Latest / Success Story with Scott Clary / Lessons - The Hidden Psychology of Crisis Survival | Matt Gutman - Chief National Correspondent at ABC News

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Lessons - The Hidden Psychology of Crisis Survival | Matt Gutman - Chief National Correspondent at ABC News · Success Story with Scott Clary

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  visit vanta.com slash scott now before this offer expires that's vant.com slash scott for a thousand
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  dollars off in this lessons episode discover why panic is wired into human DNA as both a survival
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  mechanism and a challenge learn to differentiate between debilitating anxiety and natural stress
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  responses and explore techniques like breathwork intentional exposure and psychedelic integration
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  to transform panic into resilience you mentioned something i just want to ask you one thing on
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  that point because you said it's built into our genetic our DNA into our genetics right this is
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  this is how we survived as a species and evolved but it's also it's also partly built into
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  catches and past trauma so how do you know when it's working the way it should versus if it is maybe
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  working on overdrive because of things that have happened in our past i mean i think it's a brilliant
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  question and i'm not just buttering up the interview i think it's a really good question we don't know
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  um the thing is if the panic is debilitating to your life
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  then it's something you've got to deal with then there's something going on there with the
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  trauma that you need to deal with if it's a one-off like you had on an extraordinarily hot day in
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  Miami when you're hungover and you see some weird stats about your blood pressure and you have
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  and you have a panic attack that's a different issue right that it's environmental
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  maybe you have a greater predisposition for panic because you are higher on the anxiety scale
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  possibly it's not a bad thing by the way but when it's like debilitating your life then
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  that's when you need to deal with it on a more holistic way and that's what i needed to do
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  i needed to like basically treat panic as i treated the big stories i worked on in my journalism
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  career which is like and that's how i played sports you know in high school and college like
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  if there's a wall i'm gonna run through it i'm gonna do whatever i need to do and that's what i
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  sign myself with panic i'm like okay first i'm gonna learn everything there is to possibly learn
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  about panic then i'm gonna figure out why it is that i'm broken and why humans evolved to have panic
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  in the DNA or anxiety because all the science tells us it's so unhealthy and then once i looked
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  looked into that of realizing yes it's kind of unhealthy but it's also one of the things that
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  preserves humans and your body doesn't care if you suffer a little bit it wants you just not to be
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  dead anything to not get dead no i was gonna say i mean that's a good that's a good nice little
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  built-in uh uh uh safety mechanism i mean i'm not gonna complain about that but i was just going to
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  ask when you look at sort of the point in your life when you realize it was a major issue you do
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  some breath work and you go back to work you're still reporting you didn't change your career
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  wasn't was the solution breath work was the solution therapy was the solution awareness was a solution
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  all of those things combined with doing the thing that gives you anxiety another
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  200 times being cognizant of the fact that this feeling is actually going to arise but working through
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  it anyways with a little bit of a more educated lens like how did you evolve from that point
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  well i i definitely had not evolved what i went back to work i was presented with you know like i
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  could have stayed out but like i had i am the sole breadwinner right like i couldn't quit my job
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  so i needed to find an exit ramp and my in my brain uh i was like okay just take everything easy
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  just don't take it so seriously uh you know breath work had definitely helped to open up my mind a bit
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  and relieve some of the pressure that had been building up just emotionally so i get it a couple
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  times with Lane and i had you know a good a couple of really good experiences uh during my suspension
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  also went to Alaska had a near death experience in the sergeant like i got lost on on near denali
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  in the snow and in mid-February in Alaska just typically not a great thing to do as it gets getting
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  dark but like i had a surge of adrenaline which is basically your stress response which is the
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  same thing essentially as a panic attack but it was for the real reason that you should have a panic
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  which is your body being like holy shit Matt you're alone in denali it's 3 o'clock in the afternoon
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  it's getting dark you have no food you have a little bit of water and you're stuck in snow that's
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  over your head and you can't get out you're fucked and i'm like oh i'm fucked look how i feel
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  that's like exactly what from a level panic attack okay well this is my body working as it should
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  it during this stress response and in fact what happened was it triggered something in my brain
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  that allowed me to think of a novel way to get out of this snow that was so deep i couldn't get out
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  of it it was like this that was like quick sand of snow so powdery i couldn't get on top so i was
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  like drowning in it so i before i'd seen snow shoe hairs i'm like i'm gonna make myself like a
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  snow shoe hair so i thrashed around to this spruce tree and i apologize to the tree but i start
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  like snapping off branches and i putting them in like clothes in my jacket in my hands and in my
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  feet and in like all over and i'm basically like being a snow angel to get out of the deep snow
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  and that's how i got out of there and because the one of the things that does work when you're
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  having a panic attack is your internal GPS system i had gone down the mountain a very different
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  way than i come up off the trail because i'm like hey i'll let me trick off the beat and got
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  the finale when i'm hiking it alone in the middle of the winter that was dumb but anyway my
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  your internal GPS system works really well when you're having a stress response and it totally
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  oriented me on the right path i did not have a trail and like somehow an hour later i figured out
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  how to cross the trail and i got back on the trail like all the stuff that happens in a panic
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  in a stress response worked as it shook i'm like okay so this obviously just had a stress
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  response and it worked to my advantage i've had stress responses in a panic that do not work
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  to my advantage so part of it is okay let me figure out how to deal with the part that's not working
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  for me um yeah i had to go back to work because like i needed the paycheck to be quit honest um but
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  like the journey of figuring out panic and getting to the end of panic i don't know if it's
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  not sure i'll never have a panic attack again um but i'm in a lot better place than it was but
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  that was years that took like three and a half years of like maintenance and work and lots of
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  psychedelics and therapy and i tried every pharmaceutical out there that you could ever imagine
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  adhd dimension and bends in antidepressants in anti-seger medication everything um and it didn't
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  work what worked for me best was learning that i'm okay evolutionarily like this is part of the
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  human DNA so like that i'm not fucked up that i am like as a human is that i'm not totally broken
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  and learning that like a way to express the feelings that i've been bottling up inside for so long
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  through getting out of my right mind with altered states because in my right mind i was way too
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  controlling of my emotions but when you're doing an altered state you have no control whether it
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  be breath work or ayahuasca you lose control and once you lose control you can start to
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  expectorate to cough up to get rid of all of this like anguish and grief inside or whatever it is
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  and when you do that kind of work it does carry over into your day to day so when you do the
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  breath work or even the psychedelics when you sort of confront these demons when you're going in
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  you you notice a significant decrease when you're about to go on air next time or you're asking yeah
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  I'm on I'm asking I have no idea I haven't done breath workers psychedelics yeah yeah uh definitely
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  I'm asking for me dude I'm asking for me because I've only dealt with it by just doing it more
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  so now my my strategy is like throwing myself into more speaking engagements on purpose so that
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  I just get more I get more I get more shots at it and then every time it gets a little bit easier
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  isn't it funny how people would be like hold on I don't get it like you have a problem speaking
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  publicly but you literally do it for a living like you're speaking publicly now I mean okay so
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  humans in the room with you but like you talk for a living I mean it's funny and no one would say
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  be like there's no way Scott experiences stage fright like how would that be possible he's so
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  fluid he's so confident but that's how humans are right we're we're an interesting species
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  um so yeah like it works through reps but for me I'd had thousands of reps alive TV and I still
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  was having panic uh so I needed to figure out this other way out and so there are a couple of
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  things that happen with altered states one is the medicine itself helps relieve anxiety right like
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  especially with ketamine they've done a lot of it a lot of studies on ketamine but also MDMA
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  and the psilocybin mushrooms and there is a a physical impact host treatment of these things that
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  it definitely reduces the incidence of anxiety and depression but there also images that you get
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  from having these psychedelic experiences that you take with you and that um I use this sort of
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  like a treasure box to go back to for periods of calm like I'm thinking about you know one of these
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  things in ketamine is that I was flying over this forest just like me Matt or my avatar soaring over
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  this forest and I perch on this high cliff and for some reason my avatar decided to take a nose
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  dive into the forest and the dirt thousand feet below and instead of just like smashing my face into
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  the forest or the the the forest floor the forest rose up to meet me so in my afterwards as
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  them doing what's called integration which is like you think about and and you get help with this
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  psychologist like why you saw the stuff you saw what experiences you had and how to work that
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  into your day-to-day life and gain meaning from it I was like that's like the trust fall of life
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  I'm always worried that I'm gonna let myself down or that someone's gonna let me down so I have to
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  have hyper control but look at that the earth met up rose up to meet me it's gonna be okay
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  everything is gonna be okay and it like hey maybe that wouldn't work for everybody for me that
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  gave me a really a real sense of peace like I'm gonna be caught in the trust fall of life
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  and so that's one of the things I keep in my little treasure box of images
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  thanks for tuning in if you found this valuable don't forget to hit that subscribe button
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  so you never miss an episode and if you want to dive deeper into this conversation check out the
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  links in the description to watch the full episode see you in the next one
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  you