Latest / The Kids Menu / 04: Involving Kids in the Kitchen
Transcript
- Christiana Cortina: to start off, we can talk about the tofu tacos with the salsa verde. Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: so I was running late that night, so my boyfriend did end up making the tofu. and he did a great job. And then when I got back, I made the salsa verde, which was very fast. Chef Mark: Hmm. Christiana Cortina: And as I was making it, I did use the food processor, not the blender. 'cause Chef Mark: cool. Christiana Cortina: it's easier to clean. So I was curious if like that maybe made it less chunky. I don't know if there'd be a difference. Chef Mark: In general, I think food processor is gonna become more chunky than a blender typically. Christiana Cortina: really? Okay. Okay. Well, it was, it didn't taste chunky at all. It was very smooth. Chef Mark: Great. Christiana Cortina: and when I was making it, I feel like every time I make one of your recipes, I'm like, there's such a minimal amount of ingredients that I'm like, is this gonna need something else? And I don't mean it in a way that I'm doubting you. It's just like a me thing where I'm like, I feel like this is just not that many things that it's gonna be like as good as it always ends up being. So that being said, I loved the salsa. It was so good. It tasted amazing, like zesty and just super yummy. I had it with tortilla chips. And then with the tofu, which was also really good. I never had like a I guess Mexican-inspired tofu. Usually I do like more of a Asian inspired. So it was really good. I put the salsa on top of the taco, the tofu on the taco, and some cheese and I think we had something else on the side, but it's slipping my eye. But yeah, it was really good. And it was really fast and easy. Chef Mark: That's so exciting to hear. I'll I'll respond to a few things. I have lots to say in response. I Christiana Cortina: Okay. Chef Mark: think that me making simple recipes and you receiving it that way, almost questioning like will this be good 'cause it's so simple and few ingredients, that is the biggest win for me, because that's exactly what I wanna do for people. And I think that's how how cooking can be. Super simple, not too many ingredients. And that's the kind of things that I like to show kids and adults. And I've kind of found this crossover of like, it's easy enough for kids, but also an adult really finds it good and tasty and easy. So that's a huge win. I'm really happy to hear that felt easy for you. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, and it like tasted super elevated. Like it didn't taste like it was easy to make, which I like that. Chef Mark: That's man, that's like the sweet spot. I really think about that a lot of like the outcome being outsized compared to the amount of effort you put in. I always am aiming for that. So that's exciting to hear. And I had a question. Did you use a spicy pepper in there? What kind of green pepper did you use? Christiana Cortina: I forgot about that. I used the jalapeno, but Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: I took out the ribs, is that what they're called? The white parts that you Chef Mark: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: said in the video is actually what makes them spicy, which I learned because I thought it was the seeds. so I always thought if I take out the seeds that it wouldn't be spicy, but I did cut it out and it wasn't spicy. It didn't have a kick or anything to it, which I preferred. Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. that's very cool. I'm glad that you learned that. And for listeners right now, that is the facts about peppers is a capsaicin, the spicy stuff in peppers, is contained in all of that white stuff in the center of the pepper and those they can be called ribs and some t sometimes people call it pith, but it's just Christiana Cortina: Mm. Chef Mark: all of that stuff that holds the seeds in place and connects the outer part of the pepper. If you take those out and really, especially on a spicy pepper, meticulously carve out all of the white bits, you can get any pepper to be almost zero heat. Big asterisk, it'll obviously hotter peppers can carry more heat, but jalapenos for sure can get turned down to almost zero heat. So I'm happy that that worked out for ya. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, I really liked the jalapeno. I don't really like green bell peppers or the flavor of them. I love all the other color bell peppers. And I'm pretty sure I learned that they're all the same pepper. They're just picked at a different ripeness. Chef Mark: Yeah, so I think the the mature colored ones are actually different varieties. The red, orange and yellow are different, but the green peppers could be any one of those picked before it's had a chance to mature into its final color. Christiana Cortina: okay. That makes sense. I thought it was like a little like sequence, like first they're green, then they're then Chef Mark: I I would love that. Christiana Cortina: they're yellow, then they're orange, then they're red. Chef Mark: And that would kinda kind of make sense, but not quite. And I don't know if you've ever seen like tomatoes or peppers mid ripening. They're kind of like mottled. They have like different colors throughout. It's like a gradient of different colors before they reach their final ripeness. So that wouldn't actually work of going full color, new full color. But that does make sense that you would think that. I love that. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, I really did think that. And now that you say that, I hate when I get a red pepper and there's a green spot on it. I don't like that. Mm-hmm. Chef Mark: Yep, a little underripe. And the flavor's so different. So that's like a good lesson. And the same ingredient picked at a different time can completely taste different. It's almost a whole other thing. Christiana Cortina: For sure. I always substitute a green pepper for another color pepper in any recipe because I just Chef Mark: Okay. Christiana Cortina: know. And I used to not feel that way, but the last I'd say five to ten years, I really do not like the green pepper for some reason. Chef Mark: Okay. Christiana Cortina: Okay, speaking of cooking in the kitchen, tell me a little bit about your experiences of cooking with kids and maybe some experiences you have with parents that they talk about with you when they're cooking with their kids. Chef Mark: Okay, so this is like the whole thing. This is what I do. I love getting in the kitchen with kids. And today we're talking about the importance of involving kids in the kitchen and in the cooking process in the home. And so some of my experiences have been teaching cooking classes in after school programs. So going to a school and bringing a bunch of things, setting up in a classroom. Rarely a kitchen, but mostly just in a classroom and bringing like a little mobile plug-in burner and and oven so I can do cooking things when we need that. And just being in that environment with the kids is so fun because what I see is they get engaged with their curiosity. And I've already spoken about it here, but I will keep hammering home this huge takeaway and like life's epiphany that I've had working with kids when they're actively prepping the food. They're on a cutting board with a little knife and they make their own version of whatever we're making, I think of Thai fresh rolls, cutting up a bunch of veggies, wrapping them up in some rice paper. They try all the veggies and fruits that I bring, the and herbs, like fresh mint. They put it into their wrap and then they eat it and most of the time end up enjoying it. And having parents pick the kids up and the parents' minds are blown. They're like, who is this child who's eating all these foods? Who is this wizard who helped them do it? and then I wanna just pass along to the families, you know, when th in those environments that You can do this at home too. So th that's just you know, tiptoeing into this conversation today. But the first thing that comes to mind is those really fun experiences, getting curious and having fun with the kids and letting them actively participate, really firsthand create the foods that we're doing. Christiana Cortina: I love that you said you notice their curiosity, and it sounds like you create such a space of enjoyment for them and space to let them get curious instead of kind of giving them information or educating them about the food. You're just giving them the tools and letting them be curious and come to the conclusion themselves. Chef Mark: Yeah, thanks for reflecting that back because I think that took me a long time to learn that lesson myself. I think at the beginning I was very much just sharing information, teaching a lot of the ways that we do it in our classroom environments in schools, teacher just telling you information, you have to internalize it, memorize it, then later do something with it. Took me some time to figure that out. And a lot of it was just classroom management and the energy of the kids. They weren't actively engaged in the same way. They were just antsy and wanted to go do something else because they were bored and just hearing my voice talk and talk and talk. They wanted to get in the kitchen and actually do stuff. So I tried to start setting up shorter times in the beginning of class to cover really important safety stuff, give them first hand demos and show them the example of what we're gonna do. And then they get a chance to carry those activities out as soon as possible. Get them actively doing it. Christiana Cortina: That's so special. And I think there's this kind of false conception. Is that the right word? Preconception? Okay. This false conception that Like that kids need to know the nutritional profile of foods and like what foods are quote unquote good and why they're good and what they do for their bodies. And s sometimes they think there's a thought that if kids know, they're going to want to eat it more or they're going to feel like it's important to eat it more. but what I've found is not only does that oftentimes backfire, but it kind of puts food into categories and it kind of takes the fun out in my opinion. and it makes Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: it more of like a lesson or a requirement instead of just something that is fun to make and then tastes really good. Chef Mark: I think it's a really good point. And I'm wondering if you see that even more kind of in the spaces that you're in because you're so focused on nutrition and you see other maybe in your feed parents or nutritionists talking about tell the kids like why this bell pepper has the right nutrients in it and they have to learn that it has X, Y, and Z and there therefore it's good for them. Do you feel like you see a lot of that just kind of in your daily life? Christiana Cortina: Definitely. And I'm not saying that's always wrong or not a good approach. I think it totally depends on the kid, but depending on their temperament and as kids get older, I just can see that sometimes that backfires and like I said, it kind of just makes it feel like a chore or a requirement which can make a kid resistant to wanting to eat it or wanting to make it or interact with it. so just The most important thing that I try to help parents with is creating that space and that felt safety of it's your choice to try it and you get to decide if you like it. It doesn't matter what it does for your body or, you know, all of those other extra little fun facts that we could throw in there as adults because ultimately we live in a food environment where we're getting a lot of different foods most of the time if we're privileged enough to have access to that and we're going to be able to get the nutrients we need. Chef Mark: That's such a good point to have it be well, I'm just thinking of our our tagline, keeping food fun. And Christiana Cortina: Ha ha ha Chef Mark: and letting the kid have that like real agency and choice in the whole matter. That seems important to create that like warm, safe, welcoming environment around the food as the kid gets in the kitchen. And I'm thinking about how I feel fortunate that my perspective and just the way I engage with food is such a place of pure pleasure. I just love I keep thinking of bell pepper, because that was the thing that a lot of parents were surprised that the kids were eating and they enjoyed it. And I just love the feeling of it like cutting it and getting some like red juices flowing from it and the cold, crisp nature of chewing into it. And you can cut it different sizes and get a different textural experience in your mouth. You can put it into the roll with other flavors and other ingredients, and then you have a new experience with the flavors. I just think it's so fun and I love Bringing that, I think that's one of the gifts that I have that I get to bring in the kitchen with me with kids, is just the pure pleasure of like this individual food is so special. Christiana Cortina: So glad you said that. And that's something I encourage parents to do too, is talk about all of those features of the food. Like, this bell pepper is so crispy and juicy. And I like the way it feels when I have it this size or when it's cut up really small, I like it in this meal. But when I eat it with this like dip, I like it to be this size or this color. So really like diving into the features rather than the nutritional content. is way more fun. and something I thought of too when you were talking was it's kinda like when reading is like really fun and exciting when you're young and you like get picture books and, you know, it's kind of enjoyable and then you're like in school and you're forced to read all of these things you don't want to read and all of these teachers are telling you, you know, you have to read this because you're gonna learn this, this and this and it's good for your brain. And I was a third grade teacher, so I, you know, I'm have done this and kids ultimately Chef Mark: Yes. Christiana Cortina: just get like, I don't wanna do that. Like this is boring. So I don't know, I think it's a fair comparison to say that can be how food starts to feel when it becomes this, you should eat this because it's good for your muscles and you should eat this because it's good for your bones or whatever you choose to say. Chef Mark: completely agree with that and I had kind of planned to share my little analogy but I think you kind of covered it well but my my thought is a lot of times when you're an adult and in not a food space if someone's just telling you that you my gosh you have to see this movie and they just tell you that you just have to see it and they tell you go go look it up go on Netflix tonight and type it in and watch it. You'll love it. But they haven't asked you anything about your interests or preferences and it was an unsolicited offer. I a lot of times I'm so resistant to that. I'm like You don't know me, I don't know if this movie's gonna be good. I don't think we've talked about it enough for me to be excited about it. And that's my kind of analogue to what you're doing with kids a lot of times. What we do with kids as adults to just shove a food in front of them and say, Y you have to do this, you're gonna love it, it's a great food versus them getting in kind of from the very beginning, actively engaging with the knife, cutting it, s trying different sizes, having little mini tastes, putting it into the final dish and for You know, going back to the movie analogy, if you were chatting with someone or even seeking out, okay, I wanna watch a movie, it's gonna be in this genre that mixes a little bit of comedy and romance and has this light feeling to it and is similar to this other movie, then you kind of get curiously engaged and then you can find something that you're way more interested in looking at versus someone just shoving it down your throat and telling you, you gotta do it. Christiana Cortina: Totally resonate with that. I think that is such a good point. And I think it really speaks to how kids can feel. And it made me think of a time when I used to nanny a three-year-old girl and she loved mac and cheese. And she ate mac and cheese maybe like once or twice a week. and one time there her mom bought Her the Paw Patrol mac and cheese. Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: And I was, she loved Paw Patrol. So I was like, my gosh, she's gonna be pumped. So I called her over. I was like, my gosh, look, look at this Paw Patrol mac and cheese. Like it's gonna be so good. And immediately I could tell that she decided I'm not gonna like it. Like I'm not gonna like it now. So I was like, knew I made a mistake, but I made it anyways. And I put it on her plate and she didn't touch it. And I was like, okay, well, that did not. help me in any way. So and that's happened multiple times with kids just in my personal life where I hype something Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: up and I'm like, you're gonna like it. And then I can tell they're kinda like, mm, you don't know me. Chef Mark: If you were to go back inside right now and redo that situation with the mac and cheese, what would you do right now? Christiana Cortina: That's such a good question. I would not s speak a word and I would make it and I would just serve it as if it were the other mac and cheese and see what happens. And Chef Mark: Mm. Cause she she already was loving mac and cheese and didn't really need, I guess, an adult telling her this one is a little different in some way and you're gonna love it. Christiana Cortina: Exactly. And maybe like if I did serve it, she would have questioned it and been like, this looks different. and maybe I would have approached that of, yeah, these are a different shape than usual. What do you think? so kind of just letting Chef Mark: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: her decide because you know, ultimately if she doesn't like it and didn't want it, that's you know, that's fine. Somebody else Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: will eat the Paw Patrol mac and cheese, hopefully, and it won't go to waste. But yeah, I think me deciding for her. really made her not happy. Chef Mark: That's a s that's like I don't know, a gr a great example of you know, adults telling a kid what they're gonna like. And I was thinking of what you share with me all the time is that every family has their own thing going on. And so maybe you know your kid, you know your kid best, and maybe Christiana Cortina: Uh-huh. Chef Mark: your kid is gonna be a little different than that child, and maybe they would get so pumped if it was the cartoon they love in mac and cheese together, they might lose their mind in the best way and be like, This is the best day ever. And so only you can know that as a parent if you're listening to this. Just always trust yourself and that you know your kid And that your kid changes from day to day too. Christiana Cortina: I'm so glad you mentioned that. And I was wanted to add to that too. Like it varies kid to kid, and then it varies like what mood your kid is in. So that I feel like is a big factor. I mean, maybe I would have done that on a different day and she would have been excited about it. So it's always an experiment and you're always just trying new things and it's like a practice, not a perfect. And it's always gonna probably go a different way than you expect. Chef Mark: So good. Yeah, that's so good. We're we're humans. We change moment to moment, day to day, year to year. So that's something super important to keep in mind. Christiana Cortina: There's something else I wanted to mention with that too that came up when I was talking about it is a lot of times when I'm working with parents, they'll say that, you know, their kid likes the food and then all of a sudden they're like, I don't like that anymore. And Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: then the parent kind of feels defeated, maybe, or annoyed or whatever, and then decides not to serve it again because, you know, they're listening to their child that said, I don't like that anymore. what I would recommend is giving them a reframe like you don't like this today but maybe you will another day and helping them kind of have that growth mindset of you know your preferences and tastes change instead some parents will say they respond of like well you liked this yesterday or you liked this last week and that's not super helpful for a child usually in those situations and then another thing is just trying to serve it again. Like maybe not the next day, but in a couple of weeks, if that specific food that they were like, I don't like this anymore, and it was like, you know, a tortilla, then trying to s take a break from it and then just serve it again and and don't say anything and see if, you know, maybe the child says they don't like it, but maybe they just weren't in the mood for it. And that's the only language they had to use in that moment. So not feeling super defeated, even though it makes sense, it can be really frustrating when you prepare a meal and And a kid decides they don't like it that day anymore. Chef Mark: I really I really love that just helping the kid understand themselves really. You're kind of like saying, space here for you to be yourself today, you don't like this today, and kind of right sizing it into like today, this is how you're feeling. And I might even use that on myself, just like parenting myself if I'm having a bad mood or some sort of negative feeling, like, okay, right now you're feeling this way. Okay, great. in an hour. Tomorrow, next week, you'll feel differently. I think that's really nice to do with the kids and the food. I I really love that. Christiana Cortina: Yeah. It's super helpful. I think it also takes the pressure off of the parent and that like really strong feeling of being defeated or frustrated, Chef Mark: Yeah. Christiana Cortina: even though you may still feel that in that moment. It's like, okay, I feel like this today, kinda like you said. Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. And I would wonder, depending on your kid's age, there's some time where you could share a little bit about as a parent, I feel frustrated. I don't know. What are your thoughts on that? Just sharing your own feelings of like, that's okay that that you don't want it. I've put some work into it, so I'm just feeling a little frustrated, but that's okay because you you don't want it today. And I just wanted to tell you where I'm coming from. Like, what are your thoughts on sharing your own parents' perspective on it? Christiana Cortina: I feel like that definitely would be parent to parent, child to child and an age like on Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: your relationship with the child. I know your kids are kinda older, so Chef Mark: Yeah, I have like t like pre teen and teenagers, so that seems way more appropriate than like a four year old. That's like way too much weight for a little little kid to handle. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, I feel like it would be appropriate for you to share that. And like saying, you know, it's okay that you don't want this. I'm just feeling frustrated because I spent a lot of time. Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: And to me, that models that when they are in that same kind of situation that they can communicate that they feel frustrated in a Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: in an appropriate and like healthy way of just sharing it and not because getting frustrated can lead to other behaviors that are not as communicative and could be more maybe explosive rather than just saying like I'm frustrated and I I think that's a Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: valid thing to model and to say. Chef Mark: Cool. Well thanks for the affirmation on that. I think for kids kids who are my a my kids' age and in in our family environment, that does make a lot of sense for me to do sometimes if I just be I'm just honest and not getting angry at them and not having an outburst would just say, man, I do feel defeated. I feel tired and exhausted and put in this effort for you and you didn't like it. So that just makes you feel bummed out. But that's that's okay that you don't want to eat it. You don't have to. But here's where I'm coming from. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, I think that's totally appropriate. And I I think too, like, I mean, just from being a kid, kids don't really recognize the mental load of cooking and buying the food and deciding what to eat. so they th they usually I would say aren't doing it intentionally. Chef Mark: Yeah, and that's way above their pay grade. That's not the responsibility to be Christiana Cortina: Right. Chef Mark: aware of their parents' emotions and the level of work it requires to raise a child. That's not even in their zone. Their their job is to be a kid. And not like stuff. When they when they don't want it. Christiana Cortina: Exactly. Yeah. And decide when they don't like something that day when you slaved in the kitchen. Chef Mark: Yep, for sure. Okay, so what about kids and families where the kid really doesn't wanna cook? And I'm talking about these like kind of idealized moments where there's all these kids in a classroom with me and everyone's cooking and engaged and having such a fun time. But what if you're at home as a parent and your kid absolutely has no interest and does not wanna engage in the cooking process? Christiana Cortina: So that's a great question. always I'd say it's positive to extend the invitation. and maybe instead of saying like, do you want to help me cook? Can you help me cook? Maybe asking for just one specific job could be that could be helpful. Like, can you wash the the lettuce and dry it off. and you know what that just made me think of is that really fun video that you have on your Instagram when all the kids are drying the lettuce. Chef Mark: yes. Christiana Cortina: I loved that. When we first met I watched that. I was like, that's so fun. Chef Mark: cool. So if anyone hasn't seen that video, that's from an after school class where I had everybody take some kale that we had washed and then they put it in a small clean dish towel. We went outside, bundled it up, and then the kids got to swing it around. The water flies through the towel, dries off the kale, and then we come back with dry kale. But it is the most fun. That is I cannot think of a more fun kitchen task to do, period. Christiana Cortina: So again, making it fun. That is a really fun task. And I was thinking of just if you're making like a dressing or a dip, like if you can shake it up in a jar, something that just feels Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: a little more fun, inviting them to do that job may be more of a success. And I've had experiences with kids who are more hesitant around new foods because they're nervous to try them or to interact with them in any way. And sometimes those types of kids still want to be. involved. and some ways you could do that is having them help with the dishes, having them help set the table. I can't tell you how much independence and joy I've seen kids feel when they set the table. Chef Mark: Hmm. Christiana Cortina: One of my services is I do an in-home cooking session where I'll go to a family's house and me and the child or children will cook dinner and prepare the whole meal for the family to enjoy together. And Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: I always have them set the table. And they just they love it. They take so much ownership over that. So giving small jobs like that can still be really effective and get them involved in the kitchen. Maybe not the cooking process, but you're getting them closer and closer each time. Chef Mark: That's that's really beautiful. I really love that. I l I love the setting the table as part of the food and cooking process. and just to go back a little bit, I had a few thoughts. I I think we started kind of t tiptoeing toward it but didn't quite say explicitly there's some active things kids can do in the kitchen where moving their bodies, shaking the dressing in a jar, swinging around the clean kitchen towel. Do you have any other ideas for active things that like young, energetic kids could do in the kitchen? I'm trying to think if I can get some going too. Christiana Cortina: I know, I'm trying to think of things. I mean I feel like a lot of kids like a whisk or like to stir. That that's a pretty simple, Chef Mark: yeah. That's a good one. Christiana Cortina: not super active Chef Mark: They could in in the same vein they could be like scrambling the eggs. That's a good one, because you need a lot of turns to get it to really incorporate well. Christiana Cortina: Another thing I've done in my kind of makeshift cooking group classes is I'll get the like the cookie cutter shapes. So using those not to cut cookies, but to cut different things. Maybe it's vegetables, maybe it's fruit, maybe it's slices of cheese. Like that kind of just makes things more fun. I love that. I love that. yeah, I love doing that. Chef Mark: how fun, I love that. I've never done that. Super fun. Christiana Cortina: We did like little homemade lunchables with those and cut all the like pita breads and the turkey and cheese into those fun shapes. Chef Mark: Amazing. That's a great idea. I love that so much. I'm gonna do that. Christiana Cortina: Let me know how it goes. That's a really fun thing to do with younger kids too. It's very appropriate to like just have them s cutting things with shapes. Chef Mark: Yeah. And kinda just bridging that natural kind of arts and crafts thing that, you know, preschoolers are doing in school and kindergarten kind of in that age range. That sounds so fun to just bring that into the kitchen with the food. Christiana Cortina: Another thing with young kids too is you don't always have to bring them into the kitchen for the food is you can bring the food outside of the kitchen and make it fun. something that I think of is like using vegetables to paint. So like using Chef Mark: wow. Christiana Cortina: like a broccoli head and like putting it in paint and then like putting it on paper to see what it looks like. So getting them to interact Chef Mark: Wow. Christiana Cortina: with food in different ways rather than eating it. Chef Mark: You're blowing my mind right now. This is so exciting. I love these ideas. This is so fun. Christiana Cortina: Yeah. It's like the comparing the vegetable kind of what they look like when you use them to paint. And that's a win. Interacting Chef Mark: Yes. Christiana Cortina: with the food is is a huge win, even if they're not eating Chef Mark: That's huge. Christiana Cortina: it. Yeah. Chef Mark: my gosh, my mind is just going with all these fun ideas of all the different ways like asparagus would look, even if you just laid it down and one time laid it down and made a print of the asparagus or cross-cutting it and using it to make like circles. I mean you could do so many things. It's so fun. Christiana Cortina: And you might even have some like new cool art for your kitchen. Chef Mark: Yeah. Okay, what if it's old produce that's already gonna be going bad that you're planning to throw away? Christiana Cortina: Genius. Genius. Cause then you're not wasting it. Chef Mark: That's a really good way, because I I think about how I waste f I waste so much food all the time and I know I'm not in the minority. Everyone does it, and that might feel like very wasteful if you just buy a very fresh head of broccoli just for your kid to dip in paint. But if it's maybe something that was inevitably gonna be going bad anyway, that could be a really nice way to use it up. Christiana Cortina: Definitely. Chef Mark: Okay, I was also thinking of just other ways to get kids involved. I love that you were talking about the table setting and just all of the little mini parts that are encompassing food and the kitchen and all that feeding environment at home. and you did you did touch on dishes too. And so I was thinking about how that's such an essential job and that some kids' personalities thrive on that. It's it's definitely not the majority, but when kids get excited about putting order into place, they're restoring things back to a clean state and being ready to use again. deeply satisfying and I've seen some kids who are not really interested in the food and cooking part but get super into dishes. So that's just something to put out there and is a very essential job in homes. I actually just talked to my mom on the phone right before we got on here and she was saying how my dad does that because he really doesn't cook at all. I think a handful of times in my lifetime I've seen him make something but he's he really kind of steps in and does dishes into the home environment and that's a very crucial job and helps my mom kind of keep going with all the cooking she He enjoys most days doing and maybe some days is quite tired, but keeps doing anyway. Christiana Cortina: I love that. I love that kind of division of taking responsibility for different portions of the cooking experience. Cause yeah, cleaning up is part of it. and that's definitely something that I prioritize in my cooking sessions is we're gonna clean up too because it doesn't end at the cooking. And when you're cooking with kids, realistically, it's gonna get messy and sticky probably and not be cleaned up exactly the way you prefer. But helping kids learn that that's part of the process and some of them getting excited about that. I like to just not, like we talked about, when you like hype something up, it can seem like ingenuine, disingenuous. Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Disingenuous. Christiana Cortina: so what I like to do is me and my little cousin, she's nine now and she loves making mac and cheese. and we're recently starting to have cleaning the dishes as part of the process, and she kind of doesn't love doing that. So sometimes if she is like with her friend and having fun, I'll just say, I'll do the dishes for you. Sometimes if she's not, I'll be like, you know, I'll help you. and instead of being like, why don't you want to do the dishes? It's fun, I'll like wash them myself and sit myself and say, sometimes it feels really therapeutic to do dishes. I love how it's something really dirty and then you get to feel the warm water and then it's perfectly clean. So Not really like acting like, my gosh, this is gonna be so fun, but talking through like this can be therapeutic and you know, if you're moaning and groaning as an adult about doing the dishes, which is valid, but it's not gonna make your kid wanna do them. Chef Mark: Okay, that's huge. I really resonate with just being real with kids and not like you said, not overhyping something, 'cause They're so smart. Kids are so intuitive. And if you're acting like, dishes is the most fun thing we've ever done like in this whole year. Like, no, it's fully not. It's actually not very fun, but it could be important and it could be therapeutic and it's a good thing for them to learn how to do. I think I've just really had an intuitive sense that that's one of the cornerstones of my teaching is to be real with kids and remember that they are small humans who will be adults. They're not a different species. They're just younger people. They're just like you and me. And they need to be talked to with like very real I don't know, just ke keep things real and telling them how things are and you can frame things and help them along, but not to be false and overhyped about things. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, you don't wanna be phony. They've s they can sniff that out pretty quickly. Chef Mark: Do it doesn't work well. Christiana Cortina: No. Chef Mark: Especially my kids now who are middle school and high school, they appreciate teachers at school who push them and who see them and like listen to them and not teachers who have k kind of a layer of distance between them and are either too strict or kind of phony and fake. They can just sniff it out. And they actually wanna be my kids wanna be pushed a little bit academically and have someone who sees them and respects them. And I think young kids are the same way. Like they wanna be led and like brought into something that's new and grow and have someone who sees them and makes space for them too. Christiana Cortina: Definitely. I think that's definitely a place to do it is cooking. And sometimes I think it can be really hard to let go of control when you're letting kids cook, especially when you're the parent. I'm not a parent myself, so I'm just speaking from observation. it's much easier for me to cook with other people's kids and like kind of let go and give them full control and I don't know if I've ever told you this, but my favorite thing to do when I cook with kids is when they ask me a question that I feel like they can decide, I would say, I don't know, you're the chef. It's up to you. so that's definitely my favorite line. Obviously, if they're asking me for help or guidance, I'm gonna show them. But if they ask me like, do you think this needs more whatever? I'll be like, you know, you can taste it. You let me know you're the chef and kind of let them take ownership over that. Chef Mark: That's so special. And that does take some patience as a parent to do with your own child versus, you know, work you and I working in a professional environment with other people's kids. It's so much easier for me just to do all this stuff with other people's kids. And when it comes to my own, Christiana Cortina: Yeah. Chef Mark: it's a little bit more challenging. but I will share like I just had that very kind of win last night. My oldest Owen is 14, and he got back into this week. He was like, Yeah, I think I want to start cooking dinner again for the family, and I was so excited about it. And he actually texted my mom and asked for Her recipe for coleslaw, because that's something that she's made over the years. And it was so special to have that like triple generation thing happening together. and he had a few questions for me similar to what you're saying, like just preference and taste-wise. And I just said, Here's what you could do: you could make all the dressing, put some of it onto the cabbage and carrots, taste it, and then decide yourself if you think it needs more. And then he did that very thing and he's like, it needs so much more, and dumped the whole thing of dressing. And I had a visceral reaction that I did not say out loud, it was great. I was like, boy, that was 50% more, not just a little more. Okay, great. But he did it and that was his preference and he loved it. He said he wanted the the slaw to be a little wilty, and that is actually not my personal preference. I like it to be more crisp and like fresh, so all of the mayo-based dressing really achieved the wilts he was after and he made it he made it how he wanted. Chef Owen did it the way he wanted to, and I thought that was very cool. Christiana Cortina: I love that you gave him space to do that. I'm sure that was challenging for you as a parent and as a chef. Chef Mark: I just had this moment of standing fairly close to him in the kitchen and just going, Whoa, but inside. Just inside. Wow, that is quite a bit. Okay. So cool though. Christiana Cortina: Now that we're talking yeah, that's so cool. And now that we're talking about this, obviously it's very different, but I do tend to micromanage my boyfriend in the kitchen when we're cooking. which I'm working on and when he's in charge, I do not go in the kitchen because I don't want to. I'm really, really not good at keeping things inside. Chef Mark: That's wisdom. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, but now that we are talking about this, I'm like, yeah, it's so easy for me with other people's kids. But actually when it's my friends or my boyfriend, it's not so easy at all. And I usually just end up giving them the can you chop the garlic job? Which is the Chef Mark: Just the minimal tasks. Christiana Cortina: minimal like tasks that I don't want to do. So I I think that's an area of growth for me is not doing that to the people I love. Chef Mark: I love that reflection. It's it is so hard. It's the hardest of the people that are closest to us for all the things in life. It's the hardest. Christiana Cortina: It really is. Chef Mark: Okay, I have something I've seen online, which is sneaky vegetables. Like parents somehow online in these cook nutrition spaces saying that they like somehow put veggies in something and their kid didn't know it. What are your thoughts on that? Christiana Cortina: So I'm not against this. I don't necessarily think it's the the wrong thing to do, or it's bad, or you know, that people shouldn't do it. I think it can make really yummy meals too, like the Italian soup where they blend all the veggies. Have you seen that? That that looks really good. I've never made it. but anyways, I was just thinking of that. And maybe kids don't know that there's veggies in there. However, I will say it's not usually the win that. People portray from my perspective Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: of, you know, I got my kid to eat all of these veggies because I made this recipe. it can feel like a win because your kid is eating vegetables. However, from my perspective as a nutrition professional, it isn't allowing the child to get exposure to those vegetables in an authentic way because they don't know that they're in there. And they're not really learning how to accept those vegetables or fruits or whatever, or like really explore them in a productive way. and kind of gain that acceptance and exposure that happens over time from persistence of serving those vegetables. So I wouldn't say, my gosh, never do it. It's not a good idea. But I think people like to flex that as like a Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: look at all the vegetables my kids ate because of this. and yeah, that that's kind of my take on it. Chef Mark: makes a lot of sense and I think what you're maybe getting at is that it's like it's changing the form of them and so the kid isn't getting to see okay where does we'll go back to the bell pepper that's on my mind today. Where does the bell pepper come from? What does it look like? What are those seeds inside? The stems texture when we cut it different ways. And if you're just cooking it and blending it into a saucer soup and and being like, ooh I like secretly got it in there. Cool, the kid ate the veggies. That's great. We can both agree that's awesome. However the kid didn't get to experience it in its original form and kind of interact with it in a meaningful way. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, and they like don't know that they like bell peppers that way. So Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: if you're sneaking it, they're not leaving that meal thinking, I like bell peppers when they're blended up in my sauce. Chef Mark: That's a great succinct way to say it. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, they're like, I like that sauce that was good. And yeah, that's not Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: a bad thing, but they're not leaving with the thought of like they like or they tried this, if that makes sense. Chef Mark: completely. Yeah. You d you didn't sit down with like the plate full of different veggies and try one and say, I do like broccoli and learn that about yourself. You just had it all kind of blended into something else and was kind of just like obfuscated. But I was wondering if it would be kind of a different way to interact with it for the kid to be part of a cooking process if they're making a soup or a sauce where you're blending in a lot of different veggies, 'cause those are really cool formats and I think Cultures all around the world have really, really cool soups, stews, sauces that do things like that. What are your thoughts on that? Christiana Cortina: Definitely. I think if they're involved in that and they're seeing everything that's going into it and then they try it and they like it, they're aware of what went in it. So they know and maybe they don't like a bell pepper raw and crunchy. Maybe they do like it when it like was roasted and blended into like a creamy sauce or a soup. But if Chef Mark: my gosh, I'm getting so excited. I love that. Christiana Cortina: I know. Now I'm hungry. If they are part of the process, they get to learn that and they get to know that. the other thing I would wanna know in a situation like that is if you are sneaking it and your kid eats it, if they found out that you snuck it in there or that what it was in it, what would their reaction be? So that would be my question to like a parent Chef Mark: interesting. Christiana Cortina: who if they were seeing me and they told me they did that, but their kid won't eat vegetables otherwise, I would I would ask that question because to me that like kind of erodes trust. Chef Mark: I completely agree with that. I'm thinking just as an adult, what if someone was doing that to me and and I just later found out I would feel a little betrayed and like c mm confused maybe. Christiana Cortina: Yeah, just something I thought of is like I hate spinach and smoothies. Hate it. Can always taste Chef Mark: Mm. Okay. Christiana Cortina: it. People are like, add this fruit, you won't taste it. I do. I don't like it. Chef Mark: Okay. Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: I like kale because I can't taste it in my smoothie. Chef Mark: Yeah. Christiana Cortina: But spinach is not for me in a s I like spinach, but not in a smoothie. And I remember my sister making me a spinach smoothie. And her being like, it's good, just try it. Like and I was like, Ugh, I didn't feel Chef Mark: Was she was she trying to trick you or keep it secret, or did you know going into it it had spinach? Christiana Cortina: Remember, but I do remember being a like, ugh. Chef Mark: That's that's actually kind of like the smoothie topic, I think, is actually useful. And I try to do that tactically. Like I love putting kale in my smoothie as well. Because for me, I'm almost hiding it from myself. It's like an easy way to get some veggies in the morning. And I wouldn't always want to eat the flavor and texture of kale, either cooked or raw, in some sort of application in the morning time. It's just not what my tongue is interested in at that time of day. So I think it's pretty fun to on purpose put it in there and like hiding it from myself flavor and texture-wise. And then I've also even done one level up of using different colored ingredients that can even make the final smoothie color more appealing. Cause sometimes mixing kale with other veggies looks very green or even kind of brownish and really unappealing if it's like strawberries and kale can get kind of gross looking. But a big win color wise is blueberries, because they have such a strong pigment that it completely takes over all the chlorophyll in the green veggies and you don't see it at all. So that's kind of a cool way to make it just the whole whole experience more appealing. Christiana Cortina: I love that and I'm just thinking I really wanna start making morning smoothies again that now that you said that. If you have any recipes, I don't know if you have recipes. Okay. Chef Mark: Okay, cool. I sure do. I have a really good recipe that's almost a perfect duplication of one of the st jumba juice recipes. Christiana Cortina: Ooh. Chef Mark: And it's the strawberry surf rider. And it's really simple Christiana Cortina: Yeah. Chef Mark: and really good. And I love the brightness of it. And I I remember that it has both fresh lime and fresh lemon juice. And it's so bright and just I love that flavor. Some people are like want more like creamy and smooth. This one's just like, woo, wakes you up. Christiana Cortina: Okay, I'll definitely try that. That's not CMA. Chef Mark: I'll share it with you. Christiana Cortina: Okay, cool. the other thing when you were telling me that you kinda hide it from yourself and You obviously decided to do that. And that's something I do too. Like when I put kale in my smoothies, it's not for the taste of kale. It's like, you know, you get let me get some more fiber and greens and nutrients Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: in this because I'm an adult and I'm making that decision. But I would be curious if like that's something your parent did to you when you were a kid, if that's something you would ultimately choose to do when you were an adult. Because if that had like a bad feeling of, you know, when I was younger, my Parent used to put try to sneak veggies in my smoothie, and I hated that. I feel like you might not choose to do that for yourself in the future. Chef Mark: That's I think very true. And I did not grow up having any smoothies. We didn't even have a blender at home. So we had no smoothies whatsoever when I was growing up. And that was a a very much an adulthood thing that I started incorporating. So that makes a lot of sense. And it's a very different context 'cause you're not trying to trick another person. You're just hiding it from yourself. And you're aware I put the giant handful of kale in there myself. I know what's going in. Christiana Cortina: Yeah. Definitely. I and you know I just think of like I said, I don't have kids myself, but I think of myself as a kid and my temperament was to kind of just, you know, a little more rebellious and a little more like fight back. So for me, I feel like if that would have been done to me as a kid, I would have not liked it. And I definitely as I grew up would be like, I don't do that because I hated when that was done to me. So I'm not gonna do it for myself, you know. Chef Mark: Very fair. I think it's probably so true. Christiana Cortina: What? Chef Mark: Okay, one last thing to talk about today. We were wondering about the idea of kids who are maybe not as into cooking. What if there's another bridge into cooking in the kitchen? Do you wanna speak to that? Christiana Cortina: Yes, and I do like to help parents start here when you know, if I work with a lot of parents that have picky eaters. I know we've talked about that term, it's not our favorite, but I'm just gonna say it. Or if their kid generally gravitates towards things that are sweet, I always tell parents, you know, why don't you invite your child to bake with you? and not, you know, not zucchini bread, and not like a not Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: going full into just having those veggies. Like if you have never cooked or baked with your child and you're trying to connect through the cooking experience, you know, my suggestion is to make cupcakes or a box cake or something, Chef Mark: Yes. Christiana Cortina: even letting your child choose or something that they love. And if that's sweets or that's something sugary, that's totally fine. That those steps will get you to maybe next time making zucchini bread or banana bread or, you know, something that does have some more nutrients in it and can expand their variety. Chef Mark: That's so good. I think that's really once again keeping food fun and taking pressure off of parents to always have every single thing you make be nutrient dense and super good for your kid. I think that's so cool just to get them involved. I think a box cake really is a great on-ramp. They can simply crack an egg, add a little Christiana Cortina: Mm-hmm. Chef Mark: bit of measured oil, they get practice measuring, getting their hands in the ingredients using the whisk. Christiana Cortina: Mm-hmm. Chef Mark: having the tactile feedback and then being part of seeing, okay, we created this thing together. It goes into the oven, comes out transformed into something that's delicious. I think that's a really nice on-ramp. Christiana Cortina: Definitely. And like you said before, if your kid isn't interested in cooking You know, maybe they just got home from school and you're making dinner and you invite them to cook and they're like, no, I don't want to do that. Maybe they're tired. Well, maybe on the weekend, if you're looking for something fun to do together and you say, Hey, we should make cupcakes, that would be so fun. You might have a completely different reaction and they might have a really good time cracking the egg and using the whisk. And then next time you're cooking, you can invite them in and you might get a different response because they know that they had a good time doing that. Chef Mark: Yeah, absolutely. And then I was thinking about when people get even more advanced in baking. I don't know if the adult in the home is into that at all, but if you are, then you can get your kid more into measurements and fractions and especially kind of upper elementary school. It's a really good time to be teaching about fractions, proportions, seeing the different measuring spoons and understanding what those things mean. That's my favorite way in the world to learn about fractions and proportions is through baking. Christiana Cortina: I love that. And I actually used to have a an apron that when you flipped over the bottom, it converted all the measurements of I Chef Mark: That's so cool. Christiana Cortina: know it was so cool. And it actually said eat cake for breakfast, which I loved. It was a great apron. No, I Chef Mark: Phenomenal. And you don't have this anymore? It's gone? Christiana Cortina: don't know where I went. To buy one just and try to find it. Chef Mark: I think you should. Christiana Cortina: I loved the conversion rates because fractions are really hard. And I remember teaching them when I was in third grade and I was like, ooh, this is hard to teach. So when you can make it fun Chef Mark: It is hard. Christiana Cortina: and like concrete and tangible like that, that's that's really fun. there was something else you said, but it slipped my mind. But I would like to, what I was gonna say is there are just so many lessons and skills to learn in the kitchen. math being one of them, patience Chef Mark: Mm-hmm. Christiana Cortina: being another, and just kind of fine motor skills for younger kids. So I think that's something that's really special about cooking. And you get to eat something at the end. so that's really cool. Chef Mark: Yeah, it it develops so many life skills. In addition to what you already shared, it's it's about science and even like thermodynamics, understanding heat, different types of heat. It's also like therapeutic. You were talking about doing dishes or even just creating a meal for yourself can be so self-nourishing. And so it's so much whole human development happening in the kitchen in that environment with food. Christiana Cortina: Definitely and so much connection when you're Chef Mark: Yeah. Christiana Cortina: cooking with someone or you're feeding someone. it's such a special thing. And you mentioned thermodynamics. So I would love for you to speak from a chef perspective on the difference of baking and cooking. Chef Mark: Absolutely. I think The experience and the idea around baking and cooking, people think of them as being very different, and in some ways they are. Baking is just one narrow part of cooking, in my idea. Like baking, you're using the oven and you're using convective heat, which is just having food in some sort of hot environment, and that could be boiling pasta in a pot, you have it in hot water, or you're baking a cake in a hot air oven. So that's just one part of cooking. and there's so many other things that you can do with the stovetop and having convective Inductive heat where the pan is touching the food and that heat is being directly transferred from the surface of the material. And then we touched on radiant heat at the beginning of our talk today, and that was the broiler, and that's the heat waves actually coming down and hitting the surface of the food. So it's less about the hot air of the oven just circulating around and slowly warming something up. It's about heat waves actually touching the food in the most intense kind of cooking way that we have in the kitchen. So zooming back all of that, there's so many different ways to apply heat to food and it's really cool for kids who are learning how to cook to even thoughtfully think through, okay, what parts of different kinds of heat methods are we're gonna use and how I'm gonna achieve the final goal that I wanna have. Christiana Cortina: That's so cool. I did not know any of that. And I like how you said cook baking is like a part of cooking. Is that what you said? Chef Mark: Yeah. Christiana Cortina: And is it I mean, does it ring true that I say this and now I'm like, is this true? Is that baking is a science and cooking is an art? I mean, do you agree with that as a chef? I don't I really don't. Chef Mark: You know, I really don't. I hear that as being a real big takeaway that people say. I think it's such a like a truism that people say, b and I put that in quotes. Christiana Cortina: I say that. Chef Mark: I don't think that's true as I've experienced both so much. I think that both have both elements. So cooking Christiana Cortina: Okay. Chef Mark: and baking are a a blend of both science and art. And I think there is a lot more leeway in cooking because you're not using proportions and having things come out chemically. So I I Christiana Cortina: Mm-hmm. Chef Mark: do think baking does have much more proportion of science in it. But I think there's also a lot more leeway in baking than people give themselves credit for with flavorings and amounts of time that you're cooking something, you could put it into a different shaped pan. There's so many things that you can do in baking that people don't really consider or think is possible. Yes, it is very important to have your proportion of like liquids and flour in a cake recipe, because you will not get a cake. If you do it wrong, you'll get bread or you'll get soup. So those are really important to have, but I think there's so much more nuance and spectrum to both things. Christiana Cortina: I'm so glad I asked. Can you do you have another saying that I can start saying? Chef Mark: I need to come up with that and then we'll make a shirt. I don't I don't have an answer yet. Christiana Cortina: We can have merch. I love that. Chef Mark: Yeah, that'd be sweet. Christiana Cortina: I'm gonna need one because sometimes when I don't know what to say, I just will pull out one of those like what'd you call it? Truism sayings. Chef Mark: Yeah. Just and I really put it in quotes. It's like something that sounds really good and real and it gets repeated so easily, but I really Christiana Cortina: It does. Chef Mark: don't I don't think it's true. Christiana Cortina: I'm so glad I asked you. And I have those too with nutrition stuff that people will say or, you know, ask me about. And I always am like, yeah, no. I don't usually say that, so I'm really glad 'cause I don't want to be spreading false perceptions. Chef Mark: Yeah, no propaganda here. Christiana Cortina: None. We're keeping it real. Chef Mark: Okay, so I have the recipe that I want to share with you this week ready to go, and it's gonna be hummus. Have you ever made homemade hummus before? Christiana Cortina: Okay. Ooh. I have not made homemade hummus. I like hummus. Okay. Chef Mark: This is exciting. Okay, so so cool. I like it because for kids, it's a pretty common snack thing, and a homemade version is so easy and so much better than a store-bought version. And I'll tell you one main reason why it's so much better. Christiana Cortina: Okay. Chef Mark: Storebought ones, they need to preserve their freshness and provide a little bit of acidity, and they do that through citric acid, which is a cool ingredient and I actually use in my home kitchen. It's not a scary chemical, it's just kind of almost if you had powdered lemon juice. Essentially kind of what it is. But it can just have a very narrow range of flavor and it can taste more harsh and chemically and little more just very sour without nuance of like the beautiful fresh aromas of lemon. So we're gonna use fresh lemon juice and that change alone makes it so good. We're gonna use canned chickpeas, and I love the ones from Trader Joe's, where I live there a dollar and nine cents, and that's a huge steal. And then we're gonna also use tahini and Christiana, do you know what tahini is? Christiana Cortina: Have tahini. Wait, but what is it? I don't know what it is. Okay. Chef Mark: Amazing. Okay, for our listeners who don't know, it is simply simply ground sesame seeds. And I always talk to my students who are younger about it. I I tell them about peanut butter. You simply take peanuts Christiana Cortina: Hmm. Chef Mark: and grind it into a butter. It releases its own oils and starts to form into its own thing. And it and the most basic peanut butter is just peanuts. Same same deal with tahini. It's just sesame seeds. And as you grind it, they release their own oils and blend with the solids and become butter and it's really yummy. It's a little little bit bitter a little bit, but also very creamy and provides this really nice textural and flavor backbone. And then we'll just add a little bit of cumin, just enough to give it a little something and a good amount of salt. And then you can finally adjust it at the end and make it more salty, more lemony or less or whatever you want to make it and get your final result tailored to your preferences. Christiana Cortina: my gosh, I'm so excited. I'm definitely thinking I mean, what do you think of I don't know if you know about me, but do you think I'll lean salty or lemony? be salty. Definitely. Or I don't know if you said bad, but just kind of said Chef Mark: I think I think salty. Okay, nice. Cool. I passed. Christiana Cortina: that it is a little more narrow of a flavor profile. So that I just like that you said that because you know, some Chef Mark: thanks. Christiana Cortina: people can get scared when they read certain ingredients and sometimes it's just a way to make something shelf stable and doesn't make it bad or scary. so Chef Mark: Mm. Christiana Cortina: I appreciate that you said that one thing that I have to ask. Because I've looked Chef Mark: Yes. Christiana Cortina: into making homemade hummus before and there was something about having to peel the chickpeas. Do I have to do that? Chef Mark: Okay, I'll I'll s I'll sp I'll speak to that right now. You do not have to do that. There's two two Christiana Cortina: Yes, okay. Chef Mark: choices that you can do. The quickest and easiest, you simply take your canned chickpeas and put them in your food processor or blender and get your final result. And they will be a little bit grainy because of the skins that are on the chickpeas. Second Christiana Cortina: Okay. Chef Mark: option, for just five minutes in a pan with some extra water to cover your chickpeas, you add a little baking soda to the water, and it will raise the pH and change the water environment and dissolve the chickpeas skins almost completely. Not a hundred percent, but almost completely. And then you can blend it and your result will be super smooth and luxurious. So if you want to take a few extra minutes, you will get a very nice result. Christiana Cortina: I can handle that. Do I drain them after the baking soda thing? And rinse them? Chef Mark: Yeah, so drain off all of that water. They could get rinsed or not. Usually I would rinse them just to cool them down. I would do cool water and that would cool down fast and get ready to get blended in the food processor or a blender. Christiana Cortina: Okay, well I'm excited. Do you have a favorite thing that you dip in your hummus? Chef Mark: So simple, basic baby carrots. Christiana Cortina: No me too. Chef Mark: It's so simple. It's the best kid snack of all time. It's so easy and accessible. Christiana Cortina: It's so good. I love hummus and carrots. That's my favorite thing. And I do like a red bell pepper too, but carrots are the OG. Chef Mark: Mm. I also like Persian cucumbers in long spears. Christiana Cortina: yeah, that's nice. Okay, well I'm looking Chef Mark: That's nice. Christiana Cortina: forward to making it and hopefully some of our listeners will also cook along with us and we will see you next time. Chef Mark: All right, bye for now.