Latest / The MindSets Podcast / Episode 44 - The Growth Game: Tom Murray on Wealth Management, Fitness, and Personal Growth

Transcript

Episode 44 - The Growth Game: Tom Murray on Wealth Management, Fitness, and Personal Growth · The MindSets Podcast

0:07
Hello and welcome back to another episode of The Mindset
0:10
Podcast. I'm your host Angus, and we've
0:13
been here now for 43 episodes so far, and you're now listening to
0:16
the 44th episode. On this podcast, we speak to
0:19
people from all different backgrounds that have got a bit
0:22
of an interest or a love for sport, fitness, exercise.
0:25
They may even do it for their career.
0:27
However, today I'm joined by someone who's got a little bit
0:29
of a different career yet still has the same interests.
0:31
So I'm going to hand over to Tom in a moment and he will do his
0:35
own introduction because I don't like to steal people's Thunder
0:37
and introduce them as someone they're actually not.
0:39
So, Tom, do you want to take over and introduce us to
0:42
yourself? Sure.
0:43
Yeah. Thank you very much for having
0:44
me, Angus. I've flown all the way from
0:45
Malaysia to be here. Especially so yeah my career as
0:48
I work in private wealth management in finance, which
0:51
generally just means I manage people's money for them.
0:54
But hobbies are pretty much all fitness related.
0:57
Gym, jiu jitsu, rock climbing in the past, and chess, although
1:01
I'm not sure that would count as a physical exercise.
1:03
Well, you never know. I mean, I'm I actually think I
1:06
suck at chess. I've not won a game, I don't
1:08
think, apart from maybe when I was playing someone really
1:10
young, when I was travelling Asia and I felt really bad about
1:12
it. Now, before we dive into Tom's
1:16
story, we do something slightly different on this podcast.
1:18
Where we do, I think we'll show and tell.
1:19
So show and tell, for those that don't know, is something that I
1:21
did when I was younger and I went to school.
1:23
You used to bring something in from home that you thought was
1:25
really cool and you would show it off to the class and you'd
1:27
tell them all about it. And the thing that I love about
1:29
that is it shows a bit of personality and it shows what
1:31
you're interested in. Now, every guest brings
1:34
something along and I don't know what it is.
1:36
And Tom's done the exact same. I was very fortunate because I
1:39
sprung this on him last minute. I forgot to remind him because
1:42
he's brought his whole life with him from Malaysia.
1:44
He was able to whip something out.
1:45
So what did you bring with you? I have decided to bust out the
1:51
suspenders. The reason being is you
1:53
mentioned something that I think is cool, and yeah, they get a
1:57
lot of love and a lot of hate. I think they're a very polarized
2:00
piece of clothing, but they should never have gone out of
2:02
fashion. They're a staple to any man's
2:04
suit. And yeah, bring them back.
2:06
I think I'm glad you bought these because I was actually
2:09
going to ask you a question about this anyway, but I've
2:12
never been able to pull them off.
2:14
I think it's because I'm shorter on the torso than I am on the
2:17
legs, so it makes me look even shorter.
2:19
However, those look very like strong and sturdy.
2:23
The ones that I was using beforehand also looked quite
2:25
thin and quite pathetic. But do you go beltless with
2:29
those? Yeah, beltless.
2:31
These will keep them up. You just got to make sure your
2:33
trousers aren't too baggy welling up around your armpit.
2:35
So you need a good fitting pair of trousers to pair with these.
2:38
And then they're also out to something that you can just fit
2:40
a with and. Fit a with that perfect place to
2:42
rest your thumbs if you want them to look pensive.
2:45
OK, which is something that we'll get onto, but you do look
2:48
a lot of the time in the social media post that I've seen of you
2:50
and that may have also contributed to some growth I.
2:53
Think so. I think people are just
2:54
following me for the suspenders. Oh, we'll see, we'll see.
2:58
It might not go quite so well in the horrible weather of the UK
3:01
walking around in the streets of London, but I'm glad you bought
3:04
them. And what we'll then do is we'll
3:06
spin back because I think there's quite a lot to cover.
3:09
Obviously now you are doing your own podcast, which I'm I've had
3:12
the pleasure of being invited on after this one, and we'll get to
3:16
kind of how you got there from wealth management and what
3:19
you're planning on doing going forward with that.
3:21
So one of the things we like to do is we like to start back
3:25
where it all began. Effectively, when we're younger,
3:28
we don't really think about the way that we we feel a lot of the
3:31
time. Fortunately, we don't have to
3:33
when we're young, but we do seem to recognize when we liked
3:37
starting to be active, what sort of sports we were involved in
3:40
and where that love came from. So where did things start for
3:43
you? I'm assuming it was in the UK.
3:46
It was so grew up in the UK and was here up until around 18 and
3:52
I would say it probably started with the gym around 1617.
3:55
I played a little bit of football growing up but that was
3:57
never a real passion. And then some of my friends
4:00
started getting into the gym. I saw some very small results
4:04
but pretty quickly and it taught me that your body is malleable.
4:08
You can training and you can change it because you see
4:11
someone that's big and muscly, you just kind of assume they are
4:13
a big and a muscly person, right?
4:15
You don't think that person is in shape right now.
4:17
But it taught me that I had the ability to change my body and my
4:21
physique. And so that started about a 13
4:24
year journey of fitness and body dysmorphia.
4:27
Yeah, I was going to say the body dysmorphia kicks in pretty
4:29
quickly when you're young because again, because you don't
4:32
really know what you're doing necessarily.
4:34
I mean, I don't know, I'm speaking from my experience.
4:35
I went to the gym and I didn't want to go with anyone because
4:38
of the self-conscious, but also I didn't want to be taught any
4:42
bad habits. I couldn't afford a coach
4:44
because I was like 1516 when I started going.
4:47
And so things were growing at very different rates.
4:49
Like I've always, I still, to be fair, to this day think I
4:52
neglect my arms because I'm too busy trying to care about the
4:55
other things. But I remember noticing that my
4:58
shoulders grew quite quickly and then my chest didn't.
5:01
And I was trying to handle all this.
5:02
And like you said, body dysmorphia started when you kind
5:06
of got into it and you were noticing these, I guess,
5:08
beginner gains. Were you thinking like
5:10
bodybuilding is for me, that's what I'm going to do?
5:13
Or was it just like, this is cool, I like this, I like the
5:15
way I look. I guess it never felt like
5:18
bodybuilding in the sense of I never wanted to be on stage, I
5:21
never wanted to compete, I never wanted to get absolutely jacked
5:25
to the hilt. I just liked the fact that I
5:29
grew up as a skinny kid and I was more confident and probably
5:32
too confident. So I remember 3 months in, like
5:34
my girlfriend at the time was stood there while and tense and
5:36
in the mirror and saying look how big I am.
5:39
And I probably gained like 2 kilos of lean muscle mass.
5:41
But just that feeling. And then I think he just became
5:45
a habit that I built on. But it hasn't been a vertical
5:49
journey. It's been very much train for
5:52
six months, stop for three months, train for two years,
5:55
stop for six months and so on. So over the course of my adult
5:59
life, I have had probably 3-4 years worth of periods where I
6:03
wasn't training. But when you set that bar for
6:05
yourself of you know what you're capable of looking like and then
6:08
you let yourself slip below your own standards, it's only a
6:12
matter of time before you're looking in the mirror and you
6:14
know it's not body dysmorphia talking.
6:16
You know, you have let yourself get severely out of shape and
6:18
you need to sort your shit out. And I've been there a few times.
6:21
And the longer you leave it, the harder it is to get back into it
6:24
again. And I think now is probably the
6:26
longest stint that I've ever had of consistently training.
6:29
I think it's been about three years now without missing more
6:31
than a couple of weeks in the gym.
6:33
So yeah, almost an upward. It takes a lot to get there and
6:36
I think one of the things that I always find really interesting
6:38
when I have taken a break from training, whether that's been
6:40
forced by injury or if that's been just because I I need a
6:43
break or I need to change the way that I'm training is, is
6:47
extremely humbling. When you first go back,
6:49
everything feels way heavier than it should.
6:51
But what what is nice is you do get back to the level you are at
6:55
much quicker. And one of the things that I'd
6:57
find interesting from your side, I think personally that comes
7:01
from the confidence in the when it comes to like bench press.
7:04
If we take that as an example, I think for the rest of my life,
7:07
hopefully I will always be able to venture 100 kilos because
7:10
I've done it before. But before I benched 100 kilos,
7:14
I was definitely strong enough to do it, but I couldn't do it.
7:17
And I've now had it where I've broken my wrist.
7:19
I had, I think I was out for two months and when I came back, it
7:22
took me two sessions before I was able to bench 100 kilos
7:24
again. And like I shouldn't have been
7:26
able to in comparison to the journey that it took me to get
7:28
there in the 1st place. But I think it's a mental
7:31
confidence thing. Other people just say it's much
7:34
memory. Do you find the same sort of
7:37
thing? I wish I had the scientific
7:39
background to be able to, to be able to give you a solid answer
7:42
on that. I think it's an element of both
7:44
because definitely once you know you're capable of moving
7:47
something, then you feel a lot more comfortable and you can do
7:50
it. And I do think muscle memory is
7:51
a part because your body, when you first unrack, you know, 100
7:55
kilos off the bench, you're shaking, you're not even sure
7:58
and you're thinking, am I about to die as you pull this down
8:01
where when you've done it before, you say you've got that
8:03
confidence that, you know, you can get that up.
8:04
But I think definitely a bit of both.
8:06
Sure. So let's talk about this
8:07
confidence grew it well where it grew.
8:10
So starts going to the gym, got a bit of this confidence and
8:14
this would have been around the time that you were late in
8:16
school. So in the UK you then usually
8:20
move on to things like college, sixth form, maybe university
8:23
afterwards. What were you up to while you
8:25
were kind of beginning on this fitness journey?
8:28
So fitness started for me just in college, so just out of
8:30
school and I probably trained for around 6:00 or so months
8:34
while I was still in college. And after that I went travelling
8:38
and I couldn't have gone to Uni 18.
8:41
My head was all over the place. And I went back and picked that
8:45
up at 25, which was a much better idea because I actually
8:47
passed with a decent grade, whereas I definitely would have
8:49
dropped out before. But then whilst I've been
8:52
travelling, obviously if you're living in places like Australia
8:54
and New Zealand, Thailand, where you've got your top off half the
8:58
time, it's good to be in shape. Because it's not just a case of
9:01
how other people perceive you, but it's also the case of how
9:04
you perceive yourself and in turn then how you behave, which
9:08
causes other people to interact with you in a certain way,
9:11
right? So it's not just based about
9:12
what they see in your physique, it's about how you carry
9:15
yourself. Sure.
9:16
And so you went travelling, so did you make sure that you were
9:20
training while you're travelling or did you kind of give yourself
9:22
a rest until you came back from travelling?
9:24
So travelling was seven years for me from 18 to 25.
9:27
So this is the period where I was talking about where you, I'd
9:29
stop in one place, I'd train for a bit, then I'd be on the road
9:32
and I wouldn't train for, you know, sometimes up to six
9:34
months. And it comes off quickly.
9:37
Like that hard work that it takes to build a physique, it
9:40
will go very quickly if you're not using it.
9:43
I think it takes about two weeks for muscle atrophy to start from
9:46
not using it, and then it will just snowball from that point.
9:49
And obviously, if you're not training, then your diet is
9:51
probably not as good either. You're probably picking up other
9:53
bad habits like drinking booze, eating junk food.
9:57
I find that a healthy lifestyle comes all-encompassing because
10:00
if you're training, your body demands the nutrients that it
10:02
needs, so you then eat right. If you're training, you're
10:05
focused on that. So you don't want to hangover
10:07
because you will see your entire next week's performance go down
10:10
the drain. But yeah, as soon as you've kind
10:12
of let one of them fall aside, then the rest of your life can
10:15
kind of kind of unravel as well. So yeah, I it was definitely an
10:19
up and down journey over those seven years, but while
10:21
travelling periods of gains and periods of eating a lot of shit
10:25
and looking like it as well. So 7 years is a beautiful amount
10:30
of time for me to think about being away.
10:32
But then you didn't stay in the same place as you mentioned a
10:36
few different countries there. I assume you were working while
10:39
you're away, but what were you doing for that entire time?
10:43
Because to me while that also sounds great because it sounds
10:45
like a holiday when you think of travelling, but it obviously
10:48
wasn't. Must have been quite lonely as
10:51
well at times. Definitely, definitely big
10:54
periods of that. And I had periods where I
10:56
travelled with friends that I made and I had periods where I
10:58
travelled by myself. And I still think that the
11:00
periods that I travelled by myself were the best for me
11:02
because then you, you have to find other people.
11:05
You build new connections and new relationships because you
11:07
haven't got that one person that you can lean on.
11:10
But of course, there have been periods where it's been
11:12
extremely lonely. And whenever you move to a new
11:14
place by yourself, you might make friends pretty quickly.
11:17
You know people you have a good time with, but it takes a long
11:19
time to build an emotional bond and a trust with someone so that
11:23
you feel like you have a good connection there.
11:26
And for me in Malaysia, it wasn't until, you know, the last
11:30
few months of being there that I felt like I had that.
11:32
And it takes time to get there in every place that you go and
11:35
to build it. So when you left the UK as well,
11:37
I think one of the most notable things that must have happened
11:39
in this time is not just learning a bit more about
11:42
yourself as you go around, making as many friends as
11:44
possible as you also go around, but wealth management, learning
11:48
about money. You must have done that while
11:50
you're on the move. How did that all happen?
11:51
So that I did kind of retrench back to the UK to do the
11:56
majority of that, but it stemmed from something that happened
11:59
while I was travelling. So I was working in various
12:02
things throughout the most part. I had a few different careers
12:04
that I tried my hand at from being a barman, bouncer.
12:08
He was a professional poker player for a couple of years.
12:11
Yeah, it's good. And then when I was 22 or 23I
12:16
inherited a decent amount of money, which should have, it
12:20
should have seen me through for a long time, but I pissed it up
12:23
the wall effectively. And when you have money and then
12:28
all of a sudden you don't, it leaves you wondering, you know,
12:31
what went wrong. And I felt shell shocked and I
12:34
never had any of the understanding that I needed to,
12:36
to invest that. And an interesting thing, I, I
12:39
worked out if I'd put that in the S&P 508 years ago when I'd
12:43
received it, it'd currently be worth 150 grand today.
12:46
So that you know, that's a house and I blew it in a year.
12:50
So it's. You went well, it sounds a bit
12:52
like poker, really like it. I mean, I'm not saying that you
12:55
did it with poker, but that kind of betting with the money hoping
12:59
that you can enjoy this for the for the rest of your life, but
13:02
in reality in hindsight probably wouldn't have done the same.
13:06
Thing yeah, I I just blew it. You know, you came into money as
13:09
a young, some of my young 20s was in the bit bit of a party
13:13
phase at that time. And see, I didn't invest any of
13:16
it. I didn't save any of it.
13:17
I didn't carry on working because I thought I've got more
13:19
money than I need, you know. So that was a stimulant for me.
13:24
It led to me being quite unhappy when that money ran out.
13:28
I was pretty depressed. And that wasn't just because of
13:31
the money. There was also other things like
13:33
it made me fat and lazy because I hadn't needed to work, which
13:36
then resulted in other bad habits as well.
13:39
So All in all, it was quite a bad thing for me at the time.
13:43
But of course when you hit rock bottom you then bounce back and
13:46
I've since learnt from it and yeah, now I make a career out of
13:50
trying to stop other people making the same mistakes.
13:52
Which I think is really cool and that is effectively, I guess the
13:55
point of my podcast, but also the point of your podcast is to
13:58
try and help people not make errors that we have both made,
14:03
but also kind of share knowledge from people or even learn
14:06
ourselves. Because I appreciate well, on
14:07
your podcast, you have some guests which are dropping
14:09
knowledge bombs that I couldn't even think of knowing about and
14:12
people that have made like $60 million is not.
14:16
So I think that's one of the really positive things that can
14:19
come out of a situation like that is when you get yourself
14:21
out of the situation, you know, you tend to do it with people's
14:24
help and you then obviously want to give back.
14:27
So when you went down this journey of financial and wealth
14:31
management, you recently, more recently found yourself actually
14:36
in Malaysia doing that. Moving to Malaysia, interesting
14:40
place to be place. I have visited Kuala Lumpur for
14:43
three days on an extended layover.
14:46
Thought it was an amazing place. It was very nice for me at the
14:48
time. This is unnecessary waffle of
14:50
context, but I've been travelling around Southeast Asia
14:52
for ages and this is really really bad.
14:55
We did try Malaysian food, but when myself and my girlfriend
14:58
got there, we saw Five Guys in Kuala Lumpur and Nando's and
15:05
there was one other place. Oh, Shake Shack.
15:08
Wow, we just out at those three places for the entire time we're
15:12
there, apart from a few traditional little street food
15:15
spots. But obviously that doesn't
15:17
really give me a fair representation of Malaysia.
15:19
So what's it like going there, living there, working there?
15:23
I think it's a great place to live.
15:25
I think if you're just looking for a quick holiday, Kuala
15:27
Lumpur especially probably isn't the best place to visit because
15:29
there's a couple of big tourist traps and you apart from that,
15:33
you don't really get a good feel for the city.
15:34
It's not a big party city. You'd be much better off going
15:37
to Thailand or somewhere like that if you're looking to just
15:39
go for a big piss up. But it's a great place to live
15:43
because it is a place in Asia where you get the benefits of
15:46
the weather, the cheap cost of living, the friendly people, but
15:49
you also have a good degree of westernisation there.
15:51
So you've got your creature comforts from home, as you say
15:54
you, you've got your big brands there and and everyone speaks
15:58
English. So it's definitely a good place
16:00
to start if you're looking to live and work somewhere in Asia.
16:02
Awesome. Or what I've seen of your work
16:06
is obviously probably not fair representation of your work.
16:09
So I'm aware that yourself and your colleague have a fairly
16:13
special friendship effectively. I mean, some people listening to
16:16
this will want to ask the question of is it more than just
16:19
a friendship, but a social media following developed because she
16:23
was able to get some nice angles of you while you were just
16:26
trying to do your job. You know, you were just trying
16:28
to be a professional in the workplace.
16:29
But please tell me how this all happened.
16:33
Sure. So yeah, that is jury you're
16:36
referring to. And she has become one of my
16:38
best friends. She is a bit of a social media
16:41
influencer herself. She's got a quarter of a million
16:43
followers on Instagram and so she'd had a background in it and
16:47
she asked me within my second or third day of working at the
16:50
company if she could film me and put me on TikTok.
16:54
Now she's one of these people, and I'm sure we've all met them
16:56
that are just so outspoken. Like whatever thought comes into
16:59
their mind, they will just say and crazy, but so lovable at the
17:02
same time. And she said that to me and I
17:04
was like, why? She's like, I just feel like
17:06
it's got viral potential and I think straight away it kind of
17:10
alarmed me because I've never been big on social media and I'd
17:13
actually had quite a rough journey to start off with it.
17:16
You, you're similar age to me. You'd be around when Bebo came
17:19
out, right? Yeah, so I I wanted it, but then
17:23
my sister, my older sister had it and she was just like, I'm
17:26
not letting you have it. I wasn't allowed it.
17:28
And there was also Myspace as well, which I wasn't allowed.
17:31
Your sister did you a favour, so Bebo was absolutely cutthroat
17:35
looking back at it. So I'd just moved to schools and
17:37
got to a new place. I'd moved to Cornwall's.
17:40
It was six hours from where I was from, just as Bieber came
17:42
out and Biebo was publicizing your popularity.
17:46
You had your best friends in order, I think you could see.
17:50
Remember that it was wild. It caused so many arguments in
17:53
like any household. I think you could see, you know
17:56
how many people's best friends you were, how you ranked and
17:59
everything. So it was literally just
18:00
displaying your popularity or lack of.
18:03
And I remember joining it and wasn't particularly popular at
18:06
the time and just thinking this sucks.
18:08
Like it, it hurt. And when Bebo sort of died, I
18:11
was very thankful and I never joined my Myspace when that sort
18:14
of took over. Then Facebook came out and
18:17
everyone started talking about Facebook and I was like, I'm not
18:19
playing this stupid game again. So I waited.
18:21
I think I held off on Facebook for about two years when
18:23
everyone else was on it. And eventually I caved and I
18:26
joined that and again, didn't have a lot of friends on there
18:29
liking my posts because I joined it so late and it just generally
18:33
wasn't that popular growing up and so it wasn't too keen on
18:37
that. Then Instagram came out and I
18:38
was like no, not doing it until is 3 years ago I think I got
18:42
Instagram. So I held off on that for about
18:43
10 years whilst that was popular and then again until I went to
18:47
Malaysia, I had 200 followers on Instagram.
18:50
So I really had a self-confidence issue with
18:53
social media. And when Julia said that to me
18:55
immediately I kind of retreated to that in a citadel of
18:58
boycotting social media because I've never had a good time on
19:00
it. When she posted it, I thought
19:03
she meant on her own TikTok. I thought to create a TikTok
19:07
just to post a video of me on was absolutely mental.
19:09
But I think within a week it had gone viral and had a million
19:12
views and I was sat behind her in the office and she was
19:15
refreshing her phone. I still didn't have the app, I'd
19:17
never had TikTok. And every 5 minutes we had like
19:20
another 100,000 views and it was just going crazy and people just
19:23
commenting such like over the top nice things that I never
19:28
would have thought about myself, right?
19:29
I, I would have described myself as a fairly mid guy and it was
19:34
just getting a lot of attention which I couldn't get my head
19:35
around. And so we saw that it was on to
19:38
something. I still maintain that it was
19:40
just kind of the niche of the suit and the suspenders in a big
19:42
part as well. But yeah, we just rolled with it
19:45
to see where it went and it was here we are.
19:47
I think so. This is something that I want to
19:51
talk about actually, and it's not really coming to an episode
19:54
beforehand, but based off starting a podcast, making a lot
19:58
of the content and starting to understand having met other
20:01
people like yourself that are now kind of involved in the
20:05
social media world. When I watch a video, I'm not
20:09
really watching it as a standard consumer.
20:11
Because any time I see a video do well or I like something
20:14
that's in a video, I'm watching it from almost like an editor
20:17
sort of perspective where I'm like, how do they do that?
20:20
Why is that video getting that engagement?
20:22
What about this video is supposed to make me feel this
20:24
way? Which is a pretty weird way.
20:26
And it's quite annoying as well because it means that I can't
20:28
necessarily just enjoy a cool video for just the fact that
20:31
it's cool. One of the things that jumps out
20:33
when I watch some of the videos that were put up is you come
20:37
across, and I wonder if people listening to this will agree,
20:41
it's almost like the James Bond, the international man of mystery
20:46
working abroad in the suit and clearly got a good relationship
20:50
with the person who's filming him.
20:51
Like, what's that dynamic? The whole thing's quite
20:54
intriguing. And then you've obviously got
20:56
the followers. They're just like, you know,
20:58
your aesthetic and want to see more of that.
21:01
But I think that's kind of what jumps out.
21:02
And I think because it is, like you said, crazy to think that
21:06
someone's just going to start a tick tock account.
21:08
That's just a view. But ultimately it's one of those
21:11
industry shifting movements which which was made.
21:16
But what is it like being the candid person by the camera?
21:20
And I'm going to ask you honestly, is it all candid?
21:24
It's not all candid. No, it was to start off with and
21:28
but then we had the the situation.
21:30
We couldn't just keep posting the same thing over and over
21:32
again. So then Juria started coming to
21:34
me with TikTok trends, which obviously that's less candid.
21:37
We're going through those. And then we did things like the
21:41
charity fundraise, forgetting me to say good girl, which was a
21:46
very traumatic experience in the last.
21:48
But it, it's been a, it's been a journey and it's been points
21:54
where it's been extremely stressful and I've wanted to
21:56
pull the plug on the whole thing.
21:58
It's caused me and Julia to fall out on a couple of occasions.
22:01
Like we are really good friends and then the next day we're OK.
22:04
But it can just raise the stress levels quite a lot.
22:06
And she's obviously very comfortable saying whatever and
22:09
putting whatever out there. But for me, I have this trauma
22:12
that I haven't addressed of social media in the past.
22:15
And I've been, she's been having to hold my hand to sort of guide
22:18
me through this and get me more comfortable.
22:20
And part of starting the podcast was thinking, you know, I'm
22:23
going to address this. I'm going to focus on putting
22:25
things out there and burying myself to the world.
22:28
But yeah, as you say, that international amount of mystery,
22:31
I was terrified of opening my mouth.
22:32
And jury was like, we want to put your voice out there.
22:34
And I was like, no, I didn't want to show anything.
22:36
You know, I was like, just leave the bit that they like.
22:37
I don't want to ruin it when they realize how goofy I am when
22:40
I actually say something. Well, I think something that's
22:42
quite nice about it and I think you're doing the right
22:44
approaches. I also, when I first started
22:47
podcasting, I found it deeply weird talking into a microphone,
22:52
found it incredibly strange having a camera pointed at me.
22:55
The classic thing of I don't even like the way that I sound.
22:58
And then it's like anything. If you have struggled with
23:01
public speaking before, this is an extremely micro dose version
23:03
of public speaking because it is you and I in this room alone.
23:06
I don't know how many people are listening, but they're not here
23:09
right now. And you kind of begin to break
23:12
that barrier down and build this confidence, which it sounds
23:15
like, as you said, your hand was held a little bit through.
23:18
But it gets to a point now where I mean, we we were just able to
23:22
sit down and start discussing, which I mean, go back to some of
23:26
the earlier episodes of this we did needed quite a few takes.
23:29
Maybe the guests themselves, because I seem nervous is also a
23:33
little bit nervous, that kind of thing.
23:35
And I definitely think it's something that it takes a
23:38
personality to be able to get used to it.
23:41
But at the same time, the more and more you do that sort of
23:43
thing, the more and more you're able to come across.
23:45
And the positive feedback you get from it always helps.
23:49
Now, you don't always get positive feedback.
23:52
I have also listened to one of your life update episodes that
23:56
you did where you were talking about the fact that you're
23:59
leaving Malaysia, you've lost 7000 followers and you're OK
24:03
with it. I want to talk to you a little
24:05
bit about this because I think it's a really, really important
24:08
thing. We will go back to kind of
24:10
sorting your life out, that kind of thing.
24:12
But you've got a bit more of a clear direction for yourself.
24:16
I feel at the moment and normally for the social media
24:20
game, losing 7000 followers, no matter how big you are, it's
24:25
still going to be felt to a degree.
24:27
For me, that would mean I'd be negative numbers, which would be
24:31
really impressive. But from your side, it's because
24:35
you want to actually start giving a bit more of your
24:39
knowledge and who you are, which is probably why it's OK that
24:44
you're losing those followers. Yeah, it's coming from a point
24:48
of privilege because you've done it the hard way, right?
24:52
You've built up a podcast without a gifted platform.
24:55
You've had to do the hard graft of starting with zero following
24:58
right and earning it. I was born with a silver spoon
25:02
in my mouth in the social media space, so to speak, because Jury
25:05
effectively gifted me a platform.
25:08
Now that platform was gifted to me from being that just
25:12
international man of mystery. I'm using your own quote,
25:13
though. That's not my handle.
25:16
But then, you know, when I start opening my mouth and revealing
25:19
more about myself, these people create some kind of fantasy
25:23
about what they see in the TikTok, which isn't me.
25:26
And the more I reveal about myself, the more those fantasies
25:29
kind of fall apart. And I remember the first reel
25:32
that I posted, which was a snippet of my podcast.
25:34
And the first comment was, oh, no, he's a dull man.
25:37
And a lot of people are going to think that, right?
25:40
Because if they are someone that gets a lot of enjoyment from
25:43
just silly first trap tik toks, not kicking them at all.
25:46
I've had a lot of fun doing them.
25:47
And I think they are funny in a lot of ways, but they're a
25:50
different thing. And there there's not a
25:53
correlation between that and between deep, insightful podcast
25:57
conversations, right? There are going to be people
25:59
that enjoy both, but I think that's going to be pure purely
26:02
by chance rather than a correlation.
26:06
So when they followed me, for one thing, they just want first
26:08
traps and trends. And then I'm like, no, here's an
26:12
hour long conversation of me talking about mental health or
26:16
perimenopause. There are going to be people
26:18
that drop off, right? And I'm OK with it.
26:22
Cognitively, you think about it and you can logically explain
26:25
why it's happening. But of course, at the at the
26:28
time as it's happening, you are thinking, am I right about this,
26:31
that there are going to be people that enjoy what I'm
26:33
doing? Or is this my podcast a shit and
26:37
people aren't interested? I'm backing myself that I will,
26:42
you know, whittle away the ones that aren't there for that kind
26:45
of content and then start building up ones that are.
26:48
But yeah, I think I say it comes from a point of privilege
26:51
because I got given that platform in the beginning and
26:54
some of them aren't going to be interested in that.
26:56
I do think it is still an easier way to do it, but it is an
26:59
interesting mental dynamic trying to cope with it, right?
27:02
Big time. I think one of the things that I
27:03
have learned, so I'm fortunate enough through networking,
27:06
especially with the podcast, that I've now made some really
27:09
good relationships and friendships with people that
27:12
have a good following and it means a lot to them.
27:15
But if you speak to any of the people with a large following,
27:19
they will be genuinely honest about the following they've
27:23
cultivated. Not in terms of if they like
27:26
them or not because they might not know them, but they
27:28
appreciate massively that their following is actually engaged or
27:32
not. There are a lot of people that
27:34
you will go on their profile and you'll see they have hundreds of
27:37
thousands of followers. And it's an interesting thing if
27:41
I've spoken to any of them, because they may put things on
27:45
their story with slider bars and ways to interact.
27:48
And the percentage of view of interaction from the viewers of
27:51
the story is like 0.001%. And then you go to someone
27:57
that's got maybe half the amount of followers, but actively gives
28:02
value to their followers. You know, they're, they're
28:04
talking about things they understand, they're trying to
28:06
educate their followers. They may put a very similar sort
28:09
of post up and the engagement numbers wise and percentage wise
28:13
is embarrassing the other person.
28:16
And I think one of the issues with things like thirst wraps is
28:20
not, again, that they're a bad thing.
28:22
And it's very much a good way of building a following.
28:25
But at the same time, it is not representative of you as a
28:30
personality, as an individual of your own intelligence as well
28:32
and what your knowledge base is. It opens the door for a fantasy
28:37
of what someone wants to attach to you.
28:38
And when you don't fit that puzzle piece with your
28:41
personality, when you start coming through with it, you're
28:43
obviously going to get the negativity.
28:44
We're going to lose the followers.
28:46
But it's like I said, you would far rather, I would imagine,
28:50
have people that are interested, want to learn from you because
28:54
that gives more back to you knowing that your impact is felt
28:59
than uploading something and people enjoying it for one
29:02
reason or another and not really understanding really why.
29:05
And I think it's a bit of a journey that a lot of people
29:07
have to go on to really understand.
29:10
And there's the cliche phrase of what's your niche?
29:12
I actually don't like that because I think people think
29:16
about it as like what makes me individual?
29:18
Well, by actually being on the planet you, you've got some
29:22
things about you which no one else has.
29:24
And just being honest and open about your experiences in your
29:27
journey makes your niche. I don't think you need to find
29:31
one thing that people need to be interested in you about.
29:33
I think you can be you and what people will buy into is why they
29:36
buy in and they stay. But I'm interested to know
29:40
moving forward, what's your kind of, I don't, I don't want to say
29:43
strategy, but like what's your thinking for what you want to
29:46
offer back to those that stay and those that are newcomers?
29:50
Really good question. For me, the podcast is the
29:54
biggest thing. It's a passion project so it's
29:56
not something I'm looking to make a living out of or
29:58
monetize. I have a decent career already
30:01
and I have some other side forms of income as well, so I'm OK on
30:05
that front. But podcast helped me through
30:08
some of my toughest times and as I say, I grew up fairly
30:12
unpopular in school because I was different and I didn't fit
30:15
in with that group. Listening to podcasts, you can
30:18
find people that you can tell or like you.
30:20
They're talking about things that resonate with you and their
30:22
conversations that it can take a lot of courage to just pluck up
30:26
with someone in your own personal life.
30:29
So it made me feel seen and I wanted to be able to keep
30:31
replicating that and to meet more amazing people through it.
30:35
So that's what I want to shift my social media towards.
30:37
I don't really have a desire to be an influencer.
30:40
It's been nice having some attention and it's it's
30:45
definitely been good. Probably bad for the ego as well
30:48
on both parts, but that's what I want to do.
30:51
I just want to lean towards sort of turning my social media into
30:53
more podcast material and then maybe post snippets of my own
30:57
life on there as well. I think that's the natural way
31:01
to go, especially because it becomes a more sustainable
31:04
thing. Like you said, when you were no
31:07
longer candid. More stress happens because you
31:10
actually have to start putting more effort into developing this
31:14
thing which isn't naturally you. And I think one of the things
31:16
that I have personally found when it comes to the podcast and
31:19
what I bring from my own story into a podcast, or if I'm making
31:23
a video on my own personal social media, the ones that I
31:28
have to, I feel like I'm making to benefit other people or
31:32
that's what people be interested in.
31:33
Take probably 5 to 10 times as long to write and edit and make
31:37
than something that is straight off the calf from the heart
31:41
actually is relatable and understandable.
31:43
And it takes the most the the doesn't take the most effort.
31:47
It actually is the opposite. It takes the least effort.
31:50
So I think that's particularly interesting.
31:52
But you've discovered all of this by doing it all you've
31:55
started. And that's the hardest thing
31:57
that people find is everyone thinks that it's going to be
32:01
perfect. You've got to have this clear
32:02
direction. And the way we actually met was
32:04
through a mutual friend who put me in contact with you about how
32:09
to start a podcast. And I think one of the things
32:11
that people that maybe new to this podcast don't realize is
32:17
this whole thing has been pretty bootstrapped from the beginning.
32:20
Because for me, it was a commitment where I was like, I'm
32:23
doing this and I'm just going to start and I'll figure out on the
32:26
way. So the first episode, none of
32:28
these microphones, I was, I was recording off the most random
32:32
things, plugging them into whatever they would record into
32:35
laptops, old laptops, old phones that just about held enough
32:39
charge for a 30 minute episode, that kind of thing.
32:42
And I made it work. And then gradually I've I've
32:44
upgraded things so that it can be a bit better.
32:47
And that will continue happening until hopefully one day.
32:49
It's this whole professional thing.
32:52
But one of the things that I loved about our first attraction
32:55
was that you were so keen for that.
32:57
You were like, I just want to start this thing.
32:59
And when I was talking to you, it was very clear, like you had
33:02
that mentality. Why did?
33:05
Why did you have that mentality? Because I hadn't had it before.
33:10
And I think when you let yourself down once, you don't do
33:14
it again. I was in London yesterday.
33:16
I was sat in a coffee shop window and I saw Magnus Carlsen
33:22
crossing the road to the other side.
33:23
Who, for those of you on It's chess, is the best chess player
33:25
in the world? And I was starstruck.
33:28
I was like, oh, my God. And I watched him go with his
33:31
floppy hair, walked away. And I was straight like, why
33:35
didn't I go and say say hello? But in that moment, I was
33:37
starstruck and I didn't. And then I was sat there
33:39
thinking, if he comes back this way, I'm dropping whatever I'm
33:43
doing. And I'm going to say you're a
33:45
genius. I just want to shake you by the
33:46
hand and good to meet you. I didn't get that chance.
33:49
He didn't come back. Around two years ago, I decided
33:54
I wanted to start a podcast. I did a load of the research.
33:57
I was about ready to go. I told all of my friends that I
34:00
was going to do it perhaps too much because I gave myself all
34:02
the mental masturbation of I'm going to be a podcaster.
34:05
And I never pulled the trigger. And I think again, due to that
34:08
self rooted fear of social media and people taking the piss out
34:11
of me and, you know, failing in public, when this social media
34:16
thing happened with Juria and gave me a platform, I was like,
34:20
I'm not going to, I've got no excuses now.
34:23
Like I've got a reasonable enough following that I've got a
34:26
lucky unfair advantage in this game.
34:28
Now I've got a head start that it would be rude to waste.
34:30
And I remember Juria saying to me before I, we released the
34:34
first episode I did with her saying, you sure you don't want
34:36
to build up a few, you know, so that you don't run behind or run
34:39
out. And I was like, I just need to
34:41
get this first one done. And once I've got the first one
34:44
done, I just need to keep going. So I think it was because it
34:47
wasn't my first time setting myself up for this challenge.
34:51
And I've been disappointed with myself for a couple of years.
34:54
One of my best mates who I've known since I was a kid.
34:58
And you know, we trained in the gym together, we traveled
35:00
together. When I told him I was going to
35:02
do the podcast, he was like, sure, mate.
35:05
And that feeling of I've lost credibility with my friend
35:12
because I've said that I'm going to do it.
35:14
I said I was going to do it before and I didn't.
35:16
So when I said to him this time, like, right, I'm doing the
35:18
podcast, he was like, sure, mate, like you've said this
35:20
before and you haven't. And I hated that he, he's a good
35:26
friend in the sense he makes me feel like shit about myself when
35:28
I need to feel like shit about myself.
35:30
And we went to university together, both of us at 25.
35:33
And I was struggling one weekend.
35:35
And he walked into my room and the, my room was a mess.
35:38
It was 2:00 in the afternoon. I was still in bed watching
35:41
Netflix. And he just looked, you know,
35:43
what is this? And that's what I needed in that
35:47
moment. I needed a friend to come in and
35:49
not be like, you know, pretend it's OK.
35:52
It's like, no, you're being a piece of shit.
35:53
Like get up and sort it out. So a couple occasions he's done
35:57
that for me. And yeah, the podcast was one of
35:59
them. So him saying that wasn't right.
36:01
I'm doing this thing right now and when I spoke to you, I just
36:04
had that fire under my arse around.
36:05
I'm not letting myself down twice.
36:07
So here we are. There we go.
36:08
I think it's actually it's not directly from me wanting to
36:11
start podcast beforehand, but I have, I have started a number of
36:14
things and then just like not gone through them for one reason
36:18
or another or tried to pre plan too much stuff.
36:21
And this was exactly the same. It was like I've said, I'm going
36:25
to do this, I've said I'm going to do other stuff and I'm just
36:28
tired of quitting. And so unfortunately for those
36:31
that I mean, they're probably not still following, but if
36:34
anyone was waiting for me to stop doing this, well, unluckily
36:38
for you, I've committed. And so we're there now.
36:41
We have had a few people write in to do some questions because
36:45
that's another thing that we like to do.
36:46
We have a few more sections to cover on this podcast.
36:49
So listen to questions before I record an episode, I'd like to
36:54
put up a bit of information, some possible topics, and also
36:57
potentially share who's coming on to allow you guys to ask
37:00
questions directly to that guest.
37:02
You can use me as a passive way to get the the voice in there,
37:06
but it also gives a chance for the guests following to come in
37:09
and ask some more direct questions that they're
37:11
interested in that they may not be able to normally reach out to
37:14
you on. So we have three kind of a
37:17
fourth question that we'll run through.
37:20
And I just want to apologize in advance for me attempting
37:24
people's names because I'm going off your Instagram.
37:27
I'm going to probably say the handle.
37:28
I'm probably going to say it wrong.
37:30
Please don't be offended. I'm just trying my best.
37:33
So the first question is kind of from two people, the original
37:40
wording, and then there's a bit of A tag on from someone else as
37:42
well. So how do you find your path if
37:46
you're unsure of your direction in your 20s?
37:47
And that one comes from Natas Shepardier I'm going to go with.
37:53
But also there was a comment on top of that from Ellie, who says
37:56
she's also found herself in a in a bit of a rut around the age of
38:00
25 S again in 20s. But how do you find your path,
38:04
and how do you get out of that rut?
38:06
That's good because that's one of the things that I'm quite
38:09
passionate about as well, and I'm trying not to stray too far
38:11
out of my lane. As in, I'm the finance guy
38:13
that's already branching into podcasting.
38:15
But one of the things that I feel like I have to offer the
38:18
world, which I'm doing inadvertently through the
38:19
podcasting and some financial education, is trying to help
38:23
people find direction in their 20s.
38:24
Because as I mentioned to you, at 25, I was unemployed,
38:28
uneducated, unfit, broke, and I had to go back to university at
38:33
25 and address all of the other things at once.
38:36
And I was depressed because I didn't see a light at the end of
38:39
the tunnel. All of my life just felt like a
38:41
mess and I couldn't find a direction I wanted to pull in.
38:45
One of the podcasts I listened to, it was Jordan Peterson on
38:49
there, and I know he's a controversial figure.
38:50
I've been receiving some hate for dropping in one of my
38:53
previous episodes. But the man is incredibly
38:56
intelligent and one of the things that he said is just pick
39:00
something and do it. You're not going to know your
39:03
passion if you haven't done it. You're not going to see a
39:07
banker. I think, oh, I love banking.
39:09
Like, it's just not going to happen in anything like that.
39:12
So you're going to have to try things and you're going to have
39:14
to fail, and then you're going to have to try again at
39:16
something else. But from a point of education
39:18
and experience, I tried playing poker professionally and that
39:22
failed. I was a hospitality manager, I
39:26
was a doorman, I was a jujitsu coach.
39:29
I failed all of those. They never became my real
39:32
career. And then I found something that
39:34
was OK, this fits with me. I like advising people, I like
39:37
numbers, I like money. This fit into everything that I
39:41
wanted to do. Just keep making making inroads
39:46
in different things until you find something that's
39:49
worthwhile. 1 caveat I would say to that is pick something that
39:54
you think that the outcome could be something that would fit with
39:57
you right. So I would say don't pick
40:01
something that is going to have relatively low reward and would
40:03
result in the lifestyle that you wouldn't be comfortable with.
40:06
So make sure it aligns with the goals and there's a possibility
40:08
that it matches with your your desires.
40:12
And then try something. And if you try finance and it
40:14
isn't for you, great, go and try something else.
40:17
At that point at least you'll be doing it from a point of
40:19
experience and it's better than doing nothing.
40:21
If you're sat there doing nothing, you are going to get
40:23
depressed. For sure.
40:24
I think that's really good advice.
40:25
The other thing I would also add on to your caveat there is speak
40:30
to people you know that are doing different things.
40:32
If there's anyone that you know that's doing something that is
40:34
vaguely of interest to you, ask them about their journey with
40:37
it, because you might actually get interested in it.
40:40
Might light that fire a little bit more if there is a spark
40:42
within you, and it may also do the complete opposite, which in
40:47
effect is saving you having to go down that path and invest
40:51
time, money just to figure out that you don't like something.
40:54
Ask around because a lot of people are more than happy to
40:56
tell you how they do, what they do and what's good about it and
40:58
what's bad about it. So definitely, yeah, I think
41:01
that's very solid advice. So hopefully that helps anyone
41:05
that has that as a burning question.
41:08
The next question is from That's what si once si once on
41:16
Instagram. So they've asked you're moving
41:19
well, you're moving away from Malaysia because you have no
41:22
job. So what now that's.
41:25
A good question. So I still have the same career.
41:29
I have a client bank that I will continue to manage their money.
41:33
I just will be doing it under a different license and one that
41:36
doesn't give me the right to live and work in Malaysia.
41:38
So because of that I have had to leave Malaysia and and what's
41:42
next? I'm currently back in the UK
41:44
because I want to see my family and friends.
41:46
It's been a long time since I have, A lot has changed in my
41:49
life since I have seen them all. My nan is one of my best
41:53
friends, she's had some health issues recently.
41:55
So it's really important to me to get back and spend some good
41:57
time there, and this is the perfect time to do it right when
42:00
that chapter's closing and just before the next one starts.
42:04
Once this is done, then I think I'll be back to Asia.
42:06
I do just love living out there. So I'm thinking of moving back
42:09
to Bali in December and I'll just continue to do that work.
42:13
I'll continue to build the podcast and I'm also building a
42:16
finance course as well. So it won't just be doing the
42:19
management for the high net worth, but also providing access
42:22
to it for everyone else. So I think.
42:23
That's something you also mentioned in one of your
42:25
podcasts where unfortunately the people that can afford wealth
42:30
management need it the least and the people that can't probably
42:33
need it the most. And so like doing a course this
42:35
much more affordable is probably something that's quite well
42:39
wanted. I'd say exactly, and it aligns
42:41
with my audience more, right? Because I've got between the
42:45
three accounts of my TikTok, my Instagram, and then there's
42:48
someone I work with. There's about half a million
42:49
people following. And the amount of people that I
42:51
could actually work with in my high net worth wealth management
42:54
business is probably 10 or 20 people.
42:56
But then I can at least provide something for everyone else that
42:59
would be a value there. So hopefully that's not a
43:01
massive flop. And it's currently the most
43:03
stressful thing I've ever taken on in my life.
43:05
So we'll see how that turns out. I like it.
43:07
I think that's good stress. The kind of last question, like
43:11
I said, there's a there's a different question to come, but
43:14
this one comes from Jungle Loon on Instagram and they ask what
43:20
do you wish more people knew about you?
43:23
Oh. By the way, this is a great
43:26
question. I really like this one, that's
43:27
why I saved it till last. It's a great question.
43:29
You might have to edit the pause out of it here because I'm
43:30
completely blank on that one. What I wish more people knew
43:35
about me. I think the first answer that
43:42
comes to my head is a lot of people as they project this kind
43:46
of image of that I have all my shit together and that, you
43:51
know, I'm in a decent job in shape and everything else.
43:54
They think, you know, life is perfect and they see a sweet
43:57
side of me on social media because obviously I'm trying to
44:00
be as sweet as possible when you're posting stuff out there.
44:04
I am full of issues. Everyone is full of issues and I
44:08
kind of wish that people knew that and didn't project too much
44:12
onto it because it kind of gives you this this sense of pressure.
44:17
And also I don't want to be part of the problem like social
44:19
media. A curious at this the other day.
44:21
Actually, everyone on social media is full of shit because
44:25
you are literally seeing the highlight reel of their life and
44:27
they're hiding everything else. So I guess I kind of wish that
44:30
people knew that the people that have kind of created this
44:33
perfect image is so far from the truth.
44:36
And yeah, I am just a normal guy.
44:40
I think again, a great answer to it because I think it's so true.
44:43
And again, the more comfortable you get projecting, even
44:48
responding to the question like that, the more comfortable,
44:51
yeah. And the more people can
44:52
understand that, the more of a better entwined relationship
44:55
you'll have with those that care.
44:58
And I think that's awesome. So I think I'd also advise other
45:00
people to do the same in open up about that.
45:03
And if I can add on one thing to that as well, actually it's the
45:06
thing that I shared with you about the social media absolute
45:09
dread and issues that I've had with that because of then.
45:13
It also shows that you can tackle those things.
45:16
And obviously I've been very lucky and helped along the way
45:18
to do it. But my life in the last seven
45:21
months has changed so much in a way that I never thought would
45:24
be possible. And I think that it's shown that
45:28
your life can change. If you saw me a year ago,
45:31
compared to where I am now, I think that would be quite
45:33
inspiring for quite a lot of people to go after their own
45:36
issues or their own dreams and solve each one of them in their
45:39
own way. Amazing.
45:41
Now we're going to get to a few people's dreams here actually,
45:44
as well. A question which was pretty
45:46
consistent. And so I feel like I have to ask
45:49
it. And to be honest, I'm not sure
45:52
based on the fact that we've had a relatively deep discussion,
45:55
intellectual conversation so far, that some of these people
45:57
will still be here listening. But people want to know what's
46:02
your type and are you still single?
46:04
I am still single and what is my type?
46:08
People always look for a physical answer to them.
46:11
They just want to know if they match up to.
46:12
It exactly they they want to know height, they want to know
46:15
cup size yeah, everything else I, I really, I can't give an
46:22
answer on that and it's not me just trying to like people are
46:24
saying about it. But if you look at my past
46:26
relationships and partners No2 are the same.
46:30
So I think I can't even say because it sounds so cliche,
46:34
like a platitude to just say it's about the emotional
46:36
connection or whatever else. But genuinely, I enjoy deep
46:40
conversations. I enjoy, you know, challenge
46:44
people who challenge me, call me on my bullshit, which I need as
46:47
well, right? I've had girlfriends in the past
46:49
that have been too nice and I need to be put in my place
46:52
because I think I'm right about everything and I'm often not
46:55
need to be reminded of that, right?
46:57
So I think a confident person that knows who they are is
47:01
intelligent and will call me on my bullshit, but in a way that
47:05
obviously is productive and not starting a fight because, yeah,
47:11
you don't want to go down that road.
47:13
I think it's a very good response.
47:15
I think it continues the international amount of mystery
47:17
and you haven't. But I think, I think that's
47:19
probably the most important thing because when you think
47:21
about a long term partner, if anyone was listening to what you
47:25
just said and and thinks, I don't want someone to call me
47:28
out on my bullshit, I don't want that kind of relationship.
47:30
That is a good relationship because that shows how much they
47:33
care. Like if they didn't call you out
47:35
on your bullshit and if someone's not calling you on
47:37
your bullshit, they don't care if you're going on a downward
47:41
trajectory enough. And so I have it.
47:44
I have times around like, yeah, I know what I'm doing, and then
47:47
suddenly I've got to explain myself and I don't actually know
47:50
what's going on, but that's good.
47:52
It means I've got to figure out. It highlights what really
47:53
matters. 100. Percent.
47:55
I think that's important. And I think it's got more
47:56
important for me now more than ever because of this social
47:59
media thing, which has disproportionately inflated my
48:03
ego compared to anything else in my life.
48:05
I need to be kept in check. And luckily I've got a couple of
48:09
people in my life at the moment that are good at doing that and
48:11
bring me back down to earth with a third, so I appreciate it a
48:15
lot. Awesome.
48:16
Now the next part of the podcast is the three pieces of advice
48:20
section. So this is where I basically
48:23
vanish. I disappear.
48:25
It's now you in this room and the other person on the
48:28
microphone is you now can be three different versions of you
48:31
from when you were younger. It can be the same version of
48:34
you, but you want to give that person three pieces of advice.
48:36
What quick piece of advice would you give a younger version of
48:39
yourself? I like the idea of doing 3
48:41
different versions of me. I want to start with the me in
48:44
school, which I kind of touched on that I didn't fit fit in with
48:48
that group. And in hindsight I'm not
48:51
surprised because I tried so hard to fit in and to be someone
48:54
that I wasn't that it would naturally trigger someone's
48:58
self-defense systems. Just be like there's something
49:00
up with this guy and like back away right?
49:03
At this point in my life, I've traveled enough to meet enough
49:06
groups of people and ones that I fit with the ones that I don't.
49:09
There is a tribe out there for you.
49:12
Like you will find people that match your values, they match
49:17
your sense of humour, they appreciate your quirkiness.
49:20
I would say stop trying to fit a size 10 shoe a foot into a size
49:25
7 shoe right and just relax. If people don't like you for who
49:28
you are, then that's just not your tribe because no one is
49:32
going to. You're not going to be liked by
49:34
everyone, right? So just be comfortable that you
49:36
will find a group if you just keep looking.
49:40
Second piece of advice, I would give this one to myself at 22,
49:44
which was don't touch that bloody money, Invest it and let
49:49
it sort you out for life. If I had invested that, that
49:53
would have been enough for me to retire off by the time that I
49:55
reached 55 or 60. So yeah, wouldn't have pissed
49:59
that up the wall in hindsight. Next piece of advice I would
50:02
give to myself at 25 when that was kind of the darkest period
50:07
for me, when I was completely lost.
50:09
And I would have just told myself that if you want to find
50:13
a way, you'll find a way. And it can be hard when you
50:15
don't see a light at the end of the tunnel and you can think
50:17
that you know the world isn't for you and you can't think of a
50:20
direction that you want to go in.
50:22
But if you want to make it work, you can, and just keep putting 1
50:26
foot in front of the other and you will reach the end of
50:28
whatever tunnel it is that you're going through.
50:30
Awesome. Really good advice.
50:31
And I think before we move on to the next section, one question I
50:36
actually have for you based on what you said in your second
50:38
piece of advice there is I know you're not allowed to give
50:42
direct advice to everybody. That's why you have clients, you
50:45
have an agreement with them. But what is a piece of advice or
50:50
or some guidance that you could give everyone to take better
50:53
care of their money really? Sure.
50:55
Yeah. The reason for that is because
50:58
if we're seen to be giving advice, it's generally never
51:01
one-size-fits-all for everyone, right?
51:02
So telling people to go and invest, that could be terrible
51:05
advice for certain people in certain financial situations. 1
51:09
generic thing that I would say should apply to everyone is to
51:13
educate yourself to some degree. And I say this even to my
51:16
clients that pay me to do everything for them because I
51:21
may not always be in this profession.
51:22
They may need to find someone else at some point, although I
51:24
do intend to be. You know, if you're in a
51:26
relationship, it's quite often that the woman will leave the
51:29
man to just take care of the finances.
51:30
I can't remember the statistic was, but I think it was around
51:32
80% of women leave the finances to the man.
51:35
And then if that relationship falls apart then it's the in
51:39
more trouble than just the emotional distress of going
51:41
through a breakup. When you're going to find a
51:44
financial advisor, you are picking a person in a pretty
51:47
well paid job to trust them with your entire finances and they
51:52
are motivated to earn money, right?
51:55
And there have been a lot of shit bags in my industry that
51:57
take advantage of that kind of thing.
51:59
So you should at least have a good understanding of what sort
52:02
of investments look like good investments, what sort of price
52:05
investments should be, so that when you're picking someone to
52:08
trust, you already have something to judge what they're
52:11
telling you against, right? It protects yourself as well.
52:14
So I would just say invest some time into teaching yourself
52:18
about money, because money matters to everyone.
52:20
You can't choose not to take part in the game.
52:23
It literally makes the world go round.
52:25
Awesome, Now we'll get to where people can find you for some
52:28
more advice. That or some more tips and
52:31
tricks that they can learn on the way in a moment.
52:33
But another thing that we do, which again, I've said it
52:36
before, I say it again, I didn't come up with this idea.
52:38
It's not an original idea, but the guest to guest question.
52:41
So you will have to leave a question for the next guest
52:44
knowing nothing about them. But that also means that there
52:46
is a question for you to answer. So in the last episode, I had
52:49
Annabelle, and Annabelle is actually a celiac.
52:53
So she found out very young that she couldn't eat certain foods.
52:57
And she's gone through a whole journey of understanding how to
53:00
have a much better relationship with food, also how to deal with
53:02
body dysmorphia and that sort of thing.
53:05
But she's got to put in her life where she doesn't like thinking
53:07
about where she needs to be in five years, what she needs to do
53:10
to get there. She likes kind of living more in
53:13
the moment, doing the best that she can now.
53:15
And she trusts that if she keeps doing that every day, she'll end
53:18
up being in a place that she's happy.
53:21
So rather than asking you what you'll be doing in five years
53:24
time, she actually wants to know what's the biggest thing you've
53:27
learned in the last five years? Which is actually really perfect
53:31
for the fact that the last five years have probably been the
53:33
biggest change of your life. Yeah, 100%.
53:36
So good. And I feel like I could give one
53:38
of the answers that I've given so far and it would fit to that.
53:40
So I'm going to try and give something new.
53:47
I've learned that there aren't boundaries to what you can do.
53:52
When I say there aren't boundaries to what you can
53:54
achieve, again it just sounds like a platitude.
53:56
That's such a cliche, but I pigeon my pigeonholed myself as
54:01
a certain kind of person, for example, not someone who had a
54:05
following on social media or could put content out there.
54:08
And I've learned that I can do that, albeit quite badly, and
54:11
losing followers rather than gaining them.
54:13
But it's just showing me that, you know, you are capable of
54:16
trying these different things. Actually starting the podcast
54:19
and putting that out there and having some really good
54:21
conversations on it. I would just tell myself, or
54:26
I've learned from the last five years that you can dream bigger.
54:28
All of these people in these amazing spaces that are doing
54:31
these amazing things, they didn't start from that.
54:34
We all came from the same place, more or less.
54:37
I know there are definitely some different cases on that one, but
54:40
yeah, dream bigger. Strong answer, but, and
54:44
obviously I, I have to ask you what your question will be for
54:47
the next guest. Now, if you, I don't know if
54:49
you've got prepared, but it doesn't have to be, you know,
54:52
really sensible. It can be quite out there.
54:54
We've had questions about cheesecakes, doughnuts.
54:57
We've had questions about a horse sized duck, 10 duck sized
55:01
horses who would win in a fight? What would you like to ask the
55:05
next guest? I love the question of what's
55:08
the biggest animal that you think you can be in a fight in
55:11
its own natural habitat. But seeing as you've already had
55:13
an animal themed question on there, I'll go something a bit
55:16
deeper and I'll say what is something that you know you
55:19
should be doing in your life that you're not doing.
55:22
Oh OK. Yeah, that is a tough question
55:24
to answer as well. I am interested in, just because
55:27
you said it, what is the biggest animal you think you could fight
55:29
and then a? Camel.
55:31
Oh. Strong shout I've got.
55:34
I've got a battle plan for it and everything.
55:35
And the reason it's a camel is because it's got a thin enough
55:37
neck that I could sink the choke in, right?
55:39
So start with the double leg on the front legs, take it down and
55:42
then choke it out. I was going to weigh in on what
55:45
I think I could think, but I there's so many things coming
55:47
into my head. Maybe I'll give, maybe I'll
55:50
bring that question up in the next episode.
55:52
I'll also try and do an answer because I think the person
55:53
that's coming on next will also like that question.
55:55
So I'll ask, I'll ask both 1. So if you guys want to hear the
55:59
answer to that question, then make sure you come back.
56:01
You can find the Mindset podcast.
56:03
I mean, you've already done a great job of finding because
56:04
you're listening to it. But if you can find it on social
56:07
media at Mindset under score podcast, that is the same for
56:11
everywhere. However, we're about to jump on
56:14
and do another podcast episode where I guess I'm supposed to
56:17
open up a little bit more, which is quite daunting, but where can
56:19
we find you? Where can we find that podcast?
56:21
So the podcast is called Growth Game.
56:23
So on Spotify and Apple Podcasts it's called Growth Game and on
56:28
YouTube it's Growth Game TM or you can find on Instagram at Tom
56:34
G Mer. Fantastic.
56:36
Now, I'll obviously do a good job of tagging all of those
56:39
locations as we go. So if you're struggling, head
56:41
over to the social media and you'll find everything there.
56:44
However, I want to say a massive thank you for flying all the way
56:46
across the world to be here. And I want to say a massive
56:48
thank you to you guys listening and I look forward to seeing you
56:51
all in the next episode. Thank you for having me.