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MONEY DIARIES: An open heart and an open book! · She's On The Money

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Speaker 1: Just before we get started, we'd like to acknowledge and.
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Speaker 2: Pay respect to Australia's Aboriginal and torrest Rate islander peoples.
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Speaker 2: They're the traditional custodians of the lands, the waterways and
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Speaker 2: the skies all across Australia.
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Speaker 1: We thank you for sharing and for caring for the land.
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Speaker 2: On which we are able to learn. We pay respects
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Speaker 2: to elders past and present, and we share our friendship
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Speaker 2: and our kindness.
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Speaker 3: She's on the Money, She's on the Money.
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Speaker 4: Hello, and welcome to She's on the Money, the podcast
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Speaker 4: for millennials who want financial freedom. Welcome back to another
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Speaker 4: shot back money Diary Monday, where we chat to one
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Speaker 4: of our Gorge community members and learn about them, their story,
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Speaker 4: their plans, their dreams, their hopes, just all of the
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Speaker 4: jew juicy details.
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Speaker 1: Victoria, how are you going? I'm good.
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Speaker 2: I'm not as excited about this one as you are,
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Speaker 2: purely because I just don't know what I'm looking for yet.
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Speaker 4: You don't know what's going on, but it is a goodie.
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Speaker 4: Let me give you a little overview, So our diarist Roate.
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Speaker 4: I found my old therapy notes from age twelve, and
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Speaker 4: a big worry was my family's financials. I was hospitalized
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Speaker 4: several times as a child to have open heart surgery,
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Speaker 4: and my dad accepted a retrenchment to stay by my
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Speaker 4: side in hospital. My parents are now fine financially, but
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Speaker 4: I feel like too much was shared with me as
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Speaker 4: a kid, and it caused a lot of anxiety about
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Speaker 4: what is enough to get by. I want to know
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Speaker 4: what financial stability looks like for someone at twenty seven
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Speaker 4: years old.
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Speaker 1: Oh my god, now I am excited to learn about that.
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Speaker 1: That's heavy.
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Speaker 2: It's a young person. That's a lot to carry, especially
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Speaker 2: because when you're not well, when you're young, you feel
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Speaker 2: like a burden already, Like, oh, you feel like a
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Speaker 2: burden regardless of your age.
1:52
Speaker 4: And just a little content warning as well. We will
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Speaker 4: be touching on sexual assault a little bit later. So
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Speaker 4: if that's something that is a little challenging for you
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Speaker 4: right now, that is so totally fine that this might
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Speaker 4: be an episode that you want to give a mess.
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Speaker 2: We have a heap of other episodes for you to
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Speaker 2: listen to, So jump on over there now, Money Darrist,
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Speaker 2: you're hanging out in the wings. Welcome to the show. Hi, welcome,
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Speaker 2: I'm excited to have you. Thank you for taking the
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Speaker 2: time to hang out with us. But without further ado,
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Speaker 2: let's just throw you in the deep end money darist
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Speaker 2: tell us a little bit about your money story.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, so what I wrote there, I've listened to the
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Speaker 5: podcasts for a while and kind of related to the
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Speaker 5: whole money story thing. That didn't think it was that
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Speaker 5: relevant for me, Like I couldn't think of a big
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Speaker 5: pivotal moment.
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Speaker 1: Little did you know exactly?
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Speaker 5: My mom got me to go because I moved out
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Speaker 5: of home last year. My mom got me to go
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Speaker 5: back and deal with all my filing and stuff like that.
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Speaker 5: And I found the notes from when I was a kid,
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Speaker 5: and it talked about kind of my big anxiety about
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Speaker 5: my family and their financial situation. And I just kind
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Speaker 5: of realized, like, whoa, that still definitely translates to me now.
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Speaker 5: And I thought, you know, who would relate to this?
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Speaker 5: Who could I tell? And I instantly thought, Oh, like
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Speaker 5: she's on the money team know about money stories.
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, yes we do.
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Speaker 5: We do. We want to hear that I relate now.
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Speaker 5: So yeah, I sent that in.
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that is so special.
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Speaker 2: And do you think that that kind of formed the
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Speaker 2: way you've been acting around money even subconsciously as an
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Speaker 2: adult today, Like, how do you think that that's impacted
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Speaker 2: you growing into an adult.
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Speaker 5: One hundred percent? Like I value money quite highly. I
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Speaker 5: worry about not having enough, so I was very much,
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Speaker 5: especially growing up like a saber rather than a spender.
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Speaker 5: And even now I'm like very meticulous with where every
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Speaker 5: dollar goes in my paycheck. And I think it's because
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Speaker 5: I remember what it's like to not be able to
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Speaker 5: afford even like we still got all the big stuff,
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Speaker 5: We got all the food and the you know, the
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Speaker 5: roof ever ahead. But I remember the first big argument
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Speaker 5: I had with my mum was whether she would buy
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Speaker 5: the most recent Harry Potter book for me, and she
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Speaker 5: was like, we just can't. We can't afford it right now.
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Speaker 5: You could go to the library, and I was very
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Speaker 5: cranky about that because I like owning money.
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Speaker 1: I did not want the library. The library's not cool.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, I've still got them here on my bookshelf at home,
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Speaker 5: the Harry Potter books, so they were like a big
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Speaker 5: thing in my childhood. But yeah, that idea of not
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Speaker 5: being able to afford something that I considered to be
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Speaker 5: so small as just a book really like through me.
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Speaker 2: But it was a lot, like it was a lot
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Speaker 2: in their budget at that time because clearly they were
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Speaker 2: living dollar to dollar and it was all making sense
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Speaker 2: until a bump in the road came off and money
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Speaker 2: diarist was like, excuse.
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Speaker 1: Me, but why not? I don't get it.
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Speaker 2: So that hits kids pretty hard as well when it
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Speaker 2: starts to become things that really impact them. So it's
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Speaker 2: interesting to see how that translated to the way you
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Speaker 2: behave as an adult, because whether it's conscious or unconscious,
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Speaker 2: our money diary is so formative. I find it so interesting.
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Speaker 2: So thank you for sharing that with us. But let's
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Speaker 2: learn a little bit about you as an adult. Now,
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Speaker 2: tell us a little bit about what you do for
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Speaker 2: work and how much money you earn.
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Speaker 5: So I'm a registered nurse in Imagine Department. So I'm
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Speaker 5: an RN four.
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Speaker 1: Now, fancy lady.
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Speaker 5: Well, basically just means I've been out of UNI for
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Speaker 5: four years. But it meant that last financial year I
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Speaker 5: earned eighty eight thousand dollars.
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Speaker 1: And that's pretty good.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, last year I had what I affectionately called lockdown
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Speaker 5: annual leave, which is where my leaf balance was too
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Speaker 5: high that Sydney was still in like our big month long,
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Speaker 5: couple months long lockdown.
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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, so I did.
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Speaker 5: Some like uber eats driving during that time just to
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Speaker 5: have a reason to get out of the house.
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Speaker 1: Oh I love that.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, and I made an extra two thousand dollars after tax.
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, that was worth it.
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Speaker 5: Well, I mean twofold. It stopped me from sitting in
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Speaker 5: my house for four weeks in lockdown. And yeah, a
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Speaker 5: little bit of extra coin to go towards the holiday
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Speaker 5: fund is always nice.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's actually epic.
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Speaker 2: I love hearing stories about people getting little side hustles
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Speaker 2: that aren't necessarily always about the money. It's yeah, great,
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Speaker 2: you made two grand, but you're also like, no, I
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Speaker 2: needed to get out of the house. This was basically
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Speaker 2: a really good insurance policy for my mental health and
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Speaker 2: to make sure that I'm still moving and doing stuff
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Speaker 2: at a time when arguably a lot of people were
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Speaker 2: just locked away and unable to.
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Speaker 1: So I love that for you.
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Speaker 5: And we still got to chat to people like it
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Speaker 5: was still very much like here's your food, but like
6:16
Speaker 5: how is your day?
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Speaker 1: Yeah, but you still feel like you're doing something.
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Speaker 5: Still I'm talking to someone other than you know, my
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Speaker 5: partner who I live with.
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Speaker 2: I feel like in Lockdown, I was a bit like that.
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Speaker 2: Whenever the postman came, I'm like, how are you do?
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Speaker 2: You want to come for a cup of tea? Not
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Speaker 2: that I did that, but it was just a lot
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Speaker 2: more interactive than it would have been otherwise.
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Speaker 5: Oh, I was going to say, Now, if I order Uber,
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Speaker 5: it's like the person guidance and drops off my food,
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Speaker 5: and because I get we get to go out and
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Speaker 5: see all our friends. It doesn't seem as much of
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Speaker 5: a social interaction now or as it did last year.
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Speaker 5: It was definitely.
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Speaker 1: Exciting, totally.
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Speaker 2: Now, you mentioned a holiday fund before, I'd love to
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Speaker 2: know what is your big money goal?
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Speaker 5: So I always set aside parts of my money like
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Speaker 5: for holidays anyway, so I wouldn't really call that the
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Speaker 5: big goal. The big goal for me is relatively typically millennially,
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Speaker 5: is to try and buy a house. So I set
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Speaker 5: aside twenty percent of my income to a deposit account
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Speaker 5: that I'm trying to get a home deposit, so figures
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Speaker 5: cross that'll get there sometime soon. I'm starting reading into
7:16
Speaker 5: doing contributions towards my super to get that as well,
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Speaker 5: just to try and strike while the iron's hot hopefully,
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Speaker 5: so yeah, buy a house.
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Speaker 2: Smart woman. Now tell me a little bit about the
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Speaker 2: amounts in those savings accounts, because you can say, look,
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Speaker 2: my big money goals this, but this is she's on
7:32
Speaker 2: the money. I want to know how much is in
7:34
Speaker 2: that account and how much further you want to go.
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Speaker 5: So if you exclude my emergency fund, because that's I've
7:40
Speaker 5: put that in a separate account that I don't really
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Speaker 5: look at. There's ten grand in there, which I guess
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Speaker 5: I could tap into if I need, like if I
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Speaker 5: got a gin, But otherwise I have fifty thousand dollars
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Speaker 5: saved at the moment.
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Speaker 1: Oh, check you out.
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Speaker 2: You weren't wrong about being a good little saver trying.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, oh my gosh, how good?
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Speaker 2: And how much do you think you need for a
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Speaker 2: house deposit for where you want to purchase?
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Speaker 5: I live in Sydney and the house and prising is
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Speaker 5: yeah insane. I's so at the moment. And I have
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Speaker 5: learned since the spicy Cough lockdowns that I want like
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Speaker 5: a backyard, I want a house with land. I realize
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Speaker 5: how important it is for my mental health to be
8:20
Speaker 5: able to be outside and like not just on a
8:23
Speaker 5: little balcony. Yeah, so it means I'm looking at like
8:27
Speaker 5: one point two minimum in terms of purchase price, and
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Speaker 5: ideally I'd like to avoid LMI, so I'm going to
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Speaker 5: go for twenty percent of that. But currently I'm living
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Speaker 5: with my partner, so he also has that as his goal,
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Speaker 5: Like he wants a house as well, so let's go
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Speaker 5: ten percent.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, so that'll make it a little bit easier,
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Speaker 2: but obviously that's a really big goal. Like we're not
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Speaker 2: talking let's just say fifty grand and buy something that
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Speaker 2: fifty grand can buy you. How do you feel about
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Speaker 2: time frames around goals, so like, are you still committed
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Speaker 2: or do you feel like some times you fall off
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Speaker 2: the bandwagon, because I think a lot of millennials are
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Speaker 2: in this situation where they're like, oh my god, saving
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Speaker 2: for a house takes forever, but it's worth it in
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Speaker 2: the long term.
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Speaker 5: Yeah. I mean, I definitely have those moments where you're
9:13
Speaker 5: like trolling domain or real estate dot Com and you're
9:15
Speaker 5: seeing what you could get if you've got a deposit
9:18
Speaker 5: on what you had now, and it's always disheartening. Yeah,
9:22
Speaker 5: but I know that my parents now like they've offered
9:25
Speaker 5: to let me move back in home with my partner
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Speaker 5: and they set up a little space for us if
9:29
Speaker 5: we wanted to save the money we were spending on rent.
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Speaker 5: So that's something we're considering because that would save we
9:34
Speaker 5: spend fifteen grand on rent, Like my half of it
9:37
Speaker 5: is that much. So oh my gosh, wow, Si me
9:40
Speaker 5: renting is also expensive, but that would mean that that
9:43
Speaker 5: would be fifteen grand that I can save without having
9:46
Speaker 5: to like do it.
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Speaker 2: Yah, And that's a massive saving and like that projects
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Speaker 2: you so much further forward when it comes to saving
9:54
Speaker 2: for a home and if you're moving back in, like
9:57
Speaker 2: arguably you and your partner, if you're both doing that,
10:00
Speaker 2: potentially is another thirty grand a year, Like that's why.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, so that's what we're talking about at the moment.
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Speaker 5: But he's a bit older than me and has lived
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Speaker 5: out of home for a lot longer, so he's obviously
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Speaker 5: very hesitant to give up that independence to move back in,
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Speaker 5: especially with my family.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's definitely a balance of values and what you
10:17
Speaker 2: want to do and how it's working. I totally understand that.
10:21
Speaker 2: Moving on from goals, I want to know, do you
10:24
Speaker 2: have any investments.
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Speaker 5: I have my super which I never really thought of
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Speaker 5: as an investment until the podcast.
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Speaker 1: But it is, but it is. I promise it's.
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Speaker 5: Got thirty thousand in it at the moment.
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Speaker 1: Hey, that's pretty good for your app.
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Speaker 5: Yeah, I think it's like this was a little I
10:39
Speaker 5: think you guys might have posted it like a little
10:41
Speaker 5: what's the average for your age bracket? Yeah?
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Speaker 1: Probably. Yeah, that sounds like something just would have done
10:45
Speaker 1: to us.
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Speaker 5: And that kind of average, which is good.
10:48
Speaker 1: It's nice to just know your own trick.
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Speaker 4: Yeah.
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Speaker 5: I always thought I was behind because I didn't really
10:52
Speaker 5: like a lot of people start working at fourteen and
10:55
Speaker 5: nine months and they keep binding, whereas my first job
10:59
Speaker 5: I was eighteen, Like it was. I couldn't work during
11:03
Speaker 5: high school, so it was I was always worried that
11:05
Speaker 5: I'd be behind. But it's nice to know that I'm
11:07
Speaker 5: kind of on average. And then last year I put
11:12
Speaker 5: my tax return into a raise account.
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Speaker 1: And oh my gosh, who is she? I know you.
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Speaker 5: Contribute like the price of one coffee a week, which
11:19
Speaker 5: I know isn't a lot.
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Speaker 1: No, no, no no.
11:21
Speaker 2: I used to quote on the podcast all the time
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Speaker 2: from little things, big things grow, and they really do.
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Speaker 2: It's about the habit, and it's about forming those habits
11:29
Speaker 2: and creating consistency, so when your income increases or your
11:32
Speaker 2: situation changes, you can make that change.
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Speaker 5: And also, I'm very risk averse, so I went, if
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Speaker 5: I can give up one.
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Speaker 1: Cup of coffee slowly?
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Speaker 5: Yeah, like I could handle not having one coffee.
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Speaker 2: You're like, if I lost a cup of coffee this week,
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Speaker 2: it wouldn't be the worst thing, So let's start investing
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Speaker 2: with that.
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Speaker 1: I love that exactly.
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Speaker 5: I dropped my coffee on the floor the other day
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Speaker 5: and that was also five dollars down the drain.
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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, it was so disappointing. I love that
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Speaker 1: for you. Next question is do you currently have any debts?
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Speaker 1: I feel like you're going.
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Speaker 5: To say no.
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Speaker 1: I feel like I'm pretty good at predicting this, but
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Speaker 1: what is it.
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Speaker 5: No, I don't currently have any debts. I have had debt,
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Speaker 5: like I got a car loan to buy a car,
12:13
Speaker 5: but then I also got essentially I got a payment
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Speaker 5: for being a victim of a crime and use that
12:18
Speaker 5: to pay off my car loan. So now, apart from
12:20
Speaker 5: my hex, I'm debt free.
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Speaker 1: That is a really terrible money win.
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Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, it's a money win because you got
12:26
Speaker 2: money and got to pay off a debt, but you
12:28
Speaker 2: probably experienced something really traumatic.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, but I'm sorry.
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Speaker 5: I feel like I can joke about it now and
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Speaker 5: I think of it now as let's just focus on
12:38
Speaker 5: the fact that I got that money in I mean,
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Speaker 5: no debt debt free except my hex. But you know
12:42
Speaker 5: that dies with me anyway.
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Speaker 1: So all right, So we're going to come back to
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Speaker 1: that after the break.
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Speaker 2: But moving on from my question about debt, I want
12:49
Speaker 2: to ask about good money habits. But before I get there,
12:52
Speaker 2: my friend, you're in the She's on the Money community.
12:55
Speaker 2: You knew that you wanted to share money wins with us,
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Speaker 2: so it's a logical or something to assume.
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Speaker 1: That maybe you use shop back. Can you tell us
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Speaker 1: if you do, or if you've had any experience with
13:05
Speaker 1: it before?
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Speaker 4: I do.
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Speaker 5: I do use shot back. I haven't heard of it
13:08
Speaker 5: before the podcast. I was. I had the Honey extension,
13:13
Speaker 5: the one that.
13:13
Speaker 1: Like, oh my gosh, I remember.
13:15
Speaker 5: Allie you like discount codes.
13:17
Speaker 4: And it was really annoying though, because I got I
13:19
Speaker 4: reckon six emails a day from that Honey pcent.
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Speaker 5: I was like, no, the emails are worth it if
13:24
Speaker 5: I save some money. Yeah, shot back, no emails like
13:27
Speaker 5: unless I want them, which is even better. I don't
13:29
Speaker 5: feel like they're spamming my inbox, and so far I've
13:31
Speaker 5: got like thirty dollars sitting in there, which will be
13:33
Speaker 5: a nice little treat at some point.
13:36
Speaker 2: I love that I have been trying to use shot
13:38
Speaker 2: back as much as possible. If you're a long term
13:40
Speaker 2: listener of the pod, you'll know that Jess uses shot
13:43
Speaker 2: back on all of our business purchases, so hers is
13:45
Speaker 2: looking probably incredibly healthy right now. But I'm planning on
13:49
Speaker 2: drawing mine now at Christmas time and using it on
13:52
Speaker 2: Christmas groceries, because I feel like that's the thing that
13:55
Speaker 2: gets away from me at Christmas. I budget for presents
13:57
Speaker 2: and organize all of that stuff, but I totally forget
14:00
Speaker 2: how much I spend on groceries. But moving on before
14:03
Speaker 2: someone mentions the fact that I did a weeminar we
14:05
Speaker 2: shot back one time and said it's just like honey
14:07
Speaker 2: guys in front of the MD of shot back, which
14:11
Speaker 2: is just they still work with us.
14:13
Speaker 1: So far, so good.
14:14
Speaker 2: I want to know another one of your good money habits,
14:17
Speaker 2: my friend, what is your best money habit?
14:19
Speaker 5: I probably go with my best money habit at the
14:21
Speaker 5: moment is automation. Like all my pay. I'm very fortunate
14:26
Speaker 5: that I work for the government. I work in a
14:27
Speaker 5: public hospital, and they allow you to separate your pay
14:31
Speaker 5: into like six separate chunks.
14:33
Speaker 1: So oh, how good is that?
14:35
Speaker 5: So I've worked out how much my bills for the
14:37
Speaker 5: year work out to be for the month, and then
14:39
Speaker 5: set that aside, and then I get my twenty percent
14:42
Speaker 5: deposit and I set that aside, and you know, five
14:44
Speaker 5: percent goes to my little holiday accounts. Set that aside
14:47
Speaker 5: each month. So it just means that I never feel short.
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Speaker 5: So I think that's probably my best I.
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Speaker 1: Really like that.
14:53
Speaker 2: So are you saying that what hits your actual bank
14:56
Speaker 2: account that you kind of have a debit card with,
14:59
Speaker 2: that's just what you can spend, and you know you
15:01
Speaker 2: can spend because everything else is already pre allocated.
15:04
Speaker 5: Yeah, pretty much. So I do HelloFresh for meals, but
15:09
Speaker 5: for breakfasts and you know, little snacks and things like that.
15:11
Speaker 5: I've still got to put the groceries on that part.
15:14
Speaker 5: But other than that, if I want to go out
15:15
Speaker 5: with my friends or if I want that you know,
15:17
Speaker 5: cheeky second coffee for the day, like I know that
15:20
Speaker 5: that money is there for the month, and yeah.
15:22
Speaker 1: I really like that.
15:23
Speaker 2: I feel like that sounds very similar to the budget
15:26
Speaker 2: and cash flow system that I am a massive fan
15:28
Speaker 2: of because I created it incredibly biased. But it's really
15:32
Speaker 2: about automating all of the things except your food, your fuel,
15:35
Speaker 2: and your fun because you still have to like tap
15:37
Speaker 2: a debit card for those things.
15:39
Speaker 1: And it just makes sense.
15:40
Speaker 2: But as you said, if you want another cheeky coffee,
15:43
Speaker 2: it's easy to do because in the back of your mind,
15:45
Speaker 2: you're like, oh, I was pretty good with groceries this week.
15:47
Speaker 2: It doesn't matter too much if I do that. Or
15:49
Speaker 2: if you went over and had a few more splurge
15:51
Speaker 2: items in your groceries, you'd be like, ah, anomal coffee.
15:54
Speaker 2: I'll just have our tea when I get home.
15:56
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I mean reading your book did make me
15:59
Speaker 5: change my system a little bit.
16:00
Speaker 1: Oh really, how tell us spill the beans.
16:03
Speaker 5: It was probably more to do with the like making
16:05
Speaker 5: sure your fixed expenses are split up per pay cycle
16:10
Speaker 5: and audiating that, whereas I was trying to like guess
16:14
Speaker 5: before and being like, oh, I think it'll be like
16:16
Speaker 5: this much a month or that much a month.
16:17
Speaker 1: I'll tell you stress yourself out. Yeah, that's how you
16:21
Speaker 1: end up in a pickle.
16:22
Speaker 5: I had a spreadsheet and it was like it was
16:24
Speaker 5: I was close.
16:26
Speaker 1: That's more than guess what.
16:27
Speaker 2: That is better than an edge, that's for sure.
16:31
Speaker 1: I like that.
16:32
Speaker 2: And I think that we've just tobo charged it. We're
16:34
Speaker 2: working together for your cash flow.
16:36
Speaker 5: I love it absolutely.
16:37
Speaker 2: All right, let's flip this on its head, money diarist,
16:40
Speaker 2: what's your worst money habit?
16:42
Speaker 5: You thought about this one a lot, mainly because I
16:45
Speaker 5: didn't have like a gut answer, or if I did,
16:47
Speaker 5: it wasn't one that I thought was like quote unquote valid.
16:51
Speaker 5: I think, if anything, it's that I don't treat myself
16:55
Speaker 5: like I go to work like forty hours a week.
16:58
Speaker 5: We all do. And I don't like spending my money.
17:01
Speaker 5: I think that comes from that anxiety of not knowing
17:05
Speaker 5: whether I'll have enough, which is silly because I didn't
17:08
Speaker 5: really struggle with that much as a kid. But I
17:10
Speaker 5: think it's because I don't want to be without the
17:12
Speaker 5: money that I do have. So I guess my worst
17:15
Speaker 5: money habit is that I don't spend it on me
17:18
Speaker 5: that often other people one hundred percent. If you're my
17:21
Speaker 5: friend and it's your birthday, have gift, but for me,
17:24
Speaker 5: I kind of hold on to it very tight.
17:27
Speaker 2: I feel like that's really common, especially given the context
17:31
Speaker 2: you've provided us with around how you grew up around
17:34
Speaker 2: money and that you kind of have carried that as
17:36
Speaker 2: a burden, and the way you compensate for that in
17:39
Speaker 2: a way is to overcompensate when it comes to money
17:43
Speaker 2: and hoard it and not diffuse it when it comes
17:46
Speaker 2: to looking after yourself. But I do think that a
17:49
Speaker 2: healthy budget long term does include self care, because self
17:53
Speaker 2: care is going to mean that you are better at
17:54
Speaker 2: work and you're able to, you know, put more into
17:57
Speaker 2: your job and ultimately earn more money and be more sustainable.
18:01
Speaker 1: So definitely treat yourself.
18:02
Speaker 2: But it sounds like you're learning a little bit because
18:04
Speaker 2: before we started recording, you did say for your birthday,
18:07
Speaker 2: you are getting yourself a nice massage.
18:10
Speaker 5: And I have made sure that there will be, you know,
18:12
Speaker 5: enough in my little spending account to make sure that happens,
18:14
Speaker 5: because payday is after my birthday.
18:16
Speaker 2: I hate that when you're like, no, I wanted this
18:19
Speaker 2: nice thing, but I'm gonna have to budget for it
18:21
Speaker 2: a month in advance.
18:22
Speaker 5: I get paid fortnightly, my birthdays on the Tuesday and
18:24
Speaker 5: Payday's on the Wednesday on. It's like just that little
18:29
Speaker 5: bit too tight, But that's okay. We'll have enough. Or
18:31
Speaker 5: if not, I could steal a little from my travel
18:34
Speaker 5: fund and put it back when I get paid.
18:36
Speaker 1: We can replenish that later. That is fine.
18:38
Speaker 2: You definitely deserve the massage. Yeah, money diarist. Last question
18:43
Speaker 2: before we head to a quick break is if we
18:46
Speaker 2: forced you to give yourself a money grade, what would
18:48
Speaker 2: you grade yourself.
18:49
Speaker 5: I'm probably going to go with, like, I don't really
18:51
Speaker 5: understand the whole pluses and minuses of the grade system.
18:54
Speaker 2: Ah, you can just make it up, honestly, when I
18:57
Speaker 2: think that's what everybody else does.
18:58
Speaker 1: We don't fact check it, so we'll go with.
19:01
Speaker 5: Like a B. I'm not great, but I've definitely improved
19:05
Speaker 5: a lot, but I still think I have a way
19:07
Speaker 5: to go. But I'm like the higher end of the
19:09
Speaker 5: B scale, So like.
19:10
Speaker 1: A B plus, Yeah, maybe a B plus. We'll give
19:13
Speaker 1: you a B plus.
19:14
Speaker 5: I reckon if that's how it works. I'm gonna be honest,
19:17
Speaker 5: I don't really know, but let's yeah.
19:18
Speaker 1: I reckon.
19:19
Speaker 2: There's a few people listening that are, like Money Diarist,
19:22
Speaker 2: you've got a really healthy emergency fund saving for a house.
19:25
Speaker 2: Sounds like you've got a budget and cash flow system
19:28
Speaker 2: that is incredibly efficient. They're going to be shaking their
19:31
Speaker 2: phones right now listening to.
19:32
Speaker 1: You, going like, get it together, you're an a. I
19:34
Speaker 1: won't argue with you, but I do have a few
19:37
Speaker 1: questions for you. Right after this quick.
19:38
Speaker 2: Break, all right, diving straight back in Money Diarist, when
19:42
Speaker 2: you wrote into Jess, you explained that you've been going
19:45
Speaker 2: through some stuff at your parents' house and found some
19:47
Speaker 2: notes that you'd left and like kind of like journal
19:50
Speaker 2: entries from when you were little about how you were
19:52
Speaker 2: stressed about money.
19:53
Speaker 1: And I'd love to know a little bit more about.
19:56
Speaker 2: That process and how that has affected you in the
19:59
Speaker 2: long term, because Jess said you had was an open
20:02
Speaker 2: heart surgery when you were young. Yeah, oh my gosh.
20:05
Speaker 2: That is a lot of trauma to carry, but obviously
20:09
Speaker 2: created a fair bit of financial burden on your family,
20:12
Speaker 2: given your dad went through a retrenchment to make sure
20:14
Speaker 2: he could hang.
20:15
Speaker 1: Out with you, which is so special.
20:17
Speaker 2: But could you tell us a little bit about that
20:19
Speaker 2: period of your life.
20:20
Speaker 5: Yeah, So, throats that I found were like it was
20:24
Speaker 5: after I heard that I needed another surgery. So I
20:26
Speaker 5: had one when I was born, and then the second
20:29
Speaker 5: one when I was fourteen. But when I was twelve,
20:32
Speaker 5: I started getting sick with the symptoms of my heart condition,
20:36
Speaker 5: and I overheard the doctor telling my parents that I
20:39
Speaker 5: needed extra heart surgery, which my parents had never really
20:43
Speaker 5: spoken to me about because they.
20:44
Speaker 1: Wanted me to be a happy child.
20:47
Speaker 5: Exactly like I played rep sport, like I was very
20:49
Speaker 5: fit and healthy, and they didn't really want that burden
20:53
Speaker 5: hanging over me.
20:54
Speaker 2: It's stressful, and a kid doesn't fully comprehend that, especially
20:57
Speaker 2: if it's a maybe right.
20:58
Speaker 5: Yeah, right. It could have been in ten years from
21:01
Speaker 5: that point, It could have been two years from that point.
21:03
Speaker 5: It could have been six months from then. Like I
21:05
Speaker 5: wasn't going to know, so my parents didn't tell me.
21:08
Speaker 5: But then when I did hear, I didn't talk to
21:11
Speaker 5: them either, So I kind of compartmentalized and bottled all
21:14
Speaker 5: that up and got a bit stressed. And yeah, I
21:18
Speaker 5: was very much a diary kid. I wrote a lot.
21:22
Speaker 5: And then my dad got retrenched from his job or
21:25
Speaker 5: accepted in the retrenchment.
21:27
Speaker 4: I guess, can you before you go any further for
21:29
Speaker 4: anyone who doesn't know what a retrenchment is, can you
21:32
Speaker 4: just explain that for.
21:33
Speaker 5: Them my understanding, I'll put it out there.
21:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, is essentially I'll confirm nor deny.
21:39
Speaker 5: Yeah, thank you. It was essentially the business went. We
21:43
Speaker 5: no longer have a role that suits your needs. So
21:47
Speaker 5: you can either take this chunk of money to leave
21:50
Speaker 5: the business, or we can try and fit you in
21:54
Speaker 5: a hole, but it won't necessarily be at the same
21:56
Speaker 5: pay grade or in the same position. That was kind
21:58
Speaker 5: of my understanding of it.
22:00
Speaker 1: Is not wrong. Yeah, so it's similar to a redundancy.
22:02
Speaker 2: Similar to a redundancy, but it's kind of like a
22:04
Speaker 2: negotiation and yeah, okay. Rather it's a bit more in
22:07
Speaker 2: your court about what the outcome is in comparison to
22:10
Speaker 2: a redundancy where they're like, hey, JS, your services are
22:13
Speaker 2: no longer needed because you don't have a job here anymore. Yeah, okay,
22:16
Speaker 2: this is the outcome. It's a bit more in your hands.
22:19
Speaker 2: But in saying that the world is wild, and that
22:21
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that every business treats it in exactly the
22:24
Speaker 2: same way.
22:25
Speaker 4: I could see though, if that's the case, and if
22:26
Speaker 4: it was a bit in his power to negotiate why
22:29
Speaker 4: he would have elected to take that to spend more
22:31
Speaker 4: time with you knowing that you were going to have
22:33
Speaker 4: that surgery.
22:34
Speaker 5: Yeah, so he actually was one of the ones that
22:37
Speaker 5: sat with me. I have siblings, and my mom spent
22:40
Speaker 5: a lot of time with them, but my dad and
22:43
Speaker 5: I are really close, and he was probably a better
22:45
Speaker 5: presence to have at the bedside anyway.
22:47
Speaker 2: At fourteen, I can absolutely attest to that. I used
22:51
Speaker 2: to fight like cat'n dog with my mum, but my
22:53
Speaker 2: dad would walk in and I'd be like, Hi, Dad,
22:55
Speaker 2: love you, right, I was a pet.
22:58
Speaker 5: I think my mum and I are very similar, so
23:00
Speaker 5: we kind of butt heads a lot. Same that complicates things.
23:03
Speaker 1: Love you, mum if you're listening, three that.
23:06
Speaker 5: Mum doesn't know neither, but like, she doesn't know that
23:08
Speaker 5: I'm doing this, but I still love you.
23:10
Speaker 1: We won't tell her, don't worry, but mine listens. We
23:13
Speaker 1: need to remind her that I love her still. Hello, Judy.
23:17
Speaker 4: With your surgery, did you guys have and you may
23:20
Speaker 4: not know this because obviously you were quite young.
23:23
Speaker 1: Did you have private health?
23:24
Speaker 4: Were there additional expenses that were incurred as a part
23:27
Speaker 4: of that that then.
23:28
Speaker 1: Added to the stress that you were experiencing.
23:30
Speaker 5: So I did have private health insurance, not me personally,
23:34
Speaker 5: but my family. Yeah, and fortunately for us the business
23:37
Speaker 5: that retrenched my father. Part of that was that we
23:40
Speaker 5: were able to keep the corporate private health insurance. Oh incredible,
23:44
Speaker 5: oh money when yeah, absolutely, the fact that he was
23:46
Speaker 5: able to negotiate that into the process. There were a
23:50
Speaker 5: few kind of out of pocket expenses afterwards, because I
23:55
Speaker 5: had some complications after my surgery that required a bit
23:57
Speaker 5: more time and kind of accommodations to be made in
24:02
Speaker 5: my house. So they all came out of pocket, which
24:05
Speaker 5: my parents not like reminded me of in a sense
24:08
Speaker 5: that they blamed me for it. But it was like
24:12
Speaker 5: money's tight at the moment because we have to afford
24:15
Speaker 5: you know, disappointment that's coming up in this new bed
24:18
Speaker 5: for you.
24:18
Speaker 2: And yeah, and it's like really nice that they're being transparent,
24:23
Speaker 2: but I think in those moments sometimes they don't realize
24:26
Speaker 2: the impact of their words.
24:27
Speaker 1: Like they weren't trying to make you feel guilt or.
24:30
Speaker 2: Blame, but that's the way you took it because you're young,
24:33
Speaker 2: and you go, well, that's why we can't do other
24:35
Speaker 2: cool things.
24:35
Speaker 5: It's me like it was things like, oh, well, normally
24:39
Speaker 5: for our birthdays, we get to choose either what we
24:43
Speaker 5: want or where we want to go for dinner if
24:45
Speaker 5: we get to go out, And it was one of
24:47
Speaker 5: those times that Mum was like, look, we can't go
24:48
Speaker 5: out for birthday dinners because obviously that's more expensive than
24:53
Speaker 5: cooking it home most of the time. And she would
24:55
Speaker 5: say like, I'll still cook you whatever you want, but
24:57
Speaker 5: we just can't because we've just had to pay for this. Yeah,
25:00
Speaker 5: I ended up getting one of those like hospital beds,
25:03
Speaker 5: you know that like sit up and fold down, so spenno.
25:06
Speaker 5: So that was like they still provided for me. And
25:10
Speaker 5: you know, like, I don't want to say that I'm
25:13
Speaker 5: talking down about my parents at all.
25:15
Speaker 2: Oh, you're absolutely not. I don't think anyone listening would
25:18
Speaker 2: think that at all. It's like their circumstances were that
25:21
Speaker 2: they were like, we've got this kid, We're looking after them,
25:23
Speaker 2: We're giving.
25:24
Speaker 1: Them all our resources. Kid.
25:26
Speaker 2: Do you understand that that's why maybe in other areas
25:29
Speaker 2: we're not able to do it. It wasn't because of
25:31
Speaker 2: you or that they were doing the wrong thing, was
25:33
Speaker 2: actually because they cared to share. Yeah, And I think
25:36
Speaker 2: that's really important too.
25:37
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I mean I think in hindsight, as much
25:40
Speaker 5: as it was a big stressor for me, I didn't
25:43
Speaker 5: want to take away from my parents, I then became
25:46
Speaker 5: super mindful of what I was spending and what I
25:48
Speaker 5: was asking for. Yeah, but I'm also glad they told me,
25:51
Speaker 5: because otherwise I think I would have been confused. Yeah, confused, frustrated.
25:56
Speaker 2: And the alternative to that potentially could have been you
25:59
Speaker 2: feel guilty as though they were taking it off you
26:02
Speaker 2: for another reason. If you hadn't comprehended why that was happening,
26:06
Speaker 2: like oh, we had to buy a really expensive hospital bed,
26:08
Speaker 2: you'd be like, yeah, did I do something wrong? Why
26:10
Speaker 2: aren't we going out for birthday dinners? Like? Why have
26:13
Speaker 2: we taken that away? So I think it's important for
26:15
Speaker 2: you to understand context. But it's so interesting to see
26:18
Speaker 2: how children interpret the world in that way and how
26:21
Speaker 2: that impacts you now today in the way that you
26:23
Speaker 2: have your money, habits and beliefs and values, and that
26:26
Speaker 2: you haven't been spending a lot on yourself because you're like,
26:28
Speaker 2: I need to make sure that I'm holding the money
26:30
Speaker 2: that I have, which I totally understand.
26:33
Speaker 5: Yeah, and I mean, I've always been told that I
26:36
Speaker 5: will at some point need another surgery. So that's also
26:39
Speaker 5: just like probably would have been when I was a kid,
26:41
Speaker 5: that little voice in the back of my head being like, yeah,
26:44
Speaker 5: make sure just in case something goes wrong again.
26:46
Speaker 1: So yeah, Oh my gosh, that's so stressed. That's okay,
26:50
Speaker 1: that makes a lot of sense.
26:51
Speaker 4: And I know that there are a couple of other
26:53
Speaker 4: things we want to ask you about from your story,
26:54
Speaker 4: But one more thing for me, I relate to a
26:57
Speaker 4: lot of things you said because I grew up in
26:59
Speaker 4: a single income household, so I totally get that stress.
27:02
Speaker 4: Have you spoken to your mum or your dad since
27:06
Speaker 4: as an adult, because I think the thing that's really
27:09
Speaker 4: interesting is like that Harry Potter book, for example, that
27:12
Speaker 4: you still remember so dearly that she wasn't able to
27:15
Speaker 4: get that for you. I would imagine that that incident
27:19
Speaker 4: is probably burned into her brain as well. As a parent,
27:22
Speaker 4: the guilt of not being able to provide for your
27:25
Speaker 4: child something that they want, and something like a book
27:28
Speaker 4: in the scheme of things, is a relatively affordable item
27:32
Speaker 4: for most people, and it's a luxury, and that is
27:34
Speaker 4: a very privileged thing that just came out of my
27:36
Speaker 4: mouth to say, but a twenty dollars book, for example,
27:39
Speaker 4: is more accessible than a five hundred dollars xbox or
27:42
Speaker 4: something like that.
27:42
Speaker 2: Totally jokes that you think in Xbox is only five
27:45
Speaker 2: hundred dollars now, Okay.
27:48
Speaker 4: But have you spoken to her or your dad since
27:51
Speaker 4: then kind of reflected on how they felt as well,
27:54
Speaker 4: or is this something you've kind of held a little
27:56
Speaker 4: close to your chest.
27:57
Speaker 5: A bit both. I've spoken to my parents about how
28:00
Speaker 5: them talking about their finances affects my I guess level
28:04
Speaker 5: of security, and about how even though I really appreciate
28:08
Speaker 5: that they took care of me and my emotional and
28:12
Speaker 5: my physical needs, I don't think that hearing about their
28:17
Speaker 5: finances is the best for my mental health. Yeah, because
28:21
Speaker 5: it is. It's like, I remember two fights that I've
28:24
Speaker 5: had with my mother, and one of them is about
28:26
Speaker 5: the Harry Potter book. The other is that she didn't
28:28
Speaker 5: like the way I did my hair. Like they're the
28:31
Speaker 5: two moments that I think about when I think about
28:33
Speaker 5: fighting with my mom. Yeah, Okay, we're getting better at
28:36
Speaker 5: it now. Like they're in a much better financial situation.
28:39
Speaker 5: They're both stably full time employed, they've recently been able
28:43
Speaker 5: to renovate their house, which is really exciting, So we're
28:46
Speaker 5: talking more about that and about you know, how they
28:48
Speaker 5: had to reconsolidate their loans and take out a new
28:51
Speaker 5: mortgage for the renovation. And we're able to have those
28:55
Speaker 5: conversations now, Yeah, but we don't really talk about the
28:58
Speaker 5: before times or.
28:59
Speaker 1: You know, yeah, the impact that it had on you
29:01
Speaker 1: when you were younger.
29:02
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that's fair, Like it's just a
29:05
Speaker 2: place you don't need to go sometimes.
29:07
Speaker 5: And like they know that I struggled with it, but
29:10
Speaker 5: they were struggling with it too, and I think there's
29:12
Speaker 5: a lot that I don't know.
29:13
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, of course, now there's a.
29:15
Speaker 5: Lot to that story that they wouldn't have told me.
29:18
Speaker 5: And I was the oldest of us kids. So yeah,
29:23
Speaker 5: I think we've just both agreed that we'll just be
29:25
Speaker 5: more mindful about how we talk about each other's financial
29:28
Speaker 5: situation in the future.
29:30
Speaker 2: I like that you can have that conversation with your parents, though.
29:33
Speaker 2: How many people can say I've had an open, honest
29:35
Speaker 2: conversation about the way I have money conversations in my family,
29:39
Speaker 2: Like no one can say that.
29:40
Speaker 1: That is so ELP I love that. Very very healthy, Yeah.
29:45
Speaker 2: Very healthy knowing boundaries, understanding them and also just respecting them.
29:50
Speaker 1: Like, what is that about? I love that.
29:53
Speaker 4: So the other big thing I guess that you touched
29:55
Speaker 4: on before money, dirist, is that you paid off your
29:57
Speaker 4: car because you received a lump some payment following being
30:00
Speaker 4: a victim of a crime, which really, disappointingly is more
30:04
Speaker 4: common I think than people would maybe necessarily realize. So
30:08
Speaker 4: I just wanted to chat with you a little bit,
30:09
Speaker 4: and of course only share as much as little as
30:12
Speaker 4: you're comfortable with, but just about what happened, how that
30:16
Speaker 4: payment worked, and I'd love to know how you felt
30:19
Speaker 4: about that as well, because I think that's a really
30:21
Speaker 4: unique way to receive money that potentially could be tied
30:25
Speaker 4: to some icky feelings for you which would have been
30:27
Speaker 4: hard to handle.
30:28
Speaker 5: Yeah. So, while I was on placement as a student nurse,
30:34
Speaker 5: I went out with some friends one night and was
30:38
Speaker 5: a I am a survivor of sexual assault, which happened
30:42
Speaker 5: when I was out that night, And part of that
30:46
Speaker 5: process when you are sexually assaulted is you can get
30:50
Speaker 5: referred to a sexual assault support service, which is based
30:54
Speaker 5: out of kind of the big metropolitan hospitals in the regions.
31:00
Speaker 5: So I went and spoken to a counselor and had
31:03
Speaker 5: a lot to work through, understandably, of course, but because
31:07
Speaker 5: I was on placement, there was some talk about me
31:11
Speaker 5: not finishing my degree because you have to make a
31:14
Speaker 5: certain number of hours, and I was a bit stressed
31:18
Speaker 5: and didn't really think that I was, of course in
31:20
Speaker 5: the bestmental space to go and care for other people.
31:24
Speaker 5: So the council that I was speaking to said, hey,
31:26
Speaker 5: there's this way that you can apply for. I don't
31:30
Speaker 5: really know exactly what they called it, but it's like
31:32
Speaker 5: a hardship fund where you write in and you say,
31:36
Speaker 5: I have been a victim of a crime. This is
31:39
Speaker 5: affecting my life. I would like some funds to help
31:41
Speaker 5: support me. It's meant to cover all sorts of things,
31:45
Speaker 5: so like going to and from your counseling appointments, if
31:48
Speaker 5: you have to go to court and park at the
31:49
Speaker 5: courthouse and that's expensive, or just like to live your
31:53
Speaker 5: life still, you know, yeah, because it can have a
31:58
Speaker 5: big impact on you. Fortunately, the assailants in my crime
32:03
Speaker 5: pled guilty, so I didn't have to go to court
32:07
Speaker 5: and testify, which.
32:09
Speaker 2: Is wow, great, that's so rare, Like I am so
32:13
Speaker 2: happy that that was the situation for you, But for
32:16
Speaker 2: a lot of people who are like, oh, I was
32:18
Speaker 2: in that situation, for them to plead guilty and actually
32:21
Speaker 2: get to the stage of court like that is so rare.
32:25
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I mean, I'm going to say I was fortunate,
32:28
Speaker 5: but that's probably not.
32:29
Speaker 1: The You're not fortunate. We won't be using that word,
32:32
Speaker 1: my friend.
32:33
Speaker 5: No, But I was fortunate that the crime was on tape,
32:36
Speaker 5: so it was caught by so there was no ifs
32:39
Speaker 5: ands or butts about it. The only thing I had
32:41
Speaker 5: to do was identify the people involved.
32:44
Speaker 1: Who it was, and then deal with the trauma that
32:47
Speaker 1: your experience.
32:48
Speaker 4: Because you said before that that money is there for
32:50
Speaker 4: what you need it, and I'm really glad that that
32:52
Speaker 4: fund didn't have any I guess caveats and what you
32:56
Speaker 4: could use it for, because when you're a victim of
32:59
Speaker 4: something like that, or when you're involved in any kind
33:02
Speaker 4: of personal tragedy, I think people who haven't experienced it
33:06
Speaker 4: might underestimate the impact that that could have on your
33:09
Speaker 4: ability to just do.
33:10
Speaker 1: Simple day to day things.
33:13
Speaker 4: And it's a big ask for someone to experience something
33:16
Speaker 4: like that and then just go back to work or
33:18
Speaker 4: go back to UNI.
33:18
Speaker 5: Like, Yeah, at the time, I worked at as what
33:21
Speaker 5: we call an assistant in nursing, So it's like you're
33:23
Speaker 5: not registered, but you go and you do like the
33:26
Speaker 5: bed baths and you keep patients company and you know,
33:29
Speaker 5: help out with mobilization and stuff like that. Yeah, but
33:31
Speaker 5: I wasn't in the right head.
33:32
Speaker 1: Space to go, absolutely not.
33:34
Speaker 5: So some of that money went towards kind of covering
33:37
Speaker 5: my bills and things like that, the therapy that I
33:40
Speaker 5: was going to as well. When I did feel better
33:43
Speaker 5: to go back and finish that placement, it was a
33:46
Speaker 5: rural and remote placement, so I used the money to
33:49
Speaker 5: pay for a single accommodation.
33:51
Speaker 1: Oh good.
33:52
Speaker 5: The time that I went, I was staying in a
33:54
Speaker 5: hostel and that kind of crowded culture wasn't something that
33:59
Speaker 5: I was quite ready for after the assault.
34:02
Speaker 1: No, absolutely not.
34:03
Speaker 5: So I paid for a hotel room with the money,
34:05
Speaker 5: and then yeah, what I had left over, I went,
34:08
Speaker 5: what will make me less stressed right now? No debt,
34:10
Speaker 5: Yeah exactly, So I could use all my mental energy
34:13
Speaker 5: on kind of working through that event and getting back
34:19
Speaker 5: to graduating, and my life after that was all over.
34:23
Speaker 1: Back to where it should have been.
34:24
Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly, what incredible clarity from you in that moment
34:28
Speaker 4: to be able to step back and say, this is
34:30
Speaker 4: what I need right now and that's okay. You are
34:33
Speaker 4: incredibly impressive and so strong, and thank you for sharing
34:37
Speaker 4: that with us, Like that's a big thing to share.
34:39
Speaker 4: And I'm so grateful that you were really candid with
34:42
Speaker 4: us in our community because we know the statistics say
34:45
Speaker 4: it's so much more common than it ever should be,
34:48
Speaker 4: and it's really really appalling. So I have no doubt
34:51
Speaker 4: that there will be people listening to this relating to it,
34:55
Speaker 4: as much as I wish that they weren't.
34:56
Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean they talk about the percentage and the
34:59
Speaker 5: people that go through this, and you don't really want
35:01
Speaker 5: to be part of the percent but at least you
35:03
Speaker 5: know that our country has a lot of free and
35:06
Speaker 5: financial support for victims that have gone through these sort
35:10
Speaker 5: of things, and some of the therapy was free. So
35:12
Speaker 5: I guess to anyone that's listening and that has gone
35:14
Speaker 5: through that and is struggling to access mental health care,
35:18
Speaker 5: it could be something to look into.
35:20
Speaker 4: And we'll definitely pop some resources in the show notes
35:22
Speaker 4: for anybody who needs to access that for themselves or
35:24
Speaker 4: for somebody that they love.
35:25
Speaker 2: Absolutely, thank you for sharing that. Unfortunately, I do think
35:29
Speaker 2: that that is all we have time for today, So
35:32
Speaker 2: thank you for taking the time and yeah, hanging out
35:35
Speaker 2: with us and sharing some really intimate details about your
35:37
Speaker 2: life and your finances and your history and how you've
35:41
Speaker 2: gotten to be where you are today. I know our
35:43
Speaker 2: community absolutely appreciates it.
35:45
Speaker 5: Thank you for having me.
35:48
Speaker 4: If I shared on She's on the Money is generally
35:50
Speaker 4: nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's on
35:53
Speaker 4: the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should not
35:55
Speaker 4: be relied upon to make an investment or a financial decision.
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Speaker 4: And we promise Victoria Divine isn't authorized representative of Infocused
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