Latest / WOC and Allies: Business and Career Realtalk with Elaine Lou Cartas / 70: Our Big Podcast Mistake - Why We Decided To Change Our Name With Monica Schrock

Transcript

70: Our Big Podcast Mistake - Why We Decided To Change Our Name With Monica Schrock · WOC and Allies: Business and Career Realtalk with Elaine Lou Cartas

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_02: The Color Dreams podcast got a facelift.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, what do you expect?
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm from LA.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: And we changed our name to W O C and Allies Business and Career Real Talk.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: So in this episode, we talk about why the title is so long and the mistakes we made in this podcast with my marketing strategist and friend Monica Schock.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_02: And let me just say all of you are mean.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: You just really love learning the behind the scenes of my mistakes.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_02: So you don't have to do them, right?
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you're welcome.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: All right, let's drop the beat.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: Hey, I'm Elaine Lucarthas.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a business and career coach for women of color and allies.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_02: Elaine Weekly awarded me the number one thought leader, and Apple News named me one of the top five business coaches.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_02: Done doing the most as a woman of color or ally, and you want to create your own definition of success and happiness.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: Well, grab your coffee tea or boba and let's do some business and career real talk.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: Monica, you're back on.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: You were so sultry when you said that.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: I know, I know.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, I had to change the tone.
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_02: But I know, yeah.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_02: For those that don't know Monica, where have you been?
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_02: Hiding under the rock.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just how you made it through this whole podcast without knowing.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_01: Or maybe it's because episode.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's your first episode.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_01: And then no shame.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: No shame.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, sorry.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: You I did not mean to attack you if this is the first episode that you're listening into.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: We apologize, but welcome.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome, welcome.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: You the new name.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: We got a facelift because you know I'm from LA.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_02: Or what's the new thing?
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: Is it facelift?
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: Is it Botox?
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'm the wrong person.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I'm I don't know what the new procedure is.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: Anyways, welcome to the new name, WC and Allies Business and Career Real Talk.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_02: Whoa, that was a mouthful.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a mouthful, but also it's super accurate.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: And we're gonna talk about all the other things that it is, but it sounds like a really cool radio show segment.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_02: Do you do you like that?
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_02: Because I mean, Monica did pitch themselves a couple of minutes months ago to me.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_02: Like Elena, I should be in your podcast like once a month because I'm in your team.
• 2:29
  SPEAKER_02: For those of you that don't know Monica, Monica Schrock goes by she they.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_02: My marketing strategist, not only for me, but also my clients, also a client, also a friend, also a fellow Sagittarius human.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: Anything else you want to add to that long list of who you are?
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: Human.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, forgot human.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: Human human.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: You said Sagittarius.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_01: No, I think I'm good.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_01: I I think you described me perfectly.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_02: And for those that don't know, I'm Elaine.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a business and career coach and I love long walks at Target.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: So amazing.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_02: Why did we make this like what happened?
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: Why did we make this mistake?
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_02: Why why nothing is a waste of time?
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_01: So when we say we made a podcast mistake, quote unquote, it's very rare that you make actual mistakes in your business.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: These are just choices you made when you didn't have the information you have now, right?
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't make a mistake.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_01: We just didn't really have all the information.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't know how this was gonna go.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we want to talk about how nothing is a waste of time in your business because usually you don't have the same knowledge or information that you had when you made a decision prior.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so when we made the name of Elaine's podcast, well, we didn't really make the name, it was a part of your brand anyway.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_02: Color your dreams pod Yeah, we called it Color Your Dreams podcast.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_02: It was the name of our brand.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_02: It was it's a cute name.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_02: That's what we named our events.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: And figured let's do the same thing with the podcast.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_02: Keep that going.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_01: Which totally made sense.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: It was something that you've done in business since you started.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: So it just kind of like the thread through continued.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_01: And what we've learned, well, I want to say that nothing you do is a mistake or a waste of time in your business because again, you learn all those things along the way.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like you learn how people respond to the name, you learn who you attracted through having that name, you learn what people want, which is part of how we like renamed the podcast, what people want from your content.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_01: So these are all like data points and qualitative and quantitative like research that you're doing by doing anything in your business.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_01: So I just want to say that before we start this podcast.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: Anything you've done, even if people are like, you should start doing XYZ.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of the times, my clients I'll be like, Oh, do you have an email list?
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_01: If they say no, I'm like, okay, cool, let's get one for you because it's really important for XYZ reasons.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: And we can talk about that later on another episode why it's important to have an email list.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: But sometimes people get really like down on themselves because they didn't, they haven't been collecting emails up to that point.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_01: And for me, I'm like, it's okay.
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like you didn't know how important this channel was and what it could do for you.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: So we don't need to focus on why you didn't do it.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: We're just gonna focus on how to build it now, you know.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's just, you know, giving yourself a little bit of grace when you didn't know the things that you know now.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: Correct.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I think both Monica and I like we're really scrappy starters.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like, we're like, okay, this sounds cool.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna start a podcast.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: We're gonna do it.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_02: But we're not like waiting.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's one of our strengths as well as weaknesses in terms of like, let's just do it, see what's gonna happen.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_02: And what we realized when we were doing the podcast, not just a podcast, but even looking in my business, I was like, wow, SEO is so huge.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: I still get majority of clients, about 60% when I last looked at my numbers from referrals or in yules, and about 20% from SEO.
• 5:42
  SPEAKER_02: And I was talking to Monica.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: I I spoke to my whole team.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: So it was Monica, my marketing strategist, spoke to my SEO strategist, spoke to Tiffany, my brand strategist, also talked to my lawyer about this.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: So it is being trademarked, FYI.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: And you're like, why didn't we put SEO words into the name of the podcast?
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, think about it.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: Like, for example, I was getting into a fight with a family member, not fight like physically, but you know, misunderstandings that happen.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I was typing into my Spotify, I'm like, okay, dealing with a tough family member.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_02: And then in my head, I'm like, wait, if I'm looking for this, other people are probably looking for me.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: But what is call your dreams?
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_02: That doesn't make sense.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: But if I put something like W C business, career, then they would easily find me.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: Anything else that you want to add, Monica?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: I think I it's funny because what I have to do is put myself into the shoes of how someone's most likely going to search for something.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_01: Because for me, I'm gonna go to Google before I go to any of the podcast platforms, and I'm gonna say best podcasts about comics or whatever I'm looking for, because I want to see what a person has said about these podcasts.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: But that's just how I search for things and like kind of like thinking about what someone's gonna do when they go in those apps was something that maybe I wasn't thinking about when we like were doing the podcast either.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_01: I wasn't thinking, oh, someone's gonna search in the podcast like platform.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_01: I was just like, oh, I always search on Google and find the best ones because that's how I want to find them.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it's that's something too, is to think about how your audience might be like searching for things.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: But that just in my mind, I'm like, oh, well, it'd be cool to get on some list for like the best podcast for certain things.
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_01: So that's like an idea for later.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_01: But like yeah, yeah.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_01: But I think yeah, it was one of those things where we just went, like you said, we just go for things.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_01: Like I'm one of those people too.
• 7:34
  SPEAKER_01: I have an idea and I go for it.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: And there are pros and cons to that because I didn't probably spend a lot of time planning and and consulting everyone that I could consult about what would be the best way to do something.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_01: For me, when I get that that momentum, I run with it.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: So we're similar in those ways.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I think, like we said, that's a pro because we have no problem starting things, right?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: We don't have like analysis paralysis when it comes to starting new things.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_01: We'll just do it.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then we probably could have done a little bit more research, but I don't know.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: I still think it's a great way to start something.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_01: You start something, you see what works, you improve it.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_01: And it's just up from there because what you have subscribers now, you have a lot of downloads now.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's no cons in that situation.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, and and it's not being attached to the results.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: So whenever I even try something new in my business, like let me try it out for three months or six months.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_02: The podcast, I mean, I heard it's interesting because even working with Andres, my podcast SEO strategist, I'll we did a podcast episode, I'll add it to the show notes.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: He even shared with me, hey, a lot of your, I hate the word competitors, but it's just a word that's easy to use.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: But a lot of your competitors or people that work with the same demographic as you have a podcast.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, oh, that's interesting because I've always wanted to start one.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_02: And that was just kind of in the back of my head.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: And there was data informing that it would be a good idea to start a podcast because your audience is listening to podcasts.
• 8:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I just got burnt out from doing Facebook and Instagram lives.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: And in a podcast, I'm behind a mic and I'm not holding space.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: Like I'm a projector if anyone's into human design.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a lot of energy.
• 9:02
  SPEAKER_02: It's like an introverted energy.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: Like, wait, I just have to hold space for Monica or whoever guests I have.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: And the hard part though, when it comes to podcasting or any long-form content like email marketing or blogs, is it is not a short-term win.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like, ooh, I got 300 likes on my Instagram post.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: I knew it was gonna be long term.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: I wait, I waited probably six months until people started saying, hey, I wanted to work with you because I binge listened to my podcast.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_02: And I wouldn't even say my podcast is the number one way I get clients.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: If anything, it builds authority and trust for people who want to work with me and my team even more.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's a nurturing platform a lot of the time.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's that middle of funnel.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_01: People are gonna find you elsewhere and they're gonna go to your podcast and see what you're all about.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_01: So it's that next step, which is so important.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like usually we think it's just a date.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_01: In a marketing funnel, I think we we sometimes forget about that really important middle part of the funnel.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_01: You have like top of the funnel, middle, and then the bottom.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: The bottom is converting people, the top is acquiring people like as leads.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: And in the middle, there's a lot of work that has to go into that building trust and giving people the value and giving them the approach you're gonna take to helping them to support them with whatever your business is.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_01: So it's really important to have something so strong as the middle of funnel.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's like so it's so important.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_01: And you've created something.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I think another reason why it's not a mistake, too, like it is because okay, there's always these two sides of like a mistake, right?
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: So in in marketing, there is the what if of how many, how many more people could have found your podcast if it had SEO before now.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_02: Don't say that.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, no.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_02: Oh god.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: But that's what we're talking about here.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_02: I know, yes, yes, yes.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_02: Continue, continue, continue.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: But but or and now, when people find you through this SEO, you have this catalog of amazing episodes with amazing guests, and you don't have to start some from scratch.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_01: Everyone's gonna be like, oh my gosh, I'm founding the finding this podcast that's tailored to me that I didn't know was out here.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_01: And look at all this content I get to binge.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_01: So it's you know, there's like mistake, but also it's kind of a happy accident in the sense that it's not like you're starting from scratch.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_02: Correct, correct.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm really grateful for creating the podcast, but then at the same time, I was like, why are my numbers not as great?
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, wait, we're missing this part, we're missing the name of it.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how is how is the growth gonna happen if people aren't able to search for it?
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: And that was the main like like, how are we gonna get more growth?
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: It needs to be more searchable.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: Like that was it.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_02: And it sounds so simple and it's fascinating because I know not just anyone that's listening to but myself, which is why we're doing this episode, because we often hear, like, oh my gosh, especially since it's the new year, look at me, I'm so great.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: This is all the great things.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_02: Like, you know what?
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: Let's just talk about the mistake why we changed the name in our first episode of relaunching again.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, looking back to it, it's like, well, at least we tried.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: One.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_02: And then and then two, I remember one of my mentors telling me um, clear over clever.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: I know so often, like, ooh, what's a fancy name?
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like, for example, I do call myself a business and career coach, but some people don't like the word coach because of how other people in the industry feel about it.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_02: So they're gonna call themselves a guide or I don't know.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_02: I don't I don't like that.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_02: But people have called themselves like a guide or mentor.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: But here's the reality.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I know some people have changed their names to that, but I mean, I'm just being honest, like even looking in my own business.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: When people Google or yelp you, which people have, by the way, they're not putting guide or mentor, like people look kind of like, hey, oh my gosh, I have I need to fix, like, I need to change the paint.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_02: They're not gonna call like they're not gonna Google or yelp like wall creative.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_02: No, they're gonna look for painter.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_02: That's the word they're gonna use, painter.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 13:04
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and that's the thing about about titles.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, as long as it's accurate, you really want to think about how like what people are searching, like how they think about these.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I I mean, if if marketing strategist wasn't what people were looking for and they were looking for marketing contractor, then my title would be marketing contractor.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_01: I don't give a shit what it sounds like.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's what people are searching for, and it means the same thing, you know.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's important to, you know, weigh the odds.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: If you have a strong feeling about not being, you know, a guide or a coach or a mentor or like whichever word you have a strong feeling about, that that is totally cool.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_01: But I think it's it's worth looking at what people are searching for to be more, yeah, so people can find you, so people can understand what you're doing.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_01: I've had a I've worked with a lot of entrepreneurs who like to be clever, like you were saying.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's not that people should never be clever.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like when I was working predominantly making content for introverts, you know, people would use the word intropreneur and they really liked it.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_01: So it was like something that was very made a connection with introverted entrepreneurs.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_01: So that was something I would use from time to time.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: I wouldn't call myself that, but there are people who have called their audiences something of a mashup with two words.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_01: And my question to them was always, okay, does your audience know what that is?
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: I I have to even remind my clients too.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, you're using like these very big words and very much in your niche, but I want you to, you're an expert.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_02: It makes sense that you're going to use those words.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: But what will the average person, a normal person, like think about and look for?
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_02: What are the words they're using?
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: Don't think about you because you're at a high level and you're the expert, but just go back to basics.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: I've even been using marketing for like freelance marketer because like that's what people are looking for, right?
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_01: Because there is something about like marketing strategists that seems a little bit more like unattainable.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: Does that make sense?
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: Or marketing consultant.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: These two things seem very like not, they seem not accessible.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: I think is the worst.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: You know what?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: You're right.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_02: And then there's the the trend right now is also like the part-time CMO chief marketing officer.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: The fractional CMO.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, there you go.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: Fractional CMO.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: So it's like, yeah.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: But okay, so second part is the breakdown of this full ass long name, WOC and Allies Business and Career Real Talk.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're like, why is that such a long name?
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: Like, make it shorter.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we just talked about the SEO part, like WC and Allies.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: If you go to my website, ElaineLew.com, you see that woman of color and allies business and career coach.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: I've worked, I want to say, in the past three years on my SEOs.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_02: So if you look up WOC Business Coach, business coach for woman of color, woman of color, business coach, WOC business coach, I am number one.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: And we have yeah, on Google.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: And we had to add that again in the podcast because if we know what's working in one area, then it should work in another area.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_02: I would love for you to add more, Monica, about like what happens when other business owners notice that.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_02: Like, hey, if this is working here, what can we do here?
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_01: Also, just to say, if if we could make the title shorter, then we would.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we tried.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: We tried.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: We tried, and this is what would really like, you know, really serve both Elaine's audiences and tell people what because we don't want to miss out on people, right?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_01: Because Elaine is so has such a like an expansion of you know what you do and who you do it for.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: And it's really important that we include everyone within your audience.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_01: So that's why we can't make it shorter.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: And and let's be let's be honest for Monica's selfish reasons.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_02: Monica is an ongoing podcast guest.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: So honestly, I was gonna call it, I was gonna call it WOC business and career real talk, like take out the allies part.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_02: Monica's like, hey, bitch, like I'm on your podcast.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_02: I'm an ally.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_02: Well, no, no, that's not true.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_02: And that's not true.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_02: That's not true, but that's not true.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, wouldn't it be weird?
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, wouldn't it be weird if I was on your podcast and it only said WOC, which is, you know, that's the the your audience is both.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I think really we wanted to be transparent, right?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: That's the biggest thing is like not wanting to only say women of color when there are clients and people on your podcast that are al, you know, from the allied community.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_02: I I don't know if I've even shared this in a podcast episode, but I will share it on this podcast episode.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_02: When Monica first reached out to me after the first event, Monica was looking for a business coach.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_02: So Monica slid into my DMs and they were like, Elaine, I know you serve women of color.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know any coaches that serve allies?
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, Monica, that's my niche.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, welcome all.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then my- Well, I think what I said is like, I don't want to take a spot for your audience.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciated that.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: You have a coach that you can recommend that, you know, serves people, like we'll take a white client and won't take up space.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_01: But then you were like, Oh, I do.
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_01: I I do serve allies too.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: It just wasn't so what's the word?
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_01: Advertised, I guess.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_01: Marketed.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_02: Well, marketed because as soon as you became a client, I was like, I need to make that more clear.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: But not, yeah, I mean, talking about mistakes.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: But there was no other thing, yeah, learning.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's another mistake and learning.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I will say in my own business, because I know a lot of people make it specific, whether it's an Asian American community or just BIPOC community.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_02: I have found so much benefit when I'm holding space for women of color and allies because we learn and grow from one another from our different lived experiences.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I think what we were seeing when we were looking at changing the podcast is like we had to include all the elements of Elaine's business.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_01: So again, we just talked about women of color and allies, but then there's business and career, right?
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: Because Elaine is ID Bob and career coach and comes up in search on Google with career and business searches.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: So it was really important.
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like, we can have a podcast meant for, you know, women in executive positions at corporations.
• 19:08
  SPEAKER_01: That's also for women who have their own own businesses, but only have a word for one of them.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like it just didn't make any sense, you know.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like we can't do that because that's cutting Elaine's business in half.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_01: And why would we have a lead generator nurturing platform that cuts leads in half?
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: So that was part of like the the length of the, you know, like this is necessary.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_01: Trust me, we went through every single word and tried to made sure it was necessary.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: Legacy leader.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_02: I know what you're thinking.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_02: Elaine, you have such good stuff here.
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_02: I want more.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: So if you want more tips and advice for your business career in life, sign up for my gifts and gifts newsletter at ElaineLew.com forward slash join.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's J-O-I-N.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: And here's three things you'll get when you join, because I'm like Santa Claus.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_02: I love giving.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_02: Number one, funny gifts.
• 20:03
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• 20:07
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• 20:09
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• 20:12
  SPEAKER_02: That's business, career, and life tips that you can start doing today.
• 20:17
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• 20:19
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• 20:24
  SPEAKER_02: My gifts and gifts newsletter is like an up-to-date diary.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: Think Zenga or Life Journal for my fellow millennials, where I share vulnerable stories, relatable mistakes, and important life tips like what to watch on Netflix.
• 20:39
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• 20:41
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• 20:53
  SPEAKER_02: That's J-O-I-N.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_02: All right, let's get back to the episode.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I know there's some people out there that may have a business similar to me where maybe you're doing two different services or two different audiences.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: And so I had to figure out that balance.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like I might be teaching different things for my business coaching clients, my career coaching clients.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_02: So how can I make sure I still provide that individualization?
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_02: So in my business, which is why I limit the number of clients I work with, I at least provide a monthly one-to-one with me.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: So there's that.
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_02: And and here's another mistake I do want to share.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_02: I used to like separate my office hours with my business coaching clients and my career coaching clients.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: I used to have separate events.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, wait, so you know, there's no problem with testing things.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I tested.
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, let me put my business clients and my career coaching clients in office hours and events.
• 21:42
  SPEAKER_02: And it actually was beautiful.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_02: Where even though they may have different professional experiences, they have similar challenges being a woman or non binary, basically being a leader, whether in their career or in their business.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_01: And, you know, I would say too, like the Main the core messaging of what you do for folks is really a sustainable business or career and balanced with their lifestyle and their goals personally.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: So I think those things go perfectly, like they go together regardless if people have a business or are looking to stay in the corporate or nonprofit or, you know, any organization world.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so it really is the core of your of your messaging applies to both sides of your audience.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_01: And I think if you do serve, if anyone here is a business owner and they do serve a couple of different audiences, it's really important to have your core message apply to everyone you're serving, regardless of what services you offer them.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I just wanted to throw that in there because that's how you keep a cohesive brand, even if you're serving different audiences of people.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: And so I want to talk about the last word, which was a pain in the ass to figure out.
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_02: Last word in our podcast was real talk.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: It was supposed to be called WOC and Allies Business and Career Conversations.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:59
  SPEAKER_02: We were gonna do business and career talk.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: There were so many things.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_02: And then what happened was we were doing, we always look at my numbers, my marketing numbers once in a month.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_02: Every month.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: We were looking at it, and then Monica, what happened?
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we were in the patterns.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_01: We observe the pattern.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: So that is like, yeah, that's marketing, right?
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: It's like it really is like recognizing patterns and then pulling those patterns out.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: And like you were saying, going with what's working.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: So if you see these patterns of things that are working, like that's the direction you want to go.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_01: You don't want to keep doing things that aren't hitting with your audience.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_01: So what we do every month is we look at all of Elaine's emails, podcast episodes, social media posts, and you know, more specifically email and podcasts because that they carry more weight with your with your audience.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_01: We look at like, what are the subject lines that people are opening?
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: What are the emails that people are clicking more?
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: What podcasts are being downloaded the most?
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_01: And we look at these patterns, and there usually are patterns, like there usually will be.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: You're not going to look at a lot of isolated cases.
• 23:58
  SPEAKER_01: And what we noticed is people were really, you know, hot takes are like whether they're in or out anymore.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: People really want like, they want someone to be like to stand on, like to really like stand on what they're talking about and be like, this is what I think, or this is what happened.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: I love that Elaine talks about mistakes all the time because a lot of people won't talk about what has really like gone wrong or what they've had to change.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: Or like I've loved that since day one.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_01: You were always like, look, I'm gonna be transparent about what's happening in my business.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not like this, this like guru of everything.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: I learn as I go, just like you do, and you get to learn from my mistakes.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_02: Love you so much, Monica.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_01: Love you.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: So I think we saw that people wanted to learn from your mistakes.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I think people also wanted to hear what you thought about, you know, industry trends, just about like how businesses and and corp corporations operate.
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: That was a cat.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, are you burping?
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, you know, it was either a burp or a cat, but it's who we are talking about real talk.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_02: So there you go.
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's part of the brand.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Real talk.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, I mean, to sum all that up, like the real talk subject lines and the real talk, like I think one of them was work-life balance doesn't exist.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like you've been lied to.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, work life balance is a lie.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: Is a lie.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: That was our big one.
• 25:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, the number one downloaded podcast.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_01: So when we thought about like different podcasts like that and subject lines that you had gone through, we were like, okay, people are really into when you just keep it real.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, just keep it real.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_01: And then we went back in time to when Elaine did a live on Facebook and Instagram every day.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_01: And it was called Real Talk with Elaine Liz.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, literally.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_01: That was what I was called.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like the first or the like the second year you were in business or something.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_02: First year in your business, I was doing a Facebook and 65 days.
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_02: I was crazy, man.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was young.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_02: I was young.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_02: I was in my 20s.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_02: I was still in my 20s then.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_02: I was still in my 20s.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_01: Lots of energy.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: So we looked at that and we were like, people still like the real talk with Elaine Liu.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's still what they love about you.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: This has been a pattern since you started your business.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: So this was kind of an easy pattern to kind of latch on to and feel, I think, really confident in this decision.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: And then we looked at conversations, and and my opinion on it was like, I wouldn't want to listen to that podcast because that sounds really boring.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: Like I'm keeping it real.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_01: Keeping it real.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, oh, that doesn't sound like I'm gonna have fun at all.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_01: Like, but when you say like real talk and then you add a person, you're I'm like, oh, this may be, maybe this is gonna get spicy, or at least this is gonna be fun, you know, and I'm gonna learn some stuff.
• 26:25
  SPEAKER_01: So I think between that, and that's the main, I think a really big thing in marketing that people need to understand, data is really important, but so is your gut.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_01: So is you enjoying what you're doing doing.
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_01: So is you being proud to share what you've put out in the world.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_01: So I think if the data's pointing to something that you just are not into, like think about that.
• 26:44
  SPEAKER_01: Don't just do it for the data.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: But we thankfully had a sweet spot of like, okay, the data's telling us this, and also, oh, this has been part of the brand the whole time and it's really fun.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_01: So it was an easy choice to make.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna stop there so you can add it a lane.
• 26:57
  SPEAKER_02: No, I mean, I loved that it it came naturally.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_02: I know so so often when we think of names for something in our business, we're like, oh, okay, let's have a brainstorming session.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_02: And we basically like parking lot it, you know, we're like, okay, it originally was supposed to be WOC and Allie's business career conversations.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_02: And Monica and I just came like, you know what, it'll probably come naturally.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_02: So it was one of our monthly meetings, yeah.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_02: Going through the data.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: And then Monica, I remember you were just saying, Yeah, people just really like like how real you are.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_02: And then I was like, Monica, it's real talk.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's the last word.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: That's what you're missing.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: And also, we're both millennials.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_02: Majority of our listeners, maybe you you are listening, or you're millennial.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_02: So we're used to what real talk means.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_01: Not just elder millennials, but geriatric millennials.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry, I care to geriatric millennials.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: So we used to say real talk, and like that's you know, I think sometimes like nostalgic things, regardless of if they're in right now, to your audience.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: If your audience is more your age, then think about that nostalgia for them, not what's trending right now.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_02: So okay, I just I just want to kind of do like a live workshopping.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: If this was for Gen Z, what would that word be instead of real talk?
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: I'm dead.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: That wouldn't be that.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: Mrs.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_02: Ed Career.
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_02: What seemed Alex, Mrs.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: Ed Career?
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: I'm dead.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_00: I'm dead.
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_00: Or oh my God, that's so funny.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_00: I don't even know.
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so clearly, if you are a Gen Zer, please do not hire us because you just don't know.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_02: You're a lingo.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_01: We don't.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I know some, but I don't know how it would fit in here.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like if we're like bet.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: Business and career.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_02: Business and career real, I don't know.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_02: We're just dating ourselves.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, now we're just now we're just having fun.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_02: So I know I know we're talking about us, but but just like the name of our podcast real talk.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: One, and then two, we're just we're just being real.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_02: What can Monica?
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_02: What can our listeners learn from our mistake?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Also, you guys you are you all are mean.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_02: Let me just say that.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like we're looking at the date, yeah.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_02: Looking at the data, you all really want to learn from my mistakes so you don't have to repeat it.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: You are welcome.
• 29:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like, put me as a punching bag instead of yourself.
• 29:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: Me too.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_01: We can do a podcast on all my mistakes if we wanted to.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_02: I know.
• 29:18
  SPEAKER_02: But at the same time, you know what?
• 29:20
  SPEAKER_02: I I joke around my clients, like, you hire me because I've made all the mistakes.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_02: I've been fired.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_02: I've quit.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_02: I've got on debt twice.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: So I joke around with my clients saying, like, you learn from my mistakes so you don't repeat it, but I cannot protect you from your own mistakes.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: Mistakes will happen.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: Mistakes will always happen.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: So what can people learn from this?
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, the number one thing when you do anything, whether it's your website or a podcast or anything that can be searched on the internet, think about SEO.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: You don't have to be an expert to think about SEO.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: You can just search yourself.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: Search.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_01: Do a search.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um Google it.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_01: Google it.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: Google anything you want to know.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: Ask a question and see what comes up.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: Like best business coaches and wherever you live, just like people are like, you know, business coach in Los Angeles, I show up.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: I show up.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_01: Business coach for women of color in Los Angeles, Elaine shows up.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_01: So searching the questions you think, I think it's really, really important to think about what the what the people you're supporting are asking when they Google things.
• 30:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's like what you can learn, like major.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_01: If you were to take anything from this podcast right now, I would say that would be it.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_02: No, I I 100% agree with it.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'm even starting to do it in my own podcast.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_02: Also, if you don't have a podcast, because I get it, it does cost money and time.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_02: Like even when we're writing a social media or blog or a blog or an email, like I now I haven't done this a lot.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_02: I started doing in the past two months, like Googling, like what are people searching for?
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: What are the words?
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's how I write blogs.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_01: Whenever I've written blogs for any client, for any job I've had, for myself, I always, I mean, a lot of the times making blog like podcast titles and and blog post titles a question is kind of the best thing you can do, by the way.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, I think one of the biggest, I worked for a nonprofit and we did like non-toxic content.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the questions, one of the blog posts were like, is tattoo ink toxic?
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_01: And people search that all the time.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: So our blog came up all the time.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: It's just like really thinking about like the questions people are asking.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes having a question as the title is like a really great strategy.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_02: And why it's important when you do convert a client or a customer, whether it's over the phone or they buy your product, ask them, hey, how did you find me?
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: What made you decide to work with me?
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah, that's a big one.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_01: If you have an intake form, please put that on there.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_01: Please.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like I have that.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like how'd you?
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_01: Or if you don't have one, yeah.
• 31:40
  SPEAKER_01: Or if you're just talking to someone, please, yeah.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_01: But if it's on the indoor yeah.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_02: I have some clients.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I have a client who has a plant shop in the Bay Area.
• 31:50
  SPEAKER_02: So obviously it's not online or intake, but make sure when you're, you know, scanning their products, like, hi, how'd you find us?
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_02: I was walking around.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_02: So that means storefront's really important.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_02: Or how'd you find us?
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, foot traffic or word of mouth.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: My friend told me about it.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Or I saw you on Instagram or I searched on Google.
• 32:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's so important to know those things.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I think if you ever like it's important for you to know so those things, but as your business grows and it will, when you bring on a marketing person.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like us knowing that.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_01: Look at Monica.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: Monica self-promoting.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: Well, this isn't even a self-promotion if you want to, but this is just for any marketer out there that's going to be hired by your business.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_01: That information will be so crucial for them to start getting you results immediately.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like you'll be wasting so much, like, not that time is wasted, but you will wait less time to see results if you have that information for them, if they know which like, you know, channels of marketing people are finding you and which are converting the best.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_01: If you can track that, please do.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_02: And if and if things like change or trends, like before, yeah.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_02: I I mean, majority has always been referrals or renewals, but before, like, I got a lot of like when I first started, it was Facebook.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_02: And then it became Instagram.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_02: And now it's Google, SEO, and LinkedIn.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_02: So when you keep that track, that's why Monica and I meet monthly.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_02: Like we're looking at my numbers, like, oh, this is happening.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_02: This is changing.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: My leaves have never come from Instagram, by the way.
• 33:19
  SPEAKER_01: I just want everyone to know that because I think people think that Instagram is like the place you're supposed to find business all the time.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely not.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: I've literally never.
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and not be and I want to be clear, it's not because I'm doing all this content and pitching things and no one's biting.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: I just realized, like doing a little bit of content, that it's really hard to get business off Instagram.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it is.
• 33:39
  SPEAKER_01: Instagram 1%.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's a 1% like 1% of your followers see you on Instagram, which is why we focus on Instagram.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, they might find you there through your content.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and that is something that does happen, like top of funnel.
• 33:52
  SPEAKER_01: But for me, I just wanted to say that because I think a lot of times people think they should be on Instagram, quote unquote.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: Just because it exists and people might be on there selling stuff and doing a lot of content doesn't mean you should be on there, which is a whole other like episode.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_02: My gosh, I think Monica, you've created like two other episodes that we're gonna do.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: I know why you need email marketing and why you shouldn't be on like why you might not need to be on Instagram, so stop tripping about it.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, and to be transparent, as we're creating this in the new or this isn't gonna come out of the new year, like Q4.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_02: I've had myself and a lot of my clients like have seen a decline on Instagram because of everything that's happening in the world.
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_01: Oh yeah.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: So people don't want to be on it.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: And that's the risk, right?
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: If a lot of your stuff is only on Instagram or any other social media platform because people are still checking their emails.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_01: I promise you that.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_02: People are checking emails.
• 34:43
  SPEAKER_02: And what I love, the reason why I got into SEO, it's like someone that really wants to look for something.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, like, think about it.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: If I'm cramming boba, I'm gonna go on Yelp and go find a boba place.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_01: I don't like Yelp, so I never go to Yelp, but I go to Google.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: As a marketer, I have beep with Yelp, and we don't need to go into that.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that is a third podcast episode that I'm hearing in here.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for sure.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: But yeah, they're gonna search you on some platform, right?
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's Yelp or Google.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, there could be Safari.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_01: People are searching Safari.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's right.
• 35:14
  SPEAKER_01: Safari on or like sorry, Safari is definitely not it's a uh there's also Firefox.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: It's uh those are not search engines.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know why I said Safari.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_01: I'm talking about Bing or like the other the other ones that exist.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_01: So people are searching elsewhere too, but you know, Google's number one.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: YouTube, YouTube, if you're making YouTube videos, think about the SEO.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_01: That's a huge SEO.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: SEO is really huge.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that was another thing that I was considering too, like on YouTube.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_02: Not now, but like maybe in the future because Google is so huge.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_02: But I will say the reason why I chose a podcast, it's because it's real.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_02: I don't need to put like a shit ton of makeup on like a lot of other people.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_02: No shame, by the way, like for people that do a lot of makeup, but my brand is just like yeah, real talk.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_01: Real talk.
• 35:58
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I think something, yeah, I think something else that people can learn from this is that trends are trends are always like, you know, changing, but there's SEO, the things that people are like looking for, they do change, but that's why it's like makes sense to stay up on it.
• 36:15
  SPEAKER_01: But like Google, email, all the like fundamental things that people use don't go away.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: They're not going away.
• 36:22
  SPEAKER_01: So I think it's important to have that solid foundation, like we always talk about it, those sustainable strategies, those long-term strategies.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_01: They're gonna keep you top of mind for people, regardless of your capacity to create content and trending content.
• 36:36
  SPEAKER_02: I had a very disgusting metaphor of what Google is.
• 36:39
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, it's like a cockroach.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: Like if there's a nuclear bomb, like Google will still be on.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_01: But Google's always gonna survive for sure.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_02: What is one reflective question, one takeaway that you want our audience to get from this?
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, reflective question.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_02: It might be the same thing, by the way.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_01: Reflective question, I think, for me is like, where are people finding you?
• 37:00
  SPEAKER_01: Just think about that.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like, how are they finding you?
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_01: And you said takeaway.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_01: Takeaway.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know what?
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_01: I think this is a takeaway for everyone.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_01: Whether you have whether starting things is challenging for you or whether starting things is not challenging for you, whatever side of that spectrum you're on.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_01: You know, do a little bit of research.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think if you were gonna do research, like SEO is a big one, how your people are finding you, what they're searching for, but also not too much because you want to have fun and just like go for it.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I think you know, think about striking a balance of progress over perfection is cliche, but it's also true.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_01: We've made a lot of progress with this podcast that now we can build on with a little more uh data.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_02: So for me, one is be clear over clever.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_02: And then two, which is really hard for a lot of my clients when I share this with them, be unattached to the result.
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_02: And if you do make a mistake or it doesn't create the outcome that you wish you had, then reflect on it.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_02: Why didn't it happen?
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 38:03
  SPEAKER_02: So welcome to Real Talk.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yay, welcome.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: First episode.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_01: So exciting.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_01: I think we had some real talk in here for sure.
• 38:11
  SPEAKER_01: We didn't disappoint.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_00: We did not disappoint.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: Well, speaking of like self-promotion, if you want to work with both of us, Monica, how how can that happen?
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_02: Or what would what would they receive if they worked with both of us?
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 38:26
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, some seriously holistic strategy.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: But also, I think, I mean, I think we do a great job of of meeting you where you're at and not trying to stretch your capacity, but really helping you not do the most, but still get as much the most results.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_01: Because I think, you know, when it comes to most things, I know that less is more.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: So unless it's ad dollars sometimes, but we don't have to talk about that.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_01: But when it comes to marketing channels, you want to do less well instead of more not as well.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, an example of that, one of our clients, we updated their website for their membership and they converted like, oh my gosh, Elaine, Monica, like I got five new members this past week.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, Yeah, one simple change.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_01: Which besides, you know, the fee of hiring you, that was a that that that change had no cost.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_02: So it was very, very simple.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so if you want to work with both of us, go to elanelew.com forward slash call and you'll have a direct call with me to see if it's a good fit.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_02: And if it's not, that's cool.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_02: I'll refer you to other people.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_02: I'll just be real.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_02: And if you just, you know, don't want to have an open relationship with us two and you just want Monica, how can they be monogamous with you in a what relationship?
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, if if you're if you're looking for a freelance marketer for all your marketing needs, I can definitely help, especially email marketing and copywriting.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_01: You can find me at monicasrock.com.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_01: There's a few ways to work with me monthly or a one-time strategy session.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, hit me up on my website.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_02: And if this is your first episode with Monica, don't worry.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_02: Monica's gonna be You'll hear me again.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: She pitch like they pitched themselves like three episodes on this podcast.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, okay, fine.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: You you know what you don't get unless you ask what you want.
• 40:10
  SPEAKER_02: And Monica's an introvert.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_02: So if you haven't listened to the episode of, you know, how to thrive as an introvert in my podcast, go check that out.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_02: I'll put it in the show notes too.
• 40:19
  SPEAKER_01: Please do.
• 40:20
  SPEAKER_02: Well, Monica, thank you for your time.
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_01: Always.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_02: We'll see you in another episode.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: All right.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: Bye.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_02: I hope you learned from my mistakes by finding out how people are finding you and what are the words they are using to describe you.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_02: So you can edit your title and even the names of your own services, products, or maybe you have your own podcast.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_02: Remember, even though you're learning from my mistakes in this podcast episode, I cannot guarantee you are going to make your own mistakes.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, it's part of life.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_02: And if you found this episode helpful, here are four things you can do if you feel called to do them.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: Number one, share this with a friend who will benefit from learning from all my podcast mistakes.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: Number two, don't forget to hit that follow and subscribe button.
• 41:18
  SPEAKER_02: Because when you do, it lets the interwebs do their thing and let other women of color and allies know how important it is to listen to this podcast.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_02: Number three, if you feel called to do it, leave a five-star rating in review for the WC and Allies Business and Care Real Talk Podcast.
• 41:40
  SPEAKER_02: So more women of color and allies can create a sustainable life outside of their work.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_02: I created this Real Talk Podcast as a free resource for fellow women of color and allies because contribution is one of my top values.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_02: And fourth, if you would like to see how to work with me and my team to create a more sustainable business, career, and life that is aligned to your definition of success and no one else's, then schedule a complimentary legacy business and career review call at Elainelew.com forward slash call.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_02: That's E-L A I N E L O U dot com forward slash call.