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How To Get People To Take You Seriously With Tori Dunlap · She's On The Money

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Hello, my name's Santasha Nabananga Bamblet. I'm a proud yr
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: the Order KERNI Whoalbury and a waddery woman. And before
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: we get started on She's on the Money podcast, I
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  Speaker 1: would like to acknowledge the traditional custodians of the land
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: of which this podcast is recorded on a wondery country,
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: acknowledging the elders, the ancestors and the next generation coming through.
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  Speaker 1: As this podcast is about connecting, empowering, knowledge sharing and
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  Speaker 1: the storytelling of you to make a difference for today
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  Speaker 1: and lasting impact for tomorrow.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Let's get into it.
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  Speaker 3: She's on the Money.
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  Speaker 4: She's on the Money.
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: Hello, and welcome to She's on the the podcast for
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: the millennials who want financial freedom. I am super excited
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: about our guests for this week and I know you
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: guys are going to be two as she was highly requested. Honestly,
• 1:13
  Speaker 2: you were the most requested one. Don't tell anybody else.
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  Speaker 5: Tory Dunlap is a money expert.
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  Speaker 2: She is the CEO and founder of her First one
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  Speaker 2: hundred K, a New York Times best selling author for
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  Speaker 2: her book Financial Feminist, host of the number one podcast
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  Speaker 2: for women in the US, Financial feminist, and because she
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  Speaker 2: hasn't done enough, was named a.
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  Speaker 5: Forbes thirty Under thirty.
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  Speaker 2: Tory has centered her career around her passion for women
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  Speaker 2: taking control of their finances. She wants to break down
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  Speaker 2: the stigma around men overseeing finances in a household and
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  Speaker 2: empower women to master their money and build a life
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  Speaker 2: that they love.
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  Speaker 5: Tory, Hi, welcome to She's on the Money.
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: Thank you for having me excited. How did it be here?
• 2:00
  Speaker 5: I am also so excited to have you.
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  Speaker 2: Like we were just talking off air, like your technically Victoria.
• 2:07
  Speaker 2: I'm technically Victoria. My nickname is Tory. Your nickname is Tory.
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  Speaker 2: My team were actually laughing because like, I also have
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  Speaker 2: a podcast, you have a podcast. I wrote a book.
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  Speaker 2: You wrote it.
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  Speaker 3: You're the cooler version of me. You're the Australian horder
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  Speaker 3: cooler version of me.
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  Speaker 2: No, no, no, if like that doesn't even count. But like
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  Speaker 2: I'm like the small fish Australian version, and I'm always like.
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  Speaker 5: Holy great, oh Tory, dumb laugh.
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  Speaker 2: I'm so excited for this.
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  Speaker 3: No, I have heard so many amazing things about your show.
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  Speaker 3: Folks who listen to financial feminists also listened to Shees
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  Speaker 3: on the money and vice versa. So I'm just really
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  Speaker 3: excited to be here.
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  Speaker 2: So me too. We had like a podcast deep dive
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  Speaker 2: with a team from iHeart a little while ago, and
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: they did this thing called like podcast Neighborhoods, and they
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: like show you where your listeners live, like not physically,
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: but like in other podcast land and yours and mine had.
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  Speaker 5: A really beautiful intersect. But when I put it out.
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  Speaker 2: To the community, I was like, I'm going to the US.
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  Speaker 2: Who do you want me to get into touch with?
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  Speaker 2: Who do you want me to interview? And I shouldn't
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  Speaker 2: have even bothered asking because ninety percent of the answers
• 3:06
  Speaker 2: were like, Tori done that her first one hundred K,
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  Speaker 2: the girl who does financial feminist, And I was like,
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  Speaker 2: they're all the same person. Guys have some diversity. But
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  Speaker 2: to say my community are obsessed with you as an understatement,
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  Speaker 2: So for those of you who maybe haven't heard of
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  Speaker 2: her first one hundred k, why did you start it?
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  Speaker 2: Tell me about you?
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  Speaker 5: Who are you, what do you do? Why do you
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  Speaker 5: do it?
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  Speaker 2: My friend?
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  Speaker 3: Sure? So I graduated college in twenty sixteen and I was,
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  Speaker 3: you know, majored in marketing and theater, and the plan
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  Speaker 3: was to work my way up the corporate ladder as
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  Speaker 3: a social media marketer. I was gonna stop the pavement
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  Speaker 3: and have a cute little briefcase and wear a pencil skirt.
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  Speaker 3: And that's how I know it's a fantasy, is I've
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  Speaker 3: never worn a pencil skirt in my.
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  Speaker 5: Life, and they're so uncomfortable. As someone who has, you
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  Speaker 5: don't want this, Oh they're terrible.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, And that was the image I had for myself,
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  Speaker 3: as I think a lot of women in their twenties do.
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  Speaker 3: It's like, I'm going to take on the world, take
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  Speaker 3: on this city. And then I got into my first
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  Speaker 3: corporate job and was like, no, this is awful. I
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  Speaker 3: don't want to do this. I don't want to make
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  Speaker 3: some straight white man. I don't respect who's already rich,
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  Speaker 3: even richer. I don't want to have to sit at
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  Speaker 3: a desk, even if my work's already done. And it
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  Speaker 3: was just like the rose colored goggles came off really quick.
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  Speaker 3: Of course, we know in the United States that not
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  Speaker 3: soon after I graduated college, we had a presidential election
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  Speaker 3: that did not go I think as a lot of
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  Speaker 3: us expected it to go. So I'm twenty two and
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  Speaker 3: I'm coming into adulthood or really into womanhood in a
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  Speaker 3: very different country than I expect, and I'm starting to
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  Speaker 3: ask myself the kind of questions like, yeah, what kind
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  Speaker 3: of person are you? What do you stand for? And honestly,
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  Speaker 3: the election of Donald Trump kind of radicalized me. And
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  Speaker 3: I was the friend all of my friends were coming
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  Speaker 3: to for financial advice and guidance. I had a really
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  Speaker 3: good financial education for my parents, and I just thought
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  Speaker 3: that was normal because I didn't know anything different. I
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  Speaker 3: thought everybody knows not to overspend on credit cards, everybody
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  Speaker 3: knows how to save money, everybody knows how to navigate
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  Speaker 3: this financial system. And of course I realized very quickly
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  Speaker 3: that that wasn't the case, especially wasn't the case for women.
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  Speaker 3: So I'm running this nine to five job in marketing,
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  Speaker 3: and then I start a blog in twenty sixteen on
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  Speaker 3: the side that later becomes her first hundred K. I'm
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  Speaker 3: talking about money, educating women about money. I start doing
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  Speaker 3: financial coaching, and then in twenty nineteen, based on the
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  Speaker 3: name though, you know, her first hundred K was my
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  Speaker 3: own hundred K journey, me attempting to save one hundred
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  Speaker 3: thousand dollars at age twenty five, I successfully achieved that
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  Speaker 3: goal about four years ago, almost to the day, went
• 5:35
  Speaker 3: to Europe to celebrate. I got the call for Good
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  Speaker 3: Morning America to be on one of two very very big,
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  Speaker 3: sexy like morning shows that are just like career making.
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  Speaker 3: So got the call for GMA at a pub in London,
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  Speaker 3: run Blue Home, did the interview, quit my job three
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  Speaker 3: weeks later and have never looked back. And you did
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  Speaker 3: the kind intro and bio of me. But we're now
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  Speaker 3: a community of over four million people. We have a podcast,
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  Speaker 3: we have a book. We fight the patriarchy by making
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  Speaker 3: women rich. We have a team of fifteen people.
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  Speaker 5: Fifteen people.
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  Speaker 3: It's crazy and it's just my life's work. That's what
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  Speaker 3: I believe I was put on this earth to do
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  Speaker 3: is educate women about money, but also talk about how
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  Speaker 3: money affects women differently. Because the truth is is like
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  Speaker 3: I don't think we have any sort of equality for
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  Speaker 3: any marginalized group until we have financial equality. And in addition,
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  Speaker 3: a financial education in a capitalist, disenfranchised system, that is
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  Speaker 3: your best form of protest is understanding money, having financial standing,
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  Speaker 3: a financial foundation. That is the way we get ahead
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  Speaker 3: as women. If you're a person of color, if you're
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  Speaker 3: a member of the LGBTQ community, if you're disabled, like
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  Speaker 3: if you're a member of a marginalized group, having money
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  Speaker 3: means having choices, It means having freedom, and it means
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  Speaker 3: that you get to show up in a disenfranchised system
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  Speaker 3: as the fullest version of yourself and the fullest version
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  Speaker 3: in your community. So that's what I believe I was
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  Speaker 3: put on this earth to do is fight for women's
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  Speaker 3: financial rights.
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  Speaker 2: And the way you talk about it, I am a
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  Speaker 2: thousand percent convinced you're not one person ever is going
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  Speaker 2: to doubt that you are obviously insanely impressive. But one
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  Speaker 2: question I really like asking people when I talk to them,
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  Speaker 2: especially if I, you know, really admire what they do,
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  Speaker 2: is are you proud of what you do?
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  Speaker 1: Like?
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  Speaker 2: Have you had time to sit down and be like, damn, girl,
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  Speaker 2: I did that? Like are you what does that look like?
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  Speaker 3: I love that question. I will be honest with you,
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  Speaker 3: and I imagine you feel very similar. It's always like
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  Speaker 3: what's next, Like it's like, Okay, a cool I did that,
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  Speaker 3: And then you know, I take maybe like an evening
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  Speaker 3: or sometimes even a couple days, so like celebrate it.
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  Speaker 3: But then I'm always like what's next, which I feel
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  Speaker 3: like is not the healthiest thing to do.
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  Speaker 2: No, but I can completely resonate with that, like I've
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  Speaker 2: got stuff to do.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, Like we got the New York Times, which like
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  Speaker 3: I worked so hard for and our team works so
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  Speaker 3: hard for. Like I don't think I've ever pushed myself
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  Speaker 3: harder to get anything, and then I did it and
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  Speaker 3: I felt so good. But like, your life doesn't change necessarily,
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  Speaker 3: Like yes, you get to say like I'm a New
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  Speaker 3: York Times bestseller, and like that is something I get
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  Speaker 3: to say for the rest of my life. And like,
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  Speaker 3: in theory, it increases book sales, but like my mom
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  Speaker 3: literally called me and she was like, so like what
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  Speaker 3: does that mean? And I'm like, I get a sticker
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  Speaker 3: on the book, and like I get this like really
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  Speaker 3: big accomplishment, But it doesn't like guarantee like you know,
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  Speaker 3: more money or more opportunities. It's just kind of like
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  Speaker 3: you have to find fulfillment for yourself. And I've learned
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  Speaker 3: over the past couple of years, especially as like my
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  Speaker 3: goalpost of success kept moving that I was like, oh,
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  Speaker 3: unless I sit and be excited about all of this,
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  Speaker 3: it's never going to feel like enough that was a
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  Speaker 3: really philosophical answer. I love very easy question, but yes,
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  Speaker 3: I feel very accomplished. I feel very accomplished of our team,
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  Speaker 3: and most of all, as cheesy as it sounds like,
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  Speaker 3: we get messages now probably every five minutes from a
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  Speaker 3: woman somewhere that is, you know, I paid off my
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  Speaker 3: credit card debt, I negotiated a twenty percent raise, I
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  Speaker 3: just have my first one thousand dollars in my emergency fund.
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  Speaker 3: You know the best part of it is it's always
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  Speaker 3: a comma, and then after it's and I feel so
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  Speaker 3: much more confident in every aspect of my life now,
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  Speaker 3: And like that's the feeling I want for every single woman.
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  Speaker 3: I want her to show up as her fullest version
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  Speaker 3: of herself in any space, in any relationship, in any format,
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  Speaker 3: because she doesn't have to say yes if she doesn't
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  Speaker 3: want to say yes, and she doesn't have to say
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  Speaker 3: no if she doesn't want to say no. And she
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  Speaker 3: also can show up bigger in every aspect of her
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  Speaker 3: life knowing that she's financially taken care of.
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  Speaker 2: I'm so excited about that, like exactly the same, And
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  Speaker 2: I feel like you and I are very on the
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  Speaker 2: same page when it comes to that because in this space,
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  Speaker 2: like you might do really cool things. And you said
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  Speaker 2: your mum called you and said, what does that mean.
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  Speaker 2: One of my family members called me and said, I
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: didn't realize you was so rich. When I got named
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: one of the Forbes thirty under thirty, because like they
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: didn't know enough about Forbes and they thought that I
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: was on the reach list, and I was like, I
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: wish I was on the racial list because obviously Forbes
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  Speaker 2: is quite American and in Australia it's not as big.
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  Speaker 2: So when I got named on that, I was like,
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  Speaker 2: the this is a slave for me, but like, I'm
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: really sorry. It does not mean I am a trillionaire.
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  Speaker 2: So sorry, but I really resonate with that. And I
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  Speaker 2: think that in our space one of the reasons why
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: that happens is there.
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  Speaker 5: Is still more work to do. There are still.
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  Speaker 2: More women that aren't financially literate and deserve to be.
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  Speaker 2: And I think you can't just look at one thing
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  Speaker 2: and be like, oh, well I've made it. Well we haven't,
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  Speaker 2: because like I would love to think and I'm sure
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  Speaker 2: you're very similar, like my job will be done when
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: I am redundant, and people like Victoria why are you
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: talking about financial literacy? We all have financial literacy that
• 10:31
  Speaker 2: is so dumb. Like I would love people to think
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  Speaker 2: that my job wasn't necessary, and I just think it
• 10:38
  Speaker 2: is so necessary because there are still people that need help,
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  Speaker 2: and as you said before, all of those communities that
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: slip through the cracks, they need the voice that you have,
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  Speaker 2: and you do it so well. Do you cry a
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  Speaker 2: lot when you get those messages, because like I can't
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  Speaker 2: deal with them.
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  Speaker 3: It's very very kind. We got one, hmm, it's probably
• 10:57
  Speaker 3: about two months ago. Now we get so frequently. It's
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: just so kind. This one really hit me though. It
• 11:04
  Speaker 3: was like I am eighteen. I was houseless. It was
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: not even thinking about college for the first time. I
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: like have a roof over my head. I have like
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: something to live for, Like I can't even get through
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: without like getting a little choked out, but like I
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: have something to live for now. And I was just
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: like okay, like it was wolf, like wow, I love it.
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  Speaker 3: That's why you do it. That one was especially just
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: like hit me where it hurts. But yeah, it's like
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  Speaker 3: what I researched over and over for my book. And
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: I actually just got off another interview where we talked
• 11:40
  Speaker 3: about this is it's like there's so many aspects of
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: our world, like money aside, finance aside, that are just
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: so committed to women depriving themselves, depleting themselves, being the
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  Speaker 3: like skeleton version of themselves in order for other people
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: to be comfortable. And I both mean that in an
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: altruistic way of like we sacrifice so much so that
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: other people can have it, but also like in the
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: more manipulative way, like women are shrinking or made to
• 12:13
  Speaker 3: be small so that the patriarchy can stand. And I
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: want a world where every single person, but especially every
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: single woman, has joy and pleasure and ease and stability
• 12:28
  Speaker 3: and safety. And that's what money can buy you. I
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: say this in my book, But like there's this narrative
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: that money can't buy you happiness. Like money can buy
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: you happiness, It can buy you all of those things.
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: It can buy you safety and a clean, safe apartment
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: and a good car that isn't going to break down
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: on you, and a vacation to recharge and escape from
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: a job that deprives you, like money can buy you happiness.
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: And these narratives exist to make you believe that you
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: are not worthy of all of the beautiful things in life,
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: all of the beautiful, joyful things. And in addition, when
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: you are stable and safe and content, you get to
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: then change the status quo and the narrative for everybody else.
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: This whole world exists in this patriarchal capitalist way to
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: deprive ourselves of any joy or again like limit the
• 13:25
  Speaker 3: fullest versions of ourselves to make other people comfortable, to
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: fit into society's version of ourselves. And these messages are
• 13:36
  Speaker 3: the coolest thing for me because again it shows it's
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: like when you get your financial shit together, everything else
• 13:43
  Speaker 3: opens up for you.
• 13:45
  Speaker 2: And that's what's most exciting because I look at you,
• 13:47
  Speaker 2: know you are massive on TikTok adore like the fact
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: that you show up so consistently, like girl Dad is
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: a fait in itself, Like I cannot. I am so envious.
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: When I look at your content, I'm like this woman,
• 13:59
  Speaker 2: she is committed.
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  Speaker 3: Oh it's exhausting, but that's a whole other conversation.
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: Oh I can imagine. I do like one TikTok a month,
• 14:07
  Speaker 2: and I'm like over and out, babes bye. But what
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: you do so well is advocate for women but also
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: teach women to advocate for themselves. And there's a quote
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: that I love and I say all the time in
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: my community. In my community is so bored of me
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: saying it. But like a rising kidlifts soulships and you
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: do this so well. And I feel like for the
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: longest time, media committle aged white men have had their audacity,
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: and their audacity is meant that we don't have a voice,
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: and we don't have a place. And when we finally
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: realize that we probably should, we don't know how to
• 14:43
  Speaker 2: advocate for ourselves or stand up or even stand up
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: for those around us. Where do we start? What do
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: we do?
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: I think in terms of just personal finance in general,
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: there's a reason I laid my book out like this.
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: The first chapter my book, Financial Feminists, is about the
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: emotions of money, because a lot of our colleagues literally
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: just start with, like what's the budgeting method? Or like
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: learn how to set financial goals, and like those things
• 15:11
  Speaker 3: are helpful, but they can't happen until you do some
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: emotional unpacking, like money is not about math. I wish
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: more people understood this because again my not so conspiracy
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: conspiracy theory is that women have been told that money
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: is about math. But we were also told, at least
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: in the United States, growing up as women that like
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: girls were bad at math and that boys were good
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: at math.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: Oh, of course women are the worst at math according
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: to our education system as well.
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: Right, So I think that's mostly a narrative that we're told.
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: And then we're also told that personal finance is about
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: like Excel spreadsheets and mathematical equations, and it's actually not.
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: It's about your emotions, it's about your psychology, it's about
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: how you feel. If you can understand what your brain
• 15:55
  Speaker 3: and body do before you make a purchase, if you
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: can understand what your brain and body do before making
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: some sort of financial decision, you can start to unpack
• 16:06
  Speaker 3: a lot of how to be better with money. But
• 16:09
  Speaker 3: only when you start to figure out this is my
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: mindset around money, This is what I've been believing about money,
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: Just like we were talking about before. One of the
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: narratives I talk about in the first chapter is it's
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: like you've been told that money can't buy you happiness.
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: You've also been told that you shouldn't talk about money.
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: Why have you been told you shouldn't talk about money
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: to keep you underpaid and overworked, Like that's it. That's
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: why we don't talk about money. We are more likely
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: statistically to talk about sex, death, politics, religion, any other
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: uncomfortable topic before we'll talk about money. And the reason
• 16:40
  Speaker 3: behind all of that is it's rooted in shame. It's
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: rooted in shame, it's rooted in fear, it's rooted in anxiety,
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: it's in judgment as opposed to, like I was saying before,
• 16:51
  Speaker 3: the joy and the stability and the ease and the safety.
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: So the first thing you really have to do is
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: you have to start understanding what narratives am I believing
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: about money? What narratives am I believing about the word rich?
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: What narratives am I believing about my ability to make
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: money or my ability to manage my money on my own?
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: And the exercise I give in the book is to
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: think about the first money memory you have. What is
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: the first time you remember thinking about money? For me,
• 17:20
  Speaker 3: I was a theater kid, right I was saving my
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: quarters in an Altoid's tin to like go see Annie
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: the musical because my mom taught me if I wanted
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: to go, I needed to save my money.
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: That's also such a wholesome musical to want to see.
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: It's so oh, I loved Annie. That was my dream
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: was so like being Annie someday.
• 17:39
  Speaker 5: So the altoids tan.
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: It got filled, Yes, it got filled. But here's the deal.
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: It was quarters and pennies and the ticket probably cost
• 17:46
  Speaker 3: twenty five bucks and I did not have that. My
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: parents were gonna pay the whole time. Like I was five,
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: I had no like earned income source. But I saved
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: my money because I wanted it right, And so I
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: was being taught by my parents, if you want something,
• 18:00
  Speaker 3: you have to say for it, and like, that's how
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: this goes. When I ask people what their first money
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: memory is, and I would love to hear yours, most
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: of them are not as positive. Right it is I
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: showed up at school and realized I didn't have enough
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: money for school lunch, or I saw my parents fight
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: about money, or my first money memory was realizing we
• 18:21
  Speaker 3: just didn't have any of it. And what sort of
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: beliefs then did you start to build around money based
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: on how your parents manage money, based on the behaviors
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: and the outlook of your childhood growing up? Right? I
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: had another person who told me, oh, well, you know,
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: we would go over to my friend's house and they
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: were really really rich, but they were terrible people, and
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: so I thought, rich people are terrible people, like people
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: who have money are bad people, Like money makes you
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: a bad person. So that's the start. And it's really
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: mess right, like feels like therapy like it's.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: It does, and it's overwhelming because it means admitting something
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: about yourself.
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: We talk about it all the time in our community.
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: When I started my podcast, I literally started it because
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: I had a Facebook group and I really wanted the
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: information out there because people, as you know, they always
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: start with the first same few questions. And I was like,
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: you know what, if I just do twelve recordings, I
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: will have mastered it, Tori, I would have done it,
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: Like that's all I'll ever need. Five hundred episodes later,
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: I'm like still being.
• 19:31
  Speaker 5: Like, I still have more shit to talk about.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: But my first episode was called money Stories, and you
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: need to understand where you came from and what your
• 19:39
  Speaker 2: money story is, what you think, you feel, you act,
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: you behave around money, because that wasn't your fault. Like
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: you grew up around money with these preconceived ideas of
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: how they worked and what they looked like. Because that's
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: what was ingrained in you and the second you realize
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: that that defines your current thought pattern. But the beautiful
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: thing about money stories is you can create your own
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: from here, like we can change it, we can do
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: whatever we want to do. Like that's my favorite thing.
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: And when I think about money, I had the very
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: beautiful experience of having a dad who was an accountant.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: He loved telling us about money and budgeting and what
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: that meant. But also I was really bad with money
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: because sometimes even with the best support around you, you're
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: not ready to hear it.
• 20:24
  Speaker 5: Do you think I wanted my accountant dad to run
• 20:27
  Speaker 5: my first job?
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: I was like, why are you telling me?
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: Dad?
• 20:30
  Speaker 5: To save ten percent of my income always?
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: And then it'll compound over time. Ill, don't you realize
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: I have to go to the movies? Like, are you
• 20:38
  Speaker 2: not understanding that after school at four o'clock, the girls
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: from my school are going to go to McDonald's.
• 20:44
  Speaker 5: They're going to get some ice cream, then they're going
• 20:46
  Speaker 5: to walk to the movies.
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: I need to be involved in that, don't you understand?
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: So I feel like it's such a cool thing to
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: be able to reflect on it. But I think that
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: so many people they judge themselves and then define themselves
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: by what they thought a money belief and behavior was,
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: when in reality, like, if you have limiting beliefs about money,
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: we can fix them. But if you have them and
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: you hold on to them, we can't actually create the
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: life you deserve, Like you deserve so much more, like
• 21:15
  Speaker 2: and I feel like I just always want to scoop
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: up my community and be like, you deserve so much more,
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: and I want to give it to you.
• 21:20
  Speaker 5: But first you've got to take the first step, Like.
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: I can't pull your head out of the sand for you.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: You've got to do it. How do we pull our
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: heads out of the sand? What do we do? Like,
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: you know, what's the first step for standing up and
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: being like, no, actually, Tory, you're right, I do deserve more.
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: How do we do that? Because I don't have or
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: I do, let's be honest. And I think you've got
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: it too. I definitely have the audacity of a mediocre,
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: middle aged white man. And when I step into your
• 21:45
  Speaker 2: shoes they fit really well and keep doing it.
• 21:47
  Speaker 5: But how does everybody else do that? When that is
• 21:50
  Speaker 5: really scary.
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: It's really funny you say, pull your head out of
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: the sand, because after chapter one. Chapter two is what
• 21:57
  Speaker 3: I call the Ostrich effects, which is your head in
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: the sand, acting your problems don't exist.
• 22:02
  Speaker 2: What is that a thing?
• 22:03
  Speaker 5: To Ostridches bury their heads in this We don't have ostridges.
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: Actually they don't. That's a whole other thing. But they
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: were believed too, which is why we call it the
• 22:10
  Speaker 3: Ostrich effect. I actually do start I think chapter two
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: with facts about ostriches. I literally I'm like, Hi, before
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: we get into the rest of this chapter, we're gonna
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: talk about ostriches have two stomachs. Do you know that? No?
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: I didn't something I learned researching my book. You think
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: it's a finance book. Not it'st I'm here for it.
• 22:26
  Speaker 3: I love animals and money. You was selling me on this.
• 22:30
  Speaker 3: But yeah, actually that's a whole other thing. Because I
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: actually did google because I was curious do ostrich just
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: bury their head in the sand, And there was like
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: this whole like academic article where it's like, for many
• 22:38
  Speaker 3: many years I would believe to have buried the head,
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: but that they actually don't anyway, so they call it
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: the Ostrich effect. At least in the United States with personal finance,
• 22:45
  Speaker 3: it's like bury head in the sand, acting your problems
• 22:47
  Speaker 3: don't exist. The good thing about that it temporarily feels
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: good because you're just like I will handle that later.
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: Investing too complicated, I'll learn it later. Paint off my
• 22:58
  Speaker 3: debt too foolish, shame and fear, and I don't want
• 23:01
  Speaker 3: to log into my debt, so we'll do that later.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: We see this especially again in television shows. I mentioned
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: this also in my book of like Nick from New
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: Girl he has a you know, box of bills in
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: his closet. Andy in April from Parks and Recreation have
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: all of their bills frozen in a freezer like this
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: is a very common trope because I think a lot
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: of people deal with this, So the Ostrich effect totally normal.
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: Because again, the narrative that you've been taught is shame
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: shame about your money. You should feel ashamed of your
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: past choices. You should feel ashamed that you don't know
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: more about money. And so rather than make a decision
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: that might be wrong, we're going to make no decision
• 23:40
  Speaker 3: at all. And I see this so many times with women.
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: Is we get in this analysis paralysis. We feel like
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: we need to make the perfect choice, so we either
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: spend years researching because it gives us the feeling of
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: doing something.
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: We're taking steps, right.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: It's like I just need to google this one more thing,
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: and then when I've done that, I will make the decision.
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: But then suddenly you're three hours into a Google rabbit hole.
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: So the analysis paralysis is real. And then also again
• 24:10
  Speaker 3: just the shame. So the first thing we have to
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: do to actually like start doing actionable things about our
• 24:16
  Speaker 3: money is get comfortable being uncomfortable. And again, this is
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: not about math. It's about your emotions. It's about releasing
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: any shame in judgment and saying, you know what, I'm
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: going to look at this like I'm an anthropologist in
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: my own life. Oh interesting, I bought that pair of
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: shoes I didn't need and didn't want because I had
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: a terrible day at work. Interesting. That's it. You are
• 24:39
  Speaker 3: just observing your behavior and observing what's going on without
• 24:44
  Speaker 3: any sort of emotion loaded into it. No judgment, no shame,
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: no fear, no anxiety. Same thing with your debt. You're
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: literally gonna start totaling your accounts. Where does the debt live,
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: what is the interest rate? How much debt do I have?
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: You can do this for all of your credit cards,
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: your student loans, your mortgage if you have one. That's
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: a whole other conversation. I don't know how it is
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: in Australia. You can't buy a house here.
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: Oh no, you can't buy a house here. I did
• 25:11
  Speaker 2: a presentation the other day, Tory. You would have heard
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: of the like avocado fallacy right where, like.
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the avocado test.
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, if you buy less avocado toast, you're gonna
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: be able to afford a house. And I did this
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: like presentation at a university about like the property market.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: And I was like, sit down, let's go back to
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: nineteen seventy five. In nineteen seventy five, you could buy
• 25:31
  Speaker 2: a house and it was worth four times your annual income.
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: Today in Australia, to buy a house it is twenty
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: seven times your annual income. If our incomes had kept
• 25:40
  Speaker 2: up with inflation in Australia, your average Australian income would
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: be one hundred and sixty two thousand dollars. But it
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: is not, my friend, The average Australian income is sixty
• 25:50
  Speaker 2: five thousand dollars. And you'all out here is thinking that
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: we can buy property. We can't buy property.
• 25:54
  Speaker 5: Because the economy is cooked.
• 25:57
  Speaker 3: So the biggest thing is like starting to get comfortab
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: being uncomfortable of listing out your debt, listing out if
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: you do have savings, where does that live, and then
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: you can start making a plan. We can't make a
• 26:09
  Speaker 3: plan till we know the lay of the land. Yes
• 26:11
  Speaker 3: I'm a poet, didn't even know it. But like we
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: can't start putting a budget together, we can't start setting
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: goals until we've worked through our emotions number one and
• 26:19
  Speaker 3: started to understand that and started to understand the narratives
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: we've been believing about money. And then two, we have
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: to understand what is our current financial picture, even if
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: it's messy, even if it's really anxiety inducing, because you
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: can't start making steps forward until you know what's going on.
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: So listing out your debts, listing out your accounts, listening
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: out your interest rates if you don't know your interest rates,
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: that's a great place to start start calling people. Look
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: at your terms and conditions, Like, you have to understand
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: how all of this works before we can then start
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: making decisions about it.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: I agree. I just feel like that's the most empowering
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: thing you can do. And the second you start doing that,
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: you get really inquisitive and you start looking at things
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: and you start talking to your girlfriends, like you might
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: be talking to your girlfriends or work about it, and
• 27:04
  Speaker 2: you're like, oh, this is interesting, and you're right. It's
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: picking up that piece and going no judgment, no shame,
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: no anything, just going, well, that's interesting. Actually that really
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: helps me to understand a little bit more about me.
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: And like, you're the best person to understand the most
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: about you, and you deserve to know about you, So
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: let's keep doing that. I feel like it's the same
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: and like everybody, even people like you, have probably gone
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: through that. We're like far out. I didn't realize I
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: made that money decision because of this emotion or this
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: outcome or how that works. And I think that by
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: just talking about it, even just consuming content online, that's
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: more relative. Like you don't have to go straight out
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: and start talking about your income to people if that
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: makes you uncomfortable, like start small, but start stepping in
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: the right direction, because money shouldn't be something that we
• 27:51
  Speaker 2: feel ashamed to talk about. I look at not just
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: your content, but content of American creators, and I'm always
• 27:57
  Speaker 2: in awe because I'm always like, oh my gosh, the
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: confidence they have, like and the way that they often
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: support each other is so crazy cool. And in Australia
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: we have this thing called tall Poppy syndrome where you know,
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: the second someone's really successful, they feel like, Okay, now
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: we're going to cut you down. Like it's as though
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: in Australia and I'm going to get in trouble for
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: saying this, but I also don't really care. It's almost
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: like people want you to do well, but they never
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: want you to do better than them, and the second
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: that you look like you're doing better than them, well
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: it's time to rip them to shreds Now. I have
• 28:32
  Speaker 2: seen it time and time again in comment sections of
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: people being like what would you know? How do you
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: do this? What does that look like? How do you,
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: as a woman in a country like the USA deal
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: with this? Because I feel like your political system, your
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: you know everything system is working so hard against your success.
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: How does tall Poppy syndrome affect you? How are you
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: overcoming that? How do we seek inspiration? And from that
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: it's like women supporting women, but then it's like the
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: government against the women. How do you deal with this?
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: How do you still not go to sleep every night
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: and cry.
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: Y'all can't see me, but I'm literally like my neck
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: is breaking from just like nodding my head emphatically. So
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: many things here. First, like we were talking about before
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: society is built so that women hate themselves.
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: I mean that makes a lot of people a lot
• 29:24
  Speaker 2: of money. So like this story checks out, we.
• 29:27
  Speaker 3: Want to talk about just like the diet industry is
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: a multi billion dollar industry that's.
• 29:32
  Speaker 5: A women's Roman empire.
• 29:34
  Speaker 2: I'm convinced, oh totally, and is selling you on a
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: complete myth.
• 29:39
  Speaker 3: Diets don't work. We know this. Ninety eight ninety nine
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: percent of diets don't work because the more you tell
• 29:44
  Speaker 3: me I can't have fried chicken, the more I want
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: fried chicken. Like that doesn't work. And deprivation does not work.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: Like it's not about willpower, it's not about like how
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: badly you want it, it's literal psychology. It does not work.
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: And that's the perfect example of where sold this lie
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: that you need to be as thin as possible, you
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: need to take up the least amount of space possible
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: and hate yourself doing it. Cut out everything that brings
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: you joy, cut out anything that makes you happy and
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: deprive yourself in order to get this thing that you
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: think you really want, but you don't want it. You've
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: just been told you should want it. Perfect example of
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: what's going on with every single industry, with every single
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: space is when you show up as the fullest version
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: of yourself, inevitably what happens is the patriarchy feels threatened
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: by you. Again, I'm gonna sound like a broken record.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: I talk about this in my book even in Childhood,
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: like if we bring it really really far back. I
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: did a lot of research around the sort of narratives
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: or sort of like child rearing that we do. And
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: I'm going to use the gender binary here for ease.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: But like four boys and four girls, boys and even
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: the toys they are given are taught self reliance. They're
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: taught innovation, They're taught how to build right like Legos truck.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: These are what we give boys. We are telling them
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: that their value to society is and how they're contributing
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: in terms of their brains. Right, they're smart, they're again
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: self actualized. How can you show up again? It's the
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: biggest version of yourself And that's what we're teaching boys.
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: What do we give girls.
• 31:22
  Speaker 2: We give them toy ironing boards.
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: We give them dolls, we give them bridal veils, we
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: give them playhouses. Right, this is not me trying to
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: cancel Barbie. I love the Barbie movie.
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: No, no, we love Barbie. But we want Barbie and
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: the blocks so we can build the Barbie dreamhouse ourselves.
• 31:37
  Speaker 5: Like, we're not canceling Barbie.
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: Those things are fine, but stop telling me that I
• 31:42
  Speaker 2: have to play house in a house that's already made,
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: because there's no possible way I could have built that myself.
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: We give a two year old girl another child to
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: take care of.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: That's gross.
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: We are telling girls that their value is in how
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: much they give of themselves. How altruistic are you? How
• 31:59
  Speaker 3: much are you sacrificing yourself to care for other people? Now,
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: I am really beautifully glad that women are taught selflessness.
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: I am not mad about that. I think that's a
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: beautiful trait. But the issue is that we're not teaching
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: boys the same thing. So what happens as we age?
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: What happens as we grow up and we start becoming
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: more financially confident, we start showing up as the fullest
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: version of ourselves. We start talking about accomplishments. We start
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: progressing in our careers and in our relationships and in
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: our money, our altruism gets weaponized. There's a weaponization of
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: the altruism that is taught to us because you're no
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: longer controllable when you have money, when you have agency,
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: when you have stability, you're no longer controllable. And the
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: patriarchy panics. They go, We're not gonna be able to
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: control her anymore. We're going to cut her down. We're
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: going to tell her, Actually, you bragging about your accomplishments
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: is really tacky. We're going to tell her that. M
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: you know what. I don't know how much you spent
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: on that, but that feels like a waste of your
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: money and it could have gone to these other things
• 33:07
  Speaker 3: that I'm deeming are a better use from a random
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: person on the internet. Right, the patriarchy tells you that
• 33:16
  Speaker 3: your altruism is the number one priority. Now this isn't
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: pours your money and be selfish. I want to be
• 33:23
  Speaker 3: so clear.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: Oh no, absolutely not, None of that is true.
• 33:27
  Speaker 3: I'm anti capitalist over here. It's not about that. But
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: it is so interesting that when women are successful, the
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: patriarchy panics, it weaponizes our altruism against us. But we
• 33:41
  Speaker 3: absolutely worship men with money. We worship men with success.
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: We worship men with good careers and Rolex watches and
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: a nice suit like we worship that. And especially in
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: the United States and a very individualistic culture, we worship that.
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: So if you, as an individual are show gowing up
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: as the fullest version of yourself and pissing people off, great, solid.
• 34:04
  Speaker 5: And if they don't like it, you know what they
• 34:06
  Speaker 5: can do.
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: They can go find less.
• 34:08
  Speaker 3: If you are showing up in a relationship and a
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: person feels threatened, typically a man. If you're dating men,
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: like that's not the person for you. If you are
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: showing up at a job and they don't like that
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: you are succeeding, or that your coworkers don't like it,
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: You're succeeding. Okay, great, too bad, Like the biggest thing
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: we can do as individuals. Again, I mean it sounds
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: like a broken record. We started this the same way,
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: but like it's the fullest version of yourself. Is a
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: form of protest against a system that constantly demands you
• 34:39
  Speaker 3: play small. So with tall poppy syndrome. I know because
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: I have friends in Australia. I have friends in the UK.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: It's very very common there. It feels like almost gross
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: to be successful. It does because you're like so worried,
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: like is everybody gonna hate me? It's like a bubble.
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: We have a bit of that here in the US.
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: I think there's I think it's less. But I also like,
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: as harsh as this sounds, if you don't have people
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: in your life, if you're not in situations in your
• 35:09
  Speaker 3: life that will celebrate you making choices that are right
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: for you, get new friends. It sounds so bad.
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: No, that's great advice.
• 35:18
  Speaker 3: Get new friends, get a new partner, get a new job, Like,
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: as long as you are not hurting yourself or others.
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: If your choices make you happy, great. If your choices
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: make you happy but no one gets the fine. Oh
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: I'm getting really philosophical today. I'm so sorry, But like
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: I like this. The only person you have to answer
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: to when your head hits the pillow, even if somebody's
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: next to you on the other pillow, Like, the only
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: person you have to answer to is you. So if
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: your life doesn't fight you on fire, time to get
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: a new life, Like, time to get a new one.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: It's true, like you deserve so much more, So go
• 35:53
  Speaker 2: and get it because it's there for the taking with
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: the right education and the right steps and the right people.
• 35:57
  Speaker 2: And I always say to my community, if your friends
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: munchampioning you, I will champion you. I will be that
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: person that tells you to go find more, because your
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: friends they deserve less if they're going to be like that.
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: I will also say, with all of this, this is
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: only able to happen for the things we can control.
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: This is what my book acknowledges, what my podcast acknowledges. Yes,
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: I can tell you like, go live your best life,
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: live your big dreams. But at the end of the day,
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: there is racism and sexism and homophobia and ableism, and
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: a trillion dollar student death crisis and stagnating minimum wages
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: in this country, a lack of paid family leave and
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: all of these things. So it has to be coupled
• 36:38
  Speaker 3: with systemic change, like control the things that you can control,
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: show up as the best version of yourself. Get financially educated,
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: Understand how to put a budget together that supports your goals.
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: Understand how to start investing so you can build your wealth.
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: Do what you can to find a good paying job
• 36:54
  Speaker 3: that doesn't deplete you, and that gives you flexibility and options.
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: But at the end of the day, personal finance is
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: about twenty percent those things in eighty percent circumstances. It's
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: about eighty percent systemic issues. And that's where we need
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: government support, policy, change a new system, control the things
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: you can control, and then all of the rest of
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: this has to change in order for us to live
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: in a more pleasurable, more safe, more equitable society. And
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: I always when I do, you know, talk about like
• 37:26
  Speaker 3: making changes in your life, I always want to acknowledge
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: for the person that's listening, and I know you. I
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: can see you. You're like with your headphones going like okay,
• 37:34
  Speaker 3: that's great, but like I don't make shit at work,
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: or you know, I've tried and I can't pay off
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: my debt because I don't make enough money. So know
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: that I see you and that I understand that at
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: a certain point, choices are not available to you if
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: you don't have the financial means to do so. I
• 37:52
  Speaker 3: don't have an answer. The answer is to vote. The
• 37:54
  Speaker 3: answer is to change policy. The answer is to support
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: legislators and legislation you want to see but beyond that, again,
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: you and I I think work to focus people on
• 38:04
  Speaker 3: controlling the things that they can control and then changing
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: the rest of it for everybody else.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: One hundred percent. Like we'll do the big stuff if
• 38:10
  Speaker 2: we can, Like we'll use our voices to do that.
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: You don't have to do that, you can take the
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: small steps. Tory, I think we should run off for
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: a very quick break because I need a tea. But
• 38:21
  Speaker 2: also when we come back, I want to talk about
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: overcoming those barriers a bit more and building some confidence
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: to stand up for yourself. So guys, don't go anywhere.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: I am back with Tory, who is from her first
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: one hundred K, and we have been what would you say,
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: passionately chatting about our experiences as women in finance, and
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: I think it is beautiful to touch pace on I
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: guess how people can combat it. I really liked what
• 38:50
  Speaker 2: you said at the end of the first break that
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: you know, we do see that it's struggle, and we
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: do see that it is really hard. And sometimes you
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: listen to stuff, especially cuss like this, and you're like,
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: I want to just throw my phone in the bin
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: because I picked up this podcast and I just feel
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: like I can't achieve a lot because the world works
• 39:09
  Speaker 2: against you in a way. I follow you on TikTok.
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: I love your content. I don't think that is a surprise.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: You probably see my posts all the time and basically
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: like louder amen, like I'm just hanging out in the
• 39:20
  Speaker 2: back while also not posting my own content, Like I'm
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: just your personal hyt girl at this point. But you
• 39:26
  Speaker 2: did a TikTok the other day and you were recently
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: asked after talking about being get these New York Times
• 39:34
  Speaker 2: bestseller You're like a Forbes thirty under thirty. You're doing
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: all this and the audacity of a guy to stand
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: up to say, what were your credentials?
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: Ah?
• 39:44
  Speaker 5: Like, I nearly threw my phone at the wall.
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: Why do you think that question is asked of somebody
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: who quite clearly is incredibly articulate and passionate and obviously educated.
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: You don't have to ask about credentials because I can
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: tell that you I know your shit, But like, why
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: will you ask that? And when other women are asked that,
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: how should we respond when our authority in our space
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: is questioned?
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: You will appreciate this not to go to in the weeds.
• 40:15
  Speaker 3: I was speaking to a bunch of financial advisors.
• 40:17
  Speaker 2: No, you weren't, dah.
• 40:19
  Speaker 3: It was a lot of like, how is this TikTok
• 40:22
  Speaker 3: social media star qualified to like give financial advice?
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: So weird? I know more than you bye.
• 40:29
  Speaker 3: And they also meant like regulation and like basically was
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: asking like do you have a degree in finance? This
• 40:36
  Speaker 3: is again a larger conversation in the weeds, but like
• 40:38
  Speaker 3: in the United States, there's certain things that you can't
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: say if you have like a CFP, a certified financial
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: planner like license or degree, and there's certain things you
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: can't say. So again, that didn't make us sexy of
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: a TikTok, but someone did come up to me. I'm like,
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: keynoting this massive conference. I got paid twenty five k
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: to be there. Holy Holy, I am literally signing copies
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: of my New York Times bestselling book. And he's like,
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: it was really interesting what you had to say, which
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: is always what men say to.
• 41:03
  Speaker 2: Really interesting what you had to say.
• 41:04
  Speaker 3: And then he was like, so, basically, how are you
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: able to do what you do? What are your credentials? Yeah?
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: The irony is yeah, I literally have a book open
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: in front of me and I'm signing my name on it.
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: I'm just like, here you go. I'm doing just fine, sir.
• 41:17
  Speaker 5: Well, so don't ask a question you could have googled.
• 41:20
  Speaker 5: It makes you look really dumb.
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: Really, it's just bad. But like I get TikTok comments
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: all the time of like, oh, if you're a millionaire,
• 41:26
  Speaker 3: you're not because you don't look rich, like men tell
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: me like you don't look rich, or your hair's bad,
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: or like if you were a millionaire, you'd live in
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: a better house than that.
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: So what you are seeing is that living my life
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: in a hoodie is a privilege. Get out of your
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: uncomfortable pencil skirt.
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: I wore an Australian hoodie for you today. I bought
• 41:45
  Speaker 3: this actually in a New Zealand. I'm so sorry, but
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: it is an Australian brand and I love it.
• 41:48
  Speaker 2: I love this.
• 41:49
  Speaker 5: I'll send you one of our She's on the Money
• 41:50
  Speaker 5: hoodies you need much?
• 41:52
  Speaker 3: Oh my god, I would love that. So yeah, I
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: think that this is back to our conversation about like
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: women playing big in a space patriarchy feel bad, like
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: weaponize altruism, Like that's what's happening. Woman shows up as
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: fullest version of herself patriarchy, panics because realizes she's no
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: longer controllable, tries to cut you down. Now, you have
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: two potential responses. One, which is totally understandable, is to
• 42:17
  Speaker 3: be like, holy shit, am I not qualified to be here?
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: Am I not qualified to have this job? Am I
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: not qualified to show up and speak at this event?
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: Am I not qualified to do these things? Or do
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: I not say my accomplishments for fear of pissing somebody
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: else off? That is totally understandable, But that is not
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: the right answer.
• 42:36
  Speaker 5: It's the wrong answer.
• 42:37
  Speaker 3: The second answer is to show up anyway and understand
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: that the girls that get it get it, and the
• 42:42
  Speaker 3: girls that don't don't. Like there will be people who
• 42:46
  Speaker 3: don't understand what you do, and that's okay. It's okay.
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: And I think, especially as a business owner, this is
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: actually advice I give to a lot of business owners
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: or people who want to be business owners. Is we
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: feel like we have to appeal to everybody. We feel
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: like we have to serve everybody because everybody it's our
• 43:00
  Speaker 3: potential customer, and like we really want to make sure
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: that we get the money and get clients in order
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: to like support this business. And again you can translate
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: this even if you're not a business owner. I want
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: to make sure that nobody hates me, right, like I
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: want to make sure that everybody likes me and that
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: everything's great. And we know this I'm adding myself to
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: because I am a Leslie. Nope, I want to be
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: liked by everybody, like even I have to remind myself
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: of this. Even if you try to be liked by everybody,
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: Like if you were the best person for the job
• 43:30
  Speaker 3: of trying to be liked by everybody, somebody out there
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: would still not like you. So you have to again
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: understand that the only person you have to answer to
• 43:37
  Speaker 3: is you. The only person you have to answer to
• 43:39
  Speaker 3: with your choices and your decisions is you. And if
• 43:44
  Speaker 3: there are certain people that don't get what you're trying
• 43:48
  Speaker 3: to do, that's okay. Like this lovely man who was
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: probably about sixty years old and was a straight white
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: guy asking me like, I think he meant it very
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: well intentionally, but he doesn't understand how it comes across.
• 44:03
  Speaker 3: He's not my audience, and that's okay. He's not the
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: people I'm trying to appeal to. He doesn't get it.
• 44:08
  Speaker 3: The girls that get it, get it, and the girls
• 44:10
  Speaker 3: that don't don't and that's okay. But again, this is
• 44:13
  Speaker 3: back to if we show up as the fullest versions
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: of ourselves the patriarchy, and by patriarchy I sometimes mean men,
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: but what I mean really is like the deeply rooted
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: notion or narrative that someone else's success means some sort
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: of threat to us. This like narrative that we've been
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: told that there's one seat at the table, or that
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: if somebody else is succeeding, it means I can't also succeed.
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: Or it also feels like a call out. Sometimes if
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: you know you're capable of greatness, whatever greatness looks like
• 44:45
  Speaker 3: for you, and somebody else is doing great things, it
• 44:48
  Speaker 3: can feel like this mirror where you're like, holy shit,
• 44:51
  Speaker 3: this person has that, why don't I have that? And
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: then again you have a choice. You have the opportunity
• 44:56
  Speaker 3: to either go, wow, I'm gonna use this person in
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: their story as inspiration for me to motivate me. Or
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: you can be mean on the internet. You can ask, well,
• 45:04
  Speaker 3: what is the reason that I don't like them? What
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: is the thing I can find that again devalues them,
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: devalues their experience makes them look small. So yeah, I
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: mean all roads lead back to patriarchy, oh.
• 45:17
  Speaker 5: One hundred percent. And isn't that frustrating?
• 45:20
  Speaker 2: Like I have had my authority questioned multiple times, especially
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: as an Australian, and I am in the really fun
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: position where I do get to snap back because I
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: was a financial advisor. I'm now a retired financial advisor.
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: And I don't just have one degree. I got a
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: whole bunch of them, and I have an MBA, So
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: sit the hell down. It's like, you know when they
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: always say, like you learn more on the job, Like
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: I learned more about finance and personal finance and the
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: things that are important to my community, not through my degrees.
• 45:48
  Speaker 5: To me, they mean nothing.
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: In fact, I look at them and I go, that
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: was a whole heap of debt that I got myself
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: into to get to a position that I arguably was
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: already passionate about, already excited about, and could have just
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: learnt more on the job. So to me, they didn't
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: make me, They didn't help me. They might make a
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: mediocre middle aged white man shut the hell up. And
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: that's good for a hot second. But I just feel
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: like having your authority questioned, I love it, do you
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: know why? Because it means they're a little bit uncomfortable,
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: and I love making men uncomfortable. It is my favorite.
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: And I also then like to drop back and I
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: think that you'll get a laugh out of this. But like,
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: if people like to question me, I like to act
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: really dumb and be like, oh, what do you mean
• 46:30
  Speaker 2: and get them to explain themselves or I go, oh
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: my gosh, so sorry. I'm the worst at picking up
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: on tone. Was that meant to be helpful or harmful?
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 46:38
  Speaker 5: Make them dig their own grave.
• 46:41
  Speaker 3: My favorite question to like men being stupid is just.
• 46:44
  Speaker 5: Tell me more about that, And then they can't.
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: I ask men that all the time.
• 46:48
  Speaker 5: Tell me more about that, tell me a story.
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: Very like level headed. But I'll give them this kind
• 46:53
  Speaker 3: of look. I'll tell my hat a little bit and
• 46:54
  Speaker 3: more like, tell me more about that, and they always
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: back check. They're like, oh, well, this thing my favorite.
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: Oh me too, And this is a larger conversation about
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: imposter syndrome. Like, I'll tell you a story. I can
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: remember the last time I ever felt like an impostor.
• 47:09
  Speaker 3: It was twenty nineteen. Her first under k was still
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: a side hustle. It was one of like my first
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: like big speaking engagements. It felt really big at the time.
• 47:17
  Speaker 3: It was maybe like a crowd of forty people.
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: That's a lot of people, like at the end of
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: the day, Like.
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: Especially at the start, it was very significant.
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: Now, let's just reframe these twenty five k for your
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: last engagement, like queen get it.
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I was on this panel with I think
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: three or four other people. I was the youngest person
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: on that panel by at least a decade. Speaking of
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: the pencil skirts, Like they had the blazers, they had
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: the pencil skirts, they had the financial licenses, and one
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: was a CFP and like one you know, was a
• 47:47
  Speaker 3: venture capitalist. And I'm showing up in this room and
• 47:50
  Speaker 3: I remember thinking, oh, I'm maybe not supposed to be here.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: Like I had my Adidas on for a really long time.
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: I had like the signature leather jacket that I war
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: for everything, Like that's what I had on.
• 48:02
  Speaker 5: I love these I love it so much.
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: And I you know, it was twenty four and was
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: just like, this is gonna be interesting. They're way more
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: qualified than I am. Their resumes are way longer than mine.
• 48:12
  Speaker 3: What am I doing here? And as we got started,
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: I started looking out into the audience and it was
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: all women in their twenties and thirties.
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: They lived for you, my friend, right.
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: They looked like me, they were dressed like me. And
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: I turned, you know, to these very smart people who
• 48:28
  Speaker 3: were very kind and very intelligent, very good at their jobs.
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: But literally one of them started saying words like acid
• 48:35
  Speaker 3: allocation and portfolio diversifying. It was almost comical. I saw
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: every single woman just her eyes glazed over. Of course
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: not because she's stupid, it's just it's jargony stuff that like,
• 48:49
  Speaker 3: because they had been in the industry for so long,
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: they just took as like everybody knows this.
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 48:53
  Speaker 3: And that was the moment where I was like, oh,
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: I'm here for a specific reason. I'm here to make
• 48:59
  Speaker 3: this non ap proachable topic approachable. I'm here to show
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: up as someone who could be like a friend or
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: a sister to this person. I'm here to actually talk
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: about personal finance one oh one as if it's one
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: oh one, not what they think one oh one is.
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: And like that was literally the last moment I've ever
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: had imposter syndrome, because I was like, I'm supposed to
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: be here.
• 49:18
  Speaker 5: You finally knew that that was the room you want men.
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: To be right, I don't have as big of a resume,
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: I haven't been through as many of these things. But
• 49:26
  Speaker 3: I'm here for a particular reason to talk to this
• 49:29
  Speaker 3: particular person. Like that was so helpful for me, and
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: maybe it's helpful for you too. Listener of like showing
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: up in rooms where you might not be the most
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: qualified person, You're there for a different reason. You're there
• 49:43
  Speaker 3: so that people feel less alone. You're there so that
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: people can see themselves in you. You're there to translate
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: jargon like you're there for a different reason, and that
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: reason is just as valid, And I would argue maybe
• 49:56
  Speaker 3: even more valid, because you are the best person that job.
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: I love this. I feel like I've been talking to
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: you forever. You are a very busy woman. I do
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: not want to eat up any more of your time.
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: I feel like you and I could talk about this
• 50:10
  Speaker 2: until the cows come home, And I genuinely cannot wait
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: until we get an opportunity to do this again, Like
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: I will be following you up to be like when
• 50:18
  Speaker 2: can we meet?
• 50:19
  Speaker 5: How much coffee can we drink? And yell at each.
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: Other over like I just I think this is so good,
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: this has been great. But one of my favorite questions
• 50:28
  Speaker 2: to ask people is Tory came on this podcast and
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: you're very generous with your time, and you said, yeah,
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: I'll give the Shees on the Money community a piece
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: of me to help them get ahead. But coming into
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: any interview, what is one question that you wish people
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: would ask you.
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: I get asked a lot of course about like where
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: does somebody get started financially? And I think that's really helpful.
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: I think one of the things that I am most
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: proud of that actually doesn't have anything to do with
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: personal finance is how we've built our business, and I
• 50:59
  Speaker 3: wish more people are about that. Like I said before,
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: we have a team. We have built this company. We
• 51:05
  Speaker 3: have built honestly like a media company. I built that
• 51:10
  Speaker 3: with twenty dollars. Like I signed up for a Squarespace subscription,
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: I bought a domain. Maybe it was forty I think
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: I bought the Squarespace subscription and then I bought the domain,
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: so it's probably about forty bucks. Like I took no
• 51:23
  Speaker 3: outside funding. We don't do paid ads, like we have
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: grown an audience to four million people with organic social media. Now,
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: if you don't work in social media, that is almost
• 51:34
  Speaker 3: impossible to do.
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Like that is the biggest bragging rights in the
• 51:38
  Speaker 2: entire world.
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: It's very difficult, especially with companies like a Meta or
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: a Google that basically tank your organic content.
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: If you're not paying.
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: And I had this background in social media, and I
• 51:52
  Speaker 3: literally worked for companies that would spend hundreds of thousands
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: of dollars a month just on Facebook ads. And now
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: I have a ton of privilege. I want to be
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: clear about that. That's a huge part of my story.
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: I'm a cisgendered white woman who you know, graduated college
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: debt free because she worked through college but also had
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: parents to help pay. Like, I have a lot of privileges,
• 52:12
  Speaker 3: but I didn't have this like rich uncle who swooped
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: in was like, here's some investment money for your business. Like,
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: I am really really proud of what I have been
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: able to do as an individual, what our team has
• 52:23
  Speaker 3: been able to do, what our community stands for creating
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: a mission and values based company to teach women how
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: to navigate the financial system, but also working to take
• 52:35
  Speaker 3: this community and give them both an individual purpose and
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: a collective purpose. And the fact that I didn't ask
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: for outside money to do that. I haven't paid for ads,
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: Like I'm really proud of that.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: I am in awe of that, Like thank you, especially
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: in America where it is so hard to get ahead,
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: especially as a woman, and to be able to be
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: like I don't spend anything on its. I also didn't
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: take anybody's money. I did THEEPS.
• 53:04
  Speaker 5: I am just ah, I love it so much.
• 53:07
  Speaker 3: Thank you.
• 53:08
  Speaker 5: I'm so glad I asked that.
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: And it's also like, without getting too emotional, like I'm
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: really proud of myself. I've always had a vision for
• 53:16
  Speaker 3: something bigger, but I didn't know that this was it.
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: Like I always make the joke like if you would
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: have told me five years ago, Tory, you're going to
• 53:23
  Speaker 3: be educating people about money, I would have laughed in
• 53:25
  Speaker 3: your face.
• 53:25
  Speaker 5: Same I would have been like that sounds awful.
• 53:27
  Speaker 3: Literally, I like that sounds born as hell.
• 53:29
  Speaker 5: I thought I was going to be a psychologist.
• 53:31
  Speaker 3: Lucas is now like what the goal was to be
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: an actor for me and then a marketer and then
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: like it's turned into this and so it's just really
• 53:39
  Speaker 3: really amazing to see the impact it's had on people's lives.
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: To see the impact it's had on my own life,
• 53:44
  Speaker 3: Like I'm financially independent. That's the other thing that I
• 53:46
  Speaker 3: wish more people asked me about. I was financially independent
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: at twenty seven years old, meaning I never had to
• 53:50
  Speaker 3: work another day in my life if I didn't want to,
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: because I had saved slash invested enough money that I
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: could have hypothetically quit working. Now, I don't want to
• 53:58
  Speaker 3: do that because I like what I do. We have
• 54:00
  Speaker 3: a company now, and we do all these things. I'm
• 54:02
  Speaker 3: proud of that. There's a lot of things I'm proud of.
• 54:03
  Speaker 3: I think with HF and with how I've grown. I
• 54:07
  Speaker 3: don't know how much time we have. But the other
• 54:08
  Speaker 3: thing that I think is really important that I wish
• 54:12
  Speaker 3: we talked more about, just as a society and as
• 54:15
  Speaker 3: people who are public people online, is that it is very,
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: very difficult to be a person online, and we were
• 54:22
  Speaker 3: never meant to be or designed to be, as humans
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: beings that took everybody's opinion and took a million pieces
• 54:32
  Speaker 3: of data all of the time in you know, one
• 54:36
  Speaker 3: ten minute scrolling session on Instagram or TikTok. Like I
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: always think about if I walk down the street and
• 54:42
  Speaker 3: that worked the same way my social media feed did.
• 54:47
  Speaker 3: One person would be so excited to meet me, which
• 54:49
  Speaker 3: would be lovely, and then I'd have five people screaming
• 54:52
  Speaker 3: obscenities or calling me fat to my face.
• 54:56
  Speaker 5: Just it's not the reality, is it.
• 54:59
  Speaker 3: It's not the reality. And it's also like I think
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: most of us are just trying to do the best
• 55:04
  Speaker 3: that we can. We're just trying to show up as
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: the best versions of ourselves, and we are going to
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: make mistakes, and we are also going to sometimes make
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: decisions that other people don't understand because there's information that
• 55:16
  Speaker 3: we have that somebody else doesn't, and we're just trying
• 55:19
  Speaker 3: to do the right thing. And it's really often difficult,
• 55:24
  Speaker 3: even with all of these very flashy measures of success
• 55:27
  Speaker 3: and things that I'm so grateful for. You were talking
• 55:30
  Speaker 3: about showing up on TikTok every day. That is not easy.
• 55:33
  Speaker 2: Oh no, that's why I'm impressed.
• 55:35
  Speaker 5: Obviously, working a nine to five Monday to Friday job
• 55:39
  Speaker 5: is much harder than that.
• 55:40
  Speaker 2: However, Yes, I think it's one of those things where
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: just showing up it takes so much more than the time, right,
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: it takes the energy. It takes me so much emotional
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: energy just to turn up online.
• 55:50
  Speaker 3: And even if you're not an influencer or a public person,
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: like social media is a beautiful way to connect with people,
• 55:56
  Speaker 3: it is also so damaging to your psyche, Like it's
• 55:59
  Speaker 3: so hard to create content, to show up to do
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: that day in or day out, to do that where
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: people are screaming at you and just saying really gross
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: things about you. And again, I don't have an answer,
• 56:13
  Speaker 3: but just like, be kind to people online, like show
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: up as the kindest version of yourself in all aspects
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: of your life. But especially if you're hiding behind this
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: like anonymity, or you're telling somebody that you don't actually
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: know in real life about all of your opinions about
• 56:32
  Speaker 3: their work or about them.
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: It says so much more about them than it ever
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: does about you. And I just don't think they realize that.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: And it's the sad reality of the world because, as
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: you said before, we're all just out here trying to
• 56:44
  Speaker 2: do the best that we can, and your best is
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: obviously way way way up there. But your best is
• 56:51
  Speaker 2: actually just trying to put other people in the best
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: possible position, because you know that a lot of them
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: aren't and they deserve that. And the idea that people
• 56:59
  Speaker 2: don't like that blows my mind, Like the idea that
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: you're just out here trying to help and people hate it.
• 57:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, And just the assumption of positive intent, I think
• 57:11
  Speaker 3: is so important. This is important for ourselves, It's important
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: for our relationships. It's also important for like people you
• 57:16
  Speaker 3: admire or follow online, like offer yourself and meet and
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: Victoria and everybody else you follow. Like just a little
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: bit of grace. I love that we're doing the best
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: that we can, and we are doing this in the
• 57:29
  Speaker 3: hopes that we can take care of ourselves, we can
• 57:32
  Speaker 3: take care of our team, we can take care of
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: our communities, and that we can leave the world a
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: little bit better than we found it. And all of
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: this sounds like touchy feely, but like truly, just be
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: kind to people, especially the people that like you follow
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: and you hold in high regard, because we are people too.
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: We are out here doing the best we can with
• 57:51
  Speaker 3: all of it.
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: I love it, Tory. I think that is probably one
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: of the best places to leave it that I've ever seen.
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: So I am going to wrap us up here, but
• 58:00
  Speaker 2: before we go, thank you for sharing so much time
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: with me and with my community. I know they are
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: going to be so excited about this episode. I feel
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: like you're right, this episode is a little bit more fluffy,
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: but like I hope people walk away feeling so inspired,
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: so empowered to just take the first step if they
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: haven't done that yet, or just know that they're on
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: the right track, right Like if you're listening to this
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: and you're like, I am doing those things, like you
• 58:26
  Speaker 2: get it, queen, Like I love it so much. But
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: for those of you who might not have met you yet,
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: how do we stay in touch? How do we follow you?
• 58:35
  Speaker 2: How do we buy your book?
• 58:36
  Speaker 5: How do I do all of those things that I.
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: Want everyone in my community to be doing?
• 58:41
  Speaker 3: Thank you. I know there's a lot of actionable advice
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: on your episodes and your podcast as well as mine,
• 58:46
  Speaker 3: so hopefully this was actually a nice reprieve from some
• 58:48
  Speaker 3: of that. Her first hunder k is our brand. You
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: can go to her first hundred k dot com for
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: all of the ways to work with us and to
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: consume our content. We're also her first hunder k and
• 58:56
  Speaker 3: all the socials My podcast and book are called Financial
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: Feminists and should be available wherever you listen to podcasts
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: and wherever you read your books.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: We will link to all of them in our show notes,
• 59:06
  Speaker 2: so it can't be missed and you don't have to
• 59:08
  Speaker 2: write that down. But again, Tory, thank you so much
• 59:12
  Speaker 2: for sharing so much time and so much space and honestly,
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: so much of you. I feel like I've learned in
• 59:17
  Speaker 2: this I guess hour that we've been recording just so
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: much about who you are as a person, and I'm
• 59:22
  Speaker 2: even more obsessed, like I love it. I just can't
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: wait until we cross paths in person and get to
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: talk more about business, like I want to know how
• 59:30
  Speaker 2: you built this business and I want to share that
• 59:32
  Speaker 2: with my community too. So, guys, thank you so much
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: for listening, and Tory, thank you so much for joining.
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: I love it, Thanks for having me.
• 59:45
  Speaker 6: The advice shared on She's on the Money is general
• 59:48
  Speaker 6: in nature and does not consider your individual circumstances. She's
• 59:52
  Speaker 6: on the Money exists purely for educational purposes and should
• 59:55
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• 59:59
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• 1:00:01
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• 1:00:04
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