Latest / Gym Business Coach Podcast / When A Member Cancels

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When A Member Cancels · Gym Business Coach Podcast

0:08
[SPEAKER_01]: You are listening to the built-to-grow podcast delivering the knowledge and all things, fitness, business.
0:17
[SPEAKER_01]: We help jimrollers win, hear your hosts, ten lions, and Randy Axton.
0:27
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, welcome back to the Jim Business Coach podcast from host Tim Lyons, joined in studio today by Randy Axton, what's the main morning?
0:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Morning.
0:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Phil, it's Benoel.
0:37
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, y'all were sick last week with the skews.
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[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y'all, y
0:50
[SPEAKER_02]: We're just going to start this podcast off with about two weeks ago, we lost a client and her husband that had been members for 16 years.
1:01
[SPEAKER_02]: We got an email late one evening.
1:03
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it was on a Friday and it was real, you know, vague and general, you know, it was from one of our long-standing clients who just kind of give you a contact, we've been open for 16 years.
1:13
[SPEAKER_02]: This particular family has been with us since the day one.
1:16
[SPEAKER_02]: and they've been through a lot with had our kids come through here, all kinds of stuff going on with this family.
1:21
[SPEAKER_02]: We just do just great folks and you know, sometimes it's like the ones that you enjoy seeing in the gym all the time.
1:27
[SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of that staple.
1:29
[SPEAKER_02]: We got an email and it was kind of just like, you know, hey, I'm looking to make a change for some personal reasons, real vague and it was like whatever.
1:37
[SPEAKER_02]: So Zach reached out to me right away.
1:40
[SPEAKER_02]: He's like, hey, Mrs. and Mr. Johnson, they're, they're, the cancer.
1:45
[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, oh man, that's horrible.
1:48
[SPEAKER_02]: What did they say the reason was?
1:50
[SPEAKER_02]: They said his personal is a little vague.
1:52
[SPEAKER_02]: I was like, all right, well listen, man.
1:55
[SPEAKER_02]: They've been with us 16 years.
1:57
[SPEAKER_02]: That's amazing.
1:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Like that's so far past the averages of our gym, of the industry and general.
2:05
[SPEAKER_02]: It's gonna give you guys context.
2:06
[SPEAKER_02]: We've been a train gym forever, right?
2:08
[SPEAKER_02]: Even since day one, this particular couple has always been been on training, like some type of training program.
2:15
[SPEAKER_02]: So it's not like a $9 membership.
2:18
[SPEAKER_02]: We're talking, you know, everything is north at 300.
2:22
[SPEAKER_02]: And even sometimes, $400, $500 a month,
2:25
[SPEAKER_02]: Times two for 16 years.
2:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Huge client value.
2:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Great, you know, contributor to the jam in the successful where we've been at, but they're canceling.
2:35
[SPEAKER_02]: And I said, this is what I told Zach.
2:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I said, listen.
2:38
[SPEAKER_02]: make it as easy as possible for them to cancel their membership.
2:42
[SPEAKER_02]: Don't even ask them to give you a notice of actually don't bill them one extra payment.
2:47
[SPEAKER_02]: They've told us it's Friday night.
2:49
[SPEAKER_02]: We've been on Sunday.
2:50
[SPEAKER_02]: So shut it off before that Sunday hits and just make it super smooth.
2:55
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for their time.
2:57
[SPEAKER_02]: you know obviously if you can meet with them in person next week they get sessions next week even though we're not charging informed just let them come in and train with us and you know try to find out a little bit more but like don't try to keep them sure don't make them feel bad yep thank them say we're gonna miss you the doors always open
3:14
[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, it's funny because a couple of years ago, even five years ago, any time we would lose a member, I would get mad.
3:21
[SPEAKER_02]: And in this situation, I'm just like, thank them.
3:24
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, I believe that you need to make it as easy as possible for people to count with you, no matter how long they've been with you, just as a general business practice in this industry.
3:35
[SPEAKER_02]: gems, you know, we believe it's very personal.
3:39
[SPEAKER_02]: You see these clients multiple times a week, you learn about their life, they've gone to the dinner with them, all this stuff.
3:46
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you let, you know, if you go back and read the book, built a win, I talk about how I believe communities of fallacy and people are going to cancel when it's inconvenient for them, or it doesn't work out for their lifestyle anymore.
3:57
[SPEAKER_02]: And we have to be okay with that.
3:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
3:59
[SPEAKER_02]: We cannot be upset when somebody counts as their membership.
4:02
[SPEAKER_02]: We can be upset, but we can't
4:06
[SPEAKER_02]: we don't need a reason why.
4:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Honestly, you know, the fact they said it was personal, even another reason not the pride because it is personal.
4:15
[SPEAKER_02]: It has a pact that's like anybody says that.
4:18
[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I know everybody's listening, it's like, you know, you try to keep your clients when I show them on, they've got to meet with you and I get it.
4:24
[SPEAKER_02]: every member of matters, every dollar matters.
4:27
[SPEAKER_02]: But at the end of the day, I think you're going to be much better off in the long run.
4:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Just, you know, no problem.
4:32
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's get you canceled.
4:33
[SPEAKER_02]: I'd love to hear why if you can't, whatever.
4:36
[SPEAKER_02]: But like at the end of the day, we can't like fight our clients.
4:40
[SPEAKER_02]: We can't get it.
4:41
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not personal.
4:42
[SPEAKER_02]: It's 100% business, what's going on, you know, you got to look in word and say, like, hey, where do we miss the boat with this particular client?
4:50
[SPEAKER_02]: Now, obviously with this client, I'm discussing the beginning, we didn't miss the boat anywhere.
4:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Obviously 16 years.
4:55
[SPEAKER_02]: family members, like, you know, a lot of money that was, was, you know, contributed from this particular family.
5:02
[SPEAKER_02]: So we didn't miss the boat and there's really nothing else to say.
5:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
5:06
[SPEAKER_02]: We just let him go.
5:08
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
5:09
[SPEAKER_00]: You mentioned, I mean, through what you were saying, I think that that personal component in the email is a big give to, right?
5:15
[SPEAKER_00]: It wasn't something that like,
5:17
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, a newer client, some of you had been with you three four months that it wasn't getting something that they expected or the you guys dropped the ball in one way or another right if it was something like that.
5:28
[SPEAKER_00]: I would probably push a little bit harder for just a conversation, right, to figure it out because hey, we want to improve.
5:33
[SPEAKER_00]: If we did drop the world, there was an issue.
5:35
[SPEAKER_00]: If it was something that we could have done by all means, but I mean, obviously knowing this individual, and then the way it was presented to you guys, I think that it's the best way to go about it.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Sure.
5:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Because one of the things that people don't think about is the impact of the conversation they're having with everybody after they're gone, right?
5:54
[SPEAKER_00]: We know, you know, we fight our, with everything that we can to try and get referrals.
6:00
[SPEAKER_00]: But one thing that we don't think about is how many people are we preventing from walking through our door because of something like deep furls?
6:06
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there you go, right?
6:07
[SPEAKER_00]: We can do a whole podcast of that, right?
6:09
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because the truth is, it's very difficult to get a positive review by default, but it's very easy to get a negative review by default.
6:18
[SPEAKER_02]: People want to be hurt.
6:19
[SPEAKER_02]: So if you make it bad for somebody, they're going to tell 10 people.
6:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And you could be good for 10 years and they wouldn't tell anybody.
6:26
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just interesting how that's a human human behavior.
6:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
6:30
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that's the whole, that's exactly what I mean there, right?
6:34
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if you did make it difficult, if you challenge her, held her to the next, you look at the cancellation policy.
6:40
[SPEAKER_00]: We're not extra payments.
6:41
[SPEAKER_00]: One more, I mean, I mean, $99 a week, right?
6:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, that wouldn't break the bank in that situation, but at the same time, the goodwill will pay a dividend in ways that the 99 never could.
6:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you know, I think it's interesting because, you know, clients will be with the gym for years two years, three years, five years, and then the gym when they get a cancellation, it's like, well, wait a minute, you know, why are they leaving?
7:07
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought they were loyal, right, but on the flip side of that, I said, you don't own the client, like you just don't own them, like they're human being, right, they can go do whatever the hell they want.
7:16
[SPEAKER_02]: And we just have to get over this thing of like, it's a personal reason.
7:20
[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, sometimes they cancel for personal reasons against you, like they don't like you, that's fine, but 99% of the time, it's something they're going through in their life, a family member, sick, they don't have the money, they lost their job.
7:36
[SPEAKER_02]: whatever it is, right?
7:38
[SPEAKER_00]: We talk, I mean, fitness is one of the easiest things.
7:40
[SPEAKER_00]: First things to go, right?
7:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Because, yeah, it is assumed or it is felt like it's a luxury.
7:48
[SPEAKER_02]: It's interesting.
7:49
[SPEAKER_02]: Well, people don't value their own health and well being until they don't have it.
7:53
[SPEAKER_02]: Fair, fair.
7:54
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's just part of the day to day routine.
7:58
[SPEAKER_02]: And sometimes they feel like they can do themselves.
8:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Um, and it's not, it's not easy unless you're like us where fitness is kind of part of your lifestyle like gym owners or whatever, it's just, it's not easy.
8:09
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just a tough part of their day and it's like they got to like get motivated and disciplined to do it.
8:14
[SPEAKER_02]: Uh, but going back to the whole cancellation thing, like I've, you know, every gym owner here has had cancellation that don't make sense.
8:21
[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.
8:21
[SPEAKER_02]: You've had clients that you've had great relationships and then they cancel the next morning.
8:27
[SPEAKER_02]: A great conversation, maybe train in the day before, no inkling of anything, and then they cancel.
8:32
[SPEAKER_02]: And we all take it personal.
8:35
[SPEAKER_02]: We do.
8:36
[SPEAKER_02]: But you just, first off, you just can't.
8:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Just step back out of this situation.
8:42
[SPEAKER_02]: You always want to learn how you can improve, like you said before, absolutely.
8:46
[SPEAKER_02]: But at the end of the day, when I'm trying to get across in this episode, it's like, make it easy.
8:50
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
8:51
[SPEAKER_02]: Be like, don't fight them.
8:53
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, you're going to hear sales, gurus, and coaches in the business world tell you the opposite.
9:00
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, the fitness industry is notorious for this.
9:03
[SPEAKER_02]: they can't do it on a phone they have to do it in person have to mail certified letter no stop guys obviously have your policies make them fill a form out so everybody does the same way but like taxitum or have it on your website or in your app or up at the front desk or like don't make them go specifically to send a certified letter like they're that's written in a lot of contracts still.
9:25
[SPEAKER_02]: you gotta send a certified letter.
9:26
[SPEAKER_02]: You, you can't cancel out the club.
9:28
[SPEAKER_02]: You got a council with ABC financial on the 1-800 number.
9:31
[SPEAKER_02]: They put you on the hole for they just sucks guys.
9:33
[SPEAKER_02]: That sucks to stop it.
9:35
[SPEAKER_02]: Stop doing that stuff.
9:37
[SPEAKER_02]: handle it, and you're going to be better off in Lauren because, hey, you know what, if the council was easy, maybe the time's changed, it come back.
9:45
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and that's the, I think one of the most important aspects of this is just because you don't have that relationship where the relationship is ending today doesn't mean it's ending forever, right?
9:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And if we believe it's a relationship based business,
9:59
[SPEAKER_00]: the end of that relationship should just be, should be as good as the beginning of it for them, right?
10:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Leave them feeling nothing but awesome.
10:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Even though we don't, we don't like their relationship.
10:10
[SPEAKER_00]: Your business, right?
10:11
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
10:11
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you're, you're taking the head on the, the revenue, but at the end of the day,
10:16
[SPEAKER_00]: the more difficult you make it the greater the chances are that that person shares that story with the next person it turns to first somebody out exactly right and then you know and some of these people are carrying weight in the marketplace in your local area um you know how many people are they talking to in an average week that
10:35
[SPEAKER_00]: by sharing that one story about how difficult you made it.
10:38
[SPEAKER_00]: Now you're non-option for anybody that they're talking to.
10:42
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
10:42
[SPEAKER_00]: And you never think about that.
10:44
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we don't.
10:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's 100% happening.
10:47
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
10:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.
10:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And if it goes back to like, you know, if we do believe that this is a relationship business, and we do do a tune, right?
10:55
[SPEAKER_00]: We do see these people multiple times a week.
10:57
[SPEAKER_00]: You do have dinner with those clients.
10:59
[SPEAKER_00]: You do get invites to their family events and weddings and funerals and things like that over time.
11:05
[SPEAKER_00]: If you burn that bridge, it kind of devalues the whole relationship at that point because now you as the business owner have made it transactional.
11:15
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:15
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, like in this situation, like you respected the relationship that you've had for the length that you had it and you left, you left them leave on nothing but great terms.
11:25
[SPEAKER_00]: The door's open, but if you make them jump through hoops or just leave them with a bad taste in their mouth, you burn that bridge.
11:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And now they're also looking back to, why did I spend so much time there?
11:36
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
11:37
[SPEAKER_00]: What did you record it?
11:38
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a really care about me for them.
11:40
[SPEAKER_02]: They didn't care about me.
11:42
[SPEAKER_02]: There was just a business as action to them as the business.
11:45
[SPEAKER_02]: I was just a number to them.
11:47
[SPEAKER_02]: All this stuff, all the events I went into, all the people I referred, none of that even mattered to them.
11:53
[SPEAKER_02]: and they hate, like, it's really bad.
11:56
[SPEAKER_02]: And so like, guys, we just never think about this side of it, but I think, you know,
12:02
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's important because this just happened as 16-year client guys, that's things a little bit.
12:07
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, you know, and they're not like moving.
12:10
[SPEAKER_02]: They're still in town.
12:11
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure they're gonna probably do something else, but it was just, you know, the time for them to do it.
12:16
[SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, thank them.
12:18
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, 16 years, 15 years, five years, two years.
12:22
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, whatever.
12:24
[SPEAKER_02]: It's, we need to be, we need to like appreciate that a little bit more.
12:28
[SPEAKER_02]: because we've all been on the other side of that, where you're trying to cancel something, a subscription or something, and so on.
12:35
[SPEAKER_00]: Have you been in a gym when I lived in Texas?
12:38
[SPEAKER_00]: It was like three months that, I mean, I did everything they're telling me, go do this form, did this form, go do this,
12:45
[SPEAKER_00]: When you want me to do for like 30 hours a month, I'm like this is ridiculous.
12:49
[SPEAKER_00]: You know what I mean?
12:49
[SPEAKER_00]: And the only thing that it let me feel like was they're just trying to just trying to bang on 30 to 30 bucks, 30 bucks and I'm like, is it, it's that big of a deal to you?
12:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
12:59
[SPEAKER_00]: That you can't just make it easy.
13:00
[SPEAKER_00]: And I didn't even live in the state anymore.
13:02
[SPEAKER_02]: It wasn't an other option.
13:03
[SPEAKER_02]: It's, it's so common in this industry and a fitness industry.
13:06
[SPEAKER_02]: We've done it for ourselves.
13:08
[SPEAKER_02]: And unfortunately, the opposite is true, too.
13:11
[SPEAKER_02]: Like you're gonna make it easier for someone to cancel.
13:13
[SPEAKER_02]: They're just gonna go somewhere else and get banged for another three extra months.
13:17
[SPEAKER_02]: You don't get any benefit for that because you did the right thing.
13:20
[SPEAKER_02]: It's just interesting, right?
13:21
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a pretty one-sided.
13:22
[SPEAKER_00]: One thing to think about too, though, is that it also should, I mean, cause like the troubleshooting, right?
13:29
[SPEAKER_00]: Like if somebody was leaving for his X reason and you knew it, right?
13:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Now let's improve what we're doing.
13:34
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's make our services better.
13:37
[SPEAKER_00]: One thing we talk about all the time is having that superior client experience.
13:41
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
13:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And if you've done that and you then have somebody who leaves, let them go see what other gyms are doing.
13:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Let them go experience what other training is like.
13:53
[SPEAKER_00]: If you believe that your product is the best and you are bringing everything to the table,
13:58
[SPEAKER_00]: wouldn't be easy to say that that client is coming back.
14:02
[SPEAKER_00]: It's only a matter of time.
14:03
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, it goes back to how you leave that client at that point.
14:08
[SPEAKER_00]: If you've thrown that bridge and they go somewhere else, maybe this the training is subpar, maybe the experience isn't what they had over there, but because you hurt the relationship on the way out.
14:17
[SPEAKER_00]: They're never coming back.
14:18
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, again, never think about that.
14:20
[SPEAKER_02]: Because we always just take it so personal.
14:22
[SPEAKER_02]: And one last thing, I'll look kind of like, say, we do need to find out the real reason they do leave.
14:27
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, don't not ask them, don't like, but don't make it difficult.
14:32
[SPEAKER_02]: One of the things that I've done in the past where somebody, like, I need to know what's going on, I'll just say, Mrs. Johnson, listen, do you mind having a conversation?
14:40
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not going to try to keep you here.
14:43
[SPEAKER_02]: In fact, I've already canceled your membership.
14:46
[SPEAKER_02]: It's all done.
14:47
[SPEAKER_02]: That's how I'm looking for.
14:48
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm looking to find out, is there how we could approve without the OK to chat with you a little bit about that, and they're usually, yeah.
14:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Because they're going to not take that call with you if you're trying to resell them.
14:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Correct.
14:59
[SPEAKER_02]: And make them feel bad about the decision.
15:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Anyways, I'll just throw that in there.
15:02
[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, we do need to find out because how else are you going to approve if everybody just leaves you don't ask them any questions.
15:06
[SPEAKER_02]: You got to know.
15:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And as some we work with our coaching clients on all the time.
15:09
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, when we're troubleshooting retention issues,
15:12
[SPEAKER_00]: what is the commonality right if it's if it's a three month if it's a six week if it's a nine nine month fall off like why what is it about your service your delivery journey that journey right yeah that they're on that there's that common fall off and if there is usually that something within the business that can be worked on yeah but you know a lot of gyms that don't ask that there's just a fray do right but I like that non it's like taking the yeah non-threatening way of going about it yeah
15:40
[SPEAKER_02]: this time.
15:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, we're not ready.
15:41
[SPEAKER_02]: Cancer is no big deal.
15:42
[SPEAKER_02]: I just want to give you a chat about it.
15:44
[SPEAKER_02]: So hey, listen Jim owners, make it super easy for for your clients.
15:48
[SPEAKER_02]: Like I said, it's going to pay dividends in the long run and it's also hurting you without you even knowing when you when you you try to nail somebody for an extra month or whatever.
15:57
[SPEAKER_02]: And one last thing I will say is like, yes, you have policies and you absolutely should stick to the policies.
16:03
[SPEAKER_02]: just because your 30-day policy actually is going to build somebody one extra month, you should not feel bad about that.
16:10
[SPEAKER_02]: So, once it's in the policy, but again, don't make it so difficult where you didn't get the form on the right day and it's like one hour late and you're going to bang up, like that's what I'm talking about, right?
16:23
[SPEAKER_02]: And don't like pressure somebody in the setting,
16:27
[SPEAKER_02]: because it could leave a bad taste in a mouth.
16:29
[SPEAKER_02]: So make it super easy, like I said, and you know, they may come back, because like you said, maybe they're training, they're going to go down the streets horrible, they're like, you know what, that sucked.
16:39
[SPEAKER_02]: I'm coming back to you.
16:40
[SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully that helps you guys have a great year.
16:43
[SPEAKER_02]: Guys, we have a workshop.
16:44
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know if this is going to come out in the time, but like a link will be in the show notes.
16:48
[SPEAKER_02]: I'd love to see you guys come on out here for the million dollar model workshop and the grow summit coming up in June.
16:54
[SPEAKER_02]: All right, that's it for this episode until next time, guys, keep changing
16:57
[SPEAKER_02]: Alright, thanks for listening to another episode of the built-grilled podcast.
17:01
[SPEAKER_02]: If you want more help growing your business, join our free Facebook group, profit accelerator helping training gyms grow to $30,000 a month and beyond.
17:11
[SPEAKER_02]: We'd love to see you there, go check out the show notes for the link, and keep building something great, and we'll see you in the next episode.