly like this,
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  Speaker 4: Dear She's on the Money. I'm thirty three and currently
• 1:21
  Speaker 4: building my dream home, something that simply wouldn't have been
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  Speaker 4: possible without my job in the tech sector. I'm not
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  Speaker 4: in a technical role, and I didn't take a traditional
• 1:30
  Speaker 4: path to get here. It took a lot of determination,
• 1:33
  Speaker 4: a few lucky breaks, and saying yes to opportunities that
• 1:36
  Speaker 4: felt a little bit out of reach at the time.
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  Speaker 4: I'm sharing this to encourage others to explore the tech
• 1:42
  Speaker 4: space even if your background doesn't seem like the perfect fit.
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  Speaker 4: There's a real opportunity in this industry and it can
• 1:48
  Speaker 4: be incredibly lucrative, but this often comes with unpredictability. Just
• 1:53
  Speaker 4: three months into my role, half my team was laid off.
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  Speaker 4: That experience taught me a lot about future planning. Money Darist.
• 2:01
  Speaker 4: When I heard that this was your story orsa in
• 2:03
  Speaker 4: our inbox, I was.
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: Like, get her on the podcast. This will be so interesting.
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  Speaker 2: So I'm excited to chat to you.
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  Speaker 4: But before we get there, as always, I have to
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: ask everybody the same question, Money Diarist. If I asked
• 2:16
  Speaker 4: you to give your money habits a grade from A
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  Speaker 4: through to F, what grade would you give them?
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  Speaker 5: I'm thinking I'll give myself a be maybe a bit plus.
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  Speaker 2: I love that.
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  Speaker 4: Now my favorite question, can you tell us a little
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  Speaker 4: bit more about your money story?
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.
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  Speaker 5: My attitude towards money, I think was very much shaped
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  Speaker 5: by my upbringing, which I didn't realize until I was
• 2:37
  Speaker 5: thinking about my story. I grew up and I guess
• 2:40
  Speaker 5: what you would call like a middle class household, but
• 2:43
  Speaker 5: money was pretty variable when I was growing up. We
• 2:46
  Speaker 5: moved around a bit. Sometimes first my parents were working,
• 2:48
  Speaker 5: sometimes just my dad, like, we always had enough, but
• 2:52
  Speaker 5: money was sometimes quite tight, especially when I was younger.
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  Speaker 5: Both my parents come from Eastern Europe, and they like
• 2:59
  Speaker 5: both grew up during Communism, and neither of them had
• 3:03
  Speaker 5: very much back in those days. Like my mum would
• 3:05
  Speaker 5: tell me stories of how she would get an orange
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  Speaker 5: for Christmas because they were so hard to find otherwise, like,
• 3:10
  Speaker 5: it's just a completely different way of life, and so
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  Speaker 5: I think for them it was really important to work
• 3:16
  Speaker 5: hard and create something for themselves. I kind of put
• 3:19
  Speaker 5: a stake in the ground. So when I was younger,
• 3:22
  Speaker 5: they pulled all their resources into building a house for us,
• 3:26
  Speaker 5: and it was pretty stressful at the time because I
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  Speaker 5: think their ambitions were a little bit bigger than their means.
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  Speaker 5: I think we didn't really have enough money to fully
• 3:36
  Speaker 5: complete the house, and I saw it caused them a
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  Speaker 5: lot of anxiety, a lot of stress. Like I remember
• 3:41
  Speaker 5: as a kid, I would try to not ask them
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  Speaker 5: for things because I knew that it would just contribute
• 3:45
  Speaker 5: to that stress more and more. And so yeah, once
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  Speaker 5: the house was done enough, we moved in, but it
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  Speaker 5: was half finished for many years, so it was kind
• 3:52
  Speaker 5: of like living half construction site half in an actual house.
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  Speaker 5: And then yeah, later things improved. We were a little
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  Speaker 5: bit more comfortable as I got older and went to
• 4:00
  Speaker 5: high school, but we never really talked about money. My
• 4:03
  Speaker 5: dad mentioned having some investments, we never really discussed it,
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  Speaker 5: but I think from a really early age, my parents
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  Speaker 5: really instilled this idea of financial stability is super important,
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  Speaker 5: and they didn't want me and my sister to go
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  Speaker 5: through the challenges that they went through. And so looking back,
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  Speaker 5: I think my attitude towards money is very much based
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  Speaker 5: on this idea that not having enough money can cause
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  Speaker 5: a lot of stress, a lot of anxiety, and that money, yeah,
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  Speaker 5: plays I guess, an important role in building stability, in
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  Speaker 5: giving you control, giving you freedom, and so yeah, seeing
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  Speaker 5: them struggle early on, I kind of realized that I
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  Speaker 5: don't want to feel that way, and so that's I
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  Speaker 5: guess influenced some of my trajectory, and as I've entered
• 4:52
  Speaker 5: my working life, I've really kind of kept that in
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  Speaker 5: the back of my mind, which has ended up with
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  Speaker 5: me working in tech. I always pretty interested in people
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  Speaker 5: and technology, and I've kind of managed to carve myself
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  Speaker 5: a path that combines both of those things. But yeah,
• 5:08
  Speaker 5: I'm not gonna lie like a big drop. Working in
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  Speaker 5: tech early on in my life was its ability to
• 5:13
  Speaker 5: kind of set me up for the future.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, totally.
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  Speaker 4: And I feel like we all hear it right, like
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: you can make heaps of money in tech. But like then,
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  Speaker 4: I guess the conversation up until today has really stopped,
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  Speaker 4: like you go, okay, cool, I'm not technical, or I
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: don't understand it, so I don't know what that means.
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  Speaker 4: You are thirty three, Now, what age were you when
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: you first started working, Like, was this like your first job?
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  Speaker 4: Were you like, okay, cool, I'm eighteen, fresh out of
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  Speaker 4: school and we are going to work in tech or
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: what did that journey look like.
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  Speaker 5: I think at the back of my mind, I was like,
• 5:43
  Speaker 5: I'd love to work in tech, but it was a
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  Speaker 5: bit of a pipe dream at the time. I come
• 5:46
  Speaker 5: from a social science's background, so I studied psychology, which
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  Speaker 5: I think you did as well. I did so similar,
• 5:52
  Speaker 5: similar path but different yeah, much different outcomes.
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I started.
• 5:56
  Speaker 5: My first job was actually in government, but I think
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  Speaker 5: in the back of my mind, I was always thinking,
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  Speaker 5: you know, tech is a it's an area that I'm
• 6:02
  Speaker 5: really interested in. I think it's something that I want
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  Speaker 5: to move towards. And so through these kind of little
• 6:08
  Speaker 5: I call them little half steps, I started to move
• 6:11
  Speaker 5: closer and closer to the type of role that I
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: really wanted to have. And so from my government role,
• 6:17
  Speaker 5: I was really fortunate to get a job at a
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  Speaker 5: small startup. I wrote a really kind of desperate cover letter,
• 6:23
  Speaker 5: and you know that idea that women don't apply for
• 6:26
  Speaker 5: roles that they don't meet like one hundred percent critera
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  Speaker 5: for I really really.
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  Speaker 2: Chant I love this though. I was channeling that.
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: Energy and I was amazing. Yeah, I think I met
• 6:36
  Speaker 5: maybe twenty percent of that criteria, but.
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  Speaker 2: Whatever, but you got the job. Yeah.
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  Speaker 5: I wrote a really passionate cover letter and I looked
• 6:43
  Speaker 5: back at it.
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  Speaker 2: No, we don't look back. We don't look back that
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  Speaker 2: it's so silly. It was so cringe, But you know
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  Speaker 2: what is it cringe? If it worked. Yeah, it worked.
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  Speaker 5: I think the lucky thing is I'm a real people
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  Speaker 5: person and my interview because it was a startup with
• 6:57
  Speaker 5: the CEO, his dog was in the room and his
• 7:00
  Speaker 5: dog loved me, and I think he took it as
• 7:02
  Speaker 5: a side dogs.
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  Speaker 2: No though, dogs no good people. Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: I bring my dog to every single recording I do,
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: and she and I are on the same page. If
• 7:09
  Speaker 4: she doesn't like somebody, she lets me know by giving
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: them absolutely no attention, which is very strange from her.
• 7:16
  Speaker 2: But when you know, you know, dogs no. Yeah, So
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  Speaker 2: that was my lucky break.
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  Speaker 5: I was twenty four at the time, so that was
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  Speaker 5: my first kind of forea in the tech world. And
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  Speaker 5: then since then, Yeah, it's been a series of I guess,
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  Speaker 5: deliberate next steps that I've taken, going from startup to
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  Speaker 5: slightly large a tech company to or I find myself now,
• 7:37
  Speaker 5: which is kind of super big tech company I suppose.
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  Speaker 5: So that's how I ended up here.
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  Speaker 4: So talk to me about what that actually means. So
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  Speaker 4: what is your job title, like, what do you do
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  Speaker 4: for work? And how much money do you earn?
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  Speaker 5: So I'm a user experience researcher and for my salary
• 7:54
  Speaker 5: So compensation and Big Tech is often kind of referred
• 7:57
  Speaker 5: to as total comp total compensation, which includes salary, it
• 8:02
  Speaker 5: includes shares, bonuses. So there's a few different components that
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  Speaker 5: make up my total income. My base salary is two
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  Speaker 5: hundred thousand.
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  Speaker 2: Oh, very nice.
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  Speaker 5: It is very nice, yet very very fortunate to have that,
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  Speaker 5: and that includes super so that's all included in there.
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  Speaker 5: And then a significant portion of my compensation.
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  Speaker 2: Is in shares.
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  Speaker 5: Okay, Yeah, it's this number fluctuates a lot, especially in
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  Speaker 5: recent times, and yeah, it can go up and down
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  Speaker 5: really significantly throughout the year, but annually it works out
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  Speaker 5: to be anywhere between two hundred to four hundred thousand
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  Speaker 5: before tax.
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  Speaker 2: It's a lot. Yeah, So how does tax on that work?
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  Speaker 4: So you're based in New Zealand, so this is going
• 8:48
  Speaker 4: to be slightly different when answering it. But if you're
• 8:52
  Speaker 4: being issued like between two hundred and four hundred thousand
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  Speaker 4: dollars worth of shares, are you having to pay tax
• 8:58
  Speaker 4: on that asset acquisition? And what does that mean for
• 9:00
  Speaker 4: like your cash flow? Because to me, I'm like, oh,
• 9:03
  Speaker 4: like everybody's probably thinking, oh that's great, and I'm like,
• 9:05
  Speaker 4: hold on, hold on, You're giving me this, and I'm
• 9:07
  Speaker 4: incurring a massive tax bill, Like what's the deal?
• 9:09
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, it looks like you know, all that money
• 9:11
  Speaker 5: is like wow, such like as a huge amount of
• 9:14
  Speaker 5: money regardless of the tax, but you do pay income
• 9:16
  Speaker 5: tax on it, and you are responsible for paying that yourself,
• 9:19
  Speaker 5: so I have to pay that annually. I basically end
• 9:23
  Speaker 5: up with a massive tax bill, and my tax bill
• 9:25
  Speaker 5: is so large that I end up having to pay
• 9:27
  Speaker 5: an installments throughout the year. So for example, last year,
• 9:31
  Speaker 5: every four months, I was stung with a forty thousand
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: dollars tax bill.
• 9:35
  Speaker 2: That I am to pay.
• 9:36
  Speaker 4: But also in the long run, like we're not complaining.
• 9:39
  Speaker 4: This is just like part of the cash flow problem,
• 9:41
  Speaker 4: right Like more money, more problems. But the more cash
• 9:45
  Speaker 4: flow you have, obviously, I'm assuming that would mean the
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: more shares would be being issued to you. So even
• 9:50
  Speaker 4: if you quote earned more, I'm assuming this whole total
• 9:54
  Speaker 4: compensation package would increase. So you're always going to have
• 9:58
  Speaker 4: this problem. But I'll pay tax to get a massive asset.
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: But it has to be a value to you, right
• 10:03
  Speaker 4: Like if you didn't value shares or anything like, you'd
• 10:06
  Speaker 4: be like absolutely not.
• 10:08
  Speaker 5: It's a bit it stings a lot the first time
• 10:10
  Speaker 5: you do it, and you almost have to check yourself
• 10:11
  Speaker 5: sometimes because you go, this is so unfair, and then
• 10:14
  Speaker 5: I realize that.
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: This is absolutely fair.
• 10:18
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you're like, oh, okay, Like the entire reason I'm
• 10:20
  Speaker 4: getting these shares is because the company doesn't have the
• 10:23
  Speaker 4: cash flow to pay me half a million dollars a year,
• 10:26
  Speaker 4: and so they're giving me assets and that's going to
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: make me wealthy because I'm assuming you work for a
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: business that you really believe in, so you're assuming that
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: these shares are going to increase in value, right, one
• 10:34
  Speaker 4: hundred percent?
• 10:35
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And you know it's funny you say that, Like
• 10:37
  Speaker 5: sometimes I talk to my workmates because no one else
• 10:40
  Speaker 5: can really relate to this problem totally. I can't talk
• 10:42
  Speaker 5: to my friends about it because they'll just go, you know,
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: what are you talking about?
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: Like it's unrelatable.
• 10:47
  Speaker 4: And also like, oh, no, big worldwide problem like oh money,
• 10:52
  Speaker 4: dist has to pay tax because her workplace remunerated her,
• 10:56
  Speaker 4: so well, like I get it.
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah, Yeah, it's not the best thing to talk about,
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: but it is a real biggest challenge and something you
• 11:02
  Speaker 5: need to stay across.
• 11:03
  Speaker 4: It's also a cash flow issue, like you have like
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: at the end of the day, as much as like,
• 11:08
  Speaker 4: you know, I think people listen to money diaries because
• 11:10
  Speaker 4: like we so pervy about other people's situations. We're not
• 11:13
  Speaker 4: expecting that every single person is super relatable. Like, but
• 11:17
  Speaker 4: the idea that you're like, hey, I'm going to tell
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: you about this situation.
• 11:20
  Speaker 2: How cool.
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: We now know that there are some businesses that do
• 11:23
  Speaker 4: total compensation and salary packages and shares, and that's what
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: this means.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: If people are.
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: Being issued shares, they're now responsible for their own tax.
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: And that means that that two hundred thousand dollars salary
• 11:35
  Speaker 4: package you're getting, you're probably actually earning closer to one
• 11:39
  Speaker 4: hundred thousand dollars when it comes down to it, because
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: you're having to allocate so much of that post tax
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: income to paying tax on this asset that you're building.
• 11:46
  Speaker 5: Am I correct, absolutely, yeah, And your tax goes up
• 11:49
  Speaker 5: as well, so you end up hitting much higher tax brackets.
• 11:51
  Speaker 5: You end up paying more tax. I have come up
• 11:54
  Speaker 5: with a bit of a system to help me manage that.
• 11:56
  Speaker 5: So with shares that you get access to them in
• 11:59
  Speaker 5: my company three months, so they vest every three months,
• 12:02
  Speaker 5: and I sell. I usually always sell my shares just
• 12:04
  Speaker 5: to kind of not have all my eggs in one basket.
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: But what I do is I sell sell off my
• 12:10
  Speaker 5: shares and then I allocate a portion to that to tax,
• 12:12
  Speaker 5: and I put it in a high interest savings account
• 12:16
  Speaker 5: until I have to pay it. So I'm kind of
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: trying to make the most of that money before I
• 12:21
  Speaker 5: actually have to pay that tax. So there's a bit
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: of technicality in there, but yeah, it works.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 12:26
  Speaker 4: Absolutely. When you say you sell off shares, are you
• 12:29
  Speaker 4: selling off shares like immediately when you get them, or
• 12:32
  Speaker 4: are you selling them off like after a couple of years.
• 12:35
  Speaker 4: Like I'm only asking because in Australia, if you have
• 12:38
  Speaker 4: a share for less than twelve months, you're hit with
• 12:40
  Speaker 4: like much higher capital gains tax and like much higher
• 12:43
  Speaker 4: tax rates than if you hold them for more than
• 12:45
  Speaker 4: twelve months. Is that something that you experience?
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: So in New Zealand, we don't have a capital gains tax,
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: so it's been less unrelatable.
• 12:52
  Speaker 4: It must be nice, it is, ok, yes, every day.
• 12:56
  Speaker 4: We can stop talking about this now because I might
• 12:58
  Speaker 4: get jellous my.
• 13:00
  Speaker 5: Workmates who are based in Australia yet they have to
• 13:03
  Speaker 5: do that, and I guess the strategy there it really works.
• 13:06
  Speaker 4: That's so rude that you get out of it and
• 13:08
  Speaker 4: then you're like, haha, have fun over there, have fun
• 13:12
  Speaker 4: on the other side of the ditch where tax suck.
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: I mean, Australia's got a lot of good things going
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: for it as well.
• 13:18
  Speaker 4: So no, no, I like, how like it sounds lame,
• 13:21
  Speaker 4: But I do really like our tax system. I think
• 13:23
  Speaker 4: it is incredibly Like there are definitely always places that
• 13:26
  Speaker 4: we could fix and do different things, but I think
• 13:29
  Speaker 4: we have a very fair tax system for the economy
• 13:32
  Speaker 4: that we've built.
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, the tax is interesting, but you know, at
• 13:35
  Speaker 5: the end of the day, I love knowing that that
• 13:37
  Speaker 5: money is being allocated to you know, the courses that
• 13:39
  Speaker 5: need it. And yeah, it's not money that I would
• 13:43
  Speaker 5: rather keep. It makes sense to have to pay it.
• 13:45
  Speaker 5: I should also add as part of my total compensation,
• 13:48
  Speaker 5: there's salary shares. There's also a bonus that I get,
• 13:53
  Speaker 5: so on top of everything else, there is a twenty
• 13:56
  Speaker 5: percent I guess, performance based bonus that I get and
• 13:59
  Speaker 5: obviously that can vary as well, so annually that's yeah,
• 14:03
  Speaker 5: depending on how well I do in my role, it
• 14:05
  Speaker 5: can be up to twenty percent of my salary. So
• 14:08
  Speaker 5: I guess in total, I mean it's a significant amount
• 14:10
  Speaker 5: of cash, but it can be anywhere between like four
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: hundred and eighty to six fifty annually a.
• 14:18
  Speaker 2: Year as a cash bonus. Uh no, that's total. That's total.
• 14:21
  Speaker 5: So the cash bonus is twenty percent of the annual salary.
• 14:24
  Speaker 4: Oh my goodness, that is a lot of money to
• 14:27
  Speaker 4: be dealing with. Talk to me about, like, this is
• 14:30
  Speaker 4: just exciting, like getting pervy, Like you've got like when
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: you give women money, you give them power, and if
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: they've got power, they can create really cool things. So
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: talk to me about your big money goals, Like what
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: are you currently working towards.
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm kind of in my like while the sunshines
• 14:46
  Speaker 5: make hay error, yes, And so I think at the
• 14:50
  Speaker 5: back of my mind, I'm very aware of the fact that,
• 14:52
  Speaker 5: like when tick is good, tick is great, and this
• 14:54
  Speaker 5: is not going to last forever. Like I've been super
• 14:57
  Speaker 5: fortunate to have joined my company at a time time
• 15:00
  Speaker 5: where shares were low, so they have increased in value
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: quite a lot since I've been there. And I'm trying
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: to be really mindful of like making sure that I
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: do this money justice and I use it wisely, and
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: I kind of set myself up for success. And so
• 15:14
  Speaker 5: I guess we've got of come full circle with the
• 15:16
  Speaker 5: story that I described earlier on with my upbringing. But
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: my big goal at the moment is to build my
• 15:21
  Speaker 5: own house. My partner and I just bought a house
• 15:23
  Speaker 5: right before Christmas.
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: That's so exciting.
• 15:26
  Speaker 5: It's the proverbial like the worst house on the best street.
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: Good. That's what we want to see. That was the plan.
• 15:32
  Speaker 5: We're very, very handy, so we're going to spend the
• 15:34
  Speaker 5: next year doing it up. So we're not living there
• 15:36
  Speaker 5: right now, but in the next twelve months hopefully, yeah,
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: we're going to be living in it. The goal is, yeah,
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: to create our dream home, I suppose, and as we
• 15:46
  Speaker 5: do that, try to keep the mortgage on that house
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: as little as possible. And I think that goes back
• 15:52
  Speaker 5: to the fact that I'm very aware of the fact
• 15:55
  Speaker 5: that tech is pretty unstable. You know, there's a lot
• 15:58
  Speaker 5: of I guess, job and security and and I don't
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: want to end up in a position where I've over
• 16:02
  Speaker 5: committed myself to an amazing big house with a big mortgage,
• 16:06
  Speaker 5: assuming I'm going to be making lots of money forever.
• 16:09
  Speaker 5: I think, Yeah, it's important for me to make sure
• 16:11
  Speaker 5: that that mortgage is as little as possible, so I'm.
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: Not stressing out.
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: And is that would you say the biggest goal is
• 16:18
  Speaker 4: smashing down your mortgage.
• 16:19
  Speaker 5: I think in the next few years. Yes, I want
• 16:22
  Speaker 5: to kind of make the most of this high income
• 16:24
  Speaker 5: I have and try to just not be stressed about money.
• 16:27
  Speaker 5: Like I think it goes back to that anxiety of
• 16:30
  Speaker 5: if something happens, I want to not have a huge
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: burden on myself. It's unlikely that I be able to
• 16:37
  Speaker 5: find a job earning this much ever again, probably, but
• 16:41
  Speaker 5: I just want to keep it manageable.
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not something you just walk straight into.
• 16:44
  Speaker 5: Absolutely not. It's a very temporary thing. And yeah, so
• 16:48
  Speaker 5: build the house and then hopefully with time also look
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: at kind of other investments, potentially using some of the
• 16:53
  Speaker 5: equity in that house. But yeah, that's one thing at
• 16:57
  Speaker 5: a time, that's kind of a future thing for us
• 16:58
  Speaker 5: to think about.
• 16:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah, very cool. All right, let's go to a really
• 17:02
  Speaker 4: quick break because on the flip side, I want to
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: learn a little bit more about your investments. I had
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: to hold myself back earlier before, like diving in and
• 17:09
  Speaker 4: then we're going to talk about debt invest and worst
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: money habits. So guys that don't go anywhere, all right,
• 17:17
  Speaker 4: money dist we are back, and I need to talk
• 17:20
  Speaker 4: more about your investments. So each and every single year,
• 17:24
  Speaker 4: your work is giving you between two hundred to four
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: hundred thousand dollars worth of shares like that is I
• 17:31
  Speaker 4: would say, it's not unheard of, but it's not often
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: heard of, and I just think that is so exciting.
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: Talk to me about what you're currently investing in. How
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: much is your portfolio worth now? And like you mentioned
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: that you're selling off a lot of shares, what are
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: you doing with that cash? Like, what are we doing
• 17:50
  Speaker 4: to invest for our futures?
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 17:53
  Speaker 5: Absolutely, So I'll start from the top. Until recently, I
• 17:57
  Speaker 5: actually did have an investment So my first home I
• 18:02
  Speaker 5: bought an apartment right before COVID with the intent of
• 18:05
  Speaker 5: living in it. That was also what I got with
• 18:07
  Speaker 5: my now current partner, and so as COVID happened, I
• 18:10
  Speaker 5: very quickly rented that out. So my first home very
• 18:13
  Speaker 5: quickly became an investment property. And I have recently just
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: sold that actually last week, very recently, very recently, and
• 18:21
  Speaker 5: so that's going to help us pay for building our house,
• 18:25
  Speaker 5: and the significant portion of that will go towards creating
• 18:28
  Speaker 5: the dream home. So I suppose that's no longer an investment,
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: but it was an investment until recently. And in terms
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: of shares. So obviously I've got the shares from my employer.
• 18:39
  Speaker 5: And the way that works is when I first joined
• 18:42
  Speaker 5: my organization, I got a kind of set of shares
• 18:45
  Speaker 5: that they allocated to me over a four year period.
• 18:48
  Speaker 5: So every year I get access, yeah, investing over four years,
• 18:53
  Speaker 5: and so I got and got them allocated at quite
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: a good price. So the price that you get them
• 18:58
  Speaker 5: allocated at is the day you start, basically, and so
• 19:01
  Speaker 5: that's why the shares have increased in value quite a lot.
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: So it's not like they give me two hundred k's
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: worth of shares every year, but it is based on
• 19:09
  Speaker 5: that initial grant that I got, which has increased a
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: lot just because the company has been doing pretty well
• 19:15
  Speaker 5: since then.
• 19:16
  Speaker 4: How good is that? So just to not but in
• 19:20
  Speaker 4: but give a little bit of context to those listening
• 19:23
  Speaker 4: when you get allocated shares in this way, I use
• 19:26
  Speaker 4: the word vested before, and essentially vested is like a
• 19:30
  Speaker 4: I would say a legal term for promised, and it's
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: essentially saying, and I'll ask a few other questions in
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: a hot second, but it's essentially saying that when she started,
• 19:38
  Speaker 4: she was promised X amount of shares and it might
• 19:41
  Speaker 4: have been like ten shares, and then over time, this
• 19:44
  Speaker 4: is the vesting part, she will be given those shares.
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: But it doesn't just happen upfront, because otherwise there's no
• 19:50
  Speaker 4: incentive to work hard, but there will be an incentive
• 19:54
  Speaker 4: to wait until your shares are vested. So this could
• 19:57
  Speaker 4: happen over like and I'll ask you in a second
• 19:59
  Speaker 4: what yours, But it could happen over twelve months, it
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: could happen over two years, three years. Like I've seen
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: share vesting agreements that are like ten years long, where
• 20:08
  Speaker 4: every single year you get like two or three percent
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: of the shares that you're allocated, And I just think
• 20:13
  Speaker 4: it's so interesting to know more about that. But when
• 20:16
  Speaker 4: you joined, like, do you remember the number of shares
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: that were like vested to you.
• 20:20
  Speaker 5: I don't remember the number of shares specifically, but I
• 20:23
  Speaker 5: remember the amount that it was, and it was about
• 20:26
  Speaker 5: at that point, probably about six hundred thousand dollars over four.
• 20:30
  Speaker 2: Years, oh wow.
• 20:32
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and then that's obviously increased in value. Do you
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: know on average what it would be worth now, like
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: obviously you haven't gotten access to it, but like total.
• 20:40
  Speaker 5: Yeah, total. I did look recently and it was over
• 20:43
  Speaker 5: a million dollars.
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: Oh my god, how cray is that?
• 20:48
  Speaker 5: It was crazy to see that number again pre tax.
• 20:50
  Speaker 5: So there's most half a million dollars worth of tax today.
• 20:53
  Speaker 4: That's okay, it's not the point like they're not looking at.
• 20:55
  Speaker 5: That right now, but yeah, it's a I guess life
• 20:58
  Speaker 5: changing amount of money.
• 20:59
  Speaker 4: Oh, absolutely, So talk to me about this. So vesting agreements,
• 21:04
  Speaker 4: there's lots of different vesting agreements. How long is your term?
• 21:07
  Speaker 4: Like how many years is it over?
• 21:09
  Speaker 5: So mine originally was over four years, and initially it
• 21:13
  Speaker 5: was what they call a one year cliff, so I
• 21:16
  Speaker 5: didn't get any for the first year. After the first year.
• 21:19
  Speaker 5: Now I get access to I think it's like four
• 21:22
  Speaker 5: point two five percent of my shares every three months.
• 21:25
  Speaker 5: And really the incentive there is to keep me there
• 21:28
  Speaker 5: for as long as possible.
• 21:29
  Speaker 2: Absolutely it is.
• 21:30
  Speaker 4: Otherwise why would they give you that, because at the
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: end of the day, they've obviously seen you as like
• 21:34
  Speaker 4: great talent, and been like we need to lock this
• 21:37
  Speaker 4: woman in because this industry is so lucrative, like you
• 21:41
  Speaker 4: could go and get another job tomorrow and be paid
• 21:44
  Speaker 4: really well, they're assuming, but they got to lock you
• 21:46
  Speaker 4: in for a long period of time because you're doing
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: user experience right, Like you said you were a user
• 21:51
  Speaker 4: experience researcher. The longer that you're doing that, the more
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: value you are to their company, Like you're just really
• 21:59
  Speaker 4: understanding clientele, right.
• 22:01
  Speaker 5: Absolutely, yeah, and I think, yeah, it's great to be
• 22:03
  Speaker 5: in a company that recognizes that. Of course, you know,
• 22:06
  Speaker 5: it is a big driver for keeping people there as well.
• 22:09
  Speaker 5: And I think there's this notion and tech of like
• 22:11
  Speaker 5: golden handcuffs where even if you want to leave a job.
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: You're stuck because your shares haven't vested, or like there's
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: too big of a carrot dangling, right yeah, and.
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: All the flip side as well. You know, if you
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: get laid off, which does happen.
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: You just lose everything, you use everything.
• 22:26
  Speaker 5: So you look at that million dollars and suddenly it's gone,
• 22:28
  Speaker 5: and it can be hard to plan around that. And
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: so going back to investments, I kind of treat those
• 22:36
  Speaker 5: shares a little bit like I kind of call them
• 22:38
  Speaker 5: monopoly money, because.
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: Yeah, until it's in your cold, hard hands, like I
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: just yeah, like you don't also want the heartbreak of
• 22:45
  Speaker 4: like what if something happens and you are like making
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: life plans based on those shares vesting and then they don't.
• 22:50
  Speaker 4: So if you leave, do you get to keep the
• 22:53
  Speaker 4: shares that you've already had vested to you and you
• 22:56
  Speaker 4: lose the rest?
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: Like?
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: How does that work?
• 22:58
  Speaker 5: Yeah? So everything that you've grunted up until that point
• 23:01
  Speaker 5: is yours, and then anything that you haven't received yet
• 23:05
  Speaker 5: is just disappears.
• 23:06
  Speaker 4: My goodness, and I'm being so pervy. How long have
• 23:09
  Speaker 4: you worked it this role?
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: I've been there for almost two and a half years.
• 23:13
  Speaker 4: So what happens at four years when all of your
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: shares have vested? Are they going to like vest you
• 23:17
  Speaker 4: more shares to stay longer or like what happens?
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: Then? Yeah?
• 23:21
  Speaker 5: So every and obviously they want to keep you there
• 23:23
  Speaker 5: for a bit longer than four years, So they give
• 23:26
  Speaker 5: you an allocation every year when we do performance reviews,
• 23:30
  Speaker 5: So apart from just a bonus, they give you kind
• 23:32
  Speaker 5: of a little carrot of additional shares, and those shares
• 23:36
  Speaker 5: also get allocated on a four year basis, so you
• 23:38
  Speaker 5: end up in a situation where you always have new
• 23:41
  Speaker 5: shares coming up and that kind of carrot dangling there
• 23:43
  Speaker 5: for you to keep going.
• 23:44
  Speaker 4: Yeah, which is smart from them, But also and I mean,
• 23:48
  Speaker 4: you're making a lot of money and that's fantastic, and
• 23:51
  Speaker 4: you clearly enjoy your job. But what if one day
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: you woke up and you weren't enjoying your job, Like,
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: what would be your situation?
• 23:57
  Speaker 5: Then I think that would be a really hard to
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: look at my current circumstances. And I guess knowing when
• 24:05
  Speaker 5: enough is enough, because I think that is something that
• 24:08
  Speaker 5: is in the back of my mind. Working in a
• 24:11
  Speaker 5: big tech company, it is quite demanding, and it is competitive,
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: and we do have quite a lot of pressure on
• 24:17
  Speaker 5: us to perform, and I think that there could very
• 24:20
  Speaker 5: easily be a point at which I realized that this
• 24:22
  Speaker 5: is no longer serving me. I'm not enjoying it, and
• 24:26
  Speaker 5: when I decide to leave, I will be leaving some
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: money on the table, regardless of when I decide to
• 24:31
  Speaker 5: do that.
• 24:31
  Speaker 4: You have to because like otherwise, like you're not performing
• 24:35
  Speaker 4: and then you're not getting shares vested to you at
• 24:37
  Speaker 4: your performance review at which point I'm assuming they would lay.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: You off, so you're going to lose something.
• 24:43
  Speaker 5: So for me, it's yeah, getting to a point where
• 24:45
  Speaker 5: hopefully I have my you know, my house by then
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: that I enjoy living in and I can take the
• 24:50
  Speaker 5: foot off the gas a little bit and decide to
• 24:52
  Speaker 5: do something else. And yeah, have I guess enough of
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: an emergency fund or enough money to time you over
• 24:59
  Speaker 5: to the out what's next for me? But yeah, I
• 25:02
  Speaker 5: think having a bit of that plan and really thinking
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: about what that future without this job could look like
• 25:07
  Speaker 5: is something that I think about quite a lot because
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: it's not guaranteed. And also, yeah, I will have to
• 25:12
  Speaker 5: live it one day and you know what happens then,
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: Like I don't want to get used to it.
• 25:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah, fair, but it sounds like you're trying to make
• 25:18
  Speaker 4: hay while the sun is shining. You mentioned that when
• 25:21
  Speaker 4: you get your shares you often just sell them off,
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: which is so nice because you don't have any capital
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: gains tax. But on the flip side, I need to
• 25:29
  Speaker 4: know what are you doing with that money? Is that
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: just going into your house deposit savings? Is that going
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: into another like share portfolio? Like what's the plan?
• 25:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 25:38
  Speaker 5: So it has changed a little bit recently. So I
• 25:42
  Speaker 5: paid off the mortgage on my first home and that
• 25:45
  Speaker 5: was my main goal.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: That's crazy, that's so cool. That is so cool. It
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: was amazing. Yeah, it was like, oh yeah, I just
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: paid off my first mogg. Just see down. That is
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: so cool.
• 25:54
  Speaker 5: It was a baby mortgage, it was a one bedroom place.
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: But I was really proud of myself yet to pay
• 25:58
  Speaker 5: that often yeah five years, five years, five years.
• 26:01
  Speaker 4: Well, I just paid it off over five years.
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Unrelatable?
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: No, no, but it's not you know what, who cares
• 26:07
  Speaker 4: about unrelatable? Like, it's just so cool that you got
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: to do that. Like, especially going back, can we just
• 26:13
  Speaker 4: remember that you were telling us how your parents are
• 26:16
  Speaker 4: from Eastern European descent and they experienced Communism and your
• 26:20
  Speaker 4: mum got oranges for Christmas, Like, and now you're like, yes,
• 26:25
  Speaker 4: I paid off my whole lass house in five years.
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: Like are they just like so proud of you because
• 26:32
  Speaker 4: they would be mind blown that the child that they
• 26:35
  Speaker 4: had is now capable of this.
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they're super super proud.
• 26:39
  Speaker 5: But it's funny you say that because the first I
• 26:42
  Speaker 5: mentioned some of the job hopping I did early in
• 26:44
  Speaker 5: my career, and the first take job I got, my
• 26:47
  Speaker 5: mom was super proud of me, and she was like,
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: this is amazing, this is great. Then when I told
• 26:52
  Speaker 5: her that I was leaving that job and I was
• 26:54
  Speaker 5: I got another offer and I was going somewhere else,
• 26:56
  Speaker 5: she thought I was bonkers. She thought, why would you
• 26:59
  Speaker 5: throw away the step.
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: The money? What are you doing? And she almost yelled
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: at me.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: She was like, really, I mean she's not wrong, like
• 27:07
  Speaker 4: from her background, that's of such value.
• 27:10
  Speaker 5: Yeah, she was already proud of me then, but then,
• 27:12
  Speaker 5: you know, I said, this is how much I'm going
• 27:14
  Speaker 5: to be making, and suddenly she.
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: Was just like oh, She's like, are you sure did
• 27:19
  Speaker 4: they mark up?
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: Because that's fake money. Yeah. Yeah.
• 27:22
  Speaker 5: I think for them it's really hard to relate. I mean,
• 27:25
  Speaker 5: my parents barely understand what I do for except for them. Fine, yeah,
• 27:28
  Speaker 5: it's hard for them to relate. But they're super proud.
• 27:31
  Speaker 5: And I think, you know, seeing me go through the
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: same thing of you know, now creating my house, not
• 27:36
  Speaker 5: having to do it under a whole bunch of stress,
• 27:38
  Speaker 5: I think they're just really proud to see that the
• 27:40
  Speaker 5: sacrifices and the challenges they had are no longer something
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: that I'm having to do myself so.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: One hundred percent.
• 27:46
  Speaker 4: And like it's so nice to wrap back to that
• 27:48
  Speaker 4: story that you shared with us at the start, because
• 27:50
  Speaker 4: it's just like, yeah, you mentioned it's unrelatable totally, but
• 27:53
  Speaker 4: like we're not in isolation having this conversation about someone
• 27:56
  Speaker 4: paying off their mortgage in five years and not giving
• 27:59
  Speaker 4: you the content, extend the how and literally the playbook
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: of Okay, well, if you also wanted to work in tech,
• 28:05
  Speaker 4: these are the opportunities on the table. Like, we're sharing
• 28:08
  Speaker 4: this so that people can learn and people can grow
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: and be inspired because, my friend, if you can do it, like,
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: there are opportunities on the table for other women to
• 28:17
  Speaker 4: do something similar, and I just I'm so excited about that, Like,
• 28:21
  Speaker 4: and that's why we're sharing these stories because like, imagine
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: how cool it would be if we get a message saying, oh,
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: I just I put my hat in the ring and
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: I got my first job in tech and I've like
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: doubled my salary, which we totally know, like you and
• 28:33
  Speaker 4: I know is completely possible if somebody wanted to do that. Like,
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: imagine that type of stuff coming out of you sharing
• 28:40
  Speaker 4: your story, which we know is going to happen like,
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: that's so cool.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: I would love to hear those stories, girl friend.
• 28:45
  Speaker 4: When it comes up, I will absolutely share it with you.
• 28:49
  Speaker 4: But tell me a bit more about this investment plan.
• 28:52
  Speaker 4: Like you've got a house, you paid it off, you
• 28:53
  Speaker 4: just sold your house, you're building a dream home, Like
• 28:56
  Speaker 4: are you planning on expanding and having like a bigger
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: investment folio or what does that look like?
• 29:02
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so alongside I guess paying off my mortgage. While
• 29:05
  Speaker 5: I was doing that, I was also trying to kind
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: of build up money to help myself in the case
• 29:12
  Speaker 5: of emergencies or in the case that something was to
• 29:14
  Speaker 5: happen to my job. So I started investing pretty aggressively
• 29:18
  Speaker 5: over the last I think, you know, year year and
• 29:20
  Speaker 5: a half when my income allowed me to put you know,
• 29:24
  Speaker 5: significant amounts of money aside. So for a period of time,
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: I was trying to invest about twenty percent of my income.
• 29:30
  Speaker 5: So now I've got about one hundred and thirty thousand
• 29:33
  Speaker 5: dollars in cheers eas.
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: Oh how cool? In chasa's did you say in chaerseas?
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: I love Cheersya's. I love this and it's from your
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: side of the ditch exactly. Yeah.
• 29:42
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And I love how easy they make it, and
• 29:46
  Speaker 5: I just love all the content that they produce.
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: So big cheersyas fan me too.
• 29:49
  Speaker 4: Don't worry, girlfriend, But like, I'm not even doing that
• 29:52
  Speaker 4: because they pay me. Like I'm literally obsessed with them.
• 29:54
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah, I've seen them their team speak locally and talk
• 29:58
  Speaker 5: about their journey. So yeah, super don't want to support
• 30:00
  Speaker 5: them obviously. Now that I'm saving to, you know, do
• 30:03
  Speaker 5: a huge renovation on our house, I've dropped back some
• 30:06
  Speaker 5: of the investments, but I am still investing just to
• 30:09
  Speaker 5: keep the habit up.
• 30:09
  Speaker 4: Oh, I love this for you. So we're investing. Talk
• 30:13
  Speaker 4: to me about debt. So you've just before Christmas you
• 30:16
  Speaker 4: purchased a house with your partner. How much debt are
• 30:19
  Speaker 4: you in now?
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 30:20
  Speaker 5: So our house, we bought it for nine hundred and
• 30:24
  Speaker 5: ninety thousand, and the mortgage on that at the moment
• 30:28
  Speaker 5: is eight hundred and eighty thousand, which I'm currently paying
• 30:32
  Speaker 5: off myself. My partner's got a house that we live
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: in currently, so he's paying off that mortgage and I'm
• 30:37
  Speaker 5: paying off the mortgage for our future home.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 30:39
  Speaker 4: How cool. So you're in New Zealand. What does a
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: nine hundred and ninety thousand dollars purchase get you like,
• 30:47
  Speaker 4: what type of property are we buying? Because in Melbourne,
• 30:50
  Speaker 4: like and in Sydney, that gets you to redroom, really
• 30:53
  Speaker 4: nice apartment, but.
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: Like it might not buy you land anymore.
• 30:57
  Speaker 4: I mean further out absolutely, But like in Melbourne and Sydney,
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: which are obviously CAPITALI ish cities, you don't get a
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: lot anymore for undred million dollars. So what did you
• 31:08
  Speaker 4: get to purchase?
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 31:10
  Speaker 5: So I think the New Zealand property market has dropped
• 31:13
  Speaker 5: significantly in recent years. And I'm looking at what's happening
• 31:16
  Speaker 5: in Australia and it's completely different to what's happening over here.
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: It's wild. It's such a different market.
• 31:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so we got pretty lucky. We've managed to buy
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: a very big house which is almost two hundred and
• 31:27
  Speaker 5: fifty square meters.
• 31:28
  Speaker 4: Oh my goodness, that's like nearly the size of the
• 31:30
  Speaker 4: block I own.
• 31:31
  Speaker 5: Like, so it's about four bedrooms, two bathrooms and about
• 31:36
  Speaker 5: six hundred meters of land.
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: Oh my god, how good.
• 31:40
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it is one hundred years old and it is unlivable.
• 31:43
  Speaker 5: It is in a really bad state. And so I
• 31:47
  Speaker 5: just think a lot of people didn't want to touch.
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: It, yeah, because you can't just move in. Yeah.
• 31:51
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so it's got a lot of work to do.
• 31:53
  Speaker 5: I think we're planning to put about maybe five hundred
• 31:56
  Speaker 5: to six hundred thousand into it over the next year.
• 32:00
  Speaker 4: And it's going to be your dream home exactly.
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I love that.
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: And like, in terms of proximity to your closest capital city,
• 32:07
  Speaker 4: what does that look like.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: It's literally five kilometers from the CBD.
• 32:10
  Speaker 4: Oh my god, Okay, that is so cool. So it's
• 32:14
  Speaker 4: basically like a one point five million dollar property once
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: it all comes out in the wash, Like, that's what
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: it'll cost you. I love that. And are you planning
• 32:22
  Speaker 4: on smashing this mortgage down as aggressively? Like obviously you're
• 32:26
  Speaker 4: saving for the renous and stuff. Is that all going
• 32:29
  Speaker 4: to be in cash or are you extending your mortgage
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: for that?
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: Yeah, So the goal is to not have to go
• 32:33
  Speaker 5: back to the bank. So we're trying to fund all
• 32:36
  Speaker 5: of the renovation with what we have in cash and
• 32:40
  Speaker 5: the shares from my employer and our salaries and savings
• 32:42
  Speaker 5: and things like that. And then yeah, once we're ready
• 32:45
  Speaker 5: to move in, the plan is for my partner to
• 32:48
  Speaker 5: sell the house we currently live in and just try
• 32:51
  Speaker 5: to bring that mortgage down to be as little as possible.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: So bad. Good.
• 32:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah, we don't have a big mortgage coming out every month.
• 32:59
  Speaker 4: So fair. And then let's say you still work in
• 33:02
  Speaker 4: tech and you're still making the same amount, and you
• 33:05
  Speaker 4: now have no mortgages, Like, what would the plan there be?
• 33:08
  Speaker 4: Is that like expand your property portfolio? Is it like
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: double down on investing in shares, Like what would that
• 33:14
  Speaker 4: look like after you, you know, smash these mortgages out, which
• 33:17
  Speaker 4: I have no doubt you're doing another five years or something.
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: As long as I stay in float, I have no doubt.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: It sounds like they really value you. Thank you.
• 33:26
  Speaker 5: I'm in two minds about it. On one hand, I
• 33:30
  Speaker 5: hear a lot about property. I see a lot of
• 33:32
  Speaker 5: people I know investing in property, and I guess I
• 33:35
  Speaker 5: have anadvertently dabbled in it a little bit myself. I'm
• 33:39
  Speaker 5: not sure if I love property as an investment. I
• 33:42
  Speaker 5: think I quite like the idea of investing my money
• 33:46
  Speaker 5: in shares and being able to draw down on it,
• 33:49
  Speaker 5: you know, every yeah, every year, just have a little
• 33:52
  Speaker 5: bit of I guess, like passive income coming through shares,
• 33:55
  Speaker 5: I might change my mind about that. But I think
• 33:57
  Speaker 5: at this point in time, I find the idea of
• 34:02
  Speaker 5: investing a property to be a little bit of a
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: hassle totally.
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: And I think that each to their own obviously, but
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: it's like me, like, I just look at property and go, oh,
• 34:10
  Speaker 4: there's like a heap of risk and heap of overheads,
• 34:13
  Speaker 4: and you also need a lot of money to get
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: started and then and a lot of ongoing upkeep. Like
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: for me, I'm like, hello, share market, but for other
• 34:22
  Speaker 4: people they go, no, it's bricks and mortar. And I
• 34:24
  Speaker 4: feel really secure with this, so like it's literally based
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: on your personal decisions, which is honestly why I find
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: investing so interesting. Now, with the income that you've got,
• 34:34
  Speaker 4: with the background that you have, and all of the
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: things that you've achieved thus far and will in the
• 34:39
  Speaker 4: near future. What do you think your best money habit is,
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: Because I think that we could learn a lot from you.
• 34:46
  Speaker 5: I think the best habit I have is that, despite
• 34:49
  Speaker 5: earning a lot, I still try to stay quite frugal
• 34:53
  Speaker 5: in some areas. So for me, that's things like, you know,
• 34:57
  Speaker 5: cooking something that lasts three days, not eating out too much,
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: you know, doing my own nails at home rather than
• 35:05
  Speaker 5: paying for it. And sometimes I think recently I've been
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: challenging myself and creating my own little money challenges. But
• 35:12
  Speaker 5: a recent one that I had was not spending any
• 35:15
  Speaker 5: money on Uber eats or takeaways.
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: I don't know if that's possible for me unless I
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: make that money elsewhere. So oh, that's cute.
• 35:22
  Speaker 5: Yeah, through selling something on trade me or marketplace, that
• 35:25
  Speaker 5: could turn into Uber eats money. That's Uber eats money.
• 35:27
  Speaker 5: If I get some kind of voucher from a friend
• 35:29
  Speaker 5: or through work, that's Uber eats money.
• 35:31
  Speaker 4: Oh, I love that. I couldn't stick to it, but
• 35:34
  Speaker 4: in theory, that sounds fantastic.
• 35:37
  Speaker 5: Sometimes I do little like online surveys or participate in
• 35:40
  Speaker 5: market research just to fund my Uber.
• 35:43
  Speaker 4: And you're like, that is a burger.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's.
• 35:45
  Speaker 5: My Uber fund and Uber doesn't get paid in cash.
• 35:48
  Speaker 5: Uber is like a treat. And I think that's really
• 35:50
  Speaker 5: helped me because even though I love convenience, I still, yeah,
• 35:56
  Speaker 5: in the back of my mind, I still know that
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: like every dollar counts. And again, like sickond hand shopping,
• 36:02
  Speaker 5: I grew up with my mom who loved thrifting, and
• 36:04
  Speaker 5: that's really stuck with me, And I do think that
• 36:07
  Speaker 5: sometimes when I think about it, like I do see
• 36:09
  Speaker 5: a little maybe like trace of communism still in my blood.
• 36:12
  Speaker 5: Where I reuse things, I try to get a good deal.
• 36:15
  Speaker 5: I don't buy things I don't need.
• 36:16
  Speaker 4: That's part of our money story though, And I kind
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: of like, as long as it's not causing you trauma,
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: I think it's kind of sweet that you have things
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: that you've kind of inherited from your parents, Like it's
• 36:25
  Speaker 4: so nice to be like, that's so my mum of me.
• 36:28
  Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think my parents really helped me like
• 36:31
  Speaker 5: tep two feet on the ground at all times, you know,
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: they really instilled that in us really strongly when we
• 36:35
  Speaker 5: were growing up. And so I try not to get
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: too carried away with my own spending and keep things manageable,
• 36:41
  Speaker 5: and yeah, don't get carried away too much totally.
• 36:44
  Speaker 4: The other thing that I'm saying that you're really good
• 36:46
  Speaker 4: at that you haven't identified, but you did mention earlier,
• 36:50
  Speaker 4: is that you're really good at throwing your hat in
• 36:53
  Speaker 4: the ring. Like, it is not that common to meet
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: a woman who says that. At twenty four, she wrote
• 36:58
  Speaker 4: a really convincing couple letter and then met with the
• 37:01
  Speaker 4: CEO and got her dream role, which was like the
• 37:03
  Speaker 4: stepping stone. And like your quote lucky break, you explained
• 37:06
  Speaker 4: it as in an industry she wanted to get into,
• 37:09
  Speaker 4: like so many women, as you said, wait until they
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: meet one hundred percent of the criteria before they apply
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: for a job. Like I think a good money habit
• 37:17
  Speaker 4: is just backing yourself. You're like, nope, I could totally
• 37:19
  Speaker 4: do that, Like and I am completely going to back
• 37:21
  Speaker 4: myself into this, And like, I don't think it's a
• 37:24
  Speaker 4: lucky break. I think it was like someone identified the
• 37:27
  Speaker 4: tenacity that you had and realized that you would be
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: a really good staff member. There was nothing that luck
• 37:34
  Speaker 4: had to do with this. And I just I think
• 37:36
  Speaker 4: that that is also a really good money habit that
• 37:39
  Speaker 4: you probably haven't identified. But I would hope that people
• 37:41
  Speaker 4: are taking from this episode because I'm just like, oh
• 37:44
  Speaker 4: my god, Like you're just getting it done.
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: You're like, how hard can it be? I could do that.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: That's fine.
• 37:49
  Speaker 4: Did I meet twenty percent of the criteria? Yes, But
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: also I'm really good at talking, and I would like
• 37:54
  Speaker 4: you to sit down and listen.
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: And I just think that's so cool.
• 37:57
  Speaker 5: Thanks for saying that. Yeah, I think I don't reckon
• 38:00
  Speaker 5: that enough, but I do help. You know, when I'm
• 38:02
  Speaker 5: helping my friends, like you know, find jobs or applying,
• 38:06
  Speaker 5: you're their hype girl. I'm their hype girl. And I
• 38:08
  Speaker 5: always think there's no harm in trying.
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: Just try.
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: I know, what's the worst They could say no, and
• 38:13
  Speaker 4: you go, oh, thank you for the opportunity, moving on.
• 38:16
  Speaker 5: Yeah, so I think you owe it to yourself to try.
• 38:19
  Speaker 5: Worst case scenario you don't hear back. This case scenario
• 38:22
  Speaker 5: leads to a conversation or maybe a job or maybe
• 38:24
  Speaker 5: a career change.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: So cool. See, that's a very good habit.
• 38:29
  Speaker 4: Like, I like that your habit is being the ultimate
• 38:31
  Speaker 4: hype girl for your friends. That's a very good habit.
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: You're making them a lot of money. Ten out of
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: ten bringing the mood down. Though, what's your worst money habit?
• 38:40
  Speaker 5: I think I've got too. So one of them is
• 38:43
  Speaker 5: I don't budget. And despite having a lot of money
• 38:46
  Speaker 5: coming in and like, despite educating myself with podcasts and
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: books and listening to money diaries, I don't have a
• 38:56
  Speaker 5: good sense of how much I actually have coming in
• 39:00
  Speaker 5: and coming out. And I do feel like there's a
• 39:03
  Speaker 5: lot I could optimize to really get the most out
• 39:06
  Speaker 5: of it and to be really smart with the money
• 39:09
  Speaker 5: that I am making at the moment. So I think
• 39:11
  Speaker 5: for me, I don't know what has blocked me or
• 39:14
  Speaker 5: stopped me from doing it. I imagine it's because I don't
• 39:17
  Speaker 5: need to budget. So it's not budgeting for a necessity,
• 39:19
  Speaker 5: but it's budgeting for making sure that I'm Yeah, I
• 39:23
  Speaker 5: guess making the most of this situation and setting myself
• 39:26
  Speaker 5: up for the future as well as possible.
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: And what's your second one?
• 39:29
  Speaker 5: So despite my best efforts and what I just mentioned
• 39:32
  Speaker 5: about trying to be frugal, there is a little bit
• 39:36
  Speaker 5: of lifestyle creep creeping into my world.
• 39:39
  Speaker 4: You're aware of it. We love a self aware queen.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you.
• 39:42
  Speaker 5: I do try to keep it at bay as much
• 39:44
  Speaker 5: as I can, but I love to travel and I
• 39:49
  Speaker 5: love to travel comfortably. So quickly my economy flights have
• 39:55
  Speaker 5: creeped into premium economy territory, and my Airbnb search filters
• 40:00
  Speaker 5: have expanded.
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: A little bit, a little bit. It's so frustrating.
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: Once you've experienced the front of the plane, you're like, welly,
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: I can't I always see here.
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: It's just It's funny.
• 40:10
  Speaker 4: I was trying to explain it to somebody the other day,
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: and like, I'm aware that this is incredibly privileged. I'm
• 40:15
  Speaker 4: not saying something that's relatable here, but like you sit
• 40:19
  Speaker 4: at the front of the plane, you understand what it
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: feels like. But to me, when I get that experience,
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: and usually it's because of my points, I'm not paying
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: it or it's just because like I've used my points smartly.
• 40:29
  Speaker 4: I feel like the holiday starts when you get to
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: the airport, whereas when you are, you know, flying economy,
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: and like there's nothing wrong with that at all, And
• 40:37
  Speaker 4: I still do it, and I've just booked economy flights
• 40:39
  Speaker 4: somewhere because I'm like, I'm not wasting that many points,
• 40:42
  Speaker 4: Like the upgrade was not worth it. I feel like
• 40:44
  Speaker 4: I don't start the holiday until I get to the
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: destination because like it's just not as like there's nothing
• 40:49
  Speaker 4: relaxing about being on the plane unless you're at the
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: very front of the plane. Again, very entitled, but like
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: once you've experienced it, you just go wow. So this
• 41:00
  Speaker 4: is how the other halfway of maybe I should care
• 41:02
  Speaker 4: a little bit more about points collecting or you know,
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: being able to upgrade or what flight specials are on,
• 41:07
  Speaker 4: because it just you get a taste of the good life.
• 41:10
  Speaker 4: And that's what lifestyle creep is right.
• 41:12
  Speaker 5: One hundred percent. Yeah, and I've been trying really hard
• 41:15
  Speaker 5: to balance it and also not to feel too guilty
• 41:17
  Speaker 5: about it as well, like I sometimes forget that I
• 41:19
  Speaker 5: need to celebrate the fact that I am in this position,
• 41:23
  Speaker 5: and so, yeah, it's not necessarily a bad habit, but
• 41:27
  Speaker 5: it is something that sometimes I look back and go,
• 41:29
  Speaker 5: I didn't really have to stay there, you know, I
• 41:31
  Speaker 5: would have had just as much of a good time
• 41:33
  Speaker 5: if I had taken a different flight or stayed at
• 41:37
  Speaker 5: a different place and had.
• 41:39
  Speaker 4: Totally well, I can't help you with that one, Like
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: lifestyle creep, I can help you be aware of it,
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: but I can't fix it. But I think I can
• 41:45
  Speaker 4: fix the budgeting things. So I'll set you up with
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: my money masterclass and I'll get you on a very
• 41:50
  Speaker 4: good budget and we will do it together and make
• 41:52
  Speaker 4: sure that it is all ready to go so that
• 41:55
  Speaker 4: you've got no excuses. So I can fix one of
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: those bad habits the other one, like, I'm sorry, do
• 42:00
  Speaker 4: you know what you deserve that bad habit? Let's not
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: call it bad. Let's call it treating ourselves. We're coming
• 42:04
  Speaker 4: to the end of the episode, my love, But at
• 42:06
  Speaker 4: the very start, like we've learned so much about you.
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: You said that you were a B minus maybe, and
• 42:13
  Speaker 4: then you went on to tell me all of this
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: cool stuff like what kind of B minus pays off
• 42:18
  Speaker 4: their mortgage or their first mortgage in five years?
• 42:20
  Speaker 2: I just feel like after learning this.
• 42:23
  Speaker 4: Much about you, your background, what you studied, how much
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: you're you know, putting your hat in the ring. Understanding, Yeah,
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: you do some frugal stuff, but like you've just bought
• 42:32
  Speaker 4: your first like home, like your dream home with your partner,
• 42:37
  Speaker 4: and you're planning on doing five hundred thousand dollars worth
• 42:39
  Speaker 4: of renovations in cash. Like, girlfriend, that's not a B minus. Like,
• 42:43
  Speaker 4: what do you think it would take for you to
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: say to MeV, I'm an A plus? Like what type
• 42:48
  Speaker 4: of changes would you need to make to be able
• 42:51
  Speaker 4: to grade yourself there?
• 42:52
  Speaker 5: I think despite earning a lot of money, I do
• 42:56
  Speaker 5: still think I have some room to grow, and I
• 42:59
  Speaker 5: think making them more of the money that I do
• 43:01
  Speaker 5: have coming in, So being more aware of my budget,
• 43:05
  Speaker 5: what my incomings are, what my outgoings are. I really
• 43:08
  Speaker 5: think that that would help me feel more I guess,
• 43:12
  Speaker 5: aware and conscious of where my money is going. Like
• 43:16
  Speaker 5: there's a lot of privilege that comes with being in
• 43:18
  Speaker 5: this situation, but I think I'm doing myself a little
• 43:21
  Speaker 5: bit of a disservice by being a bit lazy about it,
• 43:24
  Speaker 5: and so that education and also having a bit more
• 43:27
  Speaker 5: of a solid emergency fund, like having a nice house
• 43:31
  Speaker 5: isn't going to help me if I run into trouble
• 43:33
  Speaker 5: or lose my job.
• 43:34
  Speaker 4: But it's so good to be self aware of that
• 43:36
  Speaker 4: as well, and I just go, well, you're on the
• 43:38
  Speaker 4: right track, Like there are so many people who earn
• 43:40
  Speaker 4: heaps of money who just go right, well, I'm golden.
• 43:43
  Speaker 4: I don't have to think about this. I have heaps
• 43:45
  Speaker 4: of money coming in, and I just I think that
• 43:47
  Speaker 4: you're You're beyond that, Like you're not be minus to me.
• 43:50
  Speaker 5: Maybe an a minus, but I feel like there's always
• 43:51
  Speaker 5: room to grow.
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: So well, we can sit there for now, my love.
• 43:54
  Speaker 2: This has been so good.
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: I have loved this episode, and I just know that
• 43:59
  Speaker 4: there there's going to be someone who listens to this
• 44:01
  Speaker 4: and goes, humh, I reckon, I could do that and
• 44:05
  Speaker 4: then gets a better job or upgrades their lifestyle or
• 44:08
  Speaker 4: doubles their income because you had to chat with us today.
• 44:11
  Speaker 4: So I am just really grateful that you wanted to
• 44:13
  Speaker 4: spend the time that you probably don't actually have to
• 44:17
  Speaker 4: hang out with us and share your story for the
• 44:20
  Speaker 4: betterment of our community.
• 44:21
  Speaker 5: So thank you so much for that. I really appreciate it.
• 44:23
  Speaker 5: Thank you so much for having me. I've really really
• 44:25
  Speaker 5: appreciated being able to share my.
• 44:27
  Speaker 4: Story Adore, Thank you so much. The advice shared on
• 44:36
  Speaker 4: She's on the Money is general in nature and does
• 44:38
  Speaker 4: not consider your individual circumstances. She's on the Money exists
• 44:43
  Speaker 4: purely for educational purposes and should not be relied upon
• 44:46
  Speaker 4: to make an investment or financial decision.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: If you do choose to buy a financial.
• 44:50
  Speaker 4: Product, read the PDS TMD and obtain appropriate financial advice
• 44:54
  Speaker 4: tailored towards your needs. Victoria Divine and She's on the
• 44:58
  Speaker 4: Money are authorized represented gives of money, sirper P T
• 45:01
  Speaker 4: y L t D A B N three two one
• 45:04
  Speaker 4: six four nine two seven seven zero eight a F
• 45:07
  Speaker 4: s L four five one two eight nine