Latest / The FEEL Podcast: Women’s Empowerment, Emotional Wellness and Self-Leadership with Melissa Crook / Living Her Authentic Truth: Mental Health, Boundaries & Integrative Healing with Lindsay Kerr

Transcript

Living Her Authentic Truth: Mental Health, Boundaries & Integrative Healing with Lindsay Kerr · The FEEL Podcast: Women’s Empowerment, Emotional Wellness and Self-Leadership with Melissa Crook

0:10
Hello feel podcast, audience. Welcome back to the Pod.
0:13
This week I am here with Lindsay Kerr.
0:17
Lindsay is someone that I came in contact through the fact that
0:21
she was one of our very first feel podcast followers on
0:25
Instagram. She is been with us from the
0:27
very beginning following, and Supporting what we post and what
0:31
we talked about what we do and through that, I've been able to
0:35
also follow her and learn more about her.
0:38
Ironically, she lives here in Lubbock, so which is not always
0:41
the case, when you kind of go social with all of these things
0:44
and they're available to an you know around the world with all
0:47
our podcast, links and websites and other things.
0:51
So that was kind of a fun thing. And then I realized as I was
0:54
following her in her work, in the therapy world that My
1:00
husband and, and I have researched some of the things in
1:04
areas, she works in and Bradys actually participated in some of
1:06
this stuff never met Lindsay before a bit kind of.
1:09
So it's kind of like oh my gosh, such a small world, you just
1:12
never know who you're going to run into and and who you've had
1:15
contact with the whole six degrees of separation of think
1:18
it's shrinks down really quickly.
1:21
Lindsay's character traits that I she asked me to introduce her
1:24
by our playful empathetic and inspired Lindsay.
1:29
Welcome, so much to the field podcast.
1:31
I'm so happy to have you here. Thank you, Melissa.
1:34
I'm happy to be here. All right, so we are going to
1:36
jump right in and I cannot wait for you all to hear what she has
1:40
to share today. I think that we're going to be
1:43
able to talk about some things that maybe you haven't heard
1:47
about in a while. Or you haven't heard about in a
1:50
way that's necessarily accurate. So, I'm going to ask you to
1:53
listen to this, and be willing to be curious and be willing to
1:58
rethink old. Narratives that you've been told
2:02
about some things because I think there's some really,
2:05
There's No One path to healing and self care and therapy and
2:11
being your best self. There's a lot of different paths
2:15
that you can take and Lindsay's going to be able to offer up
2:19
some really interesting information within that that I
2:22
think if you're if I know that when we're willing to take a
2:26
look at it, we have found to be very supportive and helpful in
2:29
kind of some Non-traditional areas other.
2:31
It's becoming it's not mainstream yet, but we're at
2:35
least having conversations again.
2:36
And you all will understand what I'm talking about.
2:38
As we get into this conversation Lindsay's to start out with.
2:42
And I think this has to probably be very important for you
2:45
because of the line of work that you are in, is how to prioritize
2:49
self-care in your life and what that looks like for you.
2:52
Yeah, well, thank you for the intro and I think we will kind
2:55
of expand upon, you know what you're alluding to.
3:00
I am a mental health therapist and self-care is of the essence,
3:04
both in my work for myself and then it's often talked about
3:08
with the people that I work with.
3:10
So I think starting with myself, I am a single mother and I
3:17
recognize that self care for me is never perfect and it's not
3:22
static. I think that making sure that I
3:27
noticed for myself, that it isn't just this one Wine way of
3:31
being. And it's actually always
3:33
changing its changing based on my needs.
3:35
And then also as my daughter grows up and her needs.
3:38
So, giving myself the willingness to sometimes mess
3:41
up. I think is a big piece of
3:43
self-care and to recognize when I overextend and then learn, you
3:47
know, from that moment to say like, okay this doesn't feel
3:51
good and then how can I move back into practices that really
3:54
support me? So I've been a therapist for
3:58
around 15 years. I got my And 2007, and I did
4:04
burn out. So I had a moment of time where
4:07
I left the field of psychotherapy and was only
4:11
teaching yoga and was actually working as a barista here in
4:15
Lubbock. And I got back into the career
4:17
in 2019. And so, I think having that also
4:23
an experience where it became too much and some things happen
4:27
in my life, where I think now, Now that I have the evidence of
4:31
what that feels like, I'm really able to prioritize self-care
4:35
because I don't want to. I love my work so much and I
4:39
don't want her to, you know, experience that again because
4:42
it's really important to me to be here.
4:44
So I think prioritizing is a constant conversation with
4:49
myself and then with my daughter because it impacts her the most
4:53
and a lot of times that is, you know, making sure that I have a
4:57
morning where I take good care of myself.
5:00
Before I see clients, it's sometimes also recognizing how
5:04
many people I can work with with within a week and even though I
5:07
want to schedule that one little slot on my calendar that is open
5:12
but all the slots don't need to be open and filled.
5:15
They actually, there needs to be time that is just open for
5:19
openness and spaciousness. And so learning that dance and
5:23
knowing that it is always a dance that I'm kind of
5:26
oscillating with inside. Yeah, absolutely.
5:29
You too? Each had so many important
5:30
things are one as a mom. As a parent, you're constantly
5:34
having to be flexible because they seasons change.
5:38
They've got piano lessons, they got a recital, they've got a
5:40
game, they've got a dance thing. They've got a, you know,
5:43
whatever something going on at school, whatever, it may be, or
5:46
they just need to spend some time with you.
5:48
And so, you know, being able to adjust that but not neglecting
5:51
it. Because I think so many times
5:53
mom's just, like, forget it. I'm not even to put my effort
5:56
into it, and then all of a sudden they're just fried So
6:00
just that importance and being willing to be flexible and
6:03
recognizing it's a dance and it's going to change but staying
6:07
with it and being consistent with it because you used a great
6:09
example. I appreciate your honesty about
6:11
how the fact that you had to step away for a while and
6:14
re-examine and how important that is to be willing to do that
6:18
for yourself and to step back. And just be like, I am not at
6:25
the capacity. I need to be to be in this space
6:28
and I think so many times were unwilling.
6:29
Willing to step back and we wait too long and we stay in spaces
6:34
for too long and then it just grows and becomes more prominent
6:38
when it comes out in a way that you really didn't want it to
6:41
come out in and that can happen, obviously your line of work
6:45
where you're taking you're listening to other people's
6:48
experiences and their traumas and then you've got to, you've
6:52
got to leave space because I think you talked about a person
6:54
thing to leaving space to take that all in and release it.
6:58
Not take it on yourself and I love to eat address the stepping
7:02
away and coming back and to address the leaving enough space
7:05
in your calendar. So that your capacity doesn't
7:08
become over drawn. And you're, you know, you're
7:12
allowing yourself to be able to take this information and then
7:15
do what you need to do, take care of yourself to be the best.
7:18
You can be for your clients for yourself for your daughter.
7:21
All of those things, I think that's really important.
7:24
Yeah. But with what was the key was
7:26
there? A key thing?
7:27
Was there a time because she went back in and 20:19 the year
7:31
before a pandemic, me what? A time to be a therapist of my
7:34
word over these last couple of years.
7:36
It was there something that kind of let you know you were ready
7:39
to go back in. Yeah, I mean I think that as a
7:43
as a yoga teacher and as a barista I still was offering
7:48
support and and then at the same time I had an offer to work with
7:55
somebody doing something very unique, which we do here at De
7:58
novo therapy. So I think that while I was
8:02
practicing as a clinician, whenever I was younger, I didn't
8:05
necessarily have the tools that I have now.
8:08
And so, it was after doing some work and getting back into kind
8:13
of working one-on-one with people whether or not that was
8:15
doing some coaching work or doing private yoga session, just
8:19
recognizing that, that is a passion of mine.
8:22
And so, I also felt like whenever I had been in practice
8:27
before I didn't really have the tools that were now Available to
8:31
mental health clinicians being that, you know, we really
8:35
understood trauma a little bit better.
8:37
So in 2019, there was an opportunity presented with me to
8:41
work in partnership with de novo therapy where we now have
8:46
treatments that weren't available to me in the, you
8:50
know, I guess I graduated in 2007 at that point, a lot of
8:55
psychotherapy was based on kind of cognitive behavioral work,
8:58
and then I started working People that had severe trauma
9:02
and I think that at the time I didn't feel like I had the
9:06
capacity to do a lot of healing. And now we do understand trauma
9:11
a lot more and we have tools to provide a healing space and
9:17
really I think the most empowering thing is that it's
9:19
not necessarily what I provide but we know that everybody has
9:23
an inner healing intelligence and it's just you know giving
9:26
them the tools to allow that inner healing too.
9:30
To happen. I love that term.
9:32
Inner healing intelligence, I haven't heard that before I
9:34
think that's a really important term and to understand that we
9:37
all possess that so within that coming back in this kind of goes
9:41
nicely into it confidently. Setting boundaries you talked
9:44
about earlier about capacity and leaving space between sessions
9:49
and not feet, you know, resisting the urge to load up
9:52
but so talk and then you're also a mom and a daughter, you know
9:55
you know these things and making time for self-care so talk about
9:58
confidently setting boundaries and how that For you.
10:01
Ooh yeah. I mean I think that again just
10:03
like the prioritizing self-care that this is always something
10:07
that I'm kind of checking in with myself around because
10:11
sometimes I have a lot of energy and capacity to take on more and
10:15
then there's some times that I feel like I need to really, you
10:19
know, spend a lot of time being alone and having more
10:22
introspection. And I think, for me, it's to
10:26
understand that like we have an image of boundaries that it's
10:28
not a brick wall at. Least in my mind it's more of
10:31
kind of like it's like a baby gate or something but you can
10:37
move around and kind of figure out for yourself.
10:40
I mean I think that you know, one of the things that's been
10:43
helpful is to really have trustworthy people in my life
10:46
that respect boundaries. So always kind of checking in
10:50
and slowing down for myself too. Before I say yes I'll do that is
10:55
really. Is this a true?
10:56
Yes. Or is this an overextension?
11:00
Of my time as a yoga teacher. I learned pretty quickly that I
11:04
could teach every single day of the week.
11:06
And then I'd be working every day we of the week.
11:09
But in my mind, I had thought while I teach yoga, like, I'm
11:11
just doing yoga. Yeah.
11:13
But then I realized that even if I taught an hour class on a
11:16
Sunday that take the, it took up, you know, four hours of the
11:20
day. And that would mean a day away
11:23
from my kids. So I have some non-negotiables
11:26
and which is that I don't work on Sundays, you know, Why I try
11:30
to make sure that her and eyes time together is set in the
11:35
times that we can be together a few days of the week.
11:38
I won't take after 5:00 clients, different things like that.
11:41
So yeah, it's been really helpful.
11:43
Absolutely. I think we do have to have those
11:45
non-negotiables and kind of set those and be clear with those so
11:49
that we can both honor them and, and express clearly it because I
11:53
think the yoga thing would be tricky, but even as it one,
11:57
who's doing the yoga class, you're still giving of yourself.
12:00
Even though you're doing therapeutic comforting feel good
12:05
type exercise. It's still a giving of your
12:08
energy to help others do that too.
12:11
So being able to delineate when you're doing that just when it's
12:13
just your up the focus on you and your well-being versus when
12:17
you're sharing that and espousing that out to other
12:20
people that there is a difference there.
12:21
So I think that good and that can be tricky because if you get
12:24
real easy like this would be great for me all day like.
12:27
All right. Wait a minute.
12:28
Yeah. In the fridge, Yeah, and the
12:30
same with, you know, I think being a mental health therapist,
12:34
it's like her. I could schedule seven clients
12:38
and a day, but I have to think about how I'm going to feel the
12:41
next day and so I have have learned, you know?
12:45
Okay, well, I may not be the type of person that can see
12:48
seventh clients in a day. And so that's his also goes
12:51
into, just not comparing myself to others.
12:53
Yeah. Because other people can do
12:55
that, which is great. And then maybe that isn't
12:59
necessarily the same. Thing that's helpful for me,
13:02
right? Absolutely.
13:03
And we'll get into that later when we talk about expectations
13:05
because I think that's a very important thing to address
13:09
taking care of our emotional health as much as our physical
13:12
health. I am a firm believer that these
13:15
things are connected. So talk to me about your journey
13:17
with that and your knowledge about that.
13:19
So yeah, I love this question and I do believe that they're
13:24
connected and thankfully science is now you know taking a stand
13:27
that route, those as well. I mean I think Think that it's
13:31
felt obvious for me in that regard.
13:33
But now to say, like, okay this is all connected through our
13:38
nervous system really. And so I mean, I think for me,
13:42
it is it's a deeper listening and we talked a lot about like,
13:47
top-down or bottom-up. And sometimes, the message has
13:50
come bottom up, so it is through the body that we start to really
13:54
feel our emotions and and connecting with, you know, what
13:59
is what is that Little kind of, you know, nuanced experience
14:03
that I'm noticing in my gut. What is that saying to me?
14:07
And then, you know, there is this top-down method as well
14:11
where you might look at, okay? Let me look at what my thoughts
14:14
are thinking and how my emotions feel, and then how that settles
14:18
into my body. And so, they're both happening
14:21
and it's how we decide to kind of look at them.
14:25
I think, for me, something that you had said earlier was like,
14:28
oh look, you had the willingness to To take a break.
14:31
I don't think it was willingness, it was almost your
14:33
body screaming at you. And that's where I think we want
14:37
to make sure we don't get to that because eventually
14:40
something will it's like what's going to get our attention?
14:44
And usually the body is going to be the thing that gets the
14:46
attention and so we can take care of the body so that it
14:50
doesn't have to do that but we can also take care of our
14:52
emotions so that the body doesn't have to scream at us and
14:57
it's something. We're carrying in our body at it
14:59
in a way that It's detrimental. Yes.
15:02
Yeah, it's I think it's the most physical.
15:05
So we're going to finally take the the due diligence to take
15:09
care of it. But the messages could have been
15:11
coming through more subtle experiences before it has to
15:16
wake us up with an injury or feeling completely depleted or
15:19
whatever. Well, yeah, I mean and, you
15:21
know, I started this podcast to have these conversations because
15:24
I got to a breaking point. When I was when we first moved
15:27
here to Lubbock, I ended up in the ER twice.
15:30
The first two weeks of two, three weeks of September about
15:34
things that I came out at the end of the day.
15:36
I mean, I was in the, ER, twice. So a cardiologist, you know, you
15:41
know, got my hormones checked, the whole nine yards, and it was
15:43
like, it was just came down to things.
15:45
I had not processed and moved through there, like you're
15:48
physically, okay, but you've got this other stuff and that's when
15:52
my husband looked at me. He's like, it might be time to
15:54
get back into therapy because I hadn't been in therapy since my
15:57
early 30s. And, you know, Take these things
16:00
that we sometimes discover where we deal with and walk through as
16:04
we feel safe doing so, and our brains, just won't release or
16:09
allow us, I think to do things until we're in a safe space, you
16:12
could speak to that, probably much better than me, but for me,
16:15
it was just like, all right, I didn't have to get here.
16:19
So and what I want to do is talk about.
16:23
So the hopefully women that are younger or even ones that are my
16:25
age or older, they're in this space feel the freedom to like,
16:28
let's dive in. Let's have these conversations.
16:30
Processions, let's make these connect points, let's and so
16:33
that we can live, our best freest, lives, and that carrying
16:37
all this unprocessed stuff and have some tools to do so.
16:42
So and this e 0 and this all these talking points are kind of
16:45
led to that but yeah, you know. So we both you and I had that
16:48
experience. All right, wait a minute, we
16:49
don't have to get here. We can we can do, we can do this
16:52
better and we're going to do it better moving forward.
16:56
How can we support ourselves and other women in In
17:00
unapologetically because we don't live in a world that makes
17:04
us feel like it's safe to do so, for sure.
17:08
Yeah, I would argue Texas. Especially yeah, well, I mean, I
17:16
think that we offer women the opportunity to live
17:19
unapologetically when we do so ourselves.
17:22
I mean, I think that like, even just having this conversation
17:25
with you. Like I am, you're modeling
17:28
living in your authentic. True.
17:30
Ruth. And that is when people will
17:32
take that away and say oh wow, you know, she really just feels
17:37
really authentic whenever I'm around her and I think that that
17:40
is what gives people the courage to live in their truth.
17:45
Yeah. And so I mean I try to do that
17:46
as much as I can. Of course, I think part of it is
17:49
unpacking old narratives and that's what I really try in.
17:53
My work is like where did this story come in that that I was
17:58
supposed to feel this way? And this You know, both for
18:00
myself. But that's a lot of the work
18:02
that I do with my clients, like, where did this story come from?
18:05
And it is it something we want to keep, because sometimes it
18:08
is, sometimes, it's a beautiful value system.
18:10
That feels really integrated into your whole person and then
18:14
sometimes it's something that like doesn't really fit anymore
18:17
because we've grown our culture has expanded and grown.
18:22
And so then you get to say, Hey, you know, that doesn't really
18:24
work for me anymore. And so I think it's, you know,
18:28
being bold with things that we say Say, and even if it's
18:30
something that we've progressed saying, just, you know, kind of
18:34
being willing to apologize or whatever it is.
18:36
But it's also, you know, being creative in the way that we
18:39
dress, or really taking courageous steps into doing
18:44
things that were excited about. But kind of feel timid about.
18:48
I mean, I could imagine starting a podcast was one thing that
18:51
you're like I want to do this. How do I do this?
18:54
You know, and then when you just say well why not and then you
18:58
take the leap and do it. Yeah, and I think that's yeah,
19:01
you said so many and I think really important things is one
19:04
give that giving that kind of invites other people.
19:07
And when they see you, living authentically, invites other
19:10
women in and people into feel like it's safe to do the same
19:13
with you and that that's a space.
19:15
That is a great space to occupy. And also just I think just
19:19
continuing to be curious. I mean, I think so many times we
19:23
assign truth to thoughts and narratives rather than stories
19:28
rather than just looking at her. Thoughts and stories and being
19:31
willing to pull them apart and decide if they're true or if
19:34
they used to be true, but they're not anymore.
19:36
We just automatically assigned truth to it.
19:38
And just stopping and pausing because good or bad of the
19:42
stories and thoughts that we have.
19:44
They're going to change throughout your life and through
19:47
the different seasons. You go through.
19:48
And so being willing to pull those apart and recognize the
19:51
difference between them. And that's, I think that's a
19:55
really important. And then having those
19:56
conversations with other people, then that frees them up.
20:00
You liked it. Oh, maybe I should do that too.
20:01
Maybe that's something I should dive into.
20:04
I mean I will tell you that starting this podcast was
20:07
probably one of the I was sitting the other day and kind
20:09
of thinking about just kind of the fears and things that we
20:13
don't do because of the narratives and stories we hear
20:15
from our backgrounds being a woman, whatever it is.
20:19
And the podcast, I told my husband, when we decide it, came
20:22
out of a dream wall on my husband's birthday that he
20:26
wanted to do and he's doing some stuff from his dream while to
20:29
Minds. Just more public because it's
20:31
podcast. Yeah, it was one of the first
20:33
things I did were I just went into and was just kind of free
20:38
of expectation or like, I'm just, I feel like this is
20:43
something I can offer to the world.
20:44
I feel like this is a space. I can make an impact in, so
20:49
let's just see what happens. And I'm, that's not how I
20:53
normally operate. So, but there's something so
20:56
freed in that and then when you have those conversations other
20:58
people, then it's like, Okay. Maybe, you know, that's kind of
21:01
an example. I try to talk about that because
21:03
then hopefully, that inspires something in them will that will
21:06
give them the kind of the inspiration.
21:09
Courage, you know, push, whatever it is to get to
21:12
approach things, the same way. Yeah, I always think of this
21:16
story. I was told, actually I was doing
21:18
a lactation training and it kind of reminds me.
21:22
I use it a lot because why we have to like, ask where these
21:25
these ideas come from. And I think it's like they the,
21:28
the story goes like, A woman's making a ham for a family around
21:32
the holidays and she cuts the ends.
21:34
Off the ham and her partner is like well why do you cut the
21:37
ends off the ham and she's like, I don't know, my mom just did it
21:40
and she's like, okay well when your mom gets here let's ask her
21:43
why she cuts the ends off the ham.
21:44
So the mom comes why do we cut the ends up the hams?
21:47
I don't know, my mom just did, it's like, okay, well, when she
21:50
gets here, why don't we ask her why she cuts the ends of the
21:53
hand. So she gets there.
21:54
Why do we cut the ends off of him?
21:56
She was like oh my pot was just too small it wouldn't fit in so
22:00
I just hope it brings up for him so it can fit.
22:03
So sometimes you're doing that, we're recreating these things
22:07
which really, you know, maybe we need to stop and take a look at
22:09
it and everybody we just kind of keep doing it.
22:12
We don't ask questions. That's the thing.
22:14
That's so funny is how many of those things are?
22:18
We just doing with like, okay, wait a minute, let me let's stop
22:21
and analyze that. Let's revisit news.
22:23
Is this still apple or even necessary?
22:26
Or do I need to, to change waves and I I think it's just such
22:30
human nature that we're so habit you know faced and we don't stop
22:34
and everyone once while and do like a check in.
22:36
Yeah I love people doing that with like the top sheet like so
22:40
many people are like yes, have a top sheet.
22:42
You know, and that that becomes this bigger story in their life
22:46
like oh I can do it differently. You know, it's empowering the
22:51
top sheet is such a bad example because I've continued to have a
22:54
top sheet because I grew up with the top sheet.
22:57
My kids hate the top sheet there like that.
23:00
Ended up getting kicked to the end of the bed like their whole
23:02
lives. They don't do one.
23:03
I kept doing the top sheet into their like there was literally
23:07
like taking it off their bed and throwing it on the floor.
23:10
I was just so like, yeah, it's another layer between you and
23:13
the comforter and they're just like this is stupid and I and I
23:17
still do it, but that's so funny.
23:19
You said, example because my kids were like yes my mother is
23:21
that. Oh my gosh, I'll write the
23:25
importance of setting and coming back to your why and your
23:29
values. In everything you do.
23:31
So the work that we do at De novo is unique and I think I
23:36
already said but I realize that not everything is for everybody.
23:40
So I say this and then I'll kind of describe our work just
23:44
because maybe people that are, you know, listening to your
23:48
podcast, might be interested or have had some Curiosities.
23:51
Or like I said, have maybe tried a bunch of things in aren't
23:55
necessarily getting to where they want to get in their story.
23:59
Is so first of all I say the way that I work as a mental health
24:03
therapist is not linear and this I think is maybe a theme
24:06
throughout my whole interview here which is that you know we
24:11
have to be willing to get it wrong and and to stumble and to
24:17
circle around it's usually more of a spiral than it is
24:21
necessarily a straight line. Yeah and so when I came back
24:26
into being a mental health therapist in 20:19 the director
24:32
of de novo had approached me asking me if I wanted to embark
24:35
on this opportunity with him. And what we do is offer ketamine
24:41
assisted Psychotherapy, where we use non-ordinary States Of
24:45
Consciousness to help people with PTSD, depression and
24:50
anxiety. So ketamine is a anesthetic and
24:55
actually is really safe. It's used often in Veterinary.
25:00
And medicine with children in. So what's nice about it is that
25:07
while it relaxes the body, we use it and really low doses.
25:11
It also is not going to be depressing the respiratory
25:15
system. So some anesthetics do that
25:17
sure. However, when they first found
25:20
the substance or it was first synthesized and they were using
25:23
it in an estate anesthesia, there was something called an
25:27
emergence effect and we actually work that so it elicits a
25:31
psychedelic experience. Hmm.
25:34
And it again being really safe was popularized in the Vietnam
25:40
War, actually has something called the Buddy drug because
25:44
combat veterans could have ketamine on them and when their
25:49
friend got injured, they could give them the injection and it
25:52
was enough that they could actually get off the battlefield
25:55
Battlefield and get back to actually have surgery.
25:57
So, oh wow. So that's kind of cool.
26:02
So the way we use it is both with Ivy.
26:06
So people can come in and get about a 40-minute Ivy, and in my
26:12
office it's kind of mean assisted Psychotherapy.
26:15
So the way that we use it is an intramuscular injection, we work
26:19
with practitioners. So our office is also a blend of
26:23
medical and therapeutic modalities.
26:27
We have, I think when I initially started, With Ben, it
26:30
was me and him, and a doctor in the, in 2019.
26:35
And now we have about five to six therapists that work with
26:38
us, as well as multiple medical team members.
26:42
So we have a nurse practitioner, a few paramedics that come in,
26:47
and do the medicine work also. And okay, so just to give you
26:51
kind of an idea of what the sessions look like with me.
26:53
It's a two-hour session. I usually like to have some
26:57
rapport with my clients because it is You know, it's different
27:01
people that have never had anything like this is we want to
27:04
make sure that they're building trust with me and trust with the
27:07
medicine and trust with our whole staff here.
27:09
And so initially they'll come in after doing it in take with our
27:14
medical side of the facility will have about a 30 minute
27:18
conversation about what we're doing.
27:20
It's an intention setting space to look at you know if we are
27:25
addressing certain traumas or there is even maybe just this
27:28
underlying Feeling of self-doubt or something that we're really
27:32
trying to use the medicine for I mean, I think we share the
27:35
intention that they just want to feel better.
27:37
That's kind of a broad stroke of an intention.
27:40
Sure. And it kind of goes with the old
27:44
understanding of how these substances work, which is set
27:46
and setting, so the mindset and that's what we're trying to get.
27:50
The intention around is that mindset is for healing and then
27:54
we as a facility share that mindset and then the setting
27:58
it's a really safe. So they'll after we spend about
28:03
30 minutes kind of talking about the intention then they'll
28:06
receive the injection from our medical staff and then it's a
28:10
20-minute Half-Life. So usually there's a second dose
28:12
given in about a 40-minute art of being in this.
28:16
Not an ordinary State of Consciousness.
28:18
I often say ketamine is kind of like a dream so it's almost like
28:21
yeah, I'm holding space for a dream state and sometimes people
28:26
will talk through it. Sometimes people will stay
28:28
pretty quiet and Then afterwards we have you know another 45
28:32
minutes to kind of dive into content that came up throughout
28:35
the experience, to link it back to their intention.
28:39
I use the word inner healing intelligence earlier and the way
28:43
that I like to think about it is our bodies heal.
28:46
And we know that because we can see a cut and, you know, you'll
28:49
have a cut and then weeks later it will, but it is important to
28:54
not kind of like pick the scab or anything like that.
28:57
Sure. Some with a broken bone that You
28:59
can break a bone and then maybe it gets set in the cast.
29:03
Well, the cast isn't what's doing the healing, the cast is
29:06
giving the body, the containment, so the body can do
29:10
the healing and so same with, you know, the therapy that we're
29:13
offering as well as the not ordinary State of Consciousness.
29:17
It's not doing the healing but it is like the cast so that you
29:20
can actually get into these deeper layers to process the
29:24
trauma. Yeah, absolutely.
29:26
Absolutely. And I can tell you from you, you
29:29
know, kind of seeing this be done that.
29:33
There's a lot of power in it, but it also I think and this is
29:36
true and anything going, your, you got to go into it with a
29:40
mindset of trust and safety, or it's just going to be, you're
29:46
not going to get out of the experience, I think and I think
29:49
that's true for anything therapeutic.
29:51
Quite honestly, they going to respond spaces, where it feels
29:55
like it's safe to respond, but I think it's a really important
29:59
therapy. That's Out there an alternative.
30:00
And I'm so glad you shared about it and just also just the safety
30:04
department, this leads nicely into living out of your own
30:08
expectations versus others because you go back into in 2019
30:12
into a therapy that still coming back in and being allowed to be
30:17
practiced and there's, you know, still some people out there,
30:20
there were like oh, it's this, woo, that your whatever,
30:23
they're, they're extracting because they're uncomfortable
30:26
because they don't know. So talk about that and the Ian's
30:29
that you live on yourself versus those other kind of external
30:32
ones and then also just in your life.
30:34
But I think this just ties really nicely into that.
30:37
When I think it kind of goes back into what we had said
30:39
earlier the conversation about how to live in your truth and,
30:43
you know, to work really just without asking permission right
30:48
and write something. I bought.
30:49
I've been saying recently, as like I'm in people pleaser
30:51
recovery, which is great. And yet the people in my life
30:55
right now that sadly the people around me are bearing, the brunt
30:58
of that had they met Me, you know, 15 years ago would have
31:01
been doing a lot more all the time.
31:03
But yeah, I mean, I think I already had had some experiences
31:08
that really allowed me to believe in these medicines, and
31:12
we're in this psychedelic Renaissance.
31:14
And then I like to remind people that it's not necessarily a
31:18
Renaissance, it has been going on in indigenous Traditions or
31:22
yes, since it is continued going on.
31:24
So even though in the Western World, the war on drugs and
31:28
everything kind of started, Topped the scientific
31:31
understandings of how they work with mental health or they've
31:34
continued to be used in in Traditions around the world.
31:37
So I like to remind. Yeah, well that and I think my
31:40
belief in them, coupled with the distress that I knew that people
31:45
were under made me. Really feel like this was a time
31:48
to trust, you know, to go into this that it wasn't about me.
31:53
And what people might think about the work that I was doing,
31:56
this is about the pain that I see in the world.
32:00
He tried to stigmatize ways that people receive healing, then
32:05
we're going to leave a lot of people in pain.
32:09
So for me, it is continuing to have conversations to, you know,
32:13
debunk untruths. And you know, yes is maybe
32:17
propaganda or to even just say therapy, you know, I mean, I
32:22
want to say 20 years ago, if you had a therapist, you didn't talk
32:25
about it people. You know, might have thought
32:27
something big was wrong. It Took a lot of Courage for
32:31
people to say I need help and that has shifted.
32:34
And so now to say hey therapy is helpful and you know accessing
32:41
different states of Consciousness is helpful as
32:43
well. As long as like you said,
32:46
initially it is in a safe container and we try to Advocate
32:51
that as much as possible safety and trust and consent, you know,
32:57
just knowing that at any time Even if you come for our free
33:01
intake and you decide this isn't for you, you don't have to do
33:05
anything. You know.
33:05
You could show up for your appointment that day, but feel
33:08
like you're not ready to receive the medicine and you don't have
33:10
to so ya know, I think it's really important.
33:14
I think that whole debunking, the myths and and digging into
33:17
the truth and being willing to do the research and figure out.
33:19
If this is something that might be helpful, but being open to
33:22
that is so important because there's just so much going on
33:26
and it like I said, it's nuanced and different people.
33:29
Respond to different things and need different kinds of help.
33:31
But I think, you know, point out, something good and really
33:35
appropriate to and true is, you know, when I was growing up,
33:39
therapists were four and this was really dangerous language
33:43
around this, which I really, I think we're starting to finally
33:46
get rid of, but not in all places is crazy.
33:50
People, you know, got had needed therapy or, you know, messed up
33:55
people or it's like, no, that's, you know, it's Mental Health.
33:59
Health and Trauma is trauma. And and you don't have to have
34:04
had a trauma experience to need, mental health care, and that's
34:08
okay. And that's it.
34:09
It's all part of our health Journey.
34:11
So also just removing those sigma's and bad words.
34:15
Just dangerous words in appropriate words around.
34:18
It is so much a part of it. And this is just the next step.
34:21
I think in the process as you look at these other alternative
34:24
therapies and and you look at what they were doing with these
34:28
things, I watched a really We interesting Brady and I watched
34:31
a really interesting documentary, I think it was on
34:33
Netflix that talked about all of you know what I'm talking about.
34:36
It can't remember the name of it?
34:38
Yes I can't remember the name of either but it's a bit different.
34:41
Yeah medicines it's like a four-part.
34:43
Yeah. Yes and it breaks it all down
34:46
but it goes back to the history like prior to the 60s and these
34:50
spaces and places this stuff was being used in very successfully
34:54
and in a very healthy way and but also feel like anything any
34:59
Thing, if you use it inappropriately or wrong or in
35:03
the wrong context can be bad. And this is no different.
35:07
So the minute it was being seen as being used in the wrong
35:10
context and not a safe environment and not a safe
35:13
container instead of like, okay, let's adjust the container.
35:17
Did just a culture just took it away.
35:19
It's just, it's gone, it's dangerous, it's gone.
35:22
Nobody can use it. No one could safe and it was
35:25
just this extreme, you know, reaction to it.
35:28
So it's really I think in encouraging to see it coming
35:31
back in and hopefully more and more and more States.
35:34
These treatments will be available and legal.
35:36
I mean there's some places you still can't do it.
35:38
Thankfully ketamine was never rescheduled.
35:40
It was still you know, caber therapeutic benefit but it
35:43
wasn't. And that's good to know yet for
35:45
depression until about the 90s when they started realizing
35:48
that. Oh even people that were
35:50
receiving, the meds for surgery were feeling better mentally.
35:54
Sure. And so I think that, you know,
35:55
that's been helpful as a tool that it is available and
35:59
Initially it was just really kind of used off-label for
36:02
treatment-resistant depression, which really treatment-resistant
36:06
depression is just that maybe you have not had any beneficial
36:10
results off of two medications. So there's a lot of people that
36:14
have treatment-resistant depression that they have tried
36:17
a couple of antidepressants and it didn't seem to help and so
36:21
that's where kind of this like big, you know, I think push for
36:24
research around ketamine started.
36:27
And then now, once we know that it is helpful for treating
36:29
Tremont resistant, depression, we're looking at it for
36:32
addiction. We're looking at it more trauma
36:35
for anxiety, you know, for grief, I mean, I've had a lot of
36:39
people that, you know, yes, it's happening and just the
36:43
neurobiological contents of the brain.
36:45
But it also because there is that kind of mystical
36:48
experience, a lot of people feel really connected to their, you
36:53
know, their understanding of a higher power.
36:55
And so people that have had lost in their life or people that
36:59
maybe You have had kind of like a spiritual emergence or
37:02
something. Are we connected to?
37:04
What feels more kind of like a purpose in the world or gives
37:08
them context for, you know, how to take what they've been
37:12
through and actually start to recreate a life for themselves
37:15
that feels meaningful. Mmm.
37:17
Yeah. That's, that's really
37:19
interesting. It actually makes sense and I
37:20
think the thing that's so interesting to is, you talked
37:23
about if people don't respond to these two prescriptions we as a
37:26
culture in in the western world, We'll take prescription after
37:31
prescription after prescription and not ask and just kind of
37:35
trust blindly not ask what it's doing to our gut, not ask what
37:40
it's what this, you know, not get too concerned about side
37:43
effects but yet we won't trust a thing that you talked about did
37:48
indigenous. People have been using for
37:51
thousands of years and continue to use, I mean before, you know,
37:56
Europeans disrupted, everything that was going on with Of
37:59
Americans they were rolling along just fine, very healthy.
38:03
Using a lot of these practices in, you see that in addition, is
38:07
Nations throughout the world. So these things that are natural
38:11
and are available will get freaked out about that and it's
38:15
all about messaging and delivering, you know, so it's
38:18
like, let me tell you what that, you know, steroid drug, or
38:22
whatever it's doing to your gut. Versus The Experience, you can
38:26
have in a safe container in space with this.
38:29
People need to be curious and take a look at that again.
38:32
Well, and we love what we're doing and I think what a lot of
38:34
people are doing right now, like, you mentioned the
38:37
container, you know, I think it's a both and it's like like,
38:41
let's merge indigenous healing practices with what we are may
38:47
be comfortable with and the Western World.
38:49
And so when you walk into our office it looks like normal
38:53
Psychotherapy office. It's really inviting you know we
38:57
couple really Ritualistic practices that we ask our
39:02
clients to, you know, bring in something that represents your
39:05
intention. I'm going to set up.
39:07
I'm gonna light a candle as you go into the space and then it's
39:10
coupled with they also get their blood pressure checked and their
39:13
heart monitor read. And you know, those are kind of
39:16
these. These models that also help us
39:18
feel safe and so sure. We're not saying it has to be
39:21
all one or all the other. It's like, let's take the wisdom
39:25
that we have, and let's merge this.
39:27
So that we can get the best results and Treat the whole
39:30
person rather than just one symptom.
39:33
I love that, I love that blend of all the best things, we know
39:37
because I think that's what we should be aiming for, in all of
39:40
our settings, you know, not our mental health settings, are
39:43
physical health settings, which I mean, they're all connected.
39:46
But I mean, there's ways that you can go rather than just
39:49
throwing a prescription at it. Let's take a look at the whole
39:52
piece. Let's take all the best
39:54
knowledge we have from all these places and bring them together
39:57
to give the best most possible. Of healthiest outcome that would
40:01
this available to us. I love the you spoke to that,
40:03
that's so important accepting, the layered aspects of ourselves
40:07
and this is all the stuff, all the layers, all the muck all the
40:12
good stuff, all the years, all those things talked about
40:15
accepting the layered aspects. So I'm actually in a Ph.D
40:19
program right now studying depth so elegy.
40:22
Yeah. And what I love about this
40:24
theory, is it talks a lot about our shadow side so it's Looking
40:29
at, you know, curl Young's idea of archetypal elements inside of
40:35
us and that we do always have a shadow.
40:37
I think you had said it earlier, you know, any good seeing can
40:40
also become bad. I mean, we know this is a
40:43
something like food, like we have to feed ourselves and then
40:46
food also can carry a lot of pain and, and challenge for a
40:51
lot of us as well. So I think that, you know, to
40:54
remember like the tallest tree cast an even larger Shadow and
40:58
yet there's parts of the A that it doesn't cast The Very bare so
41:03
we do have layers to our self. I mean I think he coin curl
41:07
young corn. The word Persona really taking
41:09
it from a word that was used in theater as this kind of like
41:14
What actors put on this mask and and we have to recognize that we
41:19
all kind of do that. It's not dysfunctional.
41:21
It actually kind of helps like you're a mom.
41:23
Sometimes you're a podcaster, sometimes you're a wife, you
41:27
know? And then who are we When we take
41:30
up all the masks and what happened and so that's I think
41:33
both my constant work because it has to be part of being a
41:38
therapist, I think, is not that I have it all figured out and
41:42
I'm trying to, you know, operate from this hierarchical
41:44
structure. It's like I'm continuously
41:48
accessing different layers of myself and trying to be in
41:50
truth, with who and what needs space inside of me.
41:54
And then, you know, encouraging that with the people that I work
41:57
with as well and yeah, you know, connecting To our inner child
42:00
just as much as we connect to our wise woman or, you know,
42:04
having a moment to feel really angry and then also having a
42:08
moment to feel a lot of peace and and knowing that they can
42:11
all be kind of, you know, pooling at times and their can
42:15
feel like Paradox. But often the Paradox is just
42:19
that. That's how we are.
42:20
We're layered, we have many aspects to ourselves.
42:24
Yeah, and I think, you know, we this kind of dualistic at times
42:27
Society, we live in is just Not true to who we are.
42:30
We are complex people with a lot of nuance things happening at
42:34
one time, and that's okay. And in, don't push down any of
42:38
those things, presses them, feel them.
42:40
Look at what they're trying to tell you.
42:42
And don't treat them as good or bad or, you know, they're all
42:46
they're all signals and messages.
42:49
And you know that we can sit in those and take them all in as
42:52
part of who we are. That would be such an
42:54
interesting field of study to go into it always fascinated by
42:58
those kinds of things. In summary, in living out feel
43:02
finding empowerment embracing layers.
43:05
How would you say that? Affects how you feel?
43:08
The pun intended about yourself, and then also how it affects
43:12
your relationships, you know, I think it feels really wonderful
43:16
to feel empowered and to like we just said, give voice to these
43:20
different pieces and to recognize that we can, you know,
43:25
feel empowered through lots of different experiences.
43:28
So there's This feels empowering just to use my voice and to be
43:33
talking to you and educating people.
43:35
And then sometimes we getting in bed at night feels really
43:39
empowering and so completely that.
43:42
Yeah, you just I think being in touch with what I need is the
43:47
most important thing for me. And so, you know, checking in
43:51
with what is it that this moment really is allowing me to notice.
43:56
And to, again, I think I'll say, you know, Multiple times
44:00
throughout this conversation to just slow down and check in with
44:03
myself, like, I'll just touch my hands to my heart and just like,
44:08
what do I need? You know, even as simple as do,
44:11
I want to drink a topo Chico, or do?
44:13
I need like regular water, something like that and then
44:18
really feeling confident to make the right choice out of that
44:20
experience. But to also know there may not
44:23
ever be a right choice that it's whatever, we can kind of really
44:27
trust in our Journey through not to continue to just put one foot
44:33
in front of the other even being willing to make mistakes.
44:37
Yeah, absolutely. And I think if you can show up
44:39
that way for yourself, then it allows you to show up that way
44:42
in your relationships with other people, with a full cup with
44:45
eyes wide open. You know, recognizing you said
44:48
something really important. You know what was right, 10
44:51
years ago doesn't or five minutes ago, may not be right
44:53
now, you know? And so releasing that that that
44:56
there's always, that one right thing of right, things change.
44:59
What's right is fluid and being open to that.
45:04
You know, that idea for wherever you are in your journey, we are
45:09
down to the rapid-fire name. Five, activities that nourish
45:14
you. Some of them might mold
45:16
together, but spending time with my daughter and my dog, if
45:20
you've my dog's been running around background, I like to
45:25
just go see music with my friends.
45:27
So live music with friends. Which also involves dancing
45:31
getting a good night. Sleep is really important to me.
45:35
I would say travel and nature. Okay.
45:38
Oh, I love a lot of those things and there's lots of live music
45:41
available in Lubbock. That's one of the things that
45:43
people don't necessarily know here that you go walk into about
45:47
any space on Thursday through Saturday night and someone's
45:51
going to be in the corner somewhere louder than others,
45:55
some places and I've lived all over the country and it's not
45:58
that way everywhere. So It's very much part of the
46:00
culture here and something that we've really appreciated because
46:03
we love live music to beautiful five words on how you want to
46:06
feel the next six months. Hmm.
46:09
For a while. I mean maybe it was like five
46:11
years ago was exposed to Danielle Laporte.
46:14
I don't know if you're familiar with her.
46:16
Yeah, say that core desired feelings.
46:19
So I'm working with these core desired feelings that I've been
46:21
working with for a while and okay are balanced abundant
46:27
playful. Free and feminine.
46:31
Mmm, I love those such interesting cross points and
46:35
connections with that. I love that.
46:37
That's really cool. And I have been following some
46:39
of that stuff too. So that's really cool.
46:42
Thank you so much Lindsay. We have battled through some
46:45
technology issues today and she has hung in there with me and we
46:49
shared some great information. You're going to want to check
46:52
out our resources page on our website because that is where
46:56
you're going to be able to learn about more if you want more.
46:59
Formation on any of these topics we talked about today especially
47:03
in the therapy space. Look at our resources page on
47:07
how you can learn more about those things and just all the
47:10
resources that Lindsay uses it, she finds helpful, we will be
47:14
promoting that on our social media, you can find us on all
47:17
the socials and embracing layers on Instagram, embracing
47:21
layers.com as our website. And then check us out on
47:25
Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, Youtube, we're at everywhere
47:30
these days. So Tick-Tock we've got some
47:32
Tick-Tock videos and not done by me.
47:34
That's from one of my 20-somethings, but thanks so
47:38
much again, Lindsay, for being with us.
47:40
I really appreciate your time and your patience as we did this
47:42
today. Yeah.
47:44
Thank you for your patience. And my, you know, I was guessing
47:47
there's like it Elder Millennial and Maya technology issues.
47:53
Oh my gosh. Well, you know, we could just
47:55
stick to it. Well, thank you, Melissa.
47:57
Absolutely. No, I'm so glad to have you.
47:59
Thank you for Early follower, we just so appreciate that.
48:03
We're so thankful for that without people like you, we
48:06
wouldn't be doing what we're doing and so audience.
48:08
Again, you might want to get your notebook out and listen and
48:11
re-listen to some of the great information that Lindsay offered
48:15
here. But if we hope that this
48:16
provided a different, you know, scope and some things for you to
48:19
think about as you think about your Wellness journey and what's
48:22
best for you and what's healthy for you.
48:24
If you have any questions, let us know you can DMS at embracing
48:28
layers on Ram, you can email us embracing layers at gmail.com.
48:32
If you have any questions or thoughts, thanks for joining us
48:35
today and have a great week.