Latest / True Crime with Gavin Fish / What It Takes to Tell the Hard Stories with My True Crime Bestie, Sherrilyn Dale

Transcript

What It Takes to Tell the Hard Stories with My True Crime Bestie, Sherrilyn Dale · True Crime with Gavin Fish

• 0:01
  Hello there and welcome to the channel.
• 0:03
  I am so happy that tonight we are in, we have invited and we
• 0:09
  are being joined by one of my favorite people and true crime,
• 0:13
  Sherlyn Dale. Stick around.
• 0:27
  This video contains mature themes and discussions intended
• 0:30
  only for adult audiences. Viewer discretion is advised.
• 0:37
  Hello there, my friend. Welcome back to the show.
• 0:39
  My name is Gavin. Welcome to another true crime
• 0:42
  conversation. Glad that you're here.
• 0:44
  I'm not going to bear the lead. We're going to just jump right
• 0:46
  into it. Welcome to the show Cheryl and
• 0:48
  Dale, my pal. Hi, Jimani.
• 0:51
  What's going on? I'm so excited.
• 0:54
  I've been so excited for this. You know, me, I get really
• 0:56
  nervous with lives. And I was like, OK, we, we got
• 1:00
  to talk. When was it last week?
• 1:02
  Yeah. It felt so nice.
• 1:04
  And then you were like, would you want to come on?
• 1:05
  And I was like, oh God, only for you, that's exactly what.
• 1:08
  You said I. Was like, only for you, I can't
• 1:11
  do this. And then Colby invited me on his
• 1:14
  live on, I think it was Monday. I don't even know.
• 1:16
  All the days are blurred. And I was like, what?
• 1:18
  Who am I? I'm just.
• 1:19
  Like you're busy, girl. I'm live in it all over the
• 1:22
  place but this feels so nostalgic to me.
• 1:24
  I just love it so much. I do too.
• 1:26
  I do too. I'm glad you're here.
• 1:28
  Is that a pickle? That is, it is.
• 1:31
  It's a, it's a dill hole. It's a pickle in a hole.
• 1:36
  God, I love it. I use the word dill hole instead
• 1:40
  of using instead of using profanity that I want to use but
• 1:44
  try really hard not to so. I like that a lot.
• 1:47
  I that's one of my things. Like I like a good dill hole
• 1:49
  every now and then. Yeah, I like to call people Dill
• 1:53
  hole A. Lot.
• 1:53
  Yeah, that. I try not to be a judge mental
• 1:58
  person, but I am I, you know, here's something that is a truth
• 2:02
  of true crime. Well, we'll find out if it is.
• 2:05
  You tell me if you agree or not. Criminals are stupid, man.
• 2:10
  Yeah yeah they are do you feel bad when you not bad like cuz
• 2:15
  sometimes I just want to say like what a fucking idiot Oh
• 2:18
  right sorry we we try not to go around here but you know what I
• 2:21
  mean and what a dill hole and then you're like but honestly,
• 2:25
  thank goodness you are because we were able to figure this out
• 2:30
  a lot quicker if. You were you.
• 2:32
  Know like, unless you were smarter.
• 2:34
  Now, I've got a buddy who is a quadruple board certified
• 2:38
  forensic pathologist. He's a medical examiner.
• 2:41
  And he tells me, you know, solving a murder is actually a
• 2:44
  very difficult thing to do. And he reminds, he reminds me
• 2:50
  that most of the murders that go unsolved we don't even know
• 2:54
  about. So it's the ones that we know
• 2:56
  about. Everybody seems dumb, but there
• 2:58
  are smart criminals out there. That's actually, that is
• 3:02
  actually OK. First of all, that's fascinating
• 3:04
  when you think about it, but that's also really chilling as
• 3:07
  well. Yeah, yeah, I think I've told
• 3:10
  you. I have a buddy who's a, she's a,
• 3:13
  she's an administrative law judge up in upstate New York.
• 3:18
  And she tells me every time she goes, like on a long drive, if
• 3:21
  she's going through the desert, she looks out into the desert
• 3:24
  and goes, I wonder how many bodies are buried out there.
• 3:26
  That's my girl. That's literally my thoughts all
• 3:28
  the time. I asked Brent that all the time.
• 3:30
  I'd be like babe. And he'll be like don't.
• 3:32
  Don't even just stop. Just stop.
• 3:36
  Like, dude, I like the very first time that I ever had, it
• 3:38
  was like so early in our relationship and we were in a
• 3:41
  little road trip and I'm like, what do you think when you look
• 3:44
  at, you know, this wooded areas we're driving past and he's
• 3:47
  like, I don't know, like how how deep it goes.
• 3:50
  What kind of animals are there? I was like, oh, he's like, what
• 3:53
  do you think? I'm like, I don't know.
• 3:56
  I don't want to say out loud. Same.
• 3:59
  That's what I think. I'm like, oh, let's go for a
• 4:00
  hike. And I'm like, no, I, I think of
• 4:02
  how many bodies are buried and people haven't found it.
• 4:04
  He just kind of looked at me and he's like, OK, I'm like, well.
• 4:09
  OK. Now we moved out here to western
• 4:12
  Pennsylvania eight years ago, OK.
• 4:15
  And we bought a house that was that is very nice.
• 4:20
  It's the very first time we've had like a big beautiful home.
• 4:24
  I love your home and I've only seen pictures.
• 4:27
  Oh my goodness, it's it's, it's fun.
• 4:29
  It's a fun house. But so we live in a small town
• 4:33
  and so the good parts of town and the bad parts of town are
• 4:38
  like right next to each other because because it's just a
• 4:42
  small town, right? It's just only like 4 or 5000
• 4:44
  people that live here. Anyway, we moved here and we're
• 4:47
  thinking the word we're in a Norman Rockwell painting.
• 4:50
  This is straight, straight out of like white Christmas or, or
• 4:54
  some like amazing thing, right? And then like on the 4th day
• 4:59
  that we were here, fire engines go back past our house Roo and
• 5:03
  then cops start going by a few minutes later.
• 5:07
  We're like, what is going on? Well, it turns out the some dill
• 5:11
  hole two blocks away murdered a poor woman, took her out to the
• 5:17
  woods because our, our street we're like on we're we're very
• 5:21
  close to the woods. We're close to the edge of town.
• 5:24
  So like my little sister asked me, how far away is the country
• 5:28
  from where you live? Like next door.
• 5:31
  In the backyard. Yeah, but anyway, killed this
• 5:34
  poor woman, took her out to the woods, doused her with gasoline
• 5:41
  and lit her ablaze. No.
• 5:44
  Yeah, like we were. We've been here 4, maybe 5 days
• 5:47
  when this happened. Like, Oh my, it red.
• 5:50
  I would have moved. I would have been like, this is
• 5:52
  a sign we got to go, we got to. Go.
• 5:53
  And it was, it was literally on our street, right?
• 5:56
  So no. Because our street, our street
• 6:00
  ends being our street and becomes like this dirt lane
• 6:02
  going out into the woods. Yeah, The first thing I thought
• 6:07
  was, what an idiot. All you had to do is, like,
• 6:10
  leave her there. She would have been gone.
• 6:14
  She would have been gone in like a couple days.
• 6:19
  Do we know? Like was he caught?
• 6:20
  Was do we know who he was? Was was it someone she knew?
• 6:24
  Yes, it was a drug deal. It was a drug.
• 6:27
  Oh. Come on, not in white Christmas.
• 6:30
  I know I exactly aw. Man.
• 6:35
  But I was just thinking about like, in the woods, like, OK,
• 6:38
  the Pennsylvania forest, first of all, it's humid out here, and
• 6:41
  it is full of little woodland creatures that are like bears
• 6:45
  and foxes and mink and all just full, right?
• 6:50
  Yeah. All you'd have to do is put a
• 6:51
  body out there and it would be gone.
• 6:54
  Like that. So it was it, it was the fire
• 6:56
  like that, like the smoke and stuff like that that caught the
• 6:59
  attention. The smoke, yeah, people are
• 7:01
  like, there's a fire out in the woods.
• 7:03
  Oh my gosh. They go out, they drive out the
• 7:06
  fire. Fire engines go out there to
• 7:09
  report to the fire and go, well, there's only one thing burnt.
• 7:13
  The woods don't light on fire here, right?
• 7:15
  It's so damp, right? And so the only thing that is on
• 7:19
  fire is a poor woman who has been doused with an accelerant.
• 7:23
  And yeah, they were able to find him like that.
• 7:26
  Right away. Well, thank goodness for that, I
• 7:28
  guess. But what a way to welcome you
• 7:31
  into the neighborhood, I suppose.
• 7:33
  Yeah, yeah, that was, that was we, we learned really quick
• 7:36
  that, well, everywhere, everywhere is getting bad, I
• 7:40
  guess. Is it is so when you hear people
• 7:44
  say like, oh, like small town feel everybody knows everybody's
• 7:48
  business. Is that what is that the vibe
• 7:49
  you get? Like, do you know everybody's
• 7:51
  business? I don't care to know everybody,
• 7:54
  Everybody's business, and so I really don't, but everybody
• 7:58
  seems to know ours. Oh, OK.
• 8:01
  So I mean. What do they say?
• 8:04
  Oh, we're horrible people. No.
• 8:06
  Well, my wife works at a business downtown that that is a
• 8:10
  retail establishment. And so like everybody knows her
• 8:14
  and everybody, everybody likes her.
• 8:17
  And then in my case, like I, my day job is I write for the, for
• 8:22
  the local news company, right? So right, my name's on
• 8:25
  everything. Everybody, everybody knows me.
• 8:27
  But I think it's fine. Yeah, well, you're not out there
• 8:31
  dousing people in the forest. You would have done it a
• 8:33
  different way anyways, but yeah. Yeah, well.
• 8:39
  We already know now. Well, I was talking to my buddy
• 8:43
  back in California. I was just back there a couple
• 8:45
  weeks ago, Cherilyn. I just turned 50 years old, 50.
• 8:52
  That's how you look. Amazing.
• 8:54
  I love the new hair. Is that why you grew it out?
• 8:57
  I love it. I'm really loving it.
• 8:59
  I wanted to ask about it. So glad we are getting an
• 9:01
  opportunity to talk about it. Was this part of it like though?
• 9:04
  Like where you just like, listen, I'm 50, baby.
• 9:06
  Let's let's reinvent here. OK, So what happened was I
• 9:14
  always wanted to try long hair, but I've never gotten it past
• 9:20
  the stage where it's just like, it like really sucks to have,
• 9:24
  you know? And So what I know about myself
• 9:28
  is that if I announce a A cause or a purpose, I will make it
• 9:33
  through because I have this unreasonable fear of public
• 9:38
  failure. So I announced that I was going
• 9:43
  to grow up my hair to donate it. Oh.
• 9:46
  My God, I love that. And then what?
• 9:48
  Now, are you a tower or we're still going for a?
• 9:49
  Little We're still going, yeah, I've still got like 4 inches to
• 9:52
  go, but. Oh, that'll be so cool.
• 9:55
  So even if you want like they could, you know, you could do
• 9:57
  like a little bit of a ponytail and keep it if you're loving it.
• 10:00
  Yeah, I don't know. I don't like it very much.
• 10:02
  In fact, I, I had it trimmed last night.
• 10:05
  Speaking of knowing everybody's business, you go to, all you
• 10:08
  have to do is go to a salon and everybody knows everybody's
• 10:10
  business, right? 100%.
• 10:12
  So I don't know anything about long hair Cherylin look.
• 10:15
  I just I just part it in like. It looks good.
• 10:18
  In my. Heart, it looks shiny.
• 10:20
  You've got a little bit of a curl towards the end.
• 10:22
  I mean, this is really this is goals.
• 10:23
  I had to do that to myself. Well, I used.
• 10:27
  To do this thing, you know, you know, the Brady Bunch, where in
• 10:31
  the beginning misses Brady had that thing going on like this.
• 10:34
  That's what I looked like for months.
• 10:38
  So I've passed my Carol Brady stage.
• 10:42
  Now. I think I'm kind of in a Sandra
• 10:44
  D era because I I put on my daughter's like headband to keep
• 10:47
  it out of my out of my face. I love it.
• 10:52
  But anyway, I was the the hairdresser last night.
• 10:55
  She's like, So what do you want? Like, I don't know, I just
• 10:59
  really hate it and I don't know what to do.
• 11:02
  So she put layers in it for me. I I, I told her I wanted to
• 11:06
  still look like a man though. I.
• 11:09
  Thought you just like show this like I've got my layers now.
• 11:13
  No, I love it. You've got the curl it looks so
• 11:16
  cool. Have you done the the man bun
• 11:18
  yet? It's not.
• 11:20
  It's not long enough yet to really get it up on top.
• 11:22
  But when I work out, I put it in AI, put it in a bun when I work
• 11:26
  out, yeah. What does Kimberly think?
• 11:29
  She thinks I'm going to keep it, but I can't wait for it to be
• 11:32
  gone. OK, does she fan?
• 11:34
  Does she like it? Yeah, she likes it.
• 11:38
  I don't know, I think it accentuates my giant 6 head, you
• 11:42
  know, it's like I'm my old man receding hairline kind of thing.
• 11:47
  And. Yeah, we're not old.
• 11:51
  Well, you're not. Well, I will be.
• 11:54
  Eventually, yeah, that's like When Harry Met Sally and I'm
• 11:57
  going to be 40I. Am I'm going to be 40 next year,
• 12:04
  Literally. That's amazing.
• 12:06
  Yeah, I'm going to be 40 next year.
• 12:07
  Are you afraid of 40? No, I'm actually really excited.
• 12:11
  Yeah, yeah. 39 felt like 39 felt harder.
• 12:15
  I was just kind of like, oh, like 39.
• 12:18
  I'd rather because like my girlfriends, I think are
• 12:20
  thinking that like I'm going to probably like go into like some
• 12:24
  sort of like manic episode or something like that.
• 12:27
  So they're trying to like, plan, you know, some like, you know,
• 12:31
  like celebration, like, oh, let's go to BC to go to a wine
• 12:35
  tasting or how about New York and go, you know, watch some
• 12:38
  Broadway or so everyone's kind of making it a thing.
• 12:41
  So I think I was more like, oh, OK, well, I hope it's my 40th
• 12:44
  now instead of 39. So yeah, I think I'm I'm going
• 12:48
  to, I'm going to be OK. I was good with 40.
• 12:50
  Yeah, you're like, I was good with 40, Cherilyn.
• 12:53
  I was not good with 50. No, I have not liked this at
• 12:56
  all. Yeah, it's not been fun.
• 12:59
  But I mean, what do you do? Great.
• 13:03
  That's the thing for men. I feel like men, they get
• 13:06
  better. They get better with age.
• 13:08
  And then women, we've got this like pressure, I think, you
• 13:11
  know. I don't.
• 13:12
  I think you put that pressure on yourself.
• 13:15
  That's true. That could be.
• 13:16
  I actually do think that, actually, yeah.
• 13:19
  I mean, Kimberly just turned 50 yesterday.
• 13:24
  For 25 glorious days, I was married to a younger woman.
• 13:27
  Now she is the same age as me. Kimberly's goals?
• 13:32
  I would not be scared to turn 50 if I look like Kimberly.
• 13:34
  She is, she is amazing. She just, she ages so
• 13:38
  beautifully and gracefully so. There we go, right?
• 13:42
  She just, she just doesn't, she doesn't let the pressure get to
• 13:45
  her. Oh.
• 13:46
  My goodness, maybe that's part of it.
• 13:49
  Yeah, probably, You know, you're.
• 13:51
  Just kind of like, well, I mean, what can you do anyway?
• 13:53
  It's like freaking out over gas prices.
• 13:56
  You can't change it, so let's not, OK?
• 13:58
  That's going to be my motto going in.
• 14:01
  I still have quite a few years but here.
• 14:02
  We are. Yeah.
• 14:03
  You're you've got forever. You've got forever.
• 14:05
  Hey, I was listening to your podcast today.
• 14:08
  In fact, I told you before we went on, it's your fault that I
• 14:12
  forgot to post a bunch on social media today because I was
• 14:16
  devouring Elizabeth. I love that you listen to it.
• 14:20
  What did you? What are you thinking?
• 14:22
  Where are you I guess? What?
• 14:23
  Well, I remember, I remember when that video on TikTok came
• 14:29
  out and I said to myself, well, you took the time to like the
• 14:34
  lighting is fine. The the shot is pretty good.
• 14:39
  You set this up. Oh yeah.
• 14:42
  And, and I remember like I was going to comment and then I was
• 14:45
  like, no, Gavin, if you don't have anything nice to say
• 14:48
  online, just don't say it right. I.
• 14:51
  Would have loved to see that looking back.
• 14:54
  G Money. Just the lighting's great.
• 14:57
  I can see there was thought. No, it was planned for sure,
• 15:01
  yeah. Oh, oh, of course everything
• 15:03
  with Elizabeth is. OK, so I I am at right now, like
• 15:08
  for the last two hours I've been saying I've just been like
• 15:12
  screaming Andrew. Are you screaming at Andrew?
• 15:16
  I was just going to say it's at Andrew isn't.
• 15:17
  It What are you doing, man? Tell everybody what Elizabeth is
• 15:21
  about. Oh my gosh.
• 15:23
  OK. Elizabeth.
• 15:26
  Yeah. So Elizabeth is about Elizabeth
• 15:28
  Tekkenbrock and she is a there is literally no way to explain
• 15:34
  Elizabeth Tekkenbrock. This woman is the con artist of
• 15:39
  all con artists. I love that picture though.
• 15:41
  That was great. Yeah, that is a good picture.
• 15:43
  Hold on, we'll go there. All right.
• 15:45
  She is the con artist of all con artists.
• 15:48
  As you can see, that is a picture of her.
• 15:50
  She is beautiful. So that actually kind of like
• 15:52
  helps the appeal. But she has been lying her whole
• 15:56
  entire life. And it just gets more insane and
• 16:00
  more insane. And you know what?
• 16:02
  There wouldn't be a problem if she was just kind of like a
• 16:04
  chronic liar, except she ruins people's lives.
• 16:07
  Absolutely everybody that she comes into contact with, their
• 16:12
  life is worse. After meeting Elizabeth, Jack
• 16:16
  and Brock. She has scammed multiple.
• 16:20
  We used to say men, and now we actually have a female victim
• 16:25
  who's going to be in the second season.
• 16:28
  She's a huge part of the second season.
• 16:31
  She was scammed out of $400,000. Yeah, thinking that she was
• 16:39
  helping her best friend that she believed was dying of cancer.
• 16:43
  So she has faked cancer. I think we're on like 5 or 6
• 16:47
  times right now. Multiple elderly men.
• 16:53
  Both of them are just under $1,000,000.
• 16:55
  So that's about two million. We, we don't even know where
• 16:59
  we're at right now. We, we just kind of guesstimate
• 17:01
  for $4 million at this point. There's so many victims though.
• 17:05
  Like so, so many. What is she doing with all that
• 17:08
  money? That's the that's the big thing.
• 17:11
  So she spends it very, very frivolously.
• 17:15
  It's like going on yachts, buying design, going on trips,
• 17:20
  taking other people on trips. She gives this facade that her
• 17:24
  family is extremely well off. She kills her family off all the
• 17:29
  time too. So it's funny.
• 17:30
  She causes friction in every relationship that she's in so
• 17:34
  that no one will talk to one another and they won't pick up
• 17:38
  on the lies. So she'll say, you know, like
• 17:42
  her, her grandma's dead, her dad's dead.
• 17:44
  But then in the mean, you know, on the second hand, she'll say
• 17:47
  that her dad is some big mob guy, big drug dealer, and she's
• 17:50
  funneling a lot of his money. So it'll be like, oh, yeah, I
• 17:54
  have $20 million coming. Literally, these are the amounts
• 17:57
  that she used, $58 million coming.
• 17:59
  I just need to borrow $100,000 from you.
• 18:02
  And she makes it like so, you know, convincing that she's, you
• 18:07
  know, of the status. She she said that her grandma
• 18:10
  owned Tampa General Hospital. And it's just so insane.
• 18:16
  But when you but one thing that people say when they talk to her
• 18:20
  is she's so convincing and quick.
• 18:22
  She's been doing this her whole life that she really doesn't
• 18:25
  skip a beat, even when she's like kind of called out.
• 18:28
  She's already got, you know, some story or some way of
• 18:33
  rebounding and she'll she'll admit to certain things, you
• 18:35
  know, she'll be, oh, I did lie about that because that's
• 18:38
  because of this. And obviously a big part of it
• 18:40
  is Andrew these days, you know, he's this crazy Scientologist
• 18:45
  abusive husband that she had to lie to get out of the the
• 18:49
  marriage for. So that's why she faked cancer.
• 18:51
  It's just, it's exhaust. I'm exhausted, Gavin.
• 18:54
  I'm exhausted. What what brought you to the
• 18:57
  story? Was it that first video on
• 19:00
  TikTok? So that first video kind of got,
• 19:04
  yeah, got everybody. And then when I was invested,
• 19:08
  when Andrew came on with his side of everything, and then
• 19:11
  you're just kind of like, Oh my God.
• 19:12
  So you don't even have custody of these children that you said
• 19:14
  were crying, you know, for you on your birthday.
• 19:18
  So that kind of like piqued the interest.
• 19:20
  And then I started following and again, she's very good, right?
• 19:23
  So she was kind of doing. Andrew would come on and say
• 19:27
  something and then she'd have a rebuttal and she can change her
• 19:30
  voice in like even in her eyes, like it makes like to make her
• 19:33
  look scared, right? So then all of a sudden it was,
• 19:36
  he's right. I did lie about things and it's,
• 19:39
  you know, there's things that he's done that I would never
• 19:41
  say. And so then all of a sudden
• 19:43
  she's sprinkling this domestic violence accusation.
• 19:47
  And then of course, you don't want to be the person to be
• 19:49
  like, you're full of shit. You've you're not a battered
• 19:51
  housewife. Like we don't know.
• 19:54
  So that got her going for like another year.
• 19:57
  And then from there, it was just what was the biggest catalyst
• 20:02
  that got us? Going with it, I think it was, I
• 20:09
  think it was when one of Andrew's supporters was able to
• 20:13
  pull up records and we were able to see actual like police
• 20:18
  records, court transcripts, and Oh yes, and then the body Cam
• 20:24
  footage of one of her victims. This is her right?
• 20:27
  I'm like, oh, I love it. See, I'm blocked.
• 20:29
  I don't get to see any of this anymore.
• 20:31
  She. Is still posting like these are
• 20:33
  these are videos from this month?
• 20:35
  Yeah, she. Yeah.
• 20:36
  So right now she's on a little bit of my hiatus.
• 20:39
  That's the scary thing. That is the scary thing.
• 20:42
  She is still posting. She knows that she a girl, yeah,
• 20:46
  a girl that made mistakes trying to redeem herself.
• 20:48
  So that's always the thing too, right?
• 20:49
  Like she tries to buy back trust.
• 20:53
  And she knows that there's an FBI investigation right now on
• 20:57
  her. And it it's surprising because
• 21:01
  she will keep coming back. So right now she's on a hiatus
• 21:04
  because she's been called out for scamming new people, not so
• 21:09
  much for money, but trying to live for free and freeload off
• 21:14
  of these these these girls at the their house.
• 21:18
  They were new friends. And then they caught her in a
• 21:20
  bunch of lies. And it was just like, it was
• 21:22
  such a new friendship. They only knew her for like a
• 21:25
  weekend, I think. And there was like all this
• 21:27
  trauma and drama that happened in the matter of like 48 hours
• 21:31
  of knowing this broad. So they went on to go share
• 21:34
  their story. So now she's off again because
• 21:37
  she's like, I'm like, Elizabeth, so many people are looking at
• 21:39
  you right now. Like so many people have
• 21:43
  questions. And she had.
• 21:46
  I've never seen someone with no shame to this degree.
• 21:49
  She will continue to come back unless she's in jail.
• 21:52
  But if we're talking about 4,000,000 bucks, you know, if,
• 21:56
  if you just if, if you were a good scammer and you scammed $4
• 22:00
  million, you could just put that in the stock market and live off
• 22:05
  of the growth for the rest of your life and you would live
• 22:08
  well, yeah. You'd think so.
• 22:11
  That's what everybody says. They go, what?
• 22:14
  So that's part of it. People are like, did she
• 22:16
  actually? Because where's the money?
• 22:18
  How do you spend that? And it's things on like a
• 22:20
  private jet and going on trips and these lavish everything is
• 22:25
  just like over the top. And then she spends it all and
• 22:27
  then she's living in the slums in in Florida.
• 22:32
  It's until she scams somebody else.
• 22:36
  Oh my goodness, that is. And then it's also the emotional
• 22:40
  thing too. So another thing that she does
• 22:42
  is she gets very, very close to, you know, girls specifically.
• 22:46
  It's like the best friend that like she can't ever be alone.
• 22:49
  So she's so intense. She love bombs so quickly,
• 22:54
  basically like moves in and lives with, you know, different
• 22:57
  girls at different periods of time.
• 22:59
  And then it's usually it'll be like the cancer thing, like, Oh
• 23:02
  my God, I, I think I, it's the cancer's back or whatever.
• 23:05
  And then it's terminal. And then she'll say to them, you
• 23:10
  know, I love you so much. I I want you to have, I want you
• 23:14
  to, to take custody of my children when I'm gone, you
• 23:19
  know, like I want you to get to. I want, I want you to get close
• 23:22
  to them. So then all of a sudden these
• 23:24
  friends are picking up the kids that she does see.
• 23:27
  She's got 4. She does not see the two with
• 23:30
  Andrew. She actually tells people that
• 23:32
  those two are not even hers, that he had an affair with a
• 23:35
  stripper and she decided to try to parent them.
• 23:39
  I mean, it's insane. Yeah.
• 23:41
  So the other two, she'll, she'll say to these people like, you
• 23:45
  know, can you pick them up from school?
• 23:46
  They, I want them to get used to this new routine.
• 23:49
  Can you do this? I'm going to go out, you stay
• 23:51
  with them, do the bedtime routine.
• 23:54
  Really she's just got a babysitter for six months or
• 23:56
  until they catch on. And then it's like, oh, I'm, you
• 24:00
  know, can I borrow some of this? I'm going to go see my parents
• 24:03
  out, you know, wherever I'm going here.
• 24:06
  Can you pay for my flight? And I left all of all of my
• 24:10
  money and in my will to you, you know, it's, it's millions and
• 24:14
  millions of dollars. So when I die, like you'll get
• 24:17
  paid back everything I owe you. It's just so a lot of it is like
• 24:22
  emotional as well. So one of the things, OK,
• 24:26
  Andrew, is he like an ophthalmologist or something
• 24:28
  like that? Yeah.
• 24:30
  Andrew. Andrew's Andrew.
• 24:32
  Yeah, so he went to Med school, right?
• 24:35
  Yeah, right. Yeah, you have to.
• 24:38
  Right. Like if I'm working with eyes.
• 24:40
  Yes, that is a medical doctor. Yeah, he's a doctor, right?
• 24:45
  He's like Doctor. Andrew, it's an OD, right?
• 24:47
  Or whatever it is. But anyway, like she's talking
• 24:51
  about having stage 4 lymphoma and needing a lung transplant
• 24:56
  and then a liver transplant and Doctor Andrew has not caught on.
• 25:02
  I was dying, Cherylin. I was dying.
• 25:05
  I know, I know. Everybody's been yelling.
• 25:08
  Everybody's been yelling. I've been yelling at Andrew.
• 25:11
  Sometimes it's just like, well, that you know, and he does, I
• 25:15
  think he does admit, you know, yeah, quite a bit slipped,
• 25:19
  slipped through there. But when he she did come, I
• 25:23
  think it was when it was the surgery, that's when he was
• 25:27
  like, I want to see this, you know, like I want to talk to
• 25:31
  them. Because she was lucky around
• 25:33
  then she had a little bit more yes, she had more leeway, right.
• 25:37
  So he wasn't able to go to these appointments.
• 25:39
  And then that's when all of a sudden she she creates and
• 25:42
  fabricates this entire Google suite e-mail chain between all
• 25:46
  of these different doctors and then was sending things to
• 25:49
  Andrew. And then again, he was like,
• 25:52
  this treatment plan doesn't make sense though.
• 25:55
  Like I need to come to this next appointment.
• 25:57
  And then what do you know it, she goes to the next appointment
• 26:00
  and there's been a miracle. She doesn't need any surgery or
• 26:03
  something happened and she is better.
• 26:07
  But she even like claimed she was in chemotherapy and stuff
• 26:10
  like that, right? Oh yeah, had the whole like she
• 26:13
  she just pictures of like a chemo port, but then it moves
• 26:17
  depending on the picture. She's freaking.
• 26:20
  She's a freaking dill hole. So has she come after you at all
• 26:26
  on this? Yeah, she, she actually, I
• 26:30
  wonder, I don't think it's on there on her thing anymore, but
• 26:32
  she she was praising the podcast.
• 26:35
  She was like, listen, if this wasn't about me, this podcast is
• 26:39
  it's great. They did such a good job.
• 26:42
  My goodness. But yeah, she's kind of gone
• 26:45
  back and forth. So she'll she will try to, you
• 26:48
  know, reach out to work to figure out how she could
• 26:51
  potentially be involved and share her story to I'm going to
• 26:56
  sue you and all of this stuff. It's like babe, tell us where we
• 26:59
  lied and then you can sue us. Yeah.
• 27:03
  Well, she knows she can't. I'd wondered about that because
• 27:06
  you're Canadian, you are producing in Canada, you have
• 27:12
  very different rules in Canada, I would say that are a little
• 27:16
  less friendly to free speech than here in the here in the
• 27:19
  States. And when I was listening, and
• 27:24
  the reason that I might have a little bit of experience on
• 27:26
  this, Sherilyn, is because I've gotten a lot of threatening
• 27:29
  things out of Canada. I covered a case in Canada.
• 27:31
  Romina Shaw, have you heard? Of remember Remina?
• 27:35
  Yeah, you scared me from talking about it.
• 27:37
  Oh dude, her husband. Her, I think they did divorce
• 27:43
  before she was murdered. He full on is, is mopped up.
• 27:47
  He is a gangster and oh, he, he reached out to me and then his
• 27:54
  lawyer reached out to me and then, and then he was indicted
• 27:58
  and I didn't have to worry about it so much.
• 28:02
  But one of the things that they put in the, in their letters to
• 28:06
  me was this letter is copyrighted.
• 28:08
  So you may not share this letter online.
• 28:10
  And I said to myself, dude, this is the United States of America.
• 28:15
  Have you ever heard of free use? Like I'm going, I'm going to
• 28:19
  share this and I'm going to tell people why it's bogus, right?
• 28:22
  But anyway. Were you able to because of the
• 28:25
  cross? Like because like it was sent to
• 28:28
  you. Well, in the 1st amendment
• 28:32
  protects me here now, if he would have if he would have
• 28:36
  pushed it in Canada, I would have I would have had problems
• 28:40
  because Canada, you guys don't you the the Commonwealth
• 28:44
  countries, Cherylin and I'm I'm apolitical this on the show, but
• 28:50
  the Commonwealth nations align more closely to Great Britain
• 28:55
  than they do to us. Like we we rejected Great
• 28:59
  Britain in our history. I'm taking credit for it as an
• 29:02
  American. It was my ancestors right that
• 29:04
  rejected Great Britain and the Commonwealth nations.
• 29:08
  Just you guys. You guys think that you're free,
• 29:10
  but you don't have the same freedoms we have.
• 29:13
  That's actually you guys think you're free.
• 29:15
  That's actually really true. So I don't know.
• 29:17
  I mean, I just look at it by, you know, we're, we're, we're
• 29:22
  and telling people stories and this is their truth.
• 29:26
  Chelsea's in Florida though, so she so I guess it would have
• 29:30
  been interesting if anything happened, but really at the end
• 29:32
  of the day, it's like everything has been, you know, vetted and
• 29:37
  fact checked and it's that's it's true.
• 29:42
  This is the things that she's done to people.
• 29:44
  So. Come at us.
• 29:45
  And she knows it. Yeah, she knows it.
• 29:47
  She even said it's funny, she said.
• 29:49
  And I don't know if it was on a live or something like that, but
• 29:53
  it was that it I'm not going to come out and say everything that
• 29:58
  I've done. What they've said on the podcast
• 30:01
  is pretty much true. And then she said that, you
• 30:04
  know, there's like a couple things that aren't so I don't
• 30:08
  know. So she's.
• 30:09
  Admitting. To her or whatever, Yeah.
• 30:11
  So she won't say what specifically.
• 30:14
  I mean, I don't know what that does if she's saying that
• 30:17
  primarily everything is true on it, knowing that you're being
• 30:20
  investigated by the FBI. But yeah.
• 30:24
  Well, listen, yeah, the FBI is going to have jurisdiction if
• 30:27
  she did it across state lines, and it sounds like she did.
• 30:31
  Oh yeah, that's the biggest thing.
• 30:33
  So I think that that's what we're.
• 30:35
  It takes a long time, but I know up until a couple weeks ago, one
• 30:40
  of the one of the victim's family members, they're not
• 30:44
  participating in the season, but did reach out to Chelsea to say
• 30:48
  we know that things are feeling like they're moving more than
• 30:51
  they have. So yeah, it's good.
• 30:57
  It's sounding. Yeah.
• 30:58
  And that's what I was thinking too, because I was watching
• 31:00
  something similar. I probably Scamanda or something
• 31:04
  like that. I always say that it's similar
• 31:05
  to like Scamanda or apple cider vinegar.
• 31:08
  Like they both just you know, had a baby and the spawn of
• 31:12
  Elizabeth came out. But I think they were able to
• 31:15
  get a scamanda on the cross state lines thing.
• 31:20
  Yeah, yeah. Well, and if, if, if she's
• 31:24
  emailing what she was, she she set up a whole Google like she
• 31:28
  set up a legal practice basically, right then.
• 31:32
  Yeah, that's, that's illegal use of a communication facility.
• 31:36
  That's a federal law. That's hey, I'm going to bring
• 31:40
  this picture back up again. You just sent this to me.
• 31:42
  This is one of my favorite pictures ever.
• 31:45
  It's mine too. Look how adorable we are.
• 31:48
  This is when we. First met.
• 31:50
  This was the first time we met. This was at Camp David.
• 31:53
  This was Camp David, very special place for all of us.
• 31:57
  Yeah, Camp David refers to David Elmquist.
• 32:01
  If you guys don't know about David, well, one thing you can
• 32:06
  do is you can check the stack Deck, which is a podcast that
• 32:12
  Cherylin produced with David's father Scott.
• 32:17
  The other thing you could do is you go to my website, go into
• 32:20
  cases, and David is in here. David has a has a big case page
• 32:26
  here on the site that gives you all all the info so much.
• 32:34
  There's and I think I that's where I would definitely
• 32:37
  recommend going for sure, because that specifically the
• 32:40
  crime scene photos, I think once you see that it's, you have to
• 32:44
  see it. Yeah, like for example this one.
• 32:48
  Yeah. This one broke my.
• 32:50
  Brain and the corner there. Right, the burnt corner.
• 32:54
  Yeah. So guys, David Elmquist, man,
• 32:57
  how old? David was 24 years old, living
• 33:00
  in the Twin Cities area, Minneapolis, Saint Paul.
• 33:04
  And Speaking of fires, right? The the the the story that his
• 33:11
  wife told was that he poured on himself some crude oil.
• 33:17
  He worked in the he worked in the the oil fields in North
• 33:22
  Dakota. Yeah, that he poured upon
• 33:27
  himself some crude oil that he that he kept as a souvenir and
• 33:32
  lit himself ablaze in their kitchen.
• 33:35
  And the police and the fire Marshall kind of believed her.
• 33:43
  I think that she poured it on him and and lit him ablaze.
• 33:49
  It's a it's a sad, sad story. Go to go to the website and
• 33:52
  this. Yeah, there's, there's so much,
• 33:55
  I think. Also, do you have the photos of
• 33:58
  his wrists there? I do not.
• 34:00
  I've not published those anywhere.
• 34:02
  OK. Has Scott started to be OK
• 34:05
  publishing those? Yeah, I mean they have them on
• 34:08
  their Instagram. I believe they have them here.
• 34:14
  I have or on the Change.org. I'll send you just so people can
• 34:22
  kind of see what we're if you're come if you don't want to put
• 34:24
  it. As long as Scott and Nancy are
• 34:26
  OK with it. I'm yeah, this is from this is
• 34:29
  from, I believe their their Change.org or no, this was the I
• 34:35
  think Amy put it on the Instagram.
• 34:40
  It's not what like what we saw, although I would say that that
• 34:44
  made me even more not that I needed any convincing, but to
• 34:53
  see a fuller photo of his body, to see the difference, almost
• 34:58
  like it looked like a line. And that the, the burns were
• 35:03
  much stronger where the dishwasher was, which is where
• 35:07
  we know that the, that, that was the primary source of the, of
• 35:11
  the heat. So that to me it's like, well,
• 35:14
  she was the one standing there. She she admitted that.
• 35:17
  Yeah, And Tiff? No, He succumbed to his injuries
• 35:20
  and died. He's 24 years old.
• 35:23
  After being in After being left in the apartment for 45 minutes
• 35:32
  while the Hennepin County Sheriff.
• 35:38
  What it What are they Sheriff's Department?
• 35:41
  After they left him in. There.
• 35:43
  Yeah, apparently they thought that he had a knife, was the
• 35:47
  story. So they wouldn't go in and he
• 35:49
  was suffering and died at the hospital a little little while
• 35:53
  later. This brings me.
• 35:54
  This is This Is Us at the apartment building.
• 35:57
  Cherylin, look at us go. I love this.
• 36:00
  We've got a giant next to his little friend his.
• 36:05
  Little friend, that is me, the little Hobbit.
• 36:11
  Oh my God, I love it. You do make me feel like really
• 36:14
  tall. I I I am a tall person, but I.
• 36:18
  Because how how tall are you? You're like at least 60. 2.
• 36:22
  OK, I was going to say you at least are a foot because I'm 51,
• 36:25
  so a foot and more. Yeah, yeah.
• 36:27
  So, but everybody should check out that case that that well,
• 36:33
  the podcast I and I haven't listened to the podcast yet, but
• 36:39
  I know the case very well. Yeah, it was written by it was
• 36:43
  written and primarily narrated by David's dad.
• 36:46
  So you can definitely hear a lot of his emotion and plea and
• 36:51
  everything like that in there, which I think is powerful.
• 36:55
  I mean, I, I think that I think you and I still have plans for
• 36:58
  David. There's just something about
• 37:01
  about that case that it just won't let it, will it?
• 37:06
  I can't let it go. Well, that day, I think it was
• 37:10
  this very day, we were out of Camp David.
• 37:15
  We were working together. We had just met what the that
• 37:18
  day or the night before or something like that.
• 37:22
  Yeah. And was it was it this night
• 37:25
  that we were in the what happened to everybody is Scott
• 37:28
  and Nancy Elmquist, David's folks and and his sister Amy
• 37:33
  invited us to their home. And so you flew from Canada.
• 37:37
  I flew from PA and we met there in Twin Cities and and we stayed
• 37:43
  with them. It was it was awesome.
• 37:46
  You stayed in there like little guest quarters down in the
• 37:49
  basement and I stayed in the camper outside.
• 37:51
  It was awesome, right. But that I think it was this
• 37:55
  night, it may have been the next night where we went till like
• 38:00
  the wee hours of the morning in their living room of their house
• 38:04
  talking about the case. And Scott, like, if I could
• 38:08
  characterize Scott, Scott is a financial planner, I think is
• 38:11
  what he does for a living. He's very much the stereotypical
• 38:18
  financial planner, I would say, right.
• 38:20
  He's he's a very, very by the numbers, by the book kind of a
• 38:24
  guy. And he had a moment where he
• 38:27
  like, I, I think, I don't think anybody was his target, but Amy
• 38:32
  was in the way emotionally. And he he let out this emotional
• 38:39
  just cry this, this just deep level of frustration that was so
• 38:46
  powerful. And Amy was graceful through the
• 38:48
  whole thing. She was, she just expressed so
• 38:51
  much grace. But that's a moment that I will
• 38:54
  never forget. These poor people lost their son
• 38:57
  to a murder and nobody cares. Yeah, it's frustrating.
• 39:07
  And it is those moments that are so important to see, I think
• 39:13
  first hand as hard as it can be, right.
• 39:16
  It's not all, I mean, of course when you are are, you know,
• 39:19
  we're like, oh, look at we're, we're there.
• 39:21
  We were kind of doing some, some spy work.
• 39:23
  We've broken into the some swooping in into the parking
• 39:28
  garage. So, you know, like there's those
• 39:32
  moments that I'm like, oh, that was fun.
• 39:34
  But in the same sense it was happy, right?
• 39:36
  Like it was by the end of the night, you know, you're like
• 39:40
  decompressing, going through everything and kind of
• 39:44
  recentering to the, the, the real picture why we're there.
• 39:50
  You know, David wasn't. David's not there.
• 39:52
  Yeah, I wish I was doing more of that still like my my channel
• 39:57
  has pivoted quite a bit to to more of a live stream format.
• 40:01
  It's almost exclusively live stream but I'm hoping as I'm
• 40:06
  cutting back more and more hours from my day job that.
• 40:09
  I'll be able to get to kind of those deep dives going and
• 40:12
  visiting families that visiting the Elmquest was, was, I mean
• 40:18
  that that's kind of a moment in my life.
• 40:20
  That's kind of a me. Too, And that's what I want to
• 40:23
  do for sure too. I would love to kind of look
• 40:26
  more into that, you know, being there, being like, you know,
• 40:31
  immersed in it and more documentaries that we kind of
• 40:36
  talked about. I don't know, we need to
• 40:38
  infiltrate that that freaking side of things because it's just
• 40:43
  when you start talking to people who, you know, participate and
• 40:47
  just share, of course, there's you're so desperate to Share
• 40:51
  your story that you're just like, yes, I'll do it.
• 40:55
  I don't. They don't know the legalities,
• 40:57
  the logistics, the ethics behind it and how much people have just
• 41:02
  lost their morals when it comes to doing things like producing
• 41:08
  these documentaries and not giving a shit.
• 41:09
  When Colby and I were talking on his life, he was talking about
• 41:16
  the documentary that he did for Netflix and how he would, he
• 41:21
  just was going to give up talking about anything all
• 41:24
  together. Like he was just like, I, I will
• 41:26
  never do another interview. I he, he just had just the, you
• 41:29
  know, the worst taste in his mouth because it was not what
• 41:33
  they agreed to. They did this full documentary.
• 41:35
  He got all of these, you know, his whole family involved,
• 41:38
  poured his heart and soul into it, thinking that it was going
• 41:41
  to be one way. And it was the polar opposite.
• 41:44
  There were people in there who he specifically said he did not
• 41:47
  want in that were, you know, looked at it as sources and it
• 41:52
  and it was just like really like that.
• 41:54
  You could have, he even said you could have interviewed so many
• 41:57
  other people. I could have got you this person
• 41:59
  or this person who really knows what they're talking about and
• 42:02
  not just wanting, you know, airtime.
• 42:04
  So he was really, you know, let down.
• 42:08
  And the more I hear about this with the more people that I
• 42:11
  talked to who have participated in these types of things, it's
• 42:14
  really just, it's just icky. It's actually made me kind of go
• 42:17
  on this, I don't know, crusade of I kind of want to get my foot
• 42:22
  in that door and just start doing, start cracking the whip.
• 42:25
  Well, I don't. I have participated in two pre
• 42:31
  productions, one of which actually is on Hulu right now.
• 42:38
  I think. So in the Ellen Greenberg case,
• 42:41
  in fact, actually me tangent here for a second, I had a
• 42:44
  moment similar to what we had with Scott and Nancy and Amy,
• 42:51
  the Elm quests with Josh and Sandy Greenberg one time in
• 42:54
  their home in in Harrisburg. And it was, it was like, it was
• 42:58
  like we all just recognized what just happened, right?
• 43:03
  It was, it was a, it was the same kind of thing like, and
• 43:06
  Josh and Sandy Greenberg have been so graceful with how they
• 43:11
  have navigated 15 years of trying to get justice for their
• 43:17
  daughter and they have never had an outburst.
• 43:20
  They have never lost their cool. They have always been just class
• 43:25
  acts all the way. But we had one of those moments
• 43:27
  where I was just like, oh man, you are feeling this.
• 43:30
  It's not, you know, you, you are having to publicly keep all of
• 43:35
  that down in order to get to where it is that you want to be.
• 43:41
  And it's, I mean, it's simultaneously sad and, and
• 43:47
  inspiring that that somebody is like that, right?
• 43:50
  But getting back to like I started, I started working on
• 43:55
  this documentary on Ellen with a, with a partner.
• 43:58
  And I, I, I was the junior partner.
• 44:00
  Definitely, you know, I, I had fewer bona fides.
• 44:03
  And I was told, you know, I'm going to fund this and we're
• 44:08
  going to get it done. And, and I said to myself,
• 44:11
  great, because I had, I'd done a pre, pre production of the
• 44:16
  Amanda Winkowski case. And man, just the way that that
• 44:21
  company, I won't name them. And it's not that they're a bad
• 44:24
  company, it's that they work in an industry that's so horrible
• 44:28
  that they kind of have to behave that way.
• 44:30
  But I didn't want to do that. And so I agreed, yes, I will, I
• 44:34
  will help on this project. And then like maybe 2 years into
• 44:38
  it, Lionsgate was brought in and then I'm talking with lawyers
• 44:44
  and I'm talking with like, no, you guys are so freaking
• 44:49
  predatory. You're so predatory that I just
• 44:53
  don't want anything to do with it.
• 44:54
  And I love Ellen and I love Josh and Sandy and I love Laura, you
• 44:58
  know, the, the other producer. I love you all, but I got to go
• 45:02
  because I hate this. And I don't think, I don't.
• 45:07
  I don't think to get a story out there, we need that anyway.
• 45:10
  I don't think we need Hollywood. We don't need Netflix or Hulu or
• 45:14
  anything like that. We can just tell stories.
• 45:17
  Exactly, which I love and I think if anything, it's the it's
• 45:21
  it's kind of the like the plan that we that, you know, we've
• 45:25
  always kind of had like even for David's case of like going out
• 45:28
  there now we've already been boots on the ground K where do
• 45:31
  we want to go back? What would we want to fitly
• 45:33
  focus on and like film that ourselves?
• 45:36
  And I mean, you can produce great quality things like
• 45:39
  whether it starts on YouTube and then maybe that does get picked
• 45:42
  up. But I mean, if you're working
• 45:43
  with with the correct sound and all of like those metrics, you
• 45:49
  know that that a documentary potentially would want to pick
• 45:53
  up later. Well, we've already done done
• 45:56
  the work. Then we you sell it, right?
• 45:57
  Like, yeah, we don't have to work with anybody.
• 46:00
  Yeah. And I think that's where we need
• 46:02
  like more people need to get to more, more storytellers, I guess
• 46:05
  people who are working with families.
• 46:08
  That needs to be the focus as opposed to this big
• 46:11
  conglomerate. Did you ever meet La Donna
• 46:14
  Humphrey like a. Gavin.
• 46:18
  Have you do you know? What's going on with La Donna
• 46:22
  Humphrey? I know that there's a lot going
• 46:24
  on, but I'm going to ignore it for a second, OK?
• 46:26
  How excited you talk about it is OK, I'm going to let you go
• 46:29
  first. I'm.
• 46:29
  Going to ignore it for a second because she did something that
• 46:31
  was pretty awesome out of her own pocket.
• 46:33
  She spent I think 70 grand. Yeah.
• 46:37
  And she created a documentary and she put it on YouTube and in
• 46:41
  like 2 weeks it got a million views and then Amazon picked it
• 46:44
  up. Right.
• 46:46
  See, that's that's the thing. We'll take that from La Donna.
• 46:49
  Yeah, OK. By the way, just Full
• 46:51
  disclosure, I like La Donna. I'm friends with La Donna.
• 46:56
  I totally am. Tell me why I'm not.
• 46:57
  I shouldn't be I guess. No, I don't want to say when you
• 47:01
  should, when you shouldn't be. OK.
• 47:03
  Have you? Did you listen to the podcast?
• 47:07
  I have not listened to. No, I have not.
• 47:10
  OK, so it's it's called Who's Afraid of Ladonna Humphrey?
• 47:12
  Yes. I'll just say it.
• 47:16
  I'll just say I'll just say listen to it.
• 47:18
  Maybe, maybe listen to it. So here's my experience.
• 47:22
  This is what shocked me because I didn't realize until I
• 47:27
  listened to that podcast and he's talking about the Dark
• 47:33
  secret podcast that she had that I met her when we were at Crime
• 47:39
  Con you. We were in London together.
• 47:41
  Yeah, yeah. And I was like, Oh my gosh, I
• 47:45
  met her and she's she was telling me the story about them
• 47:51
  being, you know, stalked and harassed by who potentially
• 47:56
  could be this this predator of her Co host who was like this
• 48:02
  survivor of, you know, like the dark web and stuff like that.
• 48:06
  And then they thought could potentially be linked to the
• 48:09
  case that she had worked really hard on and did the documentary
• 48:13
  with. And it was her, like she had
• 48:16
  accidentally screen shared something with Alicia and she
• 48:22
  saw in the corner that the e-mail address and the code like
• 48:26
  the, you know, like you see your little dial or whatever it was
• 48:29
  this sleuth master or who, whatever.
• 48:32
  Oh, she was stalking herself. She was stalking her and the
• 48:36
  victim who was her podcast Co host For content Gavin you have
• 48:42
  to listen to this. OK, Dang it.
• 48:45
  It is wild, but I would love to, I would love to know more, you
• 48:49
  know, like about other sides and stuff like that.
• 48:51
  And I will say I'm not going to out the person who said it, but
• 48:54
  I will say there is an somebody else that I've talked to in the
• 48:58
  true crime space who is kind of on the fence and is just like
• 49:01
  also being like, like, I kind of like her.
• 49:07
  I do believe what happened though.
• 49:08
  But also I don't know if I like the way that she was kind of
• 49:12
  baited on the podcast. And also I'm like, I don't know,
• 49:15
  there are still people out there who who are still.
• 49:21
  When this happened, so I had just I met La Donna at the same
• 49:26
  like we went out to dinner, like all the all the creators went
• 49:28
  out to get to dinner and I was at a table with La Donna and was
• 49:34
  her name Alicia? Yeah, and another woman who's
• 49:40
  she's she's awesome. I can't remember her name right
• 49:43
  now. I'm blanking on her name.
• 49:44
  Anyway, so that was the first time I ever met them or heard
• 49:48
  about anything. And boy did it suck me down a
• 49:51
  rabbit hole. The whole dark web thing, just
• 49:53
  like what? But anyway.
• 49:55
  That was me. Yeah.
• 49:58
  But at the time I had, I had kind of had to reinvent myself
• 50:05
  out of my career from I worked in high end audio for a lot of
• 50:08
  years and I had worked, I had worked for a company called
• 50:12
  Light Harmonic, later called LH Labs.
• 50:15
  And I was the, I was the sales guy and I was the face of the
• 50:19
  company and everything that the company did, everybody thought
• 50:21
  that I was the owner. I had no ownership in the
• 50:23
  company. I just was the the guy that was
• 50:27
  the sales guy, right? And I and I freaking did a great
• 50:31
  job. But what ended up happening is
• 50:33
  we did crowdfunding in the order of like $10 million, right?
• 50:37
  Right, right, I remember. This and I think, I think Larry
• 50:40
  and the company delivered something like 4 million of it
• 50:43
  and then they just, and so all of a sudden that was my fault
• 50:47
  and it was all over. It was all over everywhere.
• 50:52
  It's kind of blacklisted and I thought, well, is the same thing
• 50:56
  happening to Ladonna? That's what I was like is this
• 51:01
  is she is the same thing that happened to me happening to her.
• 51:05
  And so I've always given her the benefit of the doubt.
• 51:08
  But no, I've not listened to the podcast.
• 51:10
  I haven't. I haven't done any of the
• 51:13
  digging. I will say listen to the podcast
• 51:15
  because Alicia is not the only person who has had scary
• 51:21
  encounters. I'll say that.
• 51:24
  So anybody listening who's a little bit, you know, curious,
• 51:29
  it's called Who's Afraid of LA, Donna Humphrey.
• 51:31
  And if I were her and I would have seen the cover art for this
• 51:36
  podcast, Diabolical, straight to jail.
• 51:40
  I would have sued Gavin. You're not ready.
• 51:45
  You are not. I would have sued for the
• 51:47
  podcast art alone. OK, I'm about to see it.
• 51:56
  Oh, no, no, yeah. Oh no.
• 52:05
  Is this the one? No.
• 52:07
  Yeah, OK, That's it. Diabolical, you guys.
• 52:11
  It's Oh my God. Wow.
• 52:15
  Yeah. So that's it?
• 52:16
  Yeah, you'll go down a rabbit hole.
• 52:18
  I don't, you know what, do you have a mug shot anywhere?
• 52:21
  I don't have a mug shot anywhere.
• 52:24
  I do, but I think our laws in Canada are quite tight.
• 52:27
  You have a mug shot. I do.
• 52:31
  Wow, are you a hardened criminal?
• 52:34
  No, I pled guilty to a mischief charge.
• 52:38
  I took a We break off drinking in my early 20s because I was
• 52:43
  just, I was, I was going through a lot.
• 52:45
  And it was definitely like the epitome of hurt people hurt
• 52:49
  people like I was, I wanted to blow up my life so bad.
• 52:54
  I I like, I was just like craving to just not be and to, I
• 53:00
  just didn't care. And yeah, I got into an
• 53:04
  altercation with a hotel clerk at a hotel and I shoved his
• 53:09
  computer at him. And so the police came and
• 53:11
  scooped me up and I pled guilty to the charge because I was
• 53:15
  like, I even had a lawyer there that was like, don't do this
• 53:19
  because this will stay. Like, you know, you're going to
• 53:21
  have to do all the things. It's going to stay on your
• 53:23
  record. And I was like, yeah, but I did
• 53:25
  it. You know, I feel like this is
• 53:27
  the, this was the wake up call. I don't want to sit here and try
• 53:29
  to rehash it all and make an excuse like it was what it was,
• 53:34
  but yeah. So was it a wake up call?
• 53:38
  For a time, I, I've gone through quite a few of those, those life
• 53:42
  imploding moments. And listen, I've been really
• 53:45
  good for a long time now. But the the, the, the 20s I
• 53:50
  think in general were kind of a write off for me for sure.
• 53:54
  Yeah. Yeah, I had a hard time in my
• 53:57
  20s, in my early 20s. I understand when people are
• 54:01
  like, I'd never go back to my 20s.
• 54:03
  I remember being 20 and being like, oh you wish.
• 54:05
  Like you're just old and bitter. No, they were not old and
• 54:09
  bitter. I had a conversation with my
• 54:13
  friend who's a documentary film maker down back in California
• 54:17
  when I was there earlier this month.
• 54:19
  And we were talking about about this kind of stuff.
• 54:22
  And like there were things that I did when I was 19202122 years
• 54:29
  old that I mean, I, I wasn't breaking the law.
• 54:32
  I wasn't, I wasn't like, I don't know, wasn't out whoring or
• 54:36
  anything like that. But but I was, I was pretty
• 54:42
  pitiful guy and did some things that were probably hurtful to a
• 54:46
  lot of people. And one of whom hasn't talked to
• 54:48
  me in 30 years and like to this day, I would love, I would, I
• 54:51
  would love to reconnect with her.
• 54:53
  But I, I understand. I understand why she wouldn't
• 54:57
  want to. You know, it's like, I really,
• 55:01
  yeah, I was, I was a, well, I was AI was a young kid and not
• 55:09
  really in touch with, with my own feelings and, you know,
• 55:16
  caught behind, caught between love and duty.
• 55:20
  And you know, I was, it was, it was tough.
• 55:23
  It was, it was a tough time, but but I wouldn't change it because
• 55:29
  it brought me to where I am like.
• 55:31
  You know, and that's the thing, right?
• 55:32
  That's the hardest and it's so it's so cliche, but it's true,
• 55:37
  right? Like who?
• 55:38
  I mean, I'm sure we could think of people who are like, well, I
• 55:41
  wish I wouldn't have met that person and done this, but you
• 55:45
  know, like actually being able to recognize and change and grow
• 55:49
  from it. And I think at the end of the
• 55:50
  day, if you can be somebody who can honestly, like, look at
• 55:54
  those mistakes and own them, not, you know, accept them and
• 55:59
  be like, oh, I had a million excuses as to why, you know,
• 56:04
  understand that it was wrong and why you wouldn't do it again and
• 56:08
  maybe help somebody else along the way with it, then that's
• 56:11
  what it's all about. Yeah, hey, we've been going on
• 56:16
  for almost an hour. Let me get a couple of a couple
• 56:18
  of questions here. Let's see, let's let's talk
• 56:24
  disability, says Gavin. Wait, a woman doesn't claim two
• 56:27
  of her kids. Who does that going back to
• 56:30
  Elizabeth? Yeah.
• 56:31
  Oh, I knew exactly who you were talking about, girl.
• 56:33
  I know that is Elizabeth, though.
• 56:35
  And it's interesting because, well, we think that everybody's
• 56:39
  heard the podcast, right? Like, that's what you think.
• 56:41
  You're like, oh, everybody now knows about her and like,
• 56:43
  they're gonna be protected. No, she's still out there doing
• 56:46
  that. So when Chelsea was doing a lot
• 56:48
  of the interviews for Season 2, she that was one of the
• 56:51
  questions she asked everybody. She's like, how many kids does
• 56:53
  she say she has? And they'd always say 2.
• 56:56
  And then they're like, she's like, oh, but she has four,
• 56:58
  right? And she'd go, some of them
• 57:02
  didn't even know about the other two.
• 57:04
  And then some of them had heard the stripper story.
• 57:07
  Wow Susie who is one of your team I believe says you should
• 57:13
  use your mug shot to make merch. Yeah, that actually would be
• 57:20
  that. I see.
• 57:21
  I don't even know how to. Oh my God.
• 57:22
  I don't want to like put like a test out there for people to be
• 57:24
  like. I'll find it for you.
• 57:30
  I've never wanted to see it and go back into that point.
• 57:33
  Listen, if I was going to do something like that sues, I
• 57:37
  would probably just take a bullet and do the AI and just
• 57:40
  get the repercussions of what people had to say about me using
• 57:43
  AI. There you go, there you go.
• 57:45
  I've never been arrested. I've been detained, but I've
• 57:48
  never been arrested. I was detained in the UK and I
• 57:52
  was full on put in one of those. They call them panda wagons.
• 57:55
  That's like the rolling. Jail.
• 57:56
  Oh, yeah. Yeah, I went there, Yeah.
• 58:00
  Have you been put in a bandwagon?
• 58:02
  Yeah, I was putting. I was putting that that was I
• 58:05
  was transported. Hey, listen, that's another one,
• 58:07
  OK? Oh, my gosh, This is terrible.
• 58:09
  That was a situation. I was with my mom, OK.
• 58:14
  And this lady just came like bat out of hell.
• 58:19
  One evening. I was pulling into my mom's
• 58:21
  parking lot and we're just sitting there, you know, do
• 58:25
  compressing over the night. This woman comes out and she's
• 58:28
  like pounding on my drivers on the window.
• 58:33
  I thought she was going to burst it open.
• 58:34
  I'm like, what are you doing? She's like you, you clipped my
• 58:39
  husband's car and she's holding a license plate.
• 58:41
  And I'm like, I am so sorry. I don't know what you're talking
• 58:44
  about. I'm trying to talk to her.
• 58:45
  I'm like, I don't. I did.
• 58:47
  I didn't hit anything like I would have felt if I hit
• 58:49
  something. What are you talking about?
• 58:51
  She was going so ballistic that my mom said it just must have
• 58:54
  been something in me. She swiped and like hit me in
• 58:57
  the side of the head with the license plate and my mom goes, I
• 59:02
  didn't know who you were. You just went like full on.
• 59:07
  You'd had enough. Yeah, I yeah.
• 59:10
  And she was. So when the police were trying
• 59:13
  to figure out everything, I'm 51, this woman was maybe like
• 59:16
  5-5 and about four of Cherilyn. And I was like, to the police, I
• 59:21
  was like, how could I have done that?
• 59:23
  They're like, there's witnesses. We don't know what you did.
• 59:26
  Maybe you want to be on the force and start taking people
• 59:28
  out, getting getting them down to the ground.
• 59:31
  But you did that. But my, that's what my mom said.
• 59:33
  She's like, I didn't know who you were.
• 59:34
  So I got to ride in that thing. And then basically I was let go
• 59:38
  because I don't know. I think it was just too, too
• 59:42
  many different stories going on. Yeah, mine was way, way more
• 59:47
  scandalous than that. I what was?
• 59:49
  Yours. Well in Great Britain.
• 59:51
  Brace yourself. Cherylin Dale.
• 59:53
  Brace yourself. Are you ready?
• 59:56
  While driving in Great Britain, I turned left on a red light.
• 1:00:03
  Oh no. After I stopped.
• 1:00:09
  They detained you. With like 8 bobbies surrounded
• 1:00:14
  me I think once they saw me stand, like they asked me to get
• 1:00:18
  out of the car. And I don't know, British people
• 1:00:20
  are small people don't think about this right?
• 1:00:22
  But they're like, they're small people.
• 1:00:25
  Super tiny. And so when they, when they see
• 1:00:28
  a guy that like is my size, man, they called in for
• 1:00:31
  reinforcements. The panda wagon got there like a
• 1:00:34
  whole thing. And I'm not like, I'm not a guy
• 1:00:38
  that I, I never would do this. But I remember sitting in that
• 1:00:42
  panda wagon with like 4 guys around me and I was like, I
• 1:00:45
  think I'd win. I think I could take all four of
• 1:00:48
  these guys. I was training hard at the time,
• 1:00:52
  you know, in martial arts. And yeah, I think I got these
• 1:00:54
  guys. I think I could get out of here
• 1:00:56
  no problem. But I'm surprised they let you
• 1:00:59
  back in for crime con. Oh, I know I'm a hardened
• 1:01:02
  criminal. I'm a hardened hardened.
• 1:01:04
  The other thing that happened from that trip is you know how
• 1:01:07
  they I don't, I don't know if you've driven very much in in
• 1:01:11
  the UK, but never I would on their motorways.
• 1:01:15
  They have little camera signs that tell you, I didn't know
• 1:01:19
  this the first time I was there. Well, the first time I was
• 1:01:22
  driving there that they're saying, Hey, cameras are taking
• 1:01:26
  pictures of your license plates, right.
• 1:01:29
  But I'm on the motorway and it's, it's, it's a wide like 4
• 1:01:33
  lane thing and they want me to go 55 kilometers an hour.
• 1:01:37
  I'm dying. So I'm, I just went, right.
• 1:01:41
  I, I drove from London up, up into the north and I just went.
• 1:01:43
  And when when I I'd like two months after I got back from the
• 1:01:48
  rental car agency, I think we got a bill for about $2800 in
• 1:01:52
  speeding tickets. No.
• 1:01:57
  Yeah, man. Because it just because the
• 1:02:00
  cameras just were picking it up the whole time.
• 1:02:03
  Oh yeah. And I and I was there for like a
• 1:02:05
  week and I was, I was letting it go.
• 1:02:09
  For like a week. We rented a nice Mercedes-Benz.
• 1:02:12
  It was a great car, you know, and and I was going up to again,
• 1:02:17
  it was a high end audio affair. So it's all fancy dancey.
• 1:02:20
  It was up in the Midlands. And so, yeah, it wasn't in the
• 1:02:24
  north, it was in the Midlands and it was at this beautiful old
• 1:02:26
  estate and everybody's showing up in their Aston Martins and
• 1:02:30
  Ferraris and stuff. And I'm like, dude, let's race.
• 1:02:32
  So I, I full on was like goading people.
• 1:02:35
  Let's go, let's go race. It was really funny.
• 1:02:41
  Oh, you know what, I will say this.
• 1:02:43
  I would. I after having driven with you
• 1:02:47
  and Amy, I would I would go in that speeding car on the
• 1:02:54
  opposite side of the road over driving with.
• 1:02:57
  Amy with Amy. Oh man, she was scary.
• 1:03:01
  I love her, but I love her. But those those people have 9000
• 1:03:08
  things going on while they're driving and not one of them is
• 1:03:13
  looking at the road or the. Speed limit, Yeah, It's all
• 1:03:16
  inside the car. Nothing outside the car matters,
• 1:03:19
  right? No, that is no one's business.
• 1:03:21
  What is happening outside of that vehicle.
• 1:03:25
  Somebody times Lynn would just reach over.
• 1:03:27
  I'd be like, we're good. I thought that we were going to
• 1:03:30
  die. I thought we were going to die.
• 1:03:32
  Yeah, when you sat at the restaurant, you know what,
• 1:03:34
  That's what I'm going to drive us back.
• 1:03:36
  I was like, that's my guy. I've forgotten that I did that,
• 1:03:41
  but I didn't want her to drive anymore.
• 1:03:43
  My mom told me that the other day.
• 1:03:45
  Amy, you should drink. Why don't just drink up?
• 1:03:47
  I'll drive. Don't worry about it.
• 1:03:49
  That's what my mom said. She's like, remember when Gavin
• 1:03:52
  we were at that restaurant and Gavin's like, you know what,
• 1:03:54
  have another I've got. I totally did.
• 1:03:57
  I encouraged everybody to get hammered because I did not want
• 1:04:00
  Amy Drive. Oh, it's funny.
• 1:04:04
  Oh, my goodness. That's so funny.
• 1:04:06
  All right, real quick, couple more things before we go.
• 1:04:08
  Let me just let's see Hope G says she's from the Twin Cities
• 1:04:14
  and it's never heard of David's case.
• 1:04:16
  What year did it happen? That was 2018, right?
• 1:04:19
  Let me see February 9th, 2018. And Mooney, who is one of my
• 1:04:29
  Ogs, says I really feel that family members of ones that that
• 1:04:33
  were taken need people like you and Cherylin to get involved and
• 1:04:35
  be advocates in their corner. You know, I'm actually working
• 1:04:40
  with someone right now to put together a like a, like a how to
• 1:04:47
  course on how to be an advocate for somebody.
• 1:04:52
  I I I love. It I think that's.
• 1:04:53
  Have you talked to Haley Gray? That's who I'm talking to,
• 1:04:59
  Cherylin Dale. How did you know that?
• 1:05:02
  Well, I'm like, that's, that's our girl.
• 1:05:04
  Because she's just, she's just an unbelievable at it.
• 1:05:07
  Like she's amazing. I wish you would have been at
• 1:05:12
  Crime Con Denver this year because we're just live right
• 1:05:16
  now, baby. I had a little one.
• 1:05:18
  That's the littlest one because I will say this from Nashville
• 1:05:24
  being the first one that I went to, to almost not going to
• 1:05:28
  Denver. I'm so glad that I did because
• 1:05:31
  seeing people like Haley be there and have like her own
• 1:05:35
  booth and the advocacy work that she was doing and the amount of
• 1:05:39
  families that came and came up. And I could tell who had worked
• 1:05:43
  with Haley because she either have, you know, this, this, you
• 1:05:47
  know, letter kind of pre written with AQR code or a postcard with
• 1:05:52
  AQR code or stickers with AQR code.
• 1:05:54
  And all you do is scan it. And when you scan it, the entire
• 1:05:57
  research document is pulled up for creators.
• 1:06:01
  Because that's one of the biggest things, right?
• 1:06:02
  You meet so many people and then it's like trying to coordinate,
• 1:06:06
  like working with each other and, and who wants to keep
• 1:06:09
  telling the story? That's like one of the hardest
• 1:06:11
  things as a creator is that you don't know, you know, like what
• 1:06:16
  you want to like what the not really boundary.
• 1:06:18
  I feel like if if they're kind of approaching you, but you
• 1:06:20
  know, like it's hard to like kind of like relive everything
• 1:06:23
  all over again for everybody involved.
• 1:06:25
  And so to have that all done this year and then actually meet
• 1:06:30
  these families. They had their own badges.
• 1:06:33
  It was just I was blown away. I like immediately emailed Elise
• 1:06:38
  and I was like this is what I will come back for.
• 1:06:42
  This was unbelievable. Well I have applied for a spot
• 1:06:45
  in content creators row for for 2026.
• 1:06:50
  They they've declined me every year before.
• 1:06:55
  Oh, they, oh, I will, I will e-mail like you can't get the
• 1:06:58
  client. You can't get the client Gavin.
• 1:07:00
  You got to be there. But yeah, I was, I'm not all
• 1:07:03
  that enthusiastic about Vegas, but that's because I'm an old
• 1:07:05
  curmudgeon. I think.
• 1:07:06
  I honestly think the entire city smells like farts.
• 1:07:08
  I just absolutely hate it in in Las Vegas.
• 1:07:13
  But I would love to experience crime con and it would be an
• 1:07:17
  excuse for Kimberly and I to get out of the house and and go do
• 1:07:20
  something together and and we both have family.
• 1:07:23
  There, see some shows, go see some shows in the evening.
• 1:07:25
  That's what I'm most excited about.
• 1:07:27
  Yeah, yeah. Maybe do something?
• 1:07:29
  A little magic, maybe? Yeah, a little.
• 1:07:31
  Bit just delay. I've done all of those so many
• 1:07:35
  times and but I would do it again.
• 1:07:37
  I used to have to go to Vegas like twice a year for work.
• 1:07:40
  And but Kimberly has family out there.
• 1:07:44
  Her aunt and uncle live out there and some cousins.
• 1:07:46
  And then I, I have AI have, I guess it's I guess he's now my,
• 1:07:53
  he's my dad's first cousin. So my first cousin once removed,
• 1:07:57
  he he runs a shop that was my Uncle Jack's shop from the 1950s
• 1:08:02
  on Sahara Blvd. called John Fish Jewelers.
• 1:08:04
  And it's time for me to get a new John Fish watch.
• 1:08:08
  So I'd love to get. In there.
• 1:08:11
  And do that. Yeah.
• 1:08:12
  OK. Well, let me know if you really
• 1:08:13
  do want to go because. I do, I do.
• 1:08:15
  I want to go. Yeah.
• 1:08:17
  If you can put in a good word, I will.
• 1:08:19
  Absolutely. I think that I'd love to see you
• 1:08:21
  there. I, I think it Nancy is usually
• 1:08:23
  always there too, so it kind of feels like home.
• 1:08:25
  Also when whenever I see her I'm like oh thank God you're here.
• 1:08:29
  Hey, I presented in London this year with Joseph Scott Morgan.
• 1:08:32
  Yeah, we. Oh, I knew that.
• 1:08:34
  I knew that. I saw that.
• 1:08:36
  I was so excited. I'm coming this year or next
• 1:08:39
  year, Yes, October, right? I will do it again too.
• 1:08:43
  I this time it was our 25th anniversary.
• 1:08:46
  And so I I went in for the little VIP dinner, the
• 1:08:50
  presentation the next day and then we were off to Portugal.
• 1:08:54
  So. Oh, nice.
• 1:08:55
  I know. It was awesome.
• 1:08:56
  It was awesome. I want to live in Portugal now.
• 1:08:59
  Yeah, I will do it. I want to go to Portugal right
• 1:09:02
  now. Like if I could go like right
• 1:09:04
  now. Do that.
• 1:09:07
  Hey, thanks for coming on. It's so good to catch up with
• 1:09:10
  you. I know I love it.
• 1:09:12
  NBF vibes. Yes, we need to.
• 1:09:17
  I would totally do that podcast again.
• 1:09:19
  We need, we need somebody to book us guests though we need
• 1:09:23
  to. Book us guests and then also
• 1:09:25
  give us also give us outlines of things on the days that we don't
• 1:09:31
  have guests. Yes, something.
• 1:09:35
  Volunteer in the comments that's.
• 1:09:37
  Right, if you were a booking producer, yeah, please, please
• 1:09:41
  let us know. All right, stick around for just
• 1:09:44
  a second. I'm going to do the outro and I
• 1:09:46
  will be right back. OK, see you later.
• 1:09:49
  All right, guys, thank you very, very much to Cherylin Dale for
• 1:09:53
  joining us. Go to I've linked to her channel
• 1:09:56
  down below. Also, you know, check out check
• 1:10:00
  out the podcast that she's done. So the stack deck and Elizabeth
• 1:10:04
  is the one that I'm listening to right now.
• 1:10:06
  It's amazing. So check that out and you can
• 1:10:10
  always reach me at gavinfish.com.
• 1:10:11
  You're always welcome to join us over on the fish tank.
• 1:10:16
  Where am I going? Right here.
• 1:10:20
  The fish tank is where we hang out on Facebook.
• 1:10:23
  There's always an invitation for you to join me there.
• 1:10:25
  With that, I be to you. I do you.
• 1:10:27
  Thank you very much for being here.
• 1:10:29
  I'll see you tomorrow night with Joseph Scott Morgan, 7:30 PM
• 1:10:32
  Eastern, right here. Take care.
• 1:10:34
  Thank you very much for watching this video.
• 1:10:36
  If you liked what you saw, please consider subscribing.
• 1:10:40
  And if you have any questions or comments, please leave them
• 1:10:43
  below.