Latest / The FEEL Podcast: Women’s Empowerment, Emotional Wellness and Self-Leadership with Melissa Crook / Season 9 Premiere: “The Power of Boundaries, Hope, and Healing” ft. Gretchen Schoser

Transcript

Season 9 Premiere: “The Power of Boundaries, Hope, and Healing” ft. Gretchen Schoser · The FEEL Podcast: Women’s Empowerment, Emotional Wellness and Self-Leadership with Melissa Crook

• 0:12
  The Littlefield podcast audience Melissa Crook here I this is
• 0:18
  going to be fun today and it's going to be authentic and it's
• 0:21
  going to be vulnerable. It's going to be all those
• 0:23
  things because my new friend, who I feel like I've known my
• 0:27
  whole life, honestly, like Gretchen Skezer is 1 of those
• 0:30
  people that you meet that I meant.
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  I'm just like, yeah, I feel like we've known each other for 20
• 0:34
  years. And she's.
• 0:37
  It's just it's going to be a treat today and also going to be
• 0:40
  a lot of really important things that you need to hear.
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  It's going to be welcoming. It's going to be safe.
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  It's going to be all the things. And Gretchen describes herself
• 0:50
  as a giver of hope, fun, authentic, loves to laugh,
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  vulnerable, and operates in her integrity.
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  Her nickname is G Rex. We'll talk about that at some
• 1:03
  point. She's famous in the podcast
• 1:06
  world and we'll get to that, don't you worry.
• 1:08
  But welcome, my friend, to the Field Podcast.
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  Wow, what an introduction. I just, and you know, the same
• 1:17
  thing goes for me. Like, I feel like I've known you
• 1:20
  like 100 years. I know, I know.
• 1:22
  I'm. I'm just.
• 1:23
  For fortunate. Yeah.
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  Well, I, I feel the same way. So we're going to get right into
• 1:28
  it. You have a journey that I think
• 1:32
  so many of us have, but we don't know how to talk about it or
• 1:35
  what to do with it. And so much of what you do now
• 1:40
  is providing safe places for people to have these
• 1:44
  conversations and do this so that they don't end up where you
• 1:49
  did. My motivation, although
• 1:52
  different, is much the same. It's like we don't need to get
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  to this point. We need to, we owe it to
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  ourselves and to women and humanity to to get this right
• 2:04
  and get this on course. So we're going to unfold your
• 2:08
  story through these talking points today.
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  And we're going to start with prioritizing self-care in your
• 2:14
  life. Talk to me about your journey
• 2:16
  with that, because it's been a journey.
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  It has been a 2 1/2 year journey of just taking care of myself,
• 2:26
  my myself care lately and self love.
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  If Thankfully the sun came out and you know I'm able to get
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  outside and play in nature. Trying to get enough rest,
• 2:40
  making sure that I keep the drama at Bay.
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  That to me is a big one. That's something that therapy
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  taught me is like setting boundaries.
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  Lifesavers. If you haven't set them now,
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  work on it. Remembering that I'm number one,
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  that was the first thing that I I needed to focus on is that I
• 3:02
  need to take care of me and that everything else can be put on
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  hold at least even for like a minute just so I can catch a
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  breath, you know, making sure that I don't have those
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  intrusive thoughts and the heck thing out on them.
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  I mean, occasionally that still happens, but it's, you know, we
• 3:23
  get some laughter out of that, but also remembering that, you
• 3:27
  know, I'm still fragile and that I, I can make mistakes and I can
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  still get depressed, but now I have better tools to handle
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  that. And I'm thankful.
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  I'm thankful everyday. And I also do a lot of writing,
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  a lot of writing. It may not go back and read a
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  lot of what I write, but it gets out of my head and I'll do a
• 3:49
  piece of paper and then I'm OK with it.
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  Yeah, yeah, It's such a great way.
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  It's such a great release. That's so good.
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  You know, I think, you know, these, these things that we deal
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  with going back to the intrusive thoughts, please.
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  I have an anxiety friend that walks life with me and intrusive
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  thoughts is part of that narrative.
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  And for years I walked around with these things dancing around
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  in my head thinking if people could read my mind they would
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  think I was effing crazy like what is this?
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  And so for years I didn't talk about it until I finally did and
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  realized, you know, these things and, and got to the root of
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  where they came from. And it and it that I think
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  sometimes we, we don't think about self-care in a way that
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  taps into those other things. And, and unloading that and
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  having places to say it out loud.
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  That's a part of our self-care. That's a part of the things we
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  need to do to not carry it by ourselves and privately, you
• 4:55
  know, not really know what to do with it.
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  Yeah, like stepping outside and screaming.
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  Yeah, I I can do that. I live on 8 1/2 acres.
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  Like, my neighbors can't really hear me.
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  I did scare a couple of deer, you know, a couple weeks ago.
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  But, you know, it happens. But, you know, taking care of
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  yourself is so vitally important.
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  It doesn't. I don't care if you're a mom.
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  I don't care if you're a CEO. I don't care if you're a sister
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  or an aunt or a caregiver. Yeah, you have to take care of
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  yourself. Have to.
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  Yeah, because I can tell you exactly what happens when you
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  don't. Yeah, and that's just it.
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  It doesn't lead us anywhere good when we don't and it and this
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  goes nicely into confidently sitting boundaries.
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  You said earlier that's part of yourself care.
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  I'm telling you people right now, if you're not doing it,
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  start figuring out what that looks like for you.
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  So talk to me about your journey with that, because I think you
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  and I both came from backgrounds where boundaries did not.
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  Exist like we. Had no, you know, in our own
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  stories in different ways. So talk to me about your journey
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  with that, figuring that out. I'm a, I'm a true extrovert and
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  an empath. And, you know, people use me to,
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  like, drain all the life out of me.
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  And I, I let them do it because I didn't know how to set
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  boundaries at the time. Yeah.
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  So one of the first things my therapist taught me was setting
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  those, those boundaries. And so now I have what's called
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  like a drama box. It's a little fake black drama
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  box. And if it smells like drama, it
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  doesn't get to come in. It's got to meet some criteria.
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  I guess it's really going to suck the life out of me again.
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  Am I going to benefit from it? Can I actually help them?
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  I can't answer yes or no or hard no to that.
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  It don't doesn't come in anymore.
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  And you know, I was 59 1/2 when I learned that.
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  I wish that I had learned that in my 40s.
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  Things probably would have turned out a whole lot different
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  for me. And now I'm AI was a people
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  pleaser and now I'm not a people pleaser.
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  The only person I want to please right now is me, probably my
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  wife. But you know, I want to, I want
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  to feel good. And so when I set those
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  boundaries and I really stick to them, it's life changing.
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  Yeah, I but I also lost a lot of friends, right?
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  And those were the people that would only come to me when they
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  needed something and I had to put a stop to it because as an
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  impact. Yeah.
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  I didn't know how to put my Shields up.
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  I know how to put those Shields up now.
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  And it'll reflect it right back on them.
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  Listen, you need to go deal with this yourself.
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  Yeah. If there's something I can
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  really help you with, then I will.
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  But I I can't take it all on. I just can't.
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  Yeah. And we weren't built to and
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  that's not what relationships are supposed to be.
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  I think that was such a big lesson for me is that the years
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  of emotional dumping and but yet not doing anything about it and,
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  and letting other people do that with me, where now is like, if
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  that's something you're going to continue to bring up and you
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  either need to do something about it or stop bringing it up.
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  But to continue hashing it over and over again and wearing out
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  everybody else around you. And I was a participant in that.
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  But I think when you don't, when you live in these codependent
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  people pleasing narratives, you don't understand it.
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  And then when you come out of it and start showing up
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  differently, it can really throw you find out real quick who is
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  authentically in it for you, is your healthiest self, and who's
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  doesn't want to move that way. And I think it's one of those
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  things that's like, not all relationships are forever.
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  And it's very important to understand you cannot.
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  I think sometimes when we make changes and we make shifts, we
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  want so badly for other people to know about us so that they
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  can shift with us. They don't always want to shift
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  with us, and it's not our responsibility to force them to
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  shift with this. And so sometimes we got to
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  release those or love them from afar because we can no longer do
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  that to ourselves, to our health, to our nervous system.
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  Yeah, I think friends are, you know, there's a reason in the
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  season for some friends. And, you know, once the emotion
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  suckers went away, like I started feeling a lot better,
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  but I also knew how to handle it better.
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  And, you know, and not being a jerk about it, It's hard.
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  You know, I have a ton of friends.
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  You know, I was the class class clown.
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  I love to play. I always had, you know, a smile
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  on my face, even though on the inside I was like, this is not
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  at work, not working, but knowing that I had an
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  opportunity, opportunity to make a change in myself that would
• 9:55
  actually make me feel better. Yeah, it wasn't easy at first.
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  Like I, you know, it was. I was super uncomfortable.
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  But man, after 2 1/2 years I'm a pro at it.
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  Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think he pointed
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  something out too. It's setting the boundaries
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  within yourself and knowing what they need to be or one thing.
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  Then you got to communicate them and and sometimes you got to
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  communicate them a couple times when people aren't used to you
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  showing up that way before you start figuring out, you know
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  what, this isn't just you not knowing what to do with this
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  healthier version of me. This is you not honoring my
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  boundary. Because usually after a couple
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  times, I'm like, Oh my gosh, that's right, you told me that,
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  please forgive me, you know, whatever versus those that just
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  don't want to go there. And, you know, communication is
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  kind and it can also be firm. Like you can be firm and be
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  kind. And, and so I think it's, you
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  know, but it's, it's tricky. It's tricky and, but also
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  necessary. And, and unfortunately, when you
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  hit the wall so hard, you get to a point where like, this is
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  about my life. This isn't, this isn't just, I'm
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  not trying to inconvenience anyone.
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  This is about my Wellness and my well-being that I've got to do
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  for me. And I hope that you are able to
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  respect that and honor that. Either way, this is the decision
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  I've made and it's how I'm moving forward.
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  That's exactly what I'm doing. And I'm happy.
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  Yeah. I, I, I like my heart's happy.
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  It. You know, when you start setting
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  those boundaries, it feels like you've taken off a weighted
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  X-ray blanket off your shoulders.
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  You just feel freer. Yeah.
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  And you also learn how to put your Shields up.
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  And, you know, sometimes we need to, like, reflect it back onto
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  that person and not take in all that energy.
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  And it's super helpful. Yeah, good stuff, Good stuff.
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  All right, this goes nicely into taking care of our emotional
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  health, mental health, physical health, spiritual health, all
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  the pieces of our health. You said something earlier that
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  I think is really important. On the outside with the funny,
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  you're hilarious. Like if I mean, you are just one
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  of the funniest people I've ever met.
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  You just, you're naturally that way, but that can be you think
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  about the funny, hilarious people that come to mind over
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  time, whether they're personal relationships or people that are
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  famous on the inside. They're not doing so well all
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  the time that exterior, but people assume the exterior they
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  see must be the whole person. So I think then it becomes even
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  more difficult because you build this persona and the impact that
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  that has on your emotional health and your mental health as
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  you're as you're carrying that around.
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  And people have a completely different idea of who they think
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  you are versus who you really are.
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  And then the shit hits the fan and you've got to like, because
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  you can't carry it. Like we're not designed to carry
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  all that. There will be an overflow of
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  some sort of problematic way, whether it's physically,
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  mentally, emotionally, it's going to show up.
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  And so did it take you hitting the wall to understand the
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  connection of all those pieces or did you have an understanding
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  of that before? And it was just like, just like
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  going to attend to that because I want to make sure I continue
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  to live in this persona that everybody sees me.
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  I had to hit the wall. Yeah.
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  Because I didn't understand what was going on inside my head.
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  You know, my entire life, you know, I had been taught, you
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  know, we don't really talk about that stuff.
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  You know, you just carry on, you know, put a smile on your face.
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  And by the time all the shit went down, nobody knew how
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  depressed I was. Absolutely nobody.
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  At the time, my wife and I had been together for 28 years.
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  My coworkers didn't know. My family didn't know.
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  My friends didn't know, like on the other side, I look fine.
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  And like you said, I'm funny. Like I am probably the most
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  irreverent person you'll ever meet.
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  But you know, laughter is a way, is a mechanism for me to kind of
• 14:20
  deal with all the stuff that was going on.
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  And sure, people would ask me how I was doing and I'd be like,
• 14:26
  hey, I'm fine. But in my head I was like, I
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  just want to be done. I'm done.
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  Like I was tapped out and it did a real number to me because I,
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  because I didn't understand. I didn't, I couldn't find my
• 14:43
  voice for what I was feeling. Like I had a voice for
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  everything else, but for my feelings.
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  I didn't have a voice because I didn't, I didn't know how to
• 14:51
  explain what was going on and couldn't find my footing.
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  And it was, it was super, super scary.
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  I was terrified. By the time everything finally,
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  like I hit that bottom, I was terrified.
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  And thankfully, there was like a little glimmer that things would
• 15:12
  change and that that was the turning point.
• 15:15
  Yeah. Yeah.
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  And I mean, and this is again, like I said earlier, this is
• 15:20
  what inspires you and I to do the stuff we do today because
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  it's like, it is scary when you hit that wall and you're all of
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  a sudden this life, this persona, this ideal that you've
• 15:32
  put out to the world, It's not working anymore more.
• 15:34
  And your body is screaming at you to be tended to.
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  And and she finally gives you no choice but to tend to her.
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  And then it's just like, Jesus, please.
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  And then you start reflecting. You know, for me, I was able to,
• 15:51
  you know, get a good therapist and get into a good holistic
• 15:54
  practitioner and have people start asking me the questions I
• 15:57
  needed to be asked in connect point.
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  And also for me, you know, my husband was like, babe, I have
• 16:04
  watched you walk around with carrying these things all these
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  years. It is time to tend to you.
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  You got to do it. You got to do it.
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  And he this is not the first conversation he and I'd had
• 16:18
  about this over the years. I didn't hide it as well as you,
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  but people, you know, but people, they, you know, hurt
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  people hurt people. And and it may not look like the
• 16:33
  way you think it is, but it, you know, so for yeah, it's just
• 16:36
  that realization. And then once you start
• 16:39
  unpacking, it's like, oh, oh, you know, because Lane, when you
• 16:44
  grow up, you know, you grew up in a generation that we did you,
• 16:48
  you feelings were not talked about.
• 16:50
  They were brushed under the rug that, you know, dry it up.
• 16:55
  What? You know, no tears here.
• 16:57
  What are you crying about? I mean, there was just no
• 16:59
  lessons. There were no examples telling
• 17:02
  us what to do with all of this stuff.
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  So, yeah. So it's like, OK, so you decided
• 17:08
  to become part of the solution. And for me, you show up
• 17:12
  unapologetically for yourself and other women, people, humans
• 17:17
  so well, but one of the the classic ways you do it, I think
• 17:22
  the greatest examples is your podcast work in the
• 17:26
  conversations you knew started needing to happen.
• 17:31
  Shit That goes on in our Heads is one of the most popular indie
• 17:35
  podcasts that are out there. It has it is blowing the roof
• 17:40
  off of probably anything that you and your host Judy Skittles
• 17:45
  the best nickname ever, honestly.
• 17:47
  And I could have that nickname too, because I would totally eat
• 17:50
  Skittles off the ground if it were within the 10 second rule
• 17:52
  or anything else. But that's a story for another
• 17:55
  day. But you guys, you know, you guys
• 17:58
  knew and, and the, the reception was immediate, like people
• 18:05
  connected with it. And so this, this ability for
• 18:10
  you to go on this journey and really learn who you were and
• 18:14
  what needed to be healed and unraveled to show up as your
• 18:17
  most authentic, healthiest self. That ability to show up
• 18:21
  unapologetically, that if you are so honest and authentic and
• 18:25
  vulnerable about your story while being hilarious, all those
• 18:29
  new are true. And I think that's a really
• 18:31
  important thing to point out too, is the nuance.
• 18:34
  Like when people think of people that are vulnerable, they don't
• 18:38
  necessarily connect with them, that also being really
• 18:41
  hilarious. And so many times that is
• 18:45
  they're character traits that go together, but we, we put these
• 18:47
  like expectations, but you're able to focus on all those
• 18:50
  things, all that energy. I'm doing a lot of talking here
• 18:53
  because I, I think this is so important, what you've done and
• 18:56
  the impact it has. How has that been for you?
• 19:00
  And talk about that realization of like, this is how I can take
• 19:05
  this really, really shitty thing that I've been through and, and
• 19:10
  give it light and get these conversations going because we
• 19:14
  don't have to go down this road. Yeah, it it's a wild, wild story
• 19:22
  and a wild journey. So like my 2 healers for me were
• 19:25
  sharing my story. So the day after all the shit
• 19:28
  went down, I posted out on the social media what was going on
• 19:32
  and people were floored. They were terrified.
• 19:36
  But I had about 200 people reach out to me and say thank you
• 19:39
  because now they feel so terrified and alone in their own
• 19:42
  journey. So sharing my story was, was a
• 19:45
  was super helpful for me. And then laughter.
• 19:49
  So, you know, Dirty Skittles and I, during the time we would call
• 19:53
  each other every day before work and laugh for hours.
• 19:57
  And it's helped set the trajectory of the day because
• 20:00
  when you laugh, it releases that cortisol and gives you some
• 20:05
  endorphins. And so every time something bad
• 20:07
  would come up during the day, we would, like, reflect back on
• 20:09
  that conversation and start laughing again.
• 20:11
  Yeah. And so it was during one of
• 20:14
  those conversations, she's like, hey, we should do a podcast.
• 20:17
  And we, you know, we released that podcast on Valentine's Day
• 20:21
  in honor of my mom because I had buried my mom in 1997.
• 20:25
  And I wanted to change the trajectory of the day because
• 20:29
  like, I'm still going through my healing journey, still super
• 20:32
  messed up, but I felt better sharing my story.
• 20:37
  And I thought other people would feel better sharing their story
• 20:41
  because it's one thing to talk into a mic versus talk to
• 20:45
  somebody face to face. And, you know, once we open up
• 20:49
  the mic to our guests, you know, these are people that hadn't
• 20:53
  shared their story with anybody, right?
• 20:55
  They hadn't shared their truths and they said would come back to
• 21:00
  us and tell us how Catholic it was for them to share that and
• 21:03
  felt like they had had a blanket like ripped off their shoulders
• 21:07
  and they just felt lighter. And, you know, every time we
• 21:11
  share our stories, we unlock somebody elses prison because in
• 21:15
  today's day and age, a lot of those resources that people had
• 21:19
  been using for years and years and years are being taken away.
• 21:23
  And So what happens with our guests is that they have other
• 21:27
  tips and tricks or resources they've used that are still
• 21:30
  widely available. And so it gives our listeners,
• 21:34
  you know, the ability to go out and research these other things
• 21:38
  that could probably help them or give them some tricks on, hey,
• 21:42
  maybe if I tried this, you know, it won't be so bad the next
• 21:45
  time. And you know, the joke was on
• 21:48
  us. We thought, oh, we're going to
• 21:49
  do 3 episodes and like called a day.
• 21:56
  But you know, we intertwined like with our conversations, we
• 21:59
  throw in laughter. We talked about some really hard
• 22:03
  subjects. But you know what, you should
• 22:05
  not, You can always laugh, right?
• 22:06
  Hindsight is 2020. And you know, I just didn't like
• 22:11
  writing my own book. You know, I wrote a couple of
• 22:13
  stories and they're, they weren't funny at the time.
• 22:16
  They're funny now. Yeah.
• 22:17
  But you know, when you reflect on stuff like that, it, it makes
• 22:22
  it not so hard. And I, we're just, you know,
• 22:26
  trying to heal the world like one conversation at a time.
• 22:29
  And the fact that y'all listen to us, I get a little anxiety
• 22:35
  still so. Yeah, I think when you start
• 22:41
  doing something and you just don't know where it's going to
• 22:43
  go and then you get the feedback that it's helpful or somebody
• 22:49
  says, I've had A and I aspire to be where you guys are.
• 22:55
  It's amazing what you've done and so incredible and, and so
• 22:59
  great that so many people are getting access to that.
• 23:02
  But also those times when people share their stories and you and
• 23:06
  you are either recording it or after the recording and then
• 23:09
  reveal, gosh, I've never shared that before.
• 23:11
  I've never said that before. It's like, all right, well,
• 23:14
  we're creating a safe enough, comfortable enough space here
• 23:18
  that they felt like they could do that.
• 23:21
  That's why I'm doing that today. If one person listens or nobody
• 23:25
  listens, I just help that person, you know, share their
• 23:30
  story. So whether you've got, you know,
• 23:32
  whatever it is. So just remember that piece is
• 23:36
  so like, wow, wow. You just never know the impact
• 23:39
  and not to mention the people you get to meet in the process.
• 23:42
  You and I would never meet if we hadn't decided to take these
• 23:45
  things and and, and take these journeys and bring other people
• 23:50
  into the conversations to talk about theirs and offer resources
• 23:53
  and support. You know, we were middle-aged
• 23:57
  and you know, beyond like never, ever in our wildest imagination.
• 24:02
  So also the people that we meet through this is astounding.
• 24:07
  It is. And you know, for me, like if
• 24:09
  you asked me five years ago if this was in the wheelhouse, it
• 24:12
  wasn't. But either was a massive mental
• 24:15
  health breakdown. And, you know, am I sorry that
• 24:19
  any of that happened? No, because I wouldn't be where
• 24:22
  I am today. I, you know, I get to share my
• 24:24
  truths. I get to talk to people, I get
• 24:27
  to reflect, I get to learn. And, you know, one of the things
• 24:31
  that like still hits me today is early on we had somebody reach
• 24:36
  out to us and said because of the episode that they heard,
• 24:40
  they actually called 988 to get the help that they needed.
• 24:43
  You know, they lived in, you know, rural America just like I
• 24:47
  do. And that that made me feel
• 24:50
  better. That like our message is getting
• 24:52
  out. And here's the great thing about
• 24:54
  podcasts. They are, there's no graphic
• 24:56
  boundary. And you know, people can be
• 25:00
  listening to our episode and they could be in Zimbabwe and
• 25:03
  they could be in Hong Kong. They could, you know, every
• 25:07
  there's mental health problems all over the world.
• 25:10
  It doesn't just happen here in the US And, you know, I'm
• 25:14
  fortunate, super, super fortunate I get to do this, you
• 25:18
  know, after finding my, my own, my own voice.
• 25:21
  Yeah. For two years, I didn't go out
• 25:23
  on any other podcast except for my own.
• 25:25
  And over the last couple months, I've been really like doing
• 25:28
  interviews and sharing my story and sharing my hope.
• 25:31
  And it's, it's fulfilling. Yeah.
• 25:36
  It makes my heart happy. Yeah, well, and it's powerful
• 25:39
  and it's important. And thank you for being a voice
• 25:41
  in that. It's such an unapologetic way.
• 25:44
  I keep saying that, but it really is.
• 25:46
  This is how we support each other.
• 25:47
  And apologetically, this is how we, this is what it looks like
• 25:51
  to lift each other up and make sure others know that we exist,
• 25:57
  that we've got resources that we want to help.
• 25:59
  And we come in and we do it together and we participate in
• 26:03
  this together because more is better because so many people
• 26:07
  need these resources. And so the more of us that can
• 26:10
  be active and involved in this, it's just, I love it so much and
• 26:14
  it's so important. Thank you so much for that.
• 26:16
  And this goes nicely into coming back to your why and your values
• 26:21
  in what you do. This is succinctly tied to that.
• 26:25
  So talk to me about that realization of how the your why
• 26:30
  and your values were. Yeah, this is the next step.
• 26:32
  This is so aligned with what we need to do.
• 26:37
  It really ties back to that night and if you want, I can
• 26:42
  talk a little bit about what happened, whatever feels.
• 26:45
  Best for you. So on Christmas Day 2022, I end
• 26:52
  up having to call 988. I was about to attempt suicide.
• 26:56
  I had a bottle of pills, like ready.
• 26:59
  They were open in my hand. And there was a glimmer of hope
• 27:03
  that things were going to get, we're going to get better.
• 27:07
  And I had remembered a couple months before that I had seen
• 27:10
  the number for 988 and what it was.
• 27:13
  It's a crisis and suicide hotline.
• 27:16
  The woman on the other end of the line was the most
• 27:19
  compassionate person I've ever spoken to and she gave voice to
• 27:22
  what was going on inside my head.
• 27:25
  And once again, the shit that goes on in our heads because I
• 27:29
  did not understand it. And so my purpose and my why, my
• 27:35
  why is I don't want people to feel so terrified and alone in
• 27:40
  their own journey as I felt mine.
• 27:43
  Because I couldn't give voice to what was going on inside my
• 27:46
  head. Yeah, I couldn't find my
• 27:49
  footing. Like I was still walking around
• 27:52
  every day with a big ass smile on my face like everything is
• 27:55
  OK. I was still laughing, but like
• 27:59
  when I was, you know, doing my writing and looking back, like I
• 28:02
  was also super withdrawn. It kind of checked out, but like
• 28:07
  nobody else realized it. But I started to realize it when
• 28:10
  I was like, you know, doing my, my research on myself.
• 28:14
  And my, why is, you know, let's, let's fix the world.
• 28:21
  Let's destigmatize the way that we talk about mental health
• 28:24
  because it's still such a taboo topic.
• 28:26
  And it shouldn't be because I'm going to tell you like 99.999%
• 28:31
  of us have some sort of messy head.
• 28:35
  And the more we hide it, the worse it is.
• 28:39
  And so you like my, my call to action out there for anybody
• 28:44
  that's an extrovert. And if you're depressed, don't
• 28:47
  hide it because it does more harm than it does good.
• 28:52
  You think that you're like saving everybody else out there,
• 28:55
  but you're not. All you're doing is you're
• 28:57
  hurting yourself. And I really hurt myself and I
• 29:00
  hurt my relationships, right? Because they're all kind of mad
• 29:03
  that I didn't couldn't open up. But you know, once you start
• 29:06
  talking about it and saying that you didn't know how to open up,
• 29:10
  then they, they understand. But like, if you're really
• 29:13
  struggling and you're an extra route, find that one friend that
• 29:16
  can help you out. Call 988.
• 29:18
  Because I'm telling you, it's not just for suicide ideation.
• 29:22
  It's for people in crisis. They, they feel these calls all
• 29:25
  day long. And you know, that 988 number is
• 29:29
  available both in the US and Canada.
• 29:32
  And if you listen internationally, there's a
• 29:35
  website you can go out to. It's called the Help hub.co and
• 29:40
  it lists out all the crisis lines out there.
• 29:42
  Oh, wow. OK, we're good.
• 29:44
  That'll be in our show notes, folks.
• 29:46
  That will be in our show notes hub.
• 29:48
  OK, I've got that down. Yeah, I think, you know, I'm so
• 29:51
  glad you shouted out 988 because they have access to resources
• 29:56
  right there in hand to help you. And and so and I think it's
• 30:00
  something that we don't maybe talk about enough.
• 30:03
  It's kind of an underutilized resource that anybody has access
• 30:08
  to out there. So thank you for sharing that,
• 30:10
  you know, and thank you for just for your authenticity.
• 30:14
  I always open like tell people, share whatever feels safe for
• 30:17
  you and whatever you feel called to.
• 30:20
  And I think I'm so glad you talked about the extrovert piece
• 30:24
  because as extroverts, we are out there listening and fixing
• 30:29
  and doing and being and taking on all the emotions of the room,
• 30:33
  making sure everybody else around us is OK.
• 30:36
  And it's a, it's all of that. But then all of a sudden things
• 30:41
  start piling up. And then if you add on to it,
• 30:44
  life just life's like there were a series of really tough things
• 30:49
  that were happening in your life that year and they just kept
• 30:52
  piling on top of each other. So this all of this taking care
• 30:57
  and minding everybody else and, and all of that got
• 31:01
  exponentially more difficult with all this other stuff.
• 31:05
  And so I want to say to all of you out there, make sure This is
• 31:11
  why I, I'm so passionate and I harp on the self-care is
• 31:17
  healthcare piece so much because having that space for you to
• 31:24
  fill your cup, to say no, to make space for you is to protect
• 31:31
  you. And also it benefits everybody
• 31:34
  else around you as well. And people that are love you and
• 31:38
  are for you, like we talked about earlier, are going to be
• 31:41
  glad you did it. And we can't assume so many
• 31:44
  times we assume everyone else around us must see what we're
• 31:48
  doing. They must recognize how much
• 31:50
  we're putting out and we're waiting sometimes for them to
• 31:54
  offer help or ask if they if that's something we really want
• 31:59
  to do or what. They're not going to do that.
• 32:01
  They're not mind readers, no matter what we think our body
• 32:04
  language is saying. And going back to that again,
• 32:07
  communication is kind for to you and to the people around you.
• 32:12
  So don't be afraid to ask for help.
• 32:15
  It is not your responsibility to carry all the burdens and
• 32:19
  resolve all the issues in every room.
• 32:23
  It is. I think it's just, and it's hard
• 32:25
  though, sometimes when you're wired the way you and I are as
• 32:31
  extroverts to, to operate that way.
• 32:34
  My oldest daughter said something to me so important
• 32:36
  when she was home from on break when when she was in college, I
• 32:41
  think it was her junior year. We're just having a
• 32:43
  conversation, sitting at the the bar in the kitchen and having
• 32:47
  some coffee and she was sharing something with me that she was
• 32:51
  heck, you know, trying to unravel and trying to figure
• 32:54
  out. And I go into fix my mom's
• 32:56
  ready, go in to fix them up. She's like, stop, I don't need
• 33:01
  you to fix this. I just need you to listen.
• 33:04
  And it was like, oh, so you know, taking that pause too,
• 33:09
  before you go in and rush in to see if everybody take that pause
• 33:14
  And, and if you aren't sure, ask.
• 33:17
  And if they're and then ask, you know, and depending on how they
• 33:21
  answer, empower them with resources instead of enabling
• 33:26
  them with you fixing it. Yeah, if that brings up such a
• 33:31
  great topic too, is, you know, when, if you're an expert and
• 33:37
  you reach out to your friends, your friends, it's not their
• 33:40
  responsibility to fix you, right?
• 33:42
  A lot of times we just need you to listen, OK?
• 33:46
  And that's like, listen with your ears, not with your mouth,
• 33:49
  but give us, you know, give us that space.
• 33:52
  There's a great Simon Sinek YouTube videos called 8 minutes.
• 33:57
  Give us 8 minutes. Because of 8 minutes, we can
• 34:00
  usually get off of our chest what what we wanted, what we
• 34:04
  want to talk about, you know, be an active listener.
• 34:07
  A lot of times we're not looking for your two cents, OK?
• 34:11
  A lot of times we're just looking for somebody to listen
• 34:14
  to us. And if you don't have somebody
• 34:16
  in your life that could give you that 8 minutes, I'm telling you,
• 34:20
  call 988. That crisis line is there for a
• 34:23
  reason. Yeah, they save lives every
• 34:26
  single day. They save my life.
• 34:28
  And I will tell you I am thankful every single day to be
• 34:32
  alive. Yeah, yeah.
• 34:34
  And some of the people you love, I mean, I think it's just such
• 34:36
  a, but it's just such a really important reminder is I think so
• 34:41
  many times. And you said mental health
• 34:43
  doesn't have favorites. And I think sometimes we go
• 34:46
  through this life thinking, oh, I'll never get there.
• 34:48
  Oh, that won't be neat. And there for years, for years.
• 34:52
  And it's still out there, but it's getting better with our
• 34:55
  conversations. For years, the conversation
• 34:59
  around people committing suicide was, oh, that was so selfish.
• 35:03
  How could they do that to their loved ones?
• 35:05
  And it's like, no, no, that's how desperate it got for them.
• 35:12
  That's how difficult. So we even taking the stigmas
• 35:15
  around the judgement and the way we talk about these things.
• 35:19
  So when people so it, it adds fear to people, feel like I'm
• 35:22
  afraid to tell people I'm having suicide ideations.
• 35:25
  I'm afraid to talk about this open.
• 35:28
  We've got to because let me tell you, none of us come out of this
• 35:32
  life unscathed. And we're all going to have
• 35:34
  points where we're going to have things that we're going to have
• 35:37
  to deal with that are going to impact our mental health.
• 35:40
  So being resourced, but that listener piece is so important,
• 35:45
  man. I mean, and I think the listener
• 35:49
  piece sometimes can be hard because when you skip quiet,
• 35:55
  sometimes the voices in your own head start coming up and the
• 35:58
  noise in your own head starts coming up.
• 36:01
  And so you're uncomfortable with the quiet because you don't know
• 36:05
  what to do with the noise. So that, for me at least, played
• 36:09
  a role too. And you know, the other thing
• 36:12
  that we need to like think about too is like, if somebody did
• 36:17
  take their life by suicide, don't stay committed suicide
• 36:20
  because like we for, for those of us that have been there, we,
• 36:27
  you know, they, they died by suicide committed is like, it's
• 36:31
  an act like it's a crime. It's not a crime.
• 36:34
  Listen, I had a really messy head and a lot of shit going on
• 36:38
  all at the same time. And my little 411 body didn't
• 36:42
  know how to handle it. Like there was no, absolutely no
• 36:45
  room for it to go anyplace. So when somebody comes to you
• 36:50
  and they do have suicide ideations or they just need you
• 36:54
  to listen and you say you, you will be there for them day or
• 36:58
  night, you better make sure you're there day or night, OK?
• 37:01
  Don't make a, a promise that you can't keep because that's even
• 37:05
  more hurtful than you like giving me your, your advice,
• 37:11
  right? Or your two cents.
• 37:13
  If you're going to, if you say you're going to be there, be
• 37:15
  there #2 just listen. Listen with open an open heart
• 37:21
  and if you are afraid for somebody that is in your life
• 37:25
  and you're afraid that they are going to attempt suicide, call
• 37:30
  988 on their behalf because it's that number's there to help you
• 37:35
  with that conversation also, right?
• 37:37
  Because, you know, for me, like I, I hit rock bottom and it
• 37:41
  didn't have anything to do with drugs or alcohol or anything.
• 37:44
  I was mentally not, not good. I was not in a good place.
• 37:49
  Yeah. I'm glad you brought that up too
• 37:51
  because I think here's another misunderstanding is people think
• 37:57
  that. So I'm going to use an example
• 38:00
  of a man we knew when my our kids were growing up.
• 38:03
  His kids were similar to our age kids.
• 38:07
  Beautiful family appeared on the outside to have everything going
• 38:11
  for them. He took his life by suicide.
• 38:15
  And thank you for that correction.
• 38:16
  I appreciate that. Language matters, and it's
• 38:19
  important that we put the right language around it.
• 38:22
  So thank you for that. And people were stunned and they
• 38:27
  were like, he's got this beautiful marriage and these
• 38:29
  beautiful children. People's relationships don't
• 38:32
  have to be falling apart around them for this to happen.
• 38:37
  And this wasn't that. So I think it's important to
• 38:40
  talk about that too. Yeah, like she just had no idea.
• 38:46
  And what was sad about it is, and you know, I'm mad at myself
• 38:52
  because I couldn't find the words to explain to her what was
• 38:56
  going on. She was really upset for like, a
• 39:01
  good couple of months. But then once she understood,
• 39:04
  you know, because my therapist gave me words to use, I didn't
• 39:07
  have the words because I'd never felt like that before.
• 39:10
  But she gave me words that I could translate into why I
• 39:15
  wasn't able to talk about it because I didn't understand it,
• 39:20
  you know, and us as humans, like when we don't understand crap,
• 39:24
  like we just like can't, don't put words to it, right?
• 39:27
  I, I couldn't put a word to it, but she, she understood.
• 39:30
  And like, I had some friends that did the same thing.
• 39:35
  A lot of times we don't have the words for what's going on inside
• 39:38
  of us. We just feel weird and
• 39:41
  compassion goes, so it is the best thing and, you know, giving
• 39:49
  us some patience and grace. All right.
• 39:51
  Like I wasn't my normal self. I mean, I was still funny, but
• 39:56
  like not as funny if I think about it.
• 39:59
  And like I did things that weren't funny at the time.
• 40:03
  They're super hysterical now, but.
• 40:08
  Like with your loved ones, like if you can't share with them,
• 40:14
  maybe just like as an extrovert, I'm just going to say this.
• 40:17
  Just say, hey, you know, I'm not, I'm not feeling good.
• 40:20
  Like I, I got some stuff going on.
• 40:22
  I, I don't know how to articulate what's going on.
• 40:25
  They're either going to, they're going to do one of two things.
• 40:27
  They're going to be like, hey, let's sit down and talk about
• 40:30
  it. Like you, you just tell me
• 40:32
  what's going on in your head to just get it out.
• 40:35
  Or two, they may shut down because they don't, they're not
• 40:38
  equipped to handle that conversation.
• 40:41
  And if you get the, the ladder of the two, you know, I'll go
• 40:46
  back to my therapist. Like therapy is amazing, you
• 40:51
  know, try and get a therapist if that, if you don't have the
• 40:54
  resources for that, I'm going to go back to 988.
• 40:57
  They're there, they have resources.
• 40:59
  They can help kind of make sense of what's going on and maybe
• 41:03
  help you come up with some words to describe how you're feeling
• 41:07
  so that you can talk to those people that you're with.
• 41:10
  Your coworkers, your your companion, your partner, your
• 41:13
  wife, your husband, your kids, anybody.
• 41:17
  But you know, it all has to come from a place of kindness, OK,
• 41:22
  Kindness. Do y'all know what kindness
• 41:24
  means? Let me tell you what kindness
• 41:26
  means. Kindness means Don't be a jerk,
• 41:29
  OK? Because a lot of people have
• 41:33
  stuff going on in the inside and sometimes it comes out.
• 41:40
  We don't want it to come out. But you have absolutely 0 idea
• 41:44
  what's going on with somebody. And that might be that they, you
• 41:49
  know, maybe somebody died, maybe they have a medical condition,
• 41:53
  maybe they're just having a bad day.
• 41:56
  Don't be judgy. Yeah, and just be kind.
• 41:59
  And you know, as a society, we, I'm going to say, like over the
• 42:04
  last couple of years, right, we forgot what kindness looks like.
• 42:08
  We forgot what, it's what, what it looks like to not be so
• 42:11
  judgy. Be kind, be kind of yourself.
• 42:15
  And like, if you're the one that's going through it, you
• 42:20
  know, offer yourself patience and grace.
• 42:23
  I, you know, I couldn't even offer myself patience and grace
• 42:26
  because I was so in my head the the entire time.
• 42:33
  Like I would show up for everybody else, but I was not
• 42:36
  showing up for me. Yeah, yeah.
• 42:38
  And, you know, negative same, same thing goes for negative
• 42:41
  self talk. Like stop.
• 42:43
  I really like we talk worse to ourselves and we would talk to
• 42:47
  like somebody we love. Be kind to yourself.
• 42:50
  Yeah. And you know, it's it, it you,
• 42:53
  you don't think it would go a long way, but it really does go
• 42:56
  a long way. Yeah, yeah.
• 42:58
  One of the things when I first got into therapy, one of the
• 43:01
  things my therapist said, she he's like, how's yourself talk?
• 43:03
  I'm like, oh, I think it's all right.
• 43:05
  Like I, you know. And then she's like, OK, so this
• 43:09
  is what I want you to do this week.
• 43:10
  I want you to whether it's on your phone, in your journal,
• 43:14
  wherever it is, I want you to write down any.
• 43:17
  Are you on track? Anytime you start talking in a
• 43:21
  way that's not supportive or empathetic or kind or gracious,
• 43:25
  and and then I want you to, you know, say that in a healthy way.
• 43:31
  And, and she's like, just pretend you're talking to one of
• 43:34
  your daughters and reframe it in a healthy way.
• 43:37
  And I because I honestly believe that I'm pretty good with that.
• 43:42
  I was stunned. Like I was like.
• 43:47
  Oof. Like, and it's the little things
• 43:49
  and it's subconsciously we do it without even realizing it until
• 43:55
  were asked to pay attention to it.
• 43:57
  It was the same for me when my husband and my therapist
• 44:02
  combined as a team kind of to to get me to stop apologizing for
• 44:09
  every single thing that happened in the world.
• 44:11
  And and it was again, one of those things I was more aware of
• 44:14
  that one. I didn't think it was as bad as
• 44:16
  it was, but it was those just stopping for a moment and start
• 44:20
  tracking and keep inside. You will not believe the
• 44:22
  difference it makes when you stop apologizing for the person
• 44:26
  who across the street fell on the ground and you're convinced
• 44:30
  it's because they were looking at you and they tripped.
• 44:32
  I mean, you just find those unbeaten some ridiculous things
• 44:35
  to apologize for because you're so conditioned to it.
• 44:39
  And then also self-taught. Oh, that was really stupid.
• 44:43
  No, no, it was just a mistake. It wasn't really.
• 44:48
  You're not stupid or even how you frame it like something that
• 44:51
  I have learned to do so that we are identifying with these
• 44:56
  different things that are going on.
• 44:57
  It's like instead of saying Oh my anxiety, it's not my anxiety,
• 45:02
  the anxiety that I'm feeling, the anxiety that I deal with,
• 45:05
  the anxiety diagnosis is part of my character traits but doesn't
• 45:10
  define who I am. Even saying that in a different
• 45:13
  way is really helpful. So don't underestimate the
• 45:17
  number you're doing on yourself with the self talk.
• 45:22
  Yeah, it's hard. We're so mean to ourselves.
• 45:24
  So mean. Like we talk to ourselves.
• 45:27
  Like you would talk to somebody and text, OK?
• 45:29
  Like it's stuff that you would never say to somebody face to
• 45:32
  face. Yeah.
• 45:34
  Like just stop because I'm counting.
• 45:36
  It just makes you feel worse than you already did.
• 45:39
  Yeah. It does nothing to move the
• 45:40
  needle in a better, healthier direction for you not.
• 45:43
  No, yeah. Absolutely.
• 45:46
  All right, this is a journey that you've been on and you've
• 45:49
  really shifted is living out of your own expectations versus
• 45:53
  others expectations. Talk to me about that.
• 45:57
  I mean, that's really under all of this, what we've been talking
• 45:59
  about the whole time with the shift that you've made over the
• 46:02
  last, you know, 2 1/2 three years.
• 46:05
  So talk to me about what that has felt like for you.
• 46:10
  It's been liberating. It really has like for me, you
• 46:15
  know, at the beginning of the year in January, I quit my job
• 46:20
  of living, you know, living, breathing corporate America for
• 46:24
  45 years. And I opened up my own company
• 46:27
  and I, and for me, that means that I get to take, you know, I
• 46:32
  took all that pain and turned it into purpose.
• 46:36
  And I get to, to work with people that, you know, know me
• 46:41
  #1 by reputation, you know, that's one thing.
• 46:44
  Don't ever burn bridges because you never know when you're going
• 46:46
  to need to cross over them again.
• 46:49
  And I get to live my truth. I, I get to live and do the
• 46:55
  things that I want to do and not what everybody else wants me to
• 46:58
  do. And I, you know, once I hit 60
• 47:02
  and I'll be 62 and I returned 62 in July, like I quit giving a
• 47:09
  crap about a lot of things. And, you know, like shedding,
• 47:14
  shedding away, you know, I get to follow things that make the
• 47:22
  world better. I, I get to, you know, lead with
• 47:27
  my authentic self and show up the way that I want to show up.
• 47:33
  I get to laugh a little bit more now.
• 47:36
  I feel lighter. Like not only not my brain so
• 47:39
  much because, you know, lately with anxiety, it's kind of like
• 47:43
  squirrels on crack. Like, I can't, I can't wrangle
• 47:46
  everybody together. So but, you know, I get to, I
• 47:55
  get to help change the world and change how we talk about mental
• 47:59
  health and take it into companies and make them really
• 48:04
  think about it. Yeah, because a lot of times
• 48:07
  companies don't think about the mental health aspect of their
• 48:10
  employees. I mean, they try.
• 48:11
  I'm going to, I'm going to give credit to about 40% of the
• 48:16
  companies out there that are really trying.
• 48:19
  You know, the other 60% need a lot of work.
• 48:22
  And I get to take that experience that I've had in 45
• 48:26
  years and like my own lived experiences and help people
• 48:31
  realize that they can do things better.
• 48:33
  And for me, yeah, I, I love doing that.
• 48:37
  And, you know, with the podcast, I get to talk to people, you
• 48:40
  know, being an extrovert and I live in upstate New York and a
• 48:43
  really tiny farming community. I, you know, I don't see a lot
• 48:46
  of people. So doing that, the podcast, you
• 48:50
  know, gets that extrovert a part of me out where I can, you know,
• 48:53
  engage with people and I've gone about, you know, with people
• 48:58
  I've worked with over the years. I've now set up zoom meetings so
• 49:01
  I can just talk to them, you know, with me.
• 49:04
  Like when COVID came around, I am telling you that was prison
• 49:07
  for extra roots. It was truly prison.
• 49:10
  Hey, like couldn't talk to anybody.
• 49:12
  You couldn't hug anybody, you know, like you couldn't go
• 49:15
  outside. You were on a mask.
• 49:17
  Like you could have resting bitch face and nobody would ever
• 49:20
  know because you had a mask on. But, you know, now I don't have
• 49:25
  bitch face anymore. And I get to, like I said, I get
• 49:29
  to live my truth. I get to pursue the things that
• 49:32
  really make me happy. Yeah.
• 49:35
  And I have. I have so much amazing support
• 49:39
  from everyone in my life, like my family, my friends, my wife,
• 49:44
  you know, like, well, not my coworkers anymore because I
• 49:47
  don't have any coworkers because it's me, but like my customers
• 49:51
  and you know, everybody that we interview on the podcast.
• 49:54
  Because now I have all these friends that I never thought I
• 49:57
  would have. And what it took was a really
• 50:01
  horrible mental health suicide attempt to get me here.
• 50:06
  And I'm so grateful for everything I have in my life.
• 50:10
  I I wake up every morning and I watch a 20 minutes of a funny
• 50:14
  video just to start my day because that's really how
• 50:17
  everybody should start the day. That's a great idea.
• 50:21
  Don't do that. Start your day.
• 50:25
  Start with laughter and then after that, like I speak what
• 50:29
  I'm grateful for that day and I'm like I said, I am grateful
• 50:32
  every single day to be alive and to be able to share my gift in
• 50:38
  give people the, you know, there is hope.
• 50:41
  Like I, I didn't think that there was, but it took 2 1/2
• 50:45
  years with some really hard work and a lot of tears and a lot of
• 50:49
  like still trying to get that negative self talk into my head.
• 50:54
  But I found that I'm kinder to people now.
• 50:56
  I mean, I was kind before, but I'm kinder now and I have
• 51:03
  boundaries now. And I can say no to things.
• 51:05
  And I didn't think I had that before, OK.
• 51:09
  And therapy wasn't easy. I literally had to speed date my
• 51:11
  therapist. I, you know, it took, it took
• 51:14
  speed dating to get to #3 And I was like, OK, this works, you
• 51:18
  know, And you know, just making sure you're taking care of
• 51:22
  yourself because you know, the world needs us.
• 51:25
  Yeah, more than ever right now. More than ever.
• 51:29
  And like when you have that intrusive negative self talk
• 51:33
  crap going on in your head, remember that you're needed,
• 51:36
  you're wanted, you're loved, and the world's a better place
• 51:39
  because you're here. And that's something that I, I
• 51:42
  repeat to myself every day that, you know, I'm a productive
• 51:47
  member of society. All of us women are.
• 51:49
  And even then, we're all very productive members of society.
• 51:54
  Life just like can kick you and don't just don't let it hold you
• 51:59
  down. Call your way back up.
• 52:01
  Like find that thing that's going to make you want to get up
• 52:04
  every morning. And, you know, with everything
• 52:07
  going on in the world, because the world totally is on fire,
• 52:11
  find that one thing a day that brings you joy.
• 52:14
  And it can be anything. It could be your kids laughing.
• 52:18
  It could be a butterfly. It could be deer in your yard.
• 52:23
  It could be the smell of your, you know, for me, like it's
• 52:28
  planting season and smelling, smelling the roses.
• 52:31
  And find your joy because even with pain, you can still have
• 52:38
  joy. You can still laugh.
• 52:40
  Yeah. I thank you for that.
• 52:41
  I think that joy piece and this, it's so interesting the time
• 52:45
  we're in that joy piece keeps coming up in conversations with,
• 52:50
  with guests on that. We've got to find it and allow
• 52:54
  ourselves to feel it and experience it because it's when
• 52:58
  the world is on fire that we need more of that to feed our
• 53:02
  souls. And we tend to feel go the other
• 53:04
  way and feel guilty because the world's on fire.
• 53:07
  I don't have time to feel joy. No, you need that.
• 53:09
  You need those endorphins, you need those that serotonin and
• 53:13
  you need that that lift. I mean, I will do a thing
• 53:19
  sometimes I did it today where I will turn on my favorite
• 53:23
  comedians on Netflix or Prime and watch them between episodes
• 53:28
  that I'm recording because I love these conversations.
• 53:31
  And also there's an emotional tax that comes with these
• 53:35
  conversations. And so I, and I'm sure you run
• 53:39
  into this. I know you've run into this same
• 53:41
  thing and so I will take the time to like what can I do right
• 53:45
  now to completely it? It'll be comedy.
• 53:48
  Sometimes it's just that stupid trashy thing you've watched 5000
• 53:53
  times that is pointless and senseless and doesn't require
• 53:57
  any of your like. You don't have to process
• 54:00
  anything as you're watching it because.
• 54:02
  You can. You can just sit and laugh like
• 54:05
  the other night we watched RV Robin Williams, like I, I
• 54:10
  laughed so hard and like, you know, nobody was doom scrolling.
• 54:15
  Everybody was watching the movie like he was a good like belly
• 54:20
  laugh. And sometimes that is that will
• 54:23
  help turn turn you around. Laughter is so good for you, you
• 54:29
  know, sharing. Sharing what's going on within
• 54:31
  you and laughing are two of the best things you can do for
• 54:35
  yourself. Absolutely, it's a huge
• 54:37
  component of our health. So don't give up your joy, but
• 54:40
  do things for fun. You're like, what's fun?
• 54:43
  It doesn't have. I remember the first time my
• 54:46
  therapist did this a few years ago.
• 54:48
  She's like, what are you doing fun this weekend?
• 54:50
  And she goes, you are so and you probably ran into this problem
• 54:54
  too. I am so purpose driven that even
• 54:59
  in the fun or the joy, I'm looking for the purpose like,
• 55:04
  Oh, that's good for my health. And, and my, and my therapist,
• 55:07
  she was like, I don't give a damn if it's good for your
• 55:09
  health or not. I want you to do something fun
• 55:13
  for no good reason other than it's fun.
• 55:16
  And and it's like it's tapping into that thing that you used to
• 55:19
  do as a kid without thinking about it that you lose as an
• 55:22
  adult. Like we somehow as adults so
• 55:25
  many times lose that. And fun is every is important.
• 55:29
  And so, yeah, whatever it is, whether it's the ridiculous show
• 55:33
  or the funny conversation or, you know, the the memories that
• 55:38
  make you laugh. I mean, you know, it's just it
• 55:42
  do something fun for no good reason other than it's fun.
• 55:47
  And you know, like for my own self-care, I'm taking Mondays
• 55:51
  off. You know, I worked in corporate
• 55:54
  America for 45 years and you know, you'd have to request the
• 55:57
  day off. Now what I did is I just turned
• 56:00
  to myself and like, hey, can we take Mondays off?
• 56:02
  And I'm like, sure, why not? So, you know, for me, that's my
• 56:07
  ultimate self-care. That is a day I do absolutely
• 56:10
  nothing. I don't do anything with the
• 56:11
  business. I don't do anything with my
• 56:13
  podcast. I do stuff for me, and it's a
• 56:17
  great way to reconnect with my wife and the outdoors and, you
• 56:22
  know, live my life. Yeah.
• 56:26
  Yeah, because I think that's an important thing to remember too,
• 56:29
  is these things that we're passionate about, that we're
• 56:31
  called to, they're very much they're they're what fires us up
• 56:34
  and gets us up in the morning. But there's a whole life to
• 56:36
  live. It's a portion and a part of us.
• 56:39
  It's not all of us. And so filling all those parts
• 56:43
  of us that's living a life, you know, and and it's and taking
• 56:47
  space and making room for all of that.
• 56:48
  So good. Thank you so much.
• 56:50
  All right, accepting the layered aspects of ourselves, all the
• 56:54
  pieces and parts, the messy, the beautiful, the complex, the
• 56:59
  stuff we wish we didn't do the job.
• 57:01
  We wish we would have taken all the shit and all the stuff.
• 57:05
  Talk to me about that, that journey, because this is, I
• 57:08
  mean, I know for me and I know for you, this has been a pivotal
• 57:12
  part of this journey of being able to embrace all those layers
• 57:16
  and, and you don't have to love them all.
• 57:18
  But that acknowledgement and that curiosity over judgement,
• 57:22
  which that's a great, my, my therapist in Ted Lasso gave that
• 57:26
  to me over the last couple years.
• 57:28
  And that's when that's, that's a great thing to apply to life
• 57:33
  right now, period. Curiosity rather than judgement.
• 57:38
  And start with yourself on that. Yeah, I like my curiosity, you
• 57:44
  know, now that I can do whatever I want to.
• 57:48
  I'm, you know, I'm teaching myself a lot about AI, you know,
• 57:52
  learning new tools. I'm learning, you know, new ways
• 57:56
  to be creative. I let my my inner child come out
• 58:01
  and play a whole lot more now than I ever did in any years.
• 58:06
  I laugh more. I still cry like the other day I
• 58:09
  had a good hard cry, but it was super cathartic and I think I
• 58:13
  should do it again. But, you know, accepting me for
• 58:17
  who I am, you know, the good, the bad, the ugly.
• 58:21
  Like, I'm human and I get to live this amazing life.
• 58:26
  And, you know, for my wife and I, time's not on our side
• 58:30
  anymore, you know? So we make we don't, we make a
• 58:33
  bucket list. We have, we make every moment
• 58:37
  count list. Because you know, if there's
• 58:40
  those you don't make that make every day count.
• 58:43
  And you know, people say it all the time, but man, you don't
• 58:46
  know what the hell is behind what?
• 58:48
  What's behind the next curtain, OK, Because life trips you up
• 58:53
  every time. And be grateful.
• 58:56
  Be so grateful for what you have because there's just so much
• 59:00
  going on in this world and I don't know, be nice to people.
• 59:05
  Can we just be nice? Please be nice.
• 59:08
  And it's, it's, it's, it's a hard life right now.
• 59:11
  So I just, I'm grateful to be able to share my journey, you
• 59:16
  know, give yourself, you know, laugh at yourself.
• 59:22
  It's funny. Hindsight is 2020.
• 59:25
  It is. And it and it tends to get
• 59:28
  funnier the farther away you get from things too.
• 59:31
  Yeah, like, you know, shit happens, OK, you know, we're,
• 59:35
  we're not perfect, but, you know, also give your the people
• 59:40
  that are around you get offer them the same compassion and
• 59:44
  grace that you that you should be offering yourself because
• 59:48
  nobody's perfect. You know what, we're not going
• 59:50
  to get it right the first 8700 times to do it.
• 59:53
  And by the time we get to 88 hundredth time, we're like, oh,
• 59:57
  I finally get it. But you know, as a woman, I'm
• 1:00:03
  you know, I'm working hard every day to empower other women to
• 1:00:08
  give them the the tools that they need.
• 1:00:12
  One thing that I figured out is. You know, the older we get, we
• 1:00:16
  need to mentor down because I really would rather not have
• 1:00:20
  people follow in my footsteps for all the bad stuff I did.
• 1:00:24
  Yeah, they're great teaching lessons, teaching moments.
• 1:00:27
  But, you know, if I had taken better care of my mental health
• 1:00:31
  in my 20s and 30s, maybe by the time I hit 59 1/2, I wouldn't be
• 1:00:37
  attempting suicide. Yeah.
• 1:00:39
  Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think that really goes
• 1:00:42
  again and speaks into why we both do we want people to know
• 1:00:46
  and have the resources on the hand before they get to a point,
• 1:00:50
  a crisis point where they absolutely have to have it just
• 1:00:53
  be operating in this way. Now keep I talked about earlier,
• 1:00:58
  have these frameworks to keep you on the tracks because life
• 1:01:01
  will knock you off the tracks and you're going to have to get
• 1:01:04
  back on. You're going to have to get up
• 1:01:05
  off the mat. But if you've got the framework
• 1:01:08
  to follow and and help you do that, then it won't take you
• 1:01:11
  out. And I think that's, you know,
• 1:01:13
  and it doesn't have to take you out.
• 1:01:15
  And Amen. Yeah.
• 1:01:17
  Absolutely, absolutely. All right, in living out feel
• 1:01:22
  finding empowerment, embracing layers, which is the acronym
• 1:01:26
  that has become a core component of what I feel so passionate
• 1:01:30
  about. Talk to me about how that's
• 1:01:32
  impacted you were you're living that out.
• 1:01:34
  You have found that and you're living it fully.
• 1:01:38
  Talk to me about how it's impacted your relationship with
• 1:01:40
  yourself, which we've fed into a little bit already, as well as
• 1:01:44
  your relationship with other people because you said
• 1:01:46
  something so important. And I think it's so important to
• 1:01:49
  remember this. I once we start taking care of
• 1:01:52
  ourselves and treating ourselves with compassion, it really does
• 1:01:56
  from automatically lead us, I think, to be more empathetic and
• 1:02:01
  curious and kind to others because we realized there's a
• 1:02:07
  story behind that. I may even now if I'm driving
• 1:02:10
  and someone cuts me off, I'm like, you know what?
• 1:02:13
  Maybe they just lost their job. Maybe their dog died.
• 1:02:17
  Maybe their kids are having a hard time and got let you know.
• 1:02:20
  You just don't know. It's never, you know, when those
• 1:02:22
  kinds of things happen, we get so furious and angry and it's
• 1:02:25
  like, it's not about you, you know, And so it's just stopping
• 1:02:29
  in a moment and being curious about that.
• 1:02:31
  But talk to me about that change that that that switch for you
• 1:02:36
  when you started really pouring this into yourself.
• 1:02:40
  I felt lighter, I felt kinder, I felt more empathetic.
• 1:02:49
  And I've been empathetic my entire life, but I'm more
• 1:02:52
  empathetic now because I know what it's like like to live that
• 1:02:56
  truth and just understanding, you know, the human nature, you
• 1:03:03
  know, understanding how kind of people tick and be able to read
• 1:03:07
  those signs a little bit better, Not just another people, but
• 1:03:09
  learning to read those signs. And me, like, if I'm getting
• 1:03:13
  like, a little anxious, OK, maybe I just need to take a
• 1:03:16
  little breath remembering that I have an inside voice and that
• 1:03:21
  outside voice and making sure that the outside voice doesn't
• 1:03:25
  come out when I should be using my inside voice.
• 1:03:28
  Yeah, it doesn't happen all the time.
• 1:03:30
  And that's a hard lesson to learn because if you're like
• 1:03:33
  extroverted and funny like me, like sometimes that thing that
• 1:03:36
  you want to say, you probably shouldn't say it.
• 1:03:41
  It happens. But I, I've taken all those
• 1:03:46
  layers and before they were so compressed, but now they're
• 1:03:50
  opening up and I feel like there's so much more for me to
• 1:03:56
  learn just about myself. And you know, I wasn't a huge
• 1:04:03
  podcast listener before my suicide attempt, but now it was
• 1:04:06
  a ton of a ton of podcasts, you know, just but reminding myself
• 1:04:12
  that like self love and self-care are really important.
• 1:04:14
  And I, I don't care what people say that they're buzzwords, but
• 1:04:18
  shit, if you are not taking care of yourself, I will tell you
• 1:04:20
  exactly what happens. You're going to wake up
• 1:04:23
  Christmas morning and you're going to be like, I am done.
• 1:04:27
  And you'll either make that decision of, yeah, I want to
• 1:04:31
  continue living, or you'll just full on do it.
• 1:04:34
  And so, you know, part of the feel for me was coming out of
• 1:04:39
  that. You know, hindsight is 2020 and
• 1:04:42
  looking at the things I could have done better, Sure.
• 1:04:45
  And making sure that today I don't reflect so much back on
• 1:04:51
  the past, but what I did today to make myself continue to grow
• 1:04:57
  and continue to sort of reinvent myself into like that.
• 1:05:03
  Like I had to rebrand myself, rebranded myself as the 20, you
• 1:05:09
  know, 62 year old solopreneur just living my life.
• 1:05:14
  But I'm so much happier than I've ever been.
• 1:05:16
  And you know, my wife said something to me the other day
• 1:05:19
  that this is the happiest she's seen me in 20 years.
• 1:05:22
  Wow. Because I'm now living my truth.
• 1:05:25
  Yeah. Wow.
• 1:05:27
  I think that's so powerful. And I also want to speak to
• 1:05:29
  that, too, because it's never too late to make a shift,
• 1:05:33
  people. Yeah.
• 1:05:34
  I'm 55, Gretchen, 62. You know, you know, it would
• 1:05:39
  have been nice if we'd done it sooner.
• 1:05:40
  Sure. Also, don't let that stop you
• 1:05:43
  from doing it now like you might, you know, you just, you
• 1:05:47
  don't know what's ahead of you. But whatever life you have left,
• 1:05:51
  whether it's 10 days or 45 years, live it in the most
• 1:05:57
  authentic, healthy way you can and and live at that purpose
• 1:06:01
  with meaning and same present. You talked about that.
• 1:06:05
  I think that present in your relationships, in your moments.
• 1:06:08
  We're I had a panel conversation yesterday and my flimblock
• 1:06:14
  Blanca Magical shared this quote that a friend had first told her
• 1:06:17
  one time and she was talking about it in reference to to
• 1:06:20
  raising your kids. That really applies across the
• 1:06:23
  boards. Like don't be so focused on
• 1:06:25
  giving your loved ones a great life that you miss out on giving
• 1:06:32
  them a great day. And I was just like, oh wow,
• 1:06:36
  that's so good because we get so focused on the long term plan
• 1:06:41
  and down the road and this overall picture.
• 1:06:44
  What are you doing in the moment if you're working so hard on
• 1:06:47
  that great life that you're not present and around in the
• 1:06:51
  moment? That's what people, that's where
• 1:06:53
  the that's where life is lived. That's where the memories come
• 1:06:56
  from. It it, you know, kind of goes
• 1:06:59
  back to like chasing the money, chasing the dream.
• 1:07:02
  Maybe instead of chasing that, chase your happiness, chase
• 1:07:06
  those things that, you know, like really like get you going.
• 1:07:11
  That it it goes back to like finding your joy because you
• 1:07:14
  know, sometimes like chasing that dream and chasing, chasing
• 1:07:19
  the money don't come true. And then you're you're just feel
• 1:07:22
  defeated. Chase happiness like make every
• 1:07:26
  day count, laugh, be grateful for what you have get help when
• 1:07:33
  you need it. And like here, here's the one
• 1:07:35
  thing like for me, don't be ashamed that you have to ask for
• 1:07:40
  help. It's not a shameful act.
• 1:07:44
  And I learned the hard way, but at the same time, I didn't
• 1:07:47
  understand what was going on inside me.
• 1:07:50
  And now that I do understand, I take a lot of precaution to make
• 1:07:54
  sure that my heart is OK, especially now that I'm doing
• 1:07:58
  more podcast interviews and the fact that, you know, we record
• 1:08:03
  six to seven episodes one Saturday a month.
• 1:08:06
  And so those can be really difficult long days for me.
• 1:08:11
  And so I spread, I spread stuff out now just so I can bring some
• 1:08:16
  happiness and joy into my own life every single day.
• 1:08:20
  And that was a game changer for me when I realized that it's OK
• 1:08:25
  to laugh every single day and that I'm not perfect and that I
• 1:08:29
  don't have to please everybody around me and that I'm, I'm good
• 1:08:35
  enough. I am enough.
• 1:08:37
  I don't need to add, I don't need to add anything to me.
• 1:08:41
  You know, I'm, I am enough. I'm maybe a little too much for
• 1:08:44
  some people, but I am enough. Yeah, oof.
• 1:08:47
  That's good. I love that.
• 1:08:49
  So good. You, you just listed off a ton
• 1:08:51
  of things there. There's about a three minute
• 1:08:52
  clip there that I'm like, this is it right here.
• 1:08:55
  If you get nothing else out of today, these are the things we
• 1:08:58
  want you to take away. So good.
• 1:09:00
  All right, we're down to the rapid fire.
• 1:09:04
  Talk to me about 5 things that nourish you.
• 1:09:11
  The sun, laughter, learning something new every day, reading
• 1:09:23
  a good book, and being at peace with myself.
• 1:09:30
  Good. All right, 5 words on how you
• 1:09:32
  want to feel the next six months.
• 1:09:36
  Energized. Less tired.
• 1:09:41
  OK, that's 2 words accomplished. That's three loved and there's
• 1:10:07
  another one. It's going to.
• 1:10:08
  OK, this is what happens when you get old.
• 1:10:10
  It's called a brain fart. I want to feel successful.
• 1:10:23
  Well, I, I, I, I, I'm confident you will, and I'm here to tell
• 1:10:30
  you you are. But I think it's important that
• 1:10:32
  we name those things for ourselves because it helps us
• 1:10:35
  frame, OK, these are the things I've identified.
• 1:10:39
  How am I going to be an active participant within that?
• 1:10:42
  What am I going to factor into my day into my into the things I
• 1:10:46
  do to nourish myself, how things I do to fill my cup things I say
• 1:10:51
  yes and no to you know, I think that's it's such an important
• 1:10:55
  component and and thing to reflect on.
• 1:10:58
  I knew I'd love this conversation.
• 1:11:00
  I love this conversation. You're welcome back anytime I
• 1:11:04
  feel like, you know, I I feel like I know this won't be our
• 1:11:07
  last conversation on this platform and tell people this
• 1:11:11
  will all be on our resources page at embracinglayers.com.
• 1:11:14
  But tell people where they can find you, follow you, all the
• 1:11:17
  things. All right, there's two places.
• 1:11:20
  If you want to learn more about my company, you can go out to
• 1:11:24
  showsoursolutions.com. All my socials are out there.
• 1:11:28
  And if you want to learn more about the podcast, just go out
• 1:11:30
  to goes on our heads.net. Our episodes are out there.
• 1:11:34
  Our socials, we are on every single platform out there.
• 1:11:39
  Find me on Instagram. I'm out there a lot.
• 1:11:41
  We're also I'm very active on LinkedIn.
• 1:11:45
  Yes, all the things. All right, my friend, thank you
• 1:11:48
  so much. There's an honor.
• 1:11:50
  Thank you. Thank you.
• 1:11:51
  You bet, you bet. And thank you to our friends at
• 1:11:53
  Pod Match for bringing us together.
• 1:11:55
  Want to give them a shout out to you?
• 1:11:57
  Check out Gretchen's resources, follow her, check out this
• 1:12:01
  podcast. I'm telling you, I mean, it is
• 1:12:05
  it. They're having those
• 1:12:05
  conversations and I'm always so impressed and excited and
• 1:12:11
  motivated by women who take this hard stuff that life throws at
• 1:12:17
  it and is like, you know what? We I can be a resource for this.
• 1:12:21
  Now I'm going to provide insight and safety and space because I
• 1:12:29
  don't want anybody to ever feel like I felt I don't want anybody
• 1:12:32
  to ever get to that space. So we're going to open the door
• 1:12:36
  and we're going to welcome people in and that's what you
• 1:12:39
  do. And so thank you for how you
• 1:12:41
  show up in the world. I appreciate you so deeply.
• 1:12:44
  Friends that are listening. There was a ton in here to take
• 1:12:49
  away. So go back, re listen, check out
• 1:12:52
  what Gretchen's about in the world.
• 1:12:55
  Be kind to yourself, be kind to other people.
• 1:13:01
  When you're in the grocery store line, you just never know what
• 1:13:05
  your interaction is going to do for someone.
• 1:13:08
  We just don't ever know what's going on in people's stories.
• 1:13:12
  It's a it's a wild time out there.
• 1:13:14
  Let's try to, let's try to see the best in others instead of
• 1:13:19
  jumping to the worst and just know they have a story.
• 1:13:23
  Even if it's a story, it's in direct conflict with how we see
• 1:13:29
  the world. They have a story that's
• 1:13:30
  informed how they show up. And so being kind is going to
• 1:13:35
  get you a lot farther than not being kind.
• 1:13:40
  And I think that's something so important to remember.
• 1:13:42
  Like we get so fixated right now about convincing other people
• 1:13:47
  we're right in this whole right, wrong thing.
• 1:13:50
  That's like, we completely miss that.
• 1:13:52
  You know what, badgering somebody and beating them over
• 1:13:56
  the head with this thing you're convinced you're right about is
• 1:13:58
  not Invitational. It is not kind and it's no way
• 1:14:02
  to create a dialogue of to and it just be curious, be a
• 1:14:07
  learner. And I this is these are things I
• 1:14:10
  work on everyday. Let me tell you, I can be as
• 1:14:13
  judgy Mcjudgy as anybody out there.
• 1:14:15
  And so I have to constantly tell myself on repeat, get curious,
• 1:14:22
  get curious, get curious because I have not arrived in this
• 1:14:26
  place. That is not why I'm saying it.
• 1:14:28
  But I know when you do get curious.
• 1:14:30
  I've seen the power in it in my own story and in others.
• 1:14:33
  And, and that's what you do. So thank you.
• 1:14:37
  So everyone listening, thanks so much for being with us today.
• 1:14:40
  Go to that resources page and embracinglayers.com.
• 1:14:44
  Let us know what you think about this episode.
• 1:14:46
  Comment on what you want to hear from us.
• 1:14:48
  Share share Gretchen's, you know, podcasts with people.
• 1:14:53
  People need these conversations right now.
• 1:14:55
  We need safe places to land. Take good care and we'll see you
• 1:14:59
  next time here on the Field podcast.
• 1:15:02
  Hello and thank you so much for being with us today on this
• 1:15:06
  episode of the Feel podcast. If you would like more
• 1:15:10
  information on how you can apply these talking points that I
• 1:15:15
  share with our guests in each episode to your own life, really
• 1:15:19
  utilize this Feel framework. Go to embracinglayers.com, fill
• 1:15:24
  out our contact form and let's set up a free 30 minute
• 1:15:29
  consultation to talk about how you can start living your most
• 1:15:34
  authentic, organic, healthy, feel fueled life.
• 1:15:38
  Thanks again for being with us today.
• 1:15:40
  We'll be back to you soon with another episode here on the Feel
• 1:15:43
  Podcast.