Latest / White Fox Talking / E79: How Gratitude, Coaching, And Small Wins Help Carol Rebuild After Assault

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E79: How Gratitude, Coaching, And Small Wins Help Carol Rebuild After Assault · White Fox Talking

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_02: Hello and welcome to the White Fox Talking Podcast.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm Mark Jala Valentine.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_02: And guess who's at the side of me?
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: Introducing Seb?
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's Seb.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: Not much of a surprise, Seb, because I won't be able to do it without you, would I?
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Let's face it.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_02: Although it's going smoother today.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: I haven't done two for a while, have I?
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_02: But it's good.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_02: It is good.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_02: Getting the back in the flow.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_02: Well, sometimes it's difficult with work and things and juggling juggling life.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: And obviously I was doing all my marathon stuff and now making it feeling still regretting it.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: No, because I've just entered some more.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: So it looks like those nice people at Impact Collective, which is Bruce, talked me into doing the Sheffield.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: Is it the not the Sheffield Shire?
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_02: The Yorkshire.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know what they call it.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: The triple crowd or something.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: It's the Sheffield half, which I did last year.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_02: The Leeds marathon, which I did two years ago.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: So the Sheffield half was brutal.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_02: The Leeds full marathon, that's very brutal.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: And then the Yorkshire marathon, which shouldn't mean as brutal as them two, but it was more prepared.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm doing not doing them all three next year.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_02: But that's donating to for the podcast and to help us to uh brutal.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: To keep on with the mental health message.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: So that's cool.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_02: That's very kind of fun.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's very kind of few.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's not, it's just stupid of me, isn't it?
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_02: I'll be a year older, a year after.
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_02: But I've got to say, yeah, the mind the sort of mindset around it has been good.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it's sort of kept me throwing out training for each, you know.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_02: I even went to type boxing today.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_02: Well, type box for 20 odd years.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_02: So that was good.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: So yes.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: Next next year you'd be joining some competition or something.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we're speculated.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_02: Doing like a over f over fifties, nearly sixties.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_02: Nearly sixties tie boxing.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: I think I'm not sure the bones will last.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_02: Anyway, shall we get on?
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_02: So I should just say, yes, there may be a content warning that might be triggering to some people on this one.
• 1:57
  SPEAKER_02: I know we have that written down in the show notes anyway on the podcast.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: But this this is about a sexual attack.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's that's what we call it.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: And then but it's mainly about the recovery.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: The White Fox Talking podcast is sponsored by Energy Impact.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: So I'd like to introduce Carol.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_03: Hi, thank you for having me.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you, Carol.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you for coming in and thank you for getting in touch and saying do you like to speak on the podcast?
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I think the for you to approach us and then you know, obviously, we want to provide as much information for people as possible.
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_02: And for you to approach us with this, I have seen the a video online with yourself talking with Matt Hall, and that was for my research, and I was quite it took me took my breath away.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_02: So if you would like to give yourself a brief introduction and then we'll we'll get on with it.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm Carol.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_03: I am a retired nurse.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_03: I had to take early retirement due to ill health, really.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_03: I had sustained a pretty violent double rape and knew I couldn't go back to work.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_03: I couldn't deal.
• 3:00
  SPEAKER_03: I was working in AE and knew I wouldn't be able to deal.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: I was frightened of my own shadow by then, and I knew I couldn't go back to working in an area like AE where you've got people who are drunk and loud, and I was too scared to go back.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_03: So I took early retirement.
• 3:16
  SPEAKER_02: Can I ask?
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I want you to, like I said before, I want you to sort of lead on this as in to speak about what you want to speak about rather than me leading to we don't want to talk too much about the incident if it's triggering for yourself, because obviously there must be there's got to be PTSD involved, all sorts of and I know sometimes well, up to about a year ago when I did my EMDR, you know, people had speak, and I would be triggered.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_02: But now I'm sort of on top of that, I suppose.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so how long ago was this incident?
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_03: It will be seven years now.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so be honest, that's still pretty new, really, isn't it?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_03: I've only really started I started working on myself two years ago now, this month.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_03: I'd reached my lowest point, uh, to the fact that I had some insulin and a syringe and I had a a goodbye note already written and I'd tried therapy.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_03: I'd tried well, I was on medication, I was on Prozac, I was on Tamazepam.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_03: Couldn't sleep even with the Tamazepam, but it did numb things.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't have to feel or think about what had happened to me.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_03: And so I started taking them during the day as well as on the night.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_03: Just to keep me in a state where I didn't have to face reality, basically.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_02: Did you did you find with that with medication it just made everything just the same?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: So you didn't have you don't have a I didn't have any feelings.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_02: Joy, but you couldn't have saddened, yeah.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_03: I had no feelings whatsoever.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_03: But I quite liked that because I didn't like the feelings I had if I had a lucid moment and going back to what had happened to me.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't like that.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_03: So that's why I started taking them during the day as well.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_00: So was this kind of your escapism?
• 4:55
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_03: Very much so.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_03: And then as a last ditch, it was a friend that had seen that someone locally was doing a mindset training day in Manchester.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_03: And they had no idea what happened to me, just that from their point of view, I'd been in a car crash and I wasn't coping with life after that.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_03: So we went along to this mindset coaching day, which is where Matt Hall was.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_03: He was my life coach, or he became my life coach after that particular day.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I realised people, we got a workbook, he was doing things with us at the time, talking to us, where do you see yourself in a year's time?
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_03: I couldn't even see myself tomorrow.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_03: And people were writing reams and reams in this workbook, and I couldn't even string up put a sentence in.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_03: So I knew that something had to change, and I just thought, right, if I try this, I've got a backup plan.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_03: I've got the initial in.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_03: I know what I'm gonna do if this doesn't work, but at least I'm going knowing I've tried everything that I possibly can.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: Can I just take you back to so your friend thought you'd been in a car crash and we spoke just before?
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: And you basically said you'd been in a car crash.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_03: To explain the injuries that I had from the night that I was saying sexually assaulted, I was actually raped by two strangers.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_03: And they broke my arm and I'd been hit across my face, so I'd had a wound on my face.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_03: So obviously I'd got my arm in a pot.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'd got Okay.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_03: I needed to explain the injuries, but I was too ashamed.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_03: I felt too guilty to tell people what had actually happened to me.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_03: So hence I came up with a car crash.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: D did you keep that to yourself for quite a long time?
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: Mm-hmm.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_03: Until I spoke to Matt Hall when I reached out and asked about life coaching, could we have a chat?
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe it would help me deal with something that I wasn't dealing with very well, or well, I wasn't dealing with at all.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: And so we had an hour's conversation, and he was exceptionally good.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_03: His people skills are amazing.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I actually opened up on that very first hour that we had coaching session about what had happened.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_03: And I I couldn't look at him actually when I was telling him because I thought I would see the same disgust in his face that my partner at the time had when he realised what had happened to me because he left me because of it.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: But I didn't see that disgust in his face.
• 7:14
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, he was appalled at how my then partner had behaved towards me.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: I should say that like I say, I've watched I've watched the interview with Matt Hall, and what we'll do is put that in I think we can put that in the show notes, can we?
• 7:26
  SPEAKER_02: Someone else's yeah.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: It's on YouTube, so it's on you, yeah.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_02: Wants to get a basis and get some background of it, because I don't think this is the place for background so too much because we want to talk about the your success of getting through it.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_02: Can I just ask once one bit?
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: So did you go seek medical health?
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: I was in to f to get the Tamazipans and things.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: Did you have to explain what had happened there?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_03: But I explained that I'd been in a car crash.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, right.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_03: And I was just having flashbacks to the car crash.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_03: This happened uh not where I lived and worked.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_03: This happened where my partner at the time, because we shared a flat over where he lived, and it happened over there.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_03: So it wasn't the same team as the people I worked with.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: So I was able to keep it from everyone.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, well, that would go about too far.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: How much how did that make you feel when your partner left you because of this?
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_02: The reaction there.
• 8:19
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it's Well, I felt even worse.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_03: I felt guilty anyway.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_03: I had always said if anything like that happens to me, I'll scream my head off and what have you.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_03: But there wasn't a sound that came out of my mouth, even though I tried, didn't happen.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_03: So that made me feel guilty that I hadn't been able to scream.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: But that could be that could be a natural acting car.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely, it is freeze part of the Yeah, exactly.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_04: Oh yeah.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, he left me and he left me a note saying that he couldn't live with someone that behaved like a prostitute.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_03: And so of course, never to tell anyone, it actually he said on the note, Oh, you'll end without any friends.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I didn't.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_02: You know the term kicker person when they're down.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's shocking.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I've I've already I'll be honest, I've already heard that once on the video, but then you you know you I guess the person you always expect any support of is your partner.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_03: And it wasn't a new relationship.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_03: We'd been together for 24 years.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: So that must have hurt just as much.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: I was not able to process what had happened that night, and then a week later, another huge life-changing thing happened, and I literally just spiraled.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_03: I call it into an abyss.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_03: There was no hope and there was no light anymore in my life, and I didn't want to be here anymore.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_02: Bloody hell.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: You okay?
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, no, I'm okay.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_02: This went on for a few years until you dec was talked into going to the this mindset, the mindset session.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_02: But then you opened up pretty quickly with with Matt, with Matt Hall.
• 9:47
  SPEAKER_02: So what was that?
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what the change was there or?
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_03: I don't really know.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_03: It he's got a real way with people uh getting you to talk about something.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_03: And it was very slow, very baby steps, the progress, but there was progress.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: And the fact that I actually spoke about it and he wasn't appalled at me, that gave me a little flicker of hope.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: Did you expect him to be appalled at you?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I did.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: How did that make you feel, being able to release something that has been with you in secret from anyone else for the first time after such a long time?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: Was there a relief?
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_03: There was a relief.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, there was.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_03: It was it wasn't it didn't stay, not not after that first session, but I felt that I spoken to somebody who hasn't judged me because of it.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe there is you know a point in going on and having another session.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe something else will happen if I if I keep going on this road.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: And so I did keep going.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_03: I worked with him actually one-to-one, as it's called, for 18 months.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_03: And at the time that we recorded the podcast, we'd been working together for just under a year.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_02: Right, okay.
• 11:00
  SPEAKER_03: But there was a massive change in me in that time, but it was a lot of hard work.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: So if we could go to from that initial meeting, it's like, can you can you explain how it works for people?
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_02: But basically what I'm thinking is obviously this is um this is a sort of I'd say a massive step, because you've contacted us and you're willing to come on here and share this.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: And as in as in to show people if they have been through something as of this enormity, then they can't there is a way through and there is yeah, there is help out there, and it's I don't know, well, with something like that, would you fall into an abyss anyway?
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's not something that's going to be overlooked, is it?
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_03: So many people never get out of that hole.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_03: Never.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_03: Because the bury do you think because to bury it or because Yeah, and because you feel so bad about yourself.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_03: I actually, because COVID hit and I actually ate myself.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_03: I became morbidly obese.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't want another man to look at me, never mind, put their hands on me.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_03: And so I I turned to takeaways and eating really badly.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_03: Could barely walk at one point.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really?
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_02: So so it has been a big journey then since it's been a yeah, a lot.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_02: So how does it so from this initial talk with um Matt Hall, how does what how did it progress then?
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_03: He gave me some homework to do at the end of that first session, which was to go and get the letter, because I kept the letter from my partner.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_03: And every time anything bad happened to me, I would read that letter, and it was like it was reaffirming that I only deserved bad things to happen to me.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_03: And he asked me to video it of me burning that letter.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_03: He wanted me to video that to prove that I'd done it, not just to sort of message him and say, I've done it, I've burnt it.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_03: I actually had to video me burning said letter, and I did, and I initially felt quite, oh, this is amazing, I'm burning it.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_03: And then once the flame hit, I wanted to put it out, but a piece of paper catches the flame and I couldn't, and I was like bereft.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like that was my guide for life gone, and I felt even more lost after that initially.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: Is that because you wanted to not wanted to, but you felt you had to stay in that state?
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think so.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, because I didn't see any other way forward at at that time at all.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, I had been given a diagnosis of PTSS, which then became PTSD.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: What's PTSS for the listeners?
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_03: Post-traumatic stress syndrome.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_03: Which then becomes post-traumatic stress disorder because it goes on for longer than a couple of months.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_03: And I still have PTSD or a generalised anxiety disorder, if you like.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_03: I struggle to travel solo, but I struggled I don't travel solo on a night time or I still get really triggered with that.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know I only found out and it's 25 years of me with PTSD, is that I only found out Reese in the last couple of years that PTSD is an anxiety disorder and not getting off the topic at all.
• 13:56
  SPEAKER_02: But I I think when I turned around and said I will always have PTSD and it's just how I handle that, then it I thought that was a massive step forward for myself.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_03: It is massive.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_03: And it is, you know, when you actually choose to get help, that's a massive step.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_03: That was the biggest step I had taken.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_03: And saying what had happened was uh huge, but then from then on it was baby steps.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_03: Because everything would would overwhelm me if he was, you know, he couldn't go too quickly.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_03: We had to literally go baby step by baby step.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_03: And eventually we got to a point where he helped me to reframe what happened to me that night and actually find gratitude in what happened.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't say that lightly because that doesn't mean I've what they did was okay, but it means because of that night my partner left me.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_03: And if he hadn't have left me, I would probably be a statistic from domestic violence.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_03: I would probably be dead anyway, because that violence was escalating.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_03: But I had shut that away in another compartment.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_03: It was in Pandora's box, lock, key, buried, never admitted until we start something called timeline therapy.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_02: Just before we're going to the timeline stuff, the um that must have been massive sort of my yeah, change of mindset to act to act to sort of give gratitude to a situation, an incident like that.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_03: It was huge.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_03: Was it uh and it wasn't it wasn't something that happened after one session.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_02: Right, okay.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_03: It was repeatedly trying to help me to move out of where I was because I was stuck in a loop of not being able to move forward.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so helping me to find gratitude actually meant I could leave some of that behind and take another step forward.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_02: Right, yeah, I suppose it's cutting some of that, cutting some of that that's holding you back, yeah.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_02: Cutting some of that away.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_03: Looking at it in a different light.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and reframing.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, reframing.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, that's a word they use a lot with life coaching.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, don't know why I've heard it.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: Well, you spot up.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do listen to an awful lot of mental well-being, mental health, and and things that describe mental challenges.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's basically what I do in my car now, rather than just listening to music all the time.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_02: So, this timeline therapy, how does that work?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_03: It's almost like I've never been hypnotised, but it's how I would imagine hypnosis works.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_03: Your eyes are closed, you listen to that person's voice, and they take you back to wherever they want you to go.
• 16:21
  SPEAKER_03: And we started going back to childhood and discovering that I had a really happy childhood.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: And from the age of about six or seven, I knew I wanted to be a nurse.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_03: That was the only thing I ever wanted to be in life was a nurse.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_03: My letter to Santa always had a nurse's uniform on it every year because I'd grown out of the one before, so I needed a new one.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I did go on and become a nurse, and I loved my job.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_03: And then after that, it was like sort of memories started coming back, things that I had no idea about.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_03: It it was like it had released things that my brain was probably saying, we've hidden this from you, but now you're able to deal with it, we think.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_03: So I'd have a flashback, and I could be anywhere at any time, and some of them were pretty vivid, to the point that I felt I was back experiencing whatever it was, and I'd be frozen to the spot.
• 17:14
  SPEAKER_03: So I even vomited on some occasions.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_03: They were so vivid, and it turned out that my relationship wasn't all that I was portraying it to be on the outside.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, it was a pretty toxic, abusive mentally and physically relationship.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: And you were never aware of this, or you didn't want to be aware of this?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_03: I think I just chose to not.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: Because the person I fell in love with was not the person that I ended up with, and I was always waiting for him to come back.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_03: Because he would, after an episode.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: Then the nice person came back.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_03: I think they call it gaslighting.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: Did were you aware of him having any issues himself?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_03: No, I was, I think, in love with being in love.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_03: I felt so lucky that this person had wanted to spend their life with me, that I just would I forgave him anything and everything, literally.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_03: I would never recommend that people do that, but we do.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_03: And not just women, men can be in those sort of situations as well.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_03: And it is it just takes all your power away from you.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: Your voice is gone.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: You can't get dressed unless you're wearing what they want you to wear.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_03: So when I actually was at work, it was great.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_03: I put that uniform on and I became somebody that I did recognise.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_02: How does it make you feel now that you can't, you know, you basically can wear what you want, where you wear it.
• 18:35
  SPEAKER_02: Is that was that part of the is that part of the realization as well?
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_03: It is, and I found that really difficult.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really?
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_03: I found it really difficult.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_03: I felt lost and I I didn't know how to.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_03: And it was almost like you put something on that you'd not been allowed to wear and you were waiting for something bad to happen for because you were doing something that you'd not been allowed to do or you were told you shouldn't do.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_03: I was neither allowed to wear red because he said it made me look like a prostitute and he didn't like the colour red.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_03: And I wore lipstick when we went out.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_03: I'd gone to meet him and a couple of friends in a restaurant, and when we got home, because my lipstick had been red, he's just grabbed me by my ponytail and scrubbed it off with a pan scrub.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_03: I was gonna say Brillo, but I don't even know if they exist anymore.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_03: That's how old I am.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: Until my lips bled.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_03: So wearing things like that, you even though in your mind you know that you're not in that relationship anymore, there is still something so scary about doing it.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_03: Because I was waiting for it he wasn't gonna punch me, but was something bad gonna happen?
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: I was waiting for the next bad thing to happen just because of wearing a colour that I wasn't allowed to wear.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like an intrusive thought coming from your subconscious, basically, through habit, I suppose.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:49
  SPEAKER_03: Through what you've been taught and told over those decades.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: Did you say it was twenty four years?
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_02: Well it is, eh?
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, deck bloody hell.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_00: So there's like several traumas here.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_03: I know.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: The relationship, the incident, what happened straight after the incident, the loss of the relationship.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: It is.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_03: And I felt really bad that I hadn't recognised that relationship to be that it was the w the way it was.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_03: And for staying, you feel so guilty that you didn't recognise it and you didn't get out and you stayed.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_02: Often people say that.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it goes back to that.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I suppose if that's your everyday life and safety, even though it's not safe in other people's eyes.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_03: And it it wasn't safe.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_03: And but it starts small little things that then ingrain into you that oh that he's upset that I must have done something to cause that.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_03: And that's how it starts, and it builds on that.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_03: And they have complete control.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_02: So with the timeline therapy, this isn't we're not just looking at the the incident and your reaction to the incident and the the trauma from that incident.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_02: We're looking at all the domestic violence as well.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: And then maybe even further back.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_02: I know like like I just said before, when I've done EMDR, which I did for something to well, I did it for part of the PCST, but the effects that have come out of it and brought brought things back, like being hit in the head with a chalk rubber as a school at school, and they're like, that's that's for the uh for the younger listeners, that's what we used to have.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: Someone would write on the board with a piece of chalk and then they'd rub it off with a rubber, and it hurt when it flew across the classroom and it hit you in the head.
• 21:26
  SPEAKER_02: And my the lady I talked to, therapists, was like, These are traumatic incidents, but you're sort of laughing at them, and it's like, well that's that's what life was like.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:35
  SPEAKER_02: But when you go back to them and you're thinking, that's not really right, is it?
• 21:38
  SPEAKER_03: And you're shocked, aren't you, at yourself for just putting up with it and tolerating it and but I didn't I didn't see a way out.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't actually want a way out, I don't think.
• 21:50
  SPEAKER_03: I wanted that relationship back that I'd had in the first sort of couple of years.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: So it was okay, it was it was okay for a while.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_02: Was there a I don't know.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: Was there anything that sort of sent it off that way?
• 22:02
  SPEAKER_03: Or No, I think it was probably just him manipulating things and making I don't know, I think when the gaslight you you are their world to start with, and then little things sneak in, little sayings and sarcasm, and you then think, Oh, I've obviously done something wrong.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_03: It must be me, because he's not like that normally.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_03: And it just builds from there to much worse things.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_02: So, how did that make you feel with it, you know, that back to the timeline therapy when you're picking all these little bits out that's coming up?
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_03: Absolutely awful.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_03: I just felt so bad about myself.
• 22:37
  SPEAKER_03: What for accepting what had happened?
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_03: For not recognising what was going on or for burying it and doing nothing about it, just keeping going in that relationship, looking for something that was no longer there, just waiting for it to come back.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_03: And it was never gonna come back, but I didn't see that at the time.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_03: So I found it just as upsetting as dealing with the night of the actual attack.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_03: In fact, some some of it was worse.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_02: What the realisation?
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think that's some of what had happened to me.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_03: I just was I can't believe that that I I I stayed after that happened.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, because we are talking physical violence as well as mental and emotional.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: So it made me feel pretty bad about myself.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_03: So again, it was having to work on my self-esteem, my column limiting beliefs.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, yeah.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_03: Because I believed everything he told me about me, rather than I wasn't listening to anything I would t t tell me about me because what he said was the law, gospel.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_03: And it's hard work when you work on your mindset and when you work on yourself and you're literally rewriting everything that you have believed for the last 24 years.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_03: And there were times I wanted to quit, but he didn't let me quit.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_03: He was really supportive, really encouraging, but if I needed a kick up the backside, I got, you know, because you can't always it's you can't always be nice and lovely.
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes I did need a kick up the backside to reframe things.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_03: Right.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_03: So as I was heading back to victim mindset.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_02: I see what you mean, yeah.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_03: And that is hard.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_03: And it must be hard for that per for that life coach to know when and how to approach those things.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I suppose that's where you get into the skill of a good life coach, and maybe some people that profess to be coaches, yeah.
• 24:32
  SPEAKER_02: What is it because again, without going off topic, and I heard a lot of things about these walk and talks with people that are qualifying, like if you don't need to say the wrong thing.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: I mean when I was going through my stuff, and seven knows, some people are honest, but I'd say it wrong word, and I'd be I'd flare up, you know what I mean?
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_02: So and that's just from my personal experience, so I suppose that's much like across the board.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_02: So what sort of what's where are we now on on this sort of timeline?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_02: How long did it take you to start?
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_02: How many sessions would you say it took, or how many months before you could get into this where you're basically going from this negative mindset or I'm still working on that.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_03: I still have moments when it will slip back, but I now have more understanding and a few more tools in my mental health box to turn things round.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_03: You know, panic attacks were happening frequently once we started working on things.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_03: I would have panic attacks all the time.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_03: And then I got you know, I learned about how to manage panic attacks and pattern interrupts and usually what your focus, you know, when you're having a panic attack, it's not about getting on the train, it's about what will happen when you get on the train.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_03: It's always one step ahead.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_03: And so he's taught me to are you safe right now in this moment?
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, take another step, okay, and do it like that.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_03: And and then it, you know, pattern interrupted.
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_03: I could feel it coming on.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_03: My actual sentence I was given was Carol, stop talking shit.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_03: What's the truth here?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_03: But just saying that automatically stops where you were heading and brings you out of that cycle that you were going to go back into.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think if no one's ever I don't know if Mike have I had panic attacks.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_02: I've had episodes where I think there was something going to happen.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 26:22
  SPEAKER_02: Do you know what I mean?
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_02: And it I could because of the nature of the incident I was involved in, I was attacked from behind.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I you know, there was sometimes I'd feel the sense that there was someone behind me, and I've I did knock someone, well not knock them out, but they ran past me and I've elbowed them and knocked them down.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's true.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_02: Sorry about that.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_00: But this is you do always like to stand with the back to a door.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_00: I yeah, and if we go into a yeah, wherever you go.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_02: I have to stand with my back to a door, and if we're going to a restaurant or anything, I have to sit with me with facing the door.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_03: So you can yeah, so you can see your way out.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so when I yeah, so I there has to be I don't like people behind me.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: But then again, I'd worked on the doors for 20 years, so you you can see door stuff everywhere, they all stand where they you know, so there's no one behind them.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_02: But the the realization is your body and your mind and your senses are picking up all this information up, even if you're not registering it, and then that's that's going through your brain and triggering whatever you and once you're in that mindset, yeah, and it's in that frame of mind, then you've the process has already started, doesn't it?
• 27:19
  SPEAKER_03: It's so difficult to stop it.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_02: If you don't, yeah.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: So you've used that what what was the what was the word?
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_02: Stop it.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_03: Pattern interrupt.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: Pattern interrupts, but then that phrase that you you have for yourselves, stop being stop talking shit.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: What's the truth?
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: That's a good I like that.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: But I have to say it out loud.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_03: So if I'm out in in town, I've start and I will now pick up my phone and I'll say it like that.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_03: And automatically picking up your phone changes.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_03: Automatically you're changing that you're changing the pathway that you were on, yeah.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_03: So just doing that before I say the pattern interrupt that I was given, it's already started to change.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_03: Because I felt ridiculous saying it out loud without the phone, because I was like, everybody's gonna stare at me now, talking to myself, and I'm swearing.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_03: And so I if I'm out, I will pick up my phone and say it as if I'm saying it to someone on the phone.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_02: That's I mean it's it's good information that people can take from that, isn't it?
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, would you recommend that they they should really go through a course of this themselves, I suppose?
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it you need I would never be here where I am now, and I've still got work to do on myself if I hadn't got that kind of help.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: You can't do it on your own.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_03: You either need therapy, medication, life cut, or a combination of all of them.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: You have to find what works for you, but you can't do it on your own.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_03: And that's something I really want to stress.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_03: If you can, you need to reach out.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_03: It's really takes a lot of courage, but it is worth it.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think, like you say, it's that first step, isn't it?
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: You know, having that first step.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_02: I remember when I because a lot of my close friends, like seven that that I used to work with, they knew about my PTSD and stuff, but I'd hid it from everyone in the mountain world.
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, I didn't talk about it, and then it were like, 'Cause you're working with these people, there's quite a lot of ego and stuff.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: And then it was until I thought I'd achieved something where I could fit in.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_02: But it were like, oh right, it won't that big a deal anyway.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah what I mean.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_02: Some people are still we're just sort of bother with them.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it's difficult.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_03: It's difficult still, I find I feel sometimes that I have to still hide a part of myself because it's such a taboo and sensitive topic that you feel like you're gonna upset people if you mention anything like that.
• 29:29
  SPEAKER_03: You know, when you're meeting people and you're talking about your relationships and your family, I feel I can't share anything like that because I don't want to upset someone, but then I'm not being my true self.
• 29:41
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_03: And if these kind of conversations don't happen, it will never change.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_03: No one will talk about what happened to them because they feel so bad about it.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do think on the on the on the other side, or on one one side of it is, and we've had people actually in in here or with that have come on and told their story and they've been really nervous, and then when they've finished, they've gone, do you know what?
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_02: That was really cathartic.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_02: And they feel like they've said more than they intended to say, but it's they've felt this weight lift off them because they've actually said something.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_02: But it's I think sometimes it's and I've I've seen I know what you're saying because you've seen it in people myself, you know, when you when it's you know, I've talked about my history and that you can see some people like some people are really interested.
• 30:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh right, and and what's the thoughts of that?
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, how does this work?
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_02: And some people just go, ooh, you know what I mean?
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's like yeah, like you've dropped a lead work through the uh through the coffee table.
• 30:33
  SPEAKER_03: It is, and then it it means you don't want to see it again in in that same situation, in a different room.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_03: You're sort of hesitant to talk about it then.
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and that's I don't know.
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_02: I think because we're all on our own different journeys, you know, we've both got PTSD.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 30:49
  SPEAKER_02: And we live with it.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_02: But my mine's 25 years old now, so my journey's possibly a bit further down the road.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_02: And coming accustomed to, but does it define me?
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_02: Well, sometimes not as much.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I think that's it.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_03: Not as much.
• 31:01
  SPEAKER_03: I wouldn't be here talking to you now.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_03: If it I was letting it define me.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I had nerves.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't want to particularly, but then it's like actually I do, because I want other people to see that if you get help, and it is hard work, a lot of hard work, and I'm still on that journey.
• 31:18
  SPEAKER_03: But then you can start to rebuild and actually get a life that you want to live.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_03: You're allowed to laugh again, you're allowed to wear lipstick, you're allowed to wear anything other than black, and you can choose what you have to drink if you go out.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_03: You don't, you know, all these things come back into your life.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: You live your life.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_03: You start living you weren't living before, you were existing in in a state of fear, really.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_03: Always on eggshells, because you didn't want to upset that other person.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_03: Because then obviously you didn't want to unleash punishment on yourself, whatever that might be.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_03: Financially, you know, you get the money that you give, and you have to ask for your own wages, for your own money to get whatever you have to go through.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_03: That in my case.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_02: What are the parts of this therapist there being?
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_03: There's the well, there's been the timeline therapy, and I learnt about gratitude.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_03: I was taught to journal.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_03: I'd never journaled before.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I started journaling and started looking at going out for a walk every day, just getting out and into the fresh air.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_03: And whether I wanted to or not, I had to go out.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_03: And part of working with this particular life coach was voice noting him every day, Monday to Friday, to check in.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_03: And I found I couldn't lie to him.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_03: What's the point of paying for someone's services and not doing what they're asking you to do?
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I found I was actually going out for these walks.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_03: And eventually I started to eat a little better.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_03: I joined a weight support group called the Bubble Venture.
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_03: It's not a diet club, it's just about mindfully eating and supporting each other.
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_03: And so I started to not be morbidly obese anymore, and the weights started to come off, and I started to have friends again.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_03: Those friends had always been there, they just didn't know what I was going through because I hadn't let them in.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_03: And so it's a combination of a lot of things.
• 33:13
  SPEAKER_03: There was always a lot of homework.
• 33:15
  SPEAKER_03: I had to write a letter to my younger self, and I found I could do that.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_03: I was apologizing for not keeping us safe.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_03: But then when it came to writing the letter from my younger self to my now self, I couldn't do it.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_03: I found that so difficult.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so I but we worked on it.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: Then we did something called mirror work.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't even have a mirror in the house because I didn't want to look at myself at all.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_03: So I had to order a mirror to start with.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_03: And I had to look at myself in the mirror every single day just to tell myself that I liked myself.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_03: I couldn't say I loved myself, but I had to start and say I liked myself, and that I found so difficult.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_03: But it's all about building your confidence, your self-esteem, and you know, reclaiming your own power.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_03: And I still find that difficult.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_03: I'm still I still do that every day, but I still find that hard.
• 34:07
  SPEAKER_02: But again, it's this it's the in what stage of the journey you're on, isn't it?
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: I suppose.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: And it's but it's do you look back and think from where you were what's the what it's only a couple of years ago, isn't it?
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_02: From where you were a couple of years ago, then this must be the scale of it.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, is it a sharp what do you say it's you know it's been a sharp scale and then it's and then it's Peter and then then it's but it's still going up now, even though it's not a sharp it's definitely not b it's not linear at all.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's it's very much could be sideways or whatever.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_03: But as part of journaling, I found that I liked writing, and that sometimes when I'm stressed, upset, lots of words are spinning round in my head.
• 34:46
  SPEAKER_03: And if I put them on paper, they actually came out on paper as a poem.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really?
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_03: And I think I read one of them to Matt at one point, and he's like, You've got a really way with words, you're you're a writer.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_03: And I don't be ridiculous, I'm not a writer, I'm a nurse.
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_03: He's like, No, that's a limiting belief.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_03: That is right, that's really good.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_03: To the point that just a couple of months ago, I've had a poem published in a a book of poems.
• 35:11
  SPEAKER_04: Oh right.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_03: Actually was brave enough, encouraged to submit this poem, and it was accepted, and it's been published in a book of poems.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_02: And how did that make you have you got the book?
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_02: I do have the book.
• 35:22
  SPEAKER_02: Thought you might.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_02: How did it make you feel reading that?
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_03: I felt very proud of myself, and that's a word I've struggled with for such a long time.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_03: I rarely say it about myself.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_03: I wasn't allowed to say it about myself because it made me look arrogant and ugly and it wasn't attractive.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I I stopped saying that word because it just caused upset and trouble.
• 35:42
  SPEAKER_03: But I felt really proud when that word, when that poem was published.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_03: I bought two copies, one for me, and I gave one to my life coach just to say to the person who told me I could write.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_03: This is the first thing I've had published.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_03: And I say the first thing, because I've started writing a book about my story now.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really?
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_02: How f how's how we find that?
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_02: So what's to sort of let's go into this could be difficult, couldn't it?
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_03: Um but it is difficult.
• 36:09
  SPEAKER_02: So how far how far are you into that?
• 36:11
  SPEAKER_02: We've we've had um so a friend of mine, Kelvin James, that's he's wrote about his PTSD and losing his mum in horrific circumstances.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I think it were ten years it took him to write that.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_02: But because it took him deep into recalling all this incident, and then because he sat and I suppose I'm not putting words into your mouth, but because he's sat doing it, it's uh thinking about the incident.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_02: And going into detail.
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and I have gone into detail, but I do it as and when I feel I can.
• 36:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's not I don't have a time when I want to finish it.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_03: I started it probably about nine months ago, and it's by no means it's kind of it is finished, I think, but when I say I think that's because it's on loads of pieces of A4.
• 36:53
  SPEAKER_03: I'm old school, I can't do this on a component.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_02: Tell me about it, join me, join the club.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_03: It it's pen and paper, yeah.
• 36:59
  SPEAKER_03: And not in any semblance of an order did I write any of it down.
• 37:04
  SPEAKER_03: It was just a oh I yeah, I'll write that about that today.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_03: So now it's there must be hundreds of pieces of paper and I now need to put together in some kind of chronological order.
• 37:15
  SPEAKER_02: And would it be would you be looking at it published?
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if I'd want it to be.
• 37:19
  SPEAKER_03: I just want to see if I could actually write a book.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:22
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_03: But if I did, I probably go to the people that published the poem.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_02: How did you feel writing it and getting all these putting putting it all down onto into paper?
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_02: Onto paper, sorry.
• 37:33
  SPEAKER_03: It's quite horrific when you see written down what happened to you when you are sort of writing it down, you're like, it's almost as if it happened to somebody else.
• 37:41
  SPEAKER_03: When you look at it and you're like, that's horrible.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_03: But that was me.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_03: But it's also a little bit cathartic as well, getting it out there and out of my head and onto paper.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, it's yeah, it's a long way to go.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_03: But I just go back to it when I when I have time or when I feel like I want to.
• 37:58
  SPEAKER_02: And has it been written in chronological order?
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_02: But you're putting bits all your or is it right, I'm gonna write about this bit, I'm gonna write about that bitch.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_03: No, that's how I've done it, writing in bits and bars.
• 38:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_00: So do you think your time-limp therapy now helps you?
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, probably will do, yeah.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_03: I've kind of brought it up to present day going to a I take that concert in the city where the assault happened to me, brought it back to sort of almost taking back my power and not being afraid of going there anymore.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think you were quite alone.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_03: I was I didn't want to go to that place.
• 38:32
  SPEAKER_03: I moved back to Huddersfield and I never really wanted to go back there.
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I used to love going there shopping, and I just didn't want I didn't like that city anymore.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_03: It held too many memories, it triggered me, and the day that I was going to meet my friend there on the train, I was having a meltdown at the station, thinking I can't do this, I can't get on the train.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_03: But my life coach was amazing, and he was on the phone and till I got on the train and sat down.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_03: And then when I did it, I felt amazing because I'd done it.
• 39:05
  SPEAKER_00: It sounds like you're you're constantly getting little wins here.
• 39:08
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, but I think you don't celebrate them, you kind of do it and then move on to the next.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_03: And I think that's something that I need to get better at is to realise the wins and celebrate them.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_02: You alright?
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_03: I am, yeah.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think one thing that I you know, with me sort of outdoor work and stuff and getting people out on challenges and things, and I used to say to them, you know, much in as in On the Mountain and in life, it's not just about looking forward, but if you look back and see how far you've come, because I used to take that for myself.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_02: It's like when I think of some of the states that I were in, and you know and you were talking about writing there, and now we're thinking the writing that I did, which was it was a writing therapy.
• 39:48
  SPEAKER_02: And sometimes if I write now and I get stressed, I'm writing I honestly you couldn't you won't be able to read it.
• 39:53
  SPEAKER_02: It just just sends me in a different septic.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_02: It's now you know, it's turned into a bit of a a a laugh now, I accept it.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah but the the detail that came out through that writing.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_02: I had to wake up every morning and write an account of a an incident where two people were killed.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and attempts on my life and then trying to write every morning and then you wonder why I don't like writing.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_03: That's really tough.
• 40:15
  SPEAKER_02: And s you know, when I've been I've been on assessments and being putting right, you need to write your write these down in the time.
• 40:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm I've read it, I'm like, I've looked at it.
• 40:24
  SPEAKER_02: You'll need a mirror to read that, because you have to put it the other way around.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_02: It just fascinates me where the way the brain works.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I think what you said then, yeah, about them little wins, but you don't count them.
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_03: No, you don't.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: So something for for you like even just going out walking, which you've been instructed.
• 40:39
  SPEAKER_02: Uh in what I say, is instructed the wrong word?
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_02: Did you have to be instructed or I did have to be instructed.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, obviously.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, sometimes, I mean, again, that's if a life if your life coach is encouraging, you don't do it, and you like and you basically Yeah, they have been through well, then you haven't.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_02: And they can but if a good life coach can instruct you and say, listen, you need to do this, then that's brilliant, eh?
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_00: But even if the life coach is good and instructs you, I still feel there has to be a lot of strength within you and a lot of courage within you that you actually thrive towards change.
• 41:11
  SPEAKER_00: You want to make a difference, you want to change your future, and you want to understand maybe maybe what happened in the past and kind of accept it and move forward because this is your life, and you kind of want to find your way back to you.
• 41:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you know.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_00: Where did you get that from, sir?
• 41:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's our tagline.
• 41:26
  SPEAKER_00: You know, but it that kind of really fits it, doesn't it?
• 41:29
  SPEAKER_00: You want to find your way back to you.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you do, but I think you have to hit a lowest point, or at least I had to hit that lowest point where I didn't want to be here anymore.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_03: But I was scared as well that I was gonna actually do it, and the fact that I was eating like I was, I was more scared that I'd have a stroke or a heart attack.
• 41:48
  SPEAKER_02: But that would that be like comfort eating then as yeah, bad foods.
• 41:52
  SPEAKER_03: Intentionally to put weight on so as that men would not want to come anywhere near me, and that's not a good place to be.
• 42:00
  SPEAKER_03: It was horrible.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_03: And then I set up um an online support group called Flare Fact Life After Rape Exists.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_02: How how difficult was that to do?
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_03: Because obviously you're then It wasn't actually because when I got to that point, I knew that I didn't want other people to feel like I did.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_03: Where they didn't know where to turn or who to turn to, or they didn't want to go to therapy.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_03: And I always say, I'm not a therapist, I've lived experience and I I encourage them to go to therapy, but it's a space where they can share the journey of their therapy or their counselling on the way to healing, they can share their stories with other people who get it and who understand because sometimes you your friends don't get it, or you don't want to let them in because you're scared of them judging you, because you're not in a place where you could deal with any more sort of rejection or whatever.
• 42:54
  SPEAKER_03: So I started that.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_03: And the reason I chose flare, not just because it's an acronym or whatever you call them, but it's a flare is a signal you send out in the dark when you want help to find you.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_03: That is where I've got it.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_03: So the logo that I have has two hands, one coming from above, one coming from below, and there the touch, there is a light around it, specifically because that is how I felt.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_02: That's cool.
• 43:20
  SPEAKER_02: So you put some thought into that as well, aren't you?
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_02: So and how was it when you got the response for that for that?
• 43:25
  SPEAKER_02: There's people joining that and there are people in that, yeah.
• 43:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, definitely.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_03: And it's sad to see that there are people joining it because it's it means that other people have been through it, and there is the statistics are horrendous, actually.
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_03: Quite scary.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_03: So try not to look at them, but yeah.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_00: Probably not even fully visible the statistics.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_03: No, because there's so many that are not reported.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, just not which makes it even scarier.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, it does.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_02: But how does it make well not not a but how does it make you feel that you're now helping others that have been in something similar to yourself?
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_03: That's why I'm here.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_03: Because I want it people to see that there is a you can get a life back.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_03: I don't have it all figured out.
• 44:06
  SPEAKER_03: I do still get upset, I do still get triggered, but I can pull myself back and I keep going.
• 44:12
  SPEAKER_03: And I want other people to keep going, to reach out and get help.
• 44:16
  SPEAKER_03: Because I don't want people to stay where they are, stuck in that terrible place.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_03: It's just it's just horrible.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_03: I mean the poem I wrote is called From Victim to Survivor.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_02: So where can where can people see that?
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_03: It is in Soul Valley poems number four, it's the fourth one.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_03: I can read it if you want, it's on my phone.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, why not?
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_02: Why not?
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_03: Victim was just a word to me, one filled with sadness and empathy.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_03: However, now after the attack, victim is a way of life for me.
• 44:47
  SPEAKER_03: It's the world with some degree of sympathy.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_03: Victim is what they made me confident no more.
• 44:54
  SPEAKER_03: A quivering wreck who daren't go past her own front door.
• 44:58
  SPEAKER_03: Bubbly and fun, that girl's gone.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_03: Afraid to dress up nice, afraid it may entice another attack, afraid to even begin to fight back.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_03: But victim is from where I'll have to make my stand because I want to move on.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_03: I need a hand, the hand of friendship from someone who cares.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_03: That's all it will take to begin to recover and to start to believe it's not my mistake.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_03: Victim is a world from which I want to move away, but I'm sure I will revisit it on some days.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_03: So please don't turn away.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_03: This victim needs your help today, so that she can begin to say, No longer a victim am I, but a survivor with her head held high.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that is good.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't it very deep?
• 45:48
  SPEAKER_02: Very deep, yeah.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, you are a survivor, aren't you?
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_03: Yes.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_02: Was there a moment when you thought I'm actually a survivor, not a victim now?
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_03: Not really.
• 45:57
  SPEAKER_03: I just it's sort of a gradual process, but now I don't want to be a survivor.
• 46:02
  SPEAKER_03: I want to be a thriver.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_03: I want to do things for myself.
• 46:07
  SPEAKER_03: I set up a cake business now, called a piece of cake, and I started a group, a Facebook group called Back to Basics, where I'm helping people cook from scratch who say they can't cook or they're too busy to cook.
• 46:21
  SPEAKER_03: And the reason I'm doing that is because my cooking was ridiculed and I was humiliated all the time, and the kitchen became a place that I hated, I dreaded.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_03: And then when I realized that it was nothing to do with me or my cook, it was all about him.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I just found the joy in cooking, and now I want to share it with other people.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_02: So you're facing all these things that were sort of taken away from you, aren't they?
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 46:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_03: I'm getting them back.
• 46:46
  SPEAKER_03: I'm thriving now.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_03: I make it sound easy, but it isn't.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_03: Well I don't mean to make it sound easy.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_03: It's not, believe me, but it is worth it.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_00: But you are thriving.
• 46:55
  SPEAKER_00: You are helping yourself and you're helping others.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_03: That's the thing.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_03: I want to help others.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, you don't know, I'll go put this.
• 47:03
  SPEAKER_02: You might be thinking you're not thriving.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_02: Because I would always like that.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_02: I was just surviving, but other people think you're thriving.
• 47:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I mean, because of seeing these gains, but because you have them little knockbacks now and again.
• 47:12
  SPEAKER_02: I still have knockbacks.
• 47:13
  SPEAKER_02: I had a big knockback in May, which I really struggled with, but and then things sort of take you back down a peg.
• 47:19
  SPEAKER_03: Oh yeah, it still happens.
• 47:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_03: Happens all the time.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_03: Back in June, July, I decided I wanted to start going swimming again.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_03: Put my swimsuit on and had a huge flashback.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_03: Couldn't go out the house.
• 47:31
  SPEAKER_03: And it's like, oh I've still not got over it.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_03: I should be better than this.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_03: But you you don't know when a flashback's gonna happen.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_03: It's not like a panic attack where you can feel it happening.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_03: It literally just comes over, it takes over.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_03: But I did go the following week.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't go that day, I couldn't, and I had to sit with it's being okay with that and learning that it's okay to have these things, that it is normal.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_03: And I think we'll always be like that, but that perhaps won't be as severe or as often.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_02: Well, from personal experience, yeah, I think you're right.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_02: I know uh I think sometimes people look for from they've had mental health challenges and they'll look it's a there has to be a quick fix, and it's not gonna happen, is it?
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sorry to say to most people, it's not gonna happen.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's it's this thing for myself.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_02: I know definitely I need to be exercising, I need to be with the community.
• 48:24
  SPEAKER_02: I need I I need nature.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_02: I love I I need to cuddle trees and stuff like that.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's just my makeup, and it might not be for everyone else, but for yourself, you're helping other people and you're doing your baking and you're getting back to all these things that you wanted to do.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_02: So it's it's there's not that one thing, is there?
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's not just one piece in that jigsaw.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_02: It is a jigsaw, and all these little pieces are around it to make to complete it.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I'm just seeing what else I am capable of, and I like everything, but I get scared and I taught myself out of doing so many things.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_03: And I could have talked myself out of doing this, and then I'm reminded by my cook, you're not doing this, it's not about it's about that one person that might be listening, that needs to hear what you've got to say, that might then go and get some help.
• 49:08
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_03: And when you're reminded about that, then you just think, yeah, I've got to, yeah, I have to.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, that's that's the reason we started this, isn't it?
• 49:16
  SPEAKER_02: All together, isn't it?
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_02: You know that remember that's that's the reason why we're still here.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because one person messaged us saying they were listening, because we're only doing ten originally, and some one person had tried to set their own life and were laid in hospital listening to us and saying, I think that you know it's a it's brilliant.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's 'cause we spread it, you know, hopefully doing it in a variety of accents, can't we?
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, so what's the future all for yourself and what's the is there a plan?
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_03: I would like to get better at this so that I can maybe become an ambassador for other people and speak on more podcasts on stages, just to say to show to the world that it's not the end and that you do have to work hard to get what do you mean by getting better at this?
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_02: There's been nothing wrong with now.
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't if you mean by not showing emotion and stuff, then No, I know that that's always gonna happen.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_03: In the nature of what you're talking about, it's n it should never not upset people, especially you because you've lived it, but you're not there now.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_03: And that feel is quite empowering to know that you're not there now.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_03: But there are times, you know, even now, that I put I've got a red coat on and I'll sit and I'll think something's gonna happen now, I'm wearing red.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_03: And it doesn't, and so then I think, okay, well, I might wear it again.
• 50:27
  SPEAKER_03: And it's just it's a lot of hard work and a lot of repetition, because I guess they say is it repetition, it's mastery sort of thing.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_03: It's key.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah, yeah.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_03: Or the key to ma the key to mastery is repetition.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, got it the wrong way around, but that's very typical of me.
• 50:43
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you for coming in.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for having me.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you for thank you for bringing your story to us.
• 50:50
  SPEAKER_03: Is there anything else you'd like to say or a bit of advice for anyone that's if anyone is in a relationship that is difficult or abusive and they want to reach out for help, but they know they can't use the foot, they can't speak, or the phones might be checked, then the Samaritans now have a chat box feature.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_03: And once you've finished chatting, it's invisible.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_03: They can't see who you were chatting to or what was said.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_03: So that is a safe, a safe duck, a safer way of being able to reach out and talk to someone and get advice and help.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_03: Because they can pro they can sort of promote the the right people for you to go to for that particular issue.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_03: They'll listen and then they'll be able to provide you with the people that can help you the most.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_03: And it will all be done at your pace.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_03: But it's just that feature is relatively new.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_04: Right.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so a lot of people might not be aware of that.
• 51:40
  SPEAKER_03: It's only been in probably about 18 months, two years or so that they've been using that.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_02: So I just I didn't know about that.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_03: I wanted to say that.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, right.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you very much.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 51:52
  SPEAKER_02: And big up yourself for uh support, you know.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_02: For coming across and then coming and talking with us.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, as you say if one person is this.
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think it, I think it'll be more than one person without a doubt.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_02: So thank you from them.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, just be safe.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_01: And if you'd like to support us and help us keep the podcast going, then you can go to buy us a coffee or you can click that on our website, whitefoxtalking.com, and look for the little cup.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.