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Snack Media Group · Dishing with Stephanie's Dish

• 0:15
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: When you think about how we are consuming sort of social media, it's a space I'm interested in not only as someone who writes cookbooks, but who's in the broadcast space myself and also as a consumer, like how it's so quickly changing how we're consuming video and finding out about new restaurants and getting excited about the food scene.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: Hector, tell me a little bit about your journey and how you started Snack Media.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, my journey.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: So I was actually, and most people don't know this, so I'll share a little piece of information, but in college, I was very into music and I actually started out in the sound world.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_00: So producing, making songs, that kind of thing.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: Bought a DSLR in the attempts of like, I'm going to start recording myself doing cover songs and playing for the internet and see if I can gain a following.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's how I got my hand on a camera.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: And once I had that, I was like, okay, this is like fun.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_00: I really enjoyed like the visual side of things.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so I started doing senior photos for people just to see if I had a, you know, a good eye for it.
• 1:33
  SPEAKER_00: And it turned out I did.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: Fast Forward a Bit did a marketing internship with a company called Woodchuck USA where I got to use my camera skills, video skills to create product videos to actually make sales on e-commerce.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_00: And I was able to drive their numbers significantly over a three month period just with videos and photos on Instagram.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: How long have you had Snack Media as a company?
• 2:30
  SPEAKER_00: So Snack is the COVID baby.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_00: It was born in March of 2020.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of the second iteration of my video company.
• 2:41
  SPEAKER_00: In 2017, I had my original video company, which was called Echo, which is just a combination of my first and last name, the classic name.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_00: And not a lot changed from the first company to the second company besides like a one year hiatus.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_00: where I had joined a client of mine in a program called Techstars.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give them a shout out.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: Basically, it's an accelerator program for apps or ideas.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I took a one year off hiatus to join that because it was a really good opportunity for me to get actual marketing spend, you know, more than I ever had before behind my creative ideas.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_00: So we were able to push this idea creatively and through the ad space world and
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_00: So I took a year hiatus.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_00: Leaving that, I realized that, you know, in the early days, we were creating these kind of one-off flagship videos for companies, right?
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: So I can, for example, if you've been to Crave, you know, they were a client of Heco a while back.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, we did a beautiful video, full set, multiple locations, all that good stuff.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it was about a minute and a half, two minutes.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: And I still love that video visually, but
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_00: I realized like, man, companies can't just make one video a year or every other year and expect to gain traction.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: And also like the value, the ROI isn't there anymore because they're like high ticket items, you know?
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, a video like that costs, I mean, my experience would be about $10,000 by the time it's all said and done.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly, right.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: And so the ROI just started to like not make sense anymore.
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, hey, I'm getting less content, you know,
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: Very Infrequently and It's Also Super Expensive.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_00: And anyone can tell you that formula doesn't work, you know.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: And especially in the startup space with the Techstars program, you know, it was very evident like, oh, we need to create like multiple pieces of content every week with ad spend just to see it perform well.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: And so I got hands-on experience and it almost kind of became my thesis of like, it needs to be short, it needs to be to the point, and it needs to be often.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_00: And from there, I was like, that's going to be my new company once I venture off from the startup.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's going to be called Snack Media, short, bite-sized pieces of content that are at a more approachable price point.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_00: Everything's relative, but that's going to be feasible on a monthly basis, which is what I thought.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah and there's still a big difference between you holding up your camera and doing something quick and easy and down and dirty and having someone that has like a story in mind that's producing something that is still small and snackable but they have like a beginning a middle and an end even in that short narrative time frame.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah yeah it's funny because like the lines are starting to get blurred between
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: what it used to be and what it is now.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_00: And it was kind of a bit of an identity crisis.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, well, do we do high end stuff?
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: Because we have that technical skill and we can make beautiful imagery.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: And there's sometimes a need for that.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_00: For example, internal projects at companies, sometimes they need a professional high level video that's two or three minutes long that they share with thousands of employees.
• 6:07
  SPEAKER_00: And we get that and we enjoy that.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_00: And it's great.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: But the day-to-day activity, I think, is on social media.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_00: That's where I do all my consuming.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's where a majority of people watch videos.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_00: So I really wanted to be a social video first company because I think that's where the game is played right now.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and it's really smart because that's what intrigued me about when I learned about you right away.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_01: I thought, oh, this is interesting.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_01: He's coming at it from where the consumer is versus where maybe the companies are.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_01: And all of that will come together.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: And then I saw some videos that you did for Billy Sushi.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_01: and you know Billy is a crazy larger-than-life character so he has a lot of a lot to play with but what I got about that is they were so well produced they were quick and they I knew they were driving business to Billy because Billy is also a good businessman and he's not going to do something that he doesn't think is bringing you into his seat to eat some sushi and drink some sake at his establishment so I thought that was pretty cool
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: When you approach a customer like a Billy or a Crave, because I'm assuming restaurant space is a good space for you.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I mean, ironically, Billy was kind of, we had a hiatus from restaurants after Crave.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: It was mostly B2B clients for a while.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: And Billy kind of showed up in my text messages one day.
• 7:39
  SPEAKER_00: and like you said larger than life ideas some friends introduced me to him he's like hey i got this giant thing called a sherp and i'm a you know i listen to rap music i saw the super bowl kanye west in the sherp i knew exactly what that was as soon as i got that call or a text message so i was like what is it for the listener that maybe doesn't know so a sherp is like
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_00: a nine-foot-tall, semi-aquatic, land vehicle, all-terrain, where its wheels are about five feet wide, and they look like inflated balloons, four of them, and you can drive it on grass, you can go into water, you can go on roads.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_00: Basically, it was designed to traverse Siberia without breaking down.
• 8:28
  SPEAKER_00: It's got
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: 10 Gallons of Gas in Each Wheel.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_00: So it goes forever.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's like, it's just a roaming vehicle, basically.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: So Billy ends up with one of these, probably from someone that he knows.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: He actually ended up buying that.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if I can say that publicly, but he bought it off of a friend.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's his.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_00: He has it.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: We've used it.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: We filmed a few videos from it.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, we didn't do a ton of restaurants.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_00: And then I had that with Billy.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: And
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: Here's what I've started to notice with restaurants is I think they get so much content from people posting it themselves that it's tough for them to go, okay, now I want to make my own.
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_00: And they're not really being serviced in that way.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: And we actually think that's a huge opportunity because I think it's good to have user-created content, right?
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's amazing when anyone makes a video for you.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_00: That's great.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_00: But if you want to tell a narrative or you want to remind people, you have to get on the ball and do it yourself.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what's special about Billy is he understands that.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, hey, I want to be a brand.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: I want people to see it from my perspective.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: There's stories to be told from my angle.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: And we get to do that with him.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: and even beyond that he's just to give Billy a shout out he's very much about like he's a happy jolly guy and he wants people to feel that when they come to Billy Sushi so it's actually been so much less about focusing on the food and more about like are people smiling when they watch the video and he genuinely is like you know that way and he wants people to be that way so
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: What do you say to that person that's not spending any money to create these types of snackable videos, but really could use them in terms of generating traffic?
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_00: What do I say to them?
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we're launching an ad here soon, an internal ad my team is creating.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: And we're also partnering with Eat Drink Dish, if you've heard of them.
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_01: I sure have.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Golnaz.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: Golnaz and I are partnering on this.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: Because I'm truly about like providing value to like being in that startup scene and running my own company and see dollars going in and out.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_00: You're only going to do something that works for you financially.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I think what video companies have gotten wrong in the past is that like the financial responsibility around making a $10,000 video once a year doesn't work anymore.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: and that was a hard pill to swallow for me in the early days because it was like oh cool I'm finally good enough to make these videos and now it doesn't make sense anymore yeah and that's my perspective some people might argue um but uh as soon as we kind of swallow that pill and go no let's own this social market like the social space where it actually works it actually moves the needle then it's like we've been busier than ever like you know it's
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_00: Keeping Up and Getting Videos Out the Door is now the new challenge for us.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_00: So to answer your question, if you're a restaurant owner that's not doing this and if you have
• 12:35
  SPEAKER_00: Reserves to Spend.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think this is a really good space to start.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it's never an immediate magic bullet, but I think if you commit to it for a few months and you start making good content, people will see it if it's good content.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_00: And when people see things, they get excited, they go reserve, they make plans.
• 12:53
  SPEAKER_00: That's just how society works.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen titled
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_01: I feel like restaurants have gotten kind of a little lazy in their marketing in some respects, relying on the consumer to do it all for them with reviews or Yelp or whatever the user generated content is.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, no, control your own narrative.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I would agree.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, I don't run a restaurant, so I couldn't say like,
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: It Seems Very Difficult, I would say.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: I think it is.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: I think it requires like kind of all of your attention on just running it.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: And so I think that's where the pain point is for restaurants to go, oh, let me add becoming a video content creator.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_00: And we actually kind of make that joke with Billy in some of his ads.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_00: You know, he's like, man, now I've got to do this, right?
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because that is the joke.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_00: And in our new ad that's coming out, we kind of poke fun at that, too.
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_00: It's like,
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, now I gotta run a restaurant and become like a media icon and know how to edit and all this stuff.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_00: Or I can hire an influencer who's really focusing on themselves and not my restaurant.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_00: We poke fun of those things and we're snack fit to them is we want to solve that problem.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_00: Like let us make the videos for you because it is time consuming.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_00: It does take talent.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_00: It takes research.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: And as a restaurant owner, you shouldn't be doing that.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_00: It doesn't make sense time wise.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: And so the cost to do it yourself versus us, I think is actually way less expensive just to have us handle it.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: So let me go back to you're going to partner with Eat Drink Dish and I want people to leave this podcast to generally have an idea like what does that like what does a partnership look like not necessarily specific to her but when working with you and what kind of things do you provide and how much would they need to budget to have something like this go forward?
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah so touching on Eat Drink Dish so what I was looking at in the market is like
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_00: We want to make videos that get views, is what we're attempting to do.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: Dare I say viral?
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_00: I think people avoid it.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: I think for a long time people avoided it because it's a lot of pressure.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_00: You can't guarantee something to go viral.
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_00: But then I started thinking, you know, the videos you see on your Instagram feed are the best of the best performing videos right now.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_00: And that's because the algorithm has shown it to people, AB tested it at scale, and then now what ends up on your feed is the best content.
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's what it is, whether you like it or not.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of a discovery I also made.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_00: And so what we do is we take videos that have a good structure, right?
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_00: That have a viral tendency.
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_00: And we reverse engineer those and then we go to Billy or other restaurants and we make those for them.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: So you're getting a really high chance of your video getting high engagement, right?
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_00: So that's our base.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: That's where Snack is starting an operation right now.
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_00: Well, that Instagram came in and said like, hey, we're going to do collaborative posts, right?
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_00: Where it shows up on your feed and the person you collaborate its feed.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_00: So you can kind of share your following base.
• 16:55
  SPEAKER_00: And that's where Eat Drink Dish became very, very interesting because she's already got a very, very engaged foodie community of 75,000 followers that are wanting to watch food content.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so the perfect marriage was, well, let us make the videos that have high engagement, have a tendency to go viral, and then let's do collaborative posts with Eat Drink Dish so that they also get that immediate exposure from her audience.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_00: But then again, not to take away the spotlight from the restaurant because of how the collaboration posts work, it also is on their feed too, right?
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_00: So now you get this video that's on your page,
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_00: Likely to Go Viral as an immediate 75,000 audience plus whatever their actual, you know, let's say experience following.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_00: And now you have a formula that's going to more or less guarantee that you're going to get eyeballed on it.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I felt like that was too good of a pitch or a value add to not do.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_00: And so that's what we're going to do.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: So to get to the price thing.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, go ahead.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_00: It's yeah so to get to the pricing you know it's a Golnaz and I are doing a split on it where we produce it she posts it right now we're kind of doing introductory price going to be $1,500 for a reel and you can do you know one a month or up to four a month you get some price cuts if you do more
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, we think like the right restaurants will understand that that's pretty big and they can recoup that really fast.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, that's what we're offering.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_01: I also just I feel like this is a good opportunity.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: Golnaz and I have been
• 18:43
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_01: Link With You and also this huge audience base that she has cultivated.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: It is hers.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_01: She's worked it hard.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, she's kind of grinded it.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I spoke to her about this.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, you know, your account's been around for a while and like the rules have changed over the over the years.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: And like, you know, your ability to adapt through it is pretty astounding.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_00: And so I mean, she's got
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: The Proof is in the Pudding, I'd say.
• 20:05
  SPEAKER_00: She's really done a good job, and we just get to be an extension of that, you know, to continue on into the next era.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: I can show you a little clip of our ad.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_00: Billie's featured in it, and this is not released yet, but we're talking about the pain points of making videos and not getting views, and I'll show you goal noses in this towards the end.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's so funny.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_02: Oh yeah, she's so cute.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_02: Look at that.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_00: So that's coming soon.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_00: But basically, you know, it's a boiled down version of what we're talking about where it's like, hey, making young videos is hard.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: You should do it because it's the best way to share, you know, your story, your food, the world.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_00: And we want to help you do it at the highest level.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_00: So work with us.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_01: Can we talk a little bit about just like some general trends and social things you're seeing at this point?
• 21:01
  SPEAKER_01: So like they just made an announcement today that TikTok and Universal are having a music licensing problem and they're going to start taking Universal Music off of TikTok.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: um that seems like an opening for other companies but also TikTok has tried to launch kind of a music version like an apple in other countries and so that is seen as a impediment to them doing that in the United States further what do you see like what's the next thing we've later ate have you experimented with that at all that's another food site no I haven't later ate
• 21:40
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: When you rank importance, is Instagram still where it's at for like visuals, Facebook for communicating with, let's say, the older folks and TikTok now the younger folks?
• 22:08
  SPEAKER_01: And do you have anything that you're watching on the horizon that's next?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I think what you said does ring true a little bit, but, you know, I've sent my mom TikToks and she's watched them, you know, so I think like that
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's all kind of homogenizing, if I'm being honest.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, definitely the people that are creating on TikTok are young, just because that's, you know, creating is different than consuming.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: But I think there's a lot of people consuming TikTok, Instagram, Facebook.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_00: Here's what I'll say about TikTok.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_00: It is a random mess of an algorithm where we can't, I struggle to reverse engineer those in any meaningful way.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: and I'm being fully transparent.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_00: If there's someone out there that says I'm going to make you go viral on TikTok, they're definitely lying to you or they know something that not a lot of people know because it doesn't seem to operate in a logical way, at least to me.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: I think Instagram for business still makes way more sense because there's a certain level of predictability
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_00: and strategy that you can actually write down and start to execute.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_00: And to give an example of that, we've posted every video that we've made from Billy on Instagram, on TikTok, and none of them have performed as well besides maybe one that did just as good on TikTok as it did on Instagram.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_00: And then there was one video that did okay on Instagram that did really well on TikTok by like 10x, you know, any of his other videos.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: And it was, there was no rhyme or reason for that.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_00: So TikTok is a little too chaotic for me to offer as like a service.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_00: I would say repost anything you make on the TikTok.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_01: Is there truth to the idea that if you make something on TikTok and it's watermarked and then you put it onto Instagram that they power it down?
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think that's a thing.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_01: I think so too.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you are making, do people still care about photos?
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like are just static posts a thing anymore?
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: I would say no.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_00: I've heard some rumblings of like carousels still being big, but it's also like carousels with a video mix in the middle.
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_01: some really weird stuff like that it's like two photos and then a video and you know to me that's just like a video with like a trailer at the beginning kind of thing so I would say deprioritize photos absolutely how do you feel about um there's a service called CapCut that is a video editing service that makes making slick creative videos pretty fun and fairly easy is that something you like or
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's a great tool for people to start getting their hands on it themselves.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_00: I don't personally use it, but we have opened the floodgates to anything and everything that helps us do it faster and better.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_00: So like AI captions, that's a thing we use all the time.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_00: You know, even some AI editing of long format is becoming a thing too, especially for like podcasts like this, right?
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: We can chop it up and get the best 15
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_00: Clips Without Watching the Footage Back.
• 25:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's a very new thing that we're doing right now.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_00: And that's what helps us with velocity.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I think, yeah, CapCut's great.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: We don't use it professionally.
• 25:53
  SPEAKER_00: Not that you can't make good stuff on there, but I think it's a good tool.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_00: I despised Canva in the early days, but I get why people use it because they don't want to learn Photoshop and they're not going to.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_00: And there's marketing professionals that use Canva and they're going to continue and Canva will get better.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think it'll get better too.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_01: I've used it for a long time, but it was still, yeah, it was hard to use and still is.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, it gets a little better, but you know, I've learned, I used to like get all, try to get all creative with the templates and now I'm like, nope, just use what they have and change out the elements and you'll save a lot of time.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: And that's kind of the thing right now.
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_00: It's like,
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: As creatives, and it's the last thing I'll say and let you ask your question, but as creatives, you want to contribute to the world in a unique way that's only yours.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_00: That's how most creatives feel.
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_00: This was my idea.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: I thought of this.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_00: This is my contribution.
• 26:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I had that feeling for a long time.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then I started realizing like, well, I kind of borrowed that idea from something else I saw.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_00: And then, you know, and then I saw someone else do it and now I'm doing it.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: And now it's like, are there really that many original thoughts going out into the world?
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_00: You know?
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: Big Topics Here.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_01: Because I really geek out on these thoughts about cookbook writing because I'm writing all these recipes.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: I maybe see a rest like I'm consuming a lot of content myself.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm seeing things.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm being exposed to things.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_01: I'm at restaurants eating things.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: Seasonality of ingredients are coming across my plate.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then I'm like, okay, I need to make something for the Super Bowl.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I Want to Make a Buffalo Chicken Type Thing, but the wings have been done, the dips have been done.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's incredibly hard to come up with something super original.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_01: And then even when you do and you look for it, you can find 55,000 versions of the same thing that you thought was yours.
• 27:59
  SPEAKER_01: It's becoming really challenging.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm just trying to lean into the space of
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: intent like is my intent pure and am I not like literally going to someone's website and scraping their recipe and scraping their ingredients am I making it in a way that feels unique to me that feels fresh to me am I documenting that process and that's the only way I've come to some peace with this this situation I don't know about you yeah it's a strange world um
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_01: it's taking that quote like good artists cop or good artists what is it something about great artists feel yeah I mean in a sense too and and if you look at TikTok it's just a rip-off of the original like Instagram and then Instagram ripped off TikTok for reals like it's just all a big soup right yeah and actually I I
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: I always mourn Snapchat because they were the ones that did stories and they just got completely left behind in the ether of the internet.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_00: Which is kind of weird.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's Super Weird and they like they did they really did some innovation in the early days with the stories and we still use stories now which I think they kind of fell off a little bit because it became like everyone's junk you know but um I really like story that that story is cool and then as soon as Instagram got it man that's so upsetting they just stole it and no one cares and I still use Snapchat I don't I left it behind because it's just using what people use is yeah I think what wins um
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: I used to be an Android guy and I still enjoyed Android, but everyone wanted a FaceTime or iMessage.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I still think Apple should do a subscription-based iMessage and FaceTime for any phone platform.
• 29:54
  SPEAKER_00: Like if you're on Android, you can pay.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_00: You got iMessage and FaceTime.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone's connected.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_00: Apple still gets their billions.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone's happy.
• 30:02
  SPEAKER_01: And we wouldn't need WhatsApp then.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_00: Okay.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: I'm going to ask a few more questions here and then we'll wrap it up.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: User generated content is what a lot of people are relying on to drive their marketing messages.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_01: This is content that's created by the people that use their products, not driven by them.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_01: Are we seeing less interest in that or more as we go?
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_00: The Good Question.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Let me think about that for a second.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_01: Some of it's so bad.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the bad stuff does better than some of the good stuff.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and I was going to say, we seem to be like the amateur-ish things, things that like I would never have posted a photograph like that before is almost now the thing that because it feels authentic, the word authenticity is getting thrown around a lot, probably too much.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_01: But we got so jaded about the Internet and so jaded about fake news that now everyone's looking for this authenticity.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_01: But let's face it.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm just going to throw out this, you know, if you look at like Ballerina Farm or you look at any of these giant, massive influencers, you know, they're making sourdough bread from scratch into pizza, homemaking the cheese, milking the cow.
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_01: Like, that's not that's not authentic.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_01: That's not really happening.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 31:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:36
  SPEAKER_00: We're in a weird space in time right now.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: I think 2022 to now is a weird space in time.
• 31:43
  SPEAKER_00: Stephanie Hansen.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Stephanie Hansen.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_01: You Can Just Look at Her and be like, there's no way that girl eats that stuff.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: So like the influencer game, you used to get paid to influence or paid to post.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_01: The industry is larger than ever, but it seems like it's really switching who it's using to influence.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 32:32
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I agree.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_00: I think people that are like professional influencers or
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_00: are creating UGC content, like that's what they do.
• 32:44
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think it's UGC anymore.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's a new kind of creator that specialize in a specific format.
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_00: And we're starting to create those formats ourselves, right?
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't think, I think UGC is a random person walks in, takes some video of your food and then shares it, tags the company, but doesn't have any financial interest in it.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: that to me is UGC and I think that's valuable and that's great that's like real word of mouth I think if someone's spending more than 10 minutes editing something it's now a professional service and so I think there's I think that style is something to be used until it's not and we're we're using it right now currently but I don't think it'll be forever I think that style is just a trend
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_01: Dishing with Stephanie's Dish featuring Stephanie Hansen
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: we're gonna see like endorsements UGC content is gonna be Ryan Reynolds running across our Instagram screen you know with him and his hot wife and they're gonna eat dinner at so-and-so like as soon as the content creators create stuff then the celebrities and the influence comes in and the money and then the content creators have to go on to the next thing right exactly yeah I think
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_00: Snack is positioned in a good way where there was like this return to authenticity in UGC and I think that's working for now but then when everyone's doing that then it's going to be a chase back to quality so I'm thinking I mean I'm dreaming about the Crave days where we're filming high end again and that might come back and we're prepared for it but I think it's just keeping a pulse on what's working
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: I think they're going to be documentary style, like 10 minute little and I think it'll probably happen on YouTube and then the other platforms will find a way to make longer content.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's you got to watch the market and move with it.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_00: I got tired of fighting against it and wanting my own idea.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, OK, what's happening right now?
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_01: There's real value in that, Hector.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_01: So you're smart.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_01: I've loved chatting with you.
• 35:15
  SPEAKER_01: It's been super fun.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_01: Good luck.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_01: I am excited for you.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: I will spread the word and be an evangelist for you because I do think that this is something that people in the food space could really utilize.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_01: And if Billy's any indication, that guy's smart.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_01: I know he's not doing it if it's not putting butts in seats.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks, Hector.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's great to chat with you.