Latest / The Prompt / Ep. 544 | Everyone Owns the Brand: From Siloed to Shared

Transcript

Ep. 544 | Everyone Owns the Brand: From Siloed to Shared · The Prompt

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This is on base your one stop shop for solving your most
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pressing B to B go to market challenges.
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Each week, host Chris Moody and Paul Gibson talk to sales and
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marketing leaders to get you in depth insights and creative
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strategies to set your revenue teams up for success.
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Hello, everyone, and welcome back to the latest in the
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award-winning home based podcast series.
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I'm your host, Paul Gibson. And with brand being big topics
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in 2025, I'm excited that today I'm talking with Beaver Cell,
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Global Marketing Communications Director at Alpha Sites.
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And today we're discussing reimagining brand ownership.
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B, I'm excited to get you on this show.
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Thanks for coming to join us. Thank you for having me so.
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Obviously this is a great topic and and very interesting for the
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listeners, but before we get started, if you don't mind
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simple question, can you walk us through your journey to where
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you are today and what particularly inspired you for
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this topic? Yeah.
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So in terms of my journey, I have to sit here and pause for a
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second because gosh, it's been so many years, but I've been
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leading global marketing strategy now for probably, you
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know, just coming up to 1617 years, right, So a long time and
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it hasn't changed a great deal. But my main focus has been how
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do you convert reputation into results?
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Right when I first started out this journey, it's all about,
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you know, the visuals, the colours, the logos.
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But very quickly I've transitioned and shifted into a
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position throughout my my tenure where we can translate branding,
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reputation, credibility, how firm uses their authority to
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ultimately create measurable business outcomes.
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So that's been my journey. I've worked across a number of
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technology organisations and then currently working with a
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professional services firm. Excellent, Well, brilliant.
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As I say, it's great to have you on the show.
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So let's let's dig into into the main subject then.
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And I suppose a good way to start is brand ownership.
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Shared brand ownership is something that probably is
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talked about quite a lot at the moment, maybe more now than
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ever. What's at stake would you say
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for organisations if they don't adapt?
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And why do you think it matters so much today?
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Yeah, no, it's an interesting one.
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I think gone are the days when brand ownership was essentially
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something that sat with just marketing and it became a
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marketing deliverable. Today, you know, the brand is an
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experience that touches multiple teams across, you know, the
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organization as well as a lot of external touch points.
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So I do think if you're unable to develop ownership across
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teams, it'll become extremely siloed and quite redundant
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quickly. And given that we are operating
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in a very fierce environment where you know, there is
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competition out there and you do have to stand out from the
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crowd, I think it's important for ownership to sit across the
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likes of HR. We're embedding the brand
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values, the mission, why we're all here today across, you know,
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each and every employee right through to how products then
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develop content and marketing material out into the field and
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and sharing with clients. Yeah, I think it's really
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important and and obviously we're all brand ambassadors in
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our business. It's like I always say, everyone
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in the business is a salesperson if they're having a conversation
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about a business and how they come across and how the brand
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comes across is so important for everyone.
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So makes a lot of sense. And what do you think are the
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biggest shifts you've noticed as brands move from being
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controlled by that one team to a shared responsibility across
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multiple different functions? Yeah, it's a shift that I've
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heard a lot talked about, but probably less in action yet.
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The first one and and probably the only one I'll I'll talk
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about today is brand moving from what's historically been viewed
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as you know, and I've had multiple conversations at board
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level around, you know, an awareness tool, yes, B let's go
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and build, you know, an identity market.
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Let's support top of funnel activity.
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And the shift I am seeing today, and it's something I am actively
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working on with our enablement team here at Alpha sites, but
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also across the board with sales is leveraging brand to increase,
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yes, awareness, reputation, but also supporting everything from
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lead generation right down to close rates.
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Because ultimately we live in a world where trust is the
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currency and building a strong, reputable, consistent brand.
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It's now becoming a game changer and how you how quickly you can
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generate and convert and close leads.
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So I do think there is a shift there both in perception from
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business leaders but also in the results.
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Yeah, big believer that and a lot of the stuff that demand
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base does is around getting early insight on who's in
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market. And just because you see someone
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starting to show signs, that's not the time to give it to
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sales, right. That is the time marketing to
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start, get that trust, which is all around the brand side of
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things. And that works all the way
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through the process. And I don't think salespeople
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ever get to speak to everyone on the buyer committee, right?
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So how do you ensure that the people you're not speaking to
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are also getting the feeling that you're the company they
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should work with? These are the reasons why, and
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it's all down to the marketing team getting that brand and that
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awareness and that trust across the buying committee, whether
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you know them or you don't. So 100% in agreement with that.
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So when you look at it then, how do teams like say HR or product
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and comms, how do they work together to actively shape the
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brand? And can you share any examples
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where the contributions those different teams have made have
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had a real tangible impact? Yeah.
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So if I take myself back to my time at Insight, so large
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Fortune 500 reseller now solutions integrator, when I
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joined them about 3 or 4 years in, we decided to transition
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from, you know, sort of a typical transactional reseller
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through to a, a solutions integrator.
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And that was an exciting project, but one where it was a
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collaborative effort with the likes of HR product and
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ultimately, you know, sales had to, to drive that forward as
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well on the front lines. So with HR, it was working with
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them. We need to collaborate on how we
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connect and have our employees engage with the new brand story,
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our mission, and also just revisiting the values.
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What do they mean today in this new solutions marketplace?
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So it was collaborating with them on the likes of, you know,
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internal engagement programs and even just communication
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communications initiatives. And then in terms of results on
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on that front with HR, it was then again measuring against
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some of our employee engagement scores more in the way of like,
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you know, clarity on business mission vision, how connected do
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they feel with the organization? How transparent do they feel
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leaders are being? And that was our opportunity to
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really start to open up dialogue and those communication channels
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as to why we were making the shift because ultimately no one
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likes change. But then how they were part of
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that journey. So that was HR's role with
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product. It was, you know, they were the
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enablers of bringing our story to life across, you know,
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marketing collateral. So it was working closely with
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them to collaborate and produce stories of success as we'd
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already kind of secured early on leveraging their expertise to
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craft really compelling proof points that then the team and I
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would activate both internally and externally on on channels.
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And we did actually see a, you know, I'd say casting my mind
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back, I think it was around 1/3. So maybe 33% increase in content
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engagement very early on in the first six months of that brand
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transformation. And also one metric that doesn't
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always get measured as you know, the spike in the, the number of
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solution based RFPs that we see, you know, we saw coming in.
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And I remember that moment because the RFP team, there were
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only three folks and we were inundated with, you know,
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requests for these pitch decks. So the team and I also jumped in
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to help them there. And then finally sales, you
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know, these are the, these are our front liners.
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These are the ones, you know, these are folks that you know
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had to be the most confident in delivering our our new brand
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narrative and actually understanding the the actual
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proposition. So it ranged from running, you
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know, kind of company office wide workshops right through to
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really tailored enablement sessions.
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And as a result, you know, we we were able to build traction in
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that market very quickly and also build a lot of confidence
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in in sales folks who didn't really understand why we were
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bringing this new proposition to market.
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Yeah, it makes a lot of sense. And any, any metric that's 30%
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plus increases is it's obviously really powerful.
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We have some discussions actually, because everything we
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do is B2B based, right? And most of those B2B companies
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have a set industry or niche or region or size of business that
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they work with. And so raising your brand
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profile outside of that doesn't make sense or not.
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And where where that comes in as you talk about the measurement
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of brand effectiveness, if you're getting lots of clicks
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from your on your ad campaigns and you're getting people coming
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to your website, but actually they're not people that you can
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sell to, is that a positive sign or is that just a false
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positive? And if I was a company that was
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selling technology into financial institutions and I had
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a lot of success getting retailers clicking on my ads and
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coming to my website and getting into pipeline, that's on surface
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is great, but it's not stuff that girls can ever sell.
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So it then becomes you're filling the pipeline off with
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stuff that they can't sell. Do you ever see anything like
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that or is that a discussion you have at all or?
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Yeah. I mean, we have.
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I've definitely seen that. I would say a good example would
9:24
be back in, I mean, yeah, so when I joined 8 by 8, I joined
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them in the midst of, you know, the world kind of going down
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into lockdown essentially with COVID.
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And at that stage, you know, we had a big focus on supporting
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SMBs. In fact, we're supporting
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everyone, right? We wanted all businesses out
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there. So, you know, 8 by essentially
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provide, they're a cloud communications provider.
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And so we're an element, right? We were like, this is our time
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now to essentially tell the world how great our platform is
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and actually they have to use it.
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And so for for us, a lot of the campaign work that I was focused
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on within three months of joining them was very much
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around enabling your small businesses.
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So I would say, you know, 50 seats plus right up to your
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large enterprises that weren't necessarily on that cloud
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journey as of yet. And so there was a range of
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activity that we had to quickly deploy everything from ads
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through to, you know, sales, actually getting on the phone
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and speaking to folks. And we did often attract one man
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bands, right, because there were a lot of those small businesses
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out there. And we we didn't, we really
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didn't have a proposition nor was it profitable for us to, to
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be able to, you know, continue selling to them.
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So, so we have seen that trend in that space.
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Now to answer your question, I think there's a lot you can
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glean from it. So one is kind of rethinking
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your proposition. If there is so much interest
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from a market that perhaps you haven't considered, is it worth
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going back to the table and figuring out, OK, how do we
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build, you know, sitting down with product, sitting down with
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your solutions team and figuring out how do we make this work for
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retail? How do we make this work for one
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man bands? Thankfully we were able to do
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something with them given everyone was, you know,
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essentially under so much pressure and stressed out.
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And then secondly, with those leads, it's just looking at the
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data, where are they coming from?
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So, so how are we getting those leads in?
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Is there something we're doing that we don't we're not aware
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of? So it's trying to find out ways
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in which we can leverage that data.
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Do you remember time actually alpha sites when we were running
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a talent campaign and for some reason we were having interests
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and trafficking from 35 year old, you know, the Democrats say
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30 plus. And we were actually targeting
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Gen. Z.
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And as it happens, you know, with these things when you're,
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you know, dabbling in paid and performance marketing, we were
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trying to run it ourselves and we just clicked on, you know,
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one of the categories in the age section that had set us off on a
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completely different tangent. So also it helps to go back to
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your programming and your campaigns to check you've got
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the right profiles in place because you could, you know,
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that could also be an oversight which is leading to you maybe
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targeting the wrong audience. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
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It's, it's a really interesting topic and I get into it a lot.
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So it's good to hear your thoughts on it.
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So AI is something everyone's talking about and I think it's
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it's changing how they create and manage their brands.
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Do you see from your perspective, is this more of an
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enabler or a challenge when it comes to getting those cross
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teams to collaborate? Yeah, I'm probably going to say
12:11
something unpopular now. I think at the moment, my
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personal opinion is it's more of a challenge than an enabler for
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me, Percy. And you know, the conversation
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I'm having with peers in the industry is that at the moment
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we're, we're still trying to figure it out.
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And that is a challenge rather than something that's helping us
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enable better solutions or, or Dr. efficiency.
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And I think it is, you know, and again, you know, I've actually
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got folks that I've spoken to. I went to an event last week and
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they were like, they're actually using ChatGPT to figure out how
12:40
to use ChatGPT and AI in their, in their teams.
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And I think actually that this is a point where you have to
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stop and use your own context, your experience and insight
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within the organization, but, you know, even within my team
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and figure out, you know, what are those bottlenecks today?
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Like, where are the challenges that we are facing that's, you
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know, are slowing us down? And then working from there in
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terms of like, how can AI support us to speed these things
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up to achieve better outcomes rather than jumping on every
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tool that, you know, you see advertised, whether it's on
13:09
LinkedIn or through an ad. And you know, I do have junior
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folks in the team that will often see something, but like,
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hey, B, we should, we should be using this.
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And I'm like, hold on. We, we have our focus is to
13:19
increase our time to market with some of our e-mail campaign.
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So let's just focus on that. What tools are available in that
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space? Because you can get carried away
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with the noise and get lost in in conversation on the topic.
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So yeah, at the moment, I think it's just figuring out what
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works for you. But also what people don't talk
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about is the measurement and the success metrics that you put
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against that with anything, right?
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You know, whether it's AI or another tool in the stack, it's
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figuring out what does good look like and what is success going
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to look like for us, which again, you need to spend some
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time thinking through. So from my perspective, I think
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at the moment we're kind of, you know, we're using it kind of in
13:55
a few areas, but to really leverage this, it's for
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potential when you spend a bit more time thinking, thinking
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through the strategy that. Yeah, I think that's a
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fairpoint. And and we see lots of
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instances. I mean, if AI is used to
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automate those time consuming resource heavy things that allow
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marketers and sales to do marketing and sales things,
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that's brilliant. But we see a lot of it where
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actually AI can be quite dangerous and and negatively
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affect key metrics. Like if you've got AI saying to
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the salespeople, go after that account because I say so, but
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there's no detail behind it. You're just guessing.
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And we're hearing that at least 50% of the time you're being
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sent off on wild goose chases. And it's actually a thought
14:39
affecting sales and marketing alignment because AI is sending
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them off on the wrong things. I call it AI without the Y,
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which makes makes no sense, right?
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I mean, if you don't know why you're going after that account,
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you don't know what messaging to use, you know, you'll become
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unstuck. So yeah, I think AI obviously
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it's that there's so much value in it, but we've got to be
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careful. And I had a really good quote,
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someone said with AI, 5% of AI technology will be on the right
15:05
side of relevance, which sounds complicated, but what is most of
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the stuff is AI for the sake of AI, which doesn't really help.
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We'll see. We'll keep watching this space.
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So going back to the topic then, how do you see breaking down
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silos and encouraging this cross functional effort make the brand
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experience more authentic not just for customers but also for
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the employees themselves? Just touching on your point
15:28
earlier on around AI and the sales piece, one thing we're
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doing here is we're, we're trying to build a culture that
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understands the value of AI rather than just pushing out a
15:37
bunch of features that will help automate certain workflows
15:40
within the sales process. So, so just to touch on, it's
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something that we are facing here.
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We have a very young workforce where you're always looking for
15:47
ways to drive efficiencies. And so rather than putting up
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slides saying the dangers of AI or, you know, make sure you hit
15:52
this button before you send out the e-mail, we're trying to
15:55
educate folks on just how AI should be part of your workflow,
15:59
not the focus, you know, of your entire day, how you speed up and
16:02
make work flows more efficient. Back to your question in terms
16:05
of that, that cross collaboration and how you remove
16:08
silos, it's communication quite quite honestly.
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And it's bringing teams in, you know, stakeholders in across
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these functions early on in that journey.
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So to give you an example, when I joined Alpha Sites, we were in
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the midst of a rebrand here as well.
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We were moving from a, you know, sort of single core provider in
16:28
the space to really being a one stop shop for, for all of the,
16:32
you know, our clients expert services needs.
16:35
And in that process, we bought in a a number of stakeholders
16:38
from the likes of products sales.
16:39
We've been brought in a few customers, really not just a
16:42
pressure test messaging, because that's historically how you'd
16:45
run a brand, you know, transformation project and
16:48
program. It was a case of actually
16:50
gathering feedback from them, right?
16:52
What are those pain points that we're trying to to meet?
16:55
What are these challenges that we're we're trying to solve?
16:57
But also how would how will this messaging work in market or with
17:01
those stakeholders, both in terms of what the messaging is,
17:04
but also contextually when and where will they be receiving
17:07
these messages? And that level of collaboration
17:10
and discussion and dialogue is something in my experience, you
17:13
know, 15 years past we've never done, especially in, in, you
17:16
know, that insight where we did run a very large brand project.
17:19
So it's not just get bringing in teams for the sake of bringing
17:23
them in and ticking a box and getting some feedback.
17:25
It's genuinely having empathy to your point, like understanding
17:29
their perspective and being curious around how they can also
17:32
help you build those messaging blocks and that architecture
17:35
that's really going to resonate with all of the the stakeholders
17:38
that we're focused on. Yeah, makes a lot of sense.
17:42
So if you assume we've got comms leaders listening into this
17:45
podcast, what advice would you give to move from being maybe a
17:49
brand gatekeeper to acting more of us, a facilitator to simplify
17:54
and align the teams together? Yes, so you're touching a word
17:57
there. Simplify.
17:57
I think that is definitely a key.
18:00
It's something I've always been passionate about being in the
18:03
marketing and comms realm. It's all about how do we
18:06
simplify complexity. And I and I do think that's
18:09
something I would continue to flag the fly high on is like
18:13
simplify wherever you can to bring more order to the chaotic
18:17
world and and marketplace that we're operating in.
18:20
And what does that mean? Like, you know, the day-to-day
18:22
tangible aspects of the role, whether you're marketing,
18:24
whether you're in, you know, communication is do a few things
18:28
well, first and foremost, But from a brand perspective, you
18:31
know, shifting from viewing, you know, whether it's your team or
18:36
all those around you as brand owner, brand police, should I
18:39
say in a brand governments where this these are the things you
18:41
can say. These are the things you can't
18:43
say and do to empowering them to be brand owners.
18:48
And that only comes through them buying into the the brand
18:52
mission and vision. Again, it's you know, it's
18:54
building this culture, this mindset of what your
18:56
organization stands for beyond just some, you know, a logo and
18:59
a tagline. And I think shifting them from
19:02
leasing the brand to owning the brand is where you're going to
19:06
build more authentic, you know, narratives and stories and
19:09
experiences both internally that then will translate out into the
19:13
market. So simplicity, but also changing
19:16
the shift from control governance to how do you help
19:19
others own the brand? And, you know, it can be things
19:22
like, you know, we used to have a brand Bible here, you know,
19:24
guidelines, which was and it still is in the region of about
19:27
150 pages. But we have a short version that
19:30
we will, you know, send out to product owners and so on.
19:33
Just so they've got the core principles that they need to be
19:36
aware of to go and then, you know, have some room to
19:39
authentically build out some of their material.
19:42
Yeah, I think simplification is a word I use with my team all
19:45
the time. And you can see some very clever
19:47
marketing things out there, but it takes 5 minutes to explain
19:50
what they mean by it, which you've missed the mark.
19:54
So if we dig a little bit deeper into that, then can you mention
19:58
maybe a couple of small, maybe powerful changes comms leaders
20:01
could make that would empower their teams and maybe
20:05
simplifying the brand guidelines, as you said, without
20:07
losing the brand's heart, I suppose.
20:10
I would say like introducing more creativity, opportunities
20:15
to be creative in the team, right?
20:16
I've, I've worked for organization including alpha
20:19
sites here where you know, we are trying to maintain our, our
20:23
brand voice and you know, kind of govern kind of what, what our
20:26
brand stands for and so on. But I think for a marketing
20:29
team, we're, we're actually in a very challenging space where
20:32
we're struggling to cut through. So it's empowering your team to
20:37
be a little creative within reason and let the results speak
20:41
for themselves. So it's giving, you know, more
20:43
ownership, more autonomy or not every, every single project, but
20:46
maybe just selecting one or two and then having them closely
20:50
monitor and measure. So you know, for example, when
20:52
it's a social media campaign where you're creating a video,
20:55
you know, which maybe goes outside some of those guardrails
20:58
you set for your your corporate star guide on videos and seeing
21:02
how that performs. And we've done that here both
21:05
with, you know, the type of content we're putting out there,
21:08
but also what we're saying on it.
21:11
And it has been a case of, you know, maybe asking for
21:13
forgiveness here and there because we need to try something
21:16
that cuts through because to continue doing what we're doing,
21:19
you know, the results maybe aren't delivering what they need
21:21
to say. That'll be the first thing.
21:24
And I would say, you know, and we hear a lot about this in
21:26
terms of leveraging, you know, your brand ambassadors, your,
21:29
you know, your advocates out there.
21:31
You know, we're leaning into influencers here at Alpha Site.
21:34
More of the focus on how do we attract more of that Gen.
21:37
Z pool of candidates to come and work for us.
21:40
And so with that, you know, the textbook would say you need to
21:44
create some influencer guidelines.
21:46
And the mandate I've set the team is keep it really loose,
21:48
let the influencer Dr. what they would like to talk about.
21:52
I think it's inherent in a lot of comms leaders.
21:55
We want structure. We want to know what someone's
21:57
going to say, how they're going to say it.
21:58
You know, how do we ensure everything's on message, on
22:00
point? But it's almost like trying to
22:03
loosen the control, right? Maybe gradually.
22:05
And that's quite hard for me, people that know me.
22:08
Yeah. Hopefully that inspires some of
22:09
you out there just to see, you know, what is possible if you
22:12
could step away from the day-to-day oversight.
22:15
Yeah, I think you're. Right.
22:16
And if and if you're looking for people who you want to think
22:19
outside the box, you've got to think out by outside the box to
22:21
a hire or find them right, so. Exactly, Yeah.
22:25
It's a question which I don't know whether you've been asked
22:27
before, but I hear it quite a lot.
22:28
If your brand walks through the building right now, would every
22:32
team in your business recognize it?
22:34
Is that something you hear a lot?
22:35
I haven't heard that that question before, but would they
22:38
recognize it? I should hope so.
22:41
It's. An interesting question because
22:43
I've been asked it a few times and often I think they meaning
22:47
would they recognize the logo, but what they're trying to say
22:50
is do you recognize what the brand means?
22:52
And it's quite one and as as as brand.
22:55
I'm not a brand person myself, but it does make a lot of sense,
22:58
right? If the people in your business
23:00
don't get what you stand for, watch out for anyone else.
23:03
But. 100% and it's something that we've spent.
23:06
In fact, it's something I'm really passionate about from,
23:08
you know, my my earlier days when I started at insight in
23:11
events, right? And kind of taking it back to
23:13
running these large scale exhibitions, you know, you are
23:17
essentially creating an experience which does reflect
23:20
the brand. And so to give an example of
23:22
like, you know, do they recognize the brand?
23:24
Yes, they do, but sales guys are busy selling.
23:27
And so we would spend the same amount of time we'd spend say
23:30
briefing partners on how they capture leads on the day, what
23:34
their lead follow up process would be right through to, you
23:36
know, what they're going to have on their their actual stand.
23:39
As we would with sales folks to ensure that they understood what
23:43
the event was about, what the program, what are, you know,
23:45
day's program was about and how they could delight customers
23:49
that, you know, attend on the day.
23:50
Because ultimately brand to me is, you know, every touch point.
23:53
And I think in today's world where we do have such a complex
23:56
digital structure, there are so many different touch points that
23:59
a client or a prospect can interact with.
24:02
It's important that there is consistency and people need to
24:05
be part of that, you know, sort of, I guess marketing mix where
24:09
they don't just recognize the brand, but they know the type of
24:11
experience they need to be delivering both to other
24:14
employees around the business, but also to anyone they interact
24:16
with, even on a Saturday now at the pub when they're talking
24:18
about the brand. Yeah, and it frustrates me.
24:21
I go to events and I walk around the stands and I look at the
24:25
stand and I don't know what they do.
24:27
And you think that's such a simple thing.
24:29
Just say what you do understand that's that's the be all and end
24:32
all. Be in there right.
24:33
But. Right.
24:34
Well, say what you do. So that was a challenge that I
24:39
was brought in to help solve for alpha sites, right.
24:41
So we work in a very unknown industry, let's say, unless
24:45
you're in the industry. I mean, we're we're expert
24:47
network services organization and we still, you know, will
24:51
often struggle with articulating what we do.
24:53
If you've not worked with us, you, you probably won't know.
24:55
And the best way we tackled that challenge and we continue to is
24:59
through storytelling, right? So it's essentially converting
25:03
something that's quite abstract into stories that actually bring
25:07
to life our services. So we now equip, you know, our
25:10
sales team, but even our HR and talent teams, you know,
25:14
everything from onboarding right through to, you know, like
25:16
interviewing candidates on the phone with stories that actually
25:19
help articulate who we are and what we do.
25:21
Because, you know, you'll say, Oh yeah, well, you know, we
25:23
provide XY. So can you explain what that
25:26
means? Yeah.
25:26
So let me give you an example of a project we worked on with a
25:29
client recently. And suddenly you've got the
25:30
retention, as you know, with whole storytelling, you know,
25:33
concept. So I think that's also another
25:35
way to help, you know, activate internally what that brand
25:39
mission and story is to help deliver a more impactful
25:41
external branding experience. Yeah, and it's certainly better
25:44
than the all they stand to say. We are market leaders in XYZ,
25:48
right? Over the head, right?
25:49
So we, we, we touched on AI and I can tell you're a fan, but on
25:54
a, on a, it is like topical thing right now.
25:57
Everyone's talking about it. So do you use AI yourself in
26:00
your day-to-day? And have you got an example of A
26:03
use case you could share? Yeah.
26:04
So in my day-to-day, yeah, actually I do use it my
26:07
day-to-day. So we have an in house version
26:09
that we've developed called Delivery ChatGPT and I use it
26:12
mostly. So actually I use it very early
26:15
in my early on in my day to help me have a more productive day.
26:18
So it will be helping to organise my list of things that
26:22
need to get done in order of priority.
26:24
And also that includes organising my personal life
26:27
because I'm a busy mum of two boys and sometimes it can get
26:30
quite tricky to juggle. So you know, AI has access to my
26:33
diary and it can figure out what needs to get done when.
26:36
So that's a great way to start my day and set me up for
26:39
success. And then during the day, I
26:41
personally don't tend to use delivery GPT or ChatGPT for, for
26:45
writing, but I will turn to, to AI to help generate ideas.
26:50
So often it's aspiring partner or it'll be like, you know, can
26:53
you help me with this? What are the options?
26:55
So often it's where it's almost like a teammate, someone in the
26:58
team that you can bounce off. But I am very mindful of how
27:02
often I am using it because you can get heavily reliant on the
27:05
likes of ChatGPT. And at the end of the day, you
27:08
haven't actually used your brain.
27:10
So yeah, I'd say it's, it's for, it's a range of things.
27:13
Honestly speaking, the odd occasion I, you know, have
27:15
someone reach out to me and say they'd like me to prove a piece
27:18
of communication. I'm sure the marketing comms
27:21
leaders feel this pain. And So what would have taken,
27:23
you know, my evening, I'll just put it through our system.
27:27
And actually the, the beauty is not just asking the platform to
27:31
improve for grammar, you know, tone of voice.
27:34
It'll be also to explain to me what it's changed and why.
27:37
Yeah, because that's important. Otherwise you are then
27:40
essentially just turning off your brain.
27:41
Yeah, yeah. I like to use it, as you say,
27:43
like a brainstorming tool, put some thoughts in there and then
27:46
go away with it in your head and then come up with what you say
27:49
on it. So yeah, I think it makes sense.
27:51
Also, I'm very transparent about it as well.
27:53
So again, it comes back to that culture where I know, you know,
27:57
6 to 12 months ago, you know, people didn't want to admit that
28:00
even in my team that they were using ChatGPT and it wasn't, it
28:03
was just a case of lot of course should be be using it.
28:06
But now I'll often share ideas and I'd be like for my lovely
28:09
friend ChatGPT, these are the six ideas.
28:12
These are the 10 other tag lines that we could potentially
28:14
consider for this banner just to help them along and and keep
28:18
them inspired and kind of pushing their their thinking as
28:20
well. Yeah, absolutely.
28:21
Yeah. We shouldn't hide behind it.
28:23
I think what was the same AI won't replace people, but people
28:27
using AI will replace people not using AII think that's quite a
28:31
good one. So you sound like someone who
28:33
consumes lots of content and things in your day-to-day.
28:36
So is there a book or a blog or newsletter, maybe another
28:40
podcast you'd recommend to our listeners?
28:43
Yeah, there are so many out there.
28:45
I mean, blogs, even podcasts, I mean, it almost gets to the
28:48
point where you have too many. So you do have to at some point
28:51
put pin in them and think, right, I'm just going to listen
28:52
to these ten, I would say. So I was thinking this through
28:55
the last night, just preparing for a session.
28:58
And I'm going to actually suggest, and I'm more of a
29:01
hardback reader with books. I like to just put the devices
29:04
away. And actually, I actually bought
29:05
one on the weekend. It's called the Let Them Theory
29:08
by Mel Robbins, which haven't actually started yet, but I
29:11
would say from a professional standpoint, a book that got
29:14
released, I think it was 2000 and and 16 or 2006.
29:18
One of the two by young chap called Stephen Covey.
29:22
I don't know if you've you've come across him.
29:24
It's called the speed of trust. So I recommend this to everyone
29:28
that ever asks me for for, you know, any, any guidance on on
29:31
reading and essentially talks about trust being the currency
29:34
of business and how it's moved on.
29:36
Just, you know, something a soft skill to now being used as a way
29:40
to build business advantage. So I would recommend that book,
29:44
You know the Speed of Trust by by Stephen Covey, if you haven't
29:46
read it already. From a blog standpoint, one that
29:50
my CEO actually recommended about two years ago to me here
29:52
at Alpha Sites is Farnham Street.
29:55
So a lot of the folks around the business here are also
29:57
subscribed to it. So it offers on a weekly basis,
30:00
a newsletter and really just helps to demystify and simplify
30:05
a lot of complex mental models, which I've actually found really
30:09
helpful, both not just professionally, but also
30:12
personally in sort of changing your your outlook on certain
30:15
challenges or situations that you're you're encountering both,
30:19
you know, at work or, or in your personal life.
30:22
So Farnham Street is another one I'd recommend as a blog
30:25
subscription. Yeah, definitely checking that
30:27
one out. Sounds sounds really
30:28
interesting. So so you've been an awesome
30:30
guest beat and it's a cheeky ask.
30:32
I always do this. Is there anyone inspirational in
30:35
the space that you think you would recommend we should get on
30:38
the podcast in future? There is actually one lady who
30:41
I'd recommend who I worked with for a short time at 8 by 8.
30:45
Her name is Narea and she is an exceptional leader.
30:49
I actually had a conversation with her last week.
30:51
So she used to lead our our marketing function at 8 by 8.
30:56
So I highly recommend you reaching out to her.
30:58
And why do I recommend her? Because there are very few
31:01
leaders out there that I have worked with that have huge
31:06
teams, you know, that, that they're highly kind of, you
31:09
know, efficient with how they use their time, strategic, but
31:13
also in the detail, right? Day in and day out.
31:16
Like I've never known anyone that can share as many stats and
31:19
data points as this woman could, But she was invested in the
31:22
detail. What converts, what doesn't be
31:25
talk to me about, you know, communications.
31:27
Talk to me about PR constantly curious, but always human.
31:31
You know, given the, the highly pressurized role that she was in
31:34
when I joined 8 by 8, she was someone that you could approach
31:37
any day of the week and it would always inspire me with new ideas
31:40
and ways of, of delivering impact in markets.
31:43
So I'll reach out to her for sure.
31:45
Stephanie Wills, I appreciate the recommendation and if she
31:48
says no I'll I'll come back to you for some.
31:52
This has been a really interesting session.
31:54
BI know. I know people listening in will
31:56
probably have follow up questions.
31:58
And if they do, what would you recommend the best way to get in
32:01
touch with yourself after this? LinkedIn.
32:03
OK, nice and simple. Brilliant.
32:05
So great session. BI think this is really
32:07
interesting and personally I think we're just scratching the
32:10
surface. So if you're interested, I think
32:12
we could definitely get a follow up podcast, dig a bit deeper in
32:16
some of the relevant bits. But for now, thank you so much
32:18
for your time and everyone listening.
32:21
I appreciate you taking the time.
32:22
I hope you've enjoyed this episode and don't forget there
32:25
are over 500 other episodes in the series, so make sure you
32:28
check them out as well. Thanks for listening.
32:31
Until then, thanks B and Cheerio.
32:36
Thanks for joining us for On Base.
32:38
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