Latest / DunkersPodcast / Adapted4Life | Resilience, Inclusion and Open Water Confidence

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Adapted4Life | Resilience, Inclusion and Open Water Confidence · DunkersPodcast

0:11
Thanks for joining us here today at the Dunkers Podcast, our
0:14
weekly dip into the lives of cold water swimmers wherever you
0:18
are in the world. Firstly, I want to say 3 thanks
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and the first one has got to be to you for actually listening.
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The second one is I'm going to try, and I always do try to keep
0:31
the show as real and as close to life as possible with guests
0:34
that you want to hear from and others who simply have something
0:37
honest and worth sharing. Thirdly, I want you to keep
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reaching more people. Tell them about the podcast,
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share the podcast and hit the bell so that you get an update
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whenever we launch a new episode.
0:51
So thanks for being here. Let's get on with the show.
0:55
And this week on Dunker's podcast, we're taking a deeper
0:59
dive. Not into the sea.
1:01
Well, not just, but into the science of what keeps us moving,
1:04
moving forward in life. Phil, most guests come to tell
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us about a passion. You've come to tell us about a
1:12
purpose. You've rebuilt these, conquered
1:16
Kona, and now you're trying to adapt lives, including your own.
1:20
Let's start with the man behind the mission.
1:23
Phil Welcome to Dunker's podcast.
1:26
And who is Phil Ellison today? Here.
1:29
Thanks for the welcome. Sansa.
1:31
Sounds great. Yeah, it's really nice just to
1:33
spread a story and spread something that you're passionate
1:36
about. It's definitely an area that I'm
1:40
really interested in going into much further detail with people,
1:43
but anybody that will listen to me and anybody that's also
1:45
interested in in the story. Me personally, I, I've always
1:49
been sporty. I've played a lot of rugby
1:51
league. Being from the northwest of
1:52
England, that's kind of do we go, It's what you've got to do
1:54
as a young lad in this area. And obviously due to that got
1:58
plenty of injuries and ended up seeing physiotherapists and that
2:01
was my first passion really was, was an interesting physiotherapy
2:04
in the human body at a young age.
2:07
I therefore committed to going to university and studying to be
2:10
a physiotherapist and that's taken up the majority of my
2:14
adult life really. I was a physiotherapist mainly
2:17
in the NHS for 23 years and in the latter part of that I
2:21
specialised in foot and ankle as a sub speciality of
2:25
physiotherapy and worked with the orthopaedic surgeons.
2:29
But what I realised was that a lot of my role in physiotherapy
2:33
is actually coaching people to get better, to become healthier
2:36
and to develop good habits. And it's not so much about what
2:39
you do to them as a physiotherapist, but it's how
2:42
you help them to get themselves better.
2:45
And that probably then dovetailed with my enjoyment
2:48
person in triathlon and I eventually came to the the sort
2:52
of purpose of putting the two together and then, you know,
2:56
developing myself as a triathlon coach.
2:58
Right. So they come to see you because
3:00
they've got a physiotherapy problem.
3:02
And you were more sort of whole life, weren't you?
3:05
You were sort of thinking this, this whole thing has got to be
3:08
bigger than just that injury that I'm looking at today.
3:11
You. Can treat a patient in front of
3:13
you with, like you said before, like with an injured knee, but
3:16
unfortunately they come with a lot more than that.
3:18
They're an individual with a brain that's attached to that
3:20
knee and managing the person is what you, you know, to have
3:24
success treatment outcome, you've got to manage the whole
3:27
person rather than just manage the injury.
3:29
And I think that's what I really enjoyed.
3:31
And that that was one of the driving forces.
3:33
It wasn't just about, you know, physically managing a person,
3:37
the injury. It's about helping to manage the
3:39
whole, the whole person to get back to whether it's sports or
3:42
their work, their occupation. And I suppose that led to like
3:46
you say that more holistic view of people and not just
3:49
categorizing them as a an injury, as a person with an
3:53
injury. And how long through this sort
3:56
of 23 years of, of of being a physio did you did the
4:01
realization? Hit you probably took quite a
4:04
while. It's probably halfway through
4:07
that process because at first you saw most more focused on,
4:11
you know, improving your skills as a physio and diagnosing
4:14
injury and managing injury. And it's very like condition
4:18
focused, but it's not person centred at the beginning because
4:22
you're more focused on the anatomy and the Physiology, the
4:24
biology and the injury management.
4:26
But obviously the more you work with people, then you realise
4:30
that perhaps the person is at least as important as the injury
4:33
and maybe more important than the actual injury, right?
4:38
And then I think what the realisation comes with that is
4:41
that to a certain extent you're actually coaching.
4:43
So, so that dovetails quite nicely when you've got a passion
4:47
for a sport or, or you know, another pastime or something
4:49
else outside of the NHS. That if you can actually put the
4:53
two together and, and be involved with something that
4:56
you're quite passionate about yourself as a, as a sport, but
4:59
also take some of the skills you've developed as a coach
5:03
within a, a medical setting. Oh, right.
5:05
OK. Yeah, Yeah.
5:06
I don't think it's necessarily like Ausp.
5:08
No, it's, it's definitely a skill and an ability that you've
5:11
trained in a slightly skilled deputy for sort of 20 plus
5:14
years. Yes, clear.
5:16
Quite well to the, as you say now I've, I've kind of left
5:19
physiotherapy behind about two or three years ago, OK.
5:23
You don't do any of it at all. No, it's so it's more focused on
5:26
the coaching and yeah, yeah. Yeah, absolutely.
5:29
It's against like a lot of this story today.
5:32
It's kind of the spark of the COVID time and the, you know,
5:36
all the changes that were enforced on us at that point.
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I actually found that the demand for triathlon coaching grew
5:43
massively at a time when there were no races.
5:46
OK, so it's really? Yeah, I was expecting that
5:49
demand would fall because people couldn't go and race and train
5:53
together. They couldn't actually do much
5:55
outdoors. They had to do it, you know, in
5:56
in the garage and train on their own and things like that.
5:59
And opportunities were much less.
6:00
But what I realised was the the demand for community and the
6:04
demand for structure and routine in people's lives was massive.
6:08
And so people were seeking out triathlon coaching and probably
6:11
other forms of, of grouped and coaching as well.
6:14
But absolutely the demand for my coaching and and other people's
6:16
was just growing. Exponentially and I guess that
6:19
that might have been just as you're implying, I think a sort
6:23
of an output of of COVID people were lost people.
6:26
People hadn't got the structure, the routine, the the, the
6:28
dailies and they needed something.
6:31
They needed to sort of to look inwards and I guess.
6:34
I'm fine community and if we can provide that online because, you
6:37
know, part of the triathlon coaching is done online as an
6:40
online community. Not you know, most of the people
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I coach don't live geographically close to me, but
6:45
we build community because we've got and you know, people with
6:48
the same interests. They're all interested in sport
6:51
and triathlon and health and well-being and diet and
6:53
nutrition. All that comes as a package.
6:56
But yet they might be spread out across the whole country.
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But we can do stuff with zoom and webinars.
7:01
We can bring them together on the bike platform that we coach
7:04
on the bike. So I'll be sat in my garage.
7:06
I can see them on the screen. I can talk to them on the phone
7:09
and I coach them live. So although you're.
7:12
One of those merciless bike coaches are you?
7:14
Yeah, yeah. When you when you go spinning
7:16
and you. You have absolutely hate the
7:18
person that you're watching. Don't you?
7:20
Yeah. We're not quite like the Peloton
7:22
or the spirit. We give things a little bit more
7:24
steadily than that, I have to say.
7:26
But no. But but the ethos is the same.
7:28
It's giving them confidence, isn't it?
7:30
Yeah, we're providing a quality service as well, but we're also
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bringing a community together that geographically would never
7:35
be able to do that because they, you know, they live hours and
7:39
hours apart. But.
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By bringing them together in a shared like reality that they're
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actually all really interested and passionate about the same
7:47
things in life, they get on really well and we've just got
7:50
to provide a way to bring them together.
7:51
And I think in COVID that was especially important,
7:54
particularly if people were worried about their jobs and
7:57
their health and other things like that.
7:59
So that was quite an eye opener. And then sort of shortly after
8:02
COVID, I kind of had this mini midlife crisis moment thinking,
8:06
do I spend money on a new car like a Ferrari or a drop top so,
8:10
you know, convertible or do I just change my job and go with
8:13
my passion? And luckily my wife is very
8:15
supportive and we sort of, I went part time in the NHS, which
8:19
is quite good. I just, you know, sort of easing
8:22
my way out. The coaching business built up a
8:24
little bit and I transitioned quite smoothly over 6 to 12
8:27
months and then never look back. And was Nikki, was Nikki Nikki's
8:31
your wife Nick? Was Nikki part of this
8:33
transformation? Because with a bit of background
8:36
that I was sort of looking at, she was into it was in 2022 that
8:40
something that she sort of there was a realization that she found
8:45
when and that sort of opened new doors into the doors into the
8:49
cold. Yeah, I mean, like she'd been
8:51
utterly supportive in, you know, most of the decisions I've ever
8:54
made and in my career and stuff. And she can see on a personal
8:57
level how I'm passionate I am about triathlon.
9:00
And when whenever I've done presentations and talks in front
9:03
of the groups, the feedback is always really good because I'm
9:06
always talking about things I'm passionate about.
9:08
So it's not hard to say that I'm interested because I'm talking
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about things that personally really interest me or if I'm
9:15
really stimulating and, you know, really get behind these
9:19
facts and figures and all these ideas.
9:22
And so she saw that within the triathlon and the coaching and
9:25
how happy it made me personally. So obviously as, as a house,
9:28
they're going as well, hopefully support you in making that
9:31
decision. Obviously, it's purely the
9:33
financial, you know, worries, will it pay your bills?
9:36
It's not a set wage. And am I just being silly about
9:39
throwing away 20 years of a profession?
9:41
And so it wasn't an easy, it wasn't an easy decision to make.
9:44
But, you know, luckily trusting in myself and trusting in that
9:49
passion and it's, it's paid massive dividends.
9:52
So personally, my, my lifestyle is better than it's ever been.
9:57
Being able to work different hours, work from home, take my
9:59
daughter to school with, you know, so the flexibility that
10:02
this life provides is, you know. It's a new lifestyle.
10:07
Yeah, absolutely. So just just is that where this
10:11
this whole the love affair came with with cold water as well.
10:17
I'm you. Know pretty skinny get cold hate
10:21
being cold never saw the point in it would always wrap up with
10:24
you know tons of layers and a scarf and a hat and just you
10:27
know would curse and and be the first person to sit next to the
10:30
radiator and all these things to keep warm.
10:32
But Nicky was really keen to try and again she she kind of forced
10:36
the issue we went at the the kind of inverted commas perfect
10:40
time of year to the first cold water dip which was an organized
10:43
one at one of our local lakes. It was the first weekend in
10:47
January, if you'd expect. Wonderful.
10:51
Had to break the ice to get in. So it's like literally in at the
10:54
deep end. It was one of those sessions
10:57
where it's combined with the breath work practices as well.
10:59
So it was a, it was a full hour of organised with a coffee
11:02
afterwards and a bit of a social, you know.
11:05
And so that experience opened my eyes massively.
11:09
Like, I'm really glad that she convinced me to go because
11:13
sometimes you can read and you can convince yourselves that a
11:16
lot of it is Holcomb and and it's people, you know, just
11:20
skull duggery or it's just a wives tales and there's no real
11:23
science behind it. Or it's just simply felt a
11:26
fashion. Or yeah, yeah, or it's
11:28
influences on Instagram or I think it's just a fad or
11:30
whatever. And I, I don't tend to buy into
11:33
a lot of that. But when you experience
11:35
something first hand and you feel things in your body and it
11:39
makes you feel a certain way, there's no going back on that.
11:42
You then well, my my reaction to that was I've got to understand
11:46
this so. It's a mental.
11:47
Shift for you, wasn't it? The revelation for us was that
11:50
we we went to this session. It was first thing in the
11:52
morning as the sun's rising, we're breaking the ice, we've
11:55
done the breath work, we're getting in.
11:57
I must have lasted no more than 60 seconds.
12:00
And that's, that's being generous.
12:02
Nikki was much more adept to it straight away and she was
12:05
probably in for three, 4-5 minutes chatting away to people.
12:08
Had she done it before? Oh, wow.
12:10
OK, She's just virgin Duncan. Yeah.
12:12
Naturally talented, whereas me absolutely awful.
12:16
But in that time I had the typical shock response.
12:20
I gasped, I gagged. I got through that and then very
12:24
quickly got so cold and started shivering that I, you know, I
12:26
got out. I've never felt those things
12:28
before as strong as that. I got dry, went through a coffee
12:32
and a chat afterwards felt amazing.
12:35
You know, chatting to people, hugging people in the coffee
12:38
shop that I've like, I'm not a hugger, but they were very
12:41
inclusive as a community. So that's very helpful.
12:45
And then driving home, we're giggling, we're laughing and
12:48
we're thinking. Like a revelation.
12:53
And then maybe an hour after getting home, two hours of sleep
12:57
on the couch absolutely shattered, but in a good way, in
13:01
like a nice tire, just physically just I think I need a
13:04
nap. We both went on different
13:06
couches. I think we did.
13:07
And literally both of us sparked out for about two hours.
13:10
And that was off about for me, 60 seconds of cold water.
13:14
Well, that's, that's a pretty awesome recount, yeah.
13:19
I may not even believe it if somebody told me that.
13:21
No, when it's you personally. Yeah, yeah, it opens your eyes
13:25
and then say that then just was this massive opening of a rabbit
13:30
hole of me wanting to research and understand what why did I
13:33
feel like that? Should I do it again?
13:36
Do it? I often do.
13:36
I go, what's the point of it? How long will I feel like this?
13:40
Well, is there any other benefits?
13:42
Unfortunately, because of them, my sciency kind of background
13:45
and inquisitive kind of nature took over.
13:46
I had to research the hell out of it to to fully understand
13:49
what was going on. Because you know that the one of
13:52
the, the first things that we learnt about when we were
13:54
starting the podcast was the dopamine hit that you get out of
13:57
this. And apparently it's the same as
14:00
if you're smoking cannabis. So yeah.
14:04
And, and it's just, it's sort of a league.
14:06
So we actually, I think we sold one of our programmes as a legal
14:09
high. So it was just amazing.
14:12
Yeah, but so. So we were hooked.
14:14
After that, yeah, clearly that first hand experience made a
14:17
big, made a big difference. And, and then obviously as you
14:21
go into that rabbit hole, you then start to look at the
14:24
opposite, which is like heat and thermal stress from sauna and
14:28
then you're thinking about nature.
14:29
And, and that then led to me setting up the business.
14:32
I was going to say, is that what was sort of opened up these 5,
14:35
because you've got the five steps, haven't you, the five
14:37
pillars, sorry, the five pillars.
14:39
So just tell us a wee bit about that.
14:42
To supplement the triathlon coaching, I also do a little bit
14:45
of health and well-being, speaking mainly for corporate
14:47
and organisations, but I'd happily do it for any groups
14:50
really. And it's just to introduce the
14:53
fact that we've got, we've gone far away from what we're
14:58
actually evolved to be able to cope with and what has done us
15:02
good in the past. We.
15:04
As humans, yeah. So.
15:06
In current times, our modern lifestyle feels normal, but it's
15:10
not normal for Homo sapiens as a as a as a human, most of our
15:16
evolutionary pressure has come from the environment, but
15:19
pressure and stress as what's led to us being evolved to this
15:24
state now. But that means, you know, the
15:27
influence of the sun, the sun rising and the sun setting.
15:31
But we've, we've kind of moved away from that because we've got
15:34
artificial lighting, lots of other things that extend our day
15:37
massively. So we don't have to go to bed
15:39
when the sun goes down. We can extend the day much
15:42
longer if we, if we want to. Similarly that, you know, heat
15:45
and cold stress. If you didn't have a house and
15:48
air conditioning and central heating and lovely warm clothes
15:52
made of fabulous textiles, you would get cold.
15:56
But most people don't ever need to get cold anymore.
16:00
And similarly, you know, in the UK particularly, we don't get
16:02
very hot most of the time. So a lot of these stresses that
16:06
were caused by the environment, which would promote positive,
16:09
very positive adaptations within the body that we now don't.
16:13
Experience those so they've have they have they been diluted or
16:17
have they been diverted or it's often.
16:19
Converted to the comfort crisis. OK.
16:21
Because we've made like our own, you know, sort of advantages
16:26
that we've gained through technology and science and
16:29
industry and everything that's made life a little bit easier
16:32
and more mechanistic, you know, with with machines and computers
16:36
that will do lots for us. It's taken away a lot of the
16:38
stress. Life's become much more
16:40
comfortable, even though it might not feel it to us if we
16:43
compared ourselves to our ancestors.
16:45
Life is a hell of a lot more comfortable than, than it was.
16:49
And there's benefits to that, you know, with medicine and
16:52
antibiotics and vaccines and everything, life was extended
16:55
massively. But apart from those things, the
16:58
rates of disease are still quite high from chronic conditions.
17:02
And, and I think mainly that's because we're not open to the
17:06
elements. And that that's what made me
17:08
sell the five pillars, which I like to talk about.
17:12
The fact, Yeah, Tell, tell me. Yeah, so.
17:14
So. What they're not in any
17:16
particular, all because it's important not to try and provide
17:20
hierarchy because everybody would just want to start at the
17:22
top one. And absolutely, yeah.
17:24
Or, or make them regimented. They've got to be fluid then,
17:27
yes. Yeah.
17:28
And each have got distinct benefits that the others can't
17:30
necessarily provide. So they are very fluid.
17:33
So movement, yeah, which obviously incorporates exercise,
17:36
but exercise is a very recent phenomenon.
17:39
You know, exercise didn't exist probably before the 1960s or
17:43
1970s and it was an any doubt to just people working at desk
17:47
jobs, right? So, so exercise is all for
17:50
people that exercise is really healthy and the concept is fine,
17:54
but we wouldn't need it if we all worked in the fields or if
17:57
we all had, you know, very heavy labour based jobs.
18:00
We wouldn't decide to go and exercise in the evening.
18:02
Wouldn't, as you say, we? Wouldn't need it, wouldn't have
18:04
the energy, you wouldn't need to.
18:07
So we don't call it exercise. It's very much movement based.
18:10
So even just incorporate more steps in your day and just more
18:13
general physical activity, whether that's a bit of
18:15
gardening or whatever. So it's not, again, it's not
18:18
triathlon based. I've got 2 separate.
18:21
It's not performance or anything.
18:24
So that's that's the movement pillar.
18:26
We've then got sleep, which obviously is a cornerstone of
18:29
being healthy. We can find so much evidence as
18:33
to why sleep is incredibly important to us from from all
18:36
angles really, and so we talk about how to improve sleep and
18:40
maintain the quality of the sleep as well as the quantity of
18:43
sleep. Yeah, I seem to remember reading
18:45
the book All Late Teens 1718 by Rajan Chatterjee, and he was, he
18:51
talked about different sort of facets and sleep was one that he
18:56
really focused down on. I don't think, I don't think any
18:59
of us just realized how important sleep is.
19:02
Yeah. Because.
19:03
It's very passive time, isn't it?
19:04
You go to bed, you go to sleep and then you wake up, apart from
19:08
the odd dream or whatever, you're not really aware of what
19:10
went on for that 8 hours, no. And so it's very easy to think
19:13
it's not that important because you didn't experience it.
19:16
It was it was very passive in nature.
19:19
And therefore, you know, that leads people obviously to
19:21
prioritise the daytime and being very productive, wake up early,
19:25
maybe burn the candle at both ends and stay up late in order
19:28
to achieve more things. And that also comes up in the
19:32
triathlon sphere because people are very, very busy and they
19:34
want to fit the training in and get fitter.
19:37
So they'll wake up a bit earlier or they'll do a session very
19:39
late in the evening. But then if you exercise very
19:42
late in the evening, it makes you sleep quite poor quality
19:45
because. The.
19:45
Temperature is really high and so I need to warm them a little
19:49
bit about that. Because you only get fitter when
19:52
you're recovering. You don't get to as you train.
19:54
So if you're already shattered and stressed and you're trying
19:58
to squeeze more training in by waking up an hour early, maybe
20:02
you'd have got fitter by having. An hour skin bed.
20:05
Sleep and not getting up to ride your bike.
20:07
So now again, I don't know how much other triathlon coaches
20:11
would think about that, but that's where the 2 Worlds kind
20:13
of meet is. Their performance also, as well
20:16
as health, is very much governed by quality sleep and quality
20:20
recovery from what stresses have been imposed on you through the
20:23
day. So sleep's very, very important.
20:26
And then we've got healthy eating and again, I've avoided
20:28
using the word diet or nutrition because specific in nature and
20:32
also the word diet can be quite inflammatory and.
20:35
I was going to say, it's all. It's almost suggesting the
20:37
problem before it started, isn't it?
20:39
Yeah, so. So we talk more about healthy
20:41
eating and that's just some very simple practices.
20:43
It's not going into the nutritional side.
20:45
It's just about structuring your meals, basics of basics of how
20:49
to structure a good healthy plate of food and the good and
20:52
the bad and the uglier food and and that and it's so again,
20:55
it's, it's a nice practical level that everybody could
20:58
adopt. Yeah.
20:59
That needing to know nutrition facts and things like.
21:02
That and if people went on to your website, could they get the
21:05
guidance as to what sort of meal suggestions or frameworks or
21:10
would you just sort of say well? Yeah, there's an overview on
21:13
there of these pillars and. Okay, okay.
21:15
When I go to do a talk, I do one to two hours just on healthy
21:19
eating. Ohh, I see.
21:21
OK, OK. Cool.
21:22
Yeah. But again, when I still avoid
21:24
because I'm, you know, I need to respect my own boundaries.
21:27
A lot of this is my knowledge and my research, but I've not
21:30
trained as a nutritionist, I've not got any Dietetic or
21:33
dietitian qualifications. So I very much try and stay down
21:36
the middle Rd. advising and raising awareness.
21:40
But if somebody wanted a specific diet plan, obviously
21:43
you know, I've got a particular ailment or I've got these
21:46
symptoms, I wouldn't venture to. No, that's good.
21:49
That's good to know because you know, we've got to try and sort
21:52
of manage our listener will sort of think I'm going to go on to
21:55
adapted life and I'll, I'll sort of you can pick something up and
21:59
I think it's that guidance that they'll get.
22:01
And a lot of people just doing the basics and just
22:03
understanding the basic principles is enough to make a
22:07
difference. Sure, we can.
22:08
We can be guilty of making things way too difficult for
22:10
people. And once you start even using
22:13
the word like protein and carbohydrate and blah, blah,
22:16
blah, and this percentage of that and this much already,
22:18
people's eyes start to glaze over.
22:20
And that's never going to allow people to change because you've
22:23
already made a barrier. Yeah, absolutely.
22:25
We need to keep things simple, but.
22:28
Understandable and still worthwhile, but then allow them
22:31
to make some simple changes, right?
22:33
And and once people make simple changes, hopefully then you get
22:37
this snowball effect. Don't you work where they want
22:39
to be more involved, They want to learn a bit more, they want
22:41
to make a few more changes, they can see the benefit.
22:44
And yeah, the the rabbits at the trap is no, yeah, yeah, yeah,
22:47
yeah. So to and, and no, one of the
22:51
other pillars that I've noticed was when I was reading was about
22:55
emotions. And that really sort of caught
22:57
me because this is this is a very emotive thing, a whole
23:02
entity that you're actually sort of not preaching, but you're
23:05
actually saying to people is out there and you can use.
23:10
And how's how does how do you find your audiences emotionally
23:14
react to you? I think that the sort of the
23:18
awareness that human beings are are benefit or or, you know, do
23:24
well in communities when they're connected to other human beings
23:28
is it is to some people is quite new because they, they don't
23:32
necessarily think of it in that way, but you can highlight it,
23:36
right? You're asking people to think
23:37
about where they they felt a bit down or they felt a bit
23:39
isolated, or maybe they've had a bad day and how an interaction
23:42
with another person could change their mindset, could, could
23:45
change their sense of well-being.
23:47
Unfortunately, interactions with people can obviously go the
23:49
other way as well. If you have an argument or a
23:51
very stressful sort of meeting with somebody, but there are
23:55
people who you can spend 5 to 10 minutes with and there's just
23:59
something about that interaction that lifts your spirit for a
24:02
while that makes you feel better.
24:05
And I don't think everybody's got the ability to do that, but
24:07
there are certainly some people that.
24:09
Well, I can honestly say to you, Phil, that the one of the
24:13
guiding principles of the Dunkers is, is that sort of
24:17
community, it's that camaraderie that everybody or we all will
24:22
know everybody, but we'll look out for them as well.
24:25
And that's and that is a great feeling.
24:27
Isn't it? And again, it comes back to the
24:29
fact that you've got a shared, you've got a shared experience
24:32
or a shared reality. If you just went around Abersoft
24:35
and tried to pull people together to form a like fake
24:38
community, as it were, like, oh, we should all do stuff together
24:41
and we should all be more friendly and we should do stuff
24:43
for, I suppose it's a bit more like a neighborhood watch scheme
24:45
or something from the old days. But it's very hard to hold that
24:50
community together because there isn't much of A bond between
24:53
them. You're relying on the geography
24:54
of the fact that they all live on the same street.
24:57
But actually that isn't much of A bond, just that proximity.
25:00
But if you can have a small area like like I have a sock and
25:04
within that there's 304050 people all enjoy the same
25:08
activity or have the same beliefs about the benefit of
25:12
cold or the value of being in nature or in the sea or
25:15
whatever. That's already something that
25:17
brings you together. And it's not that difficult then
25:20
to then expand that. So well, why don't we, why don't
25:22
we do a podcast and have a chat? Why don't we meet up for a
25:24
coffee or have a, you know, a quiz night or a pub night?
25:27
Or it connects. It gets really sticky.
25:31
Yeah. And again, for us, it's
25:33
triathlon because we can build a community around the shared love
25:36
of sport. I.
25:37
Think triathlon works because of I know the the the 5th of the
25:41
pillars is the net is nature. Yeah.
25:43
Do you think triathlon has got that?
25:45
Is nature as important to triathletes as it is to dunkers?
25:49
No, no, isn't it? No numbers.
25:51
Numbers are important to triathlon.
25:54
But again, this is part of my coaching because when we're
25:57
looking at the improvement in triathlon, if you're solely
26:01
focused on performance metrics, data, you know, all things that
26:05
you can measure in life, smart watching from the computer
26:08
things, it becomes quite clinical.
26:13
Yeah, and, and every session that you do is black or white
26:17
kind of pass or fail, success or fail.
26:19
And therefore it can become demoralizing.
26:21
And you can't always be motivated by those numbers
26:23
because you can't always be better than your previous self.
26:26
It doesn't doesn't work like that.
26:28
Some days you're better and your numbers look good and so you're
26:31
very happy. Other days you're just not on
26:33
top of your game and your numbers look bad and then you
26:35
feel bad about yourself. What we try, what I really try
26:38
to do is find other ways to help people maintain consistent
26:41
habits. And one of the things is to
26:43
actually reflect on the fact that do you know what, When I go
26:46
for a ride, if I ride with this group of people, I come back and
26:50
I've always gone a bit further. I've stayed out a bit longer.
26:54
The time passed quicker and I didn't think about the effort
26:57
level because I was chatting and I was riding and we stopped for
26:59
coffee and I've come back feeling super motivated.
27:02
Had they done that same ride on their own or perhaps indoors on
27:06
one of the turbo trains that we use?
27:08
It's not just not the same and similarly in nature, you know,
27:12
just reflecting on the fact that if you go for a run on trails,
27:16
as as regards to running on road, cars passing new things,
27:20
it's a totally different experience.
27:22
But if you're totally hung up on numbers, you'll probably run
27:25
faster on a flat tarmac surface with cars driving at 30-40 miles
27:30
an hour past you because it's easier to run faster on that
27:33
surface. So if the numbers really matter,
27:35
you'll always be driven to where your numbers look better.
27:39
But if you're happy to let them go for a while, you will
27:42
probably come back much more motivated, much happier, much
27:46
more, you know, satisfied with the exercise session if you went
27:49
out and ran on some trails and in the woods.
27:52
So you've got that is going to really positively affect your
27:56
mental condition because you've had different types of movement
27:59
or the same type of movement in a different environment.
28:02
And yeah. Because one session in isolation
28:06
doesn't define you. So if you run a little slower
28:10
because you're running on gravel and there's a few hills and
28:12
you've got to duck under some branches and there's a stream to
28:14
cross and whatever else, you might come back and your speed
28:18
of running might be a few seconds slower.
28:20
Or simply not. You know, you can't measure
28:23
things as accurately because the terrain keeps changing.
28:27
But one session is just one of many.
28:30
We want the person to come back the next day and to get fitter.
28:33
It's a process that takes many to get healthier as well.
28:36
It's a process that takes many, many years.
28:38
So consistency is absolutely key and community really, really
28:43
helps consistency because some days you don't want to do it.
28:47
Whatever it is we're talking about, you just don't want to do
28:49
it. It's nice and warm in the house.
28:50
You know you've got sucked into the sofa, it's sucked you in.
28:53
It's nice and warm. Something on the TV, you're a
28:56
bit tired or your legs aching or whatever it is, but you might
29:01
then still go and do the cold air.
29:03
Or you might go to do the exercise session if your friends
29:05
are gone because you don't really feel like doing the
29:08
exercise or the cold air. But the fact they're there, drag
29:12
them out, Yeah. Is that how you avoid burnout?
29:14
I was. It's something that was in my
29:16
mind. I was wonder why and how people
29:19
who are triathletes or who train regularly for competition, how
29:24
do they avoid burnout? It's about managing the stress
29:27
and managing the load. So the other thing that I've
29:30
really, really keen on and I tried to help every one of my
29:33
clients understand, is that your body tends to perceive stress as
29:38
stress. So when you release stress
29:40
hormones, when you react to any form of stress, the reactions
29:45
are the same. So you might release adrenaline,
29:47
you might release cortisol, which can be good and bad, your
29:51
heart rate might spike, your blood pressure might go up, you
29:53
know, you might breathe a little quicker and all these things.
29:56
But it doesn't matter if that stress is work stress, emotional
30:00
stress, family stress, exercise based stress, cold induced
30:05
stress. Your body perceives it as
30:07
stress. Now, we can only tolerate so
30:10
much. So if we've got a sink that is
30:13
filling up with water, which is stress coming in, and our tap
30:17
leaving it is adequately draining the sink at the same
30:20
rate, the stress won't affect us too much.
30:23
We've got balance in our life. But if that tap gets blocked and
30:28
the sink is filling, or if the incoming rushing stress water
30:32
into the sink is so quick that we can't cope with it, then we
30:36
will. We will really struggle because
30:38
stress is the mental thing, but it's a physical.
30:40
It's a physical, hormonal thing as well we need.
30:43
Nice analogy. I think that's really going to
30:46
resonate. Yeah, So like if I'm adding
30:48
training stress as a as a coach, I've got to know or hopefully
30:53
have a good enough relationship with my clients that they no and
30:57
they're happy to tell me when they're going through stress at
30:59
home because maybe I need to back off the training stress
31:03
because their home life stress or work stress is really high at
31:06
the minute. That could be a bereavement or
31:08
could be maybe pressure. They might lose their job or
31:11
changing house, moving house or whatever it is that stress is
31:15
still stressed. So if I'm giving them a very
31:18
stressful week of training at the same time, they might not
31:22
come and then I'm not doing them any good.
31:25
So I need to rely on my relationship with them that
31:27
they're happy enough to tell me, look, Phil, I'm under the cost
31:29
at work this week. Can you have a look at my
31:31
training and just make some adjustments because I don't
31:33
think I can cope with that. Got it.
31:36
This is, this is like for me, this is like high level coaching
31:39
because you can't read it in the book.
31:41
And it's not about the science of designing a good training
31:44
session. It's about working with people.
31:45
Yeah. And relationship building.
31:48
I'm going to come left field here.
31:49
Are there are there any small habits that people can that all
31:54
of us can actually adopt and just sort of think, oh, I heard
31:57
that when Mark was talking to Phil.
32:00
Are there any small habits about how to sort of manage that
32:03
stress a bit, dilute it or to to not allow it to get so
32:08
compulsive that it actually changes us negatively?
32:12
I. Think that the first point would
32:16
be to recognise the symptoms of it, to recognise when you're
32:19
stressed. Because I've talked to people
32:21
before and they said I don't get stressed.
32:23
And I'm thinking that that's like, we've all been like, even
32:26
if you don't feel like this person very often, I think we
32:29
can all recognise times when we have felt stressed.
32:32
But I have definitely talked to people.
32:34
So now I don't get stressed and it's like London.
32:36
And when you they've just not labeled it as stressed, they've
32:39
felt the symptoms. So if it's maybe being a bit
32:42
more emotionally volatile, you know, not as patient as you
32:45
would normally be, whether it's, again, noticing that your
32:49
breathing is a little quicker. You know, it's, I suppose it's
32:52
going to be relatively extreme for you to get palpitations and
32:55
get a lot of the physical manifestations, you know, maybe
32:58
like increase sweat rate podcast or whatever.
33:01
You've got sweaty armpits. That's a mild stress.
33:05
Yeah. But it's recognizing any of
33:07
those changes in your behaviour because one of the typical like
33:11
stress responses is that we we kind of, we can't tolerate
33:14
things as well. So things that would normally
33:16
annoy you, but you'd normally just go.
33:18
So they start to really weigh heavy on you and you're more
33:21
likely to like have a lash in the patients might go, yeah,
33:24
patients go. And also you're not as accepting
33:27
of new challenges. You just want to keep things
33:29
very like to like blink a very tunnel vision because you're
33:32
already stressed enough and then you don't want anything on the
33:35
periphery adding to that. So you just want to try and keep
33:38
everything very strict. And and that's another sign for
33:41
me that if you're not willing to accept like new challenges,
33:44
somebody said, oh, should we do this at the weekend or should
33:46
you go and do that? Or do you fancy doing this race
33:49
and you're like, no, you can't do that and you almost won't
33:52
allow anything in, right. OK.
33:54
I think that's another sign that you're getting stressed because
33:56
you're just trying to keep life very ordered, very simple, so we
33:59
can deal with that stress. So if we, if we can see these
34:02
signs and we know we're losing patience, we feel as though
34:06
we're getting a bit introspective, even our loved
34:09
ones are becoming a real sort of pain to us.
34:11
Then is there, is there any, is it breathing?
34:14
Is it OK? I've heard breathing techniques.
34:16
Is it going for what? Literally going for what?
34:19
I mean, what would you say was a sort of A and if you dial 999 on
34:23
the stress on the data, what, what would you expect?
34:26
The main point there would. Probably be that in the
34:29
instance, particularly if you feel very anxious in the
34:33
instant, you can control your mental state better by physical
34:38
means than by trying to think your way through it.
34:40
So if you try to rationalize why am I feeling anxious?
34:43
What's going on? What's made me feel like this?
34:45
Why am I why am I feeling stressed at the minute like
34:47
work's not so bad and you know, etcetera.
34:50
To think your way out of feeling anxious is I don't know if it's
34:53
impossible, but it's incredibly difficult to do.
34:56
But if you reverse the physical manifestations of that, so
35:02
breathe, that's where the breathing comes in.
35:04
If you could do some very slow nasal breathing, extending the
35:08
exhale, maybe doing a breath hold slow it basically slowing
35:12
everything right down. Your body feels more relaxed and
35:15
your brain follows. But don't try and talk yourself
35:19
into feeling relaxed would be mine.
35:20
Yeah, that's that's really good advice.
35:22
Go for the physical. Aspect first and the other one
35:25
is just like smiling and laughing.
35:27
You can't be stressed and if you're able to laugh and smile
35:32
but it feels forced because you don't feel like smiling.
35:35
But if you kept little things like that, the physical, the
35:38
behaviour side will then influence the mind.
35:41
And so in an acute setting, if you really want to feel a bit
35:44
better right now and not stressed, it's taking a few
35:47
minutes away. Some relaxed breathing
35:49
exercises, whether it's yogic type stuff, box breathing, which
35:53
is, you know, an inhale, yes, hold, hold for about four
35:57
seconds, exhale for about four seconds and then hold on the
36:01
exhale, which is a little bit more stressful.
36:04
But that those types of breath work where you're basically
36:07
slowing everything down. And the particular bit that's
36:10
worth really slowing down is the exhale.
36:13
OK, so that's where that's really calming.
36:16
So again, when we think about the, we were talking before
36:18
about the the vagus nerve and the parasympathetic nervous
36:21
system, it's the exhale that brings that that really
36:24
facilitates that rather than the inhale is quite stimulatory, of
36:28
course. But the exhale is much more
36:30
calming and really seems to work on the parasympathetic nervous
36:34
system more. So irrespective of how quickly
36:36
you breathe in, if you can just slow down the breathing out then
36:40
that allows. Things to come down OK, on your
36:43
website you there are and I would sort of advise anybody,
36:48
everybody to to after listening to this podcast to make sure
36:51
that they go and see its website address.
36:54
Adapted life dot. Co.uk, there we go, and we won't
36:57
let you go because we'll say that again before the end.
37:00
On your website, you talk about various courses and retreats and
37:03
guided programs. Just before we finish.
37:06
Just tell us a bit about those, Phil, if you will.
37:10
Sorry, go on, explain that. Well, really you've got these,
37:13
you've got the courses and the retreats and the guided
37:15
programs. Can anybody just just sign up
37:17
for those or how do you access that?
37:20
Because obviously you're talking about them on the website and
37:24
it's if people sort of see that and think, OK, well, what are
37:27
these guided? Courses, yeah.
37:29
The the the work that I've done mainly, as I said before, is
37:31
predominantly been for corporate entities that have come to me
37:35
for health and well-being. Sessions.
37:37
I see. I see.
37:39
Sorry, I've done some work with David Lloyd Jim's to provide
37:43
some health and well-being type sessions for them.
37:45
Because again, going back to what I said before about
37:49
exercise being quite is the invention really.
37:52
A lot of people go to the gym with the intention of like
37:54
smashing themselves to bits every time they go thinking that
37:57
that's virtuous and the more sweat they leave on the match
37:59
the better. And when I tell them the
38:01
opposite is true and it's hard because it goes against what's
38:06
been marketed to them. What social media?
38:08
Absolutely. And what the gym sell.
38:12
But it's the right messages that we don't always.
38:14
We should probably go to the gym quite often if we enjoy the
38:17
environment, but we shouldn't be trying to smash ourselves to
38:20
bits just to make up for the fact we've been sat at a
38:22
desperate hours at work. That's not the right attitude.
38:25
And that again fits with triathlon training because we,
38:29
if someone's trained for triathlon, they're often
38:31
training every day of the week and a lot of the time 2/2 times
38:34
a day. So they'll do 10 to 14 exercise
38:37
sessions, individual access per week.
38:39
Now if we don't get the intensity balance right, then
38:43
they, like you said, a bit burnt out, overtrained to stress,
38:45
etcetera. They just would give up.
38:48
So most of the workouts that we do are quite low level.
38:51
You could talk, maybe not as easily as we're talking here,
38:55
you'd be mildly out of breath. But we have to do that because
38:58
you can't have 10 to 14 hours of exercising a week and do it all
39:03
intense. But for the average gym dollar,
39:06
who might go 2, three times a week, you could probably smash
39:09
yourself every time. You could work as hard literally
39:11
for an hour or 45 minutes in a spin class or where it is.
39:14
You could probably work as absolutely as hard as you can
39:17
with the instructor shouting at you and then, you know, feel
39:20
absolutely shattered, probably quite sore, maybe sore for days
39:23
after, but actually feel quite good about yourself.
39:26
But that's not sustainable. And actually for health, it's
39:29
probably not the best way to do it.
39:30
I know. So again, this is a lot of what
39:33
I like to talk about because it throws a spanner in the works.
39:37
And it's a bit, it's a bit controversial.
39:38
It's not controversial if you understand the mechanisms, but
39:42
because the mechanisms don't align with marketing and social
39:45
media and things, then for people to try and get their head
39:48
around, it's really quite. Struggling.
39:50
It's the word that's sort of going through my mind is
39:53
moderation. It's it's it's about sort of
39:56
guidance, clearly. It's about commitment, clearly,
40:00
but it's about moderation, just doing it.
40:02
But consistency, Exactly. That's the word you used earlier
40:05
on. Yeah.
40:06
Trump's intensity? Yes, every time.
40:09
Across. The board, across the board, if
40:12
you exercise really well now and quite intensely for the next
40:15
month, it's probably going to have minimal effects on your
40:17
long term health and the length of your life because one month
40:20
over 70 to 80 years is it's inconsequential.
40:24
So if you go and exercise that, and this happens a lot, doesn't
40:27
it, with fads to do dieting and exercise, we get so keen on the
40:30
1st of January, like I said, with the cold water or whatever
40:33
your experience is, you go and give it everything that you've
40:37
got, but then it gets a bit miserable.
40:39
You feel so sore and so tired all the time.
40:42
And you know, when you do exercise that hard, it often
40:44
drives your hunger and your appetite, so you can often eat
40:48
more than you would have eaten had you not even done the
40:51
exercise. And so when we're looking at
40:53
calorie balance, I just, you know, for people who want to
40:55
improve their body composition and maybe lose a little bit of
40:58
body fat, however, they can end up actually gaining weight by
41:02
training harder. Because it's so stressful.
41:05
Yeah, yeah. When you're recovering.
41:07
Afterwards, it can drive your appetite even higher, right?
41:10
Whereas had you exercised more modestly, more moderately, your
41:13
appetite's often not affected. OK, so this and this is yeah,
41:17
yeah, this is part of the rabbit hole that I've been, I've been
41:20
down for the last number of years, but.
41:22
Clearly you can see the light down there.
41:24
Yeah, you know, to me, I can talk about it.
41:27
And again, I'm not an expert, but I can be quite passionate
41:30
about it because it just makes sense.
41:32
Yeah, when you understand it, it just all makes sense.
41:35
And it's therefore not like I'm peddling snake oil.
41:37
No, it just just, yeah, yeah, I'm just going to ask one good
41:41
thing, and that is Colin told me before we'd met, said, oh, you
41:45
must say, have a word with Phil about his Iron Man, because
41:49
apparently you've done Iron Man as well as triathlon.
41:52
Yes, Iron Man's the longest. Generally it's the longest of
41:55
the triathlon distances, so it takes most of the whole day.
41:58
Oh, does it? OK, it's a two 2.4 mile swim,
42:02
which is, you know, in itself is a long time to be in a lake or
42:05
the sea or wherever. And it's 112 miles on a bike,
42:09
which again, most people wouldn't think of driving.
42:11
You're right. And then you run a marathon at
42:13
the end of it. So now that's the bit that
42:15
brings it home to people, because most of the general
42:18
public would think running a marathon is quite an ordeal, you
42:21
know, to run 10. Miles I think most of the
42:23
general public would. When you've already been out for
42:25
8 hours before even getting to the marathon or whatever it's
42:29
taking, then it's yeah. So I again, it's, it's something
42:32
that I was passionate about and, and got quite good at and went
42:36
to the world championship in, in Hawaii.
42:38
So you can, if you, if you do well in your age category, so
42:42
many people per year can go to the World Championships.
42:44
And that's, that's in Kona, HI, which again was just the
42:47
pinnacle of, of that was successful.
42:49
Well, the buzz. That must have been amazing.
42:51
Yeah, yeah, yeah. So.
42:53
But you're glad you've done it. Oh yeah, yeah.
42:56
But then what's interesting is that by completing that personal
43:00
challenge, because that I'd always been my goal to get
43:02
there, that took some of the enjoyment away from it for me
43:06
because I'd achieved what I wanted to.
43:08
And now I'm much more passionate about the coaching and the
43:11
business and the passion I had for my personal goal of, of
43:16
being the best triathlete I could be in going to the World
43:18
Championships. Once I'd achieved that, I
43:21
obviously just the same person and still had goals.
43:23
They just, they just shifted. And so I found it harder to do,
43:28
to do triathlon, but to do Iron Man, particularly because you
43:31
need to invest so much of yourself into it.
43:33
If you drive isn't quite there, it's hard.
43:36
It's really hard to do. And it's not that the drive is
43:38
gone, but the drive has shifted to to the coaching, you know,
43:42
each year now. And that's what focus is about,
43:44
isn't it? You know, you think Focus moves
43:46
and and you know it's not always in the same.
43:49
The sites don't always look at the same thing.
43:52
And I can still be successful, but it's by sending other people
43:56
to Conan. Yeah.
43:57
And enjoying vicariously. And the fact that I played a
43:59
small part in them being able to go.
44:01
Absolutely. And and that, you know, that's
44:04
essentially at this moment in time, that's much more
44:06
rewarding. Brilliant.
44:07
Brilliant. Well, honestly, it's, I mean,
44:10
just a revelation. It's, you know, for me here,
44:13
it's I'm just, I'm just gobsmacked because it's just
44:18
the, the way that you've done it and the way you chunk it down.
44:20
I'm going to just ask one thing that's gone through my mind.
44:23
Of the five pillars, which is the one that people usually get
44:26
wrong because we've got movement, sleep, nature,
44:29
emotions and nutrition, which is the one that usually people
44:34
might find a bit harder? I, I think it's difficult to say
44:39
when, when I do some of the talks, what I do is, is say as
44:44
we're summing up and as we're concluding at the end of the
44:46
session, at the end of the days, I've given you a lot of
44:48
information today. We've talked about 5 pillars.
44:51
I've told you an absolute ton of things that you could be doing
44:53
better. And if I leave you like that,
44:55
you're going to do nothing. So it's information overload
44:59
which doesn't result in, in action.
45:01
If I bombard you with these 50 things that you're not doing
45:05
well and you should be doing, you'll do none of them.
45:08
You're unlikely to do any because what is the point?
45:10
If I'm not doing 50 things well, why should even bother doing one
45:14
of them, right? Because it doesn't matter.
45:15
So once I've done that, what I really want to do at the end of
45:18
the session is try to help them focus on the one area that's
45:21
going to make the most difference to them.
45:23
So I'll get them to look at the pillars and say, right, you
45:26
know, which one? Have you identified that you
45:29
really are quite poorer? So I do it more on an individual
45:33
level. OK, you.
45:35
Think that it's the sleep side of things that you're finding.
45:38
Yeah, I know from what you've said, my sleep habits, my sleep
45:41
hygiene very poor. I've got lack of routine and
45:45
structure and whatever I do, I'm sucked into using the phone and
45:49
the social media too late in the evening or whatever.
45:51
Then that's where they because if they can just improve sleep,
45:55
then that might have, you know, we're going back to the.
45:59
Book is absolutely. Awful and all the other pillars
46:02
you're not so bad at. Just try and work on sleep and
46:05
forget the rest for now. So you know, it's nice to come
46:07
back to once you've made some some differences and hopefully
46:11
felt a little bit better and seen some improvement, then
46:14
maybe come back to it. And then maybe look at the
46:16
eating and look at the movement side of things.
46:18
But I think we need to again, to make this actionable and help
46:22
people form really good habits, we've got to keep it simple.
46:26
And keep it personal. Yeah, keep it personal.
46:28
So although I'm talking to groups, I don't do this on a one
46:31
to one level because you know, again, it will probably take too
46:34
much time. It's it's about them within the
46:38
group, just. And I think a lot of people
46:39
might find it with respect to intense because you're asking
46:43
them not only to sort of understand a different way of
46:47
life. This this, as we said at the
46:49
beginning, is this whole lifestyle balance.
46:52
They've never thought of that. We've never thought of that.
46:55
All of a sudden we've got an awakening and that's a shaking
46:58
it shaking us at the same time. And to take that and then to
47:01
take the solutions and then to try and adapt it into your life.
47:05
That's that's a lot going on. That's what you say in Overload
47:08
I. Guess.
47:08
Yeah. And like the take away messages
47:10
that because life feels normal to us now, but it's not
47:15
essentially normal for us as human beings.
47:17
It's very easy to accept, Yeah. But the difficult thing for us,
47:21
and it is really, really difficult for every single human
47:24
being, is you have to consciously choose to do things
47:27
that make your life more difficult now for your future
47:30
conflict. So if you want you in your 70s
47:33
and 80s to be living healthier with less visits to the doctors,
47:37
with the ability to go out on holidays and walk with your
47:40
grandkids and etcetera, etcetera, you need to suffer
47:44
some discomfort now. And that's, you know, using the
47:47
cold dips, it's not comfortable using the sauna for 20-30
47:50
minutes. That's not comfortable
47:52
exercising or moving when you don't have to because you could
47:55
use the elevator and the escalator and you could go in
47:58
the car and all these things, we have to choose to do them.
48:02
Yeah. Whereas if they were enforced
48:04
upon us by a lifestyle, because we don't have the technology, we
48:07
don't have the the warmth and the air conditioning, we don't
48:09
have the vehicles, we life was just more difficult, we wouldn't
48:13
need to make those choices. No.
48:14
And that's the fact that ultimately the thing that
48:17
underpins a lot of this is we have to choose discomfort now.
48:20
I'm going to leave it at that. That's a lovely, lovely message
48:23
to take. A lovely and 1 secret question.
48:26
And that is what changed your life little one thing you think
48:31
changed your life? Was it dunking or was it?
48:34
Definitely. Yeah, there's, I think there's,
48:36
there's three things. Oh, wow.
48:38
One, we've not spoken mice. It's quite a personal thing, but
48:41
in my 20s, I developed an autoimmune condition which is
48:45
called ankylosing spondylitis, which meant my immune system was
48:48
fighting itself. And I had for about 10 to 15
48:52
years just uncontrolled low back pain, could hardly work,
48:55
couldn't some days couldn't even stand on one leg because the
48:57
because the pain was so severe. It would come and go, but it
49:01
was, it was really quite difficult.
49:02
Couldn't get a diagnosis for a long, long time.
49:04
We went to millions of specialists injections and we're
49:07
the wonderful treatments as you would and eventually 12 to 15
49:12
years after it started knows the condition and it meant I was
49:16
eligible for an injection that I have to self inject and it
49:19
turned my life around. That's how I got into triathlon
49:22
because I thought I don't know how long this pain is going to
49:24
be gone for and if it comes back I want to achieve something.
49:28
So I signed up for an Iron Man 12 months later.
49:31
Then that was so. Then that was literally like
49:33
you. Know that was ballsy, let's be
49:34
honest. But it was, but it was
49:36
enforcement because I just didn't stop working after a
49:40
while. Now I'm now, well, many, many
49:44
years after starting. I started probably at 23, so
49:47
about 20 years of them and they still work perfectly well.
49:51
So that's one thing. That's a revelation.
49:53
The second was unfortunately the COVID pandemic was bad for a lot
49:58
of people, but it opened my eyes to a different way of life.
50:01
If we'd not have had the enforced changes related to the
50:05
the social aspects of of COVID-19, I wouldn't have been
50:09
off work in the NHS, the coaching business wouldn't have
50:11
built. I wouldn't have had a slight
50:13
window to look into this new lifestyle and how life could be.
50:17
And I've not looked back from that point.
50:18
So actually I I think I would still be working as a physio.
50:22
Yeah. Yeah.
50:23
COVID, yeah. COVID changed so many.
50:25
People. So I have to be thankful for
50:26
that. Yeah, though.
50:27
Yeah, yeah, it was a negative. Yeah, it's a world issue, health
50:31
issue. It's not something we've had
50:32
before. And then the final one is like
50:34
saying it's my wife taking me to the cold dip.
50:36
Brilliant. Because had she not have
50:38
convinced me to go and give that a go, we wouldn't be sat here
50:41
talking. No, I wouldn't have built a new
50:43
company. I wouldn't have learned about
50:45
movement and nature and, you know, healthy eating.
50:49
So there's probably those three things that have been quite
50:51
pivotal in in my life really. And I bet it for the people.
50:54
So to get to this part of this podcast and sit down there and
50:58
think, what are the things that have influenced me?
51:00
They'll find 2 two or three things exactly the same.
51:04
Phil, really, really great talking to you.
51:06
Thank you very much for your time.
51:07
It's and the hospitality. We are actually recording this
51:10
in Phil's, one of Phil's living rooms.
51:13
So thank you once again. And I'll always sign off the
51:16
same way. And that is made the Spirit and
51:18
the dunkers go with you.