Latest / The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten / "Shit Tests" And Other Myths

Transcript

"Shit Tests" And Other Myths · The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten

• 0:05
  Hi everybody, and welcome to the dr.
• 0:07
  Psych mom show. Today we're going to be talking
• 0:10
  about the ubiquitous idea of shit tests.
• 0:13
  This is something that guys talk about and all guy sections of
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  the internet, I can explain what it is and why I don't believe
• 0:20
  that it's real or at least it can be real, but it's certainly
• 0:25
  not like this. This major thing that women do
• 0:27
  or anything like it, please do subscribe, before I get to the
• 0:32
  topic for today. I will tell you to subscribe.
• 0:34
  I have a lot of good one. Saint female arousal, female
• 0:36
  sexual dysfunction. And then most recently about
• 0:39
  couples you made in counseling. Number three.
• 0:41
  The divorced in spirit AKA just a Loveless marriage.
• 0:45
  And I talked about that in depth and who gets involved in those
• 0:48
  and what to do. All right?
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  So this idea of shit testing is big in the manosphere.
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  It's like this idea that women are trying to test your quote
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  frame, meaning like whether you're going to fold like a
• 1:01
  little whiny baby in the face of any sort of Test or whether you
• 1:07
  are going to remain strong and firm in your masculinity.
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  Women don't do this. Women, don't do this.
• 1:14
  So, the way that this sounds, I thought it was a good analogy.
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  I thought of in my Facebook group where this discussion came
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  up was, you know how you feel as a man like, a man listening to
• 1:24
  this. When women talk about the man
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  cold, you know, and like how apparently, like men lay in bed,
• 1:30
  the minute that they get cold and, like, call out of work.
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  I mean like just the Crazy shit that I've like never seen or
• 1:38
  like so. Okay, so then when people are
• 1:39
  talking all on the internet like women, they're like so convinced
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  as like a man called and women keep on ticking and men just
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  like, give up and going to bed. Have you seen that?
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  Because like, I've not seen that, I've been married twice
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  like nobody takes a fucking day off work.
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  Unless they're about to literally die.
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  You know. Like if you're a responsible
• 1:59
  guy, of course you're still doing shit.
• 2:02
  I mean like it's goes without saying, you know, too many But
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  then so many women think it's the opposite.
• 2:07
  So the reality is that the women that are partnered with
• 2:13
  unusually lazy men, right? So like 10% of women, they're
• 2:20
  very loud about this and then other women, it goes a long
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  sounds good way to feel good about yourself and your gender.
• 2:27
  So they're like, yeah, man, cold.
• 2:29
  Meanwhile likes. Women are like, by the way,
• 2:31
  obviously to me the physically weaker, To about gender, we are
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  smaller, you know, like I mean, women are, they have migraines
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  more, they have depression more, they have anxiety more, they
• 2:44
  have chronic pain more out of all.
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  The people that I've talked to over all these years, women have
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  chronic pain, so much more there.
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  In bed much more reality, me too.
• 2:52
  You know, me too. I get my greens to, you know,
• 2:55
  and depression. So anyway, so the way that a man
• 2:58
  would feel here in about this man called be like, hell, you
• 3:01
  talking about I've been in the military, like, you know, or
• 3:04
  like whatever the case may be. You like, we what are we even
• 3:06
  talking about this? That is how the average woman
• 3:09
  feels hearing about shit test, the exactly exactly how so.
• 3:14
  Similarly there may be five to ten percent of women.
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  Everybody with borderline personality, which is about five
• 3:22
  percent prevalence rate can go back to my narcissus borderline
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  podcast. So, women with borderline
• 3:27
  personality disorder totally test, they don't just test you.
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  They test their therapists, they test their doctors, they test
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  their friends, they test in, Ways like well like maybe I'm
• 3:36
  going to kill myself if you don't do this.
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  These are people who've experienced tremendous trauma.
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  In fact, borderline personality disorder is getting a makeover
• 3:44
  lately. Well well deserve as complex
• 3:48
  PTSD and it is you know you don't come out borderline.
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  If you had a childhood that was anything less than traumatic or
• 3:54
  neglectful, you just don't and similar, I think what's waiting
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  in the wings, I hope it's a transformation and the makeover
• 4:02
  for narcissistic personality disorder, which also comes from
• 4:05
  Alma and parenting that can be overly overly validating to the
• 4:10
  point. That is crazy making or also
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  neglectful / abusive. So it's not like one personality
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  disorder, by the way, this is like treatable now.
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  Nobody used to think borderline was treatable and now they don't
• 4:22
  think narcissism is treatable. They're both treatable their
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  people. Their people, people are
• 4:27
  treatable. Anyway, that's aside the point.
• 4:30
  But anyway, so yes, there are women who do this and yes, men
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  haven't. Countered, who are the women
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  that are going out and dating loads, and loads, and loads of
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  guys, because they can't stand to be alone.
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  People with borderline do. So they may be a small percent
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  of the population, but they are a larger percent of of whose men
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  who men have dated. So if men have dated, a lot of
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  women statistically, they're going to get one with borderline
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  personality in there. That's definite that they do
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  testing also women with narcissistic personality, do
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  testing but then you maybe like what about men to men with
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  narcissistic personality. Is order, which is in higher
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  rates than women narcissism is higher in men and borderline
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  higher, and women, do those men test women.
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  Yes, of course. Oh my God, how many times have I
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  been in session? And there?
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  Right there and the man who struggles with narcissistic
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  traits. And or if not a complete
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  diagnosis is like, no she she loves my body, she loves my
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  body, she just can't get enough of my body and she's just, she's
• 5:32
  really into me, working out and the, and the woman's Like oh
• 5:35
  yeah, yeah, really I'm really into him working out.
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  Then I get her individually and she's like, yeah, he he really
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  needs me to say things like that.
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  He's really needs a lot of validation.
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  So like if I don't say things like that he kind of like keeps
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  looking at me until I do. So I do, you know, exact
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  equivalent of basically I should test.
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  There is something that you're supposed to say, and if you
• 5:57
  don't say it, the person will become whiny, sulky and
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  difficult. So happens as much with men as
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  it happens with women in the personality.
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  Sort of row. Now in the 95% of people who are
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  not, who the the 90% of people. Because I guess there's listen
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  in in the, I just did a Tick-Tock on this, but the
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  prevalence of actual NPD narcissistic personality
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  disorder is very low in the community, but it's high within
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  mental health. So it's like 2 to 16, percent of
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  people that come in for mental health counseling but only point
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  five percent in the natural population.
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  So borderline is like five or under in the natural population
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  but it's something like, oh, Over ten or even twenty percent
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  of people who are in inpatient. Anyway.
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  The point is these rates are very, very low in the natural
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  environment. The average time that your wife
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  says to you something, it's not a test.
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  It's not a test it, if it's a test, it's just so that you say
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  you love her more. It's like a preoccupied
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  attachment thing which is way high rates that's like 20 or 25
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  percent of people have preoccupied, attachment refer
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  back to the attachment style podcast.
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  So people that are always reassurance Of either gender.
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  It's not a shit test. Nobody is trying to like, make
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  sure you're strong enough to put them in their place.
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  This is not like a real thing. It sounds like something out of
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  like, maybe like porn, like BDSM pouring.
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  Like what a sub would do like this.
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  Like the brat culture with like BDSM, this is not what your
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  average wife is doing. So if your average wife says, do
• 7:30
  I look fat in this dress? What she is saying, has nothing
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  to do with the man. This is like, why?
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  It's so like strange and self-absorbed for men to think
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  that this happening and I'll talk about what this relates to
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  in a second, but she's insecure about herself her body.
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  She's worried about her. She feels bad about herself.
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  Your job is to say no sweetheart.
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  You look beautiful, but I like this other dress better if she
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  really is going to embarrass herself somehow that she doesn't
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  fit into it. But generally your job is just
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  to be sweet and loving and reassuring.
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  That is what an emotionally healthy not.
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  Borderline woman wants you to do is no test.
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  Like the people think that women are like shit.
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  Testing them are also. The people that grew up in
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  houses that I talked about, always with my bank idea, that's
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  like my favorite one to talk about growing up in like a
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  paranoid - house with the parent who comes home.
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  They're like, I went to the bank, I'll tell you what
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  happened first, I asked if they had cash, they had change for a
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  20 and they said, no. And I I said Scrappy, you know
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  the underdog rises again. I said, well tell me take me to
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  your manager and then the manager said, so like a person
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  who's like, always going out in the world and engaging a,
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  totally normative interactions, but somehow thinks that everyone
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  is out to get them all the time. They raise men, who are then
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  very susceptible to the idea of the shit tests.
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  It goes along with how they view the world in general, which is
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  people are out to get them and trap them.
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  So men, who have trouble trusting men who grew up in very
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  Very difficult homes and places where they did not feel secure
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  and safe they believe in shit tests.
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  They've of course it goes exactly along with what you
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  would believe that everyone in the world is out to get.
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  You don't make sense. Women would be out to get you
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  to. Another one.
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  They say is like a woman, that's like a.
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  So you're in a bar, let's say, in the woman, this example is
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  given to me by a male who says that the woman would be.
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  Like, I don't date bald guys. And your ab Olga So this isn't a
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  shit test this, not a shit test. Respect what she's saying?
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  And say all right, not too nice for you to say quite honestly,
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  but I'll leave no problem. That's what a man with
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  self-esteem. Does they don't say?
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  Oh yeah well I don't date like and then come up with some sort
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  of like retort that they learned online that somehow, it's going
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  to get past the woman's defenses.
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  She doesn't have defenses. She's a bitch.
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  Like, you don't say that to people, so unhealthy man, would
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  know, don't get involved with somebody who starts out by
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  insulting me. Me, that's not a shit test.
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  If you somehow end up sleeping with that woman and or marrying,
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  her you failed the common sense test.
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  The common sense test is if a woman insults you in one of your
• 10:16
  initial encounters. Don't engage with them.
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  Don't engage with them at all. If you are a wife continues to
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  somehow insult you during your marriage say, we immediately
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  have to go into couples counseling.
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  I don't want this Dynamic. You're not being very nice.
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  I don't want to be with somebody who's unkind your unkind.
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  That was an unkind thing to say. So, It's not like shit tests
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  that are going on by healthy women in order to see if men are
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  masculine enough. So like this isn't happening.
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  So if a woman is saying something to you that's rude,
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  call around. I'm being rude.
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  If you happen to already be married to her.
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  If you are not married to her use that as data about her
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  personality and instead involve yourself with somebody who isn't
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  rude to you. Now, if you are super defensive
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  and preoccupied, which are a lot of the people, you know, No,
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  that learn. Looking for advice on the
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  internet about how to relate to women quite honestly, they're
• 11:07
  preoccupied attachment. Refer back to my preoccupied,
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  attachment husband. So you're a guy who thinks that
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  his wife is quote shit testing him.
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  And she's really just like joking.
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  Like, she's like joking around. Like, another example is, oh,
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  hey. Are you texting your girlfriend?
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  Like that's like a cute joke. Like that's like a joke.
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  Unless she's looking at you. She's she's got a glint in her
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  eye. She's got a knife in her hand
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  and she's like, are you texting your girlfriend?
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  You motherfucker. This is a borderline personality
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  situation unless of course you are texting your girlfriend in
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  which case yeah, she's got a hunch.
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  He's got a leg to stand on but in a real situation where a
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  woman's like oh who are you texting all your girlfriend's
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  which is basically trying to do is say I think you are handsome
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  and I think you are a sexy and I'm flirting with you telling
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  you that I think that other women would be attracted to you.
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  If a man thinks this is on top the shit test, there's something
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  wrong going on, that's joking around if you're so defensive
• 12:02
  that You can't take a joke, like a joke that you could know
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  because you, if you are in this situation, I've already told you
• 12:09
  to go to a therapist, right? So, you should say to your
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  therapist. You should say, oh, my wife said
• 12:14
  to me, well, that's a bright shirt that you're wearing
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  because it was a red shirt and I usually wear a brown shirt, and
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  I thought it was a shit test. So what I did is I remember the
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  things that I was learned that I said this other, you know, -
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  sort of thing back. Did like maybe your wife was
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  just like, oh, ha ha. Like, look, you're wearing
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  something different. Really nothing to say here in
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  marriage? You know, I meet our small talk
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  is limited. Let's just bring up the shirt
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  for a second, literally nothing going on.
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  Except trying to have a fucking conversation.
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  Then like, you know, like that's probably what's going on.
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  So this whole idea that women are like, testing men is just as
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  crazy to the 90% of women, if not more as it is.
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  Is when four men, when they listen to women, say really
• 13:06
  anti-male stuff, which is your correct way.
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  Common and should not be and I call it out when I hear it, you
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  know. But like oh so it like another
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  one would be for women. That say that the man is like
• 13:19
  totally helpless so he can't even make a sandwich.
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  He wouldn't even know where his socks were.
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  If I didn't tell him the average man listening to that is like,
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  are you fucking kidding me? I make the fucking sandwiches
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  for the kids like all the time when you're not here.
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  When Are out doing whatever if you were working late or like
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  what are you even talking about man?
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  So that is how the the same anti-female thing comes out with
• 13:43
  the shit test idea as comes out with the men or lazy.
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  Men are incompetent man or men are dogs, that's another one.
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  Like the all men are assholes who's going around saying all
• 13:53
  men are assholes women that were raised in Dysfunctional homes
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  where they learned that all men are assholes because all men are
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  in assholes and all women are not manipulative nor are The
• 14:03
  majority of women manipulative there are personality disorders
• 14:07
  that lead to people acting manipulative of both genders,
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  both genders. So as I said, like narcissistic
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  males and there can be borderline males and
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  narcissistic women obviously as well.
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  But men that send these are the cluster B personality disorders,
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  the more dramatic ones and other one is history, onic
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  personality. If you want to look that up, we
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  don't have time to discuss that one.
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  It just means being pretty fucking history onic.
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  But the point is people with personality disorders test their
• 14:32
  Partners constantly The Narcissist test to make sure
• 14:35
  that the person is obsequious enough and worshipful enough and
• 14:39
  the border line test to see if they can push away the person
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  because they're so scared. That the person will leave them
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  because it's a disorder predicated on fear of
• 14:47
  Abandonment because they've been abandoned so much as a kid
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  emotionally or physically. And so they push away the
• 14:53
  partner and they are the one who will be like a, what do you wear
• 14:56
  in that ugly red shirt for. Yeah, that's a shit test, but
• 14:59
  it's not a shit test. It's basically the response to
• 15:02
  that shit too. Test.
• 15:03
  If your wife has borderline personality, go back to my
• 15:05
  podcast and see and she says, what do you fucking wearing that
• 15:08
  ugly red shirt for? That's not a shit test that's
• 15:11
  called. I am telling you with my words
• 15:13
  that I am a deeply troubled, mentally ill person.
• 15:16
  And I am basically begging you to get me into some kind of
• 15:19
  counseling immediately, because our children are listening to
• 15:22
  me. Be my worst self at all times,
• 15:25
  due to my complete absence of any self-worth, which was
• 15:29
  hammered into me, tragically in my own girlhood dad, Like, she's
• 15:33
  saying to you. It's not a shit test.
• 15:34
  Okay, so if you see somebody that's quote shit, testing you
• 15:37
  in a bar, there are plenty of lovely women that will confess
• 15:41
  that will not say anything insulting about you at all.
• 15:45
  I will not make you jump through any hoops at all and a few Hoops
• 15:49
  that you met in your anxious mind think that they're making
• 15:52
  you jump through. If you look at it through the
• 15:54
  lens that I'm teaching you right now, may just be joking around
• 15:59
  because they actually think that you have some self-esteem.
• 16:02
  So they're like, joking around a little bit like oh you must
• 16:05
  really be a big Mets fan. Look.
• 16:07
  There's men that are so sensitive out there in the
• 16:09
  world, they're wearing like a Mets jersey and a Mets hat, and
• 16:12
  the woman's like, oh seems like somebody's a really big Mets
• 16:15
  fan. And they're thinking, what did
• 16:16
  she mean by that? Was it some kind of shit test?
• 16:19
  It's like no wake up like this is playful humor.
• 16:24
  So you could tell the difference between playful humor and
• 16:28
  somebody who is hates you or is insulting you in the Better
• 16:33
  either don't get into the relationship or get the hell in
• 16:36
  to counseling the same as you would.
• 16:38
  If your wife says you, what are you looking so ugly for today in
• 16:42
  any sort of scent? Do not classify that as a shit
• 16:44
  test. Classify that, as a cry for,
• 16:47
  help seemed as if she lit a match and dropped it in the
• 16:50
  middle of your kitchen. You wouldn't be like, I don't
• 16:52
  know if we need couples counseling, or if I just need to
• 16:54
  like, you know, like sold a stronger frame, you'd be like
• 16:59
  bitch is crazy. I am getting her out of this
• 17:01
  house where my kids are Our that is the way that you need to
• 17:04
  respond when someone insults you, you know, in front of your
• 17:07
  children, okay? Or even, not in front of your
• 17:10
  children. Don't get into these situations.
• 17:13
  They are far less common than then people would have you think
• 17:17
  in Internet rabbit holes, okay? And if you have questions on
• 17:20
  what specifically it should test is and isn't and you can write
• 17:24
  out a little play for me to act or even better voicemail about
• 17:29
  like something that a woman would say that in fact is a shit
• 17:32
  test. But let me tell you, if you go
• 17:34
  back with a different lens and you're like, wait was I raised
• 17:36
  to be really fucking paranoid without a raise to think women
• 17:39
  are manipulative? Bitch has by my family of
• 17:42
  origin, where I saw like basically a cold mother and like
• 17:46
  a passive father. And then I resolved never to be
• 17:49
  like this, which is like 99% of the guys listening to this that
• 17:53
  that this resonates with. Like if I looked at this
• 17:55
  different would I see that women are actually just out there in
• 17:59
  the universe? Trying to find love the same as
• 18:01
  men are Yes. Are they people?
• 18:04
  Yes. Do they sometimes joke around?
• 18:06
  Yes, if they say something, really horrible.
• 18:09
  Should I assume that that is them?
• 18:12
  Testing me or that? That is about them and their
• 18:15
  core deep self-worth issues, the ladder, the ladder, the ladder,
• 18:20
  the ladder. All right.
• 18:22
  So hopefully, this cleared something up for somebody or at
• 18:25
  least sparked, a little bit of curiosity into this concept,
• 18:28
  such that you don't miss, classify things in a way that
• 18:31
  stops you from Percy. When situations are actually
• 18:34
  very bad for you to get into and over thinking that certain like
• 18:40
  throwaway lines and or flirtation literally is some
• 18:44
  sort of test to which you would do anything but laugh and say ha
• 18:48
  ha. Literally that would be the
• 18:50
  response, you know to like the Mets t-shirt.
• 18:53
  Yeah I really do. I love the Mets like that's it.
• 18:56
  You know like you don't have to like what a I'm like say
• 18:59
  something back that's going to show that you're like some
• 19:02
  strong. Oh, guy, like that, isn't what's
• 19:04
  required, that isn't what is happening.
• 19:07
  All right, so yes, please do, subscribe, follow me on.
• 19:11
  Tik-Tok, follow me on YouTube. Follow me everywhere and I'll
• 19:13
  talk to you all soon.