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Making Advertising a Kindor Space with Glen Hilzinger · We Built This Brand

• Glen Hilzinger: Some people are naturally candid and some people are naturally kind, and to find that balance can be a challenge, but it's something we work on every day. And it's a very important part of how we work with each other and how we work with our clients. Chris Hill: Welcome to We Built This Brand. I'm your host, Chris Hill. And today we're talking with Glen Hilzinger, the Chief Creative Officer at Luquire. Now, Glen has been named one of the top 10 copywriters in the world, according to AdAge, and is actually one of the 25 most creative people in advertising, according to Business Insider. So, he's got a lot of experience and background, and I'm really excited to talk to him today about what got him to that place, and the business, and the stuff he's doing at Luquire. He spent his career creating breakthrough campaigns for a wide range of brands. He's worked with the NCAA, he's worked with Minute Maid, Expedia, even Amazon. And he draws on this experience to come and create a really unique approach to marketing and advertising and everything that Luquire has to offer as their Chief Creative Officer. Today, we're going to talk to him about the culture that he's created at Luquire. A little bit about his background, but also the culture. I think it's really interesting because they went to the point of trademarking a word for their brand. It's called "Kindor." We're going to learn about what it is, how it got trademarked, and how it influences not only the company internally, but also how they deal with clients. We're also going to dive into some of Luquire's campaigns and some of the things that he's really proud about in the time he's been there helping that business grow. And it's just overall really enjoyed this conversation. He's got a lot of really good thoughts. I think you'll really enjoy it. So let's not hesitate any longer. Let's dive in. Here's my conversation with Glen Hilzinger, Chief Creative Officer at Luquire. Welcome back to We Built This Brand. I'm your host as always, Chris Hill. And today we're joined by. Glen Hilzinger. Glen, thank you for joining us today. Glen Hilzinger: Well, thank you very much for having me. It's great to be here. Chris Hill: Yeah. So today I want to talk to you a little bit more about your, your journey to getting to the company you're at now as Chief Creative Officer at Luquire and then talk a little bit about Luquire and the business, the brands you're building there and a little bit about Luquire itself and its brand. So, let's dive in. Tell me where you got your start in business. Glen Hilzinger: I got my start by, my mother talked me into going to art school. My brothers all went to Michigan Business School, and I think she realized that probably wasn't the right fit for me. So she talked me into art school, and so I went to the Center for Creative Studies in Detroit. Once I graduated, it took me a couple years, and then copywriting found me. And I've been a copywriter ever since. Chris Hill: So when you were in art school, what was your art medium of choice? Like what was your favorite medium to work in? Glen Hilzinger: I was graphic design. I had a graphic design degree, so I knew I had to do something commercial. I didn't have the wherewithal to make a go as a fine artist. So I knew I had to do something that was more commercially viable. So I did a design degree. Chris Hill: So you did that and then you became a copywriter. What was that transition like? Because you had been doing graphic design work. Copywriting is synonymous with like marketing advertising in the industry, but I don't think about going from, "I'm doing graphic design," to all of a sudden jumping to copywriting. So what was, what made you do that jump or was that just part of your undergraduate studies? Glen Hilzinger: Well, I can't say I ever really wanted to be a writer, but I guess my only real thought about being a writer was I either had to be a journalist, or I had to write a book. And long form writing has never been my forte. And I was introduced to some copywriting classes in art school. And I guess I didn't realize quite how much I liked them until I got out in the world, and realized I didn't like being a designer. So I had a, I was working for a small marketing firm, and I had a boss who was very well connected in the Detroit advertising industry. And of course I didn't even you know what a copywriter was. And through her, I got to understand the advertising business a little bit and understood there were copywriters and art directors. And I went to her one day and said, I, cause I was sort of doing some of the copywriting on the side when we needed headlines and stuff, and I realized I was enjoying that more than the design part. So I went to her and said, "I wonder with your connections, I wonder if you could help me get a job as a copywriter," and she said, "Okay, you're fired, but I'll give you two weeks and see if I can help you find a job. So I got a job at J. Walter Thompson as a Junior Copywriter. Chris Hill: That is really interesting because getting into the copywriting field, like what comes to mind to me is like, when I got out of college, I had a similar feeling of like, I never could, like, I just felt like there was so much I didn't know about the business world, even though I had a business degree. Like so many roles, so many jobs, so many opportunities that just weren't made, I wasn't made aware of in school. So yeah, that's, that's really cool making that career transition and making that job. It stinks the chip. Got fired. But, or was that, that more, was that more of an in jest "you're fired," or was that like, "no, you're, I have to let you go now. " Glen Hilzinger: I think it was a little of both because I think she knew she had to find something, somebody quickly to replace me. So yeah, it was a little bit of a joke, but she was great, and she worked really hard. Her name was Laura Parlov, and she was, she's really the one that got me started my advertising career. Chris Hill: Moving on to that. So now you're into writing and just from doing a little digging research on you, you're pretty good at copywriting. I mean, according to AdAges Creativity, you're one of the top 10 copywriters in the world. I mean, that's really cool. How, how did you get to that phase? Glen Hilzinger: I got lucky. We had a- that accolade comes specifically from a campaign we worked on to save our local library when I was back in Detroit, and we won quite a few awards. So that's where that accolade came from. But I like to think of myself as a student, as much as a teacher, so I can always get better. Chris Hill: Yeah, for sure. And then from there, it looks like your copywriting career really took off, you started to grow until you've basically ended up at Luquire about four or so years ago. So tell me, like, was it your desire to move up into a creative officer role when you moved into copywriting, or were you just hoping that copywriting would be the rest of your career? Glen Hilzinger: Well, that's a good question. I wasn't really sure. I mean that first job I had at J. Walter Thompson was an eye opener for me because, of course I just, I was just excited that I could use creativity in my job every day. And I love that job. When I got my very first assignment as a copywriter at J. Walter Thompson was a radio commercial for the Ford Mustang. It was a little bit of a shootout with the other copywriters, of course, that they were, they were all more experienced than I was. It was the, my first assignment ever. And it was the quintessential medium, which is radio for a copywriter. I knew that much. My boss gave me a stopwatch, and I didn't even know what that was for. That's how green I was. And I went in and presented my radio script, and the Chief Creative Officer leaned across the table and he wiped his butt with it. And he handed it back to me and said, "Next." So in answer to your question, I'm not sure I really had a clear path forward. I think that was a moment where I realized that, I don't know, I guess I was meant to be a copywriter cause I wasn't really deterred. I went back and wrote another script. I can't remember if I got it in the meeting or not, but anyway, I just loved copywriting that much, just the theater of the mind and the ability to sort of manage that craft and learn that I was better at that than I was at design, fortunately. And then I just followed that path. I was at J. Walter for. A couple of years and realized I was looking for more variety. So I went to Doner Advertising for, I think I was there about 13 years, and that's where I really sort of managed my career. Just sort of, you know, it just sort of happens. You become an associate creative director and creative director. And then I went from there to Leo Burnett, and I was there for, eight or nine years. And then the path to Luquire? I think I had gotten to a point where I felt like I still had a dragon to slay. Things were going well at Leo Burnett. It's a great company. It's a great agency. The big network agencies, there are certain limitations, and I think what I was really looking for was an agency where we could really do true 360 work. So Luquire popped up on my radar, and they have media. They have PR, of course. Strategy and creative and content, and I was really excited at the opportunity, not as much to be a Chief Creative Officer as it was to, to work at a place where I could really flex those 360 muscles in a way that I really hadn't previously. So Chief Creative Officer part is great. It's really exciting to have a new experience that I hadn't had up until that point. You know, I've managed teams, but never really managed a department or a vision or been part of a leadership team. So that part's been really exciting for me. Chris Hill: That is really interesting and growing with the career you never know where it's going to take you when you start, but it's really fun when it takes you to new and exciting places and allows you to continue to pursue what you're passionate about and be creative like that. I mean, creativity is something that drives me in my business and something I really enjoy. So I can totally identify with that passion, that enjoyment. And then the dragon to say, I love that phrase. Tell me more about this dragon you felt you had to slay. Was there something specific you hoped to do with that? Is that just like a desire for more, achieving more in the business or just like personal growth? What was that about? Glen Hilzinger: I think it's less personal growth and more, I think I felt like I really had a lot to give back. The industry has been really, really good to me. I've had some lucky breaks, and I've worked with some really great people, and I've worked for some really great people over the years. Particularly when I was at Doner, I had some really great mentors who really helped me understand the power of creativity, and I sort of saw this as an opportunity to provide that for others. And again, not just, and to me, part of the exciting, the excitement of it wasn't just the creative team. It was the agency, a fully integrated agency, and being able to help provide that kind of vision to a team. I think it's the part that was really exciting for me. I hadn't really had a chance to do that yet. Chris Hill: When you came to Luquire, you mentioned they're a fully integrated agency. They're a virtual agency, which probably is appealing because you don't have to go into an office, I would assume, or do you all have some physical space there in, I think it's Charlotte? Glen Hilzinger: In Charlotte. Yeah, we're based in Charlotte. We're actually just this year celebrating our 40th anniversary. So we were not virtual for many, many years. The agency was started by Steve Luquire, it was actually a sports marketing agency back in 1986, and has evolved over the years to become a fully integrated advertising agency with PR, media. And I moved here to join the team just before the pandemic, my family and I moved down here to Charlotte from Detroit in December, and of course, the pandemic hit in March. And, you know, we were surprised as I think a lot of companies, a lot of agencies were how, just how well. It worked virtually, of course, and I can remember, gosh, they've been talking about that for 20 years. Laptops came out. Everybody said, "yay, we can work from home. We can work from anywhere," but we never really had the tools until we got Zoom, and particularly Teams is what we use, and suddenly we were running this business from home. And I guess when it came back to it, one of the things, the biggest advantage we found was for an agency like us, a small agency in Charlotte, North Carolina, which is not exactly an ad market, to try to get really top level talent to join an agency like ours is a struggle to try to get some, not that Charlotte isn't a fantastic city. It's wonderful, but it's not an ad community, and so there's risks for those who decide they want to move their families, for example. And so we really started to discover the benefits of being a virtual agency in that we could hire from across the country. So we are 30 percent virtual at this point, I should say 30 percent of our staff lives outside of North Carolina. And it really, yeah, being virtual has really allowed us to hire the best and the brightest. I've got people from all the big network agencies, you name it. We've got a Digitas, Leo Burnett, Ogilvy, and we've really been able to bring some level of talent to the agency that I don't think we would have had we stayed in the office. And I think that being the case, we didn't feel it was fair to require those who are locally in Charlotte to come in for a limited number of days a week. So we are, although we have office space, workspace here in Charlotte, we don't require people to come in and use it. It's open for use for those who are here. And for those who aren't, we bring people in twice a year. In fact, we just finished last week and all agency week. So we fly in all of our virtual employees to spend the week with our local employees with all sorts of fun presentations and team building exercises and just having a lot of fun as a team. Chris Hill: What are some of the challenges? Cause like I've, we've worked virtually as a company ever since I started my business, and I know some of the challenges, but I'm curious from your perspective, working with creatives, are there any challenges that arise from dealing with at least three different time zones when you're dealing with these creatives? Glen Hilzinger: Well, I think if you ask those that are on the West Coast, they'd say, "yeah, there are definite challenges," but you know, you sort of have to be willing to work in the time zone of where the main agency is in our clients. And most of our clients are on the Eastern seaboard. So, yeah, those on the West Coast do have a little bit of a challenge. Early meetings, but you know, they also get a good part of their afternoon to themselves. So there's upsides and downsides, and I think it takes the right kind of personality to want that to thrive in that. I think it takes the right kind of personality period to thrive in a virtual agency. One of the things that we implemented coming out of the pandemic was, it's one of our five core values, but we found it really critical for how we work as a company and for maintaining our culture, we call it "Kindor," which is a "kindness" and "candor" put together in a trademarkable form. Although we branded it and have some fun with it, it really is at the core of how we work, cause if you- you don't have the opportunity to have those sort of hallway conversations and casual lunches and cups of coffee in the break room as a virtual agency. So it requires you to be able to have really honest conversations, but done in a way where people walk away feeling heard. They feel respected. So it's something we've really focused on as a company is this idea of Kindor to the point where we now, it's something that we now engage in with clients. So we often talk about Kindor with our clients. Give us the feedback. We can't, you know, we can't make the work better unless we get honest feedback. You won't hurt our feelings. We won't hurt your feelings. We're your partner. We're not a vendor. We're here to help you make your project the best it can be, and that requires those kinds of honest conversations. So that's been, I think, you know, as we at the leadership team, we try to unpack sometimes how our, as a virtual company, how our culture is so strong. And I think Kindor is, as we sort of try to deconstruct it and figure out what are the, what are the elements that work, that are working, we think Kindor is really an important part of that. Having those sometimes difficult conversations, but the conversations you need to have in order to have that honesty and that transparency so that you can thrive, even though you're not all together in the same space. Chris Hill: I find that word to be really interesting because I've worked with tech startups and VC firms, and especially I think this was more back towards the pandemic, there was this real big trend towards "Radical Candor." Glen Hilzinger: Yes, there's a book called Radical Candor. I've got it sitting on my desk. Chris Hill: And several people in the tech world that I've dealt with have been like, "Oh, I practice radical candor," and they would just be completely blunt. And it was just like this, it's like they were jabbing a knife into you every time they would talk to you. And it was like, okay, I get it. We need to make this better. But did you really have to say it that way? Like, you could be, you could have candor without being mean. So I love this, this idea of Kindor. Glen Hilzinger: Well, Radical Candor is when you wipe your butt with somebody's script. Chris Hill: That's exactly right. Glen Hilzinger: I said I would never do that, and that, you know, that doesn't help anybody. There's the, it's a business filled with egos. And I don't know. Steve Luquire started the company four years ago. His son is now CEO Brooks, and they're just really, really nice people. And as we're growing as an agency with something we didn't want to lose. It was one of the things I was looking for was that independent agency, that sense of autonomy, and I think what comes with that is a responsibility to be kind to each other. And I've always been a big believer that you can catch more flies with honey than you can with vinegar. And, and so that's what Kindor is. You still got to catch the flies, but you can do it in a way where everybody feels respected, and they feel like they're contributing, and they're not being chewed up and spit out. And I've worked at those kinds of places, and that's not, it's not fun. There's lots of theories on how to get ideas out of people, how to get people to be creative. I like to do it in a way where people are excited to go to work the next day. They're not doing it because they're worried that they're going to lose their job if they're not being creative. I just don't think that's the way to really inspire creativity. Chris Hill: I agree wholeheartedly having worked with creatives for a long time. The worst thing you can do is just be angry, direct, blunt, literally wiping your butt with a script, or what have you. That all to me makes total sense, and so, wow. That's really cool that that's part of the brand. Would you say that's that- I mean, it looks like you've literally trademarked Kindor. Is that accurate? Glen Hilzinger: We did. Yes, we did actually trademark it. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think part of it for me is when I was at Doner, which is really my formidable years, that was early in my career. Doner was in a suburb of Detroit, and not unlike Charlotte, although Detroit was a very large ad market, it tended to be insular, in that all the agencies, the creatives would sort of drift among all the agencies in Detroit. It was hard to get people to move to Detroit from outside, just because of the nature of at the time, the city it's become pretty cool now. But Doner was a culture of mentorship. The Chief Creative Officer at the time, John DeCerchio was very much that way, and two of my best mentors were at Doner. And you can't mentor somebody. You can't beat good thinking out of somebody and consider that mentorship. Mentorship is where you sit and, you know, you have to, you can't go hire the big guns. You got to turn your own people into those big guns. And so it takes a lot of sitting around talking about work. What makes ideas good. What makes them fresh. What makes them not so good. Why your idea is bad and helping people understand how to become better creatives through that mentorship. And I think that for me, that's sort of the essence of Kindor and some of where that came from. Chris Hill: That's cool because it's an internal principle, but it's something you've taken the time to trademark and say, put a stamp on it and say, this is not just internal, but like, this is part of our brand. This is who we are, and I think that's really interesting because coming into this conversation, realizing that, you know, Luquire is a family name, you know, so it's got that historical astuteness to it, but knowing that part of the heart of the business is Kindor is really cool, and I think that's something that definitely makes your business stand out. Glen Hilzinger: Yeah. Yeah. I think I, I like to think so. I mean, I, it certainly seems to be the case with our, with our staff and you know, it's one of those things that we evaluate people on in our annual reviews and quarterly reviews. How are they doing with their Kindor? And I would say, generally speaking, people are okay with it. Not particularly good, not particularly bad. It's hard. It's not easy to- always, it's much easier to be nice than to be critical, and to find that right combination. Some people are naturally candid, and some people are naturally kind, and to find that balance can be a challenge, but it's something we work on every day, and it's a very important part of how we work with each other and how we work with our clients. Chris Hill: So speaking of working with your clients, let's take a little bit of time and talk about some of Luquire's Business, some of what you all have done, some of the branding work you have done. What would be a project that you would say, man, we're really proud of the work we did on this project since you've been here at Luquire? Glen Hilzinger: Oh, I think there's a, there's well, two, one, the shirt I'm wearing. So we just helped launch the Sullenberger Aviation Museum, which is, yes, Sully, Sully Sullenberger. The Sullenberger. There was a local businessman who was on that flight, and he's a Charlottean and decided he really wanted to do something special for Captain Sullenberger. And so they rebranded what was this little tiny, sort of airplane, dusty airplane warehouse here in Charlotte, and turn it into really a world class museum. So the Sullenberger Aviation Museum was just launched this spring, and we did the logo and the branding for it. And the campaign was really celebrating those that love aviation or have some aspirations for understanding aviation. And that was the line, I'm an airhead. That's sort of the people who love aviation are airheads. They have their head in the clouds. Chris Hill: I love that on so many levels and, as a kid, just so you know, I was the kid that subscribed to the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum Magazine, and would get it, would open it up, was so excited it would come all the time. And I remember going up for like the, what was it, Safety Patrol did a Washington, D.C. trip in fifth grade and going to D.C., getting to go to the museum. Actually getting in trouble there because I complained, because we were with chaperones that only wanted to take the kids to the gift shop. And I was like, I knew all the exhibits that were there. And I was like, "This stinks," and I said that out loud, and I got chewed out for it, but I stood by my principles. I mean, it stunk that we only went to the gift shop, and they finally gave me some time to explore, but man, it was just love that, love aviation. My grandfather was a pilot. Just always have had a fascination with it. So that's really cool. Yeah. I'm in Knoxville. In fact, my sister lives in, Winston Salem. So we're going to have to come for a visit. Glen Hilzinger: You should come and see it. You would be really impressed. So they actually have Sullenberger's plane there. It's something to see. And they did this wonderful film where they shot it with, it's a one take, and they shot it with a drone following the actual pattern, I think the eight minute flight where you can actually see it from the pilot's point of view as it circled New York and landed in the Hudson. It's remarkable, and they've got just a whole host of other planes there. They do STEM education. It's really a wonderful, in fact, when I went to first see it, we had just finished the advertising, and I was really relieved to see the museum was as great as it was because we sure made it sound good in the advertising. So it was, it's nice to see it all come together. Chris Hill: That's really exciting. Is there a, you said it sounds like a smaller museum. So is there like a, outside of Sully's plane, is there a focus on a specific type of aircraft? Is it commercial? Is it private? Like what's the focus of the airplanes at the museum? Glen Hilzinger: It's all of the above. As you know, as an aviation enthusiast, I'm sure you know that the Wright brothers did their test flight here in North Carolina on the Outer Banks, and so there's some of that history there, and there's helicopters, there's jet fires. It's really, it's pretty remarkable. So it's definitely worth it, and it's big enough. It's worth a trip. It's worth a day trip for sure. Chris Hill: Yeah. Well, both myself and my sister each have two kids. So we will definitely, we're always looking for things to do when we get together. So I'm putting this on the list. Glen Hilzinger: Then there is a gift shop, although you don't have to just stay in the gift shop. Chris Hill: Oh, I'm going there for the airhead t-shirt for sure. That's awesome. So, Sullenberger Aviation Museum and you said there was another one. What was the other one? Glen Hilzinger: Oh, there was another one we did during the pandemic. Visit North Carolina, North Carolina Tourism, is a client of ours. Has been for, gosh, 12 years now. And they got some, through Visit North Carolina and the North Carolina Restaurant Administration, they got some federal funding to promote the safety protocols around COVID. And so we did a campaign here in North Carolina, specifically to North Carolina, to promote really wearing masks. There was social distancing. We remember all those parts, but it was really about wearing masks. It was a very fun campaign. Of course, all the production was shut down during the pandemic. So we had to do something animated, and anyway, it was quite the scramble, but at the end of it, we did a statewide study and found that as a result, direct result of the campaign, 70 percent of residents were more likely to wear a mask is what they said, which was really exciting. So we won some awards, and we were clinking glasses, and then got a note from our client who said, "yeah, the awards are great, but what we should really be celebrating is the fact that we probably saved some lives," and I thought that was, that was really, that was probably one of the best messages I've ever got from a client, but certainly made us all feel really good as an agency. It is- we loved helping our clients win, helping our brands win, but when you can do something that truly has an impact on society, that's something really special. Chris Hill: That definitely is always a good feeling when it goes beyond just, "Hey, we're spending a bunch of money on ads and making something clever and snarky." We're influencing people in a positive direction, which helps going back to your, I guess, slaying the dragon. I mean, this is part of that for you. Glen Hilzinger: Yeah. It's amazing. You know, creativity can solve so many problems, and that's really what I love about this business. Yeah. I love helping brands. I love helping move the needle, but when we can really have an impact on human behavior in a way that benefits, it's really special. Chris Hill: So speaking of learning, what have you learned over the course of your career, your time in Luquire about branding businesses? Like what principles, what things would you say, "this is a core tenant that I bring into the business with me. When we go to talk to a new client," or something. What would those be for you? Glen Hilzinger: Keep it simple and make it memorable. I think if you can do, of course, it's way, way more complicated than that or complex, I should say. But if you can nail those two, it's a pretty powerful combination. Chris Hill: Keeping it clean and simple always does the job. Glen Hilzinger: And I I think, you know, one of the things that I've enjoyed over my career as the industry has evolved, because of course, my career started sort of pre-internet, which is such a weird thing to say. And then, and even as you know, we're top of mind right now, as we think of what AI might do to our business, what our industry, what the digital revolution did to advertising, there were, you know, people scared and gnashing of teeth and white knuckled, and what we've all learned in the process is it's just made us better marketers. Suddenly now we can surround consumers with our messaging in a way that we couldn't do pre-internet, and that's been probably the biggest evolution for me and my career is going from just being a creative problem solver to a fully integrated problem solver. It's just provide such a richness to the messages we can deliver and so many more opportunities. So that's probably been as in terms of the evolution of my thinking as a creative, that's probably had the biggest impact. Chris Hill: Definitely a big one. It's been an influence for me. I won't date myself, but definitely been an influence in my childhood development, all that as well. So that's interesting. Well, what is top of mind right now? You mentioned AI. Are you all How are you all tackling that? Or are you saying, you know what, we're just going to pretend it's not there and keep moving on? Glen Hilzinger: Well, I think we're tackling it like you tackle anything. I don't think it's the next NFC, which was, you know, that was the big rage three years ago. If you weren't doing that, you weren't advertising, and of course we saw what happened there. But I think the, I do think AI is probably going to be the next big revolution for our industry. It already is, and I think we'll continue to be. I think we're like many marketers and brands, we're trying to understand how we can use it both for ourselves and for our clients. It's too early to say other than, you know, ChatGPT and Midjourney and sort of treating it as a tool. I think where there's always fear associated with those kind of revolutions, which I do think AI will be for our business, I choose to look at it as an opportunity for us to become better. I think there's, you know, it's interesting. There was an award show that I was judging this spring, and there was a student entry section. And one of the entries was, and of course, for those that don't know those student entries, those aren't real assignments. Something that's created for students to work on. Sometimes they're an association with brands. And the assignment was to pick a brand and create some sort of social good with the brand, and so this particular group, and I'm going to botch it cause I can't- it was one of many entries, but it does stand out to me. I can't remember all the details, but I thought that the thinking was amazing. It was based on this idea of safely handling food and salmonella poisoning, particularly in respect to eggs. So they found a brand, it was an egg company, and they had all sorts of great stats about the amount of salmonella poisoning in the world, and wouldn't it be great if we could at least through this company with eggs start to change that? And so what they did is they printed their, the idea, they didn't actually do it because it's a student assignment, but their idea was they printed their message about safe food handling on the eggs themselves with water soluble ink, so that when you crack the egg, you get the ink on your fingers. And so it forces you to wash your hands. It was so simple and so smart. Would anybody actually do it? I don't know, but it was so smart. So when we think about something like AI, I can't imagine AI ever getting to a point where it could do that. Cause that's so grounded in human understanding, human insights. It's such an original thought. I think AI will, in many ways, I think, fill in where we do currently a lot of parody. Whether that's personalizing emails or, you know, oftentimes we test and learn in paid social, we'll take a headline and we'll tweak it a couple of different ways and put it out in the market and see which performs better. I could see AI starting to take over some of those tasks, but I have a hard time imagining it ever really doing that true creative problem solving like that example. And I think what it's going to do is it's going to force us as advertisers to get more creative because there's going to be such a din and such a noise of work created by AI out in the world. A lot of marketers who think, "well, I'll just get this AI program, and they'll write my ad campaign for me," and that may be fine, and those things may work, but I think in order to break through the clutter, the sea of sameness, we love to talk about it in advertising, I think it's going to require us as advertisers and creative people to be even more creative and original, which I'm really excited about. I think it's fantastic. Chris Hill: I've seen it in recent weeks, even I feel like it's accelerating some creativity. There's a YouTuber right now who's doing some really hilarious alien parodies where they're like aliens looking back at human civilization, and the way he does it, it's written by a human, and you can tell, and of course he says, I wrote it, but everything else is developed in AI. And the fact that he can do it all, and it looks like something that would years ago have taken a team of CGI animators, and creators, and developers, and cast, and all that to do, that he can do that on his own, is incredible. Yeah, I see it as accelerating that and helping in a lot of ways. But yeah, I don't think, God willing for the foreseeable future, I don't see that like that creativity that you talk about with the eggs coming to fruition. Glen Hilzinger: Yeah, I think that's true, and I think there will be significant changes in our industry. So, you know, a good example, I believe it was Tyler Perry had a production studio planned in Atlanta. An $800 million something that he just cancelled because of what's happening in AI and the ability for AI to generate images, and I mean where it will have a dramatic impact on certain aspects of what we do, and when we think about TV production. Yeah, I could imagine a time where we're potentially generating our TV commercials in days instead of weeks and months and changing the way we have to think about executing. But I think that what's at the core of it is creativity and ideas and originality, which to me is probably the most important part. I mean, if AI ever gets there, that's going to be big for all of us, but I can't imagine it ever getting to the point where it could really supplant that original creative thinking. Chris Hill: Yeah. I don't know if you're this way or if anybody on your team is starting to think this way, but I've really admired and noticed that like most people are already picking up on what AI is. Like AI content, AI content writing, like it becomes- like we've already adapted to the point of like, that's the uncanny valley. We can tell that's fake, which is good. May not always be the case, but it's a good thing, I think, to that testament of like why we will always be needed. Glen Hilzinger: At the same time, I try to make sure that I ground myself, and I don't want to be naive or not realistic in a sense of being defensive. You know, Microsoft just came out with a voice generator that they will not release because it is so accurate, and so I think that's just going to continue. I think that's just going to continue, and I think it's going to be on us as an industry, and I was heartened to see Microsoft do that. Although something tells me that it's on pause because they're trying to figure out how to monetize it. But anyway, let's say they did it for the good of humanity. It's coming. It's coming, and there will be a point where you will not be able to tell visually generated content that's AI generated over things that we think of as traditional productions. Now, I know that's coming, and it's, yeah, it's going to be something to watch. Chris Hill: Definitely is something to watch. So typically we wrap up the show with just a few questions at the end. First of all, I want to know what does the future of Luquire look like maybe in the next few years? What do you see the company going, or what are you hopeful for in the coming years? Glen Hilzinger: You know, we're on a growth trajectory and some of that, the agency was, you know, around for 40 years and sort of got to a point where it stopped growing. I think at the time, somewhat intentionally, but I think that the new leadership team, we see certain advantages in a level of growth that allows our own internal staff to grow. Otherwise, you know, if you cap what size you are, then the only way you can move up and move around is through attrition, and we don't want that to happen. We have some really amazing people. So we want to keep growing at a pace where we can help those people at Luquire grow and get what they want out of their careers and also provide the kind of depth of marketing expertise that our clients are looking for. I don't think we really, we don't really have a, you know, we all have those little things in our, we'd like to be a small agency of the year, Ad Age small agency of the year is one of our lighthouses we're steering towards. But I think what we really want to do is maintain the culture of Luquire which, it's interesting. There's a, this was just last year, our staff started referring to themselves as Lunicorns. Which has been kind of fun. In fact, to the point where we actually created a, I should say the staff created a book. I don't know. Can you see that? Chris Hill: Yes, I can. Oh, please. Glen Hilzinger: And it's, "I am a Lunicorn," and it's just daily "ad-firmations," we call them. So yeah, it's the, and to me, that's the sign, as I've mentioned to the, our other leadership team members, particularly Stephanie and Brooks, our CEO and president, that to me, that really says something when you have something organic like that come from your staff. And I think whatever the next years bring, I think we want to make sure we don't lose that. That's probably the most important thing to me is that really creates an environment for sharing and openness and transparency and creativity, and I think that's when we're going to be at our best. Chris Hill: That is amazing. I want to read the rest of that book now. That's so cool. That's awesome. So then the next question I always ask at the end, and this is on the more personal note, but what brand do you admire the most right now? Glen Hilzinger: There's one, there's a campaign that came out last year that I just love. I thought it was fantastic. It's for, it was produced in Europe for Orange, which is the telecoms company in Europe, and they were promoting women's soccer. And it was this really amazing campaign where they look like they were promoting men's soccer, and they were showing all these soccer highlights where you sit there and as a soccer fan, you go, "Oh my gosh, that's it. That's football is life. That's why I watch. That's why I watch." And tehn they revealed that all of the scenes were actually women's soccer games that they had CG men, did visual effects to put men in place of the women. And then they replay all those same scenes with the female soccer players. And I just, it was just so powerful. And I think it's one of those kinds of ideas that just regardless of how you feel about gender in sports, just knowing that we need to have a message like that and that it can be done in such a powerful way that you can relate to regardless of how you feel about the sport itself to me, it's just really, really remarkable. I thought it was incredibly powerful. Chris Hill: That's definitely powerful, and I know the campaign you're talking about, and it definitely does a lot to like connect emotionally with the audience. And I think that that was one of the really powerful things about it was just that almost shock value of like, "Oh wait, no, they lied to me. Oh, but it's this. Oh, wow. Yeah." Glen Hilzinger: No, no, it's true. It's pretty accurate. That's sort of the visceral response. But what I love about ideas like that is that if you are a believer in gender equality, you can watch something like that and cheer, but at the same time, you can look at it and say, gosh, for those who don't believe in gender equality, or even those that don't think much about it, or those that have some sort of prejudice against women's football for no particular reason, you can share a campaign like that because you know, it's going to change somebody's mind. Somebody's going to see that and think, "you know what? Maybe I will watch women's soccer," and to me, that's just so incredibly powerful. It's just one of those kind of brand ideas that you can just fall in love with. Chris Hill: It's a fascinating campaign. So that's, that's great. All right. Well, last question, where can people connect with you and where can they learn more about Luquire? Glen Hilzinger: Well, they can go to our website, luquire.com. They can see our work and reach out to us there, and of course, you can reach out to me on LinkedIn anytime. I'm on LinkedIn and checking regularly. So yes, or send me an email. Also works. ghilzinger@luquire.com. Happy to respond to emails as well. Chris Hill: All right. We'll include that info in the show notes and yeah. Glen, thank you so much for coming on today. It's been a pleasure to have you, and yeah, thanks for being here. Glen Hilzinger: Well, thank you so much. I really appreciate the opportunity. It's been great. Chris Hill: Thanks for checking out this episode of We Built This Brand. Don't forget to like, follow, and subscribe on your player of choice. You can also keep up with the podcast on our website at webuiltthisbrand.com. If you liked this episode, please give this podcast a five star review and make sure to tell all your friends about it so we can continue to build this brand.