Latest / Curiously Guided Podcast / Ep.90 | Breaking Down Somatics; Self Regulation at Your Fingertips w/ Savanna DeLuca, Therapist & Consultant

Transcript

Ep.90 | Breaking Down Somatics; Self Regulation at Your Fingertips w/ Savanna DeLuca, Therapist & Consultant · Curiously Guided Podcast

• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome to the Curiously Guided Podcast.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: We're your hosts, Mariah and Shay.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_02: Two online business strategists passionate about rewriting the rules to success within both life and business.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_03: This podcast started because we both felt frustrated by the lack of deep, meaningful, and transparent conversations around what it takes to actually run a business that we both feel good about.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_03: So we decided to create that for ourselves.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: We want our solo episodes and guest interviews to be examples of how you too can chase your dreams and go down your own rabbit holes, ultimately leading to a more sustainable and fulfilling life.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_03: We believe that curiosity is our superpower.
• 0:50
  SPEAKER_03: And trusting the nudge is a muscle that's meant to be strengthened.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_02: Especially if we want to create a lifestyle that feels good from the inside out.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_02: So are you ready to open your mind and let curiosity guide the way?
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: Let's take this journey together.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_03: We're so glad you're here.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_03: Now let's dive in.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_03: All right, friends.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_03: Welcome back to the pod.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_03: We have another episode that I have been kind of like cooking in my brain for several years now.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_03: And I finally got my friend Savannah DeLuca to come on the podcast and talk about her zone of genius, which is somatics.
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um, Savannah and I have been friends for many years now, and I um I used to do a bit of a like accelerator program with my clients that I wanted to build businesses and her business, wildheart therapy, was one of the first um case studies I got to have.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_03: So Savannah came to me years ago, um finishing up grad school.
• 1:50
  SPEAKER_03: She had this idea for a really cool therapy practice that was very different from what she saw out in the world, um, very much based about based in getting out in nature and how important it is to connect with your body.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so she just had a unique approach that she wanted to make work within the system.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_03: And um, fast forward several years, you'll get to hear the story of her following curiosity and doing exactly that.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_03: And at the time, she totally shot called with me.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_03: She's like, I want to have my own booked-out therapy practice, and I want to be teaching at colleges and universities.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_03: And and that's exactly what she's doing.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_03: And she literally just started lecturing and being a professor in the last year or so.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_03: So it's been cool as a friend to see her, you know, build something that she didn't know would work or didn't see examples of and see how successful it's become.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_03: And um the other part that I was left with after we shot this episode was just how we talk about this a lot, but just how simple some of this stuff can be.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um, somatics, we'll say in this, as we talk about an episode, somatics is a term that you hear thrown around a lot.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_03: And Savannah has a really nice way of simplifying like what it is at its core.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: But I know you guys have heard Mariah and I laugh a lot about um most of our lives we've felt like floating heads with this kind of weird body attached.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_03: And so um getting in touch with our body and with our feelings and getting out of the thinking mind has definitely been something that we work on actively.
• 3:26
  SPEAKER_03: So it's been cool to hear Savannah kind of dive into the science around somatics and get really nerdy with it.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_03: And we're at a cool point in time where we can actually bring data into how important it is to get out into the sunshine and get your feet onto the ground and all of these really simple practices that um have been around for ages and are things that our ancestors used to do, and um, unfortunately, things that we've become very disconnected with uh in the modern day.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_03: So for me, this episode was just a really wonderful reminder that we have access to all of these incredible tools all around us all the time.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um the one story I wanted to share with you guys, I just got back from a trip to Mexico with my best friend, and we had the fucking coolest natural phenomenon event happen to us.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we saw what's called a moon bow, which is literally the clouds part and like the most perfect timing, and a rainbow encircles the moon.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we were just sitting out on a back balcony one night, kind of like chatting and noticed it and were totally freaking out, and also noticed everybody else at the resort around us literally was either staring at their phones or like drunk and staring at each other.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_03: We were actually the only ones who saw it.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_03: And it was, it's really hard to describe, but it was powerful.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_03: It just felt so powerful.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_03: And her and I both took a lot of meaning from it, and we did a bunch of research about the spiritual meaning, of course, and and I'm sure I'll share more about that.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_03: It was a really impactful experience.
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_03: But what it really blew me away was that nature is all around us all the time doing really fucking cool stuff, really phenomenon type stuff.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_03: And how often do we miss it because we don't want to go outside and go, we want to stay inside and we don't want to go out and take the walk, or we're staring at our phones, or we're whatever, fucked up, and we don't ever look up at the sky.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_03: But there is literally opportunity to go outside and heal yourself, or even not even take a few deep breaths and connect with your body.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_03: And it sounds so simple, but there's just magic around us all the fucking time.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_03: And so seeing the moon bow really reminded me of all the magic that's around and how easy it is and how there for us it is.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: And unfortunately, we're so disconnected.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_03: So that was kind of my takeaway from Savannah's talk with us is just how this stuff is so available and we are just kind of forgetting about it.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I hope you guys pick up some tactics and some of the examples that she mentions and start incorporating in your own life as well.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: Jay, the intro was so good.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I don't even have very much to add.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_02: You uh you took the words right out of my mouth here.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_02: Um yes, ditto, same.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like the conversation with Savannah was so cool because she kind of like demystified it for me.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know, like if you say mind-body connection, I go, okay, cool.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: Once you say somatics, I go, lost me.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like for some reason, using these words sometimes, like I can't really connect them.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_02: And so, like making her kind of go back to the to the basics and explaining this stuff was really, really helpful at being like, you already know what this is, and remembering like how inherent it is, and it made me think of like we're out here buying fucking grounding bed sheets, we're out here buying all this shit, all this stuff.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I just bought a red light therapy, and like I'm it's me, like I'm buying this stuff too.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and like I just me and Andrew just bought like a red light therapy thing.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_02: And then I'm like, what was the true OG red light therapy?
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_02: Candles and campfire.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, but I'm over here like, should we get the big panel for$900?
• 7:24
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, no, girl, you need to, what are you doing?
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: You need to light some candles without fragrances in them, like beeswax candles, take it back to the ancestors, and like the conversation with Savannah was it was so good at like reminding us of that because we can get caught up in the Instagram feeds and like the the influencers and seeing what our friends bought or our family bought about this, and like trying to hack this and hack that.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_02: You can't hack nature.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: Notice that half of these things are really just trying to get us back to like what we crave at our core, which is being closer to nature.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_02: And of course, we don't feel close to nature when we're all siloed inside all of the time, staring at blue light and working on computers hunched over and not even moving our body.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: So this conversation was really, really good, really inspiring, and really practical.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: I like everything's within my reach.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_02: Outside is free, walks are free, um body scans are free, body scans, meditations are free, breath, breathing, you know, it's so basic, hopefully free.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_03: It's all free.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_03: There's resources if you need them.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_03: Before you dive into the bio, I did want to jump in and say one thing.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_03: Savannah mentions that she's hosting a summer camp for adults in this, and she has since launched it, and the link is live.
• 8:49
  SPEAKER_03: I will be there.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_03: I would if you are at all interested, please join us.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_03: It's gonna be a blast.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_03: So the links for that and all the other stuff will be in the show notes.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, yes, we will definitely put that in the show notes.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and it's uh it's just so funny because it's like summer camp to play around and being a kid in nature.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: Like when you think about it at first, you're like, I'm about to pay to go and travel and do this, but then it's like, well, you ain't making time for it in your day-to-day, bitch.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: So like apparently you do have to pay and go and travel and do it.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's and it's just it's it's funny when you when you think about it, but like how necessary it is for how we've evolved as humans.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_02: And then one more thing about like about this conversation is that it's always interesting to me when you can notice when somebody is really in their zone of genius, because you notice the inflection and like the passion in their voice, and you can tell that with Savannah, like very, very clearly.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_02: And like that's just a really cool thing to notice.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: So if you guys notice as you guys are listening to it, like there's some parts where she's just going off, and me and Shay are just like, yo, get it, girl, get it.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: And like you can feel it resonates deeper.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_02: So we're excited to share this episode with you.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_02: Let me just read her bio quick and then we'll kick it in.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: So Savannah DeLuca is the founder and executive director of Wild Heart Therapy and Consulting, where she's created a nurturing space that offers support and guidance to individuals aspiring to lead exceptional lives.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_02: Her approach to therapy is unique, combining somatic and nature-based methodologies with her expertise in attachment-focused therapy, specializing in areas such as adventure therapy, brain spotting, mindfulness, yoga, conscious relationships, and family issues.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_02: She is passionate about helping her clients navigate life transitions, build conscious relationships, and overcome personal challenges.
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_02: And with that, let's kick it into the episode.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, friends.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_03: I am so excited to have one of my good friends here today.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um, Savannah De Luca is joining us.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_03: I have a lot of history again with this guest.
• 10:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um, she is somebody that I have um personally witnessed go through a lot of chapters in life and business, and I've walked through them myself alongside her.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_03: So she's somebody that I've always wanted to bring on the podcast.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_03: I think her story is really cool, but also she is someone who is absolutely curiously guided.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_03: She um has built a career around her own personal curiosities um professionally, and always been someone that I think of that's constantly growing, investing in herself, her education.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_03: Now she's teaching.
• 11:31
  SPEAKER_03: And it's been really cool.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_03: I was reflecting with my husband before this podcast, like getting to see her speak what she wanted like years ago, and then now it's come to fruition.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_03: Like, so I'm just excited to share her story with you guys and also like her particular curiosities um around the world of somatics and kind of getting in touch with our bodies and getting in touch with nature.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_03: So, Savannah, welcome to the podcast.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_03: We're excited to have you here.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm already feeling my body enlivened by all of the things you're saying.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_01: I've got a big smile on my face and I'm feeling some heart tingles.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you for that warm introduction.
• 12:10
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, good, good, awesome.
• 12:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, well, I actually I was thinking like I first met you, I think I was traveling to Florida with our mutual friend Samantha, who's been on the podcast, who also has a business.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_03: And um, you, the first time I met you, you were like this badass yoga instructor living in St.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_03: Pete, like you had the coolest life.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_03: And you had decided, I think, to go back to grad school to become a therapist.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_03: Am I remembering that right?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that is the order of things.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not sure how quickly that all happened, but yes.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_03: Do you remember what was going on that time?
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_03: Like what motivated you?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_03: Because it was kind of like a career change.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, well, my undergrad degree was a pretty generic liberal arts degree.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought I wanted to be a park ranger and take kids on nature walks, and then at some point realized a lot of park ranger jobs are law enforcement and that that didn't quite fit the vibe I was looking for.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then I ended up in the nonprofit world for a little bit and found myself working at a school that was a nonprofit school, and it created really amazing opportunities for the students, but it made me realize how much I wanted to be in the lives of the students rather than planning the events for the fundraising.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's when I decided to go back to grad school and become a therapist.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_01: And in between there, I was doing lots of teaching yoga and just soul searching on my own and trying to figure out what life is all about.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_01: I would say I'm still on that journey.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, for forever, right?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so then like fast forward, um, Savannah and I both started several businesses around the same time.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_03: And I was working with my husband on branding and web design, and she was finishing her degree and wanted to start a practice, uh a therapy practice.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_03: You also did a lot of things in the meantime and moved across the country.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but when we when we were working on building um the name of your practices, it am I is it still Wild Heart?
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_03: Can I say that?
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's Wild Heart Therapy and Consulting.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: And we'll link to all that stuff.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_03: But when we came up with the name and like the branding, it was so fun.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_03: And you had all of this vision of like, I want this kind of unique therapy practice that I haven't really seen exactly, but I kind of want to build it around like my particular zone of genius.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_03: Do you remember that at all?
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_03: Like, tell me a bit about like the vision, if you can rewind.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: Um, well, that was definitely a time where I was going through a bit of an identity crisis.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, like you said, I had done some other companies and working with Samantha, actually, who you mentioned.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_01: And she's just a person who takes the steps to get things done.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_01: And I'd never really seen that kind of action before.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so having someone in my life who just said they were gonna do something and make it happen made it very possible for me to realize well, if it's possible, there's no reason I can't do it.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: I think sometimes just knowing something is possible gives me a lot of motivation to move forward.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so I met her.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: I also was spending a lot of time with you and watching you create your business.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that you helped me create mine in a lot of ways.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: There was a kind of a co-collaboration of finding our professional identities through that process.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_01: And I got a lot of inspiration from you and Sam both just seeing other women who that I want to do things my way, and then found a lot of success in doing that.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_01: So thanks.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I was getting, I was like giggling to myself.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I was on the website earlier today, and just like the logo and thinking back on all that, it was like a lot of fun to put it together.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but anyway, so fast forward to now, what you've done is initially your interest was more in like helping people through nature therapy.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: That's kind of how you got started, right?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_01: Experiential therapy means that the process of doing something is really one of the major tools of the therapy rather than just talking about what we're doing.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna do something, we're gonna create a little bit of conflict in the moment if that's what we want to work on outside of session.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna put ourselves in uncomfortable environments if we want to build resilience.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: And so definitely there's also a selfish piece that I just love being outside, and that's a really good resource for me and helps me feel a lot more grounded.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_01: So being able to take clients outside has always been important to me.
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_01: And that is really what I did build my company on in the beginning, and the more and more that I've learned over the past few years, I've learned a lot about somatic therapy and have just found my heart to really resonate there.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_03: Okay, cool.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_03: So, and we are gonna dive in deep into somatics with Savir, though.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_03: That's kind of why we brought her on today.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_03: But before we go there, um, you still, if I'm understanding, do some um taking people out into nature, right?
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_03: And training with students.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_03: Is that still an element of can you tell us more?
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_03: I always thought that sounded cool.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, for the past four years, and hopefully this year again, I'll be able to take graduate students out for a week to teach them about nature-based therapy.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: So they're already learning through a counseling program, but are especially excited about doing things like I'm describing, maybe going for a walk together or building a sculpture out of some nature items, just feeling our feet on the ground, maybe with our shoes off, and walking around and exploring the environment in a new way.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: And so I have the privilege of taking students out, going um on a couple different hikes, using the elements around us in Oregon.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_01: I live in Bend, Oregon, and we've got Three Sisters Wilderness right in our backyard.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: So getting to take them on hikes.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: We did a cold plunge two years ago in a fresh spring.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_01: It was just incredible and also a very big emotional experience.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_01: But it's one of my favorite things that I do is get to take students out, and they're so motivated about learning this that there's a lot of openness to that experience to have all of them there really sharing about something that they're learning and then getting to put it into practice and then to teach each other is a beautiful process.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I I feel like that's it's such a great thing that like you're bringing to the forefront and getting these students to really like experience and like it's just it's interesting because like if I'm scrolling on Instagram, right, I'm seeing all the time buy this grounding mat.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_02: You should buy this red light therapy, shmi schmer sh me.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: You should buy these group I mean, they probably got grounding shoes, which is kind of funny to me.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: Like they have all of these things, they have this acupressure mat and this whatever.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_02: And it's funny as human beings to remember what is the OG like grounding sheet.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: It's nature, but we so often look past it because it couldn't possibly be that simple.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_02: It couldn't possibly be so simple to literally go out for a week, let's say, in nature and like do an ice bath and go for hikes, and like that can't possibly allow us to heal at a deep resonant level because of how we've been trained in society, right?
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_02: But then if we think about hundreds of years ago, that was the only thing that they had.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_02: They were so connected to the land, and it's like we're missing that huge part.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_02: We've evolved past that.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like it's really cool to have people like connecting the dots to be like, hello, remember.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's it's the simplicity over here that nature provides.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: I was joking around with my boyfriend Andrew, and I literally was like, like it's it's just so funny how much money and like how much we want to throw our credit cards at things when really we can look outside and we can just choose to go for a walk outside and like holy fuck, what a gift! What a gift that we're able to do that.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_02: And so, like, I just I really love that.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_02: I hope that you do get to do it next year and for numerous years.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like what a great experience for these students for people, I mean, fuck, like more adults, like all of my neighbors.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_02: Can we all?
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I didn't haven't met them yet.
• 20:23
  SPEAKER_02: I literally just moved in, but like hypothetically, it's like if we could get a group of people and do that and put the spotlight back on like where the real juice is and like how we regulate our nervous systems and how we can become so connected to nature again.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_02: I just feel like our current society is missing that so much.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_02: So I really like that you're like tying that into things.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Ryan.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_01: I think what you're saying points to some of the principles that I believe the most that really simplicity is what creates health for us.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_01: I'm looking around at our rooms and I'm seeing plants in them.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, that's because we feel connected to nature.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_01: A room feels better when there's a plant in it.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: You talked about red light therapy.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: Is that kind of like sitting around looking at a campfire and feeling entranced in that experience of being immersed in that?
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Can you do you need an ice bath?
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe, and that's great to have as a convenient experience.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_01: But also, can you go jump in a river because they're right there and that's what humans have been doing since humans have been humans?
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think there's there, I'm never gonna not have work to do or not have an opportunity for work because of what you said.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: Our culture is driving this forward.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: But I wish there was a world where I worked myself out of a job because people just felt so resourced and able to connect with simplicity and to heal themselves.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: Really, the crux of my work at this point is the belief that people have within them the innate ability to heal and that the world is supporting us in that if we would just get out of the way.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, beautifully said.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, but and if I I hope I'm not making this up, Savannah, but this feel.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_03: I don't know if saying pioneer is too much, but I kind of remember like the practice you wanted to build, there's not a lot of like nature therapy practices out there.
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_03: And like some of the first conferences you were going to, it was like there was like 10 people, and they were like the only people talking about it.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_03: It was just felt like kind of like this budding industry.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_03: Have you seen it?
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_03: Kind of, it seems, you know, if you're having students come, it's kind of grown.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_03: And I think with the way society is going, like you're saying, it's just going to get bigger.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that question just makes me shift in my seat a little bit because there's a yes, and I think to the point of academic Western culture that says we need certain sorts of data or results to give something validity, that it's new.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: And as far as again, being a human and healing innately, these processes have been around since we've been around.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: And so I've been to these conferences.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: And yes, I think you are um maybe underestimating a little bit.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_01: There's probably like 40 people at some of these therapy, nature therapy conferences when I started going.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_01: And the last two years that I've been, they've been selling out at 75 to 100, I think a hundred something this year.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_01: So it's been really cool to watch these organizations grow.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot more graduate programs now that are highlighting these specific types of healing.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_01: And then I, if we expand from just nature therapy to somatic therapy, again, that is something that is tapped into now in a lot of different healing modalities, but it is really the body's innate ability to heal itself when we get out of the way.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's been around since people have been around.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_03: So it's kind of like we're putting language and and also probably learning more about how our bodies react with like advances in technology.
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_03: But um, I that's actually honestly a perfect segue.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_03: Tell us a bit about like what open I'm thinking nature, getting out in nature, going on a walk, those examples you shared earlier, those are probably examples of somatic practices, right?
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_03: Like, do you mind take me through like what opened the doorway for you for somatics and like how'd you dive into that?
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: Really, really quick.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_02: Can we just define what somatics are?
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like I hear the word floating around all of the time, and like you'll hear it in like the healing space and whatever.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_02: And I do want to know how you got involved in it.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: Can you just break down what the hell it means?
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_01: I will do my best, but just like the word trauma and a lot of these other words that seem to be buzzing about right now, you're gonna find as many definitions as you are experiences of these sorts of things.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_01: But I explained to everyone that I'm working with that somatic therapy is using the power of our mind-body connection to be able to heal.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_01: And so again, within us, there is innate ability to heal.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: And one way to think of this is your body is communicating to you all the time.
• 24:57
  SPEAKER_01: And because of some of those things you listed earlier about our cultural expectations and not and being so disconnected from this gift, I think we think we need to look outside of ourselves for healing.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_01: It feels confusing or counterintuitive at this point to look inward, although that's probably because that's been taught to us throughout our lifetime.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_01: And to give some clear examples of how this communication works, if you have to pee and you decide I'm not gonna go because I don't want to interrupt a meeting or because that might be rude, then you're ignoring what your body's calling to you.
• 25:31
  SPEAKER_01: If you're hungry and you don't get up and get a snack because you want to be on this fancy diet, or because you wanted to, for whatever reason, it's inconvenient, then you're just not communicating or listening to your body and participating in that feedback loop.
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: And then we can expand that to emotional.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: If you're feeling scared and you just shove those feelings down and you power through something, then you're ignoring your body's caution to you that this might be a dangerous situation or the situation might not be good for you.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_01: And if we need to cry and we don't do that because we will be embarrassed, maybe it's these people around us are going to judge us, or maybe they'll think we're weak, then we're not giving our body the ability to release a big buildup of energy that it wants to release in order for us to be able to move on from that experience.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: So, my work as I can say somatic therapy specifically is using that mind-body connection to heal.
• 26:26
  SPEAKER_01: And somatics, again, can be done in so many different ways.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: That mind-body concept is tapped into through a lot of healing modalities, and and some are ancient practices that have been slightly modified so someone can copyright it and put a new name on it.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm not very comfortable with all the commodification of these practices.
• 26:45
  SPEAKER_01: And my hope in my work with clients is just to keep reminding them that this is already within them and there's nothing I can offer besides the tools to help them get back to themselves because pretty much with anything that comes to lifestyle, it's very unique, and each of us has different needs that will make us feel good and nourished and excited, motivated, whatever it may be.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: There's no one size fits all.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for taking the time to explain that.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like it makes so much sense.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_02: And when you're like mind-body connection, like that simple definition alone is like, okay, yeah, duh.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_02: And like the example of like, even like a kid, potty training, isn't that essentially what we're being taught is to listen to our body's cues.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_02: But I think we get so confused because then at the same time, you start crying because of X, Y, and Z.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: But no, that one's not okay.
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: That mind-body connection of you expressing your emotions, that could be, and in my experience, was too much for my parents in order to deal with.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_02: And so I feel like a lot of the times we grow up with this conflicting feeling of like, okay, well, sometimes I listen to my body, but definitely not all the time, because that wouldn't be safe.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's like, and then we grow up trying to decipher like, well, which body cues are good, which body cues are normal, and like which body cues are bad.
• 28:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like that's where kind of like the um like the marketing and like marketing of health products really comes in.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_02: They play on that of like, oh yeah, like you've you've learned that this was bad.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_02: So like you must need this.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: And I feel like it is easier when we're raised in a society similar to ours, of like assuming that all of the answers are outside of ourselves because half of the time we've grown up confused, and especially like with our schooling system of like, no, you don't know all of the answers are outside of you.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so I feel like my hope is that we can teach these children at a younger age.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that like our generation is really becoming emotionally more sensitive to how this kind of interacts and how this plays together and stuff like that.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, what you're doing is really cool.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_02: I think, especially for like our generation and older and like people that that don't have that awareness that like healing is innate.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_02: Like I kind of play in this realm and like that is one of my deep core beliefs, but I still have a lot of people in my real life that like that's not even considered.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: Healing is not innate.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_02: You need to do X, Y, and Z to heal.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_02: And so, yeah, I just love your message.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: And I I think what you said about being accepted for certain behaviors speaks to the exact reason that we adapt.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: We're not doing this because we're just idiots or because we are trying to self-sabotage.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: We have different needs, and when those needs are in conflict, you have to prioritize.
• 29:49
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're a kid and you're being told, well, if I take care of my physical needs, then that's going to lead to social rejection or to me being abandoned in some way, then maybe I'll just put that to the side so I can keep this relational connection.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really how most of us end up in the situation.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_01: And to kind of continue with that idea of the feedback loop of communication, if you think about talking to someone and trying to tell them, hey, this is really important to me, and they ignore you over time, eventually they're gonna give up.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: I know that I would.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: And so that might look like in your body a feeling of dissociation where you just don't feel those sensations as much.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's harder to connect to your body, or they might get louder and louder and louder because they really want to be heard and start screaming.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_01: And that might look like uh upregulation, like an anxiety attack, and all of a sudden your body is out of control, or you bend over to tie your shoe and you throw your back out and you think, oh, I must have some kind of structural back issue, but probably you've just been ignoring rage for a long time and you might feel disempowered and like you can't quit your job, or you can't yell at that person because there would be big consequences.
• 31:00
  SPEAKER_01: So you internalize it, and then your body just says, Well, hey, you've got to listen at some point.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_01: And that manifesting physically is another piece of somatic therapy that I think people really like to tap into.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_01: And my hope is again, just as we build that communication to pay attention to your body and not try to direct it or get something out of it, but to actually build a safe and trusting relationship, then it will start to soften and open up, and you'll be able to handle things as they come.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_01: We're not trying to jump right into the deep trauma.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_01: We want to build resilience as we're working through things so that you can tolerate bigger emotional experiences when they arise.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_03: You just said a word that I think is interesting, that idea of like upregulating and downregulating.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_03: Do you mind kind of going into that and what that means?
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um something that I love to teach everyone, and I didn't coin this, but I think it to backtrack because that's how my stories go.
• 31:55
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's a good foundation for explaining upregulation and downregulation.
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_01: So as long as you're not driving, you can put up one hand.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: And we're gonna create a hand model of the brain, and this is by psychologist Dan Siegel.
• 32:09
  SPEAKER_01: But basically, your arm and wrist represent your spinal cord.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_01: Your palm of your hand represents the brain stem, or nicknamed the reptilian brain.
• 32:19
  SPEAKER_01: That's where your survival is happening, heart rate, temperature, blood pressure, things you don't have to think about, digestion.
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_01: If you cross your thumb over your palm, that is the midbrain, and that represents the limbic system, nicknamed the mammal brain, and that's where our emotional center is.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_01: And then if you cross your fingers over the top, that represents our neocortex or the human brain that is the most evolved, and that doesn't fully develop until we're about 25.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_01: And so for a visual example, if you get upset by something you're triggered, then your lid may flip, aka your in the visual Dan Siegel gives your fingers go up to represent that your cortex is offline at this point, and all of the blood is and resources are basically being prioritized to the survival part of your brain.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_01: So that part that keeps you alive and that part that's processing more through emotional and visual terms than it is through your cognitive terms.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: This is important because people often, when they're dysregulated, if say you called me a really mean name right now, that would probably hurt my feelings because we're friends and I would not expect that.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_01: It would catch me off guard and I might feel my lid flip, or I might feel dysregulated.
• 33:33
  SPEAKER_01: And I would probably start moving from an emotional place rather than a place where I can actually put together all of the past of our relationship and think about what might be going on in the future.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_01: I'm probably just gonna have a response of why are you yelling at me or why did you call me that?
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_01: And people who do this maybe, sorry, one other piece here in our limbic system and that midbrain, the emotional part is our amygdala, which is nicknamed the snow, the smoke detector.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: So that's the part that's looking for danger all of the time.
• 34:02
  SPEAKER_01: And if it's triggered, then immediately we move into that survival response, and there's adrenaline, cortisol, testosterone moving through our body to activate us, to protect ourselves in case there's a real threat.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: Often there is not a real physical threat.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_01: Most of our life we're walking through navigating emotional and social threats, although sometimes there are physical threats.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_01: I say all of this to say that stress response that happens when the amygdala is activated is often known as fight, flight, or freeze.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so coming back to upregulation or downregulation, someone who gets into a fight response or a flight response is probably more upregulated, meaning their energy is big, they're going to want to take action, move, try to get away from something, or fight by protecting themselves.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_01: A downregulated response might be more of a freeze going into a hypoarousal where I'm not moving because in order to survive, I just want to stay immobilized.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_01: And that usually happens when we're in situations for, in caught in the cases of complex trauma, extended periods of time that we can't get out of, like being a child whose needs aren't getting met over time.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: You might realize I need to just ignore my body cues because I get in trouble if I speak up, or people tell me that this is annoying, or I'm rejected in some way.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I might try to keep all of that inside because I don't want to be abused, I don't want to be hurt, I don't want to be rejected, and coming into that like freeze place is more safe.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_01: There's this a response that's sometimes talked about as well called fawn, and that's the idea of appeasing whoever might be that person that is the threat.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: And that is also a survival response.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_01: But when people are, when their amygdala is activated and they go into this stress response, if they are a fight response kind of person, then they might say something aggressive and intense, and then later are often shamed for what they did when they felt scared rather than being met in the understanding that there was something that scared them that led them to have a protective response.
• 36:00
  SPEAKER_01: And this is not to say that it's okay to be abusive or aggressive to other people, but if we can understand that usually that's coming, at least at the beginning, from a place of fear.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_01: And then if that behavior is reinforced over time, then I get what I want when I overtake someone, then maybe it does become more of a protective response.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_01: And that can lead to really damaging relationships and things like that.
• 36:20
  SPEAKER_01: But wouldn't it be different if going back to your examples, Mariah, as a kid, if someone gets really upset and we're able to go, oh, you just threw that thing or you hit your friend and that's really unlike you, you know, I don't know why you're doing that behavior.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_01: What happened that led you to have such a big emotional reaction?
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_01: We can usually help bring the brain back online so that we're thinking clearly again.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: But if we're in that place of fight, flight, freeze, we're having such an emotional response that we're not usually thinking clearly.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_01: And then once our brain comes back online when we're regulated and we're calm, a lot of shame starts to come up about how we responded when we were in fear.
• 36:56
  SPEAKER_01: So I like to teach this to clients pretty early in our relationship to neutralize some of the shame and understand your body as having a protective physiological response because it thinks that there's a threat.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_01: And it's probably learned that in this situation before there was a threat.
• 37:12
  SPEAKER_01: But for many of us, once we become adults, we need to learn new patterns so that we're not shutting down and running away from relationships or fighting people at work because that's not going to serve us in the long term.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so upregulating is those big responses, and then hypo are those down responses.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_01: And depending on where someone's at, I might utilize a different exercise or intervention with them to help them come back to that baseline, more calm, neutral, regulated.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_03: Nice, lid down type place.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_03: That was really, I love that visual of the brain and the parts and the lid up and down.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_03: That's really helpful.
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_03: And from my understanding, the idea that all of our smoke alarms are going off a lot in modern day, I think it's pretty universal.
• 37:59
  SPEAKER_03: Like I think, and like you said, it's not that we're being chased by a tiger anymore, but we have a lot of these daily stresses, subtle stress we've talked about, and and we're all walking around in this either like really elevated place or really um downregulated place.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_03: And the goal really is to kind of be floating in the middle, if I'm understanding, right?
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_03: Like that's kind of the goal here is we can use some of these somatic practices to connect our mind with our body when we notice that we're in like an upregulated place or a downregulated place to kind of get ourselves back into equilibrium.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_03: Is that right?
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I really like a lot of things are sticking out to me.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_03: Number one, I think a lot of us struggle with self-trust.
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm like kind of pulling the pieces together of how this really stems from childhood.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_03: Like I have so many memories of like needing to go to the bathroom or like um having a big reaction to something and really being shamed for it.
• 38:58
  SPEAKER_03: So I really liked what you were saying about um can you what it's really empathetic.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_03: It's allowing us to be empathizing.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_03: If someone has had a big reaction, can you think about every behavior really stems from a place of fear?
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_03: And can you have like a softer response?
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_03: And the part that really blew me away was what you said to a little kid.
• 39:22
  SPEAKER_03: If you want to kind of get the lid flipped back down, the tool that we use is curiosity, right?
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_03: Whoa, whoa, I'm observing a big reaction here.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_03: What's going on?
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_03: And so I think like obviously we love the idea of curiosity, but it sounds like getting curious and asking questions is kind of a way to get the brain back online and kind of regulate.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I'd say that the foundation of my beliefs with humans, clients, students, whoever I'm working with is people are trying their best.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_01: They don't want to suffer, and behavior is adaptive.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so if they're doing something, then they think that this is the thing that's gonna prevent my suffering or that's gonna move me forward in some way, or they unconsciously believe that because that has been the case before.
• 40:07
  SPEAKER_01: So I yeah, try to neutralize again that you don't need to feel shamed for this.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_01: That doesn't mean we need to keep acting out in an ineffective way.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: And by saying ineffective, I think it takes a little bit of the sting out of like bad or toxic, or you know, just it's not serving you if what you want is close relationships and you keep yelling at people, we're gonna have to change that.
• 40:29
  SPEAKER_01: You can still be upset and we can talk about why your body might be having a response that feels like you need to protect yourself.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're in a relationship with someone who is constantly challenging you and triggering that in you, then maybe we can talk about leaving that relationship or finding a different way if that person is willing to learn how they're navigating that with you.
• 40:50
  SPEAKER_01: But we don't have to keep triggering ourselves over and over.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_01: And we are responsible.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_01: There's a quote that I like a lot.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's you probably aren't responsible for your trauma, but you are responsible for your healing.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 41:05
  SPEAKER_02: I like that a lot.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: I like that a whole lot.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, okay, so the examples that you gave were really good.
• 41:12
  SPEAKER_02: My question is, what about like the more subtle things?
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_02: I guess when you gave that example of like bending over and like hurting your back, and it's like, girl, what if you got some repressed anger?
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm sitting here, like with my back and my shoulders, I feel like they are so tight.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_02: And my initial response is like, well, I should go to the gym and strengthen them, or I should find some stretching thing, whatever.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like, I know through my own healing journey and path that like my childhood was pretty traumatic.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_02: And like I have not, as with everybody, right?
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_02: Like, we we can't be healed all of the time.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_02: There's always going to be like different layers and different levels of kind of exploring that.
• 41:58
  SPEAKER_02: But I guess like, how do you start digging into the subtleties?
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_02: Because I guess like for me, it doesn't usually feel like rage.
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_02: To me, it feels more subtle to where it's easy for me to write it off in terms of something else.
• 42:12
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it just might be like the way that I slept for the past three years.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: Then I'll just like make excuses like for shit like that.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_02: But like, how do you start approaching like these more subtle ways that your body is maybe speaking to you that are a little bit easier to ignore?
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_01: Well, our favorite word, the curiosity.
• 42:32
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I would say, okay, if this person just led me through a guided breathing exercise, or I just sat here for five minutes and thought, I'm gonna notice my body, I'm gonna feel my feet, my legs, my hips, my torso, my shoulders, my head, you know, just in the quickest body skin ever.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_01: If and you notice, oh, my back is actually aching, and I didn't realize my back was aching until I did that.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_01: Rather than getting up or making a judgment or going to the gym, what if you just sit there a little bit longer and go, oh, that's curious?
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm just gonna keep noticing that.
• 43:05
  SPEAKER_01: And there are different ways you can do this.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: You can notice the quality of it.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_01: Does it feel like it's poking or does it feel more like a dull ache?
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_01: Is it a zero to 10?
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: Is it warm or cold?
• 43:17
  SPEAKER_01: Just getting a little bit more curious with the physical sensation and then maybe noticing, like as I'm paying attention to this, is there any emotion that's connecting in my body?
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_01: And I like to start with the body first because sometimes we have to work there.
• 43:33
  SPEAKER_01: If if anybody says, I think, then I'll say, okay, let's pause and try to feel again because our thinking comes in so quickly.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: But you don't have to think about this.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I would say the hardest part is is trust, is but I don't ask anyone to blindly trust, nor would I expect anyone to.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_01: Just like any other relationship, we want to show up consistently with care and kindness.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: And be able to take feedback if we're not doing something well or we're doing something that's hurting someone else.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_01: And so really thinking of my body and my own practice as an entity that I'm in collaboration with and having communication with it and noticing, okay, if my back is aching, like what's going on with you?
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_01: And what are you trying to tell me right now?
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe tears come and maybe my I realize all of a sudden I've been clenching my jaw and my hands are in fists and I'm really pissed.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_01: And there are different ways we can navigate that once we tune into it, but it's being able to really slow the process down to listen and to trust the intuition and not overanalyze it, which is hard for, I would guess, people like us who want to figure things out and start a business and have step-by-step instructions to help other people do it.
• 44:48
  SPEAKER_01: This is one of those things where the process really, the step-by-step instructions are slow down enough to actually see what we're working with.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_01: And there might be a long period of data collection before we know what to do.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_01: And then the next step after plenty of data collection and curiosity is what are we going to do with this information?
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_01: And that then comes within a stage of experimenting.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe I'm going to try to set a boundary with this person.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, they didn't like that, and I got shamed in that experience.
• 45:19
  SPEAKER_01: Does that tell me that I came on too strong?
• 45:21
  SPEAKER_01: Does it tell me that that person isn't receiving my boundary?
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_01: Is it just the first time I've ever had an experience like this?
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_01: So that's painful.
• 45:28
  SPEAKER_01: And is it worth trying again?
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_01: Do I try it again with someone else, or do we go back with the same person?
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_01: Lots of experiments like that.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_01: Or even, you know, I'm noticing that I feel angry now.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_01: I have a lot of clients who start with things just don't bother me.
• 45:41
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really get angry.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_01: This is predominantly a lot of women because that is our inner voice is that we're crazy, we're too much, we're that angry person in the office.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I hate to use the bitch word, but gosh, I hate to use it so much because it's been ingrained in such a vulgar way throughout my life that there's a visceral response when I hear that.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_01: And so I want to figure things out and I want to present myself in a concise and eloquent way that makes a lot of sense so that people can't call me those things.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_01: But all of that is programming.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: So just noticing what is your body communicating to you.
• 46:17
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you think about what you want to do with it, if then you have another response, like, oh, I'm realizing I'm angry, I'm ready to protect myself.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_01: But the next thought is, okay, I'm gonna go tell that person and you shrivel up again, just paying attention in the moment over and over again.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_01: And this is a constant process, and not to think that we're ever gonna heal and get all the way through the other side.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_01: But I have seen this visual and I wish I could remember the content creator, but she showed basically a little garbage pail that was full of paper balls that were overflowing and said, these are like these represent our trauma, and they just, if we don't do anything, they just keep getting piled in and you can accidentally nudge it and a few fall out, which could be like us having one of those big emotional reactions.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_01: But with a therapist, with maybe we're really lucky to have an insightful safe friend, you can, I would recommend a therapist, you can pull those out one at a time and kind of smooth them out and read through them together, process that, and then fold it up and put it over here and then the next one and the next one.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_01: So eventually you have a nice little pile of experiences that have been processed.
• 47:21
  SPEAKER_01: And instead of them, I mean, this isn't men in black with that little memory forgetter in the 90s, but um this is like instead of whenever I think about that thing, my heart starts racing and I feel small and scared, just oh, that is a bad memory that I've processed.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that's the difference between trauma being stored in the body and trauma being healed.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: So we're gonna keep navigating hard things through life.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_01: But if we're with someone and we're able to process that or we're able to protect ourselves or get away from it and feel empowered in some way, adverse experiences usually don't become trauma.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_01: They become trauma that's stored within us, where we have these physiological reactions later when we've been alone, terrified, and helpless.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_01: So the idea is that with a therapist, we're able to revisit those experiences to create connection with someone through it.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_01: So you're not alone, that you're empowered to say, I want to stop or keep going or try this way instead at any point, and to feel safe in the process to be able to do that.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_03: Wow, that was so good.
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_03: I loved how you said all of that.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I am thinking, I've shared on the podcast several times, I have body responses, like especially around when I need to like shift careers or quit jobs.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_03: My first job, like my I was like 25 and my hip was going out and I had all this back pain.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_03: And then the second I listened to my intuition and made the move, all of a sudden it vanished.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_03: And then I earlier this year I was in a bad fit again.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_03: And my right eye, I've told both of you this, would not stop twitching.
• 49:03
  SPEAKER_03: As soon as I did the scary thing, listened to myself, all of a sudden the eye stops twitching.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_03: So I think I I do think a lot of our listeners, and Savannah, I know you're like this, and Mariah, like we're all smart women and some men that, and I think we've solved a lot of our problems up in our head.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_03: So as an adult, I have found it difficult.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_03: And it sounds so basic, but I have found it difficult to connect with my body and be in touch with my body.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_03: And I relate to like the women you're saying that are coming.
• 49:34
  SPEAKER_03: It's like you know, something's off, you know that you're not like living your fullest and you're not in touch, but you don't really know where to start.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_03: Like you feel really disconnected.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_03: And I guess that's that idea of dissociated, right?
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_03: So it sounds like the if you're kind of feeling that way and you're wondering like where to get started, noticing, taking some time to be still and noticing what's popping up in your body and getting curious around that is kind of like the doorway.
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_01: I would say yes.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I also want to put a caveat that if you have had a lot of severe trauma, then, and depending on the type of trauma, then sitting still quietly, it's kind of like a snow globe settling where if it's been shaken around, you can't really tell what's going on there, but you get a pretty clear picture once everything settles.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_01: And if that clear picture is that I'm terrified right now or I'm remembering that thing that I've been working so hard to get away from, that experience is not empowering.
• 50:31
  SPEAKER_01: That can be terrifying.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_01: That's why I think it can be really helpful to be with maybe a meditation group or a yoga class or a therapist or someone that you get to process that experience with because not to discount, you know, I believe that innately our bodies want to help us heal.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of bodies have been through really scary experiences that they have felt out of control of, and that could be anything from sexual abuse to medical trauma.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that a lot of people don't understand how being under, like maybe being unconscious, but still having your body cut open and having really severe physical experiences can impact us.
• 51:08
  SPEAKER_01: And so maybe you're asleep through that whole thing, but I've heard lots of stories about people who later have panic attacks or feel really scared in certain situations that they can't explain after a medical procedure.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_01: And likely it's because your body went through something that it just needs to be processed.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_01: And so being able to revisit whatever those things are that are creating a visceral response.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_01: If you're having a visceral response to any sort of topic, then it's already in you.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_01: Talking about it with a therapist isn't going to create trauma, and it's it's just gonna bring what's there hopefully to the surface with someone who is safe and caring and help you make sense of that experience.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't feel like something that's just happening to you all the time.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_01: Because if it feels like that's happening to us, then our body doesn't feel safe and it's hard to just sit still and want to pay attention to that.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_01: However, it so yes, and there's the caveat, but for most of us, being able to sit down, build up a little bit of a tolerance, and maybe that's not I'm gonna sit for 10 minutes in silence.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_01: Maybe it's I'm gonna do body scans for a little while.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna do a body scan meditation that's gonna draw me in to notice different areas of my body and to be curious about them and not judgmental.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_01: And not all of these practices are intended to help you calm down or relax necessarily.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_01: They're intended to help you build communication with your body.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_01: And if your body has felt ignored for a really long time, it might be kind of pissed once you start giving it attention again.
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_01: It might need you to show it that you're trustworthy and that we can actually start to let our guard down and we're actually gonna do the things to to offer that self-care.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_03: I um I'm sitting here taking notes.
• 52:51
  SPEAKER_03: I really like what you're saying about like the trauma's already there.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_03: Like we know that, right?
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_03: The body keeps a score and all that, but like it's there.
• 52:59
  SPEAKER_03: None of us are escaping life unscathed.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_03: And it's kind of at some point your responsibility to your quote that you said earlier to process it.
• 53:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I like this idea of processing that feels very tangible.
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_03: And what you're saying is so important of take stock.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_03: What safe space do you have?
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_03: I do agree with you, work with a professional that is like the safest space, especially if for me, like learning how to set boundaries with my therapist.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_03: You said that to me.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_03: You were like, I wanted to do something, and you were like, okay, if you're gonna say this to anybody, you need to say it to your therapist.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_03: Like it's just a good opportunity to test out some new ideas and also be in a be with someone who can help you witness the things that as the snow settles feel unsettling, right?
• 53:45
  SPEAKER_03: You need someone that's kind of walk that walk.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_03: But the other flip side of this is we can't be with our therapists.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_03: Lord knows Savannah, I know you don't want people texting you 24-7.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_03: So, like, what are some of the I hate hacks and tools, but I know you mentioned like we have like our body scans that that's like an awesome tool.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I've mentioned with Mariah, I am trying to work on self-trust.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I found that I get a lot of energy and joy in life when I take time in the morning to like go to the church of Shay.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_03: And I ask myself every morning, like, am I low energy today?
• 54:18
  SPEAKER_03: And so sometimes before a podcast, if I'm low energy, I'll do like a harder workout or something that I know gets my energy up.
• 54:25
  SPEAKER_03: Or like today, I felt kind of like high and a little anxious.
• 54:29
  SPEAKER_03: So I and I knew you were coming.
• 54:30
  SPEAKER_03: So I was just thinking about yoga.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I did it something that was a bit more calming for me.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_03: So I think making sure you have points in your day to like take stock and then do the tools that work for you to kind of regulate.
• 54:42
  SPEAKER_03: Cause really this is like a moment by moment practice.
• 54:45
  SPEAKER_03: So do you mind sharing maybe for you personally, that's honestly a good way.
• 54:49
  SPEAKER_03: Like, how do you regulate, like in the moment-to-moment um day-to-day life kind of thing?
• 54:56
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know that anybody wants to join me in my mind.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's a very self-analytical plate.
• 55:01
  SPEAKER_01: I am reflecting constantly.
• 55:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I would say that the thing to start with, if I could recommend, would be to identify what your resources are.
• 55:11
  SPEAKER_01: And resources, when we're talking about trauma and healing, are the things that help us feel good, neutral, or nourished in some kind of way.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_01: So, starting with what are some of your internal resources?
• 55:23
  SPEAKER_01: I think curiosity is one that we all share, and probably motivation and thinking about other things about yourself, qualities that you really like that help you feel strong.
• 55:32
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe when you think about them, you notice your shoulders drop and your chest lift a little and just feeling a little more confident.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_01: External resources might be things like hobbies or friends or places that we can go, pets, beautiful sunsets or sunrises, or whatever it is that maybe you could take yourself to or participate in or engage with that helps you feel nourished.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_01: And then things that are however you want to call it religious, spiritual, higher power, but something that helps us feel like we're connected to bigger something, to something bigger than ourselves.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_01: That might be a community or a team or a religious affiliation or on and on and on.
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_01: Your community that you're cultivating here through your podcast, just kind of something that feels bigger than myself that I can call in and some resources that I personally use.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um well, yoga is one of my external ones.
• 56:26
  SPEAKER_01: I've had a much more regular practice lately, and I just feel so much more in my body and easy to connect with others.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_01: Um, being in nature is really important to me.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: I need to go outside at least once a day, and hopefully for an extended period of time, at least once a week on a hike if I can.
• 56:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I like to have a nice self-care routine that helps me feel, or like a nighttime wind-down routine that helps me feel just more rested.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_01: And something that I took from one of my clients that I think is beautiful and want to just share with the world.
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and a resource that she called in one time was a version of herself in the future.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_01: And we can also call on ancestors, grandparents, angels, spirits, whoever feels like they might be higher than us.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_01: But I love to think about an older version of myself with her silver flowing hair and her very fun flowing gowns, because I don't know, she's just a flowy lady, and calling in her and just thinking, okay, she's already been through this and she's done this and she can help me now.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so those are some of the things I would say, really before you dive into any of the harder part of the work, figure out where you're at and what is already helping nourish you.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_01: That way, when you are ready to start going in, maybe sitting down for those meditations, body scans, talking to a therapist, you have some skills or you already know that you've got a foundation of support.
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_02: It's so funny because I feel like half the time when we ask that question of like, yo, what hacks or tools you got?
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_02: We're expecting like the latest and greatest of the Shmi Shmer Shmi, but like your answer was just a reminder of like how simple this gets to be and how we all have access to something.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_02: And I like how you kind of differentiated that between like internal resources and external resources.
• 58:17
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like that's really good because as a human, we have an internal world and an external world.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_02: And so I feel like we're constantly trying to balance both of them.
• 58:27
  SPEAKER_02: And so I feel like it's the same for resources.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like, are all of your resources internal?
• 58:32
  SPEAKER_02: And so maybe that's your cue to like, hey, can you get community or like people right there with you, or like do a yoga practice, or like something that's like also outside of you to where you're not only getting resourced inside and like only connecting with like that, I guess, like that spiritual emotional side.
• 58:52
  SPEAKER_02: Like a lot of people can like hang out there, but it's and it's easy for me to hang out there.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_02: And the harder part is coming up with like external resources that I want to do just as consistently because like being in my body sometimes feels a little clunky.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just like, nah, things aren't very smooth over here.
• 59:12
  SPEAKER_02: I would rather play in the in the realm of like spiritual emotional, because that feels lighter.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_02: That feels way easier for me.
• 59:18
  SPEAKER_02: And so I like the differentiation that you gave between internal and external.
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I would like if we actually circled back to the question that I seemed to cut you off with when I asked about like what do somatics mean?
• 59:33
  SPEAKER_02: And then we went down like this huge winding path that I think was very much needed of like what somatics are.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: But like Savannah, how did you get into this stuff?
• 59:42
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, yeah.
• 59:43
  SPEAKER_01: I could you tell how awkward it is to talk about myself?
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_01: Because I feel like I stumbled through all of that at the beginning.
• 59:49
  SPEAKER_01: And then we start talking about somatics and what I can offer to other people.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_01: I'm very passionate and excited.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, I would say that my introduction to somatic work, I definitely wouldn't have called it that at the time, but was starting a yoga practice in 2010.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_01: I took a little time off of school in my undergrad to do some backpacking and soul searching and decided I didn't want to take time off and become lazy or whatever the story is they tell you you're gonna do as a young person who decides to take a break before you decide your identity for the rest of your life.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_01: So, anyways, I decided I'll take a Spanish class and a yoga class, and that will be my self-development.
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I heard things in yoga like how you show up on your mat is often how you show up in life, or you're eventually gonna be nicer if you keep doing yoga.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I didn't believe it all, but spoiler alert, it happened.
• 1:00:48
  SPEAKER_01: So the more that I got to know my body and that experience, the more that I just felt connected and empowered, and it was very healing.
• 1:00:56
  SPEAKER_01: And there were a couple practices where I was in no pain at all doing a downward-facing dog, which is a pretty standard pose, and all of a sudden was crying and had this very physical release, and I couldn't tie it to a memory, but I knew that there was something there that I felt had gone away and I felt lighter leaving that session or that yoga class.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_01: And that's been a big part of my life ever since I did a yoga teacher training in 2014.
• 1:01:22
  SPEAKER_01: I spent a month in India practicing and just learning about it and really diving into the philosophy of it, which talks a lot about how we live and really honoring our body and paying attention.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, again, that's why I say a lot of this stuff is rooted in really ancient practices.
• 1:01:38
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but yeah, then I went through that other journey of taking I did my yoga teacher training.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_01: I worked at nonprofits, I was working in summer camps and just trying to find myself for a little while, and then actually in 2016 decided to go to grad school.
• 1:01:52
  SPEAKER_01: And after that, I was really lucky to find a supervisor in my area who did experiential therapy, and a few different people connected us, so it just kind of seemed meant to be.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_01: And she has been a huge advocate for my career since then, is actually the one who helped me start working with graduate students.
• 1:02:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I just started teaching two somatic classes at that same college.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so it's amazing how a few years down the road it all switches around.
• 1:02:19
  SPEAKER_01: But there's an the Association of Experiential Education is where I went to those conferences that you mentioned at the beginning of this talk, Shay.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_01: And that has been a huge point of professional growth for me.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_01: It's a lot of people who are educators that work in outdoor programs and who are in a lot of different ways trying to help people get connected to themselves and to the earth.
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_01: And there's a subgroup under that called the Therapeutic Adventure Professional Group, who are kind of a culmination of people who are elders in the group.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_01: Most of them have said, I thought I invented adventure therapy and then I found all of you.
• 1:02:55
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's really a group of pioneers who continue to try to do things out of the box and aren't really worried about having huge budgets or fancy equipment.
• 1:03:05
  SPEAKER_01: The heart of the work that I do and the community that I work within is that the process is the learning and that really life is all about the process.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_01: So, how do we handle whatever is showing up in the moment?
• 1:03:16
  SPEAKER_01: Whether that's in my body as a somatic experience, or whether that's we're on a hike and I didn't bring my rain jacket and it's starting to rain and there's a natural consequence of this.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_01: Do I get mad at the sky?
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_01: Do I get mad at the person that's with me and take it on on them?
• 1:03:30
  SPEAKER_01: Do I just regret that I did this and walk home?
• 1:03:32
  SPEAKER_01: Or do I take it as an opportunity to dance in the rain?
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_01: You know, how we show up is really what I'm trying to focus on all of the time with my clients.
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_01: And I would say that's been evolving in my own practice through yoga.
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I couldn't even tell you how many other kinds of spiritual and health-focused activities that I've participated in and even ran wellness retreats for a little while, and have found myself just in this career of somatic therapist, which I fully identify as now, and hope to do this for I don't know, 20 years.
• 1:04:04
  SPEAKER_01: I guess we'll see how long they love me and how long it works out.
• 1:04:07
  SPEAKER_01: But I love showing up every day and having really connecting conversations with people.
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I am constantly learning through my clients and definitely having opportunities to heal through them, whether that's working with a couple who's showing up very lovingly with each other, working with the family and seeing the way that the parent and child are interacting and having new relational experiences, sometimes through observation or sometimes through helping them build a connection.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_01: And then most of my work is with my one-on-one clients.
• 1:04:33
  SPEAKER_01: And it just feels so sacred to get to be the person that sits with someone on their healing journey as they open up and start to learn about themselves, how amazing they actually are.
• 1:04:45
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:04:46
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't even answer your question.
• 1:04:47
  SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry, Marat.
• 1:04:48
  SPEAKER_03: No, it absolutely did.
• 1:04:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, you know, one thing I'm really struck by with somatics, and I think maybe that's why we had this kind of like amorphous idea of it, but it is kind of broad and really individualized.
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like as you were talking, you know, a lot of this, like my menu of what, you know, deregulates me or regulates me may look different, does look different than Savannah's and looks different than Mariah's.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_03: And you really have to figure that out for yourself.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_03: And I think for me, I'm also reflecting on like, I've had tools that I've used in the past that kind of have seasons to them where I'll try to keep going back to something and it's not hidden like it used to, you know, it's not giving me that same effect.
• 1:05:32
  SPEAKER_03: And so um being okay with like, okay, maybe this is a tool that's leaving, and what tools can I bring in?
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but thinking about semantics as like something that you can, a toolbox that you can tailor to yourself if you kind of learn some of the resources and practices is a really empowering idea.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, my hope is that I'm not teaching people how to navigate a particular situation, but how to listen to what their body is communicating.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_01: Communicating to them so that they can adapt to a particular situation.
• 1:06:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that that's it's just so empowering because you're right.
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I'm just thinking, I guess, like bird's eye view and like seeing the timeline, I guess, of like all of our lives kind of like on top of each other and just like how unique each of us really are, but how often we're told to do the same shit as somebody else.
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_02: And like I remember when we first started talking about like seasons on the podcast of like, oh, like sometimes this makes sense in seasons, and like it was kind of like a new concept to us, like two years ago.
• 1:06:42
  SPEAKER_02: Essentially, we're just like, Oh, yeah, there's like different seasons, which is bananas when you think about this, because you're like, bitch, what like seasons?
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_02: The whole world is seasonal.
• 1:06:54
  SPEAKER_02: What do you mean?
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_02: It's so it like it can make you angry, I think, to look at how our society operates when you start to learn how you operate.
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like there is some some level of anger that could be there of like, why was I taught to kind of like disregard how I felt essentially?
• 1:07:18
  SPEAKER_02: And Savannah's over here laughing because didn't I say before that I didn't feel anger?
• 1:07:23
  SPEAKER_02: Is that why you're laughing?
• 1:07:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because I did say that.
• 1:07:26
  SPEAKER_01: It just resonates so much.
• 1:07:28
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, we should be angry.
• 1:07:29
  SPEAKER_01: I feel angry.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm don't even get me started on learning all about witchy stuff and how the patriarchy and colonization has just influenced every structure in our society.
• 1:07:41
  SPEAKER_01: And often we are at the expense of that.
• 1:07:43
  SPEAKER_01: Women are more often than not the people who have autoimmune disorders who are navigating a lot of these feelings of perfectionism, or I'm not enough, or I need to make myself smaller so that other people can feel better.
• 1:07:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm just at a point where I'm thinking, fuck that.
• 1:08:01
  SPEAKER_01: I tell my clients all the time, and I tell myself all the time, you deserve as much as everyone else.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_01: And that is not trying to be superior, it's just trying to be real.
• 1:08:12
  SPEAKER_01: We all deserve to be able to take care of ourselves, to pursue health and connection with other people and fulfillment.
• 1:08:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think those are the universal experiences that humans want.
• 1:08:25
  SPEAKER_01: And how we get those, like you said, Shay, is a different menu for everyone.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna need the same things as you, and I'm hoping that there's overlap because that's how we have connections and friendships and really build on new ideas and learn from each other and get creative and adapt, but also that it's okay to be unique at times.
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_01: And often if you feel like nobody else gets me, it's because you're pioneering something new and you just haven't found the other people who like the thing you like yet.
• 1:08:54
  SPEAKER_01: The chances of you being the only human on this planet to think something is cool or interesting or exciting are really rare.
• 1:09:01
  SPEAKER_01: But it's discouraging if the people in your circle don't see what you see and then tell you that you should be embarrassed of that or that it's not worth pursuing.
• 1:09:09
  SPEAKER_01: That really wears on us over time.
• 1:09:11
  SPEAKER_01: So if you're out there and you're feeling alone, you're probably doing something really cool and you just haven't found your people yet.
• 1:09:17
  SPEAKER_03: You just need to find your nature therapy conferences and get together every year.
• 1:09:22
  SPEAKER_02: I'm also thinking, and you could also be an Enneagram type four, which is like the conversation that we had before this.
• 1:09:30
  SPEAKER_02: And so the type four, I've just I'm just laughing because it's been a joke ever since we had the conversation.
• 1:09:35
  SPEAKER_02: But like the type four is like the uniqueness, like individual really cares about that, and like the biggest fear is like being misunderstood.
• 1:09:40
  SPEAKER_02: And so I'm laughing about that because I'm like, yeah, that's kind of what I've been exploring lately and realize that like that's a core fear of mine.
• 1:09:48
  SPEAKER_03: Savannah's a four too, is that right?
• 1:09:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I I never remember you haven't remembered.
• 1:09:53
  SPEAKER_03: She's somewhere around there, I think.
• 1:09:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's but to your to your point about seasons, uh, Mariah.
• 1:09:58
  SPEAKER_01: I I've recently had this epiphany because I say sometimes, you know, 21-year-old me would think I'm so boring now because I love my nighttime and my Sunday chores and meal prepping and going on a high click.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_01: I love my routine and she would judge me so hard.
• 1:10:13
  SPEAKER_01: But also, why would I want a 21-year-old running my life?
• 1:10:17
  SPEAKER_01: I'm 36 years old and life looks different.
• 1:10:19
  SPEAKER_01: And thank goodness I wouldn't have made any progress if I was still trying to measure to her standards.
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_01: Or, you know, those of us who think all the way back to 12 years old, I was gonna be this someday.
• 1:10:30
  SPEAKER_01: Of course we want to adapt.
• 1:10:32
  SPEAKER_01: But as long as you're listening to yourself in the moment, you're being able to trust yourself and really tune into what those experiences are and learn from them, then we can't make bad choices.
• 1:10:42
  SPEAKER_01: We just make new choices and life is full of experiments.
• 1:10:46
  SPEAKER_02: We're just experimenting, being curious, living, learning, loving, hanging out.
• 1:10:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's good.
• 1:10:53
  SPEAKER_02: This conversation was really good, Savannah.
• 1:10:55
  SPEAKER_03: I cannot believe what time it is right now.
• 1:10:56
  SPEAKER_03: I just glanced at the clock.
• 1:10:58
  SPEAKER_03: Holy moly, Savannah, time has flown, and I know you gotta run out of here.
• 1:11:01
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for sharing all of this with us.
• 1:11:04
  SPEAKER_03: It was fascinating.
• 1:11:05
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, truly.
• 1:11:06
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for having me.
• 1:11:07
  SPEAKER_01: I love to talk about my work.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_01: This is really fun.
• 1:11:10
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're out there and you're curious, go try a class, find something online.
• 1:11:15
  SPEAKER_01: There's so many different ways to connect with your mind and body.
• 1:11:18
  SPEAKER_02: Well, where I was gonna say, speaking of finding things online, what if the people want to find you online?
• 1:11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how do we find and connect with you?
• 1:11:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so I uh my company is Wildheart Therapy and Consulting.
• 1:11:31
  SPEAKER_01: WildheartTC.org is my website.
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm currently offering somatic therapy intensives so you can reach out and do some short-term work with me that looks like an intake session and then meeting together for a few-hour session and then doing a close-up, or maybe doing a few of those three-hour sessions, depending on what feels right.
• 1:11:51
  SPEAKER_01: And the hope for that is to really get into the body and target some of these things and work through them in a quicker way because when we're working with the body, there's no on and off switch.
• 1:12:00
  SPEAKER_01: Once you tap into something, it might just keep going.
• 1:12:04
  SPEAKER_01: And so having extended sessions with people instead of that 50-minute weekly where you pop in, you catch up, maybe you get 30 real minutes of talking and then the session's over.
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to do work where I get to dive deeper in with clients.
• 1:12:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and then I'm also going to be offering the details are not live yet, but we'll be soon.
• 1:12:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, kind of a somatic summer camp experience for a weekend this summer at a camp in uh Three Sisters Wilderness in Oregon.
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll share more about that.
• 1:12:32
  SPEAKER_03: Cannot wait to hear about that.
• 1:12:33
  SPEAKER_03: That sounds cool.
• 1:12:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:12:36
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you so much for having me this evening.
• 1:12:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:12:38
  SPEAKER_03: Well, with our last two seconds here, we always like to wrap up the podcast by asking you what in a brief second is sparking your curiosity right now.
• 1:12:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, just being really sweet to myself.
• 1:12:53
  SPEAKER_01: It's been so nice lately to instead of saying you should do this next thing, just saying you're doing a great job and noticing how that is impacting the way that I feel less anxiety, I feel more at peace, I feel more confident, and seem to be more approachable to other people.
• 1:13:11
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 1:13:14
  SPEAKER_01: Sparked by myself and what's going on in this internal world.
• 1:13:17
  SPEAKER_03: But we could we could all stand to be a little bit more sweet.
• 1:13:20
  SPEAKER_03: I like that idea a lot.
• 1:13:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um I feel like it's so it's so wholesome.
• 1:13:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's like the wholesome version of my, and it all really doesn't fucking matter.
• 1:13:29
  SPEAKER_02: But like yours is like way more wholesome.
• 1:13:31
  SPEAKER_02: I like yours.
• 1:13:32
  SPEAKER_03: Well, Savannah, thank you so much again for coming on.
• 1:13:35
  SPEAKER_03: We'll make sure to leave all of your links and information in the show notes for our listeners.
• 1:13:39
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but I think we're ready to close this episode down.
• 1:13:42
  SPEAKER_03: Remember, friends, you have the power to create whatever the hell you want.
• 1:13:46
  SPEAKER_03: Follow the nudge, ask questions, and let curiosity guide the way.
• 1:13:50
  SPEAKER_03: We'll see you in the next episode.