Latest / Dear Divorce Diary: A Fresh Approach To Healing Grief & Building A Life Of Confidence After Divorce / 373. Good News and Bad News About Why You Can’t Let Go After Divorce (Pt. 1)

Transcript

373. Good News and Bad News About Why You Can’t Let Go After Divorce (Pt. 1) · Dear Divorce Diary: A Fresh Approach To Healing Grief & Building A Life Of Confidence After Divorce

0:00
SPEAKER_01: Good morning, Sunshines.
0:02
SPEAKER_03: We missed you last week.
0:04
SPEAKER_01: I have been traveling a lot the last year lately.
0:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
0:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: It's good though.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: It's good, good, good.
0:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, so proud of what y'all did while I was out.
0:16
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh man, the episode y'all did was Did we make mom proud?
0:20
SPEAKER_01: Were you so proud of proud?
0:23
SPEAKER_01: And it was super interesting.
0:24
SPEAKER_01: Like there's never been an episode that I didn't know.
0:27
SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
0:27
SPEAKER_01: Like I had to listen to my own podcast.
0:29
SPEAKER_01: It was, yeah.
0:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
0:30
SPEAKER_01: So on the way to the airport, that's what I did.
0:32
SPEAKER_01: It was amazing.
0:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
0:34
SPEAKER_03: We earned you that explicit rating, honey, last week.
0:36
SPEAKER_03: That was good.
0:37
SPEAKER_03: Everybody came in hot.
0:38
SPEAKER_03: It was good.
0:38
SPEAKER_01: You know what's something I've been wanting to process a little bit?
0:41
SPEAKER_01: Is I've been struggling with the explicit rating a little bit.
0:44
SPEAKER_01: And um actually I was pondering this last week.
0:47
SPEAKER_01: Do I want to talk with our listeners about this?
0:49
SPEAKER_01: Because we dropped a we dropped a reel on Instagram last week where I said something explicit from the podcast.
0:58
SPEAKER_01: It was a clip directly out of the podcast.
1:00
SPEAKER_01: And I've really been grappling with that.
1:02
SPEAKER_01: And I'm all for authentic expression.
1:04
SPEAKER_01: And I do curse in my real life.
1:07
SPEAKER_01: And also I've been asking myself, like, how like, what is that about?
1:14
SPEAKER_01: How important is it?
1:15
SPEAKER_01: And then I got into a fight with my kid this week and she was like, I don't like it.
1:19
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, oh.
1:22
SPEAKER_04: And so like you cussing.
1:25
SPEAKER_04: Cursing.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:28
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
1:29
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
1:30
SPEAKER_01: So, anyways, this is me polling the audience.
1:33
SPEAKER_01: Are you pro-cursing, con-cursing, neutral on cursing?
1:37
SPEAKER_01: Send us a message.
1:38
SPEAKER_01: I'd love to know.
1:40
SPEAKER_01: Just like in the inquiry.
1:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:43
SPEAKER_01: Super interesting.
1:50
SPEAKER_00: Hi, love.
1:51
SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Dear Divorce Diary, the podcast helping divorcees go beyond talk therapy to process your grief, find the healing you crave, and build back your confidence.
2:01
SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Don Wiggins, a therapist, coach, integrative healer, and divorcee.
2:07
SPEAKER_00: Join me for a fresh approach to healing grief and building your confidence after divorce.
2:20
SPEAKER_03: On to the show.
2:25
SPEAKER_03: Like, I don't know.
2:27
SPEAKER_03: What?
2:28
SPEAKER_03: I said so now I might feel like I'm in my head and I've got to edit myself.
2:31
SPEAKER_03: But anyway, let us know how you feel.
2:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, no, I think it's a group, I think it's a it's a it's a T it's a it's a conversation, right?
2:38
SPEAKER_01: Like there's no urgency to make this decision.
2:40
SPEAKER_02: It's yeah, yeah, yeah.
2:41
SPEAKER_01: It's conversation.
2:43
SPEAKER_01: That you're hearing happen live.
2:45
SPEAKER_03: Anyway, we got an A last week for explicit, so I'm very excited.
2:49
SPEAKER_03: Absolutely, absolutely.
2:51
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
2:52
SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, so this week's episode is beyond exciting.
2:56
SPEAKER_01: It's something we've been really needing to record for a very long time and just haven't done it justice yet.
3:01
SPEAKER_01: We've touched on it here or there, but this is going to be a two-part series on how to understand what the see I want to curse right here.
3:08
SPEAKER_01: What the F you need.
3:12
SPEAKER_01: Just feels right.
3:14
SPEAKER_01: Um, what you need in this season of life.
3:17
SPEAKER_01: I think that one of the complaints about the world of wellness in general, right?
3:23
SPEAKER_01: Big blanket wellness, whether it's physical wellness, mental or emotional wellness, you name it, is that there is a lot of information.
3:30
SPEAKER_01: There are a lot of products, there are a lot of providers, but how do I know what I actually need based on what I'm actually experiencing?
3:36
SPEAKER_01: And how do I know when I need it?
3:39
SPEAKER_01: And I think it's a very overwhelming inquiry for people who are already just beyond overwhelmed.
3:46
SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna unpack in two parts.
3:48
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna do the first half today, we're gonna do the next half next week to have this sort of full and complete, beautiful look at is my healing plan appropriate for, big enough for what I'm carrying?
4:01
SPEAKER_01: And man, this is gonna be detailed, nuanced, down to the every little detail, right, of what is worth considering.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: There's going to be a checklist, which we will probably put in the show notes, right?
4:11
SPEAKER_01: I'm thinking we may host it somewhere so you click to it versus copy and paste out of the show notes, but we'll solve that problem later this week.
4:21
SPEAKER_02: Yes.
4:22
SPEAKER_01: But there will be a checklist for you to actually look at and tally up like where you're at and what you need.
4:28
SPEAKER_01: Cool?
4:29
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
4:29
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
4:30
SPEAKER_01: All right.
4:31
SPEAKER_01: So what's that Taylor Swift song where she is it Taylor Swift who talks about band-aids on a gunshot wound?
4:38
SPEAKER_01: Are those Taylor Swift lyrics?
4:40
SPEAKER_01: I have no idea.
4:40
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, band-aids don't fix bullet holes.
4:43
SPEAKER_01: That's it.
4:44
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:45
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:46
SPEAKER_01: So I think a lot of times in life in general, that's just sort of where we've ended up, right?
4:52
SPEAKER_01: Is we are profoundly bleeding from multiple gunshot wounds, and we've got these really cute Welly band-aids, and they're adorbs, but they're just not doing the trick.
5:03
SPEAKER_01: So minor hot pink.
5:05
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: I mean, there's so many cute designs, the whole thing, you know.
5:10
SPEAKER_01: But let's dig in to how to know, right, what you're experiencing and what you need.
5:16
SPEAKER_01: All right.
5:17
SPEAKER_01: This is an eight-point checklist that we're going to unpack.
5:19
SPEAKER_01: So today we're going to go through the first four.
5:23
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to outline what all eight are so that we just sort of have a framework of what we're going to accomplish today, what we're going to put to next week, and then we'll break down the first four.
5:32
SPEAKER_01: Cool.
5:33
SPEAKER_01: So the first one is understanding what am I actually carrying.
5:38
SPEAKER_01: So because before we decide what we need, we have to accurately name the scope of what happened.
5:43
SPEAKER_01: So this first chunk is going to be like really analyzing, okay, what are we actually dealing with here?
5:49
SPEAKER_01: What needs to be addressed?
5:51
SPEAKER_01: The second one is am I safe and stable enough for deeper healing?
5:57
SPEAKER_01: Because this is something I think gets missed a lot.
6:00
SPEAKER_01: Sometimes the next right intervention is actually more stabilization, not excavation.
6:05
SPEAKER_01: And so for people who have done EMDR and they've said it didn't work for them, or um, you know, people who are really struggling to let go of things, often it's because they need more stabilization work.
6:17
SPEAKER_01: Um, the third part of the checklist is do I have an information problem?
6:22
SPEAKER_01: Do I need more information?
6:23
SPEAKER_01: Or do I have an integration problem?
6:25
SPEAKER_01: I don't know how to actually apply or live from this information I have.
6:32
SPEAKER_01: The fourth one is my current dose of support big enough, right?
6:36
SPEAKER_01: Like forget whether or not what you're doing is technically good.
6:39
SPEAKER_01: Do you have enough of it?
6:41
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna get in the weeds about that.
6:43
SPEAKER_01: And then next week we're gonna unpack these next four, which is do I have the right tools for the actual wound?
6:50
SPEAKER_01: Because not every problem is solved by the same modality.
6:53
SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna unpack, you know, what are the tools for the job?
6:57
SPEAKER_01: What are the problems and the what are the tools that match the problem?
7:01
SPEAKER_01: The next one is the person helping me skilled enough for where I've been and where I'm going.
7:08
SPEAKER_01: So really helping you to understand if a practitioner or the people you're working with have actually the skills to address your current problem.
7:17
SPEAKER_01: Uh, number seven is what is my trajectory?
7:21
SPEAKER_01: So helping you understand, and this is a question we've gotten asked a lot, a lot, but how to know am I healing?
7:32
SPEAKER_01: Is it working?
7:33
SPEAKER_01: Right?
7:34
SPEAKER_01: Is what I'm doing working and where am I in the healing journey?
7:37
SPEAKER_01: I think people really struggle to grapple with am I healing?
7:41
SPEAKER_01: Is it working?
7:41
SPEAKER_01: And am I gonna be done soon?
7:43
SPEAKER_01: And how will I know when I'm done?
7:45
SPEAKER_01: And you know, that kind of thing.
7:46
SPEAKER_01: So we're really gonna dig into that.
7:48
SPEAKER_01: And then the last part of the checklist is what is it costing me to stay under-resourced?
7:54
SPEAKER_01: Like really taking a look at if I haven't addressed these first seven pieces of the checklist, right?
8:01
SPEAKER_01: If the the interventions aren't accurate, if I'm not treating the right things, if blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
8:07
SPEAKER_01: Like what happens next for me if uh the treatment doesn't match the problem?
8:13
SPEAKER_01: So that will be how we wrap up next week.
8:17
SPEAKER_01: All right, scrolling back to the top.
8:20
SPEAKER_01: Any reactions, initial like responses or reactions to this where we're headed the next two weeks?
9:18
SPEAKER_04: I'm just I'm excited.
9:19
SPEAKER_04: I'm excited that this mu this is this is gonna be a really comprehensive series for them, for our listeners.
9:27
SPEAKER_04: Tactical ladies.
9:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like like really tactical, like this is like it's gonna demystify some hair when a curse.
9:36
SPEAKER_01: Shit.
9:37
SPEAKER_05: It's gonna demystify some.
9:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:41
SPEAKER_01: Uh welcome to my inside my world.
9:46
SPEAKER_01: Um, how about for you, Tifferdoodle?
9:49
SPEAKER_03: What do you, what are your initial I'm excited because I think that a lot of women struggle with this on knowing when to get the help, what they exactly need help with.
9:59
SPEAKER_03: And like we say all the time, the divorce is a symptom.
10:02
SPEAKER_03: And that could not be more truthful.
10:05
SPEAKER_03: That it's not just your divorce.
10:07
SPEAKER_03: It's like you have a ton of holes or gunshot wounds that you have been hemorrhaging for years and just trying to hide behind bad decisions, self-destruction, addiction, all kinds of fun stuff.
10:21
SPEAKER_03: Attachment styles.
10:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, we were we were kicking that around this morning, right?
10:25
SPEAKER_01: I think it's a whole it's a whole different episode series, but divorce typically is some combination of attachment wounding, addiction, and um cheating, right?
10:37
SPEAKER_01: Or betrayal related issues.
10:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
10:40
SPEAKER_01: Um, but that's a different episode for a different day.
10:43
SPEAKER_01: All right.
10:45
SPEAKER_01: Checklist segment one.
10:48
SPEAKER_01: What am I actually carrying?
10:50
SPEAKER_01: So I want to read this to you.
10:53
SPEAKER_01: Reading a checklist is sort of boring.
10:56
SPEAKER_01: So to unboringify it.
10:59
SPEAKER_01: Can you cuss on everyone?
11:03
SPEAKER_01: Somebody else.
11:04
SPEAKER_01: To unboringify the checklist, I want you to pause for a moment, take a breath, drop into your body, and notice what your body says when I read each one.
11:15
SPEAKER_01: And maybe we'll chitty chat a little bit in between the ones, right?
11:18
SPEAKER_01: But so here we go.
11:20
SPEAKER_01: All right.
11:21
SPEAKER_01: I want you to somatically check anything that's true right now.
11:27
SPEAKER_01: And the importance of understanding that we've sort of talked about as a team is like for most of our healing journeys, we were struggling to heal things we hadn't had words for yet, right?
11:41
SPEAKER_01: We didn't realize there were problems yet.
11:42
SPEAKER_01: And when you don't sometimes when you don't have a diagnosis or realize something is a problem, it makes healing the thing that much more hard, vague.
11:52
SPEAKER_01: Like the the intervention isn't as precise as it could be when we can really define what the problem is, right?
11:59
SPEAKER_01: So here we go.
12:00
SPEAKER_01: All right.
12:00
SPEAKER_01: First thing deep breath.
12:03
SPEAKER_01: I'm grieving the loss of my marriage or relationship.
12:08
SPEAKER_01: Check.
12:09
SPEAKER_01: All right.
12:10
SPEAKER_01: Number two, there was betrayal, infidelity, abandonment, abuse, addiction, coercion, chronic conflict, or some other significant relationship injury.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: Did I say addiction in there?
12:28
SPEAKER_01: You did.
12:29
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
12:32
SPEAKER_01: Could each of us say yes to this?
12:34
SPEAKER_01: I just yes, absolutely.
12:35
SPEAKER_04: All of the above?
12:36
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
12:37
SPEAKER_04: All of the above.
12:37
SPEAKER_04: So far.
12:38
SPEAKER_04: Yep, so far.
12:39
SPEAKER_01: I'm I'm on the good company, friends.
12:44
SPEAKER_01: All right, number three, feeling into it with your body.
12:47
SPEAKER_01: My attachment system feels activated.
12:51
SPEAKER_01: So meaning, I obsess or panic or cling or avoid or check frequently, like repetitively, right?
13:03
SPEAKER_01: Pursue, withdraw, or struggle to let go.
13:09
SPEAKER_02: I'm three for three.
13:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:11
unknown: Okay.
13:12
SPEAKER_03: We're with you.
13:13
SPEAKER_04: We're with you.
13:14
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
13:15
SPEAKER_04: I was like, I'm I'm a clean and withdraw at the same time.
13:19
SPEAKER_04: I'm with you.
13:20
SPEAKER_04: I'm with you.
13:20
SPEAKER_04: Okay.
13:22
SPEAKER_03: Okay, go ahead.
13:25
SPEAKER_01: Makes relationships a wild ride.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: Umce the relationship crisis or divorce, right?
13:34
SPEAKER_01: So my sleep is affected, my appetite, my energy, the physical tension I'm carrying.
13:39
SPEAKER_01: Did you know that muscle tension is unprocessed emotion?
13:43
SPEAKER_01: Digestion, hormones, pain, headaches, etc., my body feels different.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: I would have had to say I would have said no to that one, but only because my body was already struggling with all of those things leading up to that moment, right?
14:02
SPEAKER_01: I think the divorce, my childhood and the divorce or the marriage had already activated all of that.
14:08
SPEAKER_01: So I think for a moment when we decided to get divorced, or for a moment, I actually had the tiniest bit of relief for those things, but trust me, it all came crashing back very, very quickly.
14:19
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, your girl had a six-pack for the first time post-divorce.
14:22
SPEAKER_03: Like I, but I wasn't eating.
14:24
SPEAKER_03: Like it definitely wasn't like I was thin, but it wasn't like a healthy thin, if that made sense.
14:28
SPEAKER_03: Like it was it was bad.
14:30
SPEAKER_03: And then I was using weed to sleep every night.
14:32
SPEAKER_03: So I was not sleeping if I was not heavily high.
14:36
SPEAKER_01: I think that's a story for so many humans, let alone humans going through divorce crisis.
14:41
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
14:43
unknown: Yeah.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
14:44
SPEAKER_01: The next thing is I'm dealing with legal custody, housing, career, or financial stress at the same time.
14:55
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
14:56
SPEAKER_02: I left my marriage without a job and moved to a new city.
15:01
SPEAKER_02: I have no single mother.
15:02
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you know what I'm saying?
15:03
SPEAKER_02: Like I signed up for a moment.
15:05
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I quickly quit my job and started a business, which was uh, you know, like a month after I did that, I was like, what have I done?
15:14
SPEAKER_01: Um but yeah, very often, right, you're moving, you're dealing with legal things, like the legal system right there is like its own trauma within a trauma, right?
15:23
SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, anyways.
15:26
SPEAKER_01: Gosh.
15:27
SPEAKER_01: And then the, you know, when you have little kids, like the schedule, like, oh my goodness, there's so much.
15:31
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
15:32
SPEAKER_01: All right, next one.
15:34
SPEAKER_01: My identity has been disrupted.
15:36
SPEAKER_01: I genuinely am not in touch with who I am or what I want anymore.
15:42
SPEAKER_03: I told the story about the eggs.
15:43
SPEAKER_03: Like I said, I started crying at the restaurant because I didn't know how I wanted my eggs.
15:47
SPEAKER_03: I literally had no identity outside of myself in most relationships I had been in, specifically.
15:54
SPEAKER_03: Oh, yeah.
15:55
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
15:55
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
15:55
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
15:56
SPEAKER_03: I molded to whatever their life was.
15:59
SPEAKER_03: So having a become Stevens on my own was so foreign.
16:02
SPEAKER_03: Like I didn't even know what to do with my hands.
16:04
SPEAKER_03: Like it was a lot.
16:05
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
16:06
SPEAKER_01: I love that phrase.
16:07
SPEAKER_01: Uh okay.
16:08
SPEAKER_01: I'm parenting children who are also struggling with the transition.
16:14
SPEAKER_01: Managing other people.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
16:16
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
16:17
SPEAKER_03: I can genuinely say that was I think you resonate joy with that more because my daughter was so young and he was gone most of the time anyway, that it was just like a geographical change for her.
16:26
SPEAKER_03: I don't know that it was that crazy.
16:29
SPEAKER_04: The divorce results.
16:30
SPEAKER_04: Right.
16:30
SPEAKER_04: And then so it's like navigating, and I was I tried so hard to shield them.
16:35
SPEAKER_04: Like I was always honest with them, but I tried to shield them from it.
16:38
SPEAKER_04: Like he still came over and ate dinner with them.
16:43
SPEAKER_04: And then like I had errands to run and leave.
16:46
SPEAKER_04: So like I still saw him every day.
16:49
SPEAKER_04: And when, you know, he would make little comments and blame it on me.
16:53
SPEAKER_04: Like there was just so much to make.
16:56
SPEAKER_04: Um, and then like collapsing on the floor with all three of them in my arms because when is daddy coming home?
17:02
SPEAKER_04: You know, like it was it was definitely, definitely a journey.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: All right.
17:10
SPEAKER_01: Let us lean into the next one, which is I'm carrying older wounds that this divorce has ripped back open.
17:17
SPEAKER_01: And for me, I would have just been like, Me, me, me, pick me, it's me.
17:21
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
17:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
17:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
17:24
SPEAKER_01: Which is part of just what makes it so much to deal with.
17:29
SPEAKER_01: Um, okay, next one.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: I've lost friendships, family relationships, community, traditions, or belonging along with the marriage.
17:41
SPEAKER_04: I will say that that I I think this was the um the demise of my marriage was probably the moment where I truly started seeing my parental figures more clearer.
17:59
SPEAKER_04: You know, like um, I called my mom at 2 a.m., like crying, pacing up and down my driveway.
18:07
SPEAKER_04: And all she could really tell me was, well, I've always been cherished.
18:11
SPEAKER_04: I don't know what to say.
18:12
SPEAKER_04: It's like not that.
18:16
SPEAKER_04: That's not that, not that.
18:17
SPEAKER_04: So um I think it was just I started to really unpack that was such a pivotal moment for me.
18:24
SPEAKER_04: I truly started to unpack, like, I've never been chosen.
18:29
SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
18:30
SPEAKER_04: Like this, there's there's this is the foundation that I had to work with.
18:34
SPEAKER_01: And so maybe you never had stable family relationships, but then in that moment it feels like you're losing family relationships at the same time.
18:41
SPEAKER_01: Even though maybe nothing technically actually changed.
18:45
SPEAKER_01: Never changed, right?
18:46
SPEAKER_01: Scales are falling from the eyes and loss is piling on.
18:50
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
18:51
SPEAKER_04: So yeah.
18:52
SPEAKER_04: Wow.
18:52
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
18:53
SPEAKER_03: I lost my entire community.
18:55
SPEAKER_03: So my entire way of life and everything that I had known in my marriage was gone.
18:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:01
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
19:02
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
19:02
SPEAKER_01: This next one was a massive one for me, which is I'm trying to function professionally while privately falling apart.
19:11
SPEAKER_01: Because you started a business.
19:13
SPEAKER_01: You well, I think just being a therapist going through something is like um, but yeah, in general.
19:21
SPEAKER_01: And I think I I don't know.
19:23
SPEAKER_01: I mean, I would guess that most people struggle with this, but um felt very much.
19:28
SPEAKER_03: I had to start working.
19:29
SPEAKER_03: And I know that there's a lot of women that are in that position where then I had to go from being a stay-at-home mom to having to provide and work.
19:36
SPEAKER_03: And so it was like adjusting to not being at home with my kid, her being in a daycare, somebody else watching my kid during the day, like all that guilt, all that shame.
19:45
SPEAKER_03: Like maybe I should have just stayed.
19:46
SPEAKER_03: I mean, there's a million things that are just like going through your head at that point.
19:51
SPEAKER_01: And then the next one is really just notice what your body says here.
19:57
SPEAKER_01: I'm lonely enough that I sometimes consider returning to relationships or situations I know aren't good for me.
20:05
SPEAKER_01: So loneliness as a huge part of the problem that needs to be identified and solved for.
20:12
SPEAKER_03: I would have substituted relationships with substances.
20:16
SPEAKER_03: Because I never wanted to go back to the marriage.
20:19
SPEAKER_03: But I wanted to go back to old habits to make me feel better.
20:23
SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
20:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:27
SPEAKER_01: Uh okay.
20:28
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I'm trying to date or build new relationships while I'm still highly activated by the old one.
20:36
SPEAKER_01: This is um a healing red flag.
20:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:39
SPEAKER_01: We talk about red flags in dating, right?
20:41
SPEAKER_01: But it's like, oh, do we talk enough about this red flag?
20:44
SPEAKER_01: Like as uh yeah, part of your healing journey.
20:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
20:48
SPEAKER_01: Okay, and here's the last one in this section, which is I've been struggling for months or years rather than experiencing this as short-term disruption.
20:57
SPEAKER_01: And the importance of that is that when we've been dealing with a problem that has become chronic and it's become almost normal and it's just persisted for so long, we very often lose the plot, right?
21:09
SPEAKER_01: We don't realize the downstream effects it's had on our health, our mental health, our overall capacity.
21:15
SPEAKER_01: Um, and so when something's acute, like, oh, I have the flu, right?
21:19
SPEAKER_01: It's like seven to 10 days and you're through it, versus, oh, I have fibromyalgia and I deal with chronic pain every day, right?
21:26
SPEAKER_01: It takes a very different toll on the nervous system and on your way of living.
21:32
SPEAKER_01: So I think that was 13.
21:34
SPEAKER_01: Is that 13, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13?
21:39
SPEAKER_01: That was 13.
21:40
SPEAKER_01: So just get a sense, right?
21:42
SPEAKER_01: Again, there's gonna be like a tangible checklist that you can look at and you can sort of circle or deal with this.
21:48
SPEAKER_01: But just notice of those 13, how many did you resonate with?
21:54
SPEAKER_01: Most, some, all, right?
21:57
SPEAKER_01: Because not all of these things need the same scope of treatment, you know, and really having uh an understanding of everything you're grappling with.
22:06
SPEAKER_01: I think right there, just give yourself some grace, right?
22:10
SPEAKER_01: Just realizing, like, see, I want to curse again.
22:15
SPEAKER_01: Do it.
22:16
SPEAKER_01: Dang.
22:18
SPEAKER_01: I'm just trying it on, trying it on.
22:20
SPEAKER_01: Um doesn't feel as satisfying.
22:23
SPEAKER_01: Um like, wow, you've really got a lot on your shoulders, love, right?
22:27
SPEAKER_01: Like a profound amount of stuff on your shoulders.
22:30
SPEAKER_01: Profound.
22:31
SPEAKER_01: And I think when we're in survival mode, we sort of lose track of that sometimes.
22:35
SPEAKER_01: It's like, let me just get to the next day and the next day and the next day.
22:38
SPEAKER_01: Let me just get through this minute.
22:41
SPEAKER_01: And really not having the capacity to see the whole picture.
22:45
SPEAKER_01: All right.
22:46
SPEAKER_01: Our next segment of the checklist is.
22:50
SPEAKER_01: Am I safe and stable enough for deeper healing?
22:54
SPEAKER_01: So, just as a point of reference or point of education, as a trauma-informed therapist or as a trauma-informed team, we really truly understand in practice that before we can process, we have to stabilize.
23:12
SPEAKER_01: So we're looking at how disassociated is this person?
23:15
SPEAKER_01: How much support do they have?
23:17
SPEAKER_01: How much sleep have they gotten?
23:19
SPEAKER_01: What is their capacity to tolerate the painful emotions we're going to ask them to feel and process?
23:26
SPEAKER_01: And very often, this is what breaks down in most therapeutic settings.
23:32
SPEAKER_01: Most therapeutic settings just don't have a good enough handle on stabilization before deeper processing work.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: So that that's just like a a bug in your ear if you're trying to pick a therapist or program or uh, you know, trying to be in solution that we really have to look at this.
23:50
SPEAKER_01: All right.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: So because sometimes we have to focus on stabilization, let's go through this list of stabilizing elements and see how you're doing.
24:03
SPEAKER_01: All right, first one.
24:05
SPEAKER_01: I can reliably eat, sleep, hydrate, work, parent, and complete basic daily tasks.
24:11
SPEAKER_01: I can reliably eat, sleep, hydrate, work, parent, and complete basic tasks.
24:18
SPEAKER_01: Now, this is an interesting one because knowing what I know now, like today I can say yes to those things.
24:25
SPEAKER_04: Right.
24:26
SPEAKER_04: This isn't like eating a bag of chips on the sofa.
24:29
SPEAKER_04: This is like nutritious meals and that nourish your body.
24:32
SPEAKER_04: This is And we're not talking about five hours of sleep at night.
24:36
SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
24:36
SPEAKER_01: This is a comprehensive clear list of And again, not needing to have two glasses of wine and a gummy in order to sleep, right?
24:44
SPEAKER_01: So it's like, yeah, can you do these things?
24:48
SPEAKER_01: Um and are they doing the trick?
24:51
SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
24:52
SPEAKER_01: Like, are you getting rest?
24:53
SPEAKER_01: Are you nourished?
24:54
SPEAKER_01: Are you able to parent um and work?
24:59
SPEAKER_01: Number two, I have ways to regulate myself when I become highly activated.
25:03
SPEAKER_01: And again, we're talking about regulation or support, right?
25:08
SPEAKER_01: Not numbing.
25:09
SPEAKER_01: So I have ways to regulate myself.
25:11
SPEAKER_03: We're not talking about food, binging TV, scrolling on your phone, having a drink.
25:18
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
25:19
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:19
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
25:20
SPEAKER_01: So, and and some ways that maybe are still dissociative, but they're way better is like calling your friends or working out.
25:29
SPEAKER_01: I mean in the bathroom, you know?
25:31
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:31
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
25:33
SPEAKER_01: Um, okay.
25:34
SPEAKER_01: The third one is I can experience difficult emotions without completely losing access to myself.
25:42
SPEAKER_01: So meaning I can sit with a painful emotion, I can let it come, I can let it go, it doesn't get stuck, I don't ruminate it on it, I don't, I don't um descend into the depths of hell or get swallowed by panic.
25:54
SPEAKER_01: What else would you say happens when people can't experience difficult emotions?
25:59
SPEAKER_01: You know, they click into parts, right?
26:01
SPEAKER_01: Dissociative parts, firefighters and manager parts, yeah.
26:06
SPEAKER_01: But lose perspective, right?
26:07
SPEAKER_01: Get completely swallowed by emotions or completely shut down.
26:12
SPEAKER_01: All right.
26:13
SPEAKER_01: Next question on the checklist.
26:15
SPEAKER_01: I have at least one safe person I can contact when things become overwhelming.
26:21
SPEAKER_03: I would categorize what a safe person is because I think for me it was someone that can actually hold space and listen rather than egging on my bad behavior or kind of going into this doom spiral trauma bond bullshit.
26:33
SPEAKER_03: Do you know what I mean?
26:34
SPEAKER_03: Like someone that can actually hold space for you and witness your pain and just allow you to be instead of trying to fix you.
26:40
SPEAKER_04: Uh-huh.
26:41
SPEAKER_04: Because I didn't have a lot of things.
26:42
SPEAKER_04: Or like that.
26:44
SPEAKER_04: Not even just fix, but like um, you know, like trying to distract or okay, well, let's go get drunk, or like um yeah.
26:52
SPEAKER_04: Dust constantly um looking for the positive, or well, at least, you know, at least you found out before you got a disease, you know.
27:03
SPEAKER_01: All those things are always trying to say.
27:05
SPEAKER_01: That's yeah.
27:07
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
27:07
SPEAKER_01: This one sometimes is tough, especially early on, but my home environment feels physically and emotionally safe enough for recovery.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: I think early on, right, a lot of times women are still living with their partners, uh, and that makes it very hard to feel resourced and stable.
27:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
27:26
SPEAKER_01: So very often that is something that has to be addressed before being able to do deeper work.
27:32
SPEAKER_01: Okay, next one.
27:34
SPEAKER_01: I have periods during the week.
27:36
SPEAKER_01: This one's laughable.
27:37
SPEAKER_01: I have periods during the week when my nervous system genuinely calms down.
27:41
SPEAKER_01: I don't think that anyone in modern when I was drunk.
27:46
SPEAKER_01: When you were drunk, yeah.
27:48
SPEAKER_03: Do you know what I mean though?
27:50
SPEAKER_03: Like I know, like I was activated all the time.
27:52
SPEAKER_03: I woke up, yeah, I had anxiety, and I would literally be buzzing all day.
27:57
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
27:58
SPEAKER_03: Like, yeah, yeah.
27:59
SPEAKER_03: I don't know what it was like to be relaxed back then or at peaceful.
28:02
SPEAKER_03: That was not any sort of thing that I grappled with or understood.
28:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
28:08
SPEAKER_03: I was distracted from the time I woke up to the time I went to bed.
28:11
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
28:12
SPEAKER_04: I don't even know if I could have described what peace would have felt like.
28:15
SPEAKER_04: No, I don't, yeah.
28:16
SPEAKER_04: I don't I think recognized.
28:19
SPEAKER_03: Tiffany said something noise in your head.
28:21
SPEAKER_03: Like there were constantly just noise in my head.
28:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like noise.
28:24
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
28:25
SPEAKER_01: Ti Tiffany said something to me recently about, you know, perspective or perception on activation.
28:30
SPEAKER_01: And I um it just really helped something land for me.
28:34
SPEAKER_01: Like, I don't think most women realize how overstimulated and um overwhelmed I really think it's that frog in a boiling pot of water.
28:45
SPEAKER_01: We just don't even realize how bad it is.
28:49
SPEAKER_03: Until it's not, yeah.
28:51
SPEAKER_01: And it's normal.
28:52
SPEAKER_01: So it's like, no, this is just life, right?
28:55
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, it's fascinating.
28:58
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
28:59
SPEAKER_01: Next one.
29:00
SPEAKER_01: I'm not spending most of my time in fight, flight, freeze, fawn, collapse or obsessive rumination.
29:13
SPEAKER_01: So fawn is that human pretzel thing we do, right?
29:16
SPEAKER_02: Where we people please.
29:18
SPEAKER_01: Make ourselves if you struggle with people pleasing, know that in the fight, flight, freeze, in the continuum of trauma-based activation, we've sort of broadly accepted that fight, flight, freeze, fawn is considered trauma activation or nervous system activation beyond outside of a window of tolerance, right?
29:40
SPEAKER_01: You're out, you're well beyond your window of tolerance in your body-mind.
29:44
SPEAKER_01: And people pleasing is typically falls under fawning.
29:50
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
29:51
SPEAKER_01: All right.
29:52
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I can tell when I'm becoming overwhelmed, and I know what helps.
29:57
SPEAKER_01: That again isn't a substance.
30:01
SPEAKER_03: I think that second part gets everybody tripped up because that wasn't a real thing.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: I will say I think I did better with that based on what I understood at the time.
30:14
SPEAKER_01: If I had had this checklist at the time, my answers would probably be very different.
30:19
SPEAKER_01: But I did immerse myself.
30:20
SPEAKER_01: I had the luxury, and part of it was because it was my profession, right?
30:24
SPEAKER_01: But I had the luxury of immersing myself.
30:26
SPEAKER_01: But I was in 12-step meetings and yoga, and I made sure I got massage.
30:31
SPEAKER_01: Like I was doing a lot, walks on the beach every day.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: I was doing a lot to get into my body, and I did know I called friends a lot.
30:41
SPEAKER_01: I was in a women's group.
30:45
SPEAKER_01: I piled on a lot of things.
30:47
SPEAKER_01: So I did start to connect the dots about what pretty early on, and it's probably what saved me, right?
30:52
SPEAKER_01: But um feeling overwhelmed and then knowing what helped or what I needed.
30:57
SPEAKER_01: And a lot of times then I would still use like calling someone to process, but I wasn't actually feeling, I was just vomiting, all the things.
31:08
SPEAKER_01: But the beach walks in the UI.
31:10
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
31:11
SPEAKER_04: I got on, I would get on Marco Polo and just like Yeah, go on and on.
31:16
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
31:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:17
SPEAKER_01: Which I understand today was parts, right?
31:19
SPEAKER_01: Like dissociative parts.
31:20
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
31:21
SPEAKER_04: That couldn't mean to be heard, validated, seen, but yeah.
31:26
SPEAKER_01: And the last one in this section, the healing work I'm doing leaves me more resourced over time, not repeatedly blown open with nowhere to put what surfaces.
31:38
SPEAKER_01: Have either of you had healing experiences with providers who had you unpack trauma, but then you didn't have the tools, or can you tell a story?
31:50
SPEAKER_01: Can you think of a friend, or like, is do you think this is a common experience where someone unpacked?
31:56
SPEAKER_01: I actually experienced this at church a year or two ago, where someone was asked to share their traumatic experience with the group, and they got up and started sharing it, and you could tell they weren't well resourced enough to speak about it publicly, and became very, very disintegrated and just like it was very disturbing to watch and couldn't regulate it all.
32:19
SPEAKER_01: And, you know, there was like it was it was very hard to watch, right?
32:24
SPEAKER_01: So have you ever seen this happen where someone is processing something deeply painful and they don't have the tools or the resources or the support system to then help them carry what they've unpacked or witnessed in themselves?
32:38
SPEAKER_03: I mean, as stupid as it sounds, that was my experience in talk therapy.
32:42
SPEAKER_01: No, I don't want to.
32:42
SPEAKER_03: My first talk therapist that like came when I came out about my addiction at 16.
32:47
SPEAKER_03: It was like, cool, you have an addiction, but there was nothing then that was done to unpack all of the shit, right?
32:52
SPEAKER_03: But it was also my own capacity at that point because like I had told you before, I had people had wanted me to do EMDR back then when I was 16.
33:00
SPEAKER_03: And I'm like, there's no way.
33:01
SPEAKER_03: Like I will collapse.
33:03
SPEAKER_03: Like I was not well resourced enough.
33:05
SPEAKER_03: I was not, and again, we talk about this in working with minors, right?
33:08
SPEAKER_03: About doing this, putting them right back into the same situation with parents that aren't stable.
33:12
SPEAKER_03: Like it's the same shit, right?
33:14
SPEAKER_03: So, like again, that safety and security is so important when you're seeking help because if you're sending somebody right back into the frying pan, it's kind of like, ooh, you know?
33:22
SPEAKER_01: Well, this whole section, right, about stabilization and support is why we work with women in a program.
33:28
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
33:29
SPEAKER_01: As a team.
33:31
SPEAKER_01: Because, right, like rolling into this next cohort, even there are going to be four or five team members and then all the women, right?
33:38
SPEAKER_01: The the amount of support is profound because most of us don't have, even if we have a support system, even if we have family members or friends, they don't, those people aren't well resourced enough to hold the depth of what we're trying to heal, right?
33:55
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, totally.
33:59
SPEAKER_01: Because of section one, right?
34:01
SPEAKER_01: It's so complex.
34:02
SPEAKER_01: There are so many things we were trying to tackle at once.
34:04
SPEAKER_01: And your average lay person, your average family member, your average friend group, like they just don't have that level of capacity.
34:12
SPEAKER_05: So yeah.
34:13
SPEAKER_01: So if you've ever had that experience where someone's asked you to process, you know, um, abuse inside your marriage or, you know, sexual abuse, or, you know, anything and um and pushed you to talk about it before you had the capacity to do so.
34:29
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and then it causes all sorts of dissociation, decompensation, destabilization.
34:33
SPEAKER_01: I know that's a bunch of gobbledygook jargon, right?
34:36
SPEAKER_01: But that's that's what happens when we yeah.
34:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
34:40
SPEAKER_01: If it F's you up after.
34:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:43
SPEAKER_01: I mean, we expect healing to be uncomfortable, but it's not supposed to be destabilizing.
34:48
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:48
SPEAKER_01: I mean, for more than a couple hours.
34:51
SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
34:52
SPEAKER_01: Like a couple hours, yeah.
34:53
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:53
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
34:54
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
34:54
SPEAKER_01: So if many of those things were a no, then the emphasis needs to be on what needs to be built underneath me before my system can safely let go of anything, right?
35:05
SPEAKER_01: Safety first, then capacity, then deeper processing.
35:08
SPEAKER_01: That's the order of things.
35:10
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
35:10
SPEAKER_01: Number three, do I have an information problem or an integration problem?
35:14
SPEAKER_01: So now let's just sort of walk through this one.
35:17
SPEAKER_01: We can go a little more quickly, I think.
35:19
SPEAKER_01: Do I need more information?
35:21
SPEAKER_01: Do I understand what I'm experiencing?
35:24
SPEAKER_01: Do I need more information or do I need help living out the things that I have learned or begun to understand about myself?
35:32
SPEAKER_01: And listen, I think that the information integration question is one that gets revisited at every stage of recovery, if that makes any sense.
35:41
SPEAKER_01: Because like today, I am now, you know, if I'm learning a new modality or I'm developing a new skill, right?
35:48
SPEAKER_01: It's information first, it's integration second, it's information.
35:51
SPEAKER_01: Like that's the cadence of growth, right?
35:53
SPEAKER_01: Is we start with information and then we figure out how to integrate.
35:56
SPEAKER_01: So for today, do you understand your attachment style?
36:03
SPEAKER_01: At least at a basic level, anxious, avoidant.
36:07
SPEAKER_01: There are nuances of anxious and avoidant.
36:10
SPEAKER_01: They're like sub-attachment styles, right?
36:12
SPEAKER_01: And then there's disorganized, which is a combination of both.
36:17
SPEAKER_01: Do you know what boundaries are?
36:18
SPEAKER_01: That's number two.
36:20
SPEAKER_01: That is a whole episode unto itself because most people think boundaries are an attempt to control somebody else's behavior and they are not.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: Right.
36:28
SPEAKER_01: They are self-caring choices, they are ways of managing your own needs in life and capacity.
36:35
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, boundaries are self-carrying choices.
36:38
SPEAKER_01: So do you really understand what a boundary is and how to set one?
36:43
SPEAKER_01: Uh, do you understand codependency?
36:45
SPEAKER_01: That also is its whole own episode.
36:49
SPEAKER_01: Do you understand sort of that interconnectivity between victim, rescuer, persecutor, and how if the people that you are around are not okay, you're not okay.
37:00
SPEAKER_01: Um, do you need to manage other people's emotions and behaviors in order for you to feel stable?
37:05
SPEAKER_01: People pleasing is a function of codependency, right?
37:07
SPEAKER_01: Like, do you really understand uh the roots and wings of codependency?
37:16
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I've learned about trauma and the nervous system.
37:20
SPEAKER_01: I know some things about trauma and the nervous system.
37:23
SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of people can say yes to that one these days, which is fantastic.
37:27
SPEAKER_01: Number five, I've listened to hundreds of hours of podcasts, which means you probably are pretty well informed, right?
37:35
SPEAKER_01: Uh the next one is I've read the books.
37:38
SPEAKER_01: There are so many great books out there these days about trauma, healing, recovery, you name it.
37:44
SPEAKER_01: Or listen to the books, right?
37:46
SPEAKER_01: Either way.
37:46
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I can explain exactly why I choose unavailable people.
37:52
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and I would argue like I can spot an unavailable person, not just based on like, you know how when we start to date, we're like, no, I picked a completely different person on paper, but then the roots of it ended up being identical.
38:05
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, they're the same person.
38:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
38:07
SPEAKER_01: So it's like, I can explain exactly why I choose unavailable people, and I can spot it beyond, no, this one has a job, or no, this one still talks to his children or whatever.
38:15
SPEAKER_01: Like it's goes deeper than like these sort of surface level things that we look at.
38:18
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
38:19
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I know my childhood patterns.
38:22
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I can intellectually explain why my marriage, how my marriage unfolded the way it did.
38:28
SPEAKER_01: And the final one is I frequently know what I should do, but I can't consistently do it when I'm triggered.
38:40
SPEAKER_01: I'm really curious where our listeners land in this section, right?
38:44
SPEAKER_01: Because a lot of these concepts are super complex.
38:48
SPEAKER_01: And sometimes you can't fully even understand them until you're doing the work to integrate them.
38:53
SPEAKER_01: And um that's an interesting phenomenon.
38:57
SPEAKER_01: But so some of these things, you know, maybe you do need a little more learning around, a little more information around.
39:04
SPEAKER_01: But I also think a lot of these things, if you have at least an entry-level amount of information, most people need help with integration, how to actually tackle codependency or how to actually beyond setting a boundary, maintain a boundary or well, it's moving again, like in IFS, it's moving from that awareness into action and then also having a space for people to hold you accountable.
39:30
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
39:31
SPEAKER_03: What is the key to integration?
39:33
SPEAKER_03: It's accountability, it's community, it's proper support.
39:38
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, and the capacity to choose differently in correct.
39:42
SPEAKER_03: Capacity to be able to get to crossroads and go towards the growth instead of what's familiar.
39:47
SPEAKER_03: Yep.
39:47
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
39:49
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
39:50
SPEAKER_03: Yep.
39:51
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
39:52
SPEAKER_03: Shit's percolating.
39:54
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
39:55
unknown: Yeah.
39:56
SPEAKER_03: Do you know how many times we see that in our group, though, in our program and our thread of women saying, yes, like hold me accountable, ladies.
40:04
SPEAKER_03: I'm about to do this.
40:05
SPEAKER_03: Please stop me.
40:06
SPEAKER_03: Somebody stop me.
40:07
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
40:07
SPEAKER_03: Somebody wanting to have access to integration, right?
40:12
SPEAKER_01: Yes, to the increasing capacity for integration.
40:15
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
40:15
SPEAKER_03: I'm about to do something stupid.
40:17
SPEAKER_03: Please hold my hand so that I don't.
40:19
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
40:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
40:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
40:20
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
40:22
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
40:22
SPEAKER_01: Permission to tell a story for my weekend.
40:24
SPEAKER_01: It's intense.
40:26
SPEAKER_04: Um I would love to hear.
40:27
SPEAKER_04: I have not talked to you at all about your weekend.
40:29
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
40:30
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to keep it super brief.
40:31
SPEAKER_01: However, uh, I spent the weekend in Denver from the Women of Menopause Love Lounge, the other podcast that I co-host with them.
40:39
SPEAKER_01: And so I would say very similarly to the retreat that we did for our women in our program in Myrtle Beach a couple of months ago, this was a very similar concept, right?
40:48
SPEAKER_01: We've spent the year getting to know each other and working through a lot of stuff on Zoom or in Riverside.
40:56
SPEAKER_01: Um, we've gotten to know each other a lot on phone calls and FaceTimes, and you name it.
41:01
SPEAKER_01: Some of them have met each other in person here or there.
41:03
SPEAKER_01: But this was a, you know, three straight days dedicated to deepening those relationships with a bunch of people who do healing work, right?
41:10
SPEAKER_01: So oh man.
41:13
SPEAKER_01: And so I got to do some EMDR and obviously practice homeopathy.
41:17
SPEAKER_01: And I walked around with my Materia Medica all weekend, and that was just so much fun.
41:21
SPEAKER_01: But um, come Saturday morning, it was my turn to fall apart.
41:26
SPEAKER_01: And yeah, and um we enjoy space right now.
41:30
SPEAKER_01: We're like, I literally cried all weekend, which is very, very noteworthy.
41:35
SPEAKER_01: But Saturday morning it was my turn to tall to fall apart.
41:38
SPEAKER_01: And there is one of the ladies of the lounge that I'm particularly close with.
41:41
SPEAKER_01: This is not a secret, all the lounge ladies know it.
41:44
SPEAKER_01: And she was able to really, really hold me as I started to drop into emotion and the bubble went into my throat and all of the here comes my cursing shit.
41:55
SPEAKER_01: And um, so we're sitting around a table, right?
41:57
SPEAKER_01: And I could feel it all coming and I could feel all the parts start to talk inside my little brain.
42:03
SPEAKER_01: And I just locked eyes with her and I just said in probably a very young voice, I'm going to stay right here with you right now because if I look at them, I will lose it, right?
42:12
SPEAKER_01: Like I don't mean lose it like um fall apart.
42:16
SPEAKER_01: I mean I would lose access to the emotional wave that was going to move through me, right?
42:21
SPEAKER_01: I needed to allow all of that emotion to come up and move through.
42:25
SPEAKER_01: And then once I got to a certain point in that emotional process, then I could turn towards them and engage in a feedback loop, right?
42:33
SPEAKER_01: So right there, that's integration versus right.
42:36
SPEAKER_01: Like it's in that moment understanding what you need and being able to hold, like maintain that awareness, do the thing that's going to break the cycle.
42:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, what a ride.
42:48
SPEAKER_01: Super cool.
42:49
SPEAKER_01: I love that.
42:50
unknown: Yeah.
42:51
SPEAKER_01: And PS, I that would not have been available to me, right?
42:54
SPEAKER_01: Without those women or those relationships or that container that had even been built over the weekend, right?
42:59
SPEAKER_01: It was like I needed to go last.
43:01
SPEAKER_01: And because it was like that safety got built over the weekend.
43:05
SPEAKER_01: I spent the early part of the weekend mostly holding space for other people, right?
43:09
SPEAKER_01: Okay, number four.
43:10
SPEAKER_01: So this is our final chunk for today.
43:12
SPEAKER_01: And then next week we will pick up with five through eight.
43:17
SPEAKER_01: Is my current dose of support big enough?
43:23
SPEAKER_01: Right.
43:23
SPEAKER_01: So if you think about when you've gotten surgery or you've stubbed your toe or name the thing, like they make sure when they discharge you from your medical facility after surgery that your pain management plan surpasses your pain, at least in the early part, right?
43:41
SPEAKER_01: While you're in an acute healing phase, because again, stabilization, chronic pain, and the experience of chronic pain delays healing because there's constant stress being registered in the body mind, right?
43:55
SPEAKER_01: So is your current dose of support and healing and recovery big enough for the pain that you're carrying?
44:02
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
44:02
SPEAKER_01: I'm we're not necessarily assessing here whether or not what you're doing is technically good because that's actually a different bullet, right?
44:09
SPEAKER_01: We're gonna address like, is your practitioner have the blah blah blah.
44:13
SPEAKER_01: This is like, is it enough?
44:14
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
44:15
SPEAKER_01: Number one, I have consistent professional support.
44:21
SPEAKER_01: And can we just all agree?
44:24
SPEAKER_01: Like, for the sake of this particular checklist, are we agreeing that professional support is warranted in this particular circumstance, right?
44:31
SPEAKER_01: Based on everything we're carrying in a moment of time like this, right?
44:34
SPEAKER_01: Like even today, though, I have consistent professional support, right?
44:39
SPEAKER_01: I have a yoga facilitator, a chiropractor, a home.
44:43
SPEAKER_01: You know, like we we need consistent professional support.
44:46
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
44:48
SPEAKER_01: Number two, I have so.
44:50
SPEAKER_01: Support available between difficult moments, not just an appointment.
44:54
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, can we unpack that one for a moment?
44:57
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
44:57
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
44:58
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
44:59
SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
44:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:59
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
45:00
SPEAKER_04: Healing doesn't happen necessarily between the hours of nine and two years.
45:05
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, or one hour a week.
45:06
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
45:06
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
45:06
SPEAKER_03: In somebody's office.
45:08
SPEAKER_03: Mm-hmm.
45:10
SPEAKER_03: And again, it's support.
45:12
SPEAKER_03: I struggled with that for a really long time because again, if you're always the one in your friend group that's a strong one that nobody checks on because they don't feel like they need to, you're going to realize that the people you've surrounded yourself with do not have capacity to carry your big emotions.
45:28
SPEAKER_03: So in other words, like for me to be a fucking mess, my friends weren't used to that at all.
45:34
SPEAKER_03: Like I had to go 25% because if I won a hundred, God help me.
45:38
SPEAKER_03: Like they weren't going to be able to carry it.
45:39
SPEAKER_01: 100%.
45:40
SPEAKER_01: And like it needs to be said, here comes Karen.
45:46
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
45:47
SPEAKER_01: It needs to be said that our assumption over here on the podcast at Deer Divorce Diary is that your current support system is at a very similar vibrational level that you are.
46:01
SPEAKER_01: Because like calls to like.
46:04
SPEAKER_01: This is quantum physics.
46:05
SPEAKER_01: This is not, uh, I didn't make this up.
46:08
SPEAKER_01: Don't shoot the messenger.
46:09
SPEAKER_01: Like it just is, right?
46:11
SPEAKER_01: If you are wanting to move to a higher vibe state, you're recognizing that you are in experiencing pretty low vibe things.
46:18
SPEAKER_01: Like we function in environments that mirror the frequency or the vibration that we have been functioning in at and around, right?
46:26
SPEAKER_01: So it goes without saying your current layperson support system is not well resourced enough.
46:37
SPEAKER_01: Unless you've been doing that work to find higher vibe people and to tip up in the vibrational scale, right?
46:43
SPEAKER_01: So did I say that clear enough?
46:44
SPEAKER_01: Would you say it again?
46:45
SPEAKER_01: I did.
46:46
SPEAKER_03: And I think it's basically like it boils down to the fact that the same woman who chose her partner also chose her friends.
46:52
SPEAKER_03: So understand that if your ex-husband needed caregiving of emotions, you were a people pleaser with him, you were a fixer, you were XYZ, you probably serve that same role in a majority of your relationships with friends and with family.
47:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
47:07
SPEAKER_01: That doesn't mean they're bad people.
47:08
SPEAKER_01: That's not it's not a criticism of the people.
47:10
SPEAKER_01: It's just saying they're struggling with the same things that you are, whether you realize that or not.
47:14
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
47:15
SPEAKER_04: Right, right, right.
47:16
SPEAKER_01: And I have said this often like providers cannot take their patients further than they've gone in their own recovery journey, right?
47:25
SPEAKER_01: And this is the same thing.
47:26
SPEAKER_01: Like your layperson support system can't get you across the bridge that you seek to go across because they haven't crossed the bridge themselves.
47:34
SPEAKER_01: Probably for the most part, give or take one standard deviation from the norm.
47:39
SPEAKER_01: Uh okay.
47:41
SPEAKER_01: Third one.
47:41
SPEAKER_01: Someone who understands my whole picture is helping me identify what needs attention next.
47:47
SPEAKER_01: This is my superpower.
47:54
SPEAKER_01: Like order of operations or knowing exactly where to intervene, right?
47:58
SPEAKER_01: Like that is my superpower.
48:00
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
48:00
SPEAKER_01: But right, like this is what allows for efficient, less disruptive healing is knowing where to push or intervene next.
48:10
SPEAKER_01: Because without that, right, the sort of balance between resource and processing, between information and integration, right?
48:20
SPEAKER_01: It's like the more we can really be precise about that, the less disruptive, the smoother, the faster, the more efficient healing is.
48:30
SPEAKER_01: Would you say anything different about that?
48:32
SPEAKER_03: I think it's priceless to have a practitioner who, yes, understands the entire picture and knows where to take you next because a lot of times there's so much going on that it's like they have to know where to hit on.
48:43
SPEAKER_03: It's like that's the superpower, right?
48:45
SPEAKER_03: Like me, I feel like my superpower is intuition.
48:48
SPEAKER_03: I just intuitively know where somebody needs to go.
48:52
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
48:53
SPEAKER_03: Even if they're not telling me.
48:55
SPEAKER_03: Like I can hear what people don't say.
48:57
SPEAKER_03: That is my witchiness.
48:59
SPEAKER_03: So yeah, right.
49:00
SPEAKER_03: Like just kind of knowing intuitively, oh, we have to go here.
49:03
SPEAKER_03: We have to pivot here.
49:04
SPEAKER_03: Like that's yeah.
49:06
SPEAKER_01: Amazing.
49:07
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: The next one is I have modalities that address the body and the nervous system, not just my mindset or my thoughts.
49:17
SPEAKER_01: I think a lot of people would say yes to that these days.
49:19
SPEAKER_03: That's so huge.
49:20
SPEAKER_03: Yeah, because I feel people dropping words like toxic positivity, right?
49:23
SPEAKER_03: Like all of this other shit.
49:24
SPEAKER_03: And it's like, but do you but are you still experiencing physical symptoms in the body?
49:29
SPEAKER_03: If the answer is yes, then you are not equipped with tools to help nervous system.
49:34
SPEAKER_03: Or you're not using them enough, or you haven't been to her long enough.
49:38
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
49:39
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
49:40
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
49:41
SPEAKER_01: Uh all right.
49:42
SPEAKER_01: Next one.
49:42
SPEAKER_01: I have some, oh, this one's huge.
49:44
SPEAKER_01: I have somewhere safe to practice boundaries, communication, asking for help, receiving and being seen, aka what I just described to you, I did this weekend, right?
49:55
SPEAKER_01: Somewhere to practice with a group of people who have agreed, who have consented.
50:01
SPEAKER_01: And that's the problem often when you don't have a healing group or support system.
50:07
SPEAKER_01: Your family and friends do not consent to practicing boundaries with them, right?
50:10
SPEAKER_01: They want it the way they want it.
50:12
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
50:13
SPEAKER_01: Right.
50:13
SPEAKER_01: But somewhere safe to practice boundaries, communication, asking for help, receiving love and support and being seen.
50:22
SPEAKER_01: And I think this one is funny.
50:24
SPEAKER_01: Most people don't have this place also because they don't feel comfortable receiving love and support, and they don't feel comfortable being seen.
50:31
SPEAKER_01: So they intentionally don't have these places to do these things, but these are fundamental to recovering, to recovering heartache, which happens not just in the emotional field, but happens in the physical body.
50:45
SPEAKER_01: We have an episode on that way, way, way back in like season two or three.
50:48
SPEAKER_01: When you experience grief, loss, heartache, it literally takes a physical tone on your cardiothoracic devices in your body, right?
50:58
SPEAKER_01: We heal those things through having safe spaces, having healthy boundaries, allowing ourselves to be seen and then to receive love and support.
51:08
SPEAKER_01: And most of us have shut that shit down a long time ago.
51:12
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
51:14
SPEAKER_01: Tell me I'm wrong.
51:15
SPEAKER_03: Oh no, I agree.
51:17
SPEAKER_03: I am I am said person.
51:19
SPEAKER_03: I'm the poster child for that shit.
51:21
SPEAKER_03: Anyone that had a lot of trauma too growing up and has a hyper-independent part who literally feels like they've just they were the only adult in the room, right?
51:28
SPEAKER_03: Like all of those things.
51:30
SPEAKER_03: Um, that's gonna continue to follow you, and it is gonna have to be an active challenge the rest of your life to seek out support and seek out help and be able to receive it.
51:38
SPEAKER_04: And receive it.
51:38
SPEAKER_04: That's where I really got so like when when Don and I um met for the first time, or when she moved to be with closer to my family, or like all these scenes, like it uh what did it feel like?
51:53
SPEAKER_01: Pressure?
51:54
SPEAKER_01: Pressure.
51:55
SPEAKER_04: It made me right.
51:55
SPEAKER_04: It made me um like it was hard to breathe.
51:59
SPEAKER_04: It was so much pressure, it was so much like I didn't believe it.
52:02
SPEAKER_04: Like she's so intense, like she tells me she loves me.
52:05
SPEAKER_04: I'm just like, eh, you know what I mean?
52:07
SPEAKER_04: Like it was it was really hard at first because receiving love, I um unequivocal It was equated to not having to earn it.
52:17
SPEAKER_04: Yes, it was very unsafe.
52:19
SPEAKER_03: And also for women who feel like their story has been too much over the years, right?
52:23
SPEAKER_03: Women who have exiled parts that say, I'm the problem or I'm a disappointment, like that shit is always gonna get triggered in you.
52:31
SPEAKER_03: Like your trauma is too big to be held, right?
52:34
SPEAKER_03: Like that's the thing.
52:35
SPEAKER_03: Like, can you hold this for me?
52:36
SPEAKER_03: I don't know.
52:37
SPEAKER_03: So I'm gonna give you 25% to start, and then I'm gonna give you 50, and we're gonna see when you crack, and then I'm gonna be proven right that I'm the disappointment in the problem.
52:45
SPEAKER_03: I'm too much, right?
52:47
SPEAKER_01: Yes, so just like a reenactment loop over and over and over again.
52:52
SPEAKER_01: Right.
52:52
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
52:53
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
52:54
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
52:55
SPEAKER_01: Uh I have community with people who understand this season of life.
53:00
SPEAKER_01: Ooh.
53:02
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
53:02
SPEAKER_01: I think that I did not have a real struggle for divorce, right?
53:05
SPEAKER_01: Like, yeah, it's a real struggle for divorce because it's just not a popular support group.
53:10
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
53:11
SPEAKER_03: I feel like our clients tell us that all the time, right?
53:13
SPEAKER_03: Like that's why they're in our programs and in our community because they feel seen and understood instead of just trying to explain it to somebody that's like, oh, you're fine, it's okay, or asking really dumb shit, you know.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
53:23
SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah.
53:24
SPEAKER_01: And most of the lounge ladies that I was with this weekend have been divorced and some of them are remarried, some of them aren't.
53:29
SPEAKER_01: And they were all like, gosh, what I wouldn't have given to have a program like yours when I was going through divorce, right?
53:34
SPEAKER_01: Because yeah, it's it is that sort of built-in like roadmap, support system, like all the things, you know.
53:42
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
53:43
SPEAKER_01: Um, okay.
53:44
SPEAKER_01: The next one is my support addresses more than one layer of the problem when multiple layers are involved.
53:52
SPEAKER_01: Let's unpack this.
53:53
SPEAKER_01: What do we mean?
53:55
SPEAKER_01: So, like off the rip, we're body, mind, spirit people.
54:01
SPEAKER_01: So we can't think ourselves well.
54:06
SPEAKER_01: Um we ha with this moment in time is a is a it's we've sort of addressed this in the first bullet, right?
54:14
SPEAKER_01: But it's there's multiple systems involved here, family systems, legal systems, um, you know, therapeutic systems.
54:23
SPEAKER_01: Like there's so much going on here.
54:24
SPEAKER_01: So when you hear my support address is more than one layer, when there are multiple layers involved, what does that conjure for you?
54:31
SPEAKER_01: What are you thinking, feeling, experiencing, considering?
54:35
SPEAKER_03: For me, it has to be all-encompassing, right?
54:37
SPEAKER_03: And I've said it before, I don't really care if someone isn't Christian that comes onto the table, right?
54:44
SPEAKER_03: I just need you to believe in something bigger than yourself.
54:46
SPEAKER_03: I don't care if it's Mother Earth, universe, something.
54:50
SPEAKER_03: Like I need people to understand that in order to get truly well, they have to have their mind right, their body, right, and their spiritual sense, right?
55:00
SPEAKER_03: Like all of those three things have to be able to come together.
55:04
SPEAKER_03: Period.
55:05
SPEAKER_01: Again, that's why we designed this program the way we did, right?
55:08
SPEAKER_01: Because we address all three layers in one place.
55:13
SPEAKER_01: And not exhaustively, right?
55:14
SPEAKER_01: I'm not saying that you can't like most people still.
55:17
SPEAKER_01: I'll throw the Bible at you.
55:18
SPEAKER_03: No, we don't pound it into the body.
55:20
SPEAKER_03: Yes.
55:21
SPEAKER_03: And we have women in the program that aren't that don't identify necessarily as Christians traditional.
55:25
SPEAKER_03: So like it's all over the place, but we need you to, we need you to have something.
55:30
SPEAKER_03: Some sort of faith.
55:31
SPEAKER_04: This Adler who said you have to have a belief system.
55:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
55:35
SPEAKER_01: Look at Joy quoting the greats.
55:38
SPEAKER_01: Ooh, that's sexy.
55:40
SPEAKER_01: It's all right.
55:42
SPEAKER_01: Uh, next one.
55:43
SPEAKER_01: I'm getting enough repetition and reinforcement for new patterns to actually become familiar.
55:51
SPEAKER_01: Repetition is the key to learning, and I do think immersion is the way to be.
55:56
SPEAKER_03: And exposure, right?
55:57
SPEAKER_03: Because again, what did I do?
55:58
SPEAKER_03: I I hung out at my house for 10 years and didn't heal.
56:03
SPEAKER_03: And I had very surface level friendships, and I had I did not allow people close enough because I didn't want to be triggered.
56:11
SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
56:11
SPEAKER_03: And then when I started doing that, I got triggered AF and I'm like, wait, I'm supposed to be healed.
56:15
SPEAKER_03: And then it's like, no, honey.
56:16
SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
56:17
SPEAKER_01: We build cages around our thorns so we don't bump into them.
56:20
SPEAKER_01: Also, Joy has this phrase, she says a lot, I think it's you, Joy, and I might put you the phrase, but like if you hang out with four smokers, you're gonna become the fifth one.
56:26
SPEAKER_01: Is that you?
56:27
SPEAKER_01: I swear.
56:27
SPEAKER_01: Oh uh, yeah.
56:28
SPEAKER_01: Right?
56:29
SPEAKER_01: You become who you are, you hang around.
56:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
56:31
SPEAKER_01: Right.
56:31
SPEAKER_01: So if you don't have enough competition and reinforcement for new patterns, like it might take you a long time to get where you're trying to go.
56:38
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, for sure.
56:40
SPEAKER_04: Yeah, agreed.
56:41
SPEAKER_04: We're not advocating for you to get rid of your no, no, no, no, your community.
56:48
SPEAKER_04: Right, right.
56:49
SPEAKER_04: So, like another thing I say a lot is there's like the three, the twelve, and the many.
56:54
SPEAKER_04: Like the the the close people, the one that you pull your heart and soul into, if they don't have capacity or tools or um to be able to hold your space, like those are the three people, like get get one or two people that can hold space for you and still have your other people.
57:13
SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
57:14
SPEAKER_04: Like, um it's inner circle and outer circle.
57:16
SPEAKER_04: You know what I mean?
57:17
SPEAKER_04: Right.
57:17
SPEAKER_04: Yes, yes.
57:19
SPEAKER_04: Yes.
57:19
SPEAKER_04: So um, yeah, I just wanted to put it out there.
57:22
SPEAKER_04: We're like, we're not saying ghost all your friends.
57:25
SPEAKER_04: We're saying be mindful of who is in your in your circle.
57:28
SPEAKER_01: 100% change evolves over time.
57:31
SPEAKER_01: And listen, you could very well be the catalyst for many people in your circle rising with you, right?
57:37
SPEAKER_01: It's just like that's what's happened to me, right?
57:41
SPEAKER_04: It's what's happening in the screen.
57:42
SPEAKER_04: Sometimes I just were some people that didn't that didn't come with, you know, that I have have I have lost friends and and family members or distance or whatever, be but you know, for the most part, most of my people that were my people then have stepped up um in some capacity.
58:06
SPEAKER_04: They all aren't quoting that, but they're all stepping up to the to the you know, um a little bit.
58:13
SPEAKER_04: So I still have almost all of the pe friends I had back then, I still have to this day that I can are in my circle.
58:21
SPEAKER_04: So it is a process.
58:24
SPEAKER_01: You probably were a ringleader.
58:27
SPEAKER_04: Oh, yeah.
58:29
SPEAKER_04: I mean, I love them and they listen to this, so like I'm not but yeah, right?
58:34
SPEAKER_04: Like you take the first step and um they can come with you or not.
58:40
SPEAKER_04: I would say most people will will come slowly, but you know, you're not gonna you're not gonna be alone on an island.
58:48
SPEAKER_04: Um, and if you don't have people that can that just know that they're creating space if you don't have people that that can't come to the table, it's just creating space for people that can.
59:00
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
59:01
SPEAKER_04: Absolutely.
59:01
SPEAKER_03: You know, tolerating less, I think, right?
59:04
SPEAKER_03: Like tolerating less.
59:07
SPEAKER_03: That process of weeding out who can really stand with you and who can't.
59:10
SPEAKER_03: Right.
59:10
SPEAKER_04: And it's a non-negotiable, like it's non-negotiable at this point in my life.
59:14
SPEAKER_04: If I meet someone new, I spent the weekend with ladies this weekend that couldn't.
59:19
SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, okay, you know, I wish them well.
59:21
SPEAKER_04: They were kind, enjoyable, but it's they're not my people because it's a non-negotiable for me to have real conversations and not just careful.
59:32
SPEAKER_04: So beautiful.
59:35
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
59:36
SPEAKER_01: That was repetition and reinforcement.
59:38
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
59:39
SPEAKER_01: The next one is when something destabilizes me, I know where to take it.
59:43
SPEAKER_01: Like I know what to do next when something is destabilizing.
59:46
SPEAKER_01: I know who to take it to, I know where this particular destabilizing of information needs to go.
59:53
SPEAKER_01: I I know where where to talk about this thing.
59:57
SPEAKER_01: I think I learned that lesson the hard way for like 10 straight years.
1:00:05
SPEAKER_01: Like, how many times have I wanted to pick up the phone to call the person that could not handle the thing I was gonna say?
1:00:14
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:00:15
SPEAKER_04: Right.
1:00:16
SPEAKER_04: Oh, that one, I felt that one.
1:00:17
SPEAKER_03: And then get off the phone a feeling.
1:00:21
SPEAKER_03: Worse.
1:00:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:00:24
SPEAKER_01: That has been probably one of the last to go.
1:00:27
SPEAKER_01: You know?
1:00:30
SPEAKER_04: Because it's the one that we all, we all want the worst.
1:00:33
SPEAKER_04: We all want the most, right?
1:00:34
SPEAKER_04: To be able to have that person.
1:00:36
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
1:00:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
1:00:38
SPEAKER_01: All right.
1:00:39
SPEAKER_01: And the last one, my healing, this one's interesting.
1:00:42
SPEAKER_01: My healing does not depend entirely on how disciplined I can be while I'm already exhausted.
1:00:48
SPEAKER_01: So for instance, this is for the woman who is very disciplined about going to the gym because if she doesn't go to the gym, she can't stabilize, right?
1:00:58
SPEAKER_01: And so she has to stay disciplined, but actually the amount of cortisol that's going through her body, the amount of recovery that she's getting is not enough.
1:01:05
SPEAKER_01: The gym is adding to cortisol, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
1:01:07
SPEAKER_01: Right.
1:01:08
SPEAKER_01: So it's like, um, or if she's being crazy disciplined about her food, but actually she's not well fed enough, or the body is experiencing some sort of scarcity or withholding, um, or being disciplined around work when really she needs to take a day off to rest or recover, or discipline.
1:01:24
SPEAKER_01: Does this make sense?
1:01:25
SPEAKER_01: This is like if your healing depends on all of these buckets of discipline over like almost like you're a machine when you're not, you're an organism that has varying needs on a day, and especially as women, in a month, right?
1:01:42
SPEAKER_01: We our organism is profoundly different from day to day.
1:01:46
SPEAKER_01: And so if your healing depends on how disciplined you can be, it's not allowing you to breathe or flex with your actual needs in your current lived experience.
1:01:59
SPEAKER_01: So this has been a longer episode than usual, although we've had a lot of tech difficulties.
1:02:04
SPEAKER_01: So once we cut it all out, I don't know.
1:02:08
SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
1:02:08
SPEAKER_01: So, but you're starting to get a sense of, right, if your pain is currently at an eight out of 10, 9 out of 10, 10 out of 10, I would guess that's the range that most women are in.
1:02:17
SPEAKER_01: Maybe some days it's a seven, some days it's a 10, but there's a range in there where we're pretty outside of our will window of tolerance at this season in life.
1:02:26
SPEAKER_01: What is the intensity of the support?
1:02:29
SPEAKER_01: We're not even looking right now at the quality, we're looking at the dose.
1:02:32
SPEAKER_01: Is there enough?
1:02:34
SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna look at the quality of it starting next week's episode, right?
1:02:40
SPEAKER_01: But yeah.
1:02:41
SPEAKER_01: Is the dose enough to support the amount of pain I'm experiencing?
1:02:49
SPEAKER_01: Okay, darlings, that's what we've got today.
1:02:51
SPEAKER_01: But to recap very briefly, we looked at what am I actually carrying?
1:02:57
SPEAKER_01: How much am I actually carrying?
1:02:59
SPEAKER_01: And I think right here, I'm just gonna go for it.
1:03:01
SPEAKER_01: It's a fuck ton.
1:03:02
SPEAKER_01: Number two, yes.
1:03:06
SPEAKER_01: Am I safe or stable enough?
1:03:08
SPEAKER_01: Do I have enough resource?
1:03:09
SPEAKER_01: Am I stable enough for deeper healing?
1:03:12
SPEAKER_01: Um, I think the answer is probably no, generally speaking, right?
1:03:16
SPEAKER_01: Number three, do I have an information or an integration problem?
1:03:19
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna say that one's probably mid.
1:03:22
SPEAKER_01: Most people do have an integration problem, but maybe you also have an information problem, but it's probably mid.
1:03:28
SPEAKER_01: I would get I'm getting I'm guessing.
1:03:30
SPEAKER_01: And number four, is my current dose of support big enough?
1:03:33
SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna guess most people are gonna say no.
1:03:36
SPEAKER_03: I think it's helpful because it's in a checklist.
1:03:38
SPEAKER_03: Like it's very basic.
1:03:39
SPEAKER_03: Like go down the list.
1:03:40
SPEAKER_03: And if you don't have a lot of these things, I think it points to a direction.
1:03:43
SPEAKER_03: And this is a lot of things that I don't feel like women actively think about.
1:03:47
SPEAKER_03: Like it's like we're giving them guardrails, we're giving them parameters, whereas it's like they can actually pinpoint it.
1:03:53
SPEAKER_03: And again, it's different when you don't just feel like you're crazy, but you can actually point to parameters and say, that's me or that's not me.
1:04:02
SPEAKER_03: Like it feels it makes you feel seen, it makes you feel like you're not alone on an island.
1:04:06
SPEAKER_03: Like we get it, we understand.
1:04:07
SPEAKER_03: And we would have said like, like yes and no to like a majority of this shit, too, like in our own healing journey.
1:04:15
SPEAKER_03: So, like, we've been there.
1:04:16
SPEAKER_01: Okay, darlings.
1:04:18
SPEAKER_01: I really hope that this is helping you identify and define why you're perhaps staying stuck or why it keeps hurting so bad, or why it feels like you keep slipping back, you know, rather than moving forward or whatever it is.
1:04:30
SPEAKER_01: I hope we're really helping you conceptualize what it takes for most women to get not just stable from divorce, but where they want to go, right?
1:04:40
SPEAKER_01: Like you have this big beauty, there's a so many divorce coaches out there that are gonna say, this is the catalyst for your best life.
1:04:47
SPEAKER_01: And that can be true, but it only can be true if you're able to take an honest look at these parameters and then fill in the gaps, right?
1:04:55
SPEAKER_01: Because otherwise you're just doing the same old stuff, expecting different, different outcomes.
1:05:00
SPEAKER_01: So catch us, catch us next week for the come the the remainder of the checklist.
1:05:07
SPEAKER_01: The checklist will be in the show notes.
1:05:09
SPEAKER_01: If you haven't hopped into Cocoon yet, why?
1:05:13
SPEAKER_01: No, like really tell me why.
1:05:15
SPEAKER_01: Uh is our free community for women moving through this process.
1:05:19
SPEAKER_01: And uh, we want to see you in there.
1:05:22
SPEAKER_01: All right, talk soon.
1:05:23
SPEAKER_01: We love you so much.
1:05:24
SPEAKER_01: Peace.