Latest / Speaking of Supply Chain / Design the Process With the People in Mind

Transcript

Design the Process With the People in Mind · Speaking of Supply Chain

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: When one thing becomes a commodity, something else becomes at premium.
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: What's becoming commoditized is analytics, coding, data democratization. It's becoming commoditized.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: What then becomes the premium is those critical thinking skills,
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: the objective thinking, the communication. Those become the premium. And
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: if you look at anybody getting into the field, that
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: is how you can write your ticket. Now it's tough
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: out there, but being able to not only do it
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: but communicate it, that is what we're needing in their workforce.
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: Welcome to speaking of supply chain. I'm Christine Barnhardt, head
• 0:36
  Speaker 2: of Industry Engagement and Alliances at MEBAK. This is where
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: we go beyond the buzzwords to unpack what actually drives
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: supply chain performance today. I am thrilled to be joined
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: by Eric Wilson, Director of Thought Leadership at the Institute
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: of Business Forecasting and Planning and author of the new
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: book Beyond Borders, Cultural Complexity and Global Business. Any of
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: us know Eric from his work in forecasting, planning, and.
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: S and OP.
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: Throughout his career, he's helped organizations improve how they make decisions,
• 1:10
  Speaker 2: align functions, and drive better business performance. And beyond borders.
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: He builds on that work by exploring one of the
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: most overlooked influences on business success culture. Because while organizations
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: invest heavily in strategy, technology, and process, those things don't
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: exist in a vacuum. Their shape by the people using them,
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: their experiences, assumptions, values, and history. Understanding those differences helps
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: explain why two organizations, or even two teams within the
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: same org can look at the same data, participate in
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: the same meeting, and walk away with a very different conclusion.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: Welcome Eric to speaking of supply chain.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: Thank you, Welcome, Welcome, welcome. I'm excited. I'm always always
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: happy to see you, always happy to have time with you.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: But it's always awesome to see you and so happy
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: that you agreed to be a guest on the show.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: We go way back, like my to our days. I
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: guess at very Plastics, which I.
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Think was like we don't want to age ourselves. It
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: was it was it was a which it was a
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: while ago.
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: It's it's been super fun though, to see how your
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: work has evolved from you know, when we met, you
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: were standing up demand planning and forecasting and s and
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: O p at Berry and you know, then you moved
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: really into like thought leadership and business transformation. So I'm
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: gonna be honest, I was super excited when I heard
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: that you had written this book on culture. I wasn't
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: surprised because I do think it's kind of the natural
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: extension of many of the conversations that you and I
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: have had throughout, you know, the time that we've known
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: each other, which is like it always seems like we understand.
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: The process, like we know what the process should be,
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: but the people kind of get in the way of
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: the process sometimes.
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: And yeah, so I would love to understand what inspired
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: you to write Beyond Borders.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: I said, thank you very much for having me, And
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: it was kind of if you look at my rast
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: three business books I wrote, it was kind of an
• 3:21
  Speaker 1: optosite progression. My first book, Predictive Analytics, talked about the
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: technical side of demand pranning and predictive analytics. My second
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: book on the Practical Guy for Sales and Operations Branning
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: went in for s and op IBP the process. Now
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: I'm talking about the people because that's really where it
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: all matters. If you ask why I wrote that book,
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: it's because of the experiences we had at Barrier because
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: of the experience I had through my career. You always
• 3:48
  Speaker 1: saw the underlying every meeting we had, every type of
• 3:53
  Speaker 1: process designed, you always see people being part of that
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: and different cultures approaching things slightly from And then when
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: I wrote my last book on S and OP, it
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: really gnalled at me underneath because I could put out,
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: here's what an S and OP process look like, here's
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: the nine dimensions everyone should do, and you put down
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: a technical process, and underneath I knew it was missing
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: that piece, that people were not interpreting what I was
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: saying the same way. And that's what led to the
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: last two years of me taking what I took from
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: S and OP those nine dimensions and putting people to
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: them and how they look at them based on the
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: regions and cultures that they brought that really developed their
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: thought process.
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: Is that how long it took two years to it
• 4:42
  Speaker 3: took two years.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: There was one year of solid research that went into it, because,
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: like I did with a lot of my books, I
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: don't want to be my opinion. So there was two
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: years of you know, the literature first to really developed
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: the theory because there's a lot of good material out there.
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: Amaron Meyer and Hofstad. There's a good material out there,
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: but it's not business specific, especially for our fields. But
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: I took that to where you helped develop some of
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: the thesis with it. I have the nine dimensions I
• 5:10
  Speaker 1: understand s and op We've already done the research there
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: for my last book. But I put those together and
• 5:15
  Speaker 1: then then a series of surveys, hundreds of interviews with
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: people globally to test out my theories and get feedback,
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: get worldwide stories. Then I took a year writing the book.
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: So yeah, there was two solid years and put in together.
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: I mean, it's really really good.
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: A couple of things that kind of stood out to me.
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: Jumped off the page, if you will.
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  Speaker 2: Whereas like business doesn't operate in a vacuum, it operates
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: through people, and I was like, oh my god, yes, dinging.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: And then the other was like culture, and you spoke
• 5:48
  Speaker 2: about this numerous times, but like, culture isn't about putting
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: people into boxes, right, It's about understanding why we experience
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: the same situation differently. And I thought that that was
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: pretty meaningful. Like I said, you know, you and I
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: know each other from Barry, and we I can recall
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: like we'd be in.
• 6:04
  Speaker 3: The same meeting. We'd come out of the meeting and.
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: I would be like, oh, you know, and you're like,
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: wait a minute, no, it was you know, and and
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: we're and by the way, we have a lot of
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: similar cultural influences and we still experience that meeting differently.
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: So I I loved this book. I will say like
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: right now.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: At you know, been with me box since September, and
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: so much of this book spoke to me because I'm
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: back in an organization which truly has a global footprint,
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: which it's been a few years for me since I've
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: operated on a more global scale. And I'm like, oh,
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: that's the reason the Germans and I are butting heads
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: about this or you.
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: Know what I mean, Like you're like, ohit.
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: A minute, like I have yeah, So yeah, stereotypes exist
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: for reason. Sometimes it doesn't mean they're bad, and you
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: you hit it. What one of the biggest questions I
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: learned in reading the book, and I mean not reading book,
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: but developing the book, is there's no right or wrong answer.
• 7:09
  Speaker 1: Sometimes it's just different approaches. And I think that's where
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: a lot of people need to start thinking about this
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: is Hey, that means my way is not always the
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: way there's other ways.
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: Right exactly, And I think it hits on you know sometimes, yes,
• 7:24
  Speaker 2: we often talk about people process tools, but I occasionally
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: will be like people process tools mindset.
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: I think that.
• 7:32
  Speaker 2: This really encapsulates the people and the mindset kind of
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: together and how they're approaching something just from a different angle,
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: from a different perspective. And it's funny because supply chain
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: transformation in general, we often talk about it through the
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: technology or through some type of a new process or framework,
• 7:56
  Speaker 2: but at the end of the day, it's really the
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: people who are making decisions, solving problems, creating value. So
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: from your perspective, why is investing in people such an
• 8:06
  Speaker 2: important part of building a successful organization?
• 8:10
  Speaker 1: Because without people, you're not going to have the organization.
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: There you go, easy, No, but.
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: I have AI, I mean, Eric Gun, I'll just I'll
• 8:18
  Speaker 3: just get some.
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: Agents because people really are the innovators. People are the
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: ones that are pushing it. People are the ones that's
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: that's verifying. They still need the people.
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: Uh.
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  Speaker 1: If you look at most of most of the you know,
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: uh research that you know IBF did when it comes
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: to forecasting an S and OP, the missing skill is
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: not the analytics and AI. The missing skill is communication
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: influencing skills business Acramen. That's what keeps showing up as
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: the number one skills people are looking for. And you're
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: looking at the communication that goes right to the heart
• 8:57
  Speaker 1: of what I was writing about. It's not how to
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: community this way and this way. It's to be able
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: to communicate so that the other person is not only
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: understanding you, but you're building those business bonds and collaboration
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: consensus that you're understanding what those core concepts means together.
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: So when you're looking at why do we invest in people,
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: because people really are the necessities to be able to
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: build collaboration, consensus, transparency. You're not going to do that
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: with AI or technology.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: You know, it's funny because the last time I saw
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: you was at the Best of the Best SNOP conference
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: in Chicago and sitting in the audience, one of the
• 9:38
  Speaker 2: things that I pulled out was, you know, this pendulum,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: if you will, from an education standpoint, right, And I
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: look at my own kids who are gen z ers, right,
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: they're in their mid twenties, and their education was very processed,
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: technically focused. It was not focused on communication and social
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: skills and being able to communicate an idea and and
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: and things of that nature. So I almost feel like
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  Speaker 2: we've we've created a generation of people that are further
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: from what's needed then than probably what we were or
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: or even what the millennials were before them.
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  Speaker 3: Is that is that fair?
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: That is fair? And I mean they have skills that
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: obviously we didn't have, right that they capability from a
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  Speaker 1: process and really the coding, the technology, the embracing technology
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: and their capabilities. But at the same time, you're right,
• 10:35
  Speaker 1: there's there's a gap now and not only communication, but
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: critical thinking skills, and that does seem to be that
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: penduum when you see that critical thinking skills becomes that
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: pendrum in really education and our society, and we're seeing
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: it starting to swing back, that critical thinking skills and
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: education and that communication is becoming more of a premium
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: now than what it used to.
• 10:59
  Speaker 2: Okay, so basically the people that know how to communicate,
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: that know how to build relationships and networks and then
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: really take a problem and not jump to a conclusion,
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: but examine it from all sides.
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: I said four years ago, I made the statement that
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: when one thing becomes a premium, I mean something when
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: one thing becomes a commodity, something else becomes a premium.
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: What's becoming commoditized is analytics, coding, data democratization. It's becoming commoditized.
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: What then becomes a premium is those critical thinking skills,
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: the objective thinking, the communication. Those become the premium. And
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: if you look at anybody getting into the field, that
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: is how you can write your ticket. Now it's tough
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: out there, but being able to not only do it,
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: but communicate it, that is what we're needing in the workforce.
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: Which it speaks to me because that's the reason that
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: I've been successful and I've advanced to multip right. I'm
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: an electrical engineer. I understand the technical side of it.
• 12:05
  Speaker 2: I can speak the technical side of it, but I
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: can also speak to marketing and sales and commercial teams,
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: which is really different from a language standpoint between the two.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: So, one of the things that we've been talking about
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: that really resonated me was this concept that business process
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: doesn't exist in a vacuum. And when I think about
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: me Bach, we spend a tremendous amount of time helping
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: clients design operating models and planning processes and doing transformation.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: But success is not simply about designing the right process, right,
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: It's really about designing one that works in the real world.
• 12:45
  Speaker 2: And there were a couple of times in the book
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: where you talked about like in the real world, like
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: what's like pragmatically like not not this ethereal academic, right,
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: So it really reinforced that for so, you know, like
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: when you talked about process and culture and how these
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: things kind of come together, help us understand that a
• 13:09
  Speaker 2: bit more.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: When if you look at like the services you provide,
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: those are absolutely necessary. We need the structure. We need
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: someone to come in has that third party view of
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: being able to say this is what works, this is
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: why it works. These are the pieces you need. You
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: need that structure. But structure does not mean inflexible. You
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: have different perceptions of collaboration, consensus. You know, these different
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: core things that you're bringing in, you need to be
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: able to adapt them to the environment and business culture
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: that you're working in. And I think that's what makes
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: you really greatest well, because you can not only take
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: a structured process but make it adaptable to different cultures.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: And when you get global and different ones, now you
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: have to be even more cognizant. So when you're designing
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: the way these kind of work together, instead of taking
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: your process and saying here's your process, you need to
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: design the process with the people in mind. They always
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: say people process technology. What does that mean when you
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: say people process, It's not here's the people I need
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: to do this, it's what kind of process works best
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: with these people. That is designing the process with the
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: people in mind. And that's the way when culture starts
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: to play more of a low understanding, at least having
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: an admission that cultures are different, that people will approach
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: things differently. At minimum, having the understanding and being open
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: and having a safe environment for them to communicate. That
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: is at least the minimum of entrigue to be able
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: to build a good process.
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: Agreed.
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: It was funny as I was going through the book
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: and you were kind of talking about the different geographic
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: areas and I got to southern Europe, and for I
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: had like three or four years when.
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: I was at Whirlpool that I reported to an Italian
• 15:04
  Speaker 3: in Italy.
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: Right, So not only was he the Italian, but he
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: was an Italian in northern Italy.
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: We and I loved him.
• 15:10
  Speaker 2: He's grade Upperto, and but I can remember being in
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: a meeting with him when I was in Cassanetta and
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: he kind of like he was so mad at me.
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: We were butting heads and he's like, you are so German, Christine,
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: and I was like thank you, and he's like, I
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: didn't mean it as a compliment, you know, And I
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: always think about that because I would describe him as
• 15:30
  Speaker 2: like he thinks like a play of spaghetti, Like.
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: I really got it, Like where are we going with this?
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: Right?
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: So the book it made me chuckle because I was like, oh,
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: how I could have used.
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: This like twenty five years ago and granted like I
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: figured it out right, like, which I think is what
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: you did too. Right, It's like the school of hard knocks.
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: What I love about this is that you're like sharing
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: it in a methodology that people can can practice and
• 15:59
  Speaker 2: get better at. Right, Like it's one thing to acknowledge it,
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: but then how do I continually reinforce that that I
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: have a bias and I need to like think differently,
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: which is really what I loved. So you know, I
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: think you know kind of transitioning a little bit. Let's
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: talk about trust, because you talked about trust a lot
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: in the book. My question for you would be, is
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: trust kind of the invisible operating system within an organization?
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: I I if I had one thing to rewrite in
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: that book, I would talk even more about trust. I think, really, yeah,
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: because what I really discovered since then, uh working with
• 16:42
  Speaker 1: I was on an AI conference and a lot of
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: people talking about trust and really dawned on me there
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: of Oh yeah, that's what it really was. Getting to
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: trust is that golden thread that you seen between all
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: the dimensions between different culture Trust seems to be that
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: golden thread. And if you can get to that, I
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: think you can get past a lot of the boundaries
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: because it's how do your trust? Do I trust the
• 17:08
  Speaker 1: person or do I trust the process? Or do I
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: trust the output or do I mean, there's so many
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: different ways you can trust, and it means differently the
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: different cultures, and it will impact everything from decision making
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: to conflict to communication. Trust really impacts most everything that
• 17:29
  Speaker 1: I see, not now you know.
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: It's funny to me as I was reading and thinking back,
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: the most fun that I've had in professional environments when
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: I really think about it, or when I really trusted
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: the people that I was interacting with right the project team.
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: You know, there's I can sit here today, I could
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: think of three or four people from Barry that it's like,
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: you know, I trusted them, Like you could come to
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: me and say this is what it is.
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: And I didn't question.
• 17:57
  Speaker 2: I didn't have to put invest time in validating that
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: what you told me was true because I trusted you,
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: and it allowed me then to go attack other parts
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: of the problem or of the business. I have those
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: situations pretty much for every company that I've worked for,
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: and the most negative experiences that I've had over my
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: You did for years where where when there wasn't any trust.
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: So for me, it wasn't even like I can't tell
• 18:28
  Speaker 2: you it was all like regional or even like I
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: had great trust with people and other cultures. It took time,
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: there was conflict to get there. I wish that I
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: would have had your book. I think I could have
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: gotten there probably faster, right, But but building that trust
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: was was really really important. So yeah, I think trust
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: makes collaboration possible, right, I think you said that in
• 18:54
  Speaker 2: the book, So I'm seeing that from you, right.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: Something else that I really.
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: Found interest seeing that you you kind of wrote things
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: through this lens of national or regional kind of cultures. Right,
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: But I kept kind of finding myself replacing the word
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: culture with other forms of diversity inside organizations, generational diversity,
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: functional diversity.
• 19:25
  Speaker 3: But the one thing that I noticed.
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: That was absent from your writing is you didn't address
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: gender diversity. You're right, was that intentional?
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: It was, Yes, it was intentional. I kept it obviously,
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: I've been a huge proponent of gender.
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: Are That's why it surprised me.
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: But I did keep it to regional and national identities
• 19:47
  Speaker 1: when I looked at but you abscribe it is transferable.
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: When you're looking at being able to relate to someone,
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: there is not only a difference between nationalities, but you
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: do see it gender wise.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: I want to see I want to see the distributions
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: and the reverse bell curves. I want to see them
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: broken out, still in the same regions, but I want
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: to see, like from gender gender. I would love to
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: see what that looks like from a gender perspective.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: I have the data, We'll go through the data, and
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: maybe we'll come back and I'll present the data and
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: the gender. But to that point, when you're looking at really,
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: if my book is about understanding your own biases and
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: then having empathy for others that works across genders as well.
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: That is a necessity. So if you're looking at if
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: you're a male and an executive, will guess what some
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: of your job is to understand you have biases and
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: to understand empathy for others that you might be working
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: for as well. The same rules and walls of pride.
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: On the other ways, there needs to be people that
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: break out of those gender national those stereotypes that identities have.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: They need people like yourself, Christine and others to break
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: out of those. If you don't see anybody that looks
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: like you doing something that you're not used to doing,
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: you're always going to do it the same way.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: One hundred percent. I can't agree with you enough. And
• 21:14
  Speaker 2: it actually for me. One of the questions that I
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: wanted to ask you was about empathy, because I still
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: see a ton of empathy in business. But I think
• 21:25
  Speaker 2: that it's self selected because the people that are in
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: these roles, they're used to working cross regionally, cross functionally, right,
• 21:34
  Speaker 2: and so we get to know each other. But I
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: have noticed in the general population, and I'm going to
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: speak for the Midwest, empathy is I don't see as
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: much empathy now is what I saw twenty years ago.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: Have we somewhere lost along the way we lost our
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: ability to be empathetic.
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: I think we're just becoming more polarized. It's that we
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: are with specially with the way we're consuming information now.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: People aren't reading books. Yeah, They're consuming the social media
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: and the threads, and that's how they're consuming information. And
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: most of it's an echo chamber that's reinforcing sometimes bad beliefs,
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: and with that it's creating more polarized type of society
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: that we live in.
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: Into business, based on your research or I mean, because
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: I haven't seen it, it just it still feels pretty
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: like people are trying to be collaborative on the business side,
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: but it personally it does seem very very extreme.
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: It is. It is very extreme, and I would say
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: it's further extreme than what you've seen before. And going
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: back to a book that I wrote now like almost
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: ten years ago, I wrote Cultural Cycles, Why History Repeats Itself,
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: and that was I've always had a passion for culture
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: and understanding different culture and that book actually talked about
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: the typical cycle that societies go through, typically an eighty
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: to one hundred year cycles once again based on other
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: types of research, but doing you know, expanding upon that
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: using other types of data. So it's a data driven
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: you know book. It looks at that gap you're seeing
• 23:21
  Speaker 1: now actually increases at the reset of the cycle before
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: the rebirth, that gap actually increases. You see more ways
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: disparacy and more more types of rhetoric between a larger
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: as far as as far as national elections and things
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: of that sort, people's opinions will actually get further away
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: before they once again, is that Pendril, We're going to.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: Get to a breaking point where then we reset.
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: Unfortunately, when I went through those cycles, it went through
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: reset and then rebirth, but you had to go through
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: the reset to get to the rebirth.
• 23:57
  Speaker 3: Hopefully I live long enough to get through this.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: Our our kids will see it.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: So I mean, what organizations are becoming more global? I think?
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: I think I think it's like global used to be
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: like a few companies. Now global is like everybody doesn't
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: really matter what you do or where you're at. You
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: have to think at least outside of your own country
• 24:19
  Speaker 2: or outside of your own you know, region, to other regions.
• 24:23
  Speaker 2: What capabilities and mindsets do you think we'll distinguish tomorrow's
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: leaders in that context, it's.
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: Going to be back to some of the skill sets
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: we talked about communication, but not just being able to communicate,
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: how you communicate in the nuances in your communication? Uh?
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: Are are our key? Uh? The curiosity? That is that?
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: And I wrote that as a key theme in my
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: book because I truly believe that's what because that's what
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: drove me, is the curiosity. And and and I know
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: you have it as well, but that curiosity is like
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: I want to learn stuff. I want to know why
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: this is doing it. And if you have that curiosity,
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: you will naturally develop more of an empathy. In my opinion,
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: my empathy comes from my curiosity of wanting to understand
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: other culture, other people, and not assuming that I have
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: the answers. That's really what's going to drive people, is
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: that curiosity.
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: I mean, honestly, it's part of why I came to
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: Meebach is you know me, I get bored, right, And
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: so you know, as I've gotten older, every couple of years,
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: three four years, I'm like ready to do something new.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: And it's because it's like, Okay, I'm curious, I want
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: to maybe a thread takes me down a different path.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: Like I said, I'm an electrical engineer, I'm doing go
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: to market marketing alliance is projects like yeah, exactly. One
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: of the things that I think I read in the
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: book is you said something to the effect of the
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: best global leaders don't assume they understand people.
• 25:49
  Speaker 3: They stay curious. And I thought that that was was really,
• 25:53
  Speaker 3: really good.
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: So, you know, I think for me one of my
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: biggest takeaways from Beyond Borders is that strategy, technology, process,
• 26:03
  Speaker 2: they're only part of the equation, and that organizations succeed
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: because people understand one another, they build trust, they navigate
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: their differences, and ultimately they find a way where they
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: can make decisions together. And I think for those of
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: us that are leading these kinds of transformation, it's really
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: an important reminder, right, success isn't about designing better processes.
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: It's about understanding that people who bring those processes to life. Right,
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: So what would be like before we leave, what's like
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: you one? You're one thing that you hope people really
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: get out of this book?
• 26:43
  Speaker 1: Well, when I wrote the book, it was I had
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: this idea, I had this story I wanted to share.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: I knew there was a hidden conflict that was happening
• 26:53
  Speaker 1: inside boardrooms. And what I would discovered is other people
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: have the same thing. The response I get is amazing.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: What you and I are talking about other people in
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: the same message resonates with other people. It's resonating right now.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: It's over a month since the book was released. It's
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: sold twenty five different countries have purchased it. It's a
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: variable globally in your local Amazon dot DE, dot BR
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: dot JP, wherever you are, it's it's a variable locally.
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: It was one of Amazon's top new releases. I was
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: amazed by the response. So what I wanted to get
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: out of it was just sharing it. And I'm humbled
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: that the messages actually resonate where am I and I
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: at now, I'm just I'm now scared that I did
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: the topic justice because it's such an important topic. I'm
• 27:40
  Speaker 1: worried that I didn't do enough for it and maybe
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: you know, starting.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: The conversation like is such a such an amazing thing.
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: I mean, I feel really privileged to call you a
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: friend and that you, you know, shared the book with me,
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: and that I got to be you know, part of
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: you being able to evangelize that hey, this is an
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: important topic. You know. The other thing that I find
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: interesting before I let you go is we haven't really
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: talked about s and OP or planning, demand planning, or forecasting.
• 28:12
  Speaker 2: Because for me, this like the whole time I'm reading
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: the book, and I loved your anecdotes because I am
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: a planner, But I kept I kept going back to
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: I think that this applies not just to business, but
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: to life in general.
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: Right, So if we didn't talk about all the anecdotes
• 28:27
  Speaker 1: and stories, people have to buy the book to read those.
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: There's some good ones in there, there are there's.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: Some great ones.
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: The little engine that could and build your own adventure,
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: and absolutely if people want to they want to know more,
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: They want to have a conversation with you, they want
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: to get to know you.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: What's the best way for people to reach you?
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: Just reach out to me at Wilson Demand at gmail
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: dot com. You can find me there as well, or
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: Eric ATIBF dot org. However you want to read me.
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: LinkedIn is probably the best way to find me. I'm
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: all over LinkedIn. I love sharing. If you're on LinkedIn,
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: find me on LinkedIn and we'll be able to have
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: each other's networks and follow you back.
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: I love it. I love it.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: We'll also make sure that we include some links to
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: you and to the book in the show notes.
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: So all right.
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately our thirty minutes has passed, so for those listening,
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: if you would like to continue the conversation with me,
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: you can find me on LinkedIn.
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: That's the easiest.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: I'm always happy to connect continue the discussion. Before we wrap,
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: I need to thank our sponsor, Meeboch. So. Meebok is
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: a global supply chain consulting and engineering firm helping organizations
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: bridge strategy and execution across the end to end supply chain.
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: We work alongside our clients and customers to design, to implement,
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: and to optimize supply chains that deliver measurable business outcomes
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: in the real world. So thanks again for joining us
• 29:57
  Speaker 2: and we will.
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: See you next time on Speaking of SUPPLYTI.
• 30:00
  Speaker 4: Thank you you've been listening to Speaking of Supply Chain
• 30:08
  Speaker 4: a meboch podcast. Keep connected with us by subscribing to
• 30:11
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• 30:13
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• 30:15
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• 30:18
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• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening. Until next time.