Latest / Talk Copy to Me | Content + Copywriting Podcast / Ready for a Website Rewrite? Here's How to Know It's Time

Transcript

Ready for a Website Rewrite? Here's How to Know It's Time · Talk Copy to Me | Content + Copywriting Podcast

• 0:04
  Erin Ollila: Hey friends, welcome to the Top coffee Timmy podcast. Here we empower small business owners to step into the spotlight with their marketing and messaging. I'm your host, Erin Ollila. Let's get started and talk copy. How do you know when you're ready for a website rebrand? Now that question gets posed to me so often, as a website copywriter, I get on a great many discovery calls with people who are considering rewriting the copy on their website. And I don't know how to tell you this. But most of the time that they're considering this is because their website designer, who they've already paid 1000s of dollars for a website, ask them, well, where's the website copy. And they realized that that wasn't part of the package deal. The website designer wasn't writing their copy, or the copy that they already had for their website doesn't quite fit their new website rebrand. And that's where I come in. And I'm happy to be there. But because I find that this is a question that so many people have. And in all honesty, it's a question that I haven't really seen answered Well, myself, I thought it would be important to come here and talk to you guys about it today.
• 1:20
  Erin Ollila: So that's what we're going to do. Were talking all things about how you can determine if your website is ready for a full rebrand. Of course, design plays a role in this, but we're focusing a lot on our website, copy and SEO today. So buckle up, you're in for good ride with this episode. Before we continue, I want to say a great big thank you to one of our listeners, their name is Crizal 503 on Apple podcast. And they say this podcast is such a great show. It is informative, fun, and so many interesting practical ideas, highly recommend giving this a lesson.
• 2:02
  Erin Ollila: Thank you so much for taking your time to leave us a review.
• 2:05
  Erin Ollila: If you are listening, and you have not yet reviewed the top copy to me podcast, I would be so very grateful for you to head on over to Apple podcasts. Leave the review, if you're in Spotify, you just give us a rating, hopefully of five stars Fingers crossed. Reviews are so helpful to podcasters. And it would be in the world to me. But I know you're you're wondering, you're saying Aaron, you just tempted us with this conversation about website copy?
• 2:30
  Erin Ollila: Can we stop talking about reviews? Sure, we can. There are many, many reasons why your website copy needs to be updated. And I want to point out before I give you a long list of those reasons, that just because you may have one of those reasons on your list. Or just because someone's told you that you need to redo your website copy does not mean that you need to. It sounds silly, but in all honesty, you need to be ready to redo your website copy so that you're happy with the end result that you get the majority of time the people that I've seen, either come to me unhappy because they've worked with a different copywriter, and they didn't like the results, or people who were having a harder time getting through the web copy process. The reason that they felt like that is because I don't want to say it's a mindset issue because it's not it could be let's say, but it's not only that, but a lot of the times they're struggling because they're not really solidified on what their message is, or what their offers are, or how they want to position that message and offers to make the you know, the most sales or to attract the most people. But they're going through this process, right?
• 3:46
  Erin Ollila: Maybe someone told them that they needed a new website copy, maybe it was that designer, love you designers, but maybe someone told them or you need a new website copy and they just hadn't done the work necessary to get there. So so I'm gonna give you a lot of clues that it might be time for your website copy to be updated, but no going into this that you really kind of need to weigh all of these things on your own to see if it is the right time for your own business. So let's just kind of get started for some of those reasons. Okay. One of the main reasons I see people needing a website rebrand with new copy is that they have inconsistent messaging. So if you're trying to speak to people in you know, different groups, it may be important to figure out what that underlying connectivity is, you know what, what the connective tissue is between those groups, so your messaging can be consistent throughout your website. Another example of being ready to get a website rebrand is if you've outgrown your former design and your former website copy. And for this example, I think sometimes this just happens and we know it. We know Oh, we've outgrown it. It's maybe that your previous design looked too juvenile, or maybe your copy that you had on your site was talking to everyone about everything that you know, and you recognize that it wasn't as strategic as you hoped. So, you know, example number two is really something more that you are feeling yourself based on the look, the feel and the flow of your site. Another reason is because your business may have may have changed. And when I say that, I mean the things that you offer, the services that you provide. And when it comes to changing, and how you know how these things have changed, it could be that you've added something to your business. So what's currently on there is still correct, you know, they may still be able to buy some of those things or hire you for some things. However, you have added an additional level of support, or you've added something completely brand new to your offerings that wasn't there before. Another very different example of why you may be ready for a website rebrand is that your SEO is non existent. So I have a lot of clients that will come to me, and they'll be like, Yeah, I think my web copy is good. Let's just throw some keywords in there and call it a day. And then in our conversations of where we're doing our work together, and we are being strategic, we're doing the research for the SEO, we recognize that the keywords that they want to rank for, and not just because they liked those keywords, or not just because they want to be called some clever name for like the their job position, let's say, but the the words that they want to rank for, because people are actually searching for them don't fit in the copy that they've written.
• 6:42
  Erin Ollila: This has kind of always been one of my biggest bones that I've picked with this online, like copy world is SEO has a place in content, a beautiful place. And SEO also has a place in website copy. But you do have to treat copy and content differently while following the same SEO best practices. Because you know, you can't have website pages that ramble on for for paragraphs and paragraphs and paragraphs in order to like use natural keywords in there. So to come back to the main point, if you had hoped that your copy would rank you for keywords that were related to your business or your niche or your industry, or the type of people you served or the work that you do. And it's not happening for you. I highly recommend a new website copy at that point. Something else that is kind of related to SEO is your website analytics and the data that that they give you, what does it tell you about your website. So for example, if you are checking your analytics somewhat regularly, and you don't see that you're improving, or signs of improvement, let's say, for example, some of this could be things like you're not getting conversions on your conversion related events, or you're having low time on page or high bounce rate, things like that, if their analytics are reporting to you that you're not really being successful in your attempts to convert people, that could be a sign that your copy needs to be updated so that you're doing a better job attracting people to the site and then converting them once they're actually there. One of my favorite ways that I recognize that clients need to update their sales copy.
• 8:30
  Erin Ollila: And in some cases, this is some of my former clients whose businesses have changed. And maybe like they follow the example of having new offerings, let's say. But one very, very big green flag for me for new website copy projects, is when I hear people tell me that they're doing a lot of work on Discovery calls. And I know it doesn't seem that obvious at first, right? Because there are many reasons why people could be spending a lot of time on Discovery calls, you know, they could just not have the best selling skills. In all honesty, I spend a lot of time on Discovery calls because I love connecting with people. And as my business has grown. And as I've done this for a long time, I recognize that I need to be better about not just connecting but also doing a very good job of being organized with my time so that I can present the right information to my potential clients and give them all of the ability to ask the questions that they want the space that they need, so they can feel comfortable doing so and not just being friendly. Besides that, right. Those things can influence discovery calls. But if you are on your discovery calls and you are treating it more like a sales call, or a educational sales call where you have to explain things to them.
• 9:50
  Erin Ollila: The reason that that's happening is because the information that you've provided them outside of that discovery call is not doing its job. And I cannot tell you how much I see this. And people don't recognize it. So it's one of my favorite ways to know, when I'm meeting with a lead for website copy that they're very ready to move forward because I can get a feel on how well they know their business and how well they knew their clients and what they'd like their messaging to be. But if they're telling me that they're doing a lot of selling, they're doing a lot of explaining, that's a very clear signal to me as the copywriter that the information that they're providing right now is just not what their clients are, excuse me their leads, in this case, need in order to make a decision. I all the time, see people providing so much information, because they feel like, well, I have to tell them this, and I have to tell them that. And let me explain every step of my process. And let's talk about why these steps and my processes are so important.
• 10:53
  Erin Ollila: That's great. Like you please do tell your clients that. But your leads first have to decide if they even want to work with you.
• 11:02
  Erin Ollila: So you don't want to bombard them with too much information that makes them feel overwhelmed, it might oftentimes it makes them feel overwhelmed to even press the button to book a discovery call. But if they have moved forward enough to get on the call with you, you have to it isn't your responsibility to let's say, build a connection. Make them feel comfortable, showcase your personality, showcase your expertise, and teach them everything that there is to know about what it is that you do, how you get results for your clients, or your customers, and how they can have those same results when they work with you, as well as what the package looks like what it cost, how long it takes it all those like minut details. So if you can get your web copy really set up well for you, that it's doing all that duty for you, you can then just join the discovery call and do what you should do, which is discover. Okay, I'm being corny here. But truly, it's discover whether you guys would be a great blog partnership, whether they should hire you that you'd be the right person, whether you should onboard them that they would be the right client, right. So let's regain control of that discovery call by putting the right information on our website to help people make decisions. Okay, so something that's very similar to that, but it's not reliant on the Discovery call itself is when you have leads who are confused.
• 12:33
  Erin Ollila: Now, it could be that you're in, let's say, you're in groups with people or you're being introduced to people in a networking event, or you're on a podcast as a guest and the people who are interviewing you or the people you're getting to know or the people who may be curious about working with you, they're just not exactly sure what the offer is. So a lot of the times I see this as something where we need to focus more on the sales, the shop or the Services page. And honestly, I see this a lot, because businesses often don't know exactly what they're selling.
• 13:09
  Erin Ollila: And I'm not trying to pick on anyone here because this is a problem I've had on and off in my own business. But especially when you are in a small business and you you're multi hyphenate or you are very passionate about a wide range of things you can do. I see this all the time in the writing world and myself included. There's a lot of things I can do. I mean, my education is in creative writing and memoir and essay. So I could write you an essay, or I could write you an autobiography. I could also write you conversion copy for your sales page. I could also write product copy for a product that you may be selling. And what I mean by that is just like the one or two sentence description of the product, right? There's so many things that copywriters can do.
• 13:55
  Erin Ollila: However, it's best to stay in a somewhat centered lane. And if you don't know that and your own business, and you're still trying to do all of those things, that's usually very confusing for your leads. Using the example of copy again, you know, like a lead could go to a copywriters website and be like, great. They write words, but how can they help me? Or I'm not really sure what this package includes, like, one thing I hear a lot when I meet with people for full website, copy projects, where I'm doing the work for them all the research all the writing all the SEO, all the editing. And they'll say like, how many pages Does this include? I've worked with coaches before where one coach had a 12 page website very clearly why she needed every single one of those 12 pages.
• 14:46
  Erin Ollila: And another coach that I worked with had a four page website.
• 14:49
  Erin Ollila: They were they were working in very similar industries, but because the way that they worked with clients was so different.
• 14:58
  Erin Ollila: They needed different things. So I get a lot of times people feel confusion as to how they should determine how many website pages they need. And if you're hiring a copywriter, I mean, this is an aside. But if you're hiring a copywriter, these are the kinds of questions you want to know, because it's important to know what the deliverable is, so that you feel excited about the end result. But you also need them to help you with strategy. Like for me, in particular, and I can't speak for other writers.
• 15:27
  Erin Ollila: But for me, in particular, like, I need to sit with my clients and do a strategy conversation, before we go much further in the website process. Because how do I not know you need a speaking page, like if we don't have a conversation about the fact that you are a regular guest on podcast, or you often go to universities and teach at the universities, or you work within people's business programs as a coach in your field, I won't know that that's something that we should highlight on your business. So while it's not specific to the discovery calls, if you find like your, your leads, and your network have this level of confusion about exactly what you do, or what you offer, it's very likely related to just some ambiguity in your copy around those things. So sometimes we get that information from the people that we know, like the people who are in our network or our leads, and that's wonderful. But another way to look at that example, in a slightly different approach is when we're doing social listening, and we hear a lot of confusion based within social listening. So for example, a very easy one could be if you're talking to someone, let's go back to the podcast guest one.
• 16:43
  Erin Ollila: And in the conversation, you're describing something, and the host says, Oh, I didn't know you did that. That is like the biggest flag that your your copy needs to be updated. Because if it's something that's pretty integral to your business, you want people to know, it's something you specialize in. So that's an easy one. Another more hidden social listening clue is if you hear a lot of questions, let's say Facebook groups, or, or other Online Communities you may be part of and people are, are confused about things that are related to your industry, or related to your service services, like things that you provide, not necessarily exactly related to you. But they're confused about something. Now, if you can recognize that confusion, and say to yourself, hey, does my copy explain this?
• 17:34
  Erin Ollila: Like, am I being clear about this on my website, that's a sign if you're not obviously, that you need to do some website updating. I've seen this myself.
• 17:45
  Erin Ollila: Some of the things that I've seen this particularly on is when I'm doing things like brand messaging, people have a hard time understanding the difference between like, what's brand strategy? What's brand messaging? What's your brand style guide? What's your editorial guide, like all of these key terms, it can be difficult to know, like, what makes them different from another. And I will put in the show notes, I do have a couple episodes that explain those terms to you in case you're a little unsure of yourself. But so I had heard many things about brand messaging, and people just having a lot of confusion about it. And I remember that's something that I do in vnP VIP days. And I remember being like, do I actually explain that on my own site? And I didn't all of these examples, I think are symptoms of a larger problem.
• 18:35
  Erin Ollila: Usually people kind of have multiple flags like this. And that's how they can determine it's really time for a full copy upgrade. But in that instance, it was an easy fix. And it could be for you. If it's not, though, because brand messaging is just a small part of what I do and what I offer. I didn't need to do a big fix. If it were a big fix, though, that's when you have to think okay, let me add that to a services page. And if your services page isn't correct, then does your homepage copy have the correct information. And if your homepage copy doesn't does your contact page, right? So things are so interconnected within your website when it comes to user experience, site navigation and the conversion related copy that sometimes these smaller symptoms need to be looked at a little bit closer, because they're actually signals have a bigger problem than they appear on the outside. But one common thing that I see a lot I hear this all the time and I'm doing like voice of customer research for my clients is that they're jealous of their competitors.
• 19:42
  Erin Ollila: Can we put this on pause everyone for a second because I know it's so hard to admit your own vulnerabilities or your own.
• 19:51
  Erin Ollila: I don't think this is the right word here all but like flaws or things that make you feel uncomfortable. But let's be very clear everyone. Okay, I can say everyone, so many people have jealousies and so many people having like insecurities, or they're envious of the people that are around them. And this could be like not a problem at all. I'm not suggesting you have to have a problem with jealousy, it could just be something that you notice and gives you that little twinge of sadness that like, why are they doing such good copy? Or why does their sales page you know, sound so convincing? If you're noticing things like that, or if you have like a handful or a couple of competitors, that you are very closely admiring and think like, what is that? What is that commandment? Like, don't covet your neighbor's wife, like, if you're coveting your competitors copy, it's probably time you need a new website, copy rebrand for yourself. And I just think this is so common. And I think sometimes people are either embarrassed or uncomfortable admitting it, but it is, again, so normal to like, read your competitors copy, especially when you see it on social media, like the fast in your face copy all the time. And you think to yourself, like, why did they know exactly what to say, I feel like I'm like, I can barely keep up with them. Or they have the best ideas, they always say it so well. I want to buy their products and services. And I sell the same thing. Like if you hear that, whether it's you're singing out loud to your friends and your colleagues, or you're seeing it just to yourself in your head. That's a pretty big signal that your site can be improved. And I'm going to call you out again for a second good old friend listener here.
• 21:39
  Erin Ollila: Because what I hear of so much with tiny businesses, is you've all done the DIY website copy.
• 21:44
  Erin Ollila: So if you're jealous of your competitors, you have to sometimes Pump those brakes and be like, did they like you might not know the answer to that. But if you're envious of their copy, and you've written your own copy, it's probably because they've had their copy either updated by someone who's edited their copy, or they've paid a website copywriter to do it for them. Because there gets to be this moment of growth in businesses where suddenly what the DIY did and what that like to move you forward, it's just not going to do much more for you. And I think if you've listened to this podcast for long enough, you would know that I am highly in support of the DIY business copywriter. I do not think people need to rely only on copywriters to move their marketing forward. I mean, I would we like just a second away from our 100th episode. And I probably say at least 50 At least 50% of these episodes I have been giving you tips and tricks on on how to do it yourself, if you don't have the budget to hire a copywriter. But when that growth does happen, and you notice that other people are getting a little bit more ahead of you, instead of spending money on courses and programs and quick win fixes, it might be a better idea to save some money and hire a service provider, like a copywriter, or like a website designer, because designers play a large role in our websites, or any of us these other more very niche, very experienced people to do the work for you. Because we can build upon the greatness that you've already created. But we can also take you a lot further than you've gotten yourself as well. And then one that is completely out of our control.
• 23:35
  Erin Ollila: And goodness gracious, I hope it's not something we all have to worry about too much more often. One thing I want to point out is the outside world, things happen and the world changes completely outside of our control. And because of that, sometimes our copy just needs complete updating. I think we get this and 2023 surviving a pandemic, living through the atrocities that are happening in our current immediate history and immediate and future. I mean, at this point, we can recognize that sometimes what works before will not work in the future. I had a client where most of her business was in literally speaking at companies or going as a consultant into companies to do one on one training with staff group training, things like that. And all of her work, let's say was travel base and on her clients site, she did not have her office like she just lived in her clients buildings. So when the pandemic happened, suddenly her entire business changed and that was outside of her control.
• 24:45
  Erin Ollila: She could no longer just go to the events just work at their offices. And because of that the way that she positioned her business needed to change and it needed to change quickly, I think with how the world has changed and what I'm hoping For the world, as we all get better at learning our business values, and what we stand for, is that we may realize there are things in our copy that could be insensitive, or there are things in our on our websites that are not accessible, or not globally inclusive. I also have a couple great episodes I will link to in the comments for that. But when we can recognize that it's really important for us to go beyond recognition and actually make the changes. So I'm getting I was really hoping to be done by 30 minutes, and I still have a couple points, we're going to try to power through them friends. Just a quick reminder, again, if you are here, and you're listening, I started this show by saying I would absolutely love any Apple reviews or Spotify reviews. I feel like it's something I haven't really asked for in a long time. And it would just, it's the holiday season. I mean, can we all just like is this a present that we can give our host Aaron for the holiday season? I hope so. If you give me a review, I will absolutely shout you out on the next episode. So just a quick little ad space moment to encourage you to pop into Apple pop into Spotify and review the show.
• 26:09
  Erin Ollila: While you're here listening, let's finish some of these main reasons that will help you know that you're ready for a website rebrand. One thing that I see done wrong very often is that businesses and solopreneurs often make themself the star of their show. This is normal. This is not me picking on you, it is completely normal to talk about you because it is you and your business, you know, and I'm saying was really more for solopreneurs or super micro businesses. Like if you're the brand of your business, you should be front and center.
• 26:44
  Erin Ollila: However, all of the words on your website, need to showcase to your leads why you or your business are the right people to work with to help them them solve their problem. So it's not really about you. Yes, you're the expert. Yes, you have expertise. Yes, you can provide transformations and solve problems and meet needs. But they still need to understand when they come to your website and read your copy that you get their needs. And why you could be the right person for them. So if you are the star of your of the show on your website, you actually really need to work through updating your copy so that your audience could then be the star of the show. And you are like the light that's shining on them.
• 27:38
  Erin Ollila: I just had a theater teacher of mine from high school who I just adored and admired and will love for the rest of my life pass away. And we were at her memorial service. And it was really beautiful to see how they really spotlighted the idea that she was the supporting star, you know that like she was a high school musical theater teacher, I couldn't really even go more into detail to say anything other than that, like she supported her students. And if we can look at our website, copy as your clients are the stars like they're the students on the stage, and you are that spotlight, that is making them shine as best as possible.
• 28:21
  Erin Ollila: That's that's the dream for the website. Another example is that you are oversharing I kind of touched on this before when I talked about length of pages and like the information that goes on pages. But please, if you're listening to anything in this episode, please stop saying so many words on your website. Your website pages are not blogs, they are not essays, they are not articles, like you do not need to provide every detail about your story because you need to give the your audience the information that they need.
• 28:59
  Erin Ollila: Like, there are so many great crafty ways to share that entire story. Like every detail you want to share about your life, your story throughout your business and your marketing. And many of those ways can be tied back into your website. An easy example here I usually talk to my clients about when it comes to things like about pages is give the details. You know, give the bullet points make the big headlines on the things that you need them to know. But you could always add like, you know, in one of your likely h four fonts, let's say you could add a little italic line that says want to learn more, read the full blog post about my business trajectory. And then write a 5000 word blog post if you're dying to share your entire business trajectory, write it out. Just put it into a blog post because your about page is not that right. So that's one example. But if you find that you're oversharing maybe you're talking maybe you're treating your service page, like a sales page For each of the services that you offer, that's not going to help. Same thing for like tiny products. If you have a shop, you can't write an entire sales page for a small priced item within the ecosystem of a large shop. So if you are oversharing, that could be a, you know, a sign that you really need to figure out what belongs, what goes. And then so that I'm not, you know, Debbie downer here. Please repurpose everything that goes because you can use it. And if you can't figure out how to use it come to me because I guarantee I will know how to use any copy that you are not going to use in your pages anymore. Because we do not waste our words, friends, we do not waste our words, the final feeling of like, ways to know you're ready, it would be if you've never really felt connected to the copy. Or if you've DIY the copy yourself and never felt excited by it. I don't want anyone to think that like, if you hire a copywriter to write write your website copy for you, it's just miraculously going to be perfect. And you're gonna love it for the next 10 decades. 10 decades is 100 years, but he got you get the point I'm going with here.
• 31:14
  Erin Ollila: That's not the truth. Because you've just heard what 15 Maybe reasons why you maybe need ready to have a website rebrand from me. So yes, businesses evolve, website copy evolves, on average, I think people update their website copy in full every two to three years, two to four years. And that's a good thing, it's not a bad thing. That means your business is growing, that means that your message is growing, that means that your message could be tightening up.
• 31:44
  Erin Ollila: So don't think of it as a bad thing. But if you ran that copy, and you kind of felt like, blah, or if you've kind of felt like it had no personality, it really didn't speak for who you are as a business owner, or who your business is, or who you're trying to serve. We don't want to keep that like, you want to feel proud to send people to your website. I hear all the time, one of my true biggest pet peeves. And I probably feel so frustrated about this because I've said it myself, way more than I like to admit publicly.
• 32:18
  Erin Ollila: But one of my biggest pet peeves is when I see someone on social media say like, oh, I would love to work with you on that, like, you know, like, Here's my email like, or here's my website, don't check it out, just email me like, and we'll talk about this. And I'm like, because you're embarrassed by your website. Like, that stinks. That makes me so sad. Like, I want you to feel so pumped up about your website that you're like, Yes, I'm the perfect person for you to hire. Here's why. And my website will tell you like, again, it makes this discovery calls actually be discovery calls and not sales calls. Or better yet, I'm gonna be honest, better yet, let's just cut the discovery calls completely.
• 32:56
  Erin Ollila: Because there's so much that can be sold, without getting on like on a call is specifically if it's priced under a certain amount of money. One thing I actually really want to talk about I'm glad I just thought about this is I have website audits that I do for my clients, and they're under $1,000. And I love doing them. Because it tells people exactly what they need to do with their website to get it to the point that they're happy with. Very often I'll be able to do things like give tips about what specific copy needs to be improved and how to do it.
• 33:28
  Erin Ollila: But what a website audit covers is a heuristic review of the copy, a technical review, a U X Review and SEO review of, of what's working and what's not right. So the reason I originally brought this up is because a website copy does not cost as much as most of my other services, it is great for someone who can DIY. And for someone who just kind of wants to kind of see where things are landing before working with me.
• 33:57
  Erin Ollila: I don't need to get on the phone before people hire me for a website audit at all. Because it's something that like it's proof, you know, it's going to be what you need. But like, with the amount of podcast episodes that I've had on my own show, content that I have on my website, guest episodes and community like speaking that I've done. I think that my experience and my education speaks for itself. And when Mike when they can see the copy of what's involved in a website audit, it's an easy purchase, right? So it's not something we need to have a discovery call about. Obviously, you know, for higher price things that are customized or individualize discovery calls are important.
• 34:41
  Erin Ollila: But the reason I'm saying this, though, is like I want you to be able to just pass that over and be like, hey, go check out my website. Like I'll tell you the exact way we can work together.
• 34:51
  Erin Ollila: You can book it directly from the site, you know, there are like there's an application on the site, whatever the individual cases for your business. I want you just to be excited I needed to send people there. I do not want to hear people say, don't look at my website. And yeah, I'm making a big deal about this. But guys, I can't tell you how often I hear this all the time. And I just think like, I know personally of all the times that I've said it, I felt when I felt embarrassed about my site site, I also felt shame of saying, Don't go look at my site, like, it made me feel like diminished as a small business. And I think from the outside, we can acknowledge that when we see other people doing this, it makes us kind of question like, why not? Like, if you're a business owner, why aren't you fixing like the most important marketing assets you have. So if you're experiencing any of that, that could be a great reason that it's time to update your site. And then, you know, these aren't really specific, like reasons to know that you're ready for a rebrand.
• 35:54
  Erin Ollila: But some things to pay attention to, if you're still on the fence after listening to this. And if you are on the fence hiring me for her website, audit guys, like, let's get this figured out, I can help you figure out exactly what you need. But rewinding, if you have heard this, you're still a little unsure. Some things I want you to start paying attention to are your analytics. So please look at things like your low conversions. Those are signs that your copy is not compelling, right, your messaging is maybe muddled. A high bounce rate is often a sign that you're not delivering on the search intent, or the search expectations that they had, once they clicked over to your site.
• 36:35
  Erin Ollila: User Experience, how's that working like are people moving through your site as you want them to. And that's one of those things that don't get talked about when it comes to copy quite often, but it's vital. You are the travel agents have your website, you are the tour guide, like you need to move people through the site. And that's how a conversion happens. When you take them from your homepage and you move them, let's say to a shop, if you have a shop, and you on their shop page, you have featured items like whatever it is for your business act like the tour guide. So is it difficult to move through your site? I mean, that's something you could review on your own. Or you could look at your analytics to show you the routes that people take when they land on a certain page. Where do they travel throughout your site? And where did they get off of your site? All of those things are kind of clues. So again, most common signs that can kind of remind you these things are lack of attracting new leads. If that's not happening, that's something you want to pay attention to low conversion rate. I just said that though, outdated content, huge sign. Hopefully this is helpful. We are going to have a whole bunch of episodes coming up in the near future about websites. This is kind of like are testing the waters to kind of give you the idea. Do you need a tiny update? Or do you really need to do the whole thing. But I will see you back next week to talk about how to prepare and the week after to celebrate my 100th Episode.
• 38:00
  Erin Ollila: Thanks so much for coming along this ride with me. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Top copy to me. If you enjoyed spending your time with me today. I would be so honored if you could subscribe to the show and leave a review.
• 38:18
  Erin Ollila: Want to continue the conversation. Head on over to Instagram and follow me at Erin Ollila. Until next time friends