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Are On-Scene YouTubers Hurting the Nancy Guthrie Investigation? · True Crime with Gavin Fish

• 0:01
  I have said time and time again that journalism is a career path
• 0:08
  or what do we want to call it? A skill?
• 0:14
  AI don't even know the word for it, but it is it is a career
• 0:18
  path that does not require you to go to some fancy school.
• 0:23
  You don't need to go to Columbia.
• 0:24
  You don't need to go to wherever to get your journalism degree or
• 0:29
  your communications degree. You just need to be somebody who
• 0:32
  journals the goings on the happenings of wherever is it is
• 0:38
  that you live or you know, you might do it on a community
• 0:41
  level, nation, national level, world level, doesn't really
• 0:44
  matter. But, and I've defended that
• 0:47
  position because that is my story, right?
• 0:50
  I work as a reporter for a local news agency.
• 0:55
  I did not go to journalism school.
• 0:57
  I was trained on the job kind of the way journalists of old were,
• 1:01
  right? You, you get a job, you work in
• 1:04
  The Newsroom, you work your way up, that sort of thing.
• 1:08
  But I am very much second guessing that entire position
• 1:13
  now. Because we have got.
• 1:20
  I don't want to. We've got so-called my goodness,
• 1:23
  my hair is doing something here. Hold on, let's do that.
• 1:27
  There we go. We have got so-called citizen
• 1:31
  journalists in the Nancy Guthrie case that have inserted
• 1:36
  themselves into the the discussion, right?
• 1:43
  They, they no longer are reporting the news.
• 1:46
  They are making the news. And that is a really, really bad
• 1:53
  idea. And so while we're going to
• 1:54
  frame this around the Nancy Guthrie case, this conversation,
• 1:59
  we're going to be talking about responsible human behavior.
• 2:05
  I feel like I'm a little hot here.
• 2:06
  I'm going to pull back the microphone, responsible citizen
• 2:10
  journalism, responsible journalism.
• 2:13
  And we're going to call out some folks that have been behaving
• 2:17
  badly. We're going to try to learn for
• 2:19
  ourselves how not to behave because we don't want to be
• 2:24
  these guys. And along the way, we're going
• 2:28
  to learn what's going on with the case, what's going on around
• 2:31
  the case like Sheriff Nanos, what else have I got?
• 2:34
  Oh my goodness, get this, get my list up.
• 2:36
  What else have we got? We in true crime headlines,
• 2:39
  we're going to be looking at Sheriff Nanos.
• 2:43
  We're going to be looking at the Long Island serial killer case.
• 2:45
  Some strange news there. Little news out of the Anna
• 2:48
  Kepner case, which we went into in depth yesterday.
• 2:53
  And we've got some good news along with three questions.
• 2:56
  So we got a lot to cover. We got the a 15 gallon show that
• 3:00
  we need to fit into a 5 gallon bucket.
• 3:03
  It's going to be a long one. It's going to be a good one.
• 3:06
  I hope you'll stick with me. This video contains mature
• 3:21
  themes and discussions intended only for adult audiences.
• 3:25
  Viewer discretion is advised. Hello, my friend.
• 3:30
  Welcome back to another true crime conversation with me,
• 3:33
  Gavin Fish. I am so glad that you would
• 3:38
  check in with me, that you'd spend some time with me to, to
• 3:43
  hang out here on YouTube or on Spotify or on your podcast,
• 3:46
  wherever, wherever it is that you are.
• 3:49
  I'm glad that you've joined us. Thank you for doing that.
• 3:53
  Please tell us in the live stream where you are joining us
• 3:56
  from. I love that part.
• 3:58
  I love to know where you guys are.
• 4:00
  I love to see the regulars. I love to see the newbies.
• 4:03
  I love to see people who are near and far.
• 4:05
  So definitely check in there. I am for you, YouTube live
• 4:12
  stream viewers. I'm going to stick in a goal for
• 4:15
  super chats. I'm super grateful.
• 4:19
  Maybe use a different modifier there, Gavin.
• 4:22
  I'm Uber grateful. I'm very grateful.
• 4:25
  I'm gratefulissimo for the generosity of so many of you who
• 4:34
  watch the channel, who share my videos, who subscribe and like
• 4:39
  who give of your hard earned treasure to either be a member
• 4:42
  or a patron over on Patreon or or who offer me super chats and
• 4:47
  super stickers. You guys are awesome.
• 4:50
  Thank you, thank you, thank you for doing that.
• 4:52
  It makes it so that the work that I do and putting together
• 4:56
  this program for you pays off so I can keep doing it.
• 4:59
  So thank you. I I really appreciate it.
• 5:03
  All right, let's do a quick little recap A Rooney, if we
• 5:06
  can, of this case. This is the Nancy Guthrie case.
• 5:11
  Nancy Guthrie, 84 years old. She is taken in the middle of
• 5:17
  the night out of her sanctuary, her home, where she has lived
• 5:24
  for decades, where she has raised her family, where she has
• 5:29
  memories, where you know she lived when she lost her husband.
• 5:36
  This, this is her sanctuary, her place and criminals, horrible
• 5:43
  people in the middle of the night.
• 5:46
  I, I think people, I think people we know at least one
• 5:49
  person went in there injured her and took her out and she's never
• 5:55
  been heard from, seen again. It is most likely that her days
• 6:01
  here in this mortal coil have come to an end because of the
• 6:05
  nefarious and evil actions of these people, at least one of
• 6:11
  whom was caught on video wearing a mask, wearing gloves, armed.
• 6:19
  It's just it's a disgusting, horrifying and infuriating case
• 6:25
  that has the nation and the world captivated and for good
• 6:30
  reason, right? This could be our mother.
• 6:32
  This could be our grandmother. It is it is somebody's mother
• 6:36
  and grandmother. She is she is their loved one.
• 6:41
  They're the center of their world and and she was taken and
• 6:46
  it is just beyond the. Pale that this.
• 6:50
  Kind of crime happens. I hate, I hate crimes against
• 6:55
  the elderly and children. It just it just I'm working my
• 7:01
  I'm, I'm worked up. I'm worked up.
• 7:05
  We just got started there. I am spilling water on my
• 7:08
  keyboard. I'm so worked up.
• 7:12
  Wanda, can you bring me off the edge?
• 7:14
  Maybe Wanda can give me just a little, just some music to OK.
• 7:24
  Wanda is my music director, everybody.
• 7:29
  Thank you Wanda, that that helps a lot Wanda is my music
• 7:32
  director. She, she sometimes is the person
• 7:36
  who who, who takes me off the ledge.
• 7:40
  Why is my? There we go.
• 7:42
  OK, where was I? Oh, I was angry, but it's OK,
• 7:48
  There's something else to be angry about.
• 7:50
  OK, Here on the channel over the last couple of weeks, there have
• 7:54
  been a couple of stories that are already right there.
• 7:58
  They surround the story. They are not the story.
• 8:02
  They shouldn't be the story, but they they surround the story.
• 8:06
  So we have to talk about it. One of the one of those has been
• 8:10
  the whole JLR saga, right? This is this is a guy who is a
• 8:14
  YouTube, a successful YouTube has a big channel with over half
• 8:18
  a million subscribers. Many of his followers are just
• 8:22
  how would I describe them tastefully and and I guess
• 8:26
  without besmirching them. I I wanted to use the word
• 8:29
  rabbit. They're ardent.
• 8:31
  They're ardent followers and they will go to great lengths to
• 8:36
  not only support him but intimidate those who who.
• 8:41
  I don't know don't support him right and.
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  That became a story that that kind of surrounded the Nancy
• 8:50
  Guthrie case because he has been on the ground, quote UN quote,
• 8:55
  investigating. I I I would call it more like
• 8:59
  activist ISM activism more than investigation.
• 9:05
  That's just my take. I mean, you might disagree, but
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  he now. Is.
• 9:15
  I think he's still there. Last time I checked, I haven't
• 9:18
  checked in the last couple of days, I think he's still there.
• 9:21
  And there was an article that I brought you yesterday in
• 9:25
  headlines that didn't doesn't name him specifically.
• 9:29
  And it may not be about him, it may be about any number of other
• 9:33
  people, but I'm suspicious that it is about him and I want to
• 9:39
  start there. It, it, but I, I don't know that
• 9:43
  it's about him. I I'm just suspicious.
• 9:46
  OK, so for those of you who were on last night, you have seen
• 9:50
  this article, but I thought that I would bring it again to frame
• 9:55
  this because again, we are talking about my profession,
• 10:01
  something that I came to later on in life, but have grown to
• 10:04
  love. And I kind of feel protective of
• 10:08
  it like like a Big Brother with his kid sister, right?
• 10:12
  Like I can I can pick on my profession, but you may not that
• 10:17
  that's kind of how I feel about it.
• 10:19
  This written by Marissa Orr. Here is the article day 72 of
• 10:25
  Nancy Guthrie case. This came out two days ago.
• 10:28
  We are now at day 74. Neighborhood patrols increase
• 10:32
  after YouTube harassing complaints again Marissa Orr for
• 10:37
  KVOA. And I we don't need to read the
• 10:42
  whole thing, but. This will this will set our
• 10:44
  stage. OK.
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  Dateline is Tucson, AZ. It has been 72 days since the
• 10:50
  disappearance of Nancy Guthrie. As the search.
• 10:52
  Continues for the 84 year old. There is an update regarding an
• 10:56
  increase in patrols due to YouTube harassing complaints.
• 11:00
  Now that is a weirdly phrased sentence.
• 11:04
  It should, at least as I understand it.
• 11:06
  I mean, it's, it's grammatically correct, but I would, I would
• 11:11
  write it as due to an increase or regarding an increase in
• 11:16
  patrols due to complaints of harassment by a YouTube or
• 11:23
  Youtubers. I think that's what Marissa
• 11:26
  meant in her reporting. And like I said, she she wrote
• 11:30
  it correctly. I just, I kind of stumbled on
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  it. News 4 Tucson, this is KVOA
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  learned that the Pima County Sheriff's Department attended a
• 11:38
  recent homeowners association meeting for Guthrie's Catalina
• 11:41
  Foothills neighborhood. At that meeting, some of the
• 11:44
  neighbors complained about a YouTube.
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  OK, so it's a single YouTube harassing residents in the area.
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  PCSD confirmed that they have also received similar complaints
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  from Guthrie's daughter, Annie. I think they're Marissa.
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  I'm sorry, I I'm picking a part. There should be a comma there
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  and there. But that's OK.
• 12:05
  That's OK we're fine. So complaints from Guthrie's
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  daughter Annie in relation to her neighborhood.
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  Mooney, you were a school teacher, right?
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  Am I right on this? There should be commas.
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  But you know what I over comma things it's fine.
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  The department has increased patrols in both areas due to
• 12:24
  those complaints and then. Blah blah blah blah blah blah.
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  Blah, blah. I think that that's pretty much
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  then it then it goes into the story.
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  OK, so there there are complaints by neighbors in the
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  neighborhood of Nancy Guthrie and in the nearby neighborhood
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  of Annie that there is a YouTube that is harassing them.
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  Consequently, the Pima County Sheriff's Department have
• 12:52
  increased their patrols. Now, I have done my fair share
• 13:00
  of clashing, not, I mean friendly clashing with police
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  while I'm carrying out the duties of my job, one of the,
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  one of the. And here I am putting myself in
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  the story again. But it's an anecdote.
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  One of the things that we will do as reporters is we will be
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  doing something that is constitutionally protected, that
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  is not only protected but important that we do.
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  And police won't like what we're doing.
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  And so they will try to intimidate you out of doing the
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  thing. Sometimes they they don't like
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  it because what you're doing might be distasteful.
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  And, and sometimes it is it, it requires A journalist there
• 13:46
  though, in order to create the record, right.
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  So, so I've had my fair share of those kinds of incidents.
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  Like I, I can, I can think of one right now that was in a city
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  here in Western Pennsylvania where there was a shooting and
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  it was in the middle of the night and I middle of the night.
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  It was like 10:00 at night. I go out to do photojournalism
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  to get. Photography of it.
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  Another journalist will be writing the story because
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  breaking news. I'm out there getting
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  photography of it. I'm outside of the of the taped
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  off, cordoned off area and I have a long lens and a good
• 14:27
  camera and I'm taking pictures at night.
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  Now the police found this distasteful because what I
• 14:32
  didn't know is that the victim was a victim of himself.
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  Nevertheless, I was assigned and it was something that was
• 14:40
  important. And so I was taking pictures and
• 14:43
  an entire Police Department without their captain tried to
• 14:49
  intimidate me out of there, threatened me with arrest, the
• 14:53
  whole thing. I ended up calling 911 and going
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  these police officers are threatening me, me with arrest.
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  I'm outside of their crime scene and I got a call back from the
• 15:05
  chief. They got radio calls.
• 15:06
  And it was like this. So this.
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  Kind of thing happens, right? But if you are just out, like if
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  you're doing something that's not a protected activity, if
• 15:16
  you're out there harassing people, yeah, the police will
• 15:21
  come and they will arrest you. They can.
• 15:23
  They should. And that is what I mean, that
• 15:27
  sets the stage for the conversation that we're going to
• 15:29
  have today. But before I continue, I want to
• 15:32
  check in with you guys in the live chat.
• 15:35
  I think I saw a super chat come in as I was doing my my
• 15:38
  diatribe. Let's see, lady.
• 15:42
  Saga thank you very much First super chat.
• 15:45
  I deeply appreciate it thank you We're on our way to our goal.
• 15:48
  I I appreciate you. Thanks.
• 15:51
  OK where are you guys checking in from Mooney is digging the
• 15:54
  stripes do you like this? I have I have decided that I
• 15:59
  want to wear natural fibers from now on, so I am trying out linen
• 16:06
  for the first time in my life and.
• 16:10
  I got to say it's. Comfortable shirt breathes well.
• 16:12
  And, and thank you. I, I like the stripes myself.
• 16:15
  Thank you. Hillbilly says you do a good
• 16:20
  job, Gavin. Well, thank you very much, Bama.
• 16:22
  Beth is in the house. Good to see you.
• 16:28
  Let's see. Prague.
• 16:30
  Tracy Burns. Is in the house, Prague is in
• 16:32
  the house. Thank you very much.
• 16:36
  Love Prague, Jenny says. The difference from your face
• 16:40
  now compared to when you recorded your intro is amazing.
• 16:43
  Way to go. Thank you.
• 16:44
  Yeah, I probably need to re record the intro and outro.
• 16:48
  I'll keep the music though. Don't worry guys.
• 16:50
  Salisbury, Tennessee is here. Sharky Sharona is melting again
• 16:54
  in Lake Tahoe. Omaha, NE is here.
• 16:58
  The nickel capital of Canada. Happy Valley.
• 17:01
  Phoenix, AZ Guam is here. Jacksonville, FL.
• 17:06
  I'm sorry. Northern Kentucky.
• 17:07
  Jacksonville, FL Portland, OR Vancouver, Missouri.
• 17:12
  Eastern Kentucky. Toledo, OH.
• 17:16
  We got any fellow Welshes or Brits?
• 17:21
  Welcome, welcome, welcome. Yeah, I I appreciate you
• 17:25
  subscribers too. Thank you very much.
• 17:28
  Viewing from Santa Claus Land. Hence not the North Pole.
• 17:36
  Santa Claus. You're going to have to give me
• 17:40
  more. I'm not sure.
• 17:41
  Not sure. Seattle.
• 17:42
  Jersey Shore is here. I live where James Beard was
• 17:46
  born and lived before New York. All right, Alaska is here.
• 17:52
  Hillbilly. Thank you.
• 17:53
  Prayers for Nancy and her family.
• 17:55
  Fife, Scotland. We've got OK watching from the
• 17:59
  city where Keanu Reeves grew up. Was it Toronto?
• 18:02
  I don't know. I don't.
• 18:04
  For some reason, he strikes me as a Toronto guy.
• 18:07
  He's so chill and polite. Hello.
• 18:13
  From where Alabama, Georgia and Florida meet?
• 18:20
  All right, since you know where I live already, how about a new
• 18:22
  clue for a nearby city? This city is South of me and is
• 18:25
  mentioned in Carly Simon's song, You're So Vain.
• 18:30
  Saratoga, I believe, would be the name of that city.
• 18:34
  That's a good one. All right, British Columbia in
• 18:36
  the house. Thank you very much.
• 18:37
  I, I appreciate you guys. Thanks so much.
• 18:40
  I could go on and on and on. You guys are amazing and thanks
• 18:44
  for checking in. I that's that's probably my
• 18:47
  favorite. That's probably my favorite part
• 18:50
  of of the show. It's just.
• 18:55
  Like making new friends. Making new friends OK, where are
• 19:00
  we going to go from here Gavin? Let's let's take it back over to
• 19:07
  you guys will notice in if you're on YouTube, it'll be in
• 19:10
  the description below. If you're on a podcast, it'll be
• 19:13
  in the show notes. Lots and lots of links tonight.
• 19:18
  I've got so much to go through tonight, but I want to we've set
• 19:23
  the stage about what we're talking about, but I now want to
• 19:28
  maybe escalate things a little bit and talk about what the
• 19:33
  local impact in Tucson has been from from like content creators
• 19:41
  being on the ground. It's not just Youtubers, right?
• 19:44
  Content creators, Local news organizations.
• 19:48
  National news organizations. It has been disruptive, if you
• 19:53
  guys remember, but let's let's read from the AP here.
• 19:59
  But this this was back in February.
• 20:02
  Do you guys remember this from Jacques Bilode and Sejal
• 20:10
  Govindarao writing for the AP Dateline Phoenix?
• 20:18
  This again back February 25th the no parking zone around the
• 20:22
  home of Today show host Savannah Guthrie's mother where
• 20:24
  journalists. And social media streamers have
• 20:26
  stationed themselves over the past three weeks since her
• 20:28
  disappearance is being widened in response to.
• 20:31
  Bitter complaints from neighbors about congested roads,
• 20:34
  trespassing and trash left alongside roadways.
• 20:38
  I think that these, these fine folks living out there in the
• 20:44
  Catalina foothills put up with a lot, right?
• 20:48
  Put up with a lot. It wasn't just a media circus.
• 20:54
  I mean, it was a media circus, but it wasn't just that it was
• 21:00
  littering and it was trespassing.
• 21:04
  Just, you know, people. People sometimes just feel
• 21:07
  completely empowered to go, oh, you know, this neighborhood
• 21:11
  doesn't have fences. I guess I will just walk walk
• 21:14
  across this area to see what Nancy's backyard looks like or
• 21:17
  whatever, right? And, and, you know, again, not
• 21:23
  supposed to put myself in the story, but when we moved here to
• 21:26
  Western Pennsylvania, for the first time in our lives, we
• 21:30
  experienced a place where there just aren't fences, just aren't
• 21:35
  all that many fences, right? And.
• 21:38
  I was I was watching my kids. I was looking out the back
• 21:42
  window of the house watching my kids jump on the trampoline when
• 21:45
  just a stranger walked through. My kids were like five and two
• 21:51
  and a grown full grown stranger just walked through my backyard.
• 21:55
  I ran out there. What are you doing?
• 21:58
  She's like, oh, I just I just like to cut through here to go
• 22:00
  to my house. Stop.
• 22:02
  Don't do that. You may you do not have
• 22:05
  permission to be on my property. Like I just happened to watch
• 22:09
  you as you're going. I don't know you right.
• 22:12
  And I'm sure that's exactly what these people and Nancy Guthrie's
• 22:17
  and Annie's. Neighborhood.
• 22:21
  Feel like like why are you trespassing on my on my
• 22:26
  property? Continuing this article back in
• 22:29
  February, Pima County officials say an effort over the weekend
• 22:32
  to have one way traffic flow on the road in front of Nancy
• 22:34
  Guthrie's house. In the Catalina foothills just
• 22:37
  outside Tucson hasn't worked as they hoped, leading to expanded
• 22:41
  parking restrictions. And then it talks about.
• 22:45
  You know, new restrictions, violators, what it's going to,
• 22:48
  what it's going to take. The constant presence of news
• 22:51
  crews, bloggers, curious onlookers has drawn mixed
• 22:55
  reaction from neighbors. Some appreciated the attention
• 22:57
  the case has been getting. Others have placed traffic cones
• 23:00
  and signs on their properties to keep people off.
• 23:02
  Yeah, one of my biggest pet peeves is people parking on my
• 23:05
  driveway. I hate it.
• 23:07
  Do not ever park on my driveway. Ever.
• 23:12
  That that is not for you. That is for me, my wife, our
• 23:16
  children and and the guests that we deem may do that.
• 23:21
  And my whole life I've had people parking on or in front of
• 23:25
  my driveway. It drives me crazy.
• 23:28
  So yeah, they're, they're putting out traffic cones.
• 23:30
  Please don't block me in that kind of stuff.
• 23:33
  Authorities say tents, generators, satellite trucks set
• 23:36
  up along the road have created congestion and safety concerns.
• 23:39
  Yadda, yadda, yadda, right. So, so I mean, this whole thing,
• 23:45
  this whole like circus, the trespassing, the littering, the
• 23:51
  curious onlookers, the, the well-intentioned people that
• 23:57
  were curious and may want to, may have wanted to leave flowers
• 24:01
  on a makeshift memorial for Nancy.
• 24:03
  People who deeply care. You know, there's a wide range
• 24:06
  of professionals that have crews pop up tents and generators and
• 24:12
  battery backups and all that stuff.
• 24:14
  They're just, it created an issue.
• 24:17
  And this is back in February, right?
• 24:19
  We are now in the middle of April.
• 24:22
  OK, so moving forward, actually, it's actually a couple days
• 24:27
  back, but but then you know, this article from the Guardian
• 24:33
  from February 22nd. So a few days before the last
• 24:35
  article we looked at this one starts talking about.
• 24:38
  OK, now, now we've got concern as an industry here, right?
• 24:44
  This is a huge story and you know the the journalism and
• 24:52
  media industry are going wait a minute, I don't like.
• 24:55
  These amateur YouTube citizen detectives.
• 25:01
  And are they putting the case in jeopardy and they start, they're
• 25:05
  starting asking these questions, right?
• 25:08
  And this is a responsible question to ask.
• 25:12
  And I am, I am asking the question of myself as well
• 25:16
  because I, while I have not been out in Tucson, I have not been
• 25:20
  out on the ground. I have been reporting on the
• 25:24
  case. I think that having eyeballs on
• 25:27
  this case is good. I think it it keeps it in the
• 25:30
  public zeitgeist. It makes it so it's more likely
• 25:34
  that somebody might call with a lead, somebody might say to
• 25:38
  themselves, oh, I want that reward.
• 25:42
  I think there's value in it. But is there also a danger of
• 25:52
  putting the case at jeopardy, especially when it comes to
• 25:57
  misinformation? Right.
• 26:00
  I hate that word. I, I, I hate that misinformation
• 26:03
  and disinformation is such a politically loaded word.
• 26:06
  But you know, poor reporting or or full on just speculating and
• 26:14
  speaking in facts rather than in in actual editorial where
• 26:19
  everybody understands, hey, this is editorial, this is opinion,
• 26:23
  that kind of stuff. So this written by Elena
• 26:26
  Demopoulos from the Guardian back in February.
• 26:30
  She writes self declared sleuths have inserted themselves in the
• 26:35
  search for Nancy Guthrie, compromising the investigation
• 26:38
  for views and clicks. On the 10th day for the Search
• 26:42
  of Nancy Guthrie, reporters camped outside of the missing
• 26:45
  woman's home noticed a strange man strut right up to the front
• 26:49
  door. It had been more than a week
• 26:51
  since the mother of today's show host Savannah Guthrie, had
• 26:54
  disappeared, and authorities had just announced they had a new
• 26:57
  lead from Ring footage of what looked like a potential suspect
• 27:01
  or subject attempting to tamper with the doorbell camera.
• 27:04
  Which we've all we've all. Seen.
• 27:05
  That video, right, I'll put it up again on the morning of her
• 27:11
  disappearance. So now who was this unknown
• 27:14
  person clad in a Gray top and black pants, carrying a large
• 27:18
  bag and striding to the door? I cannot believe that this
• 27:22
  happened. It was a Domino's delivery
• 27:25
  driver. A Domino's delivery driver
• 27:29
  quote, Never seen something quite like this, local ABC
• 27:33
  reporter Ford Hatchett wrote on X delivery was for an
• 27:37
  independent journalist out here who is live streaming JLR
• 27:41
  investigators. Investigates a viewer ordered it
• 27:44
  for him. Now I I have no idea if Mr.
• 27:49
  Riches was like hey order me a pizza and somebody ordered it
• 27:52
  for him or just an over enthusiastic viewer was like
• 27:58
  hey, Jonathan looks hungry there, I'm going to send him a
• 28:03
  pizza. Either way, a Domino's delivery
• 28:08
  driver full on walks up to the door.
• 28:16
  OK, continuing the article, this is JLR Investigates is the name
• 28:20
  of the YouTube channel run by Jonathan Lee Riches, who
• 28:22
  describes himself as a fearless investigator and has more than
• 28:26
  540,000 subscribers that watch his dispatches from outside
• 28:30
  Guthrie's Tucson home. Quote, We can't believe we have
• 28:34
  to say this, but media on scene, please do not order food
• 28:37
  delivery to a crime scene address, the Pima County
• 28:40
  Sheriff's Department wrote in a statement.
• 28:42
  This interferes with an active investigation.
• 28:44
  Please also respect private property laws.
• 28:48
  OK, There was something that, oh, this reminded me of
• 28:56
  something. Again, not trying to insert
• 28:59
  myself into the story here, but an anecdote that I I want to
• 29:04
  share. OK, here in my area, there was a
• 29:13
  there was a story that had to do with the alleged and alleged
• 29:22
  inappropriate sexual or romantic language between a female high
• 29:28
  school teacher and a minor student.
• 29:33
  Now, this obviously is a big deal in any community, right?
• 29:37
  And I was assigned to do the investigation to the to, well,
• 29:42
  not to do the investigation, but to, to work on the series.
• 29:45
  I, I needed to call school boards and principals and I
• 29:49
  needed to try to make contact with the victim's family and,
• 29:55
  you know, who had been speaking out and the alleged, well, the
• 30:01
  teacher and all the stuff, right?
• 30:04
  Doing so in a responsible but bold manner and covering the,
• 30:12
  you know, covering school board meetings, the whole thing.
• 30:14
  It was this big thing. Well, in the meantime, there was
• 30:18
  another guy who made a Facebook page and he called it.
• 30:29
  Well, you guys know I'm in western Pennsylvania.
• 30:31
  I think he called it the Butler News Butler is a town north of
• 30:35
  Pittsburgh that you guys might remember it because that's where
• 30:42
  an assassin shot at Donald Trump when he was running for
• 30:47
  president the second time, hit him in the ear.
• 30:49
  And I was Butler, PA, right? So by the way, I had been
• 30:53
  assigned to cover that. But was but had to leave town.
• 30:57
  So I was supposed to be at that. But anyway, I think he called it
• 31:01
  the Butler news and he quickly racked up huge Facebook,
• 31:08
  Facebook following and and I talked to him a couple of times
• 31:13
  and he told me, oh, I've got I've got witnesses, I've got
• 31:17
  statements. I've got people who are talking
• 31:18
  to me, Gavin and I will share it with you.
• 31:20
  And I went great, but that never came.
• 31:25
  Didn't matter how many times I asked for it, it never came.
• 31:27
  He never had it. He never at least I think he
• 31:31
  never had it. He did give me some contact
• 31:34
  information for some people that had like third party, you know,
• 31:37
  heard rumors this, that and the other, but he never had it.
• 31:40
  But he was, he was going online talking about this definitely
• 31:45
  happened and, and she definitely did this.
• 31:48
  And I've got the, I've got the receipts and I've got all the
• 31:51
  tea. And he's racking up hundreds of
• 31:56
  thousands of followers and thousands and thousands of
• 32:00
  dollars by acting that way, right?
• 32:03
  So it's tempting, it's tempting to act that way.
• 32:05
  I look at a channel like JLR Investigates and I see 500 +
• 32:10
  1000 subscribers and I go, dude, if I only did that, if I did
• 32:16
  that shtick, I would be working this full time.
• 32:22
  You know? We wouldn't have to struggle on
• 32:24
  certain months, you know. I, I, I have those conversations
• 32:28
  with myself, but then I remember that that Facebook news
• 32:32
  organization that put himself out there, I actually don't
• 32:35
  think it was called the Butler News.
• 32:36
  Now I can't remember. But put himself out there as a
• 32:39
  news source, a credible news source.
• 32:44
  And he basically printed money. And I even thought like last
• 32:51
  week, hey, I wonder if that guy, I wonder if I could hire him to
• 32:54
  run my social media rather than no, Gavin, don't do that because
• 32:58
  what kind of stuff is he going to put?
• 32:59
  Out there, right. So anyway, that was a bit of a
• 33:03
  tangent and I didn't even do the tangent music, but anyway.
• 33:10
  Continuing the article, national media has descended on crime
• 33:16
  scene crime scene since the dawn of tabloids.
• 33:20
  Take two. Javi.
• 33:22
  Javi, you're going to edit that out for me.
• 33:23
  Thanks. Buddy, since the dawn of
• 33:26
  tabloids more than 100 years ago, the modern media circus
• 33:30
  only became more invasive with the advent of the 24/7 news
• 33:33
  cycle. Yeah, I actually know the guy
• 33:38
  who Ted Turner hired to create CNN.
• 33:44
  He ruined the world for us, man. But anyway, the Nancy Guthrie
• 33:48
  investigation is no different. But this time an even more
• 33:51
  meddling type of reporter has come to define the three-week
• 33:54
  investigation. The true crime streamer self
• 33:57
  declared sleuths like Riches have inserted themselves into
• 34:01
  the investigation, broadcasting their videos to a sizable
• 34:04
  audience. He posts stream.
• 34:06
  He posts streams with titles like Breaking Manhunt, Nancy
• 34:10
  Guthrie, Kidnapping Live. But once you click through, you
• 34:13
  mostly see Riches simply sitting in his car.
• 34:16
  On Day 19 of the investigations, he was at one point documenting
• 34:19
  a police shift change at the scene of the crime bathroom.
• 34:23
  Break, he narrated to his 29,000 viewers.
• 34:25
  That drove me nuts. That kind of stuff just drives
• 34:28
  me nuts. Rich's does try to offer more
• 34:30
  than just dry footage of the house's exterior.
• 34:33
  He has investigated, that is, in quotes tips such as an unrelated
• 34:37
  CARTO and hospital airlift, as if these leads might go
• 34:41
  somewhere. Followers might appreciate
• 34:43
  Rich's tenacity. Yeah, but the false.
• 34:46
  Tips breed misinformation. That word that I hit again.
• 34:49
  State Representative Alma Hernandez slammed wannabe
• 34:52
  reporters who have now caused more harm than good to the
• 34:55
  entire situation and put the. This serious case in jeopardy
• 35:01
  and then it goes into, you know, before his true crime pivot
• 35:03
  Riches spent time in jail for wire fraud, made headlines of
• 35:08
  2012 for driving to Connecticut in the wake of the Sandy Hook
• 35:11
  tragedy posing as an elementary school shooter's uncle who he is
• 35:17
  known for his prolific filing of absurd lawsuits and blah, blah,
• 35:21
  blah. It doesn't doesn't really
• 35:22
  matter, but. I mean, this is a serious
• 35:26
  concern. It's a, and do I, I don't know
• 35:32
  if his JLR that is harassing neighbors or that neighbors feel
• 35:36
  like there is harassment going on.
• 35:39
  I don't know. But and and he is not the only
• 35:42
  one, right. So where is that line of
• 35:47
  responsibility? Because we're going to get into
• 35:50
  it here, you know, coming up, there is a place for citizen
• 35:55
  journalism. And sometimes it is super
• 35:58
  valuable. So important.
• 36:02
  I mean, there, there have been, there have been major news
• 36:05
  stories that have been uncovered that have changed.
• 36:09
  I mean, they've changed policies of governments that have come
• 36:14
  out on TikTok videos by dudes with cell phone cameras.
• 36:19
  So it's important. It's important work.
• 36:25
  But where is the line? Let me check in with you guys,
• 36:28
  see what you are saying over in the live stream.
• 36:31
  Let me refresh by here real quick, see if you guys are
• 36:35
  saying anything that you want me to check out.
• 36:44
  It's doodlebug didn't put GF in the in the comment but I but I
• 36:48
  caught it. Youtubers 99% stayed in one spot
• 36:51
  and they picked up after themselves and others.
• 36:53
  True probably true. I don't know if that it's true
• 36:57
  I. Don't know that.
• 36:57
  It's false, probably true, but but it only takes one or two,
• 37:03
  right? You know coffee time for D
• 37:07
  content providers are needed, but you.
• 37:09
  Have to respect people's homes for sure.
• 37:13
  Let's see, Debbie says, if you wouldn't do it or want it at
• 37:20
  your home, then don't do it at someone else's.
• 37:22
  Yeah, just the standard golden rule, right?
• 37:25
  Do unto others. Let's see.
• 37:30
  Elizabeth Mcmasters, Esquire. Gavin, I think if Nanos would
• 37:33
  have had regular press conferences, it may not have
• 37:35
  been this bad. An interesting an interesting
• 37:39
  take, Elizabeth. They saw an information void and
• 37:42
  took advantage of it. In my opinion.
• 37:45
  That is a terrific insight. Had there been constant updates
• 37:52
  to the media? Yeah, not only would that have
• 37:56
  influenced the way on the ground YouTube streamers would have
• 38:00
  handled things, it would have changed the way the media
• 38:04
  handled it as. Well, right.
• 38:06
  Great comment. I hadn't thought about that at
• 38:09
  all. Yeah, K hunk one, Gavin, there's
• 38:14
  no real markings to indicate property lines.
• 38:17
  I I understand, however, it is somebody's property.
• 38:23
  If it is not on the street in that neighborhood, in almost any
• 38:27
  neighborhood, it is somebody's property.
• 38:30
  And it only takes about, I don't know, 16 milliseconds for a
• 38:36
  thinking person to to say yeah. I I shouldn't be on people's
• 38:43
  property now listen. I would also come to the defense
• 38:47
  of bold, good investigative journalist.
• 38:51
  People like Brian Anton, I bring him up all the time, right?
• 38:55
  Brian is a very, very, very good investigative reporter who will
• 39:00
  boldly approach people who will get interviews, but he will not,
• 39:09
  he will not go and just trespass on somebody's property.
• 39:13
  I, I, I can't imagine that he would do that.
• 39:16
  I imagine that he would ask for permission.
• 39:20
  Because that's what that's what any reporter would do.
• 39:24
  And any like trained reporter, somebody who's been on the job
• 39:27
  for a little while, somebody that's not just so overbearing
• 39:32
  and overly hyped about his or her own importance.
• 39:36
  I I that's, I guess that's my point, right.
• 39:41
  Thank you for the comments. Great.
• 39:45
  Yeah, poor delivery guy. I'd be mortified.
• 39:51
  Yeah, they're. True crime junkies.
• 39:53
  I see I see your comment. I I, I I'm not going to try to
• 39:59
  purposefully point out people specifically unless they are in
• 40:03
  an article that I'm reading and. The one that you want me to to
• 40:07
  check out is in an article that we're going to to get to just
• 40:15
  just keep on going, Mooney says. Gavin, I think you missed my
• 40:25
  ever so clever comment comma comment.
• 40:27
  Here goes commas save lives. Let's eat grandma versus let's
• 40:32
  eat grandma. Yeah, that's that's a good one.
• 40:36
  To be fair, he took front the front stoop pics.
• 40:38
  Yeah, that is true. Talking about Brian Enton, yes,
• 40:42
  his producer did go up to the front door.
• 40:45
  However, that is within the normal bounds of of of
• 40:52
  journalism, right? That that is within the normal
• 40:55
  confines. OK, I'm going to go up to the
• 40:58
  front door and knock on the door, see if anybody will talk
• 41:01
  to me. If they don't talk to me, I have
• 41:03
  something to report. They didn't answer the door.
• 41:06
  If they do talk to me, I have something to report.
• 41:08
  They answer the door and talk to me.
• 41:10
  Maybe it's off the record, maybe it's on background.
• 41:13
  Maybe they say get off my property, which I then turn
• 41:16
  around and do see I I can use the curtilage as as a reporter
• 41:22
  and that's perfectly fine. I can use the curtilage the way
• 41:26
  a normal person. What I should not do is walk
• 41:29
  around on people's property, and that's the difference.
• 41:33
  So, and actually, to your point, Ohio Palm Mom, I think it
• 41:38
  probably hurt the investigation, releasing the photography and
• 41:43
  video of the blood on the front porch.
• 41:48
  I think it probably did hurt the investigation.
• 41:50
  But I don't think that Brian Inton and his crew were outside
• 41:54
  of journalism ethics. I think that the scene shouldn't
• 41:58
  have been opened back up. That that's what I think.
• 42:03
  Let's see, Apple says, I respect you.
• 42:04
  Don't harass folks for content. I do my best.
• 42:07
  Do my best. Okie dokie, that's all.
• 42:11
  That's all you guys have with the GF on there.
• 42:14
  Want to make sure that we don't go too long tonight.
• 42:18
  Thank you to all of you who are joining me.
• 42:19
  By the way, we've got 679 people on by my count and and I am
• 42:24
  grateful that you would spend your time with me, especially
• 42:27
  those of you who are Spotify Premium members.
• 42:31
  I can't tell you how much it helps the channel.
• 42:34
  If you're a Spotify Premium member, you can watch this
• 42:37
  video, especially if you are a a Rewatch Crew member and you are
• 42:42
  a Spotify Premium member. Go go watch it on Spotify.
• 42:45
  It helps me out huge, way bigger than YouTube.
• 42:49
  And yeah, I don't I guess I don't need to beat that horse.
• 42:53
  OK, what was the next thing? OK, talking about the motive
• 42:58
  here. Let's.
• 42:59
  Let let's talk about. Why this kind of thing is
• 43:03
  happening? Why the rise of citizen
• 43:06
  journalism? You know, what are the good
• 43:09
  things about it? What are the bad things about
• 43:11
  it? And I actually think that
• 43:12
  there's a pretty good article from the 17th of last month that
• 43:17
  talks about this. This written by Megan Palin from
• 43:19
  the New York Post. Youtubers making thousands of
• 43:23
  dollars from ghoulishly hanging around crime scenes and
• 43:27
  unfounded theories. OK, let me just let me let me
• 43:31
  just pause here and offer a little criticism of the New York
• 43:35
  Post. They are, they are rather a
• 43:38
  tabloid and writing, writing that headline is a tabloid style
• 43:45
  headline. Also, I am a YouTube making
• 43:49
  money not by hanging around crime scenes, but by covering
• 43:53
  crimes. So I'm, I, I am also in the
• 43:57
  sights of, of this article, but I, but I also kind of think it's
• 44:00
  fair that I am. OK.
• 44:03
  This again talks about the the police scene.
• 44:07
  I'm sorry, the pizza delivery guy talks about JLR, you know
• 44:13
  who's camped out and then I'm I'll continue here, OK, quote
• 44:17
  we're trying to get. People a view from an outsider
• 44:19
  looking in to see what it's like, especially after the
• 44:21
  mainstream media goes home, said Alina Smith, Co, founder of
• 44:25
  Crime Scene Collective, a network of streamers who are.
• 44:28
  Also in Tucson, AZ at the Guthrie House.
• 44:32
  Quote I asked my supporters and followers what else they want,
• 44:35
  what they're looking for, and I try to give them that, she told
• 44:37
  The Post. To casual observers, it may seem
• 44:40
  bizarre to watch for hours only to see a little more than a
• 44:44
  police shift change happen. But.
• 44:46
  Streamers who have built their brands giving daily commentary
• 44:50
  on missing person cases, murders and police investigations have
• 44:54
  devoted communities who treat the cases like interactive
• 44:56
  mysteries. Rich's JLR investigated tips
• 45:01
  including an unrelated cartoon and a hospital airlift.
• 45:05
  He felt he could be connected to the case.
• 45:08
  He also takes requests for Super Chat cash donations.
• 45:10
  As do I, right quote. Is the doormat still there?
• 45:14
  One woman asked after donating $5.
• 45:17
  Richard Rich is obliged walking. Closer to Guthrie's house and
• 45:21
  zooming in on the mat. Yep, have a look, he replied.
• 45:24
  They haven't ever taken it away for testing.
• 45:27
  These DIY online channels can prove lucrative too, with top
• 45:31
  live streamers pulling in up to $30,000 a week, according to
• 45:34
  Smith. With fans flying in from other
• 45:37
  states to meet them, followers say they admire the doggedness
• 45:43
  and feel like they're part of the investigation.
• 45:45
  However, they are not, and this is where police say problems
• 45:50
  arise. During the ongoing search for
• 45:52
  Guthrie and in the absence of suspects and leads, there has
• 45:57
  been intense speculation, often fueled by live streamers.
• 46:01
  A fever pitch was reached with baseless accusations made
• 46:05
  against Nancy's son-in-law, Tomaso Sione, as he was the last
• 46:09
  person to see the 84 year old grandmother alive.
• 46:12
  I will come to the defense of streamers here.
• 46:15
  OK? It wasn't a streamer who made
• 46:17
  that accusation. That accusation came from the
• 46:24
  mainstream media anyway. 5th grade teacher Dominic Evidence,
• 46:28
  48, Evans, 48, said accusations against him exploded online
• 46:34
  after amateur investigators realized he played in a band
• 46:37
  with Sione and he had to send his kids away and hide inside
• 46:41
  his own home with the lights off as people went to great efforts
• 46:44
  to catch a glimpse of him. Guys, we are not those people,
• 46:48
  OK? We will just be happy Making
• 46:50
  less than $30,000 a week. I mean there there may come a
• 46:57
  time I hope there's a time when I am on the ground.
• 47:01
  I would love that. I would love to be on the ground
• 47:04
  for some of these cases. As I've said as late as
• 47:08
  yesterday, love to be on the ground with some of these cases,
• 47:11
  but I'm not going to be a JLR investigates.
• 47:16
  I, I would model myself after a person like Brian and, or other
• 47:23
  investigative journalists that do things the right way.
• 47:27
  We don't want people having to send their children away.
• 47:30
  We don't want, we don't want wild, we don't want to be making
• 47:34
  wild accusations against people. We don't want to have them, you
• 47:40
  know, hide in their homes. On February 16th, Pima County
• 47:44
  Sheriff Chris Nanos put out a statement refuting rumors and
• 47:47
  stating Guthrie's families members had been cleared of
• 47:50
  suspicion. So yeah, let's see, there was
• 47:56
  another one. Another case recently cautioned
• 47:59
  as to what can happen if people broadcast libelous and
• 48:02
  defamatory allegations online. Texas.
• 48:04
  TikTok tarot card reader Ashley Guillard repeatedly and
• 48:08
  baselessly claimed in videos that University of Idaho
• 48:12
  professor Rebecca Schofield had a secret romance with one of the
• 48:16
  four. Victims of the Moscow ID student
• 48:18
  murderers and had ordered the killings.
• 48:21
  She made the claims from November 22 onward, despite A
• 48:24
  lawsuit filed by Scofield a month later stating she had
• 48:27
  never met the victims and was out of the state when the
• 48:30
  murders occurred. Even after police said Scofield
• 48:33
  was not involved and despite cease and desist orders from
• 48:36
  lawyers, Guillard continued to make claims that led to a Boise
• 48:39
  court to rule against her and award Scofield $10 million in
• 48:43
  damages. Meanwhile, in December last
• 48:46
  year, quiet Brentwood LA Block turned into a live stream circus
• 48:49
  in the hours after Rob Reiner and his wife Michelle were
• 48:52
  allegedly murdered. They were murdered inside the
• 48:55
  mansion, allegedly by their own son.
• 48:58
  See, we should, we should switch around that that sentence a
• 49:01
  little bit. With disorderly social media
• 49:03
  influencers causing headaches for both neighbors and cops,
• 49:07
  several of them erupted in verbal arguments outside the
• 49:10
  crime scene and were forced by. Police.
• 49:13
  To turn down music blasting from a car.
• 49:15
  One man stood in front of the home wearing a black sweatshirt
• 49:17
  topped with a gold Burger King crown and repeatedly accused
• 49:21
  members of the meeting media of assaulting him, claiming at one
• 49:24
  point he touched my property and is invading my creative bubble.
• 49:28
  No arrests were made. So yeah, we got issues.
• 49:34
  We've got issues that there there is a place for citizen
• 49:41
  journalism. 100% but this is crossing a line man, these these
• 49:47
  kinds of stories, they're just absolutely crossing a line.
• 49:49
  It's like they are I. Mean, I mean, what are we doing
• 49:58
  as consumers of media? What are we?
• 50:01
  Doing this is causing me to take a hard look at myself.
• 50:09
  Do you guys watch Smarter every day?
• 50:14
  Smarter everyday Recently it's a YouTube channel, an engineer
• 50:18
  named Destin who reminded me of a lesson that I got years and
• 50:23
  years ago so cool about something called the Johari
• 50:28
  window, which is basically a a way for one to analyze oneself,
• 50:36
  right? It's, it's a method for self
• 50:40
  discovery of expanding the things you know about yourself
• 50:45
  and learning things that you don't know about yourself.
• 50:49
  It's terrific. And, and I'm having one of those
• 50:51
  moments, right? Like what are we doing as
• 50:56
  content creators and as content consumers that is causing a a
• 51:06
  market for behavior like this? Right, it's creating a market
• 51:12
  for behaviour like this and and maybe it's not I mean, this is
• 51:17
  just a little reflection, right? Maybe it's not just consumers
• 51:22
  driving it or content creators driving it.
• 51:24
  Maybe it's also that the trust in.
• 51:29
  The national media. The so-called mainstream media
• 51:34
  is at an all time low and so people are looking for someone
• 51:38
  they trust and then when they find somebody that I don't know
• 51:40
  they identify with, they latch on to that person.
• 51:42
  I don't know. I don't know it's worth it's.
• 51:46
  Worth trying to figure this out though for sure, but the reason
• 51:51
  that that content creators are doing it 100% in my opinion is
• 51:57
  financially. Well, no, no, no, that's
• 51:59
  overstating it. I would say the primary
• 52:01
  motivator for content creators is financially motivated.
• 52:07
  That includes me, right? But it also includes police
• 52:12
  officers. It includes judges and
• 52:15
  prosecutors and defense attorneys.
• 52:19
  Everybody's primary motivation is financial.
• 52:24
  So a main financial or a primary financial motivation in and of
• 52:30
  itself is not unrighteous, I guess, but it can become
• 52:36
  unhealthy, especially if we're talking about so much money,
• 52:40
  right? If I was out there making
• 52:42
  $30,000 a week. Crying out loud, you make more
• 52:46
  than the average American. You're in the top 1% or 2% of
• 52:52
  American earners after 4. Weeks of being on the ground
• 52:57
  right you're 6 figures so yeah it it can become unhealthy and
• 53:04
  unrighteous the the motivation itself in and of itself is not
• 53:08
  that but it it can become that let me see what what questions
• 53:16
  you guys are asking Leslie Hankins says Gavin the better
• 53:19
  self inquiry question is why are we not holding police
• 53:23
  accountable accountable to do the job when there is a vacuum,
• 53:26
  it will be filled by other seeking truth.
• 53:28
  I think that's a good question. I that, and and indeed it might
• 53:34
  even be a better question than what I was saying.
• 53:38
  I was kind of focusing my are my ire at the media coverage of it,
• 53:45
  of the traditional media. And you're focusing on police.
• 53:50
  I I do. Think that police?
• 53:52
  Could do a better job of just being transparent.
• 53:55
  A very good example of transparency in police was in
• 54:00
  the investigation of the case of Monique and Spencer Tepi.
• 54:06
  Right now, police in that case, they couldn't there.
• 54:12
  There were a lot of things they couldn't tell us, but we were
• 54:16
  all confident that they were, that they were.
• 54:23
  Working on it because they were talking to the media and they
• 54:25
  were answering questions and they were putting out statements
• 54:29
  and they were handling it really, really well.
• 54:32
  So yeah, I think I think you've got a good point.
• 54:40
  Let's see coffee time for D says hey slot GF would thank you and
• 54:45
  play music. For a $100 super sticker would
• 54:51
  play, I would play music for a super.
• 54:56
  That's hilarious. Now again, Archangel Morici,
• 55:02
  says Gavin, I'm sorry, but why the doormat wasn't taken to
• 55:05
  analyze? Was that statement correct?
• 55:08
  I don't. Know, I don't know.
• 55:11
  I mean JLR reported it was. I don't know if it was or not.
• 55:15
  Leslie says TMZ played a bigger role on the case, possibly
• 55:19
  throwing off track. All YouTube people put together
• 55:22
  did a fraction of the possible harm that TMZ did.
• 55:24
  Why are we not outraged at TMZ? I kind of am.
• 55:29
  I mean, right now we're I mean we're couching this discussion
• 55:34
  in the complaints that Youtubers are harassing people or a
• 55:41
  YouTube is harassing people. These are allegations that I
• 55:45
  don't know if he is harassing or she or if they think that he has
• 55:50
  or feel that he has. But but yeah, that that's
• 55:57
  probably why I'm not that's why I'm not talking about TMZ.
• 56:00
  It hasn't hasn't been part of the couching of the
• 56:05
  conversation. It's doodlebug Gavin.
• 56:07
  It's the. People who literally.
• 56:08
  Believe they have just as much right to be there 24/7.
• 56:16
  Hang on just one second. I just heard a loud crash in my
• 56:21
  house. Maybe that was Thunder or
• 56:26
  something. OK, it's doodlebug.
• 56:29
  It's the. People who literally.
• 56:31
  Believe they have just as much right to be there 24/7 as the
• 56:34
  homeowners that bother me. Smoking weed, cussing loud,
• 56:37
  loudly, shining bright lights, etcetera.
• 56:39
  I agree with that. I agree with that, Lee says.
• 56:45
  Mike Ruiz with Fox Digital did a great job too.
• 56:47
  Very respectful. Indeed he did, Mike.
• 56:49
  Mike's a professional too. Mike's terrific.
• 56:55
  Let's see. Oh, it's storming.
• 56:57
  That was that was Thunder that I heard through my headphones.
• 57:00
  Crazy autumn and I live in the same place.
• 57:05
  Okie, dokie. All right, So what did I plan
• 57:09
  next? I have to go to my notes, right?
• 57:13
  Let's see it. It got even messier than this,
• 57:18
  right? Going back to previous reporting
• 57:21
  again, this one from March 2nd, right?
• 57:25
  Ghoulish. Again, using the word ghoulish,
• 57:28
  what is it with the New York Post Ghoul this and ghoul that
• 57:32
  ghoulish Nancy Guthrie streamers are feuding with each other
• 57:36
  outside of her house as crime scene becomes grim spectacle
• 57:40
  again. The New York Post is pretty
• 57:43
  tabloidy that's written by Alex Olivera.
• 57:46
  Ghoulish streamers are turning Nancy Guthrie's Tucson home into
• 57:50
  a grim spectacle as they feud with each other a month after
• 57:53
  the 84 year old grandmother went missing. 1 streamer who goes by
• 57:56
  Kiki. Showed up at the crime scene
• 57:59
  over the weekend wearing a tiny pair of booty shorts and a crop
• 58:02
  top, accompanied by a leather clad cameraman.
• 58:06
  But she got into a fight online with other streamers who are on
• 58:09
  site, including the true crime gadfly JLR Investigates and
• 58:14
  another person known online as Criminal Network.
• 58:17
  They accused her of using the scene of the Guthrie tragedy to
• 58:20
  stage a risque photoshoot. They were salivating at that,
• 58:24
  that that caused drama. And yeah, footage from Kiki
• 58:29
  Stream captured somebody appearing to call her
• 58:31
  embarrassing until she flipped them the middle finger.
• 58:36
  The clip ended up on X, where the streamers had it out with
• 58:39
  each other. Quote, adults talking, pay
• 58:43
  attention, Kiki. Once this becomes about me or
• 58:45
  you, it's no longer about Nancy. So unless you're helping to find
• 58:49
  her, respectfully, STFU, Criminal Network wrote.
• 58:52
  Yeah, that was helpful. I will no longer entertain you
• 58:56
  or your hidden motives. Nancy.
• 58:57
  Notice your name is not Nancy. OK, but here's the thing.
• 59:02
  Those kinds of comments insert themselves into and.
• 59:05
  And this is the kind of. False righteousness that if it
• 59:11
  were in a religious setting, people would call what?
• 59:16
  You know what? What am I?
• 59:21
  What is the word that I'm looking for?
• 59:22
  Somebody help me out. It's it Well, hypocrisy, right?
• 59:26
  This, this is this is false righteousness.
• 59:29
  Say her name. Her name is Nancy.
• 59:30
  Your name is not Nancy. Don't put yourself in the middle
• 59:32
  of this. And yet by making that comment,
• 59:35
  this person is indeed putting themselves in the middle of it,
• 59:41
  and they're doing it by design that they're not doing it
• 59:45
  accidentally. You can't convince me of that.
• 59:47
  This is my opinion, but it's being done by design.
• 59:52
  OK, so. Yeah, you successfully turned
• 59:58
  all the attention from Nancy Guthrie and diverted it to me,
• 1:00:02
  Kiki wrote, calling out JL Rs account.
• 1:00:04
  I think the FBI would applaud you for your job well done.
• 1:00:07
  While you were focusing all your attention on me, I was reporting
• 1:00:10
  the facts and raising awareness in my own video, she added.
• 1:00:12
  Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah, right?
• 1:00:13
  So now we we've got just idiots which.
• 1:00:18
  I mean, the Internet's full of them, right?
• 1:00:22
  We've just got. Idiots arguing and, and and
• 1:00:30
  they're making money doing it. OK, so we got messy behavior.
• 1:00:36
  The the shift, you know, of focus away from the case itself.
• 1:00:45
  Oh, let's see, there's this article.
• 1:00:48
  We vote on whether the family is guilty.
• 1:00:50
  Meet YouTube. YouTube's Nancy Guthrie, Sleuth
• 1:00:55
  by Karen Southern from thetimes.com OK 2. 1000.
• 1:00:59
  Watching Wow. Jimmy Williams says into the
• 1:01:02
  iPhone he is holding with a selfie stick.
• 1:01:04
  There's speculation maybe she's in Mexico.
• 1:01:07
  Nancy Guthrie. This is from February 23rd.
• 1:01:11
  For the live streamers covering the suspected abduction, doing
• 1:01:14
  nothing is not an option. Williams, who runs the Dolly
• 1:01:17
  Vision YouTube channel, is one of the Internet personalities
• 1:01:20
  who flocked to a case that is proven irresistible for true
• 1:01:22
  crime obsessives. Nancy, 84, is the mother, blah
• 1:01:26
  blah blah. OK Williams, a 54, a 51 year old
• 1:01:31
  former electrician, has been standing outside the Guthrie
• 1:01:33
  home from morning until night for days.
• 1:01:36
  Regardless of what is happening on scene, he has to entertain
• 1:01:39
  the viewers watching their thousands.
• 1:01:41
  His folksy charm has helped him amass almost 100,000 YouTube
• 1:01:44
  subscribers. Quote.
• 1:01:45
  It's a hurry up and wait thing, he said of filling the hours of
• 1:01:48
  dead time. You're waiting to catch the
• 1:01:50
  moment that everybody wants to see.
• 1:01:53
  It's almost like fishing. If you're in a rush, you're not
• 1:01:55
  going to catch any fish. But if you're patient, it's
• 1:01:57
  going to be here when everything goes down.
• 1:01:59
  And true crime, patience is key. It's just those few moments each
• 1:02:02
  day that really captivate everyone, and you've got to be
• 1:02:05
  here to catch those moments. Williams was on the scene when
• 1:02:09
  the FBI briefly erected a white tent outside Guthrie's home, a
• 1:02:12
  development. That product provoked excitement
• 1:02:14
  in a case where news. Was slow to trickle.
• 1:02:17
  He flew to Tucson from his home in Virginia Beach on the East
• 1:02:20
  Coast days after the story broke.
• 1:02:23
  He felt he left briefly before returning to the delight of his
• 1:02:25
  audience, who feast on every morsel of Guthrie content.
• 1:02:29
  So yeah. Quote, if overwhelmingly they
• 1:02:36
  want me to go somewhere else or do something and I'm willing to
• 1:02:39
  do it, you can't get Fox News to leave where they're at and set
• 1:02:41
  up somewhere else. This is more of a running gun
• 1:02:44
  type of media and it's just getting bigger and bigger.
• 1:02:46
  OK, So, you know, they're just been all sorts of just all
• 1:02:53
  sorts. Now I want to I want to switch.
• 1:02:57
  I want to switch. Instead of focusing on the
• 1:03:02
  people who are on scene, let's let's focus on the citizen
• 1:03:05
  journalism perspective of. This.
• 1:03:11
  Let's see. Yeah, Autumn is saying the the
• 1:03:16
  storm is wild right now. Yeah, Emmy is saying the police
• 1:03:19
  are at fault for releasing the crime scene too fast.
• 1:03:21
  They certainly should not have done that.
• 1:03:27
  Let's see, man, Can you guys hear the rain?
• 1:03:31
  It is storming hard out there. I hope we don't lose connection,
• 1:03:37
  antis says Gavin. We as the viewers need to be
• 1:03:39
  better about who do we choose to follow, subscribe.
• 1:03:41
  We should all be better about who gets our views.
• 1:03:44
  I wish everyone was as genuinely kind and ethical as you.
• 1:03:47
  Well, that was very self-serving to read that comment.
• 1:03:49
  But thank you. And I think that I think that
• 1:03:51
  some of the onus is on viewers. I do I I do.
• 1:03:58
  OK, I'm going to skip one thing and I want to go over to a 2022
• 1:04:06
  article about the rise of citizen journalism from UK
• 1:04:10
  Writers College. This is written.
• 1:04:13
  How is it written? By It doesn't say.
• 1:04:16
  It doesn't say, but it goes like this.
• 1:04:24
  Never before have ordinary citizens contributed so much to
• 1:04:28
  gathering and showcasing news. Is this a good thing and how
• 1:04:32
  does it impact traditional journalism?
• 1:04:36
  What is it? Subassis Roy investigates.
• 1:04:39
  OK Citizen journalism relies on the contributions of citizens
• 1:04:43
  for the process of gathering, analyzing, and disseminating
• 1:04:46
  news and information. The Cambridge English Dictionary
• 1:04:50
  defines citizen journalism as the activity of recording or
• 1:04:54
  writing about news stories, when this is done by ordinary people
• 1:04:57
  rather than by trained reporters.
• 1:05:00
  Abraham Zapruder recorded the assassination of John F Kennedy
• 1:05:04
  on 22 November 1963 with his home movie camera.
• 1:05:08
  His footage has become a classic and has been aired frequently on
• 1:05:12
  television channels throughout the world.
• 1:05:14
  This was long before the technological boom that erupted
• 1:05:17
  in the late 90's. The emergence of social media
• 1:05:21
  technologies, high speed Internet and smartphones with
• 1:05:24
  powerful cameras are democratizing media today.
• 1:05:28
  Someone will undoubtedly share a video or photo on social media
• 1:05:31
  pages when any major event takes place.
• 1:05:34
  And by the way, the media will often times show those people
• 1:05:39
  are sharing the news of these events on Twitter or on their
• 1:05:41
  Facebook pages or YouTube channels.
• 1:05:43
  They're all they also like sharing, comment on it.
• 1:05:45
  The war in Ukraine provides a stark example of this.
• 1:05:48
  Directly affected people provide the content much faster than any
• 1:05:52
  media outlet could ever reach them.
• 1:05:55
  There are many such examples of this around the world, whether
• 1:05:58
  it is the war in Syria, Libya or Yemen, the Arab Spring
• 1:06:01
  revolutions, the Manchester bombing or the demonstrations
• 1:06:04
  for Black Lives Matter. We see citizens at the forefront
• 1:06:07
  of reporting through social media.
• 1:06:09
  So is traditional journalism doomed to extinction?
• 1:06:13
  Now we must remember that the responsibility of a journalist
• 1:06:16
  is to provide accurate, unbiased and well informed information.
• 1:06:21
  OK. This is.
• 1:06:24
  This is actually a point of view that is refreshing to read, even
• 1:06:31
  written in 2022, because I mean, I remember, I think it was.
• 1:06:38
  A RealClearPolitics poll. It was a major polling
• 1:06:42
  organization. I don't know if it was RCP, but
• 1:06:45
  you know, they're, they do these polls from time to time about
• 1:06:50
  the, the trust in the media and so forth.
• 1:06:54
  And one of the. Polls was a was they questioned
• 1:06:59
  journalists about their role in and what it is that they do.
• 1:07:05
  And overwhelmingly, the journalists, you know, young
• 1:07:09
  journalists, people that are working in major newsrooms are
• 1:07:12
  saying, no, it's not my responsibility to provide
• 1:07:17
  unbiased information. My bias informs my reporting,
• 1:07:22
  not the other way around. And I see it the way it's
• 1:07:26
  written here, it needs to be accurate.
• 1:07:29
  It needs to be well informed. It needs to be unbiased.
• 1:07:35
  If you're a commenter like I am in this, you know, situation in
• 1:07:40
  this forum. Then you need to be.
• 1:07:44
  Sure that you, your audience understands you are providing
• 1:07:47
  commentary. That is your opinion and it is
• 1:07:49
  editorial. It is not the news.
• 1:07:54
  But if you are a news reporter like I am in my day job, then
• 1:07:59
  yeah, you can't be. You can't be letting your bias
• 1:08:03
  inform your reporting. Traditional journalism needs to
• 1:08:06
  be responsible and accountable, but such boundaries do not exist
• 1:08:10
  for citizen journalism. The result is that a lot of
• 1:08:13
  content on social media is biased and provides a personal
• 1:08:16
  perspective on a topic. A citizen journalist can portray
• 1:08:19
  a glass as half full or half empty based on his or her point
• 1:08:23
  of view. In the age of the ubiquitous
• 1:08:25
  reach of social media, this can negatively impact society.
• 1:08:29
  Yeah, and a journalist should just simply say, here's a glass
• 1:08:33
  that has water in it and let the viewer or the reader say for
• 1:08:38
  themselves whether they think it's half full or half empty.
• 1:08:42
  In the age of ubiquitous reach of social media, this can
• 1:08:44
  negatively impact society, Noam Chomsky, the celebrated American
• 1:08:48
  linguist, philosopher, historian and social critic, said the duty
• 1:08:51
  of journalists. Is to tell the truth.
• 1:08:53
  Journalism means you go back to the actual facts.
• 1:08:56
  You look at the documents, do you discover what the record is
• 1:08:58
  and you report it that way. Traditional journalists must
• 1:09:01
  validate the news item appearing on social media.
• 1:09:04
  Separating the wheat from the chaff is one of the critical
• 1:09:06
  responsibilities journalists present.
• 1:09:10
  A well balanced news item covering all the perspectives of
• 1:09:13
  a story rather than A1 dimension view.
• 1:09:16
  I would love your comments on this if you find that to be the
• 1:09:20
  case in in today's world because.
• 1:09:23
  I think that's. Probably 1 of the reasons that
• 1:09:26
  there's been a rise of citizen journalism is people don't
• 1:09:29
  believe this to be the truth, right?
• 1:09:34
  Let's see, professional journalists have enormous social
• 1:09:37
  reach. Their social media pages have
• 1:09:40
  huge followers. They can help spread the voice
• 1:09:42
  of a citizen journalist to thousands of people all over the
• 1:09:44
  world. While citizen journalists report
• 1:09:47
  on a single event, traditional journalists can offer a broader
• 1:09:50
  perspective. They can visualize a train of
• 1:09:52
  events. They can join the dots with
• 1:09:53
  their analysis and access data. About other events, therefore,
• 1:09:58
  we can see that citizen journalism offers speed and
• 1:10:00
  reach that complements traditional journalism, but the
• 1:10:03
  role of conventional journalism still remains.
• 1:10:06
  As an authoritative, authoritative source of accurate
• 1:10:09
  information and a balanced perspective, echoing the words
• 1:10:12
  of acclaimed journalist Christiane Amanpour.
• 1:10:15
  Good journalism, good television, can make our world a
• 1:10:18
  better place. That ended up kind of puffy, but
• 1:10:21
  I take the point. OK, the last one I wanted to
• 1:10:26
  zoom out on was Where is It? Oh, this from Writer's Digest,
• 1:10:36
  this again from 2022. I don't know.
• 1:10:41
  We've already kind of, we've already kind of beat this horse.
• 1:10:46
  Will the journalism industry adapt that?
• 1:10:48
  That's what I wanted to read. OK.
• 1:10:50
  We're seeing a huge shift in how and where consumers get their
• 1:10:52
  news, and journalism is expanding and evolving.
• 1:10:55
  People have switched to the Internet for convenience and
• 1:10:57
  choice and no longer rely on traditional outlets.
• 1:11:00
  It's a world of instant information and on the scene
• 1:11:03
  reporting and citizens are filling a void left by a
• 1:11:07
  mainstream media astoundingly out of touch with ordinary
• 1:11:10
  people. Many former traditional
• 1:11:13
  journalists such as Pulitzer Prize winning Glenn Greenwald
• 1:11:17
  have left the mainstream and established their own news
• 1:11:20
  sites, blogs and newsletters and successfully utilize online
• 1:11:23
  platforms such as Substack, a subscription based service
• 1:11:27
  meanwhile. Traditional journalism is
• 1:11:29
  suffering. Hundreds of local newspapers,
• 1:11:32
  magazines and newsrooms have closed.
• 1:11:34
  By the way, in my area I work for a an online publication that
• 1:11:38
  has absolutely. Destroyed what was the £800
• 1:11:47
  gorilla in our area? 100 and some odd year old paper
• 1:11:55
  it has, has been relegated to almost nothing because of the
• 1:12:01
  work that we do now. I mean, I'm not, I'm not proud
• 1:12:05
  of that. I think we should have
• 1:12:06
  competition. Well, I guess I am a little
• 1:12:08
  proud of it because it doesn't matter why.
• 1:12:12
  But the the fact the matter is hyper local news when done
• 1:12:19
  responsibly, citizen journalism when done responsibly can add to
• 1:12:27
  the the journal of our time, I guess is what I'm getting at.
• 1:12:32
  Oh, here it is. This is backed up by recent
• 1:12:34
  numbers from the Edelman Trust Barometer report, which reveals
• 1:12:38
  trust in traditional news journalism is at an all time
• 1:12:41
  low. Just 39% of people in the US
• 1:12:43
  said they trust the media, down 6 points from 2021.
• 1:12:45
  And remember, this is 2022. 2/3 of people worldwide view the
• 1:12:50
  government and media as divisive forces in society.
• 1:12:54
  Established journalists often resent citizen journalists
• 1:12:57
  saying they have no right to the title as they have none of the
• 1:13:00
  skills, training, qualifications or experience.
• 1:13:02
  They're partly correct. Most are amateurs and the
• 1:13:05
  information can be. Questionable and is just as
• 1:13:07
  slanted as traditional media. The Edelman report also showed a
• 1:13:14
  significant dip in people's trust in social media.
• 1:13:16
  It was right at 37%. So anyway, that's the part that
• 1:13:21
  I wanted to bring up to you guys.
• 1:13:22
  So OK, can we please? I'm just going to I'm going to,
• 1:13:30
  I'm going to put out. I'm just.
• 1:13:33
  Going to beg my my citizen journalist friends, specifically
• 1:13:40
  Youtubers. OK, specifically on the ground
• 1:13:44
  in Tucson? YouTube colleagues OK, pull back
• 1:13:52
  on the reins a little bit, a lot of bit.
• 1:13:56
  Pull back on the reins. Calm down, stop trespassing,
• 1:14:02
  stop harassing and start doing real journalism.
• 1:14:08
  There are, there are courses that you can take online that
• 1:14:13
  will teach you the ethics and responsibilities of journalism
• 1:14:19
  and, and everybody who is doing citizen journalism who, who
• 1:14:24
  decides to do it professionally, right?
• 1:14:28
  Should take those kinds of courses or like in my case and
• 1:14:33
  I'm not holding myself up as some like great example, but.
• 1:14:36
  Because it was almost accidental, but I went to work
• 1:14:39
  for a good media organization that had to.
• 1:14:43
  Pull. Back the reins on my behalf.
• 1:14:45
  No, Gavin, I'm not publishing that.
• 1:14:48
  You cannot say that. No, Gavin, all I heard was no,
• 1:14:53
  no, no, no, no. For like the first year and a
• 1:14:56
  half. This has got to be changed and I
• 1:14:59
  would have temper tantrums. Well, I'm not putting my name on
• 1:15:01
  that. OK, we'll take your name off of
• 1:15:04
  it and we'll publish it the way I edited it, right?
• 1:15:07
  And I'm so grateful looking back.
• 1:15:09
  That I had editors that would do that to me and for me.
• 1:15:14
  So my colleagues, my YouTube colleagues that fancy yourself
• 1:15:18
  citizen journalists, as long as you're creating a journal, I
• 1:15:22
  think that you are a citizen journalist.
• 1:15:24
  Be more responsible, be more ethical and and and.
• 1:15:30
  Be on the ground and do good work.
• 1:15:32
  It's awesome that you're there. Just stop the harassing, stop
• 1:15:37
  the trespassing. Stop the stop stop circus, will
• 1:15:42
  you? And and remember, I mean, what
• 1:15:46
  is the point? What is the point in all this?
• 1:15:49
  The point, the point. This is the .84 year old Nancy
• 1:15:58
  Guthrie is still missing. She's probably dead and we want
• 1:16:01
  to hold whoever did this to her responsible.
• 1:16:05
  That is the point. And now, Wanda, I'm going to
• 1:16:12
  need you again. Can we get?
• 1:16:19
  Can we get some transition music?
• 1:16:21
  Because I I. Think what we're what we're we
• 1:16:23
  need to transition to. Oh, Wanda has got other people
• 1:16:28
  walking into the booth. Wanda, you guys ready?
• 1:16:32
  OK, transition music. Here we go.
• 1:16:43
  Wow, that was talent. Are those your nephews?
• 1:16:48
  Amazing. You guys have anything
• 1:17:01
  Still going. That is terrific.
• 1:17:04
  Let's do 3. Questions.
• 1:17:05
  It's three questions with Gavin Fish.
• 1:17:12
  How Okie Dokie in the three questions segment we answer.
• 1:17:19
  I answer three of your questions that you sent to me at
• 1:17:23
  threequestions@gavinfish.com. It is 3 questions at
• 1:17:27
  gavinfish.com. What is it?
• 1:17:29
  It's three questions at gavinfish.com spelled out THRE
• 1:17:33
  send me 1000 questions, send me one question, ask me about the
• 1:17:37
  mysteries of the universe, ask me of my favorite color,
• 1:17:39
  everything in between and I promise that I will answer each
• 1:17:43
  and every one of. Those questions to the best of
• 1:17:45
  my knowledge and, but but I get to do it in the order that I see
• 1:17:50
  fit. So question #1 tonight.
• 1:17:51
  And I like the ones where you guys can answer the questions
• 1:17:54
  too. Those are my favorite ones from
• 1:17:57
  Christina. Would you rather explore the
• 1:18:00
  ocean or explore space? This is an easy one for me,
• 1:18:02
  Christina as I am. I'm not afraid of water, but I
• 1:18:09
  feel like the worst way to die would be drowning.
• 1:18:14
  Now understanding that if you're in space and something happens,
• 1:18:18
  you you. Effectively are drowning.
• 1:18:21
  Right. There's a lack of oxygen, but I
• 1:18:24
  don't. Know just drowning for me that
• 1:18:26
  the worst way to go. Plus in space you're flying, so
• 1:18:32
  I would rather explore space than the ocean.
• 1:18:37
  I don't want to be crushed. On the other hand, do I want to
• 1:18:41
  like, explode rather than implode?
• 1:18:44
  Oh, I just I. Just taking a dark turn.
• 1:18:47
  Dark, dark, dark. Yeah, I I would rather explore
• 1:18:51
  space. Christina, thank you very much
• 1:18:53
  for the question from Kelly. If you could be any male
• 1:18:57
  professional athlete, who would it be and why?
• 1:19:00
  If I could be a professional male athlete.
• 1:19:02
  OK, I, I want your answers to this.
• 1:19:06
  Doesn't have to be male, could be female.
• 1:19:08
  But for me, I'm answering Kelly's question.
• 1:19:13
  I think I would want to be. You know, I saw.
• 1:19:17
  A. I saw a clip of Tiger.
• 1:19:20
  Woods way back in the day where he made this.
• 1:19:23
  Chip off of, off of. The green in the rough to like
• 1:19:28
  20 feet above the pen. And then it rolled in just
• 1:19:31
  perfectly. And he was like celebrating.
• 1:19:34
  Yeah. You know, And he it was, it was
• 1:19:36
  celebrating as if he had cured cancer.
• 1:19:38
  That is one of the things that I hate about professional sports
• 1:19:43
  is ultimately you guys are out there in tights.
• 1:19:48
  You've got some apparatus that you need to get something into
• 1:19:52
  through around nearby. You know, what sports ball are
• 1:19:59
  you going to put in what apparatus that that is basically
• 1:20:01
  professional sports like American football that is just
• 1:20:05
  angry men in tights aggressively snuggling.
• 1:20:09
  It's just not my thing. It's not my thing.
• 1:20:13
  But there are a couple of athletes that I love.
• 1:20:15
  OK #1 Yogi Berra. OK, I love Yogi Berra.
• 1:20:22
  He didn't take himself seriously.
• 1:20:24
  He played a good sports ball game.
• 1:20:27
  I do love baseball. I love the game.
• 1:20:29
  I don't like the professionalism side of things, but I love Yogi
• 1:20:34
  Berra. I thought that he was witty and
• 1:20:36
  clever and hilarious, and I think for the very same reason.
• 1:20:41
  I would have to say Bob Euchre for #2 Those guys are just
• 1:20:45
  hilarious. Never took themselves seriously,
• 1:20:48
  though. They loved their game, right?
• 1:20:51
  And I, I can respect that. I think that's awesome.
• 1:20:53
  So I guess I would choose Yogi Berra and the uke.
• 1:20:59
  Bob Euchre and question #3 comes from John.
• 1:21:04
  Where did you take the misses on a first?
• 1:21:05
  Date. John, you've opened a can.
• 1:21:11
  You've opened a can. John, I have shared.
• 1:21:16
  This on the channel before I'm happy to share it again.
• 1:21:19
  It's not a super long story, but here's the thing.
• 1:21:24
  I met the future missus fish, my snuggly bear, my sweetie pie, my
• 1:21:29
  one and only through a mutual. Friend and we all went to church
• 1:21:34
  together. I had moved into the area.
• 1:21:36
  I had this old friend. She was a new.
• 1:21:39
  Friend of my snuggly bear sweetie pie one and only and she
• 1:21:42
  introduced us. Now this friend was dating a guy
• 1:21:47
  who was a private pilot and had access to a plane.
• 1:21:52
  Multiple planes. You would rent planes right?
• 1:21:56
  And our mutual friend was saying hey my my guy friend and I are
• 1:22:03
  going on a date. You and the future missus Fish
• 1:22:08
  should join us. We are going to fly down to Half
• 1:22:12
  Moon Bay and grab dinner. And this friend of ours, this Co
• 1:22:17
  friend, this mutual friend of both Kimberly and I, she is the
• 1:22:21
  daughter of a private pilot as well, famous in our circles for
• 1:22:28
  flying war birds and stuff. Like really cool guy.
• 1:22:32
  So she was around aviation her whole life.
• 1:22:34
  She was probably attracted to aviators.
• 1:22:37
  And so anyway, they invited us to do this as a double date.
• 1:22:41
  So I go to Kimberly and I say, hey, would you be interested in
• 1:22:46
  going on a double date with me and with this person and that
• 1:22:50
  person? I don't want to give their names
• 1:22:52
  because I haven't got their permission.
• 1:22:53
  But anyway, she goes, that sounds like fun.
• 1:22:56
  And I said what we're going to do is we're going to.
• 1:22:58
  Hop in a plane, private plane, and we're going to fly down from
• 1:23:03
  Sacramento to Half Moon Bay. They say it's a beautiful
• 1:23:07
  flight. I've never done it before, but
• 1:23:09
  we're just going to grab pizza. Are you up for it?
• 1:23:10
  She's like, yeah, I'm up for it. And when I pick her up, she was
• 1:23:15
  looking good. She was looking.
• 1:23:19
  I mean, my wife doesn't overdo things ever.
• 1:23:22
  She never has. She's just tasteful.
• 1:23:25
  She was looking great. She was wearing these.
• 1:23:29
  She was wearing an outfit with white pants.
• 1:23:30
  It's this beautiful little summer outfit.
• 1:23:32
  It was great. It was great.
• 1:23:35
  She looks so good. Any who we get to the airport,
• 1:23:41
  drive to the airport to meet our friends and we pull up to the
• 1:23:43
  ramp and there's the. Plane exactly what I expected.
• 1:23:48
  It was a it was a Cessna 182. I think it was a 1956 fastback.
• 1:23:55
  Kimberly the future Misses fish, my sweetie pie, Snuggly bear one
• 1:23:59
  and only. Was expecting more of a Pretty
• 1:24:01
  Woman scenario where she was going to be getting onto a
• 1:24:04
  private jet, not into A4 passenger airplane with a prop
• 1:24:09
  on the front of it. A Volkswagen with wings is what
• 1:24:13
  she called it. She didn't say it.
• 1:24:15
  Then the other thing about Kimberly that I did not know
• 1:24:18
  because this was our first date, is she gets motion sick.
• 1:24:21
  So she was, she just wasn't enjoying herself at all.
• 1:24:27
  But we take this beautiful flight.
• 1:24:29
  We go from Sacramento, we go down to the Bay Area.
• 1:24:31
  We get out over Oakland. We crossover the Bay Bridge.
• 1:24:36
  We then crossover the Golden Gate Bridge.
• 1:24:38
  Just as the sun is setting in front of us, we hang a left.
• 1:24:43
  We go down the coast, over over the water, down the coastline to
• 1:24:46
  Half Moon Bay, land at this beautiful little airport, tie
• 1:24:50
  down the plane. We go and grab a pizza, we take
• 1:24:54
  it out to the Marina. We sit on the dock.
• 1:24:58
  The sun is now like just kissing the water and and we have pizza
• 1:25:06
  and I think I had some some like sparkling cider or something
• 1:25:10
  like that. And the four of us just watch
• 1:25:12
  the sun go down, eating our pizza and drinking our little
• 1:25:17
  bubbly out of the bottle. And then we got in the plane and
• 1:25:22
  we flew home the same way. And there's a different view
• 1:25:26
  this time. It was a night time view of the
• 1:25:28
  Bay Area. It was beautiful.
• 1:25:30
  Now, I thought it was the world's greatest first date.
• 1:25:32
  If it, if it would have been me flying, that would be the only
• 1:25:35
  what ended up happening is I was like, I got to get my pilot's
• 1:25:38
  license and this friend taught me how to do it.
• 1:25:41
  And I I found a flight school, found an instructor and and got
• 1:25:45
  my license and everything starting with that date.
• 1:25:49
  Kimberly has been in a plane with me exactly 2 more times in
• 1:25:56
  the 26 years that we've been married.
• 1:25:59
  She just doesn't like it and she doesn't she she gets sick from
• 1:26:04
  the motion sickness and and it's not romantic to her.
• 1:26:08
  It's not like she doesn't. She doesn't feel the romance of
• 1:26:12
  flight like I do, but that was our first date.
• 1:26:15
  I would love to hear about your first dates and the comment and
• 1:26:19
  comments. And while you are jotting those
• 1:26:22
  down, I do have a couple of headlines.
• 1:26:25
  Let's get into them. True crime headlines.
• 1:26:33
  Wow. Okey dokey.
• 1:26:35
  Headline #1 from aol.com written by Aaron Johnson, This came out
• 1:26:41
  today. New black eye for Nancy Guthrie,
• 1:26:44
  sheriff. Full story on how deputy was
• 1:26:47
  dumped from the force after kidnapping charge Already facing
• 1:26:52
  a recall drive for the still unsolved kidnapping case of
• 1:26:55
  Savannah Guthrie's mom, Pima County Sheriff Chris Nanos is
• 1:26:57
  reeling from a new embarrassment, the arrest of one
• 1:27:00
  of his top deputies for kidnapping a female prisoner.
• 1:27:05
  Travis Reynolds, 22, is busted on March 26th for wooing a woman
• 1:27:09
  a woman he was transporting to county jail into seat acd sex
• 1:27:14
  romp at a motel in return for. Help with her case the Tucson
• 1:27:18
  Police Department has charged The Dirty deputy allegedly told
• 1:27:21
  the woman anyway he that that is essay that's exactly what that
• 1:27:27
  is that is essay the. Lustful Out has since been
• 1:27:32
  canned and now faces charges of kidnapping, but his bust was the
• 1:27:37
  only only the latest black eye for Nanos.
• 1:27:41
  Radar Online reported on March 2nd.
• 1:27:43
  The 40 year department veteran has been accused of bumbling the
• 1:27:46
  Nancy Guthrie crime scene, dragging his feet with the FBI,
• 1:27:49
  blah blah blah. So anyway, Sheriff Nanos is
• 1:27:53
  having issues. Man I I wonder if he will even
• 1:27:57
  seek re election. Next one coming to us from the
• 1:28:00
  New York Post in the Rex Heuerman case, again, kind of a
• 1:28:05
  tabloid headline junkie who stole ex police chief's sex
• 1:28:08
  toys, tried to visit Gilgo Beach serial killer for bizarre sit
• 1:28:11
  down. A career criminal who's scrapped
• 1:28:15
  with a disgraced Long Island police chief, ended the cop's
• 1:28:18
  career, tried to get a jailhouse sit down with Gilgo Beach killer
• 1:28:21
  Rex Heuerman, A desperate bid to try to implicate the ex cop in
• 1:28:25
  the grisly murders. The Post has learned ex junkie
• 1:28:28
  Christopher Loeb. That's disparaging was viciously
• 1:28:34
  beaten by former Suffolk County police chief Jimmy Burke in
• 1:28:36
  2012. That was quite a story after
• 1:28:38
  stealing in the cops sex toys sending the controversial cop to
• 1:28:46
  prison and he said he remains convinced the former chief was
• 1:28:49
  somehow involved in humor man's monstrous crime.
• 1:28:52
  So he's trying to get, he's trying to get that cop looped
• 1:28:57
  into the long. Island serial killer case dumb.
• 1:29:03
  #3 this in the Anna Kepner case. Since you guys are asking, I did
• 1:29:08
  check out the docket again today.
• 1:29:11
  I haven't seen anything new in there but from people.com
• 1:29:15
  stepbrother charged with SA ING and murdering Anna Kepner is not
• 1:29:19
  in custody still with family, prosecutors announced on April
• 1:29:25
  10th at TH. Mr. Hudson, 16 year old
• 1:29:28
  stepbrother of Anna Kepner, had been indicted on charge of
• 1:29:31
  murder and aggravated essay by a federal grand jury and would be
• 1:29:34
  tried as an adult. Five days later, he is still not
• 1:29:37
  in custody and continues to spend his.
• 1:29:39
  Days at the home of his uncle or accompanying his father to work,
• 1:29:42
  according to documents filed in federal court on in Miami.
• 1:29:45
  And that is the document that we read yesterday.
• 1:29:48
  And there's a reason for this. It is because there has they
• 1:29:52
  have to go through the process. It's now transferred to adult
• 1:29:55
  court. He has to have a bond hearing.
• 1:29:58
  They'll probably be revoked. That's my guess.
• 1:30:00
  But for now, he remains a free young man.
• 1:30:05
  And now. And now for the good news of the
• 1:30:08
  day. The good news of the day.
• 1:30:12
  This coming to us from today.com.
• 1:30:15
  Chick-fil-A employee returns $10,000 found in bathroom Oh my
• 1:30:20
  goodness, I love people sometimes.
• 1:30:22
  Written by Joseph Lamour for today.com, a fast food worker
• 1:30:27
  look at his face a fast food worker and and a Chick-fil-A
• 1:30:30
  employee to boot. A fast food worker and Good
• 1:30:33
  Samaritan made sure a customer was blessed with relief on
• 1:30:37
  Easter weekend. On April 3rd, Jayden Sintrone, a
• 1:30:42
  Chick-fil-A worker in Kingston, North Carolina, became a hero to
• 1:30:46
  a customer who had misplaced 2 envelopes containing $9833 in.
• 1:30:52
  Cash. He found them that morning in
• 1:30:55
  the men's restroom quote. They were on the floor next to
• 1:30:57
  the toilet. My first thought was just like,
• 1:31:00
  OK, now this isn't happening, Citron told NBC affiliate WITN
• 1:31:05
  on April 7th. Something is wrong.
• 1:31:08
  According to the affiliate, one envelope was labeled First
• 1:31:10
  Citizens Bank with $5000 inside and another labeled Truest Bank
• 1:31:15
  with $4333 inside. Rather than pocket the money
• 1:31:19
  himself, he picked it up and brought it to human resources,
• 1:31:22
  Cintron said. John McFall, the owner operator
• 1:31:26
  of the Kingston Chick-fil-A, says he's grateful for employees
• 1:31:29
  like Cintron. Quote, acts like this reflect
• 1:31:32
  the values our restaurants aim to uphold each day, and we're
• 1:31:35
  proud to see that lived out here at Chick-fil-A in Kingston.
• 1:31:38
  McFall said in a statement provided to TODAY by
• 1:31:41
  Chick-fil-A. Centrone told the station the
• 1:31:44
  money was returned to its owner, who offered him $500.00 for
• 1:31:47
  turning it in quote. I don't want anything out of
• 1:31:50
  this, he told WITN, declining the money several times before
• 1:31:53
  he eventually relented. I was in the right place at the
• 1:31:56
  right time, but more than that, my faith teaches me to do what's
• 1:31:59
  right and care for others, Centrone said in a statement
• 1:32:02
  provided to Today by Chick-fil-A.
• 1:32:04
  Knowing how devastating it would be to lose something like that,
• 1:32:07
  I just wanted to make sure it got back to its owner.
• 1:32:10
  I'm grateful I could help, and I'm humbled by the response.
• 1:32:12
  Let's get his picture up here one more time.
• 1:32:15
  Mr. Jayden Centrone. Thank you, Sir, for being a Good
• 1:32:21
  Samaritan. That restores my faith in
• 1:32:25
  humanity and, you know, ends the segment of headlines.
• 1:32:32
  Here we go. True crime.
• 1:32:41
  Headlines All righty. Let's end this show strong
• 1:32:46
  deeply appreciate the the Super chat from Galen Gam.
• 1:32:51
  I always appreciate your reporting.
• 1:32:53
  I am a little concerned that they have a law that they're
• 1:32:56
  trying to pass in California against citizen journalism.
• 1:32:59
  I, I better look that up. Thank you very much, Gay Lynn.
• 1:33:03
  I, it, it's, it's a First Amendment thing.
• 1:33:07
  If, if there is a law that is passed against citizen
• 1:33:10
  journalism, it will go straight to the Supreme Court very
• 1:33:15
  quickly and it will be tossed very quickly.
• 1:33:18
  It's like it's, it is, it is in the 1st Amendment.
• 1:33:24
  So funny. Very good.
• 1:33:29
  Jenny says. Autumn Gavin is a diamond in the
• 1:33:31
  rough, in my humble opinion. Thank you.
• 1:33:34
  He's always very level headed. We'll look at all sides.
• 1:33:37
  It's very fair. Love his coverage.
• 1:33:38
  I thank you, Jenny. I appreciate that.
• 1:33:42
  Let's see cowboy logic. The Pittsburgh Post Gazette for
• 1:33:49
  a fact was the £100 gorilla in the room for well over 100
• 1:33:52
  years. Those days are gone.
• 1:33:53
  Indeed, the Post Gazette is gone.
• 1:33:55
  Not the only one in western Pennsylvania.
• 1:33:58
  Melanie Main says yes. Well said Gavin.
• 1:34:00
  Not sure what what you agree with but thank you for agreeing
• 1:34:03
  with me. Ohio Palm Mom says when.
• 1:34:06
  So many traditional media sources are owned by the same
• 1:34:08
  entity, the slanted viewpoint of the employer can come through
• 1:34:11
  regardless of the rider. Indeed, Debbie says yes.
• 1:34:16
  Misses Guthrie is the missing point.
• 1:34:19
  That's probably what Melanie was saying.
• 1:34:22
  She is the She is the point. She is the point.
• 1:34:25
  And Wanda's nephews with their harmonies.
• 1:34:28
  Pretty amazing, right? Anything else you guys want Me?
• 1:34:33
  Let's see. Coffee time for DS says I would
• 1:34:37
  be Wayne Gretzky. You know Wayne Gretzky is a guy
• 1:34:39
  too. I like Wayne Gretzky, that is.
• 1:34:43
  That is a good choice for sure. See if there's anything else
• 1:34:52
  affordable. Miss Ford, Sable.
• 1:34:58
  Any future Ascot sightings? Well, I see the Ascot all the
• 1:35:03
  time and and every once in a while I will even wear it to
• 1:35:06
  church, like on a chilly day. Will we do an Ascot?
• 1:35:09
  Me anything? Will we?
• 1:35:11
  Will we be wearing an Ascot? I guess you know what is our
• 1:35:15
  next? What is our next?
• 1:35:18
  I guess what would be the next major milestone?
• 1:35:24
  200,000 subscribers maybe or let's see if I go to mute this.
• 1:35:33
  Just looking right now I have 16,856,172 views, maybe 20
• 1:35:42
  million views. We could do an Ascot, me
• 1:35:44
  anything, something like that that would be good.
• 1:35:47
  And Debbie saying we love our velvet voice to fair reporting
• 1:35:50
  hippie. You guys are most kind.
• 1:35:54
  Thank you so much. Thank you for joining me
• 1:35:55
  tonight. Remember there are links in the
• 1:35:58
  description in the show notes all throughout wherever you
• 1:36:02
  watch or. Listen to this program Spotify
• 1:36:08
  on the different podcast platforms or right here on
• 1:36:10
  YouTube. Visit my website gavinfish.com.
• 1:36:13
  Oh, I did want to announce. I did want to announce that I am
• 1:36:17
  starting up in Ernest a weekly. I'm restarting the crime COD
• 1:36:25
  newsletter and I'm going to be doing it weekly.
• 1:36:27
  It's going to be a Tuesday newsletter.
• 1:36:30
  OK, so if you go to my website, gavinfish.com, let me bring it
• 1:36:35
  up here for you. For those waiting around to the
• 1:36:38
  end, you guys are awesome and you Scroll down to the bottom
• 1:36:41
  that will get you to where you can subscribe to the Crimecod
• 1:36:46
  newsletter. Also, the first time that you're
• 1:36:48
  on my site. I don't make it super obnoxious,
• 1:36:50
  but the first time you're on my site.
• 1:36:51
  It will OU. Also if you click on crimecod U
• 1:36:55
  at the top that will take you to crimecod.com where that's my
• 1:36:58
  fullon news website. It has the same place where you
• 1:37:02
  can subscribe. It has the same OU and it has a
• 1:37:05
  link like newsletter and it has a little thing where you can
• 1:37:08
  subscribe to the newsletter. So there are multiple ways that
• 1:37:11
  you can subscribe to the crime COD newsletter.
• 1:37:14
  A newsletter did go out today to my 2866 subscribers to that
• 1:37:19
  newsletter. It will go out every Tuesday.
• 1:37:23
  I invite you to subscribe. I I usually get two or three new
• 1:37:27
  subscriptions a day. I I would.
• 1:37:30
  That would be fun. Maybe that's when I do an ask
• 1:37:32
  out me anything when we get to like 10,000 subscribers on the
• 1:37:35
  crime crime cod newsletter. Definitely definitely,
• 1:37:40
  definitely do that. The the newsletter is going to
• 1:37:43
  have, you know, what are the what are the it's.
• 1:37:46
  Going to be. Kind of a weekly roundup thing.
• 1:37:49
  What are the cases that you should be looking at?
• 1:37:52
  What are some of the things that I have said and published?
• 1:37:55
  I plan on making it so that it's not just a promotion for yours
• 1:38:00
  truly. It is a newsletter worthy of
• 1:38:03
  reading. There will be some brief
• 1:38:06
  articles from me. So lots and lots and lots to do.
• 1:38:09
  Please subscribe to Crime Card if you haven't already done it.
• 1:38:15
  Yeah, it it's an easy and freeway to to support the
• 1:38:19
  channel. And another easy and freeway to
• 1:38:21
  support the channel is to share this with people so that they
• 1:38:25
  too. Can.
• 1:38:27
  Subscribe I would just love. Your help on that?
• 1:38:30
  Also remember you're always welcome to join us in the fish
• 1:38:35
  tank. Oh, I did publish my high
• 1:38:39
  protein and air quotes cheesecake recipe that you guys
• 1:38:43
  have been asking for in the tank.
• 1:38:46
  It's an easy recipe. There's a picture of the of the
• 1:38:49
  cheesecake that I made last night.
• 1:38:51
  I had I've already I've already had three pieces of it, but it's
• 1:38:55
  within my dietary, you know, plan.
• 1:38:59
  So I did it. If if you want the recipe,
• 1:39:03
  Darshi be Darshi be, and that's a good reason to be over there
• 1:39:07
  in the tank. We don't only do true crime.
• 1:39:10
  We do apparently recipes now. Maybe I need to?
• 1:39:14
  Put a recipe into the Crime COD newsletter.
• 1:39:18
  Maybe your recipes could go in the Crime Cotton newsletter.
• 1:39:21
  There's so many great ideas, so many great ideas.
• 1:39:25
  With that guys, thank you again for your support.
• 1:39:28
  Thanks for being here. Thanks for sticking around to
• 1:39:29
  the end, and I bid you a deal. Until the next time and until
• 1:39:34
  then, take care of yourselves. We'll see you then.
• 1:39:38
  Thank you very much for watching this video.
• 1:39:40
  If you liked what you saw, please consider subscribing.
• 1:39:43
  And if you have any questions or comments, please leave them
• 1:39:46
  below.